Return to Transcripts main page
The Lead with Jake Tapper
22-Year-Old Man Arrested In Charlie Kirk Killing; DHS Says, Suspect Killed, ICE Officer Hurt In Chicago; Trump Eyes Memphis As Next Target In Crime Crackdown; Taylor Swift's Attorneys Deny She Agreed To Sit For Deposition In Blake Lively-Justin Baldoni Dispute; Emmy Host Nate Bargatze's Plan To Keep Acceptance Speeches Short. Aired 6-7p ET
Aired September 12, 2025 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[18:00:00]
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: Welcome to the lead. I'm Jim Sciutto in for Jake Tapper.
This hour, we are learning more about the man arrested in connection with the fatal shooting of Charlie Kirk and what was actually engraved on bullet casings recovered alongside the gun.
Plus, President Trump today says he is contemplating sending the National Guard into yet another American city. This as an ICE target was killed and an ICE officer hurt during a federal immigration enforcement operation in Chicago.
Also, if you're tired of watching long, rambling acceptance speeches at award shows, like me, the Emmy's host has a plan for Sunday's ceremony and it just might guilt trip the long talkers into keeping it brief.
The Lead tonight, the suspect in the assassination of Trump ally and conservative activist Charlie Kirk is now in custody. 22-year-old Tyler Robinson is being held without bail in a Utah jail on several initial charges, including aggravated murder. According to officials, Robinson's father is the one who recognized his son in photos released by the FBI.
CNN's Nick Watt has more on what exactly led to Robinson's arrest, along with new details on the evidence against him.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GOV. SPENCER COX (R-UT): Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. We got him.
NICK WATT, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): After a 33-hour manhunt, a 22-year-old suspected assassin in custody. The endgame began just before 8:00 P.M. last night.
KASH PATEL, DIRECTOR, FBI: The FBI released a never-before-seen video of the suspect. We also released new images to the public of the suspect. WATT: Apparently Robinson's own father recognized his son, confronted him and heard his confession. His dad called a youth pastor, who, in turn, told law enforcement.
PATEL: The suspect was taken into custody at 10:00 P.M. local time.
WATT: We're told that on the morning of the murder, Robinson arrived at the UVU campus at 8:29 A.M., then changed into that outfit we see in the security camera, images, the T-shirt with an eagle and an American flag, to shoot the right wing influencer dead at 12:23 P.M. Then he changed back into a plain tee in shorts for the roughly three- hour drive back home.
Robinson grew up here in Washington County, rural, quiet, conservative.
COX: investigators interviewed a family member of Robinson who stated that Robinson had become more political in recent years.
WATT: And at the family dinner in recent days --
COX: Robinson mentioned Charlie Kirk was coming to UVU. They talked about why they didn't like him and the viewpoints that he had. The family member also stated Kirk was full of hate and spreading hate.
WATT: That is where the suspect jumped off the roof after the shooting and ran fleeing in this direction. Now, investigators say his roommate has showed the messages from the suspect, in which he talks about collecting a rifle from a drop point, later of wrapping it in the towel and stashing it and watching where he stashed it, and also apparently talking about engraving the ammunition.
Now, this is where investigators found the rifle wrapped in a towel with engraving on the ammunition, words, letters, symbols.
COX: A second unfired casing read oh, bella ciao, bella ciao, bella ciao, ciao, ciao.
WATT: Apparently referencing a song that glorifies Italian partisans who fought fascists and Nazis in World War II.
Another red, hey, fascist, catch.
COX: Well, I will leave that up to you to interpret what those engravings mean. I think the clearest one that says, catch fascist, I think that speaks for itself.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WATT (on camera): So, state officials are expected to bring charges Tuesday, which would mean that Robinson makes his first virtual appearance 3:00 Tuesday afternoon. Meanwhile, sources tell CNN, federal officials are also weighing charges.
In meantime, I want to show you this. That is the tent where Charlie Kirk was shot dead. Just an hour or so ago, this cleaning van came in, workers cleaning up that area where Kirk was assassinated. Jim?
SCIUTTO: Good Lord to see that. Nick Watt in Utah, thanks so much.
