Return to Transcripts main page

The Lead with Jake Tapper

Now: Trump, GOP Senators On Key Committee Meet Amid Hangups On Bill; Trump Rebukes Senators Who Oppose Bill, But He's Silent On Musk; Ex-Biden W.H. Press Secretary Now An Independent; Senate GOP Debates Gutting Clean Energy Tax Credits; Trump's Tax & Spending Bill Threatens Future Of Clean Energy; Judge Blocks Deportation Of Boulder Attack Suspect Family; DOJ: Chinese Researchers Smuggled "Biological Pathogen" Into U.S.; Rep. Mike Lawler (R-NY) Is Interviewed About Gaza Aid Operation Pauses After Days Of Deadly Shootings. Aired 5-6p ET

Aired June 04, 2025 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KASIE HUNT, CNN HOST: Dance scene. Yes, it's been missing, Mia for 40 years now. Now the cast is reuniting. They're asking fans and collectors to please help.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ask your friends, ask your relatives, ask your bandmates.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you know where it is, if you -- if you know has it call us, text us.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Go to losstothefuture.com or call this 800 number below. We need your help.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We'll make a hero out of you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We will all be so grateful.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We need it anytime (ph).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: So Phil Mattingly is standing by for "The Lead."

And Phil, I don't know if I'm going to make people angry, but when I first met you, I didn't know your name and I put you in as Marty McFly in my contact list just because there's, you know, a little resemblance between the two of you. Are you hiding the Gibson guitar?

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN HOST: I don't have it, but I deeply support their efforts. Kasie, thank you very much. We'll see you back in "The Arena" tomorrow.

HUNT: Have a good show.

[17:00:55]

MATTINGLY: The future of President Trump's big domestic agenda, it could hang hinge on a meeting happening as we speak. The Lead starts right now.

Despite Elon Musk -- despite Elon Musk trashing his bill, President Trump is moving on meeting with Senate Republicans right now. Can he keep them all together? A key GOP senator at the White House, he'll be here on The Lead. Plus the president's other major conversation today with President Vladimir Putin. What Trump says the Russian leader told him about Ukraine's two surprise attacks this week and Russia's very clear plans to respond.

And in the Sean Diddy Combs trial, a woman who says the music mogul dangled her off a 17 story floor balcony. What else she revealed? That's some testimony ahead.

Welcome to lead. I'm Phil Mattingly in for Jake Tapper. Our politics lead, the future of President Trump's so called one big beautiful bill, it is on the line, the president meeting right now with members of the Senate Finance Committee Republicans to hammer out the issues and hang ups around the bill in the upper chamber.

Now, we don't know exactly what changes these senators may be presenting and we're going to ask when one of those senators heads here right after that meeting. What we do know is at least one committee member, Republican Senator Thom Tillis has raised concerns with the rolling back of green energy credits and the bill's impacts on Medicaid.

While we're on that subject today, a new Congressional Budget Office or CBO analysis says nearly 11 million more people would be uninsured by 2034. Largely due to the bill's Medicaid cuts and federal work requirements for Medicaid expansion recipients.

Another significant area of concern for multiple Republicans, the deficit. The CBO today saying Trump's bill would add $2.4 trillion to deficits over a 10-year period. That number could very well complicate the job for Senate Majority Leader John Thune, a man who can only lose three Republican votes in his chamber.

Adding to that complication, you know, remember Elon Musk, right? Well, today he's not really pumping the brakes on this, stirring the pot on his X platform saying, quote, "A new spending bill should be drafted that doesn't massively grow the deficit and increase the debt ceiling by $5 trillion dollars." Trillion dollars in all caps, which might remind you of the guy Elon used to sit down the hall from in the White House.

We start things off with CNN's Manu Raju on Capitol Hill. CNN's Kristen Holmes is at the White House.

Manu, this meeting that's going on right now between President Trump and Republicans, what were you hearing ahead of it about what they may be asking for, how they thread this needle right now?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, the Senate Republicans actually met behind closed doors for several hours this afternoon to try to hammer out this massive complicated plan and try to get their disagreements ironed out by the Senator -- Senate majority leader's deadline, which is to get this pass and onto Trump's desk by July 4, meaning it has to be on the floor really by the end of this month.

And so by next week then you had the bill text together. And so those differences about how deep to cut federal spending as well as how the -- what to include in this massive multitrillion dollar tax overhaul, those all need to be figured out, which is why this meeting at the White House today is critical with Trump and members of the Senate Finance Committee, which determines how to structure that key tax policy.

