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The Lead with Jake Tapper
Chinese A.I. Startup "DeepSeek" Rattles U.S. Tech Stocks; Trump Fires Justice Department Officials Who Prosecuted Him; Officials Launch Crackdown On Unlawful Immigrants Across U.S.; Scores Of Palestinians Return To Devastated Northern Gaza; Marking 80 Years Since The Liberation Of Auschwitz. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired January 27, 2025 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:01]
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: I mean, people are waiting for hours for this thing. What weird thing would you wait in line to sniff?
BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Some scrambled eggs at a Super Bowl party. Yeah. You don't like scrambled eggs?
KEILAR: I love scrambled eggs, but not as. No, I want my wings. I want some seven layer dip. You want to up it to eight or nine? Really? Bring the game. That's fine.
SANCHEZ: Egg salad, with some celery salt.
KEILAR: No. Absolutely not. Absolutely not. You know who agrees with me? I'm sure.
Jake Tapper in THE LEAD starts with him right now.
SANCHEZ: I don't know about that.
JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Any minute, President Trump is going to be meeting with congressional Republicans down in Florida at his Doral resort.
THE LEAD starts right now.
The Trump administration kicking off week number two with two major overhauls, one cracking down on who gets to serve in the U.S. military, and two, who is in the United States illegally. The new rules and new raids happening nationwide.
Plus, thousands, tens of thousands of Palestinians in Gaza are returning to their homes as the cease fire appears to hold. What they are coming home to as world leaders debate what could happen to them and their land.
But first, the Chinese A.I. startup called DeepSeek taking the world by storm, operating like other A.I. companies but at a fraction of the cost, its crazy price tag and censorship that comes along with it.
(MUSIC) TAPPER: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.
And we're going to start with breaking news in our money lead and DeepSeek, a relatively new Chinese A.I. company, rattling U.S. stock markets today. The tech heavy Nasdaq closing down more than 3 percent. DeepSeek is only one year old, but already claims it can keep up with other A.I. platforms such as ChatGPT and at a fraction of the cost.
Let's get right to CNN's Matt Egan in New York.
Matt, why the panic by investors and why today?
MATT EGAN, CNN REPORTER: Well, Jake, Wall Street got rocked today by major developments on the A.I. front. The Nasdaq losing more than 3 percent. And Nvidia, which had been one of the hottest stocks on the planet, plunging 17 percent, losing more than $600 billion today alone. It's a staggering loss.
And all of this was set off by a little known Chinese A.I. startup called DeepSeek. DeepSeek stunning investors, and I would imagine officials in Washington by saying that its new AI. model can go toe to toe with ChatGPT, Google's Gemini and other leading A.I. models.
And here's the kicker. DeepSeek says that it's been able to do this without those next generation chips that Nvidia makes, and at a fraction of the cost. DeepSeek says it was able to train its A.I. model for less than $6 million. All of this is forcing investors to rethink some of the major foundational ideas that they had had, right? The previous thinking was that you had to spend gobs of money to train A.I. models, and that you needed the next generation computer chips.
Now, I should note that some of the market strategists, some of the A.I. experts I'm talking to, are a bit skeptical about some of these claims from DeepSeek. So there's still we need -- there's still a lot more that we need to learn here.
But look, Jake, investors we're already concerned before any of this news came out that some of the A.I. stocks had perhaps gotten too expensive, that some of the gains in the market had become too concentrated. And this news out of this Chinese startup is only going to amplify those concerns.
TAPPER: Matt Egan in New York, thanks so much.
Let's go to breaking news now in our law and justice lead, the new Trump administration has fired federal prosecutors at the Department of Justice who were involved in the criminal cases investigating President Trump and his role in the January 6th Capitol riots.
Let's get right to CNN's chief legal affairs correspondent, Paula Reid.
This news is breaking right now. Paula, tell us what's going on.
PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Jake, we have gotten so much news out of the Justice Department in just the past 30 minutes. Trump, Justice Department officials doing exactly what President Trump said he would do. Firing officials who worked on criminal investigations related to Trump and also launching an investigation into the prosecutions of January 6th.
