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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Elon Musk Posts On X, Kill The Bill; Ex-Capitol Police Chief's First Interview Since Retiring; Ventura's Friend Testifies Combs Dangled Her Over 17-Storey Balcony; "Goodnight, And Good Luck" Airs Live Saturday At 7PM ET; Acting FAA Admin Testifies Before House Budget Committee Today. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired June 04, 2025 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[18:00:00]

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN HOST: Welcome to the Lead. I'm Phil Mattingly in for Jake Tapper.

This hour the influence of Elon Musk versus President Trump. The world's richest man wants to, quote, kill the bill, referring to the very legislation that brought Senate Republicans to the White House this afternoon.

Also, the head of the FAA noted the agency has work to do to prevent near misses and pilots losing communication with air traffic control. How quickly he says you'll see changes.

And stunning testimony in the Sean Diddy Combs trial from a witness who says Combs dangled her from a 17th story balcony.

The Lead Tonight, Elon Musk attacking President Trump's so-called big, beautiful bill multiple times repeatedly online, demanding lawmakers, kill the major domestic policy legislation and start all over again. Trump's response so far, oh, we haven't really heard much of anything.

CNN's Kristen Holmes starts us off from the White House. Kristen, I think the meeting just ended, so we're all still trying to figure out what happened. What do we know about where the White House is tonight?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, look, let's talk about that thing you just mentioned, which is kind of the elephant in the room, right? Why has President Trump not responded to Elon Musk? And I do want to give the caveat, which we always give with Trump, which is this could change at any moment. But I spoke to a number of administration officials who said that, yes, he was unhappy yesterday with these tweets, but he was also surprised and a little bit confused at just how strongly Musk was coming out against this bill. The confusion also in the sense that they'd had these conversations before and it felt a little bit 11th hour for Musk to be weighing in at this time, something we've heard from lawmakers on the Hill as well.

The other interesting part of this that I heard from these administration officials who've been speaking with Donald Trump about this was that, in some ways, he seemed to almost be okay with these attacks, linking it to the repeal of these electric vehicle credits, saying that it was likely because this was something that Elon Musk had to do for his business, which is just an interesting thing when you hear Donald Trump talking like that, especially given what we have heard from him as he has attacked a number of these senators who have spoken out against the bill.

I mean, Rand Paul, for example, we saw Donald Trump absolutely light him up online, saying that he had no good ideas, that all he did was say no, that his ideas were loser ideas. And a part of that I'm told is because the White House believes to a certain extent, or at least many of them believe that they're never going to turn Rand Paul, that Rand Paul's never going to get behind this bill. So, it doesn't matter what Donald Trump does because there's not really anything left to lose.

But with someone like Elon Musk, first of all, they don't necessarily believe that this is going to have that much of an impact on these senators, but, two, Donald Trump, as we know, and Elon Musk, their relationship is in a category all of its own.

MATTINGLY: The most critical point, which you were the first one to tell me many, many months ago.

Kristen Holmes from the North Lawn of the White House, thank you so much.

Well, that meeting with President Trump and group of Senate Republicans just wrapped up. It was about this bill critical senators from the most important committee. One of those senators, Republican Senator Steve Daines of Montana is fresh out of that meeting. He joins us now.

Senator, I really appreciate your time. I just want to start with, there are a lot of moving parts in your conference about things people want, things people are concerned about. What specifically did you and your colleagues say you wanted change today and how open was the president to it?

SEN. STEVE DAINES (R-MT): Yes, well, it was great meeting. It's nice to have all the Senate Finance Committee Republicans who will write this tax portion of the bill around the table with the president. We had Vice President Vance there as well, Secretary Bessent and Kevin Hasset. So, we had the A team there. But it was a very productive conversation.

And I think one of the key takeaways here is, number one, by acting now, getting this bill passed, we will prevent the largest tax increase in American history. And number two, we talked a lot about the growth potential that's going to happen to the economy because of this bill. These provisions are very pro-growth. They also will help American businesses become more competitive because we've got provisions there to encourage investment in research and development.

So, there's a lot of talk about the growth we need here is when you grow the economy, wages go up and that's a good thing for the American people.

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MATTINGLY: Did the president mention -- look, I understand and have a fairly decent sense of where your conference is in general about what they're focused on right now. Elon Musk has a powerful platform and literally a week and a half ago was working in the White House. Did the president mention that at all. Is he concerned? Are you guys concerned about the effect?

