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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Judge Sets Friday Hearing in Trump's Attempt to Fire Fed Governor; Eight-Year-Old Fletcher Merkel Identified as Minnesota Shooting Victim; Sources Say, White House Planning Immigration Enforcement Operation in Chicago as Soon as Next Week. Police: Shooter Had "Deranged Fascination" With Prior Shootings; Judge Sets Friday Hearing In Trump's Attempt To Fire Fed Governor. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired August 28, 2025 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to The Lead. I'm Jake Tapper.

This hour, hearing has now been set for tomorrow morning, a legal hearing over whether President Trump can actually fire a Federal Reserve governor for the reason he is citing. This is the latest chapter in a legal battle with major implications for the Fed, for the interest rates that you pay and for the power of the presidency.

Plus, an 11-year-old girl speaking to CNN today about surviving that horrific mass shooting at the Minneapolis Catholic school yesterday. Hear her account of sitting in the church just moments before gunfire erupted, and how she and other children ran into a nearby room and piled furniture in front of the door.

Also, did Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard revealed the identity of an undercover CIA officer?

[18:00:03]

What sources are telling CNN tonight about a recent memo made public by DNI Gabbard and how her office is responding, that's ahead.

The Lead tonight, the legal showdown over presidential power that is headed to the courts tomorrow morning. A federal judge is set to hold a hearing after Fed Governor Lisa Cook sued the Trump administration in federal court today. She calls the president's efforts to remove her from the position at the Fed, quote, unprecedented and illegal.

President Trump says he's removing Cook over allegations that she made false statements on a mortgage application. But is that sufficient cause?

CNN's Chief White House Correspondent and Anchor Kaitlan Collins' live for us at the White House. And, Kaitlan, how is the White House responding to Cook's lawsuit?

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jake, they've acknowledged that she is challenging her firing, that this is going to now set up this huge legal showdown starting in court tomorrow where Lisa Cook's just trying to get that temporary restraining order where she can basically stay on the job as this is going to play out.

They knew this was going to be a legal battle, Jake. Obviously, we've never seen a president do this in the Federal Reserve Board of Governors' history before, and so this is going to be a familiar territory for them because they've done this with other people who have never really been fired by the executive branch of four and now are in this position.

And so they say they're well prepared for this legal fight, Jake. They do ultimately believe they're going to win out here. And several White House officials pointed out to me that in her lawsuit today responding to this that Lisa Cook did not deny the allegations that are being made against her exactly when it comes to these allegations of mortgage fraud. Obviously, that's going to play out in court, Jake, but the White House says, as she is prepared to fight this battle, that so are they.

TAPPER: And, Kaitlan, there's another big controversy going on, this major shakeup at the CDC, Trump firing the CDC director, other top health officials resigning in protest. What are they saying about that and what this could mean for other federal workers and for the health of the American people?

COLLINS: Yes, Jake. It's pretty remarkable actually to see this playing out because Dr. Monarez has only been the CDC director for about a month now. She was sworn in not that long ago after being confirmed by the Senate. It was just five months ago that President Trump picked her for this job after the first person that he had designated to be the CDC director was clearly just not going to get enough support up on Capitol Hill.

And so then they picked Dr. Monarez, the president put out a statement at the time calling her an amazing public servant, an amazing mother as well. Secretary Kennedy said that he handpicked her for this job and praised her MAHA credentials. But now she has been fired, obviously, Jake, something that she was even disputing last night saying she hadn't actually heard from the White House that she had been fired and was disputing whether or not Secretary Kennedy himself could actually do so, really arguing that that can only come from the president himself.

And this is obviously a huge question at today's White House press briefing, and this is what the press secretary had to say about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: It was President Trump who was overwhelmingly reelected on November 5th. This woman has never received a vote in her life, and the president has the authority to fire those who are not aligned with his mission.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: Now, Jake, I will note obviously she's referring to the president winning the election there, but she did get votes from Republican senators upon Capitol Hill who voted to confirm her. 51 of them voted not that long ago.

