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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Now, News Conference On U.K. Parade Crash; Trump Delays 50 Percent On European Union Until July 9; Trump Escalates Attacks On Harvard In Memorial Day Posts; Severe Storms In South Disrupt Memorial Day Travelers; Gas Prices Could Dip Lower Ahead Of Summer Vacation Season; Macron Dismisses Video Showing Apparent Shove From Wife. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired May 26, 2025 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:04]

LIAM ROBINSON, LIVERPOOL CITY COUNCIL: I would appeal for people please do not share the horrifying footage of the incident on social media. Please if you have any information, forward it to Merseyside Police to help them with their investigation. We won't be commenting any further, but we will provide relevant updates as and when we know more and it's appropriate to do so.

Once again, our hearts go out to all of those affected. Liverpool is a city that has a proud history of coming together and supporting each other during challenging times. I have no doubt that will again be the case over the coming days and weeks. Thank you.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN HOST: Welcome to The Lead. I'm Phil Mattingly in for Jake Tapper.

We begin with what we were just watching this hour, the breaking news in our World Lead. You've been listening to the U.K. police giving an update. At least 27 people have been hospitalized after a man drove a car into a crowd of people during Liverpool Football Club's victory parade.

Let's go straight to CNN's Max Foster. Max, new information throughout the course of that press conference, what are we just learn?

MAX FOSTER, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Well, what we've learned that this happened right at the end of the parade, about 6:00, a car going into the crowd. Still not clear why that was. All we know that it was a 53-year-old white British male, and 27 people were injured, two of them seriously.

Four of the injured were children, sadly. One of the seriously injured is a child as well. Just speaks to this wonderful celebration for this city, almost a global event, because Liverpool is followed all over the world. They had this massive championship success. The day was just finishing and a car somehow ends up in the crowd.

That is still a mystery, Phil. We have no idea how a car managed to get into the crowd. But we're going to get some more information, I'm sure, as the investigation unfolds. What the police are very clear on is they don't want all of this speculation online. They've seen how with previous incidents, that's blown up beyond any sort of understanding and there have been more instance that follows.

So, that's why they're emphasizing, this was a white British man, but he hasn't been charged yet, as far as we know. So, still no sense of exactly why he did it, why this car went into the crowd.

MATTINGLY: Yes. Max, what they haven't said makes very clear that they don't want speculation, but what they are saying does make very clear what they think right now, I think on some level, which is not being investigated as terrorism, they're not seeking additional suspects or persons of interest. This was an isolated incident, according to what they were just saying. What are witnesses saying about what they actually saw?

FOSTER: Well, I think everyone's completely baffled about why it was there, and there's absolute horror stories about what was happening at the time. There's lots of video coming out and like the police were trying to verify all of it, but there were thousand -- along that street, there were hundreds of thousands basically around the parade in Central Liverpool. Along that street, there were tens of thousands.

So, this was just a horrific scene, and no one knew what was going on. It felt very chaotic. And, of course, you know, with the history of things that have happened around the world recently with vehicles, particularly here in Europe, there was complete panic about this being some sort of attack.

So, a massive relief to people that this isn't being investigated as terrorism, and that's a very clear signal because they would -- you know, they --- as you know, Phil, if they weren't sure it wasn't terrorism, they wouldn't be saying it right now. The anti-terrorism police would be called in automatically the beginning and they've already been stood down.

So, there's some mysterious reason why this car was in the crowd and quite how it was allowed into a pedestrianized area at that time is going to be a huge topic of debate here over the next 24 hours and onwards.

MATTINGLY: Yes, no question about that. Max Foster, great reporting, as always. Thanks so much.

Let's discuss now with Juliette Kayyem, former assistant secretary for the Department of Homeland Security, and Steve Moore, retired FBI supervisory special agent.

Juliette, you know, police just said incidents not being treated as terrorism. What does it tell you about what they could actually be investigating here?

JULIETTE KAYYEM, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Yes, and it, it was very clear at the outset a horrific incident, fortunately, so far, no casualties. When the British calls something a major incident, they are -- and this is the language that they were using, that is for people in my field has very specific meaning. It means it is not terrorism related. It means a response that is outside standard operating procedure, sort of a mega event incident, in which you're going to have to surge resources, but does not entail a terrorism nexus. At least that's what they think the stage.

So, from the beginning, they were setting the stage.

