Return to Transcripts main page

The Lead with Jake Tapper

First Interview With Hegseth's Lawyer On Embattled Confirmation; Hegseth's Mom Pleads To Senate: "He's A Changed Man"; Manhunt Underway For CEO's Killer In New York City; Delta Stowaway Has Just Landed Back In New York; NFL Head Injuries Back In The Spotlight After Late Hit; Sen. Rick Scott (R-FL), Is Interviewed About Hegseth's To Win Confirmation. Aired 5-6p ET

Aired December 04, 2024 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:00:19]

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Welcome to The Lead. I'm Jake Tapper. This hour, the plane returning a stowaway to the United States is just minutes away from landing in New York. CNN's on board the plane as French security agents escort this Russian woman who somehow snuck past multiple airport checkpoints last week.

Plus, a fast moving winter storm bearing down on parts of the Midwest and tonight moving toward the east coast with intense bursts of snow and strong winds that can create whiteout conditions. The CNN weather team is tracking the forecast. We'll bring that to you.

And we are shattered, the heartbreaking statement from the family of the United Healthcare CEO who was shot and killed outside of a New York City hotel this morning. Police say it was a, quote, brazen targeted attack and the suspect remains on the run.

But leading this hour, with his nomination in jeopardy, Trump's pick for secretary of Defense is back on Capitol Hill today, meeting with the Republicans who will decide whether or not he gets confirmed. Pete Hegseth telling reporters today he's going to, quote, "Fight like hell." And that the president-elect is still 100 percent behind him. Sources say behind the scenes, however, Trump is actually considering possible plan B. In moments, I'm going to be joined live by Pete Hegseth's attorney. And later this hour, we're going to speak to a Republican senator who met with Hegseth earlier this week.

But we're going to start with CNN Anchor Kaitlan Collins down in West Palm Beach, Florida.

Kaitlan, what are you hearing from inside the Trump world about the state of the Hegseth nomination?

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR, "THE SOURSE": Well, Jake, they're watching very closely to see what's happening on Capitol Hill with those critical Republican senators that are ultimately going to be the ones who decide Pete Hegseth fate here and what happens here from the Mar-a-Lago perspective. And they're watching meetings. One of the biggest ones that they were watching today, based on what I heard, was the one with Senator Joni Ernst because of course, she is a female combat veteran, the first elected ever to Congress who has also been very outspoken about sexual assault. And so they wanted to see what was she saying coming out of that meeting. And you saw she was relatively quiet.

She said that they had a thorough and substantive conversation. Trump world down here is kind of reading the tea leaves on what that looks like and what that means because they know just how critical having her be it yes on a Pete Hegseth nomination would be. And so, Jake, one other thing they're also doing is watching the president-elect himself very closely and how he's handling this. And you heard Hegseth saying that he had that conversation with Trump, that Trump had voiced his affirmation behind him, that he was standing with him as his pick to run the Pentagon. And I think that's certainly, you know, something very much that Trump is doing until he isn't.

That is what everyone around the former president and the president- elect knows very well. And so they've been watching that very closely to see how all of this is handled today and what all of this looks like. And Pete Hegseth going out and doing media interviews, his mom going out and doing an interview this morning are all part of the effort from people down here to try to maintain this nomination and to convince those skeptical senators either not to oppose Pete Hegseth or to at least keep an open mind behind him.

But Jake, one other thing that is happening is they're talking about other names if they do pull Pete Hegseth that could be tapped to run the Pentagon. And so that is something I've heard from a few people who know Trump well say could be potentially a worrying sign for Pete Hegseth. Trump is already discussing who he could potentially replace him with, including a conversation he had with the Florida governor, someone who not that long ago was a pretty fierce critic of Donald Trump's when they were both running for the Republican nomination. That is something that Trump has also had a conversation about this job with.

Now, whether that means Ron DeSantis would ultimately be the backup, I think still would be an open question as what that process looks like. But it is certainly something that they are watching closely here. And a lot of people I've spoken with don't have a ton of confidence in Pete Hegseth's nomination and are just watching it, kind of seeing how the developments happen, Jake, by the hour, really.

TAPPER: All right, Kaitlan Collins, thanks so much. And don't miss out on more of Kaitlan's reporting on her excellent show, "The Source," which airs tonight at 9:00 p.m. only on CNN.

We now turn to Pete Hegseth's lawyer, Tim Parlatore, for his first interview on his client's nomination.

Tim, thanks so much for being here. People might recognize you from being here a lot during some of the Trump trials. And we should note that you've lost a lot of weight. Congratulations on that.

