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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Firefighters and L.A. Residents Brace Threat of High Winds Forecast; Price Gouging Warning Raised by L.A. District Attorney; Judge Cannon Allows January 6 Report's Release. Residents Turn To Wildfire Tracking App As Flames Spread; High Winds Could Again Ground Planes Fighting L.A. Fires; Ceasefire And Hostage Deal Talks Set For Tomorrow. Aired 5-6p ET

Aired January 13, 2025 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[17:00:00]

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KASIE HUNT, CNN HOST: Welcome back to "The Lead." I'm Kasie Hunt in for Jake Tapper. We start with breaking news. We're standing by for a critical update from Los Angeles law enforcement officials. They are expected to reveal looting charges following wildfires that raged through Los Angeles last week. The L.A. District Attorney told us just last hour that those charged are going to face years in jail. This as Angelinos brace for and dread what may come next.

Wind gusts of up to 70 miles an hour are possible over the next few days. For those whose homes haven't been scorched yet, there's no guarantee they're in the clear. And as of this hour, the largest fire, known as the Palisades Fire, has burned nearly 40 square miles. That's about the size of the entire city of Paris, and it is only 14 percent contained. Let's get straight to CNN's Nick Watt who is in Pacific Palisades. Nick, how on edge are people there about these increasing winds?

NICK WATT, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, people are scared. I mean, partly because the area of concern was just expanded. So we have a large area that they're calling a PDS. That's particularly dangerous situation. So more winds gusting up to 70 miles an hour expected to begin 4:00 a.m. Tuesday morning West Coast time. That's 7:00 a.m. in the East and to continue through Wednesday. So that is a huge concern.

The National Weather Service in their tweet said this quote, "This setup is about as bad as it gets." Now, the only good thing is there are right now so many firefighters over 5,000 and so much equipment in the L.A. County area, they are pre-positioning. So the hope is that if we do get these fires again, that there are more resources ready to pounce and try and snuff out these fires before they spread as they did so devastatingly last week. Kasie?

HUNT: Well, and Nick, one of the big concerns, of course, is if the wind gets too high for some of these air -- the planes, the helicopters to be able to fight the fires, what impact will it have if those planes have to be grounded? WATT: Yeah, listen, it'll be the same impact as we saw last week.

When those planes couldn't get in the air, this fire just burned out of control, despite the valiant efforts of hundreds of firefighters on the ground. This is tricky terrain. If you can't attack these fires from the air, you have one and a half hands tied behind your back. You are in a really bad situation, but they've been using the lull in this weather to try and drop as much retardant, to try and soak as much as they can, and to dig lines around. to try and contain, prepping for the worst.

You know, I'm in the Palisades right now, which over the past few days, we've seen people walking in to try and see what's left of their homes. That is no longer allowed. We've got the National Guard in here blocking off the entrances because they don't want looters coming in and basically victimizing people all over again by stealing whatever is left. I'm also hearing from down in Santa Monica that there are people going door to door, pretending to be offering help and they are in fact scammers.

Now, you know, the damage up here is still being assessed. We've seen county fire officials walking around, looking at each house, taking a picture, and then they post those pictures online with the address. So if you can't get in, you can at least see if there's anything left of your home. Those photos, that information of course will be used for the numerous insurance claims that we're going to see filed over the next few months as this community tries to come back.

You know, I spoke to a friend of mine who lives up here, 60 kids in his school and between the two kids' classes, only 12 of those kids right now have a home to go to. And I want to read a little bit of a text I just got from him as well. He said, "the other thing that hit home for me yesterday, we were in mass. The tears in the eyes of the older people who lost their home, a lifetime of memories and the fact that they will most likely pass away before they get ever get back into that home."

So there are people who know that they're never gonna see their home again, they're never gonna see their community as it was. Kasie?

HUNT: Just incredibly heartbreaking. Nick Watt for us. Nick, so grateful for you. Thank you very much. Let's bring in now CNN Chief Climate Correspondent Bill Weir. Bill, you've been talking to survivors in this really tight-knit community of Altadena and there's still an active fire close by. What are you seeing?