Now, I could tell you, Phil, in talking to Republicans about that Elon Musk tweet his attacks against this bill, there is ample frustration within the ranks. A lot of Republicans felt completely blindsided by these -- by these comments, including the ones who have been pushing for deeper spending cuts. They said that Elon Musk should have voiced his concerns earlier and that could have changed the outcome of this bill. Even some of the hardliners in the House expressed frustration when I asked them about Musk earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ELI CRANE (R-AZ): My issue is why wasn't he -- why wasn't he talking about this before the bill, right? Because those of us that were actually trying to make cuts, we could have used his support, and that actually might have helped us out quite a bit. And that's what frustrates me. Hey, if you're going to be in this fight, be in this fight when we need you, because we to needed him.

[17:05:11]

RAJU: The Republican senators are telling me, including Senator Lisa Murkowski and the like, they want to push back the Medicaid work requirements. They also -- they think it's not workable. They just want to push back the phase out of the IRA tax credits. If it comes back --

REP. CHIP ROY (R-TX): Yes, it'll be that. It'll be that. Like so if the Senate wants to go that direction, then this bill is, I mean, it's not even close to passing. So they need to go further or the bill's dead.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: And therein lies the challenge there, Phil. As they're negotiating what to do in the Senate, do they move more towards the middle? Do they try to alleviate the concerns being raised by some of the more moderate senators, like Senator Lisa Murkowski, who told me that she had concerns about how they would implement these new work rules for Medicaid beneficiaries as well as green energy tax credits that we phased out under this plan.

Some of these Republican senators simply believe that time frame is too aggressive, want to push back the phase out of that. But if they do that, they could cause some support on the far right of the House GOP and Senate GOP. And if it comes back, if you heard Chip Roy right there, he said this bill is dead if they pare back the spending cuts. Phil.

MATTINGLY: Kristen, over to you on the north lawn, Elon. Explain the silence from the president here. And I understand, like, they have a relationship is very different from most of his advisers, friends, colleagues. I mean, there's a level of, like, equality in terms of the richest man in the world and the president, I've long thought. But why haven't we heard from the president, who typically is not a shrinking violet when somebody's attacking him?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I mean, you've got to look at this as the whole picture here. So we're told that Donald Trump was unhappy yesterday. One source who spoke to him said that after that first tweet, he was confused as well. Another source saying that Donald Trump even speculated at one point that maybe Elon Musk was doing this because this is what he had to do now that he had left the government was back fully in his businesses, particularly pointing to how this bill would repeal some of those electric vehicle tax credits, that maybe this was something he was doing for his business for Tesla, not necessarily something that he actually meant. And I talked to a number of sources very close to the president who said they weren't sure if he was going to actually react to this.

This just goes to show you that this relationship, while they are still in touch, they are still close. Clearly they are going to grow apart as their interests continue to grow apart. Elon's with his business and Donald Trump continuing to run the government. And one of the people that I spoke to said that again, Donald Trump was not even necessarily as angry as he was confused by all of this. Now, the White House officials I spoke to said they're very annoyed by the fact that Elon Musk is weighing in, but they're not really sure it's going to actually move the needle when it comes to how senators are going to vote.

And I think we saw this here with Manu, we know he's been up on the Hill talking to these leaders who said it doesn't really impact how they think of the bill. It's more just of annoyance to have this man who has the biggest platform, this mouthpiece constantly hitting at this bill is something that is just kind of getting under a lot of people's skin. But whether or not it actually has an impact long term, this is one of the tweets he said today, "Call your senator, call your congressman. Bankrupting America is not OK. Kill the bill."

Obviously, this is not opposition that he had voiced at least to this level until recently and particularly not when this bill was going through the House.

MATTINGLY: It certainly lacks subtlety, that is for sure. Kristen Holmes in the White House, Manu Raju on Capitol Hill, thanks so much, guys.

Well, my panel now here to discuss. And David Urban, I want to start off with you and put your hat on as the former Senate staffer amongst the group here today. Thread this needle for me. You know how this chamber works. You're also very close to a number of Republican senators.

How do you -- what changes can they get that won't kind of tip over the apple cart that the House just passed?