And so now, one, obviously there's real questions about who's running the CDC. Yes, they've named an acting director, but it's not someone in a permanent position. There has not been a permanent CDC director since Trump took office, obviously, as they've been having this battle play out. But now, Jake, they have to go through this process of picking someone else, nominating them, and then also getting them confirmed by the Senate, even though the person that the Senate just confirmed has now been ousted from this job.

And, Jake, I'll say, obviously we've seen so much of the reporting on the tension behind the scenes between Dr. Monarez and Secretary Kennedy over vaccine approval and what the CDC is saying about that. Obviously, they were just praising her not that long ago. And the White House hasn't explicitly said where they did not align on those areas behind the scenes. But it's clearly led to the resignation of several top officials and potentially more to come, Jake.

TAPPER: All right, Kaitlan Collins at the White House. And don't miss Kaitlan on her show, The Source with Kaitlan Collins. Tonight, she's going to be joined by three of the CDC officials who resigned in protest. That's tonight at 9:00 P.M. Eastern only here on CNN.

Joining us now, former U.S. Treasury Secretary under President Biden and former Chair of the Federal Reserve Janet Yellen. Secretary Yellen, thank you so much for being here.

So, turning back to the Lisa Cook affair, this is the first time that any president has tried to fire a governor of the Federal Reserve. You said in the Financial Times that this is dangerous and unlawful. What might you have done if this happened while you were chair of the Fed?

JANET YELLEN, FORMER TREASURY SECRETARY, BIDEN ADMINISTRATION: Well, as you mentioned, it's never happened in the Fed's entire, more than a hundred year history that a president has tried to fire a governor.

[18:05:00]

The Federal Reserve Act says that can only occur for cause. And the question here is whether or not an accusation that's been made against Lisa Cook without charge are opportunity for her to address this allegation, whether or not this represents cause.

And I'm not a legal scholar and this will have to be litigated, but I think it's important to understand the context in which this is occurring. President Trump has expressed his disagree with the policy stance that the Fed has taken. He believes that interest rates should be substantially lower, and he's mentioned on multiple occasions that his focus is on the high cost of servicing the government debt, and the higher interest rates are, the higher that debt service expense is, it's now close to a trillion dollars a year, the second largest item in the budget.

But the Federal Reserve Act clearly specifies that the Fed's mandate is to achieve price stability and maximum employment. The goals are set by Congress. The independence of the Fed just means that the Federal Reserve has the ability to decide what settings of monetary policy are appropriate. And President Trump is clearly frustrated with Powell with the monetary policy the Fed is pursuing. And I see this as part of a larger attempt to gain control of the Fed of monetary policy and to put people who agree with him and will follow his views. That's the overall goal. And --

TAPPER: Yes, he's made no secret of that.

YELLEN: The independence of the Fed.

TAPPER: Yes. I mean he's made no secret.

YELLEN: No, he has made no secret.

TAPPER: Yes, the president said the other day --

YELLEN: It's important for Americans to understand --

TAPPER: Yes. He said, I just want to read the quote, president -- the president said once we have a majority, housing's going to swing and it's going to be great. People are paying too high an interest rate. We have to get the rates down a little bit. The current Fed obviously disagrees, at least as of right now. There are seven members. There was a resignation a couple weeks ago. If he replaces Lisa Cook, he will have four members that are his appointees, not including Jerome Powell, who also was his appointee, although disagrees with him.

You say this threatens the independence of the Fed. I wonder, do you think that there are enough guardrails built into the system to protect the Fed?

YELLEN: There are a lot of guardrails. The terms of Fed governors are 14 years. They're staggered. The Fed has budgetary independence. It's answerable to Congress. But the GAO is not allowed to audit the Fed's monetary policy decisions. It was designed to be able to make independent, professional fact-based judgments, and I believe President Trump wants to change that.

It's really important for Americans to understand how dangerous this is. Once upon a time, the Fed was obligated, this was during World War II, to help the Treasury Department finance the outstanding government debt. And it held interest rates low just as President Trump wants now. And the consequence was very high inflation in the 1950s.

TAPPER: Yes.

YELLEN: There was an accord between the Treasury and the Fed then, that said that's not the job of the Fed.