[17:05:00]

BILL WEIR, CNN CHIEF CLIMATE CORRESPONDENT: Okay, so let me give you some perspective. They're doing grid searches in Arcadia, that direction, with cadaver dogs looking and going home by home checking people and also now registering the state of those homes on this online database. But I'm struck by this corner of Arcadia. Pasadena is that way, by the way, and the active fires are that way.

I'm struck by again the fickle finger of fate when it comes to these fires. This charming bungalow, their garage burned down, but if they'll come back and realize their house survived, but we'll look out of every window in every direction and all of their neighbors are gone. This is sort of a poignant symbol of California these days. The orange tree scorched, as you can see, is the fruit on the ground. This is a really interesting neighborhood.

I've been talking to locals for the last couple hours. There's a retired fire captain who lived at the end of the block. A bunch of folks below the line in TV and film production, costume designers, set designers. I met a handyman who says 40 of his clients, his customers in these neighborhoods, all of them lost their homes. And I was just talking to a gentleman, Kevin, who's an architectural photographer, so he's been into a lot of these homes. He knows the different treasures in the different demographics. Some of these houses have been here a century and are rather grand. and the property values have gone up around them. Some are modest bungalows, mid-century jewels here and there, but all of it, just so much of it looks like this.

The only houses that survived at the end of Calavera Street in Arcadia were thanks to the retired fire captain and the TV set designer and his son with a bucket brigade. Literally as embers are burning holes in their clothes and their shoes, they were putting out the roofs on what they could save. And there is a little pocket of oasis now at the end of the street. And such an example of sort of survivors' guilt and grief for what is lost around them, worries about the future.

Also, interestingly enough, Kasie, is that the bird life, because the hillsides are so scorched and the food isn't there, anybody who's putting out bird feed in these little pockets are getting just flocks and flocks of wild birds, hungry wild birds coming in. Somehow a couple of the neighbors' chickens survived behind this house while the whole house is gone. And there -- I saw two neighbors putting out hotspots while feeding the chickens. They can focus on really like those sorts of tasks of what you have when you look around and realize this community is just decimated.

And there was the band shell, the amphitheater that used to have these beautiful concerts. Kevin, the local photographer, he was tearing up. He was telling me I used to sit there at these concerts. And my eyes would fill with tears because it was such a beautiful, diverse socioeconomic cross section of people coming to listen to music in the beautiful foothills of these mountains looking out over Los Angeles, and now that's gone.

And so the only hope, you know, what they're hanging a hope on is that the tightness of this community will help them pull together. Those that survive now as sort of oases is for hope to prop up who will come back. But you got to worry about those older folks, those elderly folks who may not live long enough to see their home rebuilt, Kasie. It's just so many swirling emotions. And we're not out of the woods yet. That red flag warning is still under effect for these fires.

HUNT: Just incredibly heartbreaking. Bill Weir, thanks for that wonderful reporting. We really appreciate it. All right, let's turn out of this. At any moment, President Biden and Vice President Harris will be getting a briefing on these fires. And we're learning that President-elect Donald Trump is in talks to visit Los Angeles as early as next week to survey wildfire damage and review the state's recovery efforts. This just in, according to sources. Let's go to CNN's MJ Lee. She's at the White House. MJ, all of this of course comes as there's this big fight brewing on Capitol Hill about how to provide aid to help people who are impacted by these fires.

MJ LEE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, and any moment now, Kasie, we are about to see President Biden and the Vice President get yet another briefing from top officials in the federal government about these ongoing efforts to deal with these raging Los Angeles area fires. You know, since these fires erupted last week, of course, these briefings that the president has been getting, the updates have really been constant.

And of course, the president happened to be in the area on the West Coast last week when these fires erupted. So really got a sense of the start of the damage that began a number of days ago and getting more funding approved via Congress. That as you said, is a fight that is brewing here in Washington, but that is actually separate from some of the federal actions that have already been taken.