We heard Pete Hegseth defend himself against allegations of sexual misconduct and questions about his past drinking of alcohol with Megyn Kelly today. I want to play part of that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PETE HEGSETH, TRUMP PICK FOR DEFENSE SECRETARY: Take whatever tiny kernels of truth and there are tiny ones in there, and blow them up into a masquerade of a narrative about somebody that I am definitely not. And what they never quote, and we will get into this, too, are the legions of people from who I served with in combat, multiple tours, from the multiple veterans organizations that I very proudly ran. And I really want to get into that and my time at Fox News.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[17:05:08]

TAPPER: So what are the kernels of truth? What parts of the story are accurate?

TIM PARLATORE, ATTORNEY FOR PETE HEGSETH: Sure. What happens is he was the head of this organization. They did a lot of great work.

TAPPER: The Concerned Veterans in America.

PARLATORE: Yes. Yes. And after these events, they oftentimes did get together for an after party. And that part of it is true, but the rest of it is not. And that's where the best lies come in, is you take something that is true and then you additional facts to try and make it more nefarious than it is.

And so all of these claims of what he allegedly did during these after parties and, you know, the alcohol fueled environment is really exaggerations on something that actually did happen. You know, another example, the story about, you know, a strip club. You know, Pete discussed that this morning with Megyn where that did happen. But it wasn't Pete. He wasn't even there.

He wasn't even in the state. You know, somebody else had that event, and so they took that event and just changed the name and said, oh, it was Pete. It wasn't, you know, somebody else. So -- and that's what a lot of these things are, because you can't corroborate the full claim. But if you can corroborate, you know, a little piece of the claim, then, you know, it makes it seem more realistic than it really was.

TAPPER: So I want to ask you about a report that broke this afternoon in National Public Radio. David Folkenflik reported that a former colleague at Fox told him that Hegseth got, quote, "handsy repeatedly while inebriated, once even groping her bottom at a Manhattan bar." Obviously, it's anonymous allegation. We should note that Folkenflik has been covering sexual assault and sexual harassment at Fox for years. His track record on this is pretty good. But what is your response?

PARLATORE: And this is the pattern, is that we have all these anonymous complaints where people are saying things. They aren't giving any, you know, specifics. They don't have any corroboration whatsoever. And yet the people who were also there at the time are willing to come on the record by name, on camera and say this didn't happen. It's the same thing at CVA.

It's the same thing at Fox. It's the same thing at the Veterans for Freedom. Every single one of these, you have a few anonymous people saying it, and yet the people who come on the record and say, this is my name. This never happened.

TAPPER: So you represented Pete. You've represented him for eight or nine years.

PARLATORE: Yes.

TAPPER: I believe, starting with the Concerned Veterans for America stuff.

PARLATORE: Correct.

TAPPER: Including the incident in 2017 in Monterey. Now, we should note that Pete acknowledges that there was a sexual encounter. He says it was consensual.

PARLATORE: Right.

TAPPER: The woman had a different story. He did pay her an undisclosed sum. And to some people out there, that might look like. Well, that's guilt. That's an admission of guilt. You're his attorney, explain why you disagree.

PARLATORE: Sure, it could look like guilt. It could also look like an extortion. And that's the way that I saw it at the time, because this was something that was investigated by the police. The police found no basis whatsoever. In fact, one of the police officers told my investigator that before they interviewed Pete, based on the other witnesses' testimony and the video cameras, they were actually considering charging her with the --

TAPPER: With making a false story?

PARLATORE: No, with being the aggressor in this and taking advantage of him when he had too much to drink. And he went in, he talked to them. And of course, you know, that kind of ended the idea of charging her. But you fast forward a few years, and all of a sudden she comes in with a lawyer saying, we're going to file this. We're going to make it public, unless you pay.

And the reality is, unfortunately, especially for public figures, you know, during, you know, the MeToo Movement, a public allegation that somebody had drugged and raped somebody, they're going to get fired immediately. Fox News isn't going to wait two years to find out what happens in court any more than CNN or any other network would. He would have been fired right there.

TAPPER: So why do you think this is happening? Why do you think there are so many people coming out of the woodwork saying these things that have to do with either sexual or alcoholic impropriety?

PARLATORE: This is, unfortunately, one of the things that has happened in this country when people are going for a confirmed position.