And we know that Americans are tremendously concerned about inflation. This was a huge issue in the last election. They want inflation to be low. And the labor market is solid at the moment. Unemployment is very low. Job creation has generally been solid, and we're coming out of a period of high inflation. TAPPER: Right.

YELLEN: And the Fed is focusing, achieving low inflation and full employment, which is what they're mandated to do.

TAPPER: So, let me ask you, do you --

YELLEN: So, going down this path is dangerous.

TAPPER: Do you think -- I mean, one of the reasons why he's so frustrated is because the Fed has said that because of uncertainty in the economy, they're referring to the tariffs, they have not brought the interest rates lower yet because they're waiting to see what happens.

[18:10:00]

And, you know, all of us who follow the tariffs and the impact know that there could be impact in the coming months given the fact that so many businesses and small business owners have been eating the cost. Do you think that there's any justification for those who criticize Jerome Powell, who say he shouldn't even be talking about tariffs, that's political? We had somebody on the -- Steve Moore was here the other day and he said that that was political of Jerome Powell to say.

YELLEN: Well, the Fed isn't trying to tell President Trump how to set tariffs or what his tariff policy should be, but they need to forecast what will happen to the price level going forward. We had a period of very high inflation. It's come way down, but it's not even now down to the Fed's objective of 2 percent. And the labor market is not weak. The labor market is functioning at a good level. And there is objective reason to believe, and the data is beginning to show it, the tariffs are pushing up prices.

Now, Chair Powell did indicate in his speech at Jackson Hole last week that the labor market is looking a little softer. You know, so we have risks on two sides to the labor market to the downside and some upside risk to inflation because of the tariffs. And he's indicated that the balance of risk might be shifting in a way that would appropriately lead to some cut in interest rates.

But President Trump has said he wants dramatic cuts in interest rates, maybe 300 basis points, and there's really no way that the things that the Fed is considering it would be taking into account would lead very quickly to cuts of that magnitude.

TAPPER: All right. Former Federal Reserve Chair Janet Yellen, thank you so much for your views, we appreciate it.

And 11-year-old shooting survivor speaking to CNN explaining how children ran from the church during yesterday's horrific attack and barricaded themselves in a nearby room. Hear her harrowing account next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:15:00]

TAPPER: Just moment ago, we received this heartbreaking photo. This is a picture of eight-year-old Fletcher Merkel, forever eight-year-old Fletcher Merkel. He is one of the two children who was killed in yesterday's horrific shooting in Minneapolis. His father, Jesse, spoke earlier today, calling the shooter a coward.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JESSE MERKEL, FATHER OF FLETCHER MERKEL: Please remember Fletcher for the person he was and not the act that ended his life. Give your kids an extra hug and kiss today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Absolute madness. The ten-year-old child who was killed has yet to be identified.

We also have startling new video today showing some of the harrowing moments after the shooting at Annunciation Catholic Church began.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where's the shooter? Where's the shooter?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: You can see children there, children running for their lives, some dumping over pews to escape, a father looking for his daughters took this video.

CNN's Shimon Perez is outside the church in Minneapolis. And, Shimon, you spoke with a child who survived the shooting. Tell us about her and what she had to tell you.

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, she's quite remarkable, Jake. She's 11 years old. Her name is Chloe. She actually talked about Fletcher. They went on vacation with Fletcher to the Dominican Republic, the family did. So, she told us what a lovely boy he was and what a -- how much he was into sports. And she talked about the other girl who was killed. And all of these kids were such close friends and they were so looking forward to their first mass of the new school year.

And there's her story of how they reacted to the gunshots, what they did, how they hid, how they all reacted together to help each other is just so remarkable. And her retelling of everything, she was so poised and so incredible. Her dad has been telling me today how therapeutic it was for her to sit and talk to us. Take a listen to some of what she told us.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHLOE FRANCOUAL, 11-YEAR-OLD ANNUNCIATION CATHOLIC SCHOOL STUDENT: So, my mind for some reason keeps on replaying that exact scenario when the teacher started, like the teacher was in the middle of saying our prayers and then we heard just one shot. It felt -- I smelled smoke before everything. But I heard one shot. I thought it was a firework like everybody else. The second shot was just everybody just covering their ears. The third shot was when everybody started ducking low and all these shots were like slow until the fourth shot. It started getting faster and faster, and then that's when everybody took into action.