I do want to bring in now, former Deputy Assistant Attorney General Tom Dupree, former head of the Philadelphia and D.C. Metro Police Department Charles Ramsey, and retired FBI Special Agent Daniel Brunner. Daniel, good to have you on.
The suspect's background here is somewhat hard to put your finger on, right? I mean, to Republican parents, he was registered to vote but didn't vote and was registered as an independent. Some family members speak of him criticizing Charlie Kirk over the dinner table.
[18:05:04]
It's difficult for law enforcement, is it not, to profile and therefore predict actors like this?
DANIEL BRUNNER, RETIRED FBI SPECIAL AGENT: Yes. Deputy -- former Director Christopher Wray said it very well that the lone wolf attack is one of the most difficult attacks to defend upon, to prepare for because it's only the individual who's working this out in his mind, he's preparing for it. If he's not working with others, he's not conspiring with others, he's not preparing with others, it's very difficult to detect it. But this investigation not only will collect the evidence to support a court trial against him, but it's also going to show us where the red flags were, where these indicators were, where his pathway to violence began, and where, in future, hopefully, we can prevent it by looking at these indicators and teaching the community, teaching local law enforcement, that there's a possible indicator, a possible individual who's on this pathway to go conduct this attack.
SCIUTTO: Yes. I remember counter-terror officials describing similar challenges with lone wolf terrorists.
Chief Ramsey, so the circumstances are such that it ended up being the suspect's own father who recognized his son in those photos shared by law enforcement and has what I can only imagine a difficult conversation with his son. And in your experience, have you seen something similar?
CHARLES RAMSEY, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Yes. Actually, you know, I mean, it's not that common, but, yes, I've seen it before where family members actually will turn an individual in, whether it's a son, daughter or what have you.
But I think this whole incident really shows the power of crowdsourcing, of getting information out to the public. Once you hit that dead end, I mean, that first 24 hours when you're hot on the trail, you think you might be able to apprehend an individual because you're following hot leads, but it leads to nowhere. And at that point in time, you know, putting that information out and you're starting to see more and more departments do it and it's smart and it leads to an arrest, and oftentimes. SCIUTTO: Tom, you prosecuted a lot of cases in your time. The initial charges, three of them, aggravated murder, felony discharge, obstruction of justice. What do those initial charges tell you about the case? I mean, this is a state case now and you now have the possibility of federal charges as well.
TOM DUPREE, FORMER DEPUTY ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL: Right. Well, there's no question the state is going to pursue the most, the strongest possible charges that the evidence will support. So, there is no doubt here they are going to be vigorously pursuing a murder charge. I also have no doubt that they're going to seek the death penalty. We could see additional charges come in in the days ahead as the investigation unfolds. There could be other offenses, other obstruction-related offenses, other gun-related offense.
The other thing to keep our eye on is the possibility of federal charges. Murder is usually prosecuted as a state crime, but the death penalty is available for certain federal crimes. And I have no doubt that there are people at the Justice Department at this hour who are scouring the law books to try to see if there is a basis for bringing federal charges.
And I anticipate they ultimately will bring federal charges. And then the question will become whether the state goes first or whether the federal court case goes first when it comes to bringing this individual to justice.
SCIUTTO: Charles Ramsey, I would ask you this because you've led police departments in two cities. You have a lot of politicians now talking about how the political discourse in this country is a problem that, to some degree, fuels right acts of political violence. Is that discourse, therefore, in your view, a law enforcement issue as well?
RAMSEY: Well, it turns into a law enforcement issue, like in this case. But, you know, listen, I listened to Governor Cox earlier today when he stepped back up to the mic. And I really, really thought he had some very powerful words about this whole issue of kind of lowering things down, finding that off-ramp, being able to have political discourse without it leading to violence. That's the right message. The question is, will it last?
I mean, I've seen politician after politicians say that, but it's just like thoughts and prayers after a school shooting. You know, they say it and then they don't do a damn thing about it. And I have no reason to believe this is going to be any different. I hate to feel that way, but I've lost faith in a lot of our political leaders. I hope I'm wrong, because this is going to get worse before it gets better if they don't.
SCIUTTO: It makes the job of law enforcement harder, that discourse.