[18:05:01]

They mentioned what his race was, that he was white, just to temper any speculation about people's concerns about previous terror incidents, obviously using vehicle in Europe. And they also said that that there was no other links to anyone else than, essentially the investigation's over, except for understanding his motive. So, that was very much scene-setting for obvious reasons, because this is a horrible incident. No reason to whip everyone up into thinking it was a different kind of horrible incident.

MATTINGLY: You know, Steve, I think anybody who has been paying attention to anything like this over the course of the last several years, I know you and Juliette certainly have, immediately thought the worst in this type of situation in terms of the intent or what the motive was. The police very quickly seemed to figure out that this was an isolated incident. What's the process in that?

STEVE MOORE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT CONTRIBUTOR: Well, the process, very quickly, is you have to know what you're dealing with, whether there are going to be follow-ons, whether as, as they said, there was going to be -- this was going to be an isolated incident or not.

And so, really, what you're trying to do in, in just the shortest amount of time, humanly possible, is to get the driver, the living driver, to a place where you can talk to them, get some kind of indication of their motive. Are they distraught? Are they saying what happened? I don't know. The car just accelerated on me. Or are they saying defiant things or angry things? So, that is the first thing you have to do when you were fortunate enough to have this suspect right then and there.

And in this case, it seems that they're not, they're not ruling out that this was a crime. They're just saying it wasn't a crime that was directed, excuse me, towards social or political change, which means it could be a hate crime, it could be any other type of crime. But they're ruling out terrors. So, they apparently have some kind of scope on this.

MATTINGLY: Juliette, there are a lot of things, a lot of questions we're all going to be asking, but I want to also ask you guys in a second about this, how a car could actually get into a crowd like this. But I actually want to give credit where it's due in terms of response time here and what was described in that press conference we just heard. Because I think if you've seen the videos, which are absolutely horrifying and you've heard what witnesses are saying. The fact that it was a mass casualty event, it was horrifying.

At this point, there were no deaths, obviously. They said there were two in the hospital that are seriously injured. One of those is a children is a child, four children in total, among the 27 that were taken to the hospital. But we just heard one of the officials describe that they had to lift up the car and take four people out from underneath the car, including one of the children.

The response time here, what you saw, what you've heard from emergency officials, what did it tell you?

KAYYEM: So, it's a really hard thing to talk about in our field because, obviously, anyone who gets hurt is -- that is a tragedy. But if you have 27 hospitalized and no one dead yet -- and I saw those pictures today. I, like you, have been on standby for several hours anticipating something much worse. And that has to go to response time. In other words, you're sort of judging success in something like this when something bad happens, by how quick you can get people to hospitals, triage their injuries, focus on survivability and then knowing that they're already harmed. You know, this is not good news, but, in some ways, the fact that you were able to have an incident like this and then get to the triage of the hospital, we don't know how many hospitals they were taken to around the area.

That only happens -- that isn't luck. That isn't Liverpool luck. That is because of the extensive training that was going on. So, at the press conference, what you -- before this at the press conference, you heard one of the officials say, here's where we were pre-positioned, here's where we were planning, here's where we were practicing and drilling for the potential for a mega event or incident. And we will find out why this loophole, like what happened here? Was it because it was at the end of the parade? It was later in the evening when things start -- when public safety starts to withdraw.

But you're exactly right, Phil. It is -- I saw those pictures too. We should not be posting them. They're pretty horrific. And I'm pleasantly surprised, which I rarely am, that we have numbers like this right now. It's just a hard thing to say, but it is true.

MATTINGLY: Yes. And, and I just want to make crystal clear, because I asked the question. Nobody's diminishing or minimizing the horror of what happened or the injured that were taken (ph). The reason why I'm asking is because, again, what we saw, but also what was described in that press conference, it's very notable, because we're going to spend a lot of time trying to figure out how this actually happened.

[18:10:06]

And it seems somewhat miraculous what they have described up to this point in terms of their reaction.

And, Steve, when it comes to how this happened, I just -- the equivalent for the audience who doesn't necessarily follow the EPL or know kind of what Liverpool Football Club is, it's when a championship team in Philadelphia or New York wins, and this is their celebration parade, it's hundreds of thousands of people, you can see in the pictures. How does a car get in there?