TAPPER: Well, nobody's saying this about Marco Rubio. I mean --

PARLATORE: Well, he's -- maybe he's going to be next. You know, they started with, you know, they started with the attorney general, Matt Gaetz. Now they're focusing on Pete Hegseth. A lot of people, and particularly people like Pete that have lived, you know, that have been out there. I mean, yes, Pete is not angel.

Yes, he's been out there partying a bit. He hasn't done these things. But particularly when it's somebody like him who, you know, threatens, you know, the institution where people are afraid he might change things too much. He might, you know, stop the gravy train. He might get rid of some of the things that, you know, that people, you know, they're like, they're threatened by him.

And so people will come out just as they did for Justice Kavanaugh. And, you know, you start with, you know, a few stories, and then that begins the avalanche. And so now you have all these fake stories out there. And every single one of them has a good factual defense to them. But, you know, they're hoping that by sheer volume that they could try and convince him to get out.

[17:10:08]

TAPPER: Is he cooperating with an FBI background check now that the Trump transition has come into this agreement with the Justice Department?

PARLATORE: Not only is he cooperating, he can't wait to do the FBI background check. He's really looking forward to it because he knows, as I know, that FBI investigators are professionals. They're going to go through this. They're going to not just take a few anonymous complaints and put that in the report. They going to try and corroborate it.

The FBI background check is going to exonerate him of the vast majority of these claims. And so he's very much looking forward to that.

TAPPER: All right, Tim, always good to see you. Thank you so much. And thanks for your time.

PARLATORE: Thank you.

TAPPER: My panel is here to discuss.

Marc Caputo, let me start with you. What's your reaction to what you just heard from Tim Parlatore, Pete Hegseth's attorney? He's arguing that his client still has Trump's attention, still has the commitment to have him committed. What's the word? To have him confirmed, rather as secretary of Defense.

MARC CAPUTO, AUTHOR, THE BULWARK'S "MAGAVILLE" NEWSLETTER: Well, I guess D.C. is sometimes a lunatic asylum. So it can be the same word that can be used in both contexts. But the reality is that it really only matters what the 53 Republican senators think at this point. Trump is going to stand by his nominee as long as his nominee can stand up and get the votes. That was the lesson of Matt Gaetz.

That's going to be the lesson of Pete Hegseth. And that's going to be the lesson the others. Now, at a certain point, Donald Trump is going to decide to really start to fight and really start to bend arms, twist arms and perhaps break them. The question we have here is not only can Hegseth the votes, but if he falls short, to what degree is Donald Trump going to spend political capital?

And we don't think, at least right now, that he's willing to spend a lot. That's why he's on the phone talking to Ron DeSantis about whether he wants the job. It is pretty surprising. It kind of shocked me yesterday morning when I heard it. But that doesn't mean DeSantis is going to get the job. What it means is that Donald Trump has doubts about whether Hegseth can actually get the votes.

TAPPER: Gretchen Carlson, Hegseth's mom appeared on Fox News defending him this morning. This comes after the "New York Times" a few days ago revealed that she wrote him a really harsh e-mail in 2018 in which she accused him of mistreating women in his personal life. This is, I think, during his second divorce. We should note that she also, in that "New York Times" story, also said that she, a few hours later, apologized to Pete for writing that e-mail. Take a listen to Penelope Hegseth earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PENELOPE HEGSETH, PETE HEGSETH'S MOTHER: I wrote that out of love, and about two hours later, I retracted it with an apology email. But nobody's seen that. He's a changed man. And I just hope people will get to know who Pete is today, especially our dear female senators, that you would listen to him, listen with your heart to the truth of Pete.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: So, Gretchen, you are a survivor of sexual harassment in the workplace from when you worked at Fox. What do you think when you hear her defense of her son? What do you think when you hear the allegations against Pete Hegseth?

GRETCHEN CARLSON, FORMER FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Yes. Let me first respond, Jake, to Tim, Hegseth's lawyer, because one of the really important things that nobody's talking about is that the woman in that encounter has an NDA. So people can go out and say what they want on Hegseth's side, but she can't say anything. And I think that's a really important part of the story. So if they really want to get to the truth, they should let her out of her NDA.

That's point number one.

Now onto the mom interview. Look, it was a softball interview that was strictly appealing to the female GOP senators, as she said. And it was a mom encounter, too, because it was mom to mom. And if mom says that her child is OK, then maybe other moms will feel the same way. I don't know.

I'm seeing that there's a lot of hesitation from these female GOP senators. It'll be really enlightening to see what Joni Ernst actually says. I actually think she would make a better defense secretary than Pete. But you also have Shelley Moore Capito. And you have Susan Collins, Lisa Murkowski.