Just to give you a reminder, the president has already directed the federal government to cover 100 percent of California's costs for the next 180 days.

[17:09:59]

It has also, the federal government authorized FEMA to basically start a new program where some of these victims would be getting somewhere around $770 to kickstart their recovery and getting really critical items, just really simple basic necessities like food, like baby formula and gas. That's not to include the actions that the DOD has taken. And of course, we've seen some of the deployment of air tankers, the use of helicopters, military personnel.

And also just to give you a sense of how widespread the destruction has been, according to the FEMA administrator, some 24,000 residents have asked for FEMA aid. And earlier today we did see the White House putting out a statement mourning the loss of some 24 people whose lives have been confirmed dead. This is just a good reminder that even White House officials are waiting to get more information on the full scope of the destruction, including of course, of the number of lives that have been taken so far, Kasie.

HUNT: All right, MJ Lee for us at the White House. MJ, thanks very much. And we are standing by for two live updates on the wildfires. That briefing with President Biden and Vice President Harris at the White House. And in Los Angeles, law enforcement officials are announcing looting charges in the wake of the destructive fires that have swept the area. Much more on our breaking news in just moments.

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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP NATHAN HOCHMAN, LOS ANGELES COUNTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY: You will be arrested, you will be prosecuted, and you will be punished to the full extent of the law.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: That was the warning today from L.A. County's top prosecutor to those trying to price gouge people who've been displaced because of the fires. As California remains in a state of emergency, it is illegal for rental increases to go up more than 10 percent. However, real estate agents have seen prices spike as high as 400 percent as so many look for homes in an already stretched housing market.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JASON OPPENHEIM, FOUNDER, THE OPPENHEIM GROUP: There are price gouging laws in California that are just being ignored right now and this isn't the time to be taking advantage of situations and it's also illegal to take advantage of a natural disaster.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: All right, I want to bring in real estate agent Robin Walpert, who's based in Pacific Palisades and she's been helping people find housing. Robin, I know this has been such an incredibly difficult time for your entire community, and then now you're dealing with this. I mean, walk us through what you're seeing from these leasers who are flouting laws as people are just trying to look to put a roof over their head.

ROBIN WALPERT, PACIFIC PALISADES REALTOR, SOTHEBY'S INTERNATIONAL REALTY: Yeah, thanks. It's disheartening, to say the least, especially at a time like this when our friends and family and clients and our kids' classmates, everyone is without resources and homes and it's an unkind thing we're dealing with right now, really.

HUNT: So Robin, what are the challenges at hand as you work with people who are looking for housing? I know also the -- simply the home prices for people who may be thinking maybe we'll buy a different house have also apparently gone through the roof?

WALPERT: So I haven't focused so much on price increases for sale, but our inventory was already scarce before the fires broke out, but within 24 hours from the breakout, it was a real scramble in town where people were wanting to take some action, get some roots down, find some stability for kids, pets, grandma, grandpa, everything. And really within 36 to 48 hours, it was quite competitive and it was pretty chaotic in town trying to find housing that doesn't exist at the scale that we needed. We've got 95,000 something displaced people right now, it's a concern.

HUNT: What stories have you heard from people as they've tried to go about navigating this?

WALPERT: I think for the showings that I've gone to with clients, it's been arriving to a property and it's a carousel of crying families, 13 applications, 17 applications, 25 applications all for the same home, which has forced some people to come up and be highly competitive. A lot of it is budgets that they have from their insurance companies. And at this point, desperation, shock, despair, let's just throw it all in the pot and find something that we can turn into home.

Alternatively, we have had a price gouging problem that is turning our regular normal families who don't have that kind of budget into a terrible situation. I was put in touch with a homeowner direct through a friend. She said I have an opportunity where I can go and stay with my dad. I'd like to open up my home in Santa Monica. It's lovely. It's three bedrooms. It's one and a half baths. It's in this neighborhood in Santa Monica.