DAINES: Yes. Well, look, we we're all friends with Elon. We've got great respect for Elon. He's one of the true geniuses of America, what he has done in so many areas as a great entrepreneur. But, I mean, first and foremost, Elon Musk, while his voice, , it matters to a certain extent. Look, it's the senators that are looking at this bill and contemplate what needs to be done.

I would say that I don't disagree with Elon Musk, that we've got to do some work to certainly increase the passion on reducing spending. But this is not our only time. We're going to have a chance to address spending. This is going to be primarily focused on making these tax rates permanent and avoiding $4.5 trillion tax increase. That is the biggest tax increase in American history if we don't act.

So, that's really the focus, and I don't disagree with Elon. We need to continue the diligence of reducing this massive federal bureaucracy to find ways to drive a lot of the waste, the fraud, and the abuse out. You know, Elon's right on that, but we can't get it all done in one bill. This is going to probably take a couple bills over time. This one is primarily focused on finding ways here to prevent the largest tax increase in American history.

MATTINGLY: What was the president's directive? What was he talking about from his side of things during this discussion?

DAINES: Yes. Well, really it was that. The president was very clear, is that we simply must prevent the largest tax increase in American history, which is coming if Congress does not act. And number two, I think really the growth issues. What can we do to, can you grow the economy? Because when we grow the economy, wages increase.

But also we've got the issue of China and competition and this provision of this tax bill to incentivize American businesses to not only manufacture here in the United States but also to make sure that we're investing in research and development because we've got to drive the strongest innovation ecosystem in the world to compete long-term and to win in global markets.

MATTINGLY: I think one of the questions I've had about the design of the bill is, in order to kind of fit it into the reconciliation process, the Senate rules here, the business elements or the provisions that you are talking about here, which by far would have the biggest growth effect, that the White House is using as the justification for why they don't believe this bill will drive up deficits, they're temporary, they expire. And then most of the spending cuts are on the back end of the bill, the back half of the bill. Can you make those permanent? And then how will you pay for them?

DAINES: Yes, that's a great question. And that was one of the discussion we had here today, is to make sure that we have some of these important incentives made permanent. And so that will be some more modeling being done, certainly Kevin Hassett and Secretary Bessent and so forth, but that was part of our discussion here. Because you want to make sure that you've got long-term growth, economic growth that extends for many, many years. And so that's one of our takeaways.

But I think there's a consensus among the Senate Republicans that we wanted to try to make permanency a key theme on these provisions of the tax bill.

MATTINGLY: But the permanency, the reason it's not is because it costs a lot more money to do it and fit it into the budget window. So how do you balance it? What's the balance there? What are you cutting?

DAINES: Well, you know, it's only the CBO that was suggested by stopping massive tax increases, it costs a lot of money. And that's just a part of I think the blunders of the CBO methodology. But that's part of the careful balance we have here, is finding ways to drive a lot of the waste, the fraud, the abuse out of some of these important safety nets, like Medicaid. That's what we work on, is driving that fraud, waste and abuse out. On the other hand, how do you create incentives in this economy to invest, invest in capital, to invest in R&D, which grows the economy? And, by the way, for every 1 percent of GDP growth, it's about $3 trillion of additional tax revenues coming in.

So, this is pulling off a balancing act, certainly, but growing the economy increases tax revenues, but importantly keeps America competitive on the global stage, you look at the challenge we face, certainly across Pacific, there in China.

MATTINGLY: Yes. You're trying to tempt me into a current baseline debate, and I'm not going to let you do it, sir, not for our audience's sake.

I want to ask you, you talked about the, the waste fraud abuse elements, the cuts elements, Centers for Medicaid and Medicare Services Administrator Mehmet Oz attended a Republican senator's lunch today, and when he we left, he said this about the bills, Medicaid work requirements. Take a listen.

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DR. MEHMET OZ, ADMINISTRATOR, CENTERS FOR MEDICARE AND MEDICAID SERVICES: It was important for us to provide a, a nudge to, to some Americans to remember that they have agency over their future and what they say matters. What they do influences people around them.

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MATTINGLY: You know, a recent study from the Urban Institute think tank says anywhere between 23,000 and 27,000 Medicaid expansion recipients could lose coverage under the bill.