You have now Cynthia Lummis changing her mind on this. And yesterday you had Senator Lindsey Graham, who had concerns about this as well. So in my mind, this is not about blowing up the Pentagon. There are plenty of other people that can do that. And we've named a couple on this show today, Ron DeSantis, Joni Ernst.

TAPPER: Yes. Jasmine, Trump is reportedly considering Ron DeSantis as Gretchen just alluded to, as a backup. The two, of course, were bitter rivals during the Republican presidential primaries. Do you think that this is legit, or is this like when he invited Mitt Romney to dinner that time to kind of, I guess the belief was that he was -- they were trying to humiliate Romney as he was auditioning to be secretary of state.

JASMINE WRIGHT, POLITICS REPORTER, NOTUS: Over that stake, right? Yes. Well, I think what is true is that we know that Ron DeSantis' team, has expressed interest to Trump's transition team about being available for that position, as has other people.

[17:15:08]

But when I've talked to people within the transition team, they want to see senators keep an open mind about Pete Hegseth and they want to see Pete has at least get to the confirmation process somewhere that of course, we know Matt Gaetz didn't get to. But of course, I think all these drip, drip, drips of information, certainly the NPR report today makes it that much more difficult, even though when I've talked to people since the nominee sat down with Megyn Kelly, they thought he did a good job.

They thought his mom did a good job today on Fox, really trying to use that charm offensive that he's known so well for. But certainly I think that the drip of information and as more accusations come, it makes it more difficult for him. And I know just kind of responding back to his lawyer, of course they can deny it. They've been really profusely saying that these things didn't happen or that there were kernels of truth. But what they can't deny is when that background check happens and what it says, not necessarily just about the alleged behavior that he's had with women that I've heard of course are concerning to women senators, particularly on the GOP side, but of course, the potential that he may have a drinking problem. I think that that is what is going to be kind of the nail in the coffin if it shows in the background check to be accurate from the people that I've spoken to both in Congress and in the transition.

TAPPER: Jasmine, Gretchen, Marc, great to see all of you. Thank you so much.

The urgent manhunt underway -- CAPUTO: Thank you.

TAPPER: -- right now for the suspect who shot and killed the CEO outside his New York hotel this morning. The latest on that investigation next. Plus, the plane returning a stowaway to the U.S. has just touched down in New York. CNN is on board the plane. We'll bring you that update ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:20:38]

TAPPER: In our national lead, a massive manhunt's underway in New York City for the gunman who shockingly killed the CEO of UnitedHealthcare this morning. Brian Thompson was on his way to UnitedHealthcare's annual conference when a masked gunman shot him multiple times from about 20ft away in what police are calling a targeted attack. Senate's Brynn Gingras joins us live from New York.

Brynn, are there any new details about the gunman?

BRYNN GINGRAS: Yes, look, they are putting out a -- police are putting out a picture of this suspected gunman, hoping that anyone can help bring in some information, some tips about this person. Let me tell you really quickly though, Jake, first that they have cleared the crime scene vehicle from outside where this shooting took place. Police no longer here on the scene. Of course the investigation is still underway.

Now back to that picture, if we can bring that up to show our viewers. This is another picture that police put out on their X account, again hoping the public can bring in some tips. We're told that from sources that this picture was taken prior to the shooting at a Starbucks, really just a few blocks from where we are. And then of course, we have seen from sources that we obtained that chilling video of this shooting taking place here at the Hilton in Midtown Manhattan this morning, where police believe this gunman waited for about five minutes prior to Brian Thompson leaving a hotel he was staying in across the street, heading to this hotel, the Hilton in Midtown, for an investors conference. And we see in that chilling video how the gunman walks up behind him and fires his gun, hitting him.

And then we're told by sources that the gun jammed and he fires again once he loosens that jam. And then that video also shows us, Jake, that he just calmly walks away from the scene. Really doesn't even run very fast at all. We're told from sources he got away by escaping through a back alley onto an electric bike. And then where police at least to our knowledge, lost him was in Central Park.

And that is where they last saw him on that bike. So, a lot of investigations still going on right now. We're told that they recovered a cell phone. They're trying to use forensics to see if it tracks back to a person that helps them. Also, they uncovered shell casings here at the scene.

And of course, those images are being circulated. So that manhunt still very much underway as they have cleared the scene here, though, Jake, at the midtown Manhattan where this chilling murder happened this morning. Jake.