And I was so grateful for a moment until she said, but I would like to charge. And she threw out a number that was four times greater than a normal rent for a home like that. So if a home like that was renting for 10 grand on the normal, she was asking me for 40. I dismissed it because it was a heartbreak. Aside from illegal, it just felt really gross that this was something, in this kind of moment where someone thought that they could maybe, you know, take advantage of this situation. It's awful and it's terrible.

HUNT: Really, really awful. Robin Walpert, thanks so much for the work that you are doing to try and help all of these families. And I know you've -- I'm sure, you've been personally impacted as well. Thanks very much for taking some time with us.

WALPERT: Oh yeah, thank you for your time.

[17:19:59]

HUNT: All right, much more ahead here on our breaking news on the LA wildfires. Plus, the new twist today that means we could soon learn much more about Donald Trump and attempts to overturn the 2020 election.

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HUNT: All right, we're back now with our "Law and Justice Lead." Federal Judge Eileen Cannon says the Justice Department can release the special counsel's report on President-elect Trump's election interference case. That release could come as soon as midnight. Let's bring in CNN senior law enforcement analyst, former FBI Deputy Director Andrew McCabe, and CNN Chief Legal Affairs correspondent Paula Reid. Welcome to both of you. Paula, let me start with you. How significant is this?

[17:24:58]

PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: It's significant because it means the public could get to see Jack Smith's report detailing investigative decisions, he made in his election interference investigation. He had these two cases, right? One into Trump's alleged election interference, one into Trump's alleged mishandling of classified documents. That classified document report is not getting out anytime soon. That's still an active case.

So what we're focused on is the January 6th report. And Kasie, I also want to emphasize that the only thing that the two sides of this case have ever agreed on in the past three years is that there's really not a lot of news inside this report. We've had the January 6th committee. They had a report. Trump was indicted. There's also a big court filing in October related to this case that did something extraordinary, revealed a lot of evidence that usually isn't disclosed before trial.

So really what the fight is about right now is about the legitimacy of Jack Smith. That's what the Trump team is really focused on when they are fighting the release of this report. But as of right now, if they don't come up with a creative way to appeal Cannon's move here, this report could be released as soon as midnight tonight.

HUNT: I was going to say, what are the Trump team's options?

REID: They don't have a lot of options at this point because they were hoping that Eileen Cannon's, I mean, really shocking decision to say that Jack Smith was not properly appointed to toss out the classified documents case and use her decision there to block the release of both reports, I think they thought that was going to be enough to at least play out the clock until Monday.

But here, Eileen Cannon, who has many times done things that have shocked legal experts that helped Trump, here she's saying, look, I'm gonna focus on the classified documents report. We're still gonna focus on that, whether lawmakers can see it, but I'm not gonna block the other report. And it's unclear now that Trump is no longer a defendant, right? These cases against him were dismissed. How they would get at trying to block this report. But they're very creative and they're very persistent. So I know they're working on it. I don't know what they're gonna do.

HUNT: Well, stay tuned. Andy McCabe, let me bring you in here. Do you think -- how important do you think it is that this report see the light of day, the January 6th piece? And do you think the fact that we're still not going to see she is blocking the section of the report related to the classified documents case matters?

ANDY MCCABE, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: I think yes to both in a way, Kasie. I think it's important anytime we have a special counsel who's been employed to look into a significant matter of national interest, that person is required to submit a report to the attorney general and attorney generals have almost always turned those reports over to the public. I think following that tradition, this is certainly, both cases are matters of extreme public interest. And I think the report about the DC case should be turned over without any sort of delay, which would be immediately after midnight tonight. I think that's what we can expect.

I understand the Trump team is saying that there's not much new here. And it is true that we've seen probably a lot, you know, there's been an indictment in this case, there's been preceding indictment in this case, very extensive motion filings with all kinds of pieces of evidence and intended exhibits of trial have been exposed during this process. A lot we've seen already, but even the Trump team said in their own filing to the 11th Circuit that there were things that they saw in the report when they got to read it in advance that were new that the public hadn't seen before. So they use that as one of their arguments for trying to keep it quiet.