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It's really going to create new administrative hurdles, even for people who are eligible to keep coverage. How can you be sure, the administration insists, if you are eligible, you will not lose coverage. How can you ensure that's the case?

DAINES: Right. Well, that is absolutely an operating principle. In fact, President Trump made that very clear today in our meeting is that, we're going to go after the waste, the fraud, and the abuse, but we want to make sure we protect and keep this important safety net, Medicaid.

One of the problems we, we face with, with this very important safety net is you've got, you know, 1.4 million illegals currently, illegal immigrants on Medicaid when there should be for those who really need it, American citizens. And we've got situations where you've got able bodied American people that can work. We want to incentivize them to get off of Medicaid and back onto private insurance by getting a job.

And so those are some of the reforms that we are looking at for Medicaid. But the president made it very clear he doesn't want to see any deserving men and women, children that need Medicaid to be cut from it.

MATTINGLY: You mentioned Elon, or we talked about Elon Musk. The reason why I want to swing back is because the deficit debt issue is critical for at least four, I think, members of your conference. It's critical for bond markets right now as they're trying to understand what this bill will mean over time, and the state of the U.S. debt and financial stability. Given the degree to which Musk has been trashing the bill on those grounds, did you guys talk about that, about how to address it, how to push back on it?

DAINES: Well, I tell you one of the great principles that, that solves a lot of our problems, if you look at our fiscal challenge in America, of course, we need to rein in the massive spending, but it's really about economic growth. That is a very important lever to throw, because without a growing economy, you're not going to have the tax revenues coming into Washington, D.C.

And, again, you know, for a 1 percent increase in GDP over ten years, it's another $3 trillion of revenues coming to Washington. And so you can't cut your way out of this mess in Washington. Cuts are important, but we got to grow our way out of this mess with an economy that's growing at 3 to 4 percent annually, GDP.

MATTINGLY: Which, you know, as the White House officials economic team, like Kevin Hassett, say that they did it in the first term. They believe they can do it again. I have to ask one more time, though, because the president doesn't let people attack him or the things he cares deeply about and not respond, and yet we haven't heard a response today. So, what was his response in the meeting?

DAINES: Yes. Well, I mean, I think certainly the President Elon are great friends, there's great respect. The president called him a genius today in our meeting because he believes strong in El Musk and all the work that he did to help his new administration. But I think he's got maybe a difference of opinion right now on some of these spending issues.

You can't fix everything in one bill, but this is an important first step. We've got $1.5 trillion dollars of spending reductions. That's a great first step. But, importantly, it's making some of these tax provisions permanent. And second, making sure we don't allow the largest tax increase in American history to occur, which is going to happen on the 1st of January next year if Congress doesn't act.

MATTINGLY: Republican Senator Steve Daines of Montana, member of the Senate Finance Committee, fresh out of a meeting with the president, I really appreciate your time, sir. Thank you.

DAINES: Thank you.

MATTINGLY: Well, in the Money Lead, President Trump's raising tariffs on steel and aluminum imports from 25 percent to 50 percent, yet they're now in effect.

CNN's Vanessa Yurkevich is at the magic wall to explain how this major increase maybe passed on to consumers. Vanessa, what could be the impact caused by this doubling of those steel and aluminum tariffs?

VANESSA YURKEVICH, CNN BUSINESS AND POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, a significant increase for consumers heading their way. Just look at what happened with producer prices in the last month or so, from March to April. Because foreign prices on steel are increasing, U.S. prices of steel will increase because U.S. producers have no incentive to keep prices low.

So, producer prices on steel up 6 percent, just when there was a 25 percent tariff in that same time period, up 2 percent for aluminum, and we expect those prices to rise. And then, ultimately, what does that mean for the producers making all of this stuff that us consumers buy every single day? Well, it will have an impact. Ultimately, cars and trucks, home appliances, machinery, airplanes, building materials that we use to build homes, and food and beverage cans.

The steel industry is saying that they welcome this increase in the tariff because they believe it will create more jobs. But, Phil, for every one steel job saved, some reporting indicates from studies that 75 other manufacturing jobs are lost because of the higher inputs into making these goods and services.

I also want to draw your attention to how U.S. businesses are trying to skirt some of these higher tariffs.