TAPPER: All right, Brynn, thanks so much.

CNN's Chief Law Enforcement and Intelligence Analyst John Miller joins us now.

John, you were deputy commissioner for the NYPD. Take us inside what's happening right now at the NYPD to find this gunman?

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, it's a layered approach. As Brynn told us, you know, they lose the trail of him going into Central Park. That's not because police were on his trail, it's because, you know, you do that video canvas where you check all of the cameras, police cameras, city cameras, traffic cameras, private cameras, and, you know, the last place they see him is going into Central park riding that bicycle he used in his getaway. So, now they're working on the east side and west side of Manhattan doing canvases for video outside the park to see where do they have him exiting the park. And then they literally continue that canvas.

So they try to get an end to end trip and figure out where does that resolve. Does he take down the hood? Does he take off that backpack and get into the change of clothes? So that's in the hunt for him, based on the video. Then there's what was left behind, of course, which is you've got three shell casings from the shots he fired. But the gun jams three times. And on the video you see him calmly clear the jam, which ejects a live bullet onto the street. So they have three live bullets as well where they can check for fingerprints and DNA.

But more critically, as Brynn showed us, there's that picture in the Starbucks. He's there buying a bottle of water and two power bars. A bottle of water and a phone is found in that alleyway between the street where the shooting was and the next block where he hops on the bike. That bottle of water could offer DNA, could offer fingerprints. And as Brynn suggested, if they crack into that phone with NYPD's technicians, it may offer an awful lot more, including communications with people before the incident or even the identity of the owner of that phone if it's not a burner.

TAPPER: What are the biggest factors working against investigators right now?

MILLER: The biggest factor is you have a well disguised operator who is using a gun that apparently has a silencer who, even when it jams three times, calmly clears the malfunction and continues shooting. It's definitely something that was planned.

[17:25:11]

The idea of the backpack suggests a potential change of clothes. The getaway bike is something that could not be caught in traffic or caught up to by police. A lot of planning. So, they're counting on not his planning and professionalism, they're counting on his mistakes. TAPPER: This is of course one of the biggest cities in the world. It's incredibly congested, incredibly packed. It's peak tourist season. If you were still working for the NYPD today, what would be your message to residents and tourists this hour?

MILLER: My message to residents and tourists this hour would be there's going to be the lighting of the Christmas tree. It's holiday season in New York. And this is not a random act of violence as far as we can tell. This is something specifically targeted that wouldn't affect the average person in this investigation. And I know this is happening.

They're going to be working very closely with United Healthcare saying what letters have come in, what threats, what e-mails where someone has said, I'm desperate, you're not helping me. There was a death in my family. I'm blaming this company. I hold the CEO responsible and see, you know, which of those people they want to go talk to and which of them might or might not be connected to this along with other things going on in and around that company.

TAPPER: John Miller, thanks so much.

The new details we're learning tonight about how a stowaway evaded multiple security checkpoints as the plane returning her to the U.S. Just landed back in the U.S. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:30:46]

TAPPER: Our World Lead now, the stowaway returns. A Russian woman who snuck onto a Delta flight from New York to Paris last week has just landed at JFK International Airport as we speak.

This new video shows the 57-year-old, identified as Svetlana Dali, escorted by French security officials on her return flight this morning. CNN producer Saskya Vandoorne was on the flight and just got off the plane. Saskya joins us now by phone. So what was she doing during your flight yesterday?

SASKYA VANDOORNE, CNN SENIOR PRODUCER: Yes, Jake. Well, you know, we -- we literally just landed minutes ago and we're in the process of deplaning right now. I've just exited the aircraft and I counted at least 15 law enforcement officials. As I left the aircraft, border police, port authority, all that waiting for Svetlana Dali.

But I have to say it was quite an uneventful flight. Dali has been compliant throughout. We boarded earlier today from Charles de Gaulle Airport and she was already on the plane when we got on the aircraft. She was right at the back. And she was flanked by two French security officials on either side of her, who escorted her all the way back here to JFK.

Now, she wasn't in a handcuff and I happened to be four rows in front of her, so I was able to watch her as we took off. And Jake, she seemed very calm. You know, I noticed she was resting her head against the seat in front of her. She spent most of the flight listening to music, at times exchanging a few words with security officials. But, you know, a real change in behavior from that first attempt to send her back last Saturday when she caused such a disturbance, Jake.

TAPPER: Were any of the passengers even aware who she was and that she was on the plane?