As for the documents case, much tougher thing there. That case only exists as an appeal at the 11th Circuit because Judge Cannon, of course, dismissed it at the district court level. If the Justice Department really felt the report was more important, they could dismiss the case against Nauta and De Oliveira and release it, but they're very quickly running out of time to do that.

HUNT: Sir, what's your sense of, you say that they learned new things and that we saw that that was part of what they put in the filing to the 11th Circuit. With your understanding of what a special counsel can dig up, can unearth, what in your mind could those new things be considering as Paula notes, we have an extensive now public record about what happened on January 6th.

MCCABE: We do. We have an extensive public record, but we know that the special counsel has done a massive investigation probably hundreds of interviews, a lot of testimony in front of the grand jury, a lot of interactions with witnesses, possibly witnesses we don't even know abo, you know. Prosecutors are always very cagey about hiding some evidence for trial. So I think there's probably things that they did not expose over the course of all this motion practice and litigation. And some of those things might in fact be revealed in the report.

So it's hard to say exactly what those would be, but you can pretty much guarantee that prosecutors always hold some nuggets of the evidence and revelations for the trial itself. At this point, that is never going to happen. So I would expect that they would put that material into the report.

[17:30:00]

And if in fact it's releasable, meaning it's not covered by grand jury secrecy or other kind of privacy concerns.

HUNT: All right, Andrew McCabe, Paula Reid, thanks to both of you for being here today. I appreciate it.

All right, millions across Los Angeles still on edge, waiting to see if they'll need to quickly evacuate from wildfires. Next, I'll speak to the creator of an app that's been helping people track the threat in real time as the flames spread.

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HUNT: In our National Lead, as fires have disrupted life for millions in L.A., there's an app that has quickly become a vital tool for real time information on evacuation orders and maps of the wildfires. Watch Duty it's called. It's led by just 15 employees and 200 volunteers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I encourage you to download the Watch Duty app. That's what I've been using this entire time to track the updates of the fire, the evacuation zones.

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[17:35:03]

HUNT: All right, let's bring in the founder of Watch Duty, John Mills. John, thanks very much for joining us. This of course has become one of the most downloaded apps in the last week. Can you tell us how many people are using the app before the fires and how many are using it now?

JOHN MILLS, CEO, WATCH DUTY APP: At the end of last year, about almost 3 million downloads. And in the past six days, we have 2.2 million more downloads.

HUNT: So fair to say that this has exploded. Can you explain to us how it works, how you get all of this kind of information pulled in? I -- I think sort of my question is, as a layperson, may just be, why can't I get this from the government of California or the city of Los Angeles? You're obviously able to provide it. Tell us how.

MILLS: Yes, that's a great question. We -- we do use those sources as well, from lots of the public officials whether it's the ones you mentioned, U.S. Forest Service, BLM, it doesn't matter, right. So we take in all those public sources as well. But where the real nuances is we have people listening to the radios real time, 24 hours a day. And this is fire service radio. So we hear first responders fighting fire on the ground, and that's where we get that granular information about real time activities.

HUNT: And so are these -- these are all volunteers who listen to these radios and call things in. And can I also ask, how do you distinguish between, you know, how do you trust your volunteers to make sure that you know that the information they're giving you is right?

MILLS: Well, the better question is how do they trust me, right? Because I found these people when I moved to the woods and experienced devastating fires. And I found them on the Internet already doing this on Facebook and Twitter. So these are folks who are active, retired first responders, dispatchers, sons and daughters of firefighters. Folks have been doing this for quite some time. So they have been overwatch for me during fires. And I convince them to join me and we're -- we were going to build a nonprofit to build a really big megaphone for them to do their job.

HUNT: So is that why you built this app in the first place? I mean, tell us briefly where it came from.