Now, let's start with that first news. And that is this move to fire. We're told, over a dozen officials who worked on criminal investigations related to President Trump. The acting attorney general sent out a memo earlier notifying them that they are being removed from their positions, saying, quote, you played a significant role in prosecuting President Trump. The proper functioning of the government critically depends on the trust superior officials placed in their subordinates.
Given your significant role in prosecuting the president, I do not believe that the leadership of the department can trust you to assist in implementing the president's agenda faithfully.
So that has happened just in the past 15, 20 minutes.
[16:05:03]
And then earlier this afternoon, we learned that the Trump administration is also launching what is being described as a, quote, special project to investigate certain charges that were pursued in the larger January 6th investigation. So this isn't related to President Trump, but this is related to January 6th prosecutions, where individuals were charged with obstruction of justice.
Now, the interim U.S. attorney, Ed Martin, sent out a memo today saying that he wants to review cases where this charge was used. A senior administration official notes the fact that the Supreme Court reviewed this charge being used in the context of January 6th, that it could not be used in this context. So now all of these cases are being reviewed. The senior administration official called this a huge waste of resources and said, this is going to be a fact finding mission.
But of course, there are enormous concerns about the Trump Justice Department going after prosecutors. Of course, this was the largest criminal investigation and prosecution in the Justice Department's history. Trump has just pardoned most of the people who have been convicted. All but 14 were pardoned. The 14 received commutations, other people having their charges dismissed, but two incredibly big stories out of the Trump Justice Department in terms of how they are going to handle the criminal investigations that have occurred over the past four years.
TAPPER: Paula, was this a surprise?
REID: No, it is exactly what President Trump said he would do when he was on the campaign trail. He made it clear that he would fire Jack Smith. Officials that I've spoken with said that they could expect anyone who worked in Jack Smith's office to be pushed out. There is an enormous amount of distrust from the president's team of anyone who worked related to the special counsel's office.
So this -- it's not a surprise in terms of what they signaled they would do. But it is a surprise because these are career officials who are supposed to be impartial. They are supposed to be able to do their job, investigate, follow the facts where they may lead without retaliation.
Now, when it comes to reviewing, specifically the January 6th cases where they charge obstruction of justice, that is a little bit of a surprise, but this opens the door to a larger review of how the January 6th cases were handled.
Jake, as you know, the president has come under criticism for offering pardons that were much more broad than he had said he would. He said that he wouldn't likely pardon folks who had committed violent acts on January 6th. He pardoned many people who committed violence on that day, also commuted the sentences of others. So perhaps this is part of an effort to undermine the credibility and legitimacy of some of those cases.
TAPPER: Let's bring in CNN's chief national affairs correspondent, Jeff Zeleny.
And, Jeff, you're at the White House. The president campaigned on this, as Paula says.
JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: He campaigned on it. And it's been something that he has been thinking about for a long time. And this should not come as a surprise at all, as Paula was just saying there. But interesting in that letter that Paula was reading, if we break that down a little bit more, they're saying that these career officials cannot be trusted to implement the president's agenda. Very interesting words there.
Of course, the Department of Justice has long been viewed separately. It is not the president's lawyers, but that language certainly reflects what the president believes. And, Jake, thinking back to what President Trump still believes his biggest mistake was in his first term is appointing Jeff Sessions as the attorney general. Of course, he recused himself in the Russia investigation, and it went downhill from there.
So since that moment, the president has been intent on remaking the Justice Department in his own vision. He wants someone who is loyal to him. And this is also coming, this cleaning of house, if you will, is coming right before Pam Bondi is going to have a vote in the Senate and likely will be confirmed.
So it seems to me like trying to get some business taken care of before she becomes the attorney general, which everyone expects she's likely to earn even some Democratic votes. But this is not a surprise. But it is still noted for history that these career officials are being ousted, Jake.
TAPPER: All right. Jeff Zeleny and Paula Reid, thanks so much.