MOORE: Yes. Well, I think Juliette said it very, very succinctly. This was at the end of the parade. This was at a time where status of the inner and outer perimeters were actually changing. When you have a static situation and your inner and outer perimeters are set, or even your three perimeters are set, they know what their job is, they know what they're doing, and they're in a static position. Anytime the situation changes, saying, we're shutting down, or we are changing, or we have a moving perimeter with the buses themselves, those things add complication and complication adds vulnerability.

And you could have had a situation, and I'm not alleging this, but you could have had a situation where an outer perimeter might have heard, oh, it's passed here and it's -- we're done with this section, and they started releasing vehicles. I'm not sure that would've happened because there was only one there.

Either way, you're going to have to do a hot wash or debrief and find out exactly where this car was. Was it in the perimeter to begin with? There's all sorts of information out there from cameras and witnesses, and they're just going to deconstruct how this thing was allowed to happen.

But, yes, I mean, I just came last year went to the Dodgers World Series parade and the inners and the outer perimeters, the barriers they had set up were very elaborate.

MATTINGLY: Yes, there are certainly a lot of questions that still need to be answered. Always I appreciate you guys' perspective. Juliette Kayyem, Steve Moore, thanks so much.

Well, coming up, President Trump has made yet another threat in his standoff against Harvard University. Hint, it involves taking away a large sum of money.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:15:00]

MATTINGLY: Turning to our Money Lead, President Trump once again creating some uncertainty in the economy by moving the goalposts on his trade war, delaying the 50 percent tariffs on European Union goods until July 9th, more than a month after his original June 1st deadline.

CNN's Kristen Holmes is at the White House for us. And, Kristen, walk us through where we're actually at right now.

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Phil, trade negotiations between the E.U. and the U.S. are back in full swing, which kind of makes you wonder if that was the point of these threats to begin with, to get the ball rolling. We know that the E.U.'s trade commissioner spoke on the phone today to Secretary of Commerce Howard Lutnick, who is effectively in control of about half of the countries that they're doing trade deals with. Secretary of Treasury Scott Bessent is in charge of the other half.

Now, the trade commissioner described it as a, quote, good call, but this is the part that really matters. He said that the E.U. was fully committed to constructive and focused efforts at pace towards a deal, because part of the complaints that we've been hearing from the White House was that the E.U. was moving too slowly. In fact, when Donald Trump suggested these 50 percent tariffs to start on June 1st, he said it was because discussions were going nowhere and the bloc of nations was very difficult to work with.

Now, of course, we know that this delay came after Trump got a call from the president of the European Union, and he said that they asked for this extension to July 9th. The head of the European Union said they wanted that extension to reach a, quote, good deal. Clearly knowing their audience there and trying to ask for that extension. We will see how this goes.

Obviously, all of this creates a volatility in the market, but we know Donald Trump himself has used these tariffs time and time again to kind of leverage the United States and trying to get the other countries to do what he wants them to do. So, clearly, in this case, if the effort was to try and get the ball moving, he was successful in trying to threaten with those 50 percent tariffs.

MATTINGLY: And we all got to have a lot of fun for 48 hours along the way.

Kristen Holmes, as always, from the North Lawn of the White House, thanks so much.

Well, here to discuss all this, Marc Short, former chief of staff for Vice President Mike Pence.

Marc your view on tariffs is where Republicans were for decades, not so much anymore. You also had a view inside the White House in terms of how the president thinks through processes like this. It is difficult to divine what's meant as a threat, what's meant just blowing off steam and what people should take very, very seriously because he's deployed all three, this administration. What does that do for foreign counterparts?

MARC SHORT, FORMER CHIEF OF STAFF TO V.P. MIKE PENCE: Well, I think first, I think it has a tremendous cooling effect on the American economy. I do think he used tariffs as leverage during the first administration as well, on steel, on aluminum, but principally to, I think, rally the globe against China. I think the approach this administration has been so universal in where he's alleging the tariffs that it does have a cooling effect on the economy.

I think it hurts the same blue collar workers that I think helped propel him to victory. There's a story in the Wall Street Journal today about all the port workers out in California who are now getting laid off, the truckers who are getting laid off, a lot of the logistics people who I think were predominantly Trump voters who are now losing their jobs because of this trade war across the globe.

And I think also, Phil, you know, if it's 50 percent on E.U., that's actually higher than it is on Communist China now that he's put forward. So, I think there's also a weakening about what his position is on China as opposed to isolating China. You're now alleging tariffs hire on the European Union, that has been our ally in looking to isolate China. You have a higher tariff on E.U. than you do on China. And as you know, the president has refused to enforce the law on TikTok.