DAVID URBAN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: You know, Phil, there's so many -- there so many landmines in the -- in the Senate with -- you know, you heard this, it takes spending out over 10 years, there's bird issues right there. There are so many different nuance of problems that I don't know if they change one bit, it's not going to go back to the House. You heard Chip Roy said he's not going to pass it. But what I haven't heard from senators is any senator yet say I'm not voting for it.

There's a lot of I'm expressing concern, I don't like this, it gives me some heartburn, but no one has said, hell no. No one's laying on the tracks. I still think the bill passes. I don't think the Fourth of July is a realistic date. I think it's going to be more likely you'll get an X date for, you know, for the -- for the debt ceiling sometime in August when people really have to leave and want to go home on holiday with their families.

And I think you'll see then. But there's going to be a lot of back and forth. You heard Manu talking about the tight schedule. I just don't think that's possible. I think they'll get there.

I don't think any senators are really going to, you know, you'll get one or two are going to blow it up and most of them care, I think. You know, you hear about Medicaid, but the debt service tax cuts, the tax bill is going to be the biggest part of this. I think the White House get a pat on that a lot and that that'll turn the tables here, so.

[17:10:09]

MATTINGLY: Yes, and it's important to note, and Kevin Hassett, the NEC director, mentions this a lot, the ultimate kind of Trump card, no pun intended, White House officials have here is the alternative of a $4 trillion tax increase is probably going to help in the end.

Alyssa, I want to ask you somewhat similar to what I asked Kristen Holmes, which is the Donald Trump's, the way he is approaching Elon Musk right now, just not blowing him up, not going after him, is clearly a lot of frustration inside the White House and also on Capitol Hill. Why do you think Trump is easing off him?

ALYSSA FARAH GRIFFIN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I mean, honestly, the silence from Trump is deafening because it's very not his style. But I think that he realizes his entire legislative agenda with this big, beautiful bill is kind of on pause if Elon ends up getting enough House members to rally against this. So I think he realizes, like, this is not worth antagonizing him further.

It's not worth hitting him further because he's kind of between -- well, I'd say members of Congress are between Iraq and a hard place. Do you support the bill, side with Donald Trump, or if you're some of these, you know, Freedom Caucus guys and House, you know, conservatives who have concerns over the impact on the deficit, do you side with Elon Musk?

And again, if you don't side with Elon Musk, you may be risking some heavy political spending against you, which he's promised to do. Now, that very well may be a bluff. But I think Donald Trump's actually playing it smart, he realizes this is his whole agenda on the line, he cannot risk having Elon blow it up. So I think he's probably working this out behind the scenes.

MATTINGLY: Bakari, I was talking with a Democratic lawmaker earlier today and talking about, you know, the first major agenda item for any president inevitably ends up passing, with one exception in the 16 years I've been here. Health care repeal from Donald Trump in his first year, which was pretty catastrophic, I think legislative effort all in all.

Democrats and their ability to kind of drive opposition to that from the outside, playing the outside game and really rallying people against it, had a huge effect on getting John McCain to put his finger down. I'm interested if you think Democratic lawmakers and groups are doing anything similar this time around.

BAKARI SELLERS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: The answer is absolutely not. And I think that's unfortunate. That's an unfortunate commentary, which is why I believe David Urban is probably correct in his analysis of the future of this bill. This isn't -- look, Elon Musk and Donald Trump are going through a divorce. Elon Musk, you know, he bought the White House, he purchased what he believed to be a bill of goods and Donald Trump does what he does with individuals and contractors, which is he's stiffing him for the return.

That is something that's happening throughout this process. And we're seeing the benefits Elon Musk wants not necessarily playing out. But all in all, there are senators who are not feeling this pressure. This is -- Elon Musk is testing his political power. And look, this is someone who's new to the political scene or relatively new to the political scene.

There's no United States Senator that's going to necessarily bow to the will of Elon Musk, and he's realizing that. What has to happen is these grassroots efforts have to come. This is not a grass top, this is not a top down approach, but this is a grassroots effort. And Phil, there is such a disconnect between Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer and the leadership of the Democratic Party and what the Democratic Party is thirsting for, and no one is filling that void. I mean, AOC and Bernie Sanders actually did a good job going around the country, but we have this void and without filling it, this bill that and 11 million people will be uninsured.

All the bad things we've been talking about in all likelihood will pass. And I hate saying it, but David Urban will look like a genius.

MATTINGLY: Nobody wants that. That's uncomfortable for everybody.

GRIFFIN: The worst part.

SELLERS: Everybody. MATTINGLY: I do -- I do want to turn to another political headline today just because --

URBAN: Such a good natured pundit Urbanist.