PROKUPECZ: What was that action?

FRANCOUAL: When some kids, they hid under the pews the whole time and some ran off to the pre-K room. That's what I did. And in the pre-K room, everybody started to help, especially the kids and all the older buddies. We all started to help, like putting tables on the doors, locking the doors, putting all this stuff on the doors as much as we could.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PROKUPECZ: And, Jake, it's just incredible to think that these kids would know what to do. I mean, they drill for this. But when they have to react, when they have to take action, their ability to do it, it's just always so incredible. I would say she's probably the sixth or seventh school shooting survivor that I have interviewed.

[18:20:02]

And I'm always struck by what they remember. It's always the noises, the gunshots, how they cover their ears, and it's always the smell of gunfire. In this case, it was the smell of a smoke bomb that the shooter used.

But these are the things that the little kids always remember. And when they go to sleep at night, these are the things that they remember. And she talked about that. And the fear that she now lives with, and she's just hoping that, eventually, she'll be able to go back to school, there's just still so much work that needs to be done here as the healing is going to continue. But there's it's really tough. I mean, this was tough, Jake.

TAPPER: I've said it in more times than I care to. The adults of the United States are failing the children of the United States. I don't know how many times I have to say it. It's just a complete and utter failure to protect our children. And it's disgraceful and I'm sick of having to report these things, as I know you are, Shimon. It's just enough.

Shimon Prokupecz of Minneapolis, Minnesota, thanks so much.

Coming up next, what CNN is learning today about a major immigration crackdown set to start at one of the biggest cities in the United States in just days.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:25:00] TAPPER: In our Law and Justice Lead, the Trump administration is preparing to conduct a major immigration enforcement operation, they say, in Chicago as soon as next week. That's according to sources who tell CNN the preparations including surging agents and armored vehicles to the city.

Let's bring in CNN's Priscilla Alvarez. And, Priscilla, this would be a major escalation and certainly would not go over well with the leaders of Chicago and Illinois.

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Jake, a major escalation, but also the latest clash. Remember, Chicago was one of the first cities the Trump administration targeted when the president returned to office for its immigration enforcement operations. This is going to be much bigger in scope, of course, as they continue to escalate on this front.

Now, the blueprint for this, according to sources I've spoken with, is Los Angeles. Los Angeles, of course, had U.S. Customs and Border Protection surge to the city, Immigration and Customs Enforcement, but they also had National Guard there at the time to quell protests. And in this case, National Guard is also being prepared in the event that they are needed for what officials say would be peacekeeping presence.

Now, as part of the preparations, not only are they sending armored vehicles and mobilizing more personnel there, including CBP agents, they're also talking about using a naval base nearby as a hub for federal personnel.

Now, White House officials have told our colleague, Alayna Treene, that this is distinct from what the President has suggested as far as a crime crackdown in cities like is has been happening here in Washington, D.C. This is very much more focused on immigration enforcement in a city that did contend with an influx of migrant arrivals during the Biden administration when the Texas governor was sending migrants there.

But, certainly, this is going to be a big escalation, Jake, and one expected to kick off next Friday, though conversations are still ongoing.

TAPPER: And, Priscilla, we're also learning that the Border Patrol arrested two firefighters in the midst of their fighting wildfires in the area of Seattle. Is that true? What happened?

ALVAREZ: Yes. According to a Washington congresswoman who all confirmed these arrests, essentially, these two fire firefighters were arrested at the site where they were fighting this blaze in Washington. What is unclear, however, is the why. Why were they arrested, particularly at a moment where they, again, were at this site fighting this blaze?

Now, Washington Senator Patty Murray says that she's demanding answers from the federal government about what exactly happened here, because that still isn't quite clear. But this is a wildfire that has torched thousands of acres. And it is indicative in many ways of how the broad immigration crackdown that is happening nationwide can go on to include individuals that perhaps you may not suspect, and at moments that are inconvenient, to say the least.