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We've been looking at the Dominican Republic. A lot of companies have said that they've been trying to move to Southeast Asia out of China, but we've heard in recent months that companies are looking to the Dominican Republic. Just look at all these different brands that are already manufacturing there, including a new company, World Emblem, the largest producer of patches for clothing. They're going to be opening shop, next year, breaking ground this month in the country.

Why, Phil? Well, there's a ton of benefits. Just look at this, free zones. These are sort of industrial parks that allow companies to operate tax free in certain areas. So, you're talking about income taxes that they don't have to pay, transfer taxes, import taxes, saving millions of dollars. Proximity to the U.S., Dominican Republic just days away compared to Asia, which is weeks away. And wages about 30 percent less to manufacture in the Dominican Republic than Mexico.

But, Phil, some hurdles. We're talking about space. It's a small island, not a ton of space to manufacture, and because of the size, fewer skilled workers. And then the biggest issue that I've heard from people is people just simply don't know, Phil, that there's a big manufacturing capacity in the Dominican Republic. I asked the CEO of World Emblem how he found out about the Dominican Republic. He's moving 30 to 35 percent of his production there. This is the reason, and this is why he heard about where to move all of his production, ChatGPT. That's where he got the answer. It just shows wasn't well known to him, but he got his answer from A.I. and now he's spending millions there. Phil?

MATTINGLY: Your story this morning, laying all this out was absolutely fascinating. Great reporting. Vanessa Yurkevich, thank you, my friend.

YURKEVICH: Thank you, Phil.

MATTINGLY: Well, we'll talk more about the president's agenda later on in our Business Leader series. Hear from a company owner worried about those tariffs and the impact on his business.

But, first, a change of the guard, the U.S. Capitol four years after the January 6th attack. I'll speak with the retiring police chief about those pardoned in the riot in his advice for the next person taking over his job.

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MATTINGLY: In our Law and Justice Lead, changing times, and for the U.S. Capitol Police, a changing of the guard. Capitol Police Chief Tom Manger, who took up the role after the January 6th, 2021 riot, just retired after nearly 50 years in law enforcement. He now joins us for his first interview since leaving the job.

Sir, seeing you in a normal suit is different. I actually want to start, we were talking before during the break about -- I covered the Capitol for a long time. I think so very highly of so many Capitol police officers. What do people need to know about the Capitol Police as well as kind of the safety and security of the Capitol now?

TOM MANGER, FORMER U.S. CAPITOL POLICE CHIEF: So, I think when, right after January 6th, people looked at the Capitol Police and some people had not paid any attention to the Capitol Police prior to January 6th. And they now define -- there're some folks that define the Capitol police by that day. That's a mistake. There were a lot of failures that day. The one thing that did not fail that day was the courage, the resilience of the men and women of the Capitol Police. They fought and they did their job as best they could.

There were lots of, failures that day, equipment failures, training failures, operational planning failures, leadership failures. And I think that the cops felt like the department let them down that day, and the department did. So, four years later, I think it's a very different police department. And, certainly, the morale, the mood of the officers is much improved.

MATTINGLY: I think that's certainly been my kind of what I've picked up as well. It's been nice to see. It was a pretty difficult time for a lot of people back then.

Now that you've left officially, what is your opinion of the pardons of the January 6th rioters that took place on inauguration day?

MANGER: Well, my opinion's the same as it was on the day they occurred. It was, an absolute slap in the face to law enforcement, not just the Capitol Police and all of the police departments that were there on January 6th, trying to defend the Capitol, but it sends a message to law enforcement all over this country that politics is more important than policing.

And I think about, you know, every day there are demonstrations, large demonstrations, all over this country, whether it's about the war in Gaza, reproductive rights, climate change, you name it, you name the topic, there are protests going on where you have counter-protesters, and these officers have to keep the peace and, and they're in the middle of it.

So, as they're doing their job, do they have to be worried about what a politician's going to decide afterward that, you know, arrests they make, that, you know, what they do to keep the peace is going to be looked at and, and folks are not going to be held accountable that broke the law. I mean, this is the message that it sends when you talk about, these pardons.

And, by the way, it wasn't just the incoming president. The outgoing president on the inauguration day, pardoned Leonard Peltier, who, 50 years ago, shot and killed two FBI agents and he was pardoned. Again, I'm not sure what the purpose of that was. You know, I know I've heard folks say, oh, he was in the jail for 50 years. Okay, that's fine though. He shot and killed two FBI agents in cold blood.