[18:20:01]

So, it certainly seems like it's a pretty weak approach to China right now.

MATTINGLY: It is difficult, again, to understand kind of the through line sometimes, because you talk to administration, economic officials and they've kind of made this -- slowly moved their way into like, hey, we're going to start isolating them because we're working with our Indo-Pacific partners and then something like this happens.

One of the things, though, I want to really wanted to ask you about this, because in 2017, you and I spent a lot of late nights in the Capitol, on the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act. You were inside the room. I was waiting in a hallway outside. You were often kind enough to stop and talk on the way out. You dealt with the Senate. You dealt with Senator Ron Johnson in particular on this bill. How does this needle get thread here on the big, beautiful bill?

SHORT: Well, on the tax bill, I think we continue to underestimate Mike Johnson generally. I mean, how much of the narrative was that he'd be hard to get a reelected speaker, that he would have a hard time avoiding government shutdown, that he wouldn't get this tax bill through. And I think he's proven to be an incredibly effective speaker of the House.

The 215-214 margin in the house, though, I think, shows how little margin that actually is to change this bill. The Senate's prerogative always is to want to not accept what the House sends, and so the Senate will do their thing.

The question, I think at the end of the day, Phil, is does it actually go to conference and come out more like the House bill or do they whittle us down, looks more like the house bill coming out of the Senate too? You're right, there were plenty of centers in 2017. It wasn't just Ron Johnson. There was Jeff Flake, there was Bob Corker. There were plenty of Republicans who had their own peace of mind about what the tax bill should be. That's the nature of the Senate, and that's the play that Ron Johnson's playing right now. But the math is not there to change this bill significantly in the House.

MATTINGLY: I said hairs standing up the back of my neck, pass-throughs with Ron Johnson, deficit neutral with Bob Corker.

To that point, though, I'm trying to think, what do you think the president's role is in getting this cross the finish line? Because I actually agree and I think it's underappreciated Mike Johnson's ability, like five or six consecutive really, really tough votes. And he's cleared every single hurdle up to this point, he's going to need the president in the Senate.

SHORT: He will. And I think the Senate will work its way for the next probably couple months. I think probably before the August recess is when the president should probably lean in a little bit heavier and try and push Republican senator to get on board.

I do think that right now, the president still has enormous support amongst primary voters since that gives him enormous leverage. Where I think he's been bleeding support is probably among independent voters. But I think as long as he continues that strong support among primary voters, he can get his way in the Senate.

MATTINGLY: Deficit neutrality was something Stephen Mnuchin talked about constantly. I don't necessarily know that the studies have totally borne that out with the 2017 law. There're some people would dispute that. I don't think the numbers do though.

The idea here, adding this much to the deficit on the tax cut side, spending cut side, $3.8 trillion is significant, but the bond market's clearly a little unsettled right now. What do you make of that?

SHORT: Well, I think, one, the CBO had underestimated enormously what the tax revenue would be. They've underestimated by trillions of dollars. And so I'm in the camp that really does not really think that we should put our eggs in the basket of what CBO projects as far as its forecast.

I think the bond market actually began to get wobbly during the trade battle, and I think it's extended into some of the tax battle. But I think much of this really began during the trade back and forth. And I think that remains a concern as far as how far the president can go with this trade war he is fighting.

MATTINGLY: Why do you think it remains a concern, Marc? Is there --

SHORT: You saw how they reacted. You saw how they quickly reacted to it.

MATTINGLY: Marc Short, I really appreciate you.

SHORT: Yes, thanks so much.

MATTINGLY: Well, at a time when President Trump is making new threats against Harvard, a high profile government official has made a rather pointed remark about the importance of American universities. How might that be going over? We'll have it next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:25:00]

MATTINGLY: In Our Politics Lead, this morning, President Trump continued his attacks on Harvard University. His latest threat, the president posting on Truth Social that he may take, quote, $3 billion of grant money away from very anti-Semitic Harvard and giving it to trade schools all across the land. In another post the president slammed the university for not handing over a list of foreign students that he demanded last week, posting, quote, Harvard is very slow and the presentation of these documents, and probably for good reason. But have no fear, the government will, in the end, win. Now, this comes after Harvard sued the Trump administration over the Department of Homeland Security that tried to revoke its ability to enroll international students. A federal judge has temporarily halted that ban.