MATTINGLY: Allegedly. The headline today that Joe Biden's former White House press secretary, Karine Jean-Pierre, who people haven't heard a lot from over the course of the last couple of months, is now changing her party affiliation to Independent and has a forthcoming book called "Independent, A Look Inside a Broken White House Outside Party Lines."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KARINE JEAN-PIERRE, FORMER WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY, BIDEN ADMINISTRATION: This book, "Independent," it's about looking outside of boxes, not just always being in a partisan stance and how do we move forward together in a compassionate way, in a way that really, truly cares about people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Now, according to the publishing company's description of the book, it will examine, quote, "The three weeks that led to Biden's abandoning his bid for a second term and the betrayal by the Democratic Party that led to his decision." This was somebody, obviously, who was the public messenger for the White House, for the party in that role. Bakari is the Democrat here, what do you make of this?

[17:15:02]

SELLERS: I think the message should resonate. I think that people are going to have to get warmer with the messenger and say, you know, you were a part of this apparatus where, I mean, you can't be one foot in, one foot out. You were the press secretary kind of what did you know, when did you know it type of deal, you know, were you one of the sources in "Original Sin" type of question. But the message, I think, is of great import.

And one of the things that I told individuals, Democrats in particularly, and we have some of this kind of bro culture in our own party. I mean, whether or not you're talking about Pod Save America or whether or not you're talking about Jon Stewart, just two examples, you had individuals who were are -- who are going at Joe Biden's neck day in and day out. Some of us, like myself, wanted to give him space, but that's neither here nor there. But it was -- it was damaging to the party. And not only that, but when Joe Biden got out of the race, they were, I mean, crickets, or they could have been louder or they could have done more to support the nominee.

And that simply wasn't there. And so, there are a lot of us who have those reservations. So I appreciate the message.

I think her difficulty in selling herself in this book going forward is making people warm to the messenger. Because, look, we have a problem in the Democratic Party. It's a problem from top down and in between, it's a problem with our elected and our -- and our organizations, and we just have to take a breath, not throw the baby out with the bath water, but meet people where they are and try to figure out how we talk for the American people, not make them come to us and beg us for ideas.

MATTINGLY: Alyssa, what do you think?

URBAN: Yes, Phil --

MATTINGLY: Oh, go ahead, David.

GRIFFIN: Listen, I empathize with somebody leaving a White House they served in and having a lot of frustrations with what they saw on the inside, but this ain't the way to do it. Listen, Karine Jean-Pierre got -- I have respect for her, but she stayed very close with the Biden since she's left.

I've interviewed her since she's left the White House, and there's really no daylight between her and Joe Biden. And I don't -- I haven't gotten the sense that this is going to be some juicy kind of tell all. I think it's much more of trying to tell the Biden side of why he didn't step aside sooner, why he wasn't paying attention to public data to the degree that it really is anything more than maybe her giving what is a very valid perspective on what she thinks the Democratic Party should be.

MATTINGLY: David, real quick.

URBAN: Yes, yes. I would just say this. Look, Joe Biden sold the American people in the Democratic Party a bill of goods from when he ran. He said, I'm going to be a bridge to the future. There's a new generation of leaders out there. I'm going to run, I'm going to be a transitional figure.

And then he got in there and the power elite around him, the politburo kept him in, propped him up, weekend of Bernie style. Jake's book reveals it. Read it, it's incredible.

For Karine to come out like this now and say, oh, you know, gambling in Casablanca, I think it's a little too late. And the party is going to pay for -- Democratic Party is going to pay for it in this upcoming election and elections in the future.

MATTINGLY: I will put you down as a maybe on the --

SELLERS: You should try reading the book first, though, guys. Read the book.

MATTINGLY: No, it's an important point.

SELLERS: Jesus.

MATTINGLY: It's an important point.

Guys, I always appreciate. Wish we had a lot more time. Thanks so much for joining. Well, as noted, a Senate Republican meeting with President Trump right now is expected to join us as those conversations at the White House wrap. Plus, why some fear Trump's mega bill could force your rising electricity bill to actually go higher. And the warning about some ground beef at Whole Foods. Some of those packages were sold as late as yesterday. Much more ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:22:17]

MATTINGLY: In our money lead, President Trump is promising to save Americans money through his expansive domestic tax bill. But his pledge to gut renewable energy credits is sparking some serious debate. As a "New York Times" report today explains the cost of energy -- of electricity is already on the rise and an end to the Biden era tax breaks for the solar wind and other low carbon forms of energy, well, it could mean paying hundreds more per year for that energy.