So, when police officers around the country see these kinds of pardons, they have to question what's the elected officials commitment to the sacrifices that they make doing their job.

MATTINGLY: There has also been reporting, and it's all kind of along the same vein of a person familiar with telling CNN, the administration agreed to pay nearly $5 million to the family of Ashli Babbitt. Obviously, the pro-Donald Trump rioter shot and killed. She was trying to get into the speaker's lobby. There's video of it. Once approved in court, the settlement will end a $30 million wrongful death lawsuit.

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What's your response to that?

MANGER: Well, again, this is -- it's tough to understand because the Department of Justice and the Metropolitan Police Department of Washington, D.C., both investigated that shooting. And they came to the same conclusion that it was a lawful justified shooting, that there was no wrongdoing by police in that deadly use of force.

And so I don't understand and I think that there's a lot of law enforcement officers around this country that don't understand when you have a justified shooting and there's this kind of settlement, you know, in the case, again, after it's been adjudicated and determined by the Department of Justice and a police investigation that it was lawful and justified.

MATTINGLY: In your -- at the time we have left over the course of your four years, do you feel better about the direction of the environment you are kind of working in, the political divisiveness, the views of Capitol Police, the response to January 6th? Are you optimistic? Are you pessimistic? Where do you stand?

MANGER: Well, I'm -- by nature and optimist. But I will tell you that it didn't get much better over the four years that I was there. And certainly the next chief who will have their work cut out for them trying to navigate the politics on Capitol Hill, because it is so divisive there. It seems like there's nothing that the two sides can agree on.

And too often I found myself as the chief of the Capitol Police right in the middle of a partisan battle where I had to, you know, make sure that I wasn't allowing politics to influence the way the Capitol Police does their job.

MATTINGLY: Like some of the most surreal, bizarre issues as well. I really appreciate your time coming in. Congratulations on the retirement. Now retired U.S. Capitol Police Chief Tom Manger, thank you very much.

MANGER: Thank you.

MATTINGLY: Well, coming up that dramatic testimony from today's Sean Diddy Combs trial, a witness described how Combs violently held her over a balcony. That's next.

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MATTINGLY: In our Law and Justice Lead, dramatic testimony today in the Sean Combs sex trafficking and racketeering trial. The jury heard from two witnesses, including a longtime friend of Cassie Ventura who says Combs held her over the railing of a 17th floor balcony.

Now, we should note Combs has pleaded not guilty to the charges.

Let's get straight to CNN's Kara Scannell, Elizabeth Wagmeister, both of you were inside the court today. Elizabeth, to start with you, the stunning testimony from Ventura's friend who told the jury about several violent encounters, including when Combs and Ventura threw a knife at one another, what'd you make of it?

ELIZABETH WAGMEISTER, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: Yes, so that was a brand new allegation. Bryana Bongolan, she goes by Bonnie and -- sorry by Bana, and she is a very close friend of Cassie Ventura. They met around 2014, 2015, and they remain good friends to this day. In fact, she said that Cassie texted her today.

Well, she alleged that Sean Combs dangled her over the 17th floor balcony at Cassie Ventura's apartment in Los Angeles. As you said, Phil, she also alleged that one time Sean Combs showed up at Cassie's apartment in the middle of the night, was banging on the door. And when he came in, he threw a knife at her. She also testified to a verbal threat that Comb said to her one time.

So, here, you have Bana, who is not just testifying to her own allegations, but also the prosecution clearly bringing her up here in an effort to corroborate parts of Cassie's account. But I do have to tell you on cross-examination, the defense brought up that Bana herself has a civil suit against Combs and essentially saying to her, are you here for money? And are you telling the truth?

MATTINGLY: Kara, to that point, in terms of what the Combs legal team did today, that push back, how were they operating in their cross- examination?

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Phil, they focused on a couple of different areas, one of them drug use. Because part of the allegations in this case, as prosecutors say, that Combs had drugged Ventura, that he was forcing drugs on her. And what Bana had testified to was that she and Cassie were using drugs before Bana even met Combs. She said that they were essentially doing drugs on a weekly basis. And they had this arrangement where Ventura would give her the money and she would get the drugs.

And on cross-examination, she was asked about how many drugs she had done with Ventura and they went through at least ten different kinds of drugs that they were using, which was far more than what was brought out by the prosecution on direct.