Here to discuss this and more is our panel. Thank you both for being here. Shermichael, let me start with you. In light of the escalating attacks on Harvard, I want to play something from Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell. He said it at Princeton University yesterday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEROME POWELL, FEDERAL RESERVE CHAIRMAN: Our great universities are the envy of the world and a crucial national asset. Look around you, and I urge you to take none of this for granted. When you look back in 50 years, you will want to know that you've done whatever it takes to preserve and strengthen our democracy and bring us ever closer to the founder's timeless ideals.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Shermichael, put the lighting aside there, which is -- well, I mean it's -- the Fed chair is no stranger to tangling with the president. But those comments were pretty obvious in terms of intent. What do you make up of that?

SHERMICHAEL SINGLETON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I mean, I agree that institutions like Harvard is certainly a beacon of what America has to offer. I'm not necessarily against having some foreign students attend the university. I'm concerned about the number of Chinese students. I don't want to educate our adversary. That's a separate conversation. However, taking $3 billion away and appropriating that money for trade, that would absolutely benefit way more Americans than the number of Americans who attend Ivy League institutions, such as Harvard.

And I would say the president's overall argument in general, you think about this from this perspective, Harvard lets in, I believe, 27 percent of its total population is foreign students, about one in four. Now, if you were to decrease that, you open up potential slots for a lot of underprivileged individuals. And I'm not just talking about black kids here. I'm talking about any ethnicity, Hispanic underprivileged, white underprivileged.

[18:30:02]

You would be given an opportunity to attend an institution such as Harvard because they have the intellectual faculties, but they don't let in a lot of underprivileged students.

So, I think there is a legitimate argument to make, can you make more room for more Americans compared to the foreign students that we've made room for?

MATTINGLY: That is a more thorough argument than I've seen the president make. And the trade school, I don't think anybody disagrees on the trade schools and trying to redirect funding towards trade schools has been something bipartisan administration that tried to do over the course of the last decade or two.

I'm just interested, you know, to Shermichael's point, how do you think that tracks with what's happening right now?

AMESHIA CROSS, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, he makes a good point, but it belies something that's totally incorrect. Of the large percentage of that 27 percent of international students who attend Harvard University at any given point, the overwhelming majority are for grad school. This is not students who are undergraduate at all. They're talking about graduate school admissions.

So, we're talking about those at the Harvard Kennedy School, for instance, studying government. We're talking about those largely at the School of Medicine, who are your next innovators when it comes to breakthroughs and cancer research and things like that.

Those students aren't moving towards trade schools. They're not making the decision between going to a Harvard graduate school versus going to a trade school. Those are two very different tracks. We're not talking about undergraduate enrollment at all, and that's where Donald Trump gets it incorrect.

The secondary thing is I don't think anybody has a problem with expanding trade schools and ensuring that students have options. There is a pathway and there should be a pathway regardless of whether you choose the four-year track, the two-year track, or a certification track. I've worked at City College of Chicago for a while. I believe heavily in trade schools, apprenticeships, and the necessary, means of getting students into in-demand careers that do not require four-year college degrees or the debt that comes along with them.

But I think that those are two very different arguments to be made because, again, that 27 percent we're talking about graduate students. These are students who've already received an undergraduate education. Many for those international students actually received that undergrad education from schools abroad, from their home nations, in the same way that American students will go to the London School of Economics or go to the University of Cambridge or any place else.

Largely, that's for graduate education and the process of, you know, employment post-grad for them. That is not the same as undergraduate students, which Harvard still has a high percentage of American students --

SINGLETON: Yes, they do, the majority. You know, I love Ameshia, and Ameshia and I feel have had these conversations for years and years and years about education. Because this is something that she specializes in. She loves it. She has a huge passion in it.

The dichotomy here though, I think, Ameshia is fascinating. Donald Trump has shifted the argument having Democrats essentially have to defend elitism while Republicans appear, at least for the general public, to be saying, we're on the side of the working class person, the average individual, the guy who goes and works 60, 70, 80 hours a week in overtime to hopefully be able to make enough to put his kid through college when they turn 18 years old. That's fascinating.

In the past, it was Democrats saying, we want to get more education towards everyday people. Now, it's Republicans. And Democrats are saying, wait a minute here. We want to protect the 27 percent that are going to Harvard.

CROSS: Republicans are saying it, but they're not doing it, because college affordability is a massive topic of interest in America.