VANDOORNE: No. I'd say most of the passengers didn't have a clue until they exited and obviously saw all of these officials waiting there. When I told my neighbor who was sitting right next to me if he knew who she was, he said he'd read the, you know, the news stories, but he had no idea that she was on the flight and that in fact, now he knew she was at the back. He was rather nervous and felt uncomfortable that she was on the same plane as he was.

Now, she hasn't deplaned yet. I'm being told to move on. But when she does, we expect her to be interviewed by law enforcement officials who are going to question her on how she was able to of course evade all that airport security. And they'll then determine whether to bring charges, Jake.

TAPPER: All right, Saskya Vandoorne, thank you so much.

[17:33:08]

With brutal head injuries back in the spotlight after the NFL's most recent games. I'm going to be joined by CNN's resident neurosurgeon, Dr. Sanjay Gupta for his insight into the dangers of football. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Just into our Health Lead, the Jacksonville Jaguars have officially put quarterback, Trevor Lawrence, on the injured reserve list while he recovers from the concussion he suffered after being illegally and lately hit by Houston Texans linebacker, Azeez Al- Shaair, on Sunday. The NFL has suspended Al-Shaair for three games, but the hit has put the spotlight back on head injuries in football.

And here now for our weekly On Call segment is CNN's chief medical correspondent, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, a practicing neurosurgeon who deals with head injuries in the operating room. And Dr. Gupta, when you saw that hit, what was your first reaction?

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I think everyone thought it was pretty awful. I think if you're a neurosurgeon it looked horrific. I mean, look at -- we'll look at the video here, Jake. We'll just show it once. But there's a few things that are going on there. Obviously the first hit and then sort of the rotation that you see of -- of Trevor's head and then the second hit, basically where his head hits the turf.

Let me just show you on -- on -- on the brain model sort of what we're looking at here. The brain is accelerating in one direction. That hit comes, so it's an acceleration, deceleration injury and then the brain sort of changes directions and then you see it go back and basically hit the turf. So there's several different things that are happening to the brain in a relatively short span there.

But take a look at what happens after that. This is really important from a neuro perspective, how Trevor sort of behaves after that. I think we have that video. But basically, you -- you see him again, this is the -- the non-slowmo sort of play there. And then when you see him take the hit, you'll watch as he falls back, his left arm, Jake, goes up immediately and his right arm sort of becomes flexed.

Now that is a classic sort of position called a fencing position. It's a type of what we call posturing. And going back to the brain model that is typically occurring because these pathways in between the brain and the spinal cord here in the brain stem, they become disrupted. It's -- it's a really significant injury is -- is the point, Jake. I mean, we call these concussions, but they're brain injuries and they're significant brain injuries at that.

There are several criteria that the NFL has now that are called no-go criteria, meaning this happens and you cannot return to play. Even though Trevor was able to wake up, answer questions in a short time after that hit. If you have loss of consciousness, confusion, amnesia, impact seizure, what is called this fencing response, which is what I just showed you there in that video, or something known as ataxia, which is basically losing your balance. And that's something that we saw with Tua last season when people can't sort of regain their balance. That is now a no go criteria as well, Jake.

[17:40:03]

TAPPER: Yes, let's talk about that with -- with Tua. A lot of people wondered if he would retire after that hit in September. Is -- is someone like Tua, who has a history of concussion more prone to future concussions?

GUPTA: This -- this is a great question and I think a really important question. Are some people just more likely to suffer these brain injuries versus others? They get the same hit, same sort of play. Some develop a -- a brain injury, some don't. And -- and that's still sort of an emerging science.

But what we can say is that when people have had a concussion, then they are more likely to have a second one. Someone like Tua who's had at least three brain injuries and, you know, that that's what we sort of know of. I think he had one, a significant one when he was in college as well. When you have three, you're about three times more likely to have yet another brain injury.

So, you know, it's -- it's -- it's concerning and, you know, it's sort of declared, you know, he's sort of declared himself as someone who is more vulnerable to these sorts of injuries. Obviously, he's talked about this, his decision to continue to play. But what the data would show is that there are certain brains that are just more concussible, if you will, than other brains, Jake.

TAPPER: All right, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thanks so much. Don't forget to scan that QR code to where to go, to submit your questions about, there it is, about brain injuries. Sanjay is going to be back tomorrow to answer some of those questions.