So, this is something that Washington lawmakers are trying to get more answers on. But the bottom line is that they have confirmed that these two firefighters were arrested as they were fighting this blaze.

TAPPER: All right. Priscilla Alvarez, thanks so much.

Let's go right to our panel. So, we were told that they were going to focus, at least in the first year, on getting the dangerous criminals who were undocumented immigrants out of the country. And I think most people were like, great, get the dangerous criminals out. I don't know that I would consider people who are heroically, you know, braving fires and trying to save American lives to be part of this crackdown that's needed right now.

JONAH GOLDBERG, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. I mean, it's also kind of strange that President Trump says that he's looking at waving people who work in the hotel or agricultural business, but going after firefighters, well, that's a different matter, right?

I think though that the real significance of this story isn't so much that they detained two firefighters. It's that they detained all of the firefighters for three hours while they were checking their I.D.s. And we saw The Washington Post story on Wednesday that all, basically, Salvation Army, all these NGOs that work for disaster relief in the United States, they're going to be required to basically do I.D. checks on American citizens to make sure they're not helping illegal immigrants.

And so a lot of these strictures, it's not so much that they're detaining illegal immigrants, it's that they're gumming up the works for vast amounts of civil society and for first responders stuff to do this kind of thing. And I think it's going to eventually elicit a kind of blow back.

TAPPER: Mike, CNN has a new -- did you want to weigh in on that?

MIKE DUBKE, FORMER TRUMP WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Well, no, just that, we'll see what that blowback is. Because I think you're absolutely right, these organizations are now going to have to add an extra step to all of this.

[18:30:01]

But I don't -- I'm not sure that we've seen the blowback yet. And with these two firefighters, one of them had an order of removal. So, it's an open question. But at what point are the American people going to say it's too far, too much? I don't know that we're there yet. That's my comment.

GOLDBERG: My point is, you can defend detaining and deporting these guys. Why wouldn't you do it after the long day of work fighting a forest fire, rather than interrupting the process of fighting a forest fire? And it's like that at scale when you think about all these other institutions that they're going to ask people to basically be de facto proxy immigration enforcement agencies that I think could actually just get to a management problem that the Trump administration's ill- equipped to deal with.

TAPPER: And you talked about how there isn't blowback, and I agree, there hasn't been like any system systemic change in Congress or anything like that, but the polling is going in favor of immigration. Like you see Republicans jump 20 points on immigration is good for America and from where they were six months ago. Like there is a subtle change going on in people thinking that maybe immigration isn't as bad, even illegal immigration isn't as bad as it was depicted because we're hearing stories about, oh, this waitress and, oh, this teacher and, oh, these firefighters.

DUBKE: Yes. But then you have The Washington Post today since I think we're going to keep quoting The Washington Post instead of --

TAPPER: It's a great paper.

DUBKE: Well, the CNN's reporting had that these firefighters, by the way, were not actively fighting, that they actually, they had pulled them -- all of them back, and that's when they did the I.D. checks. But that's CNN reporting.

But let's go to The Washington Post.

TAPPER: Yes.

DUBKE: So, they reported that Pew's got a survey out that amongst Republicans, ICE is at 60 -- I think it's 68 percent approval rating. So, to your point, we can play with these figures, but Republicans now according to Pew, believe that a majority believe DOJ is a much better place, HHS, ICE, and one other, the FBI.

TAPPER: Okay.

DUBKE: And so I think when you talk about Donald Trump, is he playing to his base? Is he playing to the American people? In some instances they're both.

TAPPER: Yes.

DUBKE: But we're seeing Republicans come around.

TAPPER: Speaking of playing to his base, we're told that the U.S. Air Force is going to provide full military funeral honors for Ashli Babbitt, Ashli Babbitt, an Air Force veteran. And she was the pro- Donald Trump rioter, who believed his lies about the election being stolen in 2020, and she was shot and killed invading the Capitol when a group was trying to get onto the floor of Congress. A law enforcement officer shot and killed her after she breached a sensitive area. So, full military funeral honors for Ashli Babbitt.