They also, Combs' attorneys, focused on her memory of these details of the balcony, of the knife, and she was asked, just two days ago, you met with prosecutors, you said to them then that you didn't remember the details of the balcony and Bana testified, I don't remember. So they're really testing that memory there, Phil.

MATTINGLY: Elizabeth, there was a forensic audio and video editor who testified and testified about that 2016 hotel surveillance tape that you first reported on. What was the importance of the testimony?

WAGMEISTER: You know, so he was on the stand for nearly two hours meticulously going through that video footage from that hotel, and he was -- they were rewinding, they were pressing play, they were pressing pause, and he was asked many questions. But what he said is that from his assessment as an expert witness, that this video footage was not altered. He said that this is a reliable representation of what actually happened at that hotel.

And that is key because you remember that Combs' team, they fought very hard to get that video footage ejected from evidence. They did not want the jury to see it. And part of their many arguments was that they allege that that video footage was altered.

MATTINGLY: Kara, you're our eyes inside the courtroom. not just this trial, but so many trials that we've covered. Combs' reactions. what have you seen? What have you observed?

SCANNELL: Well, Sean Combs is very active in his defense. So, he's constantly passing post-it notes to his attorneys. He's constantly conferring with them. They come over and they talk to him in the middle of the cross-examination sometimes. Today, he seemed to be taking it in. I noticed him looking over at the jury a lot today to see perhaps how they were absorbing the testimony. And throughout the day between the video witness and then also with Bana's testimony, I mean, there were a lot of breaks, a lot of sidebars, a lot of fits and starts.

And I saw a number of the jurors rubbing their eyes. You know, this has been a long trial. We're in week four. But when the testimony starts, they are paying attention. Phil?

MATTINGLY: Two of the best, Kara Scannell, Elizabeth Wagmeister, thank you guys.

Well, up ahead, the ripple effect of Trump's tariffs on a small tech company in Nashville, Tennessee. The owner will join me in our Business Leader series. That's next.

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MATTINGLY: We are back with our Business Leaders where we hear from small business owners across America about President Trump's tariffs. Some like the tariffs, many do not.

[18:40:01]

My next guest describes his product as Life Alert mixed with FixBit but for houseplant. It's a Bluetooth device to help you care for your plant to keep it alive. The business is called Flora and launched during the pandemic.

Founder Aabesh De joins me now from Nashville. Aabesh, it's such a unique product. I have a lot of questions about how you actually produce it, manufacturing, supply chain, and what effect tariffs have had on that process.

AABESH DE, FOUNDER, FLORA: Absolutely. Well, first and foremost, Phil, thank you so much for having me and highlighting stories like mine for small businesses that are affected by tariffs. So, this story inevitably starts all the way back as really an American dream story, an adventure story of me literally turning on my MacGyver's hat to create these plant sensors that acted as life alerts, like you said. because I was a serial plant killer back in the day. Through COVID, I was killing every single plant in my line of sight. It was my mom's gift of prized rose bush plant that I killed. That inevitably led me to patenting and inventing the sensor so I could basically stop other people from serially killing their plants.

We had our breakthrough moment in terms of that American dream journey last year when we actually got on the Shark Tank, all this demand coming up. And so to feasibly make all of that work in terms of producing our first manufacturing batch, we actually produced it out of China. We had our first 2,000 units come out of China last year to essentially meet the demand out of Shark Tank. And that bill, to give you context in how that relates to tariffs, that shipping bill is about $7,000 to $8,000 all in last year.

Now, this year, we have a similar pent up demand over the summer, right? Everyone here around Nashville is getting ready to see their cherry tomatoes blossom and thrive. And so we have all these people ready to kind of pounce on the Flora pods when they arrive. We have another 2,000 batch, same batch of last year. The shipping bill this time around from the height of the 145 percent tariffs was $32,000 to $33,000. Mind you, that's with working with multiple freight forwarders to get it down. So, we had to make this choice of do we literally just take the risk of shipping these out and seeing how it plays out or do we hold back -- us as a small business to make hold of, right?

So, we decided to wait it out. Luckily, we saw some relief, right, in the 30 percent zone that effectively became a 50 to 60 percent effective tax at port because all these duties, the fentanyl duties, the sector specific duties and taxes all add up.