SINGLETON: That's true. That is true.

CROSS: And right now, colleges is unaffordable and has been for the better half of the past 2.5 decades. With that being said, from the big, beautiful bill that Donald Trump just got across the House, the percentage of Americans who rely on the Pell Grant would no longer be able to have access to it because of the new requirements that the House Republicans have placed in those, the same requirements that Donald Trump championed just last week.

So, if we're talking about college affordability, making sure that students have access, who are from low income backgrounds, who are from rural areas across America, who deserve the right to be able to attend an institution of their choice, be it whether that is a community college or a four-year university, Republicans are chopping them off at the knees when it comes to the opportunity.

SINGLETON: Quickly, I would agree with you about focusing on Pell Grants. We certainly want to make sure accessibility and affordability is there. I would argue, though, that the problem with cost isn't necessarily relegated to grants from the government. You know this better than I did. You've educated me on this. I think we need to completely restructure how colleges constantly raise tuition every four years, ballooning it to a way where the average person can't afford it, in general. That's a bipartisan issue.

MATTINGLY: I just want to say, because we're going to go, this is like an offensively competent policy discussion. That is totally out of line --

SINGLETON: Ameshia knows this conversation on this issue, Phil.

MATTINGLY: And I completely disagree with you guys bringing this to me today. It was actually very thoughtful and I appreciate you both having it. Thank you guys very much.

Well, our small business series takes us to Arizona next, where the owner of the coffee shop and restaurant says everything he does is about community. Now, tariffs are affecting his company and his customers. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:35:00]

MATTINGLY: We're back with our Business Leaders, where we talk to small business owners from coast to coast about President Trump's tariffs. Some are feeling relief from the duties. Many are feeling stress. Today we're visiting Brick Road Coffee in Tempe, Arizona, a coffee, pastry and pizza shop that launched in 2021 on the heels of the COVID-19 pandemic as a way to build community.

Founder and owner Gabe Hagen is joining me now. Gabe, I really appreciate your time. And in addition to tariffs impacting the product, you already sell, coffee, which as we know isn't produced in the mainland U.S., you're also trying to grow a business here. Talk about the overall impact of tariffs on that right now.

GABE HAGEN, CO-FOUNDER, BRICK ROAD COFFEE: Yes, so thank you first of all for having me on to talk about this. We started mid last year the expansion process for our business. And we have had to drastically re- shift our focus over the last six months, especially. We've cut over $75,000 from our growth budget. That would be an investment into equipment, build out costs, things like that, just so we could try to conserve some of our capital so we could weather whatever is coming our way, which we really, truly don't know what that would be right now.

MATTINGLY: Have you had to raise costs on customers yet? You said you're talking about taking money from a growth budget. What about kind of day to day?

HAGEN: Yes. So, so far, luckily, we've been able to absorb most of the impacts that we've seen because they are trickling in here and there.

[18:40:00]

What we're actually experiencing the most difficulty with right now is actually it's product availability. We have four specialty drinks that we haven't been able to get all four of them back in stock over the last three weeks. And every week, we put in orders to our distributors and our products keep becoming out of stock.

So, we're actually seeing more of an impact on the supply chain right now but we're anticipating that if prices do go up when these products come back in stock, we're going to have to pass those on.

MATTINGLY: With community being so central kind of to the origin story of your business, what have you noticed in the community as tariffs have become such a central point of economic uncertainty concerns people are having?

HAGEN: Yes. So, we're a community hub. We're a coffee shop. It's a very easy access point for a lot of people. We have done a lot of work to build our shop as a community hub where people can come and gather. So, we're still fortunate to see relatively steady foot traffic.

But what we are seeing is we're seeing the amount of spend decreasing. We're seeing, you know, maybe they're not going to grab that muffin, they're not going to grab that bag of coffee to take home with them. They're just going to grab their daily coffee, or maybe it's just once or twice a week versus three or four times.

So, we're still seeing the foot traffic, but our sales are still going down. And I think a lot of that comes back to just consumer uncertainty. There's a lot of people that just aren't sure what's going to happen. So, everybody, just like I did with my construction budget, everybody at home is doing that same thing with their own personal finances. They're trying to cut back where they can to really weather whatever's going to come our way.

MATTINGLY: What's your durability as a business to be able to weather that over time, right? You've been able to make changes, withhold some money, focus on kind of taking back from the growth side of things, the construction side of things. How long can you do that sustainably?