Coming up, are Republicans confident that Trump's nominee for secretary of defense can make it across the finish line? I'm going to ask a senator who met with Pete Hegseth earlier this week. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:45:57]

TAPPER: We're back with some brand new images of Pete Hegseth, Trump's nominee to be Secretary of Defense. This is just moments ago on Capitol Hill. Mr. Hegseth on his way to meet with Republican Senator Kevin Cramer of North Dakota. Here's the embattled defense secretary just a few minutes ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So do you feel confident after your meetings today to be confirmed?

PETE HEGSETH, TRUMP PICK FOR DEFENSE SECRETARY: Great meetings with all the senators today.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you feel confident?

HEGSETH: I feel confident every day.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: While the president-elect may be urging Hegseth to keep fighting, there are also reports that Mr. Trump is lining up a plan B in case Hegseth's nomination falls through.

Sources tell CNN that possible replacements include Republican Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, Iowa Senator Joni Ernst, and Tennessee Senator Bill Hagerty. Joining us now is Republican Senator Rick Scott. He's a Navy veteran who serves on the Senate Armed Services Committee as well as representing great state of Florida.

Senator Scott, you were among a group of Republican senators who met with Hegseth on Monday. You -- this morning you posted on Twitter or X, quote, I support President Trump's pick and I look forward to his swift confirmation. So you -- you don't even want to wait for that FBI background check. You don't want to hear from members of the veterans group alleging alcohol abuse, sexual misconduct? I mean, I know Hegseth denies any wrongdoing, but don't you want to get some more vetting done?

SEN. RICK SCOTT (R-FL): Well first off, number one, Donald Trump won the election. Number two, this is his nominee. All right, we know we have to make changes. Number three, Pete is a great candidate.

Here's some -- I respect people that put on the uniform and led troops at war. He went to Iraq. He went to Afghanistan. He knows people that died. He knows people that were injured. He got out. He's fought for veterans since he got out. These are anonymous accusations.

If these people -- if these people are credible. Jake, ask -- ask him to come on your show. Ask him come explain these things. He did an op- ed. He's explained this. I've talked to him about it. I've met with him. I've known him. It's -- it's disgusting to me exactly what's going on. These people are trying to just dis -- disparage somebody that has -- did they go serve? No. They put their life on the line? No. This is ridiculous what these people are doing.

TAPPER: So you think --

SCOTT: So he's a great nominee. He'll do a great job.

TAPPER: So first of all, I mean President Biden won in 2020 and you voted against several of his nominees just because somebody wins a presidency doesn't mean that everybody in the U.S. Senate should just ignore the advice and consent clause of the Constitution and vote for the person's nominees, right?

SCOTT: Absolutely. That's our -- that's our -- that's our opportunity. I've known Pete. I believe in him. I think he's going to do a great job. He's going to stop this wokeness. He's going to make it, give us a -- a lethal military. I talked to so many people in the military. They're so excited about Pete because they know it's -- he's -- he's somebody that has gone to war, he's gone to combat.

He -- he put his life on the line. He knows the risk of sending people overseas. He's not going to but whim say, oh yes, let's go send, you know, a thousand troops here and a thousand troops there. He knows the risk of this stuff. He knows the risk of -- of not having meritocracy, of not having the best people. He knows all these things. That's what they're excited about. Pete, he will do an unbelievable job.

People are going to join just because of Pete and his background and his fight for veterans. This is a great nominee. And I'm disgusted that these anonymous sources say these things without willing to go on -- go on your show or some show and -- and, you know, have you asked them all these -- all the questions.

TAPPER: A -- a point that you're making here. The woman who accuses Pete of raping her in 2017, although the police, we should note, did not charge him with any crime. That woman, Pete Hegseth paid her money and she signed a non-disclosure agreement so she can't come on my show to talk about it. Do you think Pete should release her from the NDA so that I can ask her the questions that you want me to?

SCOTT: Absolutely not. There's so many. There's -- think about it. Jake, you know --

TAPPER: Absolutely or absolutely not?

SCOTT: Wait, wait, wait, Jake. We know how many people sign non- disclosures just to eliminate something. Not that they ever did anything wrong. And he was never -- he was never, you know, never charged with anything.

[17:50:09]

TAPPER: Wait. Do you want me to ask her questions or do you not want me to ask her questions? I'm confused.

SCOTT: So -- so I'm not going to suggest that somebody, you know, change -- change a -- a contract that they sign. But this is Trump's nominee. He won. A lot of people don't like the fact that he won. He won. We got -- we have to make a change at Department of Defense. We are -- we have the risk of war. We are -- the world's on fire. We've got to change how our Department of Defense is run.

TAPPER: Yes, no I --

SCOTT: -- He's going to do it.