So, this time around, our final shipping bill for that same batch compared to the $7,000 last year is effectively over $13,000, still a 90 percent effective hike that we're having to deal with as a small business.

MATTINGLY: Do you eat that? Do you pass it on? How are you thinking through kind of the long term effect in terms of that increase?

DE: Yes. So, for us, and I'm not alone when I say this, it's an existential question, right? It's a $30,000 bill initially that became twice the amount effectively, you know, in less than a month's time. It's this uncertainty that we're dealing with. And the last thing we want to do is with these Flora pods.

You know, people buy multiple of these for their plants, right? People buy two at a time, three at a time. So, the last thing we want to do is price hike the pods to where it becomes not affordable at all. And so one of the first things that I did was look to absorbing the cost as much as we could.

And so to adapt -- administration for some relief. I realized that there was going to be some uncertainty here, but maybe we could get some loan funding to essentially get us through this hectic summer season. We chatted with dozens of banks that work with the SBA. We finally landed over 300 -- funding in the final finish line in terms of approval.

Right before it got to underwriting, two different banks with these same offers retracted them, touting the tariffs and uncertainty around the government's policies as a risk. It felt like I was hit with this manmade tsunami that the government, you know, kind of pushed through in terms of sweeping policy changes. We were this tiny ship in the middle of the ocean that were effectively drowning, looking for a lifeboat, and the SBA basically said, we don't like the fact that you're drowning out there, sorry, right?

So, we're absorbing the cost as much as we can. There's a lot of uncertainty we have to deal with, but we're figuring it out, just like all the 4 million other small businesses that are impacted by these tariffs.

MATTINGLY: Yes. The business, one more time, it's called Flora. Aabesh De, thank you very much for joining. I appreciate it.

DE: Thanks so much for having me.

MATTINGLY: Well, CNN is working on a major special production coming your way this weekend. CNN's Anderson Cooper is up next with a sneak peek.

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[18:48:27]

MATTINGLY: In our pop lead history will be made right here on CNN this Saturday night. That's when CNN Presents a live broadcast of the five- time Tony Award nominated play "Goodnight, and Good Luck" on Broadway.

It features two-time Academy Award winner George Clooney, who stars as Edward R. Murrow in the lead up to his legendary showdown with Senator Joseph McCarthy. CNN's Anderson Cooper just spoke with George Clooney on the Broadway set ahead of the big night.

Anderson is with us now.

Anderson, thanks so much for joining.

I guess there's so much excitement built up heading into Saturday night, not just because its the first time a Broadway play will be televised, but also because some of the striking parallels between the McCarthy era and now.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, "AC360": Yeah. I think that's certainly true. And I do think it's an exciting broadcast. As you said, this has never been done before. This is an opportunity for people all around the world to see a Broadway production being performed live by George Clooney and this cast. I talked to Clooney yesterday on the stage where they've recreated an

old CBS News See It Now Newsroom. Clooney obviously plays Edward R. Murrow.

I asked him about what he thinks is bringing so many people to see this play for each performance.

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GEORGE CLOONEY, ACTOR: I think they feel that they wanted a place to be in a room together where they could hear and talk about who we are at our best, and I think that's a good -- I think it's a good outlet to give them is something.

COOPER: Because a lot of people feel like in this room, probably who are, here feel that we are at our worst right now.

[18:50:04]

CLOONEY: I can make an argument that we're not. I can make an argument that we've had much worse times in our history. You know, 1968, every city in the United States was burning and there was a -- National Guard was surrounding the White House and the Capitol, and we lost Martin Luther King and Bobby Kennedy, and Tet Offensive.

But it's a frustrating time, and I think a scary time for many people. It's a scary time to be a news person, to be in your profession. Youve been picked out, you know, "60 Minutes" has been picked out. Most news organizations are under fire.

That usually happens with demagogues in a way. Usually is a way of the first places you attack are the news, because that's how we inform ourselves.

COOPER: Do you think Trumpism lasts beyond this term?

CLOONEY: I don't think so. I think I think it'd be very hard to do it.

Remember this, Donald Trump is a celebrity. That's what he is. I mean, he's got a -- you know, he has a star on Hollywood Boulevard. I don't have a star on Hollywood Boulevard. I'm not lobbying for one. I'm just saying, you know --

COOPER: It seems like an oversight, by the way.