HAGEN: Not much longer. And to be fully transparent, like the reason why we were able to do any type of growth is mid last year. I invested my entire retirement because I had a corporate career, so my 401(k). I did a -- I took money out on my house. So, I'm -- at this point, all my cards are on the table.

So, if we aren't able to weather it, there's no more reserves for me to kind of tap into as a business owner. I don't have the ability to weather a three to six-month loss while this shakes out. I really need to make sure that I'm scraping by every month. So, it is a daily challenge that we have to kind of assess and really reprioritize.

MATTINGLY: What would be -- what is your message to lawmakers? What would you tell them if they're listening right now?

HAGEN: We need stability. I mean, whether it be for at home or for in our businesses, I need to know what I can plan for. I mean, it's middle of the year, and believe it or not, we need to start planning for the holiday season. That typically means I would be putting in large, you know, cup orders that would be really great Christmas gifts and stuff like that. I'm not doing that because I can't risk tying up that capital because of that instability.

So, stability is going to be the number one thing that that's really needed, because when it comes to figuring out how to adjust to small businesses not having, you know, corporate finance departments behind us, I really have to decide whether or not I'm going to raise my prices, which ultimately impact my consumers, or I'm going to find a way to cut wages or cut hours, which impacts my staff and my staff retention. So, one way or the other, it's impacting my community, and it just depends on how bad it's going to be.

So, stability is going to be key for me planning and most businesses planning for the remainder of the year and beyond.

MATTINGLY: Tempe, Arizona is a great town. If you're in Tempe, Arizona, Brick Road Coffee is in that town, community-oriented, community-centered.

Gabe Hagen, we really appreciate your time and sharing your story. Thanks so much.

HAGEN: Thank you so much.

MATTINGLY: Well, this long weekend marks the beginning of a busy summer travel season. We're checking in with the experts to see if you can expect lower gas prices before you hit the road.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:48:20]

MATTINGLY: In our national lead, severe weather, thunderstorms and tornadoes sweeping across the South, threatening to disrupt travel plans for millions of Americans today, in on one of the busiest holiday weekends of the year.

CNN's Derek Van Dam is here with the weather report.

Derek, what are you watching?

DEREK VAN DAM, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Yeah, that's right. Phil, look, a lot of people traveling home at the moment, and unfortunately, this is a serious situation, considering that it is rolling through populated area of Alabama, Mississippi, and into western portions of Texas as well.

So we've got a lot going on -- a lot going on in terms of the severe weather potential here. Not only is it a tornado threat, but also hail threat, and the two-inch diameter hail, that is on the smaller scale of some of these storms that could potentially form across western Texas. The potential here for four-inch or greater hail is definitely a possibility here. So, this is something we're monitoring very closely.

But in terms of the storms that are moving through central Alabama, these could produce winds in excess of 60 miles per hour. But I really want to focus in on what is happening across parts of Texas, because just south of San Angelo, there is a large supercell thunderstorm that has created what is called a particularly dangerous situation in terms of a tornado warning that is ongoing. This is again just south of the city, and also flash flood warnings that are ongoing with this particular cell.

Lots of rain through this particular system. I want to time this out for you because it is going to be a rude awakening on Tuesday morning. If you're located in, let's say, Houston or the Galveston area, this area will see this round of thunderstorms move through early in the morning.

[18:50:01]

And then as these thunderstorms fire up along a stalled frontal boundary, this could bring rough weather to places like Atlanta, Birmingham. Once again, these are the two areas that we're monitoring for severe weather potential for the day tomorrow.

So, Phil, very active stretch of weather from hail to tornadoes. Back to you.

MATTINGLY: Derek Van Dam, with the latest for us, thanks so much. Joining me now to talk all things holiday weekend travel, Patrick de

Haan, head of petroleum analysis at GasBuddy.

Patrick, it's a striking moment. We saw the lowest inflation adjusted gas prices for Memorial Day weekend since 2003. I think around $3.08 a gallon.

What are trends looking like for the rest of the summer?

PATRICK DE HAAN, HEAD OF PETROLEUUM ANALYSIS, GASBUDDY: Yeah. It's certainly going to be a very busy summer with a lot of Americans hitting the road. Having said that, we do see a bit of a break compared to last year. I think Americans are a little bit overwhelmed with kind of the economic jitters of what we've been seeing here the last couple of weeks tariffs, trade wars. That has really impacted the psyche of some Americans.