GOLDBERG: I think it's grotesque. It's trying to turn her into a martyr to this day of love stuff, and it's part of the general whitewashing January 6th. I don't really know what else to say about it except it's gross.

DUBKE: Well, here's -- she served in the military with honors. Everyone that was on the Capitol that day was given clemency. I mean, if you are under the rules, she's now eligible for that honor. And, I mean, that's what we're -- I think --

TAPPER: But do you disagree that it's all part and parcel of trying to whitewash what happened January 6th?

DUBKE: I think it's -- I don't disagree that it is part of the reimagining of what January 6th was.

TAPPER: And also, we just want to note director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard yank the security clearances of several current and former intelligence officials. The controversy is that one of those whose security credentials she yanked was actually operating undercover, a CIA operative, according to a source. And this caught the CIA and the director of the CIA, John Ratcliffe, by complete surprise. A person close to Gabbard disputes that this person was undercover. Pretty --

DUBKE: Now, look, when the Biden administration did that several years ago, it was egregious. When the Trump administration does it, it's egregious. We've got to -- you can't be too flippant with security clearances nor when you have active members in the field.

GOLDBERG: DNI -- the position of DNI should never have been created and she should never have been nominated. She should never have been confirmed, and she should have been fired a long time ago.

TAPPER: Okay, thanks to both of you. I appreciate it.

Heartbreaking stories are emerging just one day after that horrific Catholic school shooting in Minneapolis. Coming up next, I'm going to talk to a father who raced to the school to find his daughter after learning about the shooting.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:35:00]

TAPPER: More on our National Lead, investigators believe that the Minneapolis shooter likely intended to carry out yesterday's attack from inside the church at Annunciation Catholic School. An official tells CNN that the shooter visited the church weeks ago under the pretext likely of wanting to reconnect with the Catholic faith. But officials say that because mass had already started, the shooter may have been locked out of the church.

Joining us now to discuss is Zach Semon. His four-year-old daughter was in her classroom right below the church where the shooting happened. And, Zach, we are so glad that your daughter is okay. Four years old is very young to go through something like this. Tell us what she experienced and how she's doing.

ZACH SEMON, ANNUNCIATION SCHOOL PARENT: She's actually doing reasonably well, considering everything. I think she's too young to kind of grasp the gravity and severity of the situation. We're continuing to monitor her and make sure she's being the same as she was before.

TAPPER: Well, also terrifying for you. I mean, it must have been so frightening when you heard about the shooting. Tell us what you first heard and when you learned your daughter was okay.

SEMON: Well, I heard from my family friend who also has a daughter. She had called me, I'm a teacher in a different school district, and we were doing our professional development workshop week, and she had called me an hour before and we had a conversation and then called me again. And I thought it was odd because we had just spoken and she just told me that there was an active shooter at Kennedy School.

TAPPER: And so what did you do?

[18:40:00]

Did you get in your car and zoom over? Or how does -- how did you --

SEMON: Yes. I dropped off my -- sorry, my son's in the background.

TAPPER: No. It's -- seeing a happy kid is nice to see.

SEMON: Yes, he got out of the watch of my wife.

I got in the car, I ran to my car drove up and I had to parked a few blocks away because, obviously, the police had shut down the area. They let me through because I was a parent and I ran into the school. It seemed like there were hundreds of law enforcement and emergency response teams there.

It was organized chaos. I mean, the staff directed us go to the gym, find your child. But my kid is, you know, small compared to all the other kid you know, K through eight with all the parents, and she's four years old.

Luckily, she was able to find me before I found her. And she was safe and unscathed. And, I mean, when I, when I hugged her she said that she was worried that I got shot. And for a 4-year-old to have that kind of thought, it's just -- it's horrible.

TAPPER: Yes, that's not right. How is your community doing?

SEMON: Pretty broken up. It's a strong community. It's a smaller community like we live in Minneapolis, but you wouldn't tell by being there. It's very family-oriented. Annunciation school has been amazing and will continue to be amazing. I have high hopes that we will rebuild the community stronger. It already was.

TAPPER: You also have a son. We saw him playing in the background there. He goes to a different school.