Tom Brunner, before we go, how do you rate the FBI's handling of this case -- Daniel, sorry, this case so far?
BRUNNER: I think this was done very well. I think that the investigators at the Salt Lake division, I think the case agents working together with the Salt Lake -- with the Utah law Enforcement. This is exactly how it's supposed to be.
[18:10:00]
Work it from the inside out, see what evidence is there, digital evidence, and then if that's not there, go to the next step, push the photograph out, put pressure on the fugitive. And that's exactly what -- so I think they did a fantastic job at Salt Lake division.
SCIUTTO: Daniel, Charles, Tom, good to have you all on, thanks so much.
Well, this morning, President Trump was asked this question I think a lot of folks are thinking about, how do we fix this country after Charlie Kirk's assassination? His answer, including, well, an attack on the radical left. That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I think with a high degree of certainty, we have him in custody, right, in custody. Everyone did a great job. We worked with the local police, the governor. Everybody did a great job. I just heard about it five minutes before I walked in. As I'm walking in, they said, looking real good. They have the person that they wanted.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Earlier today, President Trump broke the news on Fox that the alleged shooter in Charlie Kirk's murder was in custody. It happened two hours before officials in Utah confirmed that news and identified 22-year-old Tyler Robinson as the suspect.
[18:15:04]
CNN's Kaitlan Collins joins us now. And, Kaitlan, also at that interview, he's given an opportunity by Fox to condemn political violence by everyone, by all sides. Did he take that opportunity?
KAITLAN COLLINS, CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this was actually a question, you know, as I was watching this interview this morning, Jim, that the president was asked multiple times in terms of just kind of what everyone was feeling in the aftermath of Charlie Kirk's assassination, this kind of loss, you know, sense of shock and grief and horror that so many people in the nation felt watching what happened regardless of how people felt about Charlie Kirk.
And so the president was asked about this given he had spoken to Charlie Kirk's widow, and obviously he's talked about awarding him the Presidential Medal of Freedom and just kind of what the aftermath of this looks like. And he was asked multiple times by the host, you know, what his message would be to the nation, about healing, coming together, how we as a country try to basically reset from this and then come out in a better place.
And I just want you to listen to the president in his own words. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We have radicals on the right as well. We have radicals on the left. How do we fix this country? How do we come back together?
TRUMP: Well, I'll tell you something that's going to get me in trouble, but I couldn't care less. The radicals on the right, oftentimes they're radical because they don't want to see crime. Radicals on the left are the problem, and they're vicious and they're horrible and they're politically savvy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: I mean, if you listen to the president as he went on there, I mean, he was obviously kind of creating an excuse for people on the far right, as the host there, you heard invoked not just people on the far right, but also on the far left in terms of what this looks like going forward. And, obviously, that's been a question here about what this means.
And, you know, hours later is when we heard from the governor himself of Utah, Spencer Cox, and also the FBI director, and the governor, you know, was talking about the messages that were engraved on the bullet as they're still trying to determine, you know, what exactly this motive is what drove this suspected shooter to do this. And so that has been something, I think, that's also stood in contrast to when it comes to the motive and what we know now and what the president was assigning there, but also the message we heard from Governor Cox earlier today, you know, urging unity and urging the nation to come together and to get off social media and to go hang out with their loved ones and to be outside. It stands in stark contrast to what you heard from the president.
SCIUTTO: No question. Governor Cox, Senator John Curtis, I spoke to on this program just a little over an hour ago, George W. Bush, putting out a statement trying to make this, right, a national mission.
So, Trump says now he plans to go to Kirk's funeral. Do we know any further information about what that's going to look like and Trump's schedule next week?
COLLINS: He seemed to indicate that it's going to be after his state visit to the U.K. That's starting -- I believe he departs the White House on Wednesday for that. He's expected to be in Windsor, outside of London, for about two days, and then will fly back to the United States.
So, we haven't heard any announcements from Turning Point or from Charlie Kirk's family about when exactly those arrangements are expected to be held. But I would expect a heavy presence from the administration there because obviously you've seen, this is personal for the FBI director who was on the ground today. Obviously, the vice president, J.D. Vance, who flew Charlie Kirk's remains to Arizona yesterday, the president himself has been deeply affected by this, I'm told, by people around him, and just stunned the fact that this happened to one of the leading conservative activists, but also a top ally of his.