TAPPER: I -- I hear you. But you just -- you started this interview and saying you don't like all these anonymous accusations and I should be able to interview these people. I'm saying, OK, shouldn't Pete Hegseth release this woman from her non-disclosure agreement so that I can do what you suggested at the top of the interview you wanted me to do?

SCOTT: Absolutely not. I mean -- I mean so many of these things are done for variety of reasons. But look --

TAPPER: Well, how am I supposed to interview her and -- and -- and have her not be anonymous anymore if he won't release her from the non-disclosure agreement?

SCOTT: Well first off, there was an investigation. He wasn't charged. All right, that's exactly what happened. The police --

TAPPER: He did pay her money though. He did -- he did pay her money to be quiet though.

SCOTT: So there was investigation. He wasn't charged. So he's got, I mean, why don't people respect these people that defend our freedom?

TAPPER: I don't know what you're talking about.

SCOTT: I'm proud of my father. He fought in the Second World War. He did all the combat jobs. He put his life on the line.

TAPPER: Right.

SCOTT: Pete put his life on the line. Respect him.

TAPPER: Well, I -- I respect veterans and soldiers all the time, but that's not really the point. I mean, millions of Americans have served in the military. That doesn't mean that they should be in charge of the military.

SCOTT: Well, here's a guy that put his life on the line. All right, he's fought for a veteran since he got out. He's got -- he's got the right background. He knows the problem of wokeness. He's going to fix the problems of the military. TAPPER: All right, Republican Senator Rick Scott, thanks so much. Appreciate your time, sir.

SCOTT: Thanks.

TAPPER: We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:56:34]

TAPPER: In our World Lead today, CNN is on the ground in southern Lebanon where people are returning to what is left of their home, some destroyed by airstrikes. Even as CNN's Clarissa Ward reports, many blame the United States for the destruction.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): From the balcony of his apartment, a man gazes out at his city, Tyre, once renowned for its glittering waters and ancient ruins, now in ruins itself. Mousassad (ph) has lived through many wars in Lebanon, but none like this.

Twenty years we have been here in Tyre, he tells us. An Israeli strike pulverized the next door building where his neighbors once lived. Their clothes still hang ghost like in the closet.

Imagine a person was sleeping here, the building collapsed on them. Everyone died. A woman and her children, all of them dead. Why? For what? He says. America did this to us, not Israel. It's America that goes like this, like she didn't see anything and she didn't want to know anything.

Lebanon is a country where loyalties are divided, but bitterness towards the west for its support of Israel is everywhere. In villages around Tyre, Hezbollah flags fly proudly. No community has been spared. The Melkite Greek Catholic Church had been a refuge for displaced people when it was hit by an Israeli missile on October 9th. Eight people were killed.

Eighty-one-year-old church caretaker, Milad Ilya (ph), has prayed here as long as he can remember. This is my house, he says. Next to the church, a mosque connected by a shared hall for events. If our homes were hit and the church stayed, it would better, he tells us, if the church is gone. There is no coexistence between people here.

Tyre is one of the world's oldest inhabited cities, mentioned several times in the Bible. As the light falls, Kemal Istanbully (ph) does what fishermen have been doing here for thousands of years. For 60 days during the war, Israel's military barred boats from going out on the water.

Of course, it was tough, he says. We fishermen must work every day to feed our families. What's your dream for the future? We don't have a future here, he tells me. With Israel as your neighbor occupying your land, there's no future for you. There's just war after war, destruction after destruction, and the country collapses and collapses, a bleak outlook shared by many in this historic city even as a shaky ceasefire continues to hold.

Clarissa Ward, CNN, Tyre.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: And our thanks to Clarissa Ward for that report.

In our National Lead, a powerful winter storm threatens millions across the Midwest and Northeast starting tonight. The intense burst of snow and wind could knock out power and bring dangerous travel conditions. Parts of the northeastern United States could see up to eight inches of snow. Parts of the Appalachian region will see blizzard conditions, while the blistering cold will cover parts of the east coast with temperatures dropping to 10 to 25 degrees below normal tomorrow and Friday.

[18:00:07]

You can follow me on Facebook, Instagram, Threads, X, formerly known as Twitter and on the TikTok at JakeTapper. You can follow the show on X at TheLeadCNN. If you ever miss an episode of The Lead, you can listen to the show whence you get your podcasts.

The news continues on CNN with one Mr. Wolf Blitzer right next door in a place I like to call The Situation Room. I'll see you tomorrow.