Here with me now, Mary Powell, CEO of the solar energy company Sunrun. The idea of all of all over -- everything approach, do everything across every single kind of segment of the energy creation model seems to run crosswise with what they're doing here is --

MARY POWELL, CEO, SUNRUN: Well, I mean, I think the most important thing, Phil, is what we're doing at Sunrun is we are bringing online every single year the equivalent of a nuclear power plant worth of energy capacity. So everything we're doing is actually completely aligned with the President's agenda around American dominance in energy, energy independence, fueling the growth of the future, because what we do, we are a company that installs batteries with our solar energy. So we are -- we are creating amazing energy capacity for the future of America.

MATTINGLY: How you frame that is important context given, I think it was last week, a week and a half ago, the President was signing the executive orders to -- for the first time in 30 years, can start the process of building a nuclear power plant again. You're doing it on the regular level.

POWELL: For sure, yes. In fact, that is one of the things that I think is so powerful that so many people are starting to realize that what we are doing again, because we are -- we are installing batteries with solar, so that allows us to create amazing resources to then feed back to the grid. And in fact, 75,000 of our customers just this summer are participating in programs to share energy back to the grid, which helps make the grid more reliable and more cost effective for all.

So you're right, with changes to this, it would really -- it would be about driving up energy costs when in fact what we're delivering is affordable, predictable energy for Americans all across the country, but then also this incredible resource that can be passed back to the grid.

MATTINGLY: Have you been talking to lawmakers, to their staff, trying to kind of make this point, see if there are pathways to not end up where the House was?

POWELL: Yes, 100 percent. I mean, again, everything we're doing is completely aligned with the president's agenda around American energy dominance, energy independence, security. You know, in fact, you know, we can never compete in the race against China, for instance, on AI if we're not bringing online enough capacity.

[17:25:10]

So again, yes, I think as we've had those conversations, there's a lot of support for what we do. And Americans across the country, there's a lot of support for what we do. We also are fueling so much of the production being brought on to American soil. So we buy panels from Georgia, we buy most of our batteries from Nevada. So everything we're doing is about American jobs. So it's not just about American meeting Americans need for energy and energy capacity, it's also about on shoring and really fueling so many important clean energy jobs.

MATTINGLY: Yes. Critical issue, a critical message. Mary Powell, thank you so much for coming in.

POWELL: Thank you. Wonderful.

MATTINGLY: Well, just in, new orders from a U.S. judge about the wife and children of a man charged in Sunday's Boulder anti-Semitic terrorist attack. Plus the major arrest after rather small material was found in luggage in Detroit. We'll explain next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:30:15]

MATTINGLY: Breaking news in our National Lead. A federal judge today blocked the deportations of the wife and children of the suspect in last weekend's anti-Semitic terrorist attack in Boulder, Colorado.

The suspect, Mohamed Sabry Soliman, is an Egyptian national who authorities say is in the country illegally, having overstayed his visa and work permit. Now, he's charged with 16 counts of attempted murder and a federal hate crime because of Sunday's attack, which injured 12 people. CNN's Priscilla Alvarez is here now to tell us more about the order and the man's family.

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes, this is a very brief order, about two pages, but it essentially blocks the administration from deporting his family, his wife and five children. Now, I'm going to read just one part of this order, where it says, "Moreover, the court finds that deportation without process could work irreparable harm and an order must issue without notice due to the urgency the situation presents."

Now, that urgency is one that the White House has been talking about since yesterday evening. After his family was detained by Immigration and Customs Enforcement, the White House was saying that their removal was essentially imminent. In fact, in one post, saying that it could happen as soon as tonight, that meaning yesterday evening. So this is clearly going to put a big block in those plans because of this federal judge's order.

Now, Phil, we're also learning a little bit about the family's immigration history. It is very similar, almost exactly the same, actually, to that of the husband and father, meaning that they came in August of 2022 with a temporary visa. That visa ran up until February of 2023. But in that intervening period, they had also joined the asylum application of their father-husband.

So the family members have not been charged in this case, but they have been clearly the target of this administration, which is similarly said, by the way, Phil, that they wanted to talk to them as part of this investigation to see if there's anything that they knew about the father and husband.