Let's turn now to our politics lead as President Donald Trump's agenda is unfolding in the form of a nationwide illegal immigration crackdown. Also, big changes inside the U.S. military. A source telling CNN that immigration and enforcement operations will
continue two to three times a week across the southeastern United States. This after nearly 1,000 people were arrested on Sunday in multiple cities, including Chicago, Atlanta, Los Angeles and Austin, Texas.
Our CNN team is covering every angle of this, and they're here with new reporting.
Let's begin with CNN's Priscilla Alvarez, who has the latest on the crackdown on undocumented immigrants in the United States. Priscilla ice says an immigration enforcement blitz by multiple federal agencies this weekend resulted in nearly 1,000 arrests. Put that number into perspective for us. And what do we know about the people who were targeted?
PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jake, sources tell me that this is a multi-day operation that is happening across the country. What they are calling those expanded or rather enhanced operations.
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Now, the number you're referring to, nearly 1,000 arrests just yesterday across the country. Now, when you compare that to the last fiscal year, it was around 300 arrests a day. So you can see that it is indeed a ramp up from where arrests have been.
Now the question is, is it sustainable, given the fact that the Department of Homeland Security has always historically had a limited resources? But the strategy here by the Trump administration is to bolster their ops with multiple federal agencies, including Justice Department agencies, who now have immigration authority. That includes DEA, ATF, U.S. Marshals all assisting ICE in this -- this crackdown across the country.
Now, I spoke to White House border czar Tom Homan yesterday evening, and he told me that this was, quote, a game changer. He was on the ground in Chicago, where this blitz was, in part, taking place. And he said that having all these agencies was, quote, a force multiplier, as he said, they sought out public safety and national security threats.
Now, of course, Trump officials have left on the table that there could be other undocumented immigrants who are swept up over the course of these operations. We don't have a breakdown of the numbers in terms of who the threats are and who else might have been taken, but they are certainly under pressure to deliver on the president's campaign and ramping up arrests on a daily basis -- Jake.
TAPPER: Let's go to David Culver now in Guatemala City, where one U.S. military plane and one commercial plane, both of them carrying repatriated migrants, landed today.
And, David, you spoke with the vice president of Guatemala today. What does she have to say about the deportations that have taken place so far? DAVID CULVER, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: She's been very
careful in how she's worded things, Jake. And I think that's in part because of what we saw between the U.S. and Colombia over the past 24 hours or so.
So the vice president, stressing that she wants to continue communications to be strong between the U.S. and Guatemala. She said that she's aware, obviously, that Secretary Rubio will be making a visit here in the coming days. And at the same time, she pushed back that there have been any changes since President Trump took office, especially with the number of migrants coming into Guatemala. She wanted to stress that it's been the same, and perhaps even down a bit at times compared with the Biden administration.
So that was significant. However, the change is that military aircraft are being allowed to land here in Guatemala. And she says that will not change. Now, one thing, we got a bit of an insight on was how those migrants are being returned here.
And it's interesting because we spoke to a group that took off from Louisiana, and many of them had kind of spanned anywhere from a few weeks to a few months being held by immigration officials in the U.S. and we caught up with one who says he was caught trespassing. But that was ten years ago, and only now has it really caught up with him.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CULVER: You have a four year old daughter and a four month old son.
FIDEL AMBROSIO, MIGRANT DEPORTED TO GUATEMAL: Yes. I left there.
CULVER: And they're in with your wife in the U.S.?
AMBROSIO: Yes. And I'm scared, because now, Trump, they say they have to go, you know, go with a criminal. But we're not a criminal. You know?
CULVER: But you have a trespassing conviction.
AMBROSIO: Yes, but it's -- to me, it's not like that.
CULVER: To you, it's not as serious a crime.
AMBROSIO: Yes. I'm not.
CULVER: Or do you think you'll go back?
AMBROSIO: I have to go back, for sure.
CULVER: You'll find a way back.