And so I would expect to see a lot of members of the administration likely at that funeral, Jim.
SCIUTTO: And having survived his own assassination attempt here.
Kaitlan Collins, thanks so much. Of course, don't miss Kaitlan on her show, The Source with Kaitlan Collins, tonight, every weeknight, 9:00 Eastern on CNN.
An immigration forum and operation turned deadly this morning in Chicago. We're going to go live to the scene with details next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:20:00]
SCIUTTO: In our National Lead now, the Department of Homeland Security is saying an ICE operation in Chicago turned deadly today after a man stopped by agents was then shot and killed by one of those agents.
CNN's Shimon Prokupecz is on the scene in Chicago. And, Shimon, the circumstances, here are they saying that he tried to drive away?
SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's exactly right, Jim. What happened here, we're in Franklin Park, which is a suburb of Chicago, and there's been this major influx and operation that Homeland Security with ICE has been conducting here in the past week. And so this morning, it appears that as part of that operation, they were attempting to detain a man along this road here.
And in that -- during that time, what they tell us is that the man tried to flee. And in his attempt to take off in the car and flee, he struck an ICE agent and then dragged that ICE agent. And during that time, another ICE agent opened fire, fatally striking this man.
We don't know much about this man except what ICE has released. A spokesman from the Department of Homeland Security said in a statement that the individual was undocumented, was here illegally, and that it had a history of reckless driving. And that's basically it. We've not been able to find any kind of criminal record associated with this in individual and officials have not released any other information. All day, for the past several hours along this road, we saw FBI agents actually were out here collecting evidence. They are investigating the fatal shooting.
But as of this morning, we had such little information and that still stands at this point. Much of the scene has been cleared now. Schools in the area we're locked down as a result of this. We tried to go to the man's family's home.
[18:25:00]
No one was there. The governor issued a statement and saying that he wants more information and that more transparency needs to -- more information needs to come back. And that's what needs to come out. And that's what many of the advocates that we've seen out here, Jim, today, they were talking about that, that they want more information from ICE officials. You know, many of the people in these communities have been on edge here over this threat of ICE operations, all of this happening as this feeling of uneasiness in these communities has been going on all week.
SCIUTTO: It's becoming a new norm in American communities around the country.
Shimon Prokupecz in Chicago, thanks so much.
Well, President Trump and the Tennessee governor get their way. We could soon see the National Guard walking the streets of Memphis. The Memphis City Council chairman joins me next with his reaction.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCIUTTO: In our Politics Lead, President Trump has set his sights on another major city for deploying the National Guard.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We're going to Memphis. Memphis is --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's the next city?
[18:30:00]
TRUMP: -- deeply troubled. And the mayor is happy, is a Democrat mayor. The mayor is happy, and the governor of Tennessee, the governor's happy, deep troubled. We're going to fix that just like we did Washington.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: This comes, of course, after Trump previously threatened to send troops to Chicago and several weeks into federal law enforcement control over the nation's capital.
Joining me now to discuss is the Memphis City Council chairman, Ford Canale. Thanks so much for taking the time.
Thank you, Jim. Thanks for having me.
SCIUTTO: So, you heard the president there saying that the governor is happy about this, the mayor as well. Are you? Do you welcome this deployment?
FORD CANALE (D), CHAIRMAN, MEMPHIS CITY COUNCIL: Well, Jim, I think that we understand that we do have a crime issue here in Memphis that we have been working on for some time, and the numbers are moving in the right direction.
Now, we would always accept federal help with federal resources, such as federal prosecutors, FBI agents, ATF agents, U.S. Marshals, to help get the violent criminals off of our streets.
Now we all know that the National Guard is a short-term solution. And while they're here, if they can help take some of the pressures off of our local law enforcement and more collaboratively with them, then I think it can work.
But I'm really focused on the long-term solution, which is how we make Memphis safer for the long-term, not just the short-term, where you have someone come in for 30 days and then leave, but a dedicated source of federal