MATTINGLY: I want to turn to another immigration issue, and this is the story you have a very deeply reported and I think really important story today about kind of another under-the-radar move that the Trump administration is pursuing in their kind of full-scale effort on deportation as it relates to children. Walk people through that.

ALVAREZ: This is part of this aggressive focus by the administration to locate migrant children who crossed the U.S.-Mexico border alone in recent years and have since been placed with sponsors, the majority of whom are family members, including parents.

Now, senior Trump officials have said that there are hundreds of thousands of children who are missing and could potentially be in dangerous situations. But when I've talked to former Health and Human Services officials, experts, advocates, they refute those claims. They don't necessarily say that there is no exploitation and trafficking. That has happened in multiple administrations in the past.

But the idea that it's happening at scale is not correct, according to them. But all the same, Phil, this has become the premise of these welfare checks that Immigration and Customs Enforcement has conducted. And I've been told by sources that they have now brought around 500 children into government custody.

These are children that were residing in the United States in households, and mostly with family, again, because that's who they are typically released to. And this is causing concern because these kids are coming back into government custody where they could also be deported and being separated from their family members.

Now, the Department of Homeland Security did tell me in a statement that this -- these welfare checks have, "resulted in arrests of some sponsors of these unaccompanied minors. And as a result, the kids have been placed in the Office of Refugee Resettlement -- the Office of Refugee Resettlement" that, of course, being the agency charged with the care of these children.

I'll also add, Phil, that this is just one part of the broader campaign. I was also told that there is a makeshift war room that has been set up in the Health and Human Services Department where they are tracking these children, building these lists, and continuing to deploy officers nationwide. MATTINGLY: It is all over the place in terms of the scale and the scope of the overall efforts. You've been reporting on all of them, Priscilla. Great reporting. Thank you.

Well, in our Law and Justice Lead, the FBI just busted two Chinese researchers who federal officials say tried to smuggle a fungus that has the potential to be used as a weapon into the United States. The Justice Department says the fungus was concealed in a wad of tissues, and the researchers plan to study it at the University of Michigan. CNN's Josh Campbell has the details of the case.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Two Chinese researchers charged with unlawfully smuggling a dangerous fungus into the United States. Yun Qing Jian and Zunyong Liu are both facing a list of federal charges linked to the July 2024 incident, according to a federal criminal complaint filed this week.

Prosecutors say Liu smuggled Fusarium graminearum without a permit into the Detroit Metropolitan Airport using a tourist visa, allegedly to study the fungus in a lab at the University of Michigan, where his girlfriend Jian worked.

[17:35:03]

The strain is described as a potential agro-terrorism weapon in an FBI affidavit in support of the complaint. The FBI says it can cause disease in certain plants like wheat, corn, rice, and barley. And is responsible for billions of dollars in economic losses worldwide each year. Toxins from the fungus can cause vomiting, liver damage, and reproductive defects in livestock and humans.

DR. DONELL HARVIN, GEORGETOWN UNIVERSITY: This type of material should not be smuggled into any country. It doesn't matter whether the person had good intentions. If there's some type of mistake or mishap or release, that can have catastrophic consequences.

CAMPBELL (voice-over): Authorities have not said what the couple's intentions were in studying the fungus, and neither have been charged with attempting to use the material to cause harm. Jian made her first appearance in federal court Tuesday and did not enter a plea.

YUNQING JIAN: My name is Yun Qing Jian.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Ms. Jian, the reason you are here today in federal court is because a criminal complaint and supporting affidavit has been filed against you.

CAMPBELL (voice-over): She is being detained due to fear of flight risk. Liu is not in custody and is believed to be overseas, according to prosecutors.

The charges come as the Trump administration is cracking down on Chinese students studying in the U.S., especially those with alleged connections to the Chinese Communist Party. In announcing the new charges, U.S. Attorney General Pam Bondi said, the Department of Justice has no higher mission than keeping the American people safe and protecting our nation from hostile foreign actors.

A spokesperson for the Chinese Foreign Ministry responded --

LIN JIAN, CHINESE FOREIGN MINISTRY SPOKESPERSON: I'm not aware of the relevant situation. The Chinese government has always required Chinese citizens overseas to strictly abide by local laws and regulations. At the same time, we safeguard the legitimate rights and interests of Chinese citizens overseas in accordance with the law.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CAMPBELL (on camera): Now, Phil, it's worth pointing out that CNN has reached out to Jian's attorney for comment on these allegations. And the Justice Department here isn't alleging terrorism against this couple. In fact, I've talked to the intelligence law enforcement experts who say that's the opposite model of the Chinese. The FBI has accused the Chinese Communist Party in the past of trying to exfiltrate sensitive technology from the U.S. We don't really see cases of them bringing it in.