AMBROSIO: Yes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CULVER: That was one perspective. He was obviously determined to go back. He says even as President Trump is still president, and even if it means crossing illegally. However, several others we met with said they have no interest in returning to the U.S. one woman, who was 43, left behind her children and grandchildren in the U.S. and returned here in tears, just happy to be back in Guatemala after spending time in immigration detention. And she said for her, it's now a matter of just trying to figure out how to resettle her life back in Guatemala.
That's going to be the biggest challenge, though, Jake, is you've got people who fled this country, many of them during the 30-plus years of civil war and are trying to figure out not only how to step back into a place that, yes, has been able to figure out its security situation and to enhance it. But economically, there are still very few opportunities. So, they're trying to navigate that.
TAPPER: All right. David Culver in Guatemala City, Priscilla Alvarez here in Washington, D.C.
A busy afternoon, it's only getting busier. We're going to be looking out for reaction to the latest news. The president firing the prosecutor -- prosecutors who prosecuted him. Also in just a few minutes, President Trump is supposed to meet with House Republicans down in south Florida.
We'll talk to a high ranking Republican member what's on the priority list, including the price of eggs, you know, groceries -- the issue so many lawmakers promised action on immediately.
Stay with us.
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TAPPER: And we're back with our politics lead.
In just a few moments, President Trump will make it clear to House Republicans what he wants delivered in his legislative agenda, the smallest House majority since the onset of the Great Depression almost a century ago. We'll need to hash out how exactly it's members plan to enact Trump's ambitious agenda.
Those conversations are starting to take shape right now at the House Republicans annual conference, which this year is being held at Trump's golf resort in Doral, Florida, just outside Miami.
And we're joined now by house majority whip, Republican Congressman Tom Emmer of the great state of Minnesota. He's there. He joins us now.
Whip Emmer, thanks for joining us.
So I want to start on immigration, because in just the last few days, we've seen the Trump administration and ICE ramping up arrests. The president nearly launched a trade war with an ally, Colombia, over the use of military planes.
What do you think about the pace and approach to this issue that we've seen in the last week?
REP. TOM EMMER (R-MN): Jake, this is what he ran on. He's keeping the promise that he made, which is to make Americans safe. And the whole issue with Colombia the other day literally proves what he was talking about.
Why don't they want the rapists, murderers, and bad guys back? Well, apparently, Donald Trump, the master negotiator, got them to reconsider.
So not only are they taking them back, they're coming to get them with their own transportation.
So Donald Trump is just honoring the promise that he made to the American people.
TAPPER: So Trump's border czar, Tom Homan, suggests that the success in mass deportations of undocumented migrants hinges on how much money Congress allows, how much you give the Department of Homeland Security.
[16:20:11]
Take a listen to what he told ABC News.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TOM HOMAN, BORDER POLICY ADVISER: My success can be based on what Congress gives us more money, the better we're going to do.
MARTHA RADDATZ, ABC NEWS HOST: I notice you didn't put in that list of things that will be mission accomplished and success getting every immigrant who is in the country illegally out. Why not?
HOMAN: Because I'm being realistic. We can do what we can with the money we have.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: How much money are House Republicans willing to give to DHS specifically for deportations? And how much does it cost to deport people let's say a thousand people?
EMMER: Those are great questions, Jake. But bottom line is these are the people that are charged with enforcing this policy and getting it done. The White House, in conjunction with the House Republicans and the Republican Senate, will settle on all those details as we move forward in the next several weeks.
In the meantime, I would argue that the Trump administration has the funds that they need to get this initial work done. So it'll be an ongoing process. It'll be one of the things we discuss, no doubt, over the next few days here in Doral.
TAPPER: I want to get your reaction to some breaking news. A source tells CNN that more than a dozen Justice Department officials
who worked on the criminal investigations into President Trump have been fired.
These are, you know, in many cases, career prosecutors doing what they were instructed to do following the letter of the law. What do you make of these firings?
EMMER: Well, obviously, there's more to it, Jake. You say that they're following the letter of the law. Those are your words. Clearly, the executive branch works at the discretion of the executive, who happens to be Donald J. Trump.
And I have no doubt that if that decision was made, there was good faith basis for it, especially with the weaponization of the Justice Department.