MILLS: Well, unfortunately, it came out of devastation. I live off the grid in the woods of Sonoma County, and so I've experienced a couple bad fires. The Kincaid and the Walbridge fire in 2020 ended at the corner of my property. And so again, those folks who are now some employees, many are volunteers, guided me through those fires. And so that's why this all happened.

HUNT: Well, thanks for coming on the grid to explain to us and all of our viewers how this all works. And for anyone who is looking for this information, John Mills, thanks very much for your time today, sir. I appreciate it.

MILLS: Thank you.

HUNT: All right. Could there finally be a new hostage and ceasefire deal, hostage release and cease fire deal between Israel and Hamas? The new details that we are learning this afternoon, more crucial meeting scheduled in just hours.

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[17:42:36]

HUNT: All right, we're back now with more of our breaking news on the deadly Los Angeles wildfires. This afternoon, the National Weather Service expanded the area that's under a warning for winds that could gust up to 70 miles an hour. It could also turn any new spark into another fast moving destructive wildfire. Los Angeles County Fire Chief Anthony Marrone joins us now. Sir, we are so grateful for what you've been doing as well as everyone that -- that you work with.

And you say that you are better prepared this time, even more aerial resources with this, the wind set to pick up. But a Cal Fire spokesperson did tell us that sustained winds over 40 miles an hour is going to ground most of the planes that you all are able to use right now. What kind of firefighting can be done on the ground when those planes are grounded, and what impact does that have?

CHIEF ANTHONY MARRONE, LOS ANGELES COUNTY FIRE DEPARTMENT: Yes, well, it certainly has a negative impact on our efforts to contain a fire. However, I really must state for your viewers that unsupported helicopter or aircraft drops do not suppress the wildfire completely. We always have to follow up with crews on the ground. Those are usually wildland firefighting hand crews that cut a fire perimeter line around the entire incident.

So we can still do those operations, perimeter control. We can use engine companies for structure defense. And also we can use engine companies to assist with evacuations to get people out of the way of the head of the fire.

HUNT: Are you worried that these new winds may undo the progress that you've been able to make?

MARRONE: Oh, yes, absolutely. So the National Weather Service has advised us we're going to have a severe red flag. It's called the PDS. It starts tomorrow morning at 4:00 a.m. It's not going to be the traditional north wind out of the north for the Santa Ana wind. It's going to be a little bit northeast. So that's going to pose a risk for our two current fires, the Eaton and the Palisades fire, to move in an east and westerly direction, as opposed to a southerly direction. So I am very concerned. But I'm also concerned about any new starts. If we get a new fire start in a different location, it could be very difficult to contain.

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HUNT: Yes. So you -- you've also been saying that municipal water systems, they're just not built to withstand the firefight that you all faced last week. And there are not enough fire engines in the state of California to put out all of the structural fires that erupted in the wake of that. Is all of that in play with any potential new fires? And could you figure out a way to mitigate that problem? I mean, can it be fixed or was this all completely unavoidable?

MARRONE: Well, I -- I think it can be fixed. I believe if -- if it's predictable, it's preventable. I think that we have to manage our wildland urban interface in a better way. We have to build connection communities to make sure that they're fire safe. We need to have the building industry build homes with fire resistive construction techniques and products.

We cannot have wooden houses in zero clearance lots sitting next to one another. Because what we experienced here at both the Palisades and the Eaton fire was what we call a community -- a community conflagration. We had fire moving from one home to the other with no wildland brush in between those homes. The homes were creating their own ember cast. It moved out of the wildland and into the community, similar to Lahaina Paradise, California or also the incident that we had in Colorado. I believe it was the Marshall incident.

HUNT: One of the other things that we've heard about, Chief, is insurance companies or individual people hiring private firefighters. One company says they had hundreds of people on their wait list in the first few days of the Palisades fire. And if you want to pay for it's $5,000 a house in times of an emergency. Are these services helpful? How do you interact with them?