Now, having said that, last summer, 76 percent of respondents to our annual summer travel survey with GasBuddy said that they'll be traveling. This year, a slight drop to 69 percent even amidst lower gas prices. In fact, over the Memorial Day driving holiday, Americans are spending roughly $650 million less on gasoline compared to a year ago.

So, while gas prices are a little bit lower, a little bit of economic unease now factoring into how Americans are going to be hitting the road this summer.

MATTINGLY: Yeah. And it's one of several kind of cross-cutting elements converging right now that are driving prices down. What are -- what are they? What are you seeing?

DE HAAN: Yeah, a lot of this is really OPEC. Now, OPEC did just announce a move forward of their meeting for June back to May. But a lot of this really has to do with OPEC increasing production. In the long run though over the last couple of years. You'll remember back in 2022 when gas prices hit their all-time high for Memorial Day. It was really a function of the American economy reopening. Russia's war in Ukraine.

Those waves have slowly subdued over the last couple of years. Gas prices hitting the peak in 2022 but declining in 2023, 2024 and again in 2025. So a long road to finally some sort of slowdown in gas prices, but a lot of it having to do with OPEC raising production over the last few months. And also that economic uncertainty, as I mentioned, the trade war has undermined stock prices and oil prices.

So that's something to keep an eye on here as we move forward.

MATTINGLY: Patrick de Haan, always appreciate it. Thanks so much.

And in our world lead, does this look like playful teasing to you? Well, according to the French government, that's all the first lady was doing when she appeared to shove President Emmanuel Macron in the face yesterday.

CNN's Saskya Vandoorne has the latest.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SASKYA VANDOORNE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This short video of President Macron and his wife Brigitte, pushing his face as they land in Vietnam, is going viral and has caught the attention of Russian trolls.

Later, Macron appears to offer his arm, but France's first lady opts to hold the railing instead. The Elysee Palace, initially denied anything unusual had happened, calling it a moment of togetherness and playful teasing in a statement.

Macron later told journalists he was surprised by the attempts to twist the moment.

EMMANUEL MACRON, FRENCH PRESIDENT (through translator): There's a video now which opens. We're in the middle of bickering and rather joking with my wife and I'm surprised by how this becomes a kind of geoplanetary catastrophe.

VANDOORNE: French officials say the moment will likely feed the mills of conspiracy theorists and Russian trolls. It's already become a target for pro-Russian accounts and Russian state media, who viewed it as a possible opportunity to spread misinformation, and this isn't the first time.

Earlier this month, prominent Kremlin officials claimed Macron was using cocaine on a train trip to Kyiv with British Prime Minister Keir Starmer and German Chancellor Friedrich Merz. French officials say a crumpled tissue was mistaken for a bag of drugs. Macrons office debunked the rumor with humor, tweeting: This is a tissue for blowing your nose.

Officials say these efforts are part of a wider Kremlin campaign to undermine Europe's steadfast support for Ukraine in the war against Russia.

Saskya Vandoorne CNN, Paris.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MATTINGLY: Saskya Vandoorne, thank you.

Well, on this Memorial Day, how is the nation showing its respect to those who gave their lives for the country? That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:58:56]

MATTINGLY: Finally, on this Memorial Day, the sights and sounds from Arlington National Cemetery today, as our nation's leaders paid tribute to the men and women who gave their lives for their country and for all of us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Welcome to this most hallowed ground on this most special day.

PETE HEGSETH, DEFENSE SECRETARY: Let us rededicate ourselves to God and country, to our great republic, 249 years on, we stand on the shoulders of great men and on the shoulders of. those great men in those graves and may we live worthy of it.

J.D. VANCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: To the families who have lost a son, a daughter, a husband, or a wife, to every child here who misses your dad or your mom, know that your loved one to us is a hero.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: They gave everything and we owe them everything and much, much more.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: One of those heroes buried just up the Hill from where they were speaking, Thomas F. Odea Jr., lieutenant colonel killed in Vietnam, Christmas day, 1968. He's my grandfather.

Tune in tonight for a CNN Film examining the storied career of one of the most influential artists of all time, Luther Vandross.

The CNN film "LUTHER: NEVER TOO MUCH" airs tonight at 8:00 p.m. Eastern, Pacific on CNN. Jake is back tomorrow. Thanks for spending your Memorial Day with us.