So, not all of us agree with you necessarily that everything was being handled appropriately. And I think this is what you're going to see with this new administration is we're going to make sure that these bureaucracies, whether it's the Justice Department or any other executive agency, actually goes back to its mission of working for the American people, not against them.
TAPPER: So I do want to ask you about Trump firing all those inspectors. General, you have been, at least from what I can tell, in favor of the important role of inspectors general. In 2021, you offered an amendment to provide more resources for the Treasury Department inspector general and housing to ensure that they make sure that COVID relief funds for rent assistance were not abused. Just this month, you and a few of your colleagues introduced a bill calling on the inspector general of HUD to testify before Congress.
Are you not at all concerned about Trump firing these inspectors general without notifying Congress, as required by law? And how can you? Sure -- how can you make sure that they will be replaced by people who will protect the taxpayer and not be loyalists to President Trump?
EMMER: You do. You are correct that I support the attorneys general. The concept and the position, but you didn't point out, Jake, that those attorneys general that I was making contact with never responded. They never gave us the information we asked for it. In this case, Donald Trump again, is the executive.
These people serve at the discretion of the executive, regardless of what people think of what Donald Trump did. This is well within his right to do. And it's -- this is -- we're going to move on, and he's going to replace these people.
TAPPER: All right. House Whip Tom Emmer of Minnesota, thanks for joining us and sticking with us, even though its pretty loud where you are, I appreciate it.
We're getting new video today from the Gaza Strip showing this -- showing the devastation and the overwhelming trek north for so many Palestinians, a cease fire there is holding. Hamas is finally releasing hostages, but entirely new challenges are emerging. We're going to go live to Tel Aviv next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
TAPPER: New video today in the world showing scores and scores of Palestinians all on foot, all en route toward northern Gaza. For many, it's the first time they've been able to return home after 15 months of war. A war started on October 7th, 2023 by the terrorist group Hamas attacking Israel and then Israel, responding with a relentless bombing campaign.
As for what will happen to all of these people and the bombed out land, so many of them had called home, President Trump was asked about that. His answer has created something of an uproar.
CNN's Jeremy Diamond reports now from Tel Aviv.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Today, the masses of people trekking up Gaza's coastal road are not being forced to flee. They are returning home.
(SINGING)
DIAMOND: The Palestinian people are going back to their homes, this man shouts, announcing his joy to anyone who will listen. It's a great happiness. We feel like we can fly.
After being displaced for months on end, tens of thousands of Palestinians are finally returning to northern Gaza, shielded by the guarantees of a six week ceasefire.
This river of humanity flows for miles and miles, underscoring the magnitude of the last 15 months of war.
[16:30:08]
For many, like Eyad al-Masri, their journey began in southern Gaza, taking down their tents they hope forever.
I'm taking these four bags and going back to my house, Eyad says. I don't know if it is still standing or not, but I'm going back to Beit Hanoun.
People quickly crowd around the few busses heading north. Babies and belongings hoisted with urgency. Others carry what they can, taking their chances on foot. Trudging through this uneven coastal road, young and old alike are determined to push past fatigue and return home.
For the first of many, that moment came shortly after 9:00 a.m., crossing an abandoned Israeli checkpoint where masked Hamas militants now stand watch. Israel agreed to open the road to northern Gaza only after resolving a two-day dispute with Hamas over the fate of an Israeli hostage, Arbel Yehud. Hamas now set to release her alongside the captive Israeli soldier Agam Berger and a third hostage on Thursday.
Back in Gaza, this is what most are returning to, bombed out buildings and heaps of rubble now line the streets.
Even amid the destruction, there is joy as family members, separated by war, reunite.
Thank God, Muataz says as he kisses his mother and embraces his daughter. He hasn't seen them in ten months.
Amid the reunions, there are also. Tears as people set foot on the land they call home once again.
I'm crying right now out of happiness, this man says. I don't want anything except to enter my homeland.