But nevertheless, because we're talking about a dangerous pathogen here, the DOJ found they had enough, in their view, to bring criminal charges here, Phil.

MATTINGLY: Josh Campbell, thanks so much.

Well, if you shopped at a Whole Foods recently, you're going to want to hear this next one. The major warning about a product sold there as recently as yesterday. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:41:47]

MATTINGLY: In our Health Lead, the Department of Agriculture's Food Safety and Inspection Service has issued a public health alert for some raw ground beef products sold at Whole Foods Market because of a risk of E. coli contamination. Now the products are one-pound vacuum- packed packages of organic rancher organic 85 percent lean and 15 percent fat ground beef with use or freeze-by dates of June 19th or June 20th. The products were available from May 26th through yesterday, June 3rd, in 26 states and the District of Columbia. So far no reports of illnesses.

Well, also in the Health Lead, the use of fluoride in public drinking water is under scrutiny. Florida and Utah recently banned it, but new research warns doing so could lead to millions of cavities in children and billions of dollars in dental costs. We asked you to send us your questions about fluoride and its safety and effectiveness, and CNN chief medical correspondent, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, is back now to answer them.

Sanjay, Paula from Massachusetts writes, "In our household, we use filtered water coming out of our refrigerator. Does that eliminate the fluoride in water?"

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this was probably the most common type of question we got about how to handle this on your own, and the short answer to this question is, is no. Most filters are not going to filter out fluoride. Fluoride is a mineral, Phil, so it just sort of dissolves into the water, which makes it really hard to filter.

There are two types of filtration systems which will do a pretty good job. One is something known as reverse osmosis, where you're essentially forcing the water through a membrane, and the other one is called distillation, where you're essentially boiling the water and then collecting the water vapor, and those are pretty good at eliminating fluoride.

But one point I want to make, and I think it's really important because a lot of discussion around fluoride is that in most places in the United States, the fluoride levels just aren't high enough to be of concern. If you are concerned about it, you can ask your water company to give you a consumer confidence report. Those are required for you to have if you want one. Or go to the CDC's website and check My Water's Fluoride. Look for your area.

But again, Phil, in most places, fluoride is a big topic in the news, but the fluoride levels are not going to be concerning in most places.

MATTINGLY: Really, really critical context. Lucia from New York asks, Sanjay, "If fluoride was removed from drinking water, would brushing with fluoridated toothpaste or rinsing with fluoridated mouthwash be enough to protect the teeth?"

GUPTA: Yes, the answer is yes. I mean, that's the thing. One thing to keep in mind contextually, Phil, is that if you talk to public health officials, they will describe fluoridated water as one of the biggest public health achievements of the last century.

But when you look at the data more carefully, what you realize is that most of the benefit came before 1975. Why? Because after that, fluoridated toothpaste became more widely adopted. And it's really effective.

One thing, Phil, you have small kids, I have kids as well, you don't need that much, just a rice grain size for children under three of toothpaste, and for adults, just a pea-size amount of toothpaste. You want to leave the fluoride on your teeth. You want it to stick to your teeth. That's what leads to that remineralization of your teeth. So don't rinse it out and don't eat for 10 to 15 minutes. But it's really effective. And I think, again, decreases the overall incremental benefit of fluoridation in the water.

[17:45:14]

MATTINGLY: Dr. Sanjay Gupta, always appreciate your time and perspective, sir. Thanks.

GUPTA: You got it. Thank you. MATTINGLY: Well, we're standing by for a White House meeting to wrap with a group of Senate Republicans and President Trump. We will be speaking with a GOP senator in that meeting. House Republican will also join me, his focus, as he watches U.S. relations in the Middle East. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MATTINGLY: Turning to our World Lead, Russian leader Vladimir Putin tells President Trump he plans to retaliate against Ukraine for its audacious drone attacks on Russian military bases over the weekend. Trump says he and Putin spoke by phone today for more than an hour, characterizing it as a good conversation but, "not a conversation that will lead to immediate peace."

[17:50:15]

Congressman Mike Lawler, Republican from New York, joins us now. He's also the chair of the House Foreign Affairs Subcommittee on the Middle East and North Africa. Congressman, really appreciate your time.