MARRONE: Well, they're certainly helpful for those that can afford it. And, you know, I want everybody to be protected, not just those that -- that have the financial resources or whose insurance carrier sends -- sends out these private fire brigades. I think that's something we're really going to have to address after this immediate incident is over. I'd like to see more equity for everyone when it comes to getting their homes protected.

I do stand by my comments earlier. Municipal water systems are not made to -- to combat a community conflagration, fires running from home to home to home. Normally at the L.A. County Fire Department, we're one of the nation's largest municipal fire departments. We have three engines and one truck company assigned to every structure fire.

If we have 1,000 structures burning, that's 3,000 engine companies, or excuse me, 9,000 engine companies and 3,000 truck companies. We don't have that in Southern California. We can't fight the fire the way we traditionally fight them. I think we need to spend more on prevention and more on building enforcement and urban wildland management, given that climate change is real and that we're suffering the effects of climate change right now, because Mother Nature certainly was in control on Tuesday and Wednesday. HUNT: All right. Los Angeles County Fire Chief Anthony Marrone, very grateful for all of your efforts, all the work that you do, and -- and of course, for your time today. Thanks very much.

MARRONE: Thank you.

HUNT: All right. Now to breaking news in our World Lead, we're just hours away from a crucial meeting and a possible breakthrough to secure a deal between Israel and Hamas to declare a ceasefire and potentially bring some hostages home. But, of course, we have been here before and seen nothing happen. So let's turn now to CNN's Jeremy Diamond, who we find in Israel. Jeremy, what have you been hearing from Israeli officials tonight?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kasie, it's clear in speaking to my sources that we are on the brink of a potential ceasefire and hostage deal closer than we ever been, in fact. But even still, sources are cautioning that there is no final agreement as of yet until everything is agreed to. One senior Israeli official tells me that this ceasefire deal will see the release of 33 hostages in the first phase of this agreement. Most of those are believed to be alive, but there will likely also be the bodies of deceased hostages released in that first phase of the deal.

And that first phase is a six week ceasefire, 42 days of ceasefire, much needed respite in Gaza, which has not seen a ceasefire since late November of 2023. Israeli forces will remain along the Philadelphia corridor, which was a big subject of contention according to these Israeli officials. And, of course, beyond the release of the hostages and the stop in the fighting, there will also be the entry of much needed humanitarian aid. The question now is, will this agreement come together in a matter of hours or days or at all? Kasie?

[17:50:22]

HUNT: All right. Jeremy Diamond for us in Israel. Jeremy, thanks very much for that.

And we are going to turn now to White House National Security Communications Adviser John Kirby. Admiral, very good to see you. Thanks for being here. What can you tell us about how close a deal actually is, and what are the major sticking points at this hour?

JOHN KIRBY, WHITE HOUSE NATIONAL SECURITY COMMUNICATIONS ADVISER: Right now, the negotiators are at the level of dealing mostly with what we would call modalities of the deal. In other words, the -- the numbers of prisoners in Israel versus the number of hostages that will be released, the schedule, the time frame of how that would be done, and the exact details of -- of Israeli Defense Force withdrawals from -- from parts of Gaza. So it's really down to, you know, the brass, tax.

But as we've seen in the past, when you get down to that level of detail, you know you're close and you know the gaps can be closed, but that's when it gets really, really hard. That's when the negotiations become a little tougher. We do believe that we're in a different place now than were before, more than a year ago or even over the last recent months when we've been trying to get this deal in place because Hamas is much, much more weak, weaker, it's more isolated than it was before. There's a -- there's a feeling that they are more willing now to accept the deal and to move forward.

So there's optimism, but it's cautious optimism, Kasie. Again, we've been here before, and -- and we know that it's not done until it's all done. And not everything is -- is agreed to until everything's agreed to. So we've got to keep working at it.