The enormity of the destruction in Gaza, prompting President Trump to call for moving Palestinians out of Gaza.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I'd like Egypt to take people and I'd like Jordan to take people. I can -- I mean, you're talking about probably a million and a half people and we just clean out that whole thing.
DIAMOND: Among those who camped out for days near the checkpoint in northern Gaza, waiting for it to open, Trump's idea is quickly rejected.
We say to Trump, no, and a million one noes. We will stay here. We will stay in Gaza, he says, even if it is a pile of rubble.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
DIAMOND (on camera): And Jake, it is not just Palestinians in Gaza who are rejecting President Trump's plan there. Both Jordan and Egypt, the countries Trump said he would send the Palestinians to, have said that it is a nonstarter, saying they reject the displacement of Palestinians, with the foreign minister of Jordan saying Palestine is for Palestinians and Jordan is for Jordanians -- Jake.
TAPPER: Jeremy, what have we learned today about the conditions that the hostages held by Hamas were held under?
DIAMOND: Well, the Israeli military held a briefing today giving us some details about what they've learned since debriefing some of these recently freed hostages. They said that some of them had been held in tunnels without emerging for as long as eight months. They also said that some of these newly freed hostages showed symptoms of what they described as, quote, mild starvation, pointing to vitamin deficiencies, changes in their metabolism as well. But they did say that Hamas fed them better and also allowed them to bathe in the days before they were released, presumably to make them appear healthier than they were when they emerged from Gaza -- Jake.
TAPPER: All right. Jeremy Diamond, thanks so much.
Earlier this hour, we told you how President Trump is firing Department of Justice prosecutors who investigated him. His administration is also getting rid of government watchdogs in charge of hunting down fraud and corruption. We're going to speak with one of those officials getting the boot, next.
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TAPPER: In our law and justice lead: gutting the guardians. President Trump ousting more than a dozen inspectors general on Friday. Those are the government watchdogs tasked with rooting out fraud and corruption. The president's move is in an apparent violation of a 2022 law that requires a president to notify Congress and give 30 days notice before such an action.
When asked on CNN, Senator Lindsey Graham both affirmed that the president kind of broke the law and then tried to justify it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R-SC): Yeah. I think, you know, yeah, he should have done that. But the question is, is it okay for him to put people in place that he thinks can carry out his agenda? Yeah, he feels like the government hasn't worked very well for the American people. These watchdog folks did a pretty lousy job. And he wants some new eyes on Washington. And that makes sense to me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: Joining me now is one of the inspectors general fired by President Trump, former Interior Department Inspector General Matt Greenblatt. Let's note he had been serving in the position since 2019. So technically was a Trump era appointee.
So you heard, Senator Graham there. Were you given any indication that you or your colleagues were doing a, quote, lousy job?
MATT GREENBLATT, FORMER INTERIOR DEPARTMENT INSPECTOR GENERAL: No. All -- all indications were to the contrary. Folks on the Hill, you know, from both parties, have for years relied on work from the inspector general community and we add great value, billions and billions of dollars return to the Treasury based on our work. And we go about preventing waste, fraud and abuse in a highly effective way. And so we've never heard those concerns prior to Senator Graham's comments a few moments ago.
TAPPER: You've had some time to process this now. Is there any legal recourse, recourse for you here? And if there is, are you going to pursue it?
[16:40:01] GREENBLATT: I don't want to comment on anything along those lines. Right now, the big thing from my perspective is preserving the independence of inspectors general. That is an oasis of apolitical oversight inside the federal government, and we need to preserve that. Just as an American taxpayer, we all need to stand up and prevent the politicization of those positions.
TAPPER: So Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Chuck Grassley, who's a big inspector general person, he's been supporting the community for a long time, he said in a statement this weekend, quote: There may be good reason the IGs were fired. We need to know that. If so, I'd like further explanation from President Trump. Regardless, the 30 day detailed notice of removal that the law demands was not provided to Congress.
I have to say, as somebody who has admired Chairman Grassley's position on inspectors general for decades, I'm kind of surprised by the rather sanguine tone there.
Do you think there's any appetite in the Republican Party to challenge what the president did here?