CLOONEY: Yeah, what's going on?

He's a celebrity, and he's the president of the United States. And so, he has been elected. Duly elected. Fair deal.

I'm not complaining about that. That's how it works. That's how this democracy works.

But he's also a celebrity and he is charming. And to the people who like him, they think he's funny. To a great many others, they don't. And so, when he is finished and he will be finished, they're going to have to go looking for someone who can deliver the message that he delivered with the same kind of charisma. And they don't have that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: Clooney co-wrote this this play. Initially, it was for television. It became a movie. Now it's a play. He wrote it 20 years ago. But certainly, for many people who are coming, it feels very, very timely indeed, Phil.

MATTINGLY: Yeah. No question about it. Anderson Cooper, thanks so much.

You can watch the special broadcast of the Broadway hit "Goodnight, and Good Luck" this Saturday night, at 7:00 Eastern, only on CNN.

Well, the plan for air travel changes. How the FAA says it can help prevent near misses and pilots losing communication with air traffic control. But there are major questions about how the plan will become a reality. That's next.

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[18:56:45]

MATTINGLY: In our national lead, after weeks of repeated shutdowns, delays and near misses, the Federal Aviation Administration says they're making big changes. The acting FAA administrator appeared before the House Appropriations Committee today and gave some details about the agency's next moves.

CNN aviation correspondent Pete Muntean is here with me now.

What were your takeaways?

PETE MUNTEAN, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: Well, the big thing here is this was another chance for the Trump administration to make its pitch for building an all new air traffic control system, something Trump Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy has been teasing for the last month. Still low on specifics about how much this would cost. But FAA Acting Chief Chris Rocheleau did give an answer on how much inaction is costing.

He said 90 percent of the FAAs budget goes toward what he calls band, aiding the agency's aging air traffic control infrastructure, 90 percent, as if that statistic could not get any more sobering, Rocheleau said critical safety systems are facing what he calls frequent structural deficiencies. All of this highlighted by last month's repeat Newark approach control outages of radar and radio.

The Trump administration is now looking for a private company to lead the effort of building six new air traffic control centers, upgrading 600 radars and replacing copper wire with fiber optic cable at 4,600 facilities. This is what the acting head of the FAA told this House appropriations subcommittee this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) CHRIS ROCHELEAU, ACTING ADMINISTRATOR, FEDERAL AVIATION ADMINISTRATION: That will enable the resiliency, the efficiency of the system, and the ability to make sure that as we increase operations, that we'll be able to do that in a consistent manner. Without the outages and the -- and the struggles that we've been facing, as we've seen in the news just recently.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MUNTEAN: This is especially timely right now. We're at the dawn of summer travel, and that's already proving to be huge. The Thursday before Memorial Day was the fifth largest day for air travel in TSA history. Everyone wants to know right now if flying is safe, and the FAA insists most problems at Newark are really in the rearview now, a closed runway was compounding delays and cancellations there. That construction work is now over ahead of schedule, and the FAA insists it's doing some final checks right now. But it sounds like that runway will be reopened sometime next week, meaning the FAA will up the cap on the number of flights in and out of Newark.

MATTINGLY: Am I wrong to be skeptical that things are in the rearview mirror?

MUNTEAN: I, you know, the big thing -- it's two parts of the system, it's infrastructure and people. And we're still 3,000 air traffic controllers short in the U.S. and Newark is really a microcosm of all those problems. It's an -- it's an intersection of perfect storm of issues. And so, they say they will have more controllers to backfill the shortage that is taking place there sometime later this fall, like in October.

MATTINGLY: Pete Muntean, appreciate you, bud.

Well, in our last lead, a surprise for police responding to a call of noise disturbance in Columbia, Missouri.

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MATTINGLY: That's the band the All-American Rejects playing a backyard gig. It's part of their house party tour, something the band started as a way of protesting against expensive arena shows. Police did not shut down the gig, but the band played one last song.

Well, quickly to California for a wild one in the national lead. Caretakers dressing up as bears played one last song well quickly to California for a wild one in the national league. Caretakers dressing up as bears to treat a cub. Crews found the two-month-old black bear weak and alone in the Los Padres National Forest in April and took it to the San Diego Humane Society.

The staff wears bear costumes to prevent the cub from bonding with humans. The goal return to the wild after a year of growth.

"ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT" starts now.