SEMON: Yes.

TAPPER: How is he processing all of it?

SEMON: He is a little sad because he knew one of the boys that died, he -- my son participated in Annunciation's summer program, which was also really good for them. And he was -- he knew one of the boys that was -- the interview has been going around social media and he knew one of the boys that the boy that was shot.

TAPPER: The eight-year-old?

SEMON: So, he's sad. He's six, six years old.

TAPPER: Oh. So, he's -- the 6-year-old survived, but he's --

SEMON: Sorry, my son is six.

TAPPER: Your son, six-year-old, but he knew the eight-year-old? Okay, got it. Sorry about that.

SEMON: Yes, correct.

TAPPER: Let me just ask, do you have any ambivalence about sending your daughter back to school or, no?

SEMON: I have high hopes. I have full confidence in Annunciation and their community. The school is amazing. I don't know when they're going to reopen but when they do, my daughter will be there. I think it's important to show solidarity. And, yes, it's not the school's fault that this happened.

TAPPER: No, definitely not.

Zach Semon, thank you. God bless you and your daughter and your son and I assume wife out there somewhere as well. I really appreciate it.

SEMON: Yes, I appreciate the time.

TAPPER: The White House reaction to this horrific shooting is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:47:02]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: Young children were killed while praying in a church. It's utterly disrespectful to deride the power of prayer in this country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: That's White House Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt. Earlier today, she was condemning Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Frey and others who have said we don't -- along the lines of we don't want your thoughts and prayers. These kids were praying when they were shot. It's an expression of anger at those who offer nothing more than

thoughts and prayers. Instead of trying to figure out legislative ways to solve this problem, or at least security ways to solve this problem.

Let's bring in Democratic Congresswoman Ilhan Omar from Minnesota. Her district includes the Annunciation Catholic School, where this horrific shooting took place.

Congresswoman, what's your reaction to what White House Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt said earlier today about the power of prayer?

REP. ILHAN OMAR (D-MN): Obviously, we all believe in the power of prayer. It is really important when families and communities are experiencing devastating grief that we pray for them to find relief, comfort and to ask for the Almighty to help with that healing.

But I can also understand the frustration that so many communities who have found themselves in these kind of horrifying moments feel that the only thing that's being offered is something that does not feel like there is an actionable item on the agenda. We heard from the priest and the principal of the Annunciation Catholic School, what he said yesterday is that he shared an African proverb that said, pray and move your feet.

That tells us that it is important for us to pray. But it's also important for us to take actions as well.

TAPPER: You were at the news conference today. The mayor of Minneapolis, Jacob Frey, called for state and federal bans on what are called assault weapons and high capacity magazines.

You questioned why Americans have the power to change this problem, but don't change this problem. What do you think can realistically be done in this Congress in order for there to be some action when it comes to keeping firearms out of the hands of mentally disturbed individuals who are sure to use them to do harm to themselves or others?

OMAR: I mean, we as Americans used to have this ban and decided to let it expire. We can reinstall the ban, but we can also address mental health issues in a serious way. We can collectively think of what we have to do when we see signs, signs that tell us that there might be something wrong.

[18:50:05]

When we see these kind of videos on YouTube channels where somebody is glorifying violence, when we see them stockpiling that level of ammunition, when we see them have, you know, alarming messages written on their weapons.

It is important for us to take action in reporting those kind of disturbing videos, so that the relative agencies are able to investigate and make sure whatever action that person might be planning is not something that is going to devastate families and whole communities. Like we have been devastated and the families and the victims in Minneapolis have been.

TAPPER: You're not just a congresswoman, obviously, you're a mom. You have two sons and two daughters. As a parent, what do you even begin to say to these grieving parents? How do you even begin to process it?

OMAR: This is, you know, not the kind of thing that you can process when you are a parent. And I can't even imagine how the, how the parents who this has happened to are able to, to process it. Just, you know, Jake, you're also a parent. Imagine taking, you know, your little ones, to school. It's already hard to drop them off and leave them behind.