GREENBLATT: Well, I don't know what -- what they may be thinking with respect to, you know, the folks on the Hill right now, but I would hope that they would care as long term stakeholders in the OIG community, as consumers of the work product that we, you know, put forward every day in fighting waste, fraud and abuse and trying to make the government more efficient. We would hope that they would want us to be independent and therefore, you know, they are the sentries at the gate, if you will, with respect to protecting OIG independence.
And so I would hope that the folks in Congress who want us to be independent would stand up for those principles.
TAPPER: Well, let me just ask you a question, and I'm sorry that I didn't come more prepared for this specific question. I honestly don't know the answer to it.
Did you do things in the last four years that appropriately irked the Biden administration? Appropriately, appropriately pointed out to the interior secretary, Deb Haaland, things that were going on under her nose that she should have known about or that she should take care of.
GREENBLATT: Yeah, absolutely. We had a number of reports that found misconduct by senior political officials, President Joe Biden appointees, and we also found some cases where they didn't engage in misconduct. And we -- we called it like we see it. That's what our job is.
And we did the same thing under the Trump administration. And, you know, going back years and years, that's what we do. We call balls and strikes every single day. And that's why it matters that we're independent, is that we can speak truth to power, both identifying problems and saying, hey, folks, things, things are going well in this particular area.
TAPPER: How many inspectors there are like 76 or something inspector's general?
GREENBLATT: Seventy-three.
TAPPER: Seventy-three? And how many of them like are presidential appointee, kind of?
GREENBLATT: Right. So there are two camps and it's roughly split half and half with presidential appointees on the one side and what they call designated federal entities on the other side. And those are appointed by the agency head, not the president.
TAPPER: And of the 36 or so that are, like you, presidentially appointed, how many were fired?
GREENBLATT: It was at least 17 or 18. Were actually were actually sifting through the rubble right now to determine what that number is. We learned of two additional ones over the weekend. And so it's the number its a bit of a moving target right now. And we don't know. And we're -- we're finding out but were in the order of magnitude at 17 or 18 at this point.
TAPPER: Do you -- I don't know if you feel this way or if your fellow inspectors general do, but like, do you think that this is because they want to appoint factotums, toadies in their positions? Just people who are going to support Trump no matter what?
GREENBLATT: Well, that's the question. You know, when Senator Graham was talking about, you know, nominating and appointing folks who would implement the president's agenda, that's not the role.
TAPPER: That's not the job of the IG.
GREENBLATT: That's exactly right. The inspector general is supposed to be divorced from policy, divorced from any sort of, you know, political actions. We are there to be independent --
TAPPER: Yeah.
GREENBLATT: -- so that we don't have a dog in the fight.
That's why people trust our work product. We are supposed to be the taxpayers representatives on the inside, so that folks can have confidence that there's someone, you know, looking out for their tax dollars, you know, day in and day out.
TAPPER: All right. Former Interior Department Inspector General Matt Greenblatt, thanks so much for being here. Appreciate it.
GREENBLATT: Thank you very much.
TAPPER: Coming up next, the difficult return to Auschwitz 80 years later. Hear what a group of survivors recall about the horrors that happened there and their emotional experience revisiting what was the largest and deadliest Nazi death camp.
Stay with us. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:49:06]
TAPPER: In our world lead, Holocaust survivors and leaders from around the world gathered outside Auschwitz, marking 80 years since the Nazi concentration camp in Poland was liberated. Between 1940 and 1945, more than 1.1 million people, most of them Jewish, were murdered at the camp complex.
CNN's Melissa Bell has more.
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MELISSA BELL, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Their numbers dwindling but their resolve intact. Survivors supported by their families making the difficult journey back to Auschwitz- Birkenau, the largest and deadliest of the Nazi camps.
JONA LAKS, HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR: At my advanced age, it's really courageous to come back. I must say it, I didn't want to, but it's necessary. It's necessary for the world to know.
[16:50:03]
BELL: Jona Laks was just 14 when she was brought by cattle car to Auschwitz with her twin sister, Miriam, and their older sister Chana (ph), in 1944.