HUNT: So, Admiral, what has changed, do you think that has allowed the conditions that you describe beyond simply the denigration of Hamas? I shouldn't say simply. It's obviously been a significant thing. We had an official tell us from Israel that what has basically changed is Donald Trump, that Donald Trump is the sort of incentive here. How do you view the incoming administration and the pressure that may bring to bear on this? Is it impacting what's going on?

KIRBY: Well, I would say what's fundamentally changed is, again, Hamas is in a much weaker position and they are now further isolated. They can't count on Hezbollah to come to their rescue anymore, because now we've got a ceasefire that we brokered between Israel and Hezbollah that continues to hold. They can't really count on Iran much more. I mean, Iran couldn't even come to Assad's relief in Syria. They are also much, much weaker because of the war that's been going on in -- in the region and because of the way that they have their capabilities have been degraded by the Israeli military.

It's a fundamentally different environment now for Mr. Sinwar, who is the military chief and -- and ostensibly the chief negotiator. He doesn't have the capabilities that he once had, he doesn't have the influence he once had, and he doesn't have the access to proxies and supporters that -- that they -- that Hamas once had. So it's a fundamentally different environment.

But again, we don't -- we're not taking anything for granted right now. We -- we got to keep working at this. We have been keeping the incoming Trump team, Mr. Witkoff in particular, completely informed. In fact, he's in the region, and he and Brett McGurk, our special coordinator for the Middle East, are talking literally multiple times a day, making sure that -- that we're fully coordinated.

Because if we get this deal, this week, Kasie, the implementation of it is going to take weeks and weeks going forward, and the new team is going to have to handle that implementation. So they've got to be up to speed on every fact, every detail as we move forward.

HUNT: President Biden, of course, talked about the deal in his speech today, and he praised his team. You mentioned Brett McGurk, but there are obviously others as well. How does getting this deal here in his final days in office, what does that mean to him, and how does it fit into his legacy as a world leader?

KIRBY: He's not thinking about his legacy, not when it comes to this. He's thinking about those hostages and those families and getting them reunited. He's thinking about increasing and a terrific surge of humanitarian assistance in to the Palestinian people who are so desperately in need of it. And they're also in need of peace and security on both, you know, both in Israel and in Gaza.

And a ceasefire would bring the war to an end, certainly all the fighting for a matter of weeks and hopefully bring an ultimate end to the conflict. That's what he's thinking about. He wants to get those hostages home. He wants to get the humanitarian assistance in, and he wants to end this war.

HUNT: All right, Admiral John Kirby, very grateful to have you on the program tonight. Thanks very much for your time today, sir.

KIRBY: Yes, ma'am.

[17:54:49]

HUNT: All right. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HUNT: All right, we have breaking news in our Law and Justice Lead. The special counsel who investigated President Joe Biden's son, Hunter, has just submitted his final report. Let's go to CNN's Evan Perez. Evan, what happens next?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kasie, this report about -- about 20 pages really outlines the reason why prosecutor David Weiss conducted this investigation. This is a six-year investigation which as you remember, Hunter Biden has plead -- pleaded guilty to tax charges. Earlier this year he also was found guilty by a jury in Delaware to gun related charges.

And right before he was sentenced, President Biden gave him an unconditional pardon. And I'll read you just a part of what David Weiss writes here. He defends his prosecutions. He says, I prosecuted the two cases against Mr. Biden because he broke the law. And then he takes a part of his report to essentially respond to Joe Biden, the President, who accused the Justice Department of -- of selectively prosecuting his son.

And he says no -- no -- no -- no other President has solely -- has -- has made these accusations against the Justice Department for -- for the part of a prosecution such as this one. Kasie?

[18:00:11]

HUNT: All right. Evan Perez for us tonight, Evan, thanks very much for that.

And you can follow me on X and Instagram at Kasie, and of course the show on X at TheLeadCNN. And if you ever miss an episode of The Lead, you can always listen to the show wherever you get your podcasts. Don't go anywhere right now the news continues right here on CNN with Wolf Blitzer in The Situation Room.