And moments later as they are kneeling in prayer, you learn that your little children have been assassinated by a monster. And you have to come to terms with, you know, the idea that you just dropped them off and they are no longer there, or you now are having to visit them in the hospital.

We heard about a story where one of the parents was a nurse, as she rushed to attend to the victims that were showing up at the hospital, she learned that one of her children, was part of that. I mean, this is something horrific that as Americans, we have had to deal with in, you know, countless times.

And I remember, you know, the nearly the 20th anniversary of Columbine. My daughter, who has been an active -- has been active in making sure that we end this senseless gun violence in our country, organized a walkout, and she came. I was just newly elected, and she said, mom, you were in high school when Columbine happened. You all didn't do anything and we now have to deal with this ourselves.

And so, it is really important to make sure that we address this, so no other parents, no other community, no other school and no other city or state has to experience this kind of gut-wrenching, horrifying, painful experience that we now know in Minneapolis.

TAPPER: Congresswoman Ilhan Omar, Democrat of Minnesota, thank you so much.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:57:14]

TAPPER: So much going on today in our politics lead. President Trump's move to oust Fed Governor Lisa Cook tests the independence of the Federal Reserve and sets up another legal battle over President Trump's authority.

Here now is CNN's senior legal analyst, Elie Honig. He is the author of the upcoming book, "When You Come At The King: Inside DOJ's pursuit of the President from Nixon to Trump". It is set to release on September 16th. We will obviously have him back to discuss this juicy looking book.

But let's talk about the subject. Does President Trump have cause? Does he have a legal basis to fire Lisa Cook because there have been allegations made about her and mortgage fraud.

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: So, we're going to start to find out tomorrow when there's a hearing. The first question is, is there any "there" there?

Now what the administration has so far is a referral from a federal agency that oversees mortgages that lays out the facts that Ms. Cook signed two mortgages within about three weeks of each other, one in Michigan and one in Virginia -- one in Georgia, excuse me, claiming both were her primary residence. Now, that's not nothing, but I don't think that's enough.

And I think what the judge is going to say tomorrow is you have to make a showing to me that there's enough there to show that she committed some wrongdoing. If they can show that, then the second question is, is it somehow related to her job with the Fed? And I think there's a good argument, if she did commit fraud, how can you be on the Fed if you were engaged in financial fraud? So that's going to be the first inquiry.

If there is cause to dismiss her, game over, she's dismissed and that's it. If there's not, then we're going to get into the juicier constitutional questions about whether the president has the right to fire her with or without cause.

TAPPER: This fight is headed to the U.S. Supreme Court, where recent rulings have suggested that this conservative leaning court is inclined to give the president expansive powers. Have you seen any signals on how the court might view this case?

HONIG: So, there's signals both ways. The good news for the Trump administration is the court has absolutely given him expanded powers to fire federal officials, federal employees, regardless of laws that congress has passed.

The bad news, though, for the Trump administration is in a major ruling along those lines, back in May, the Supreme Court went out of its way to say, yes, you have very broad powers, but the Fed is different. The Fed is designed to be quasi-independent. It derives from the First and Second National Bank.

And so, I read that as a pretty clear signal from the Supreme Court that, yes, were going to give you very broad power over traditional agencies in the executive branch, but the Fed, I think, is different. I think if it goes to the Supreme Court, as generous as they've been with executive power, I do think they will draw a line here and say no to Trump on this.

TAPPER: Very quickly. What if Lisa Cook says, I messed up, I didn't mean to do that, I misunderstood what was being asked for, I have returned the money that whatever tax benefits she got, paid -- sent a check to the federal treasury, sorry, I goofed? HONIG: Yeah, that's going to be up to the judge if the judge credits

that, then it's not fraud. Then it's a mistake, right? But that's going to be -- the judge is essentially going to serve as the jury here. We're not going to have a full trial. It's a credibility determination for the judge.

TAPPER: Elie Honig, thanks so much. You can follow me on Facebook, Instagram, Threads, and on TikTok @jaketapper. You can follow the show on X @TheLeadCNN. If you ever miss an episode of THE LEAD, you can listen to the show whence you get your podcasts.

"ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT" starts right now. I'll see you tomorrow.