I want to start with the President's phone call with President Putin today. In his Truth Social post, laying out kind of the top lines from that call, included that Putin, "very strongly will have to respond to Ukraine." I think what was striking about it was not that there's going to be a response, I think there's been an expectation of that, but that there was no, what wasn't in there was a condemnation of any potential action or an effort to try and get him to stop. Why do you think that was?

REP. MIKE LAWLER (R-NY): Well, I think throughout the President's term, he's been trying to get this conflict to end and to get Vladimir Putin to stop. Let's be very clear. Vladimir Putin is a vile dictator and thug.

He is solely responsible for this conflict and what has happened over the last three plus years and the death and destruction that has been wrought. And frankly, I thought it was extremely impressive what Ukraine was able to pull off the other day and obviously the impact that it had on Russia's military equipment.

So there -- there is, you know, obviously a real need for this conflict to come to an end. Obviously the President has been trying over the last few months to get a negotiation between Russia and Ukraine to bring this to an end because the reality is that we're basically at a stalemate here.

And the longer that this war persists, the more likely it is that Ukraine would ultimately collapse and that would be catastrophic for Europe, for Eastern Europe and the United States and our allies. So getting this conflict to an end is critical.

I think obviously we need to do everything we can to deter Putin from taking any further action. However --

MATTINGLY: Including congressional sanctions? LAWLER: Look, I support enhanced sanctions. I am a co-sponsor of the legislation to do that. Frankly, that is something the Biden administration should have done right out of the gate. There should have been secondary sanctions. The Europeans should have ceased purchasing Russian gas.

There's a lot that should have been done in the three years leading up to this administration taking over. But I certainly believe fundamentally that both this administration and Congress need to act. Vladimir Putin needs to be stopped dead in his tracks.

And what he has done throughout the course of this -- this three-year war is nothing short of genocide.

MATTINGLY: I want to turn to the Middle East. You just returned from a trip to the Middle East, a bipartisan CODEL of lawmakers. We've seen a disturbing string of deadly shootings at these aid distribution sites in Gaza over the past few days. Today, the U.S.-backed Gaza Humanitarian Foundation paused operations. Israel has acknowledged to opening fire in some instances. What do you know about the status of this U.S.-backed group?

LAWLER: Well, fundamentally, the issue throughout the situation in Gaza has been getting the aid directly to the Palestinian people and not having it diverted by Hamas or stolen and sold by Hamas to the Palestinian people, which is often what has been occurring throughout this conflict.

And so getting the aid directly to the Palestinian people is important. Obviously, as they work through some of these, you know, challenges of distributing the aid, you know, there's going to be, you know, issues that pop up.

I would also note that throughout this, Hamas has continually put its own people, the Palestinian people, in harm's way. They have taken aggressive action against their own people. You saw "The Washington Post" basically pull back on its reporting on the situation you just mentioned because they took Hamas' word for it and discounted the Israelis' word.

And so this is a very serious situation. We have to work through both getting the aid directly to the Palestinian people while getting all of the hostages released and eliminating the threat from Hamas. Under the terms of any agreement, the bottom line is Hamas cannot remain in power.

They have sought, under these negotiations that have been engaged by the United States, by Israel, by Qatar, they have sought to not only get Israel to fully leave Gaza, but to get the United States and Israel to recognize them as the governing body. That will never happen. Over my dead body, that will never happen.

[17:55:13]

Hamas absolutely cannot remain in power in the Gaza Strip, period. So as we work through these issues, one of the things that was very clear on our trip in meeting with Saudi Arabia and meeting with Jordanian officials, they want this conflict to come to an end. They want the humanitarian crisis to be addressed.

And they want the threats of Hamas, of the -- of the Iranian proxies, the Houthis, Hezbollah, as well as the threats from Iran contained and eliminated. And so everybody is on the same page about the need to contain the threats and to push back against the threats. But obviously the -- the humanitarian situation on the ground in Gaza is one that we all want to see addressed, but not through Hamas. We want to make sure that the aid gets directly to the Palestinian people.

MATTINGLY: Republican Congressman Mike Lawler, always appreciate your time, sir. Thank you.

LAWLER: Thank you.

MATTINGLY: Ahead, the Elon Musk factor in Trump's negotiations over that mega tax bill. Late this afternoon, the world's richest man called on Republicans to, "kill the bill." He's been trashing it all day on X. What his frustrations could mean for his relationship with President Trump? That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)