By then, most of the more than 1 million people who pass through these infamous gates had been sent straight to their deaths in the gas chambers.
But Jona and Miriam say they were spared by the notorious Nazi doctor, Josef Mengele.
LAKS: Obviously, we were satisfied to get an additional pair of twins for his notorious experiments.
BELL: Were you and Miriam experimented on?
LAKS: We were, of course.
BELL: The serial number tattooed on her arm may have faded, but the memories of the survivors gathered at Auschwitz on Monday were razor sharp.
TOVA FREIDMAN, HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR: I held on tightly to my mother's hand in the dark cattle car for countless hours, while the cries and the prayers of so many desperate women permeated my soul and haunt me to this day.
BELL: Eighty years after the camp's liberation, this may be the last time that the voices of survivors are heard at Auschwitz.
MARIAN TURSKI, HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR (through translator): Those who lived to see freedom, there were really hardly any, so few. And now, there is only a handful left.
BELL: It will soon fall to others, academics, monuments and museums to make sure the enormity of what happened here isn't forgotten.
How important is it that the world marks this and understands what happened?
LAKS: Perhaps it would, hopefully, remind the world that human life is sacred and should be honored.
BELL: Melissa Bell, CNN, Auschwitz-Birkenau.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TAPPER: And our thanks to Melissa Bell for that report.
Let's bring in Van Jones, who joins us now live from Poland, who was at today's Auschwitz commemoration event.
Van, thanks for joining us. So Auschwitz remains a symbol of the worst of man. The atrocities committed in World War Two. What was it like to hear from survivors today?
VAN JONES, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: You know, everybody thinks they understand the holocaust. And that's dangerous. It's very dangerous because it's become something that because you think you know it, you push past it, to talk to people who are literally babies, who were children, who saw other children murdered. The numbers are unbelievable.
Think about 250,000 children. Imagine a stadium of 50,000 filled up with nothing but children. And then another one. And then another one. Five stadiums, all of those children murdered in less than 700 surviving.
I got a chance to meet some of those 700 children who are a part of a quarter million children who were murdered in that one place. It's very difficult to get your head wrapped around that.
Also, hate is nothing to fool around with. You got people throwing up Nazi salutes. You got people in comments saying a bunch of stuff.
L.A. just burned down almost because a little fire got out of control. Europe burned down because a fire of hatred got out of control. Six million Jews murdered, 60 million people killed because people were talking hate and people thought it was funny and people didn't take it seriously. I got a chance to talk to people, children who literally their parents had to carry them through sewers, trying to keep them alive, trying to escape the Warsaw ghetto.
I -- it's -- when you listen to what actually happened and you think about what it means for a million people to have been murdered in just that one spot, think about 9/11, 3,000 people murdered. We've never gotten over it as a country. They were killing in that one spot 6,000 human beings a day, a factory to murder people, two 9/11s every day, day after day, including weekends for weeks, for months, for years, years.
You cannot get your mind wrapped around what happened. And it was engineers. It was architects. It was not just brutes and savages. Hate can get into people and have people do horrific things.
You got to stop hate when it's small. What's happening in America right now, the antisemitism, the all the Nazi role-playing, all that needs to stop immediately.
[16:55:03]
Listen to these survivors. We cannot go down that road again.
TAPPER: Van Jones, thank you so much. Appreciate it, sir.
Today, marks one week on the job for President Trump, and the big news this hour, he's firing the federal prosecutors who investigated him. We're standing by to see the president as he meets with House Republicans in just a few minutes.
What else might be at the top of his agenda?
CNN's Kaitlan Collins is looking into all of this. She'll join us next.
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TAPPER: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.
This hour of the Super Bowl is finally set. Indeed, it is. Will we hear the celebratory notes of "Fly, Eagles, fly"? What does history say about the Chiefs' pursuit of a three-peat? And how much more should we all expect to shell out for our watch parties this year?
Plus, a stunning announcement sends U.S. stocks plunging right on the heels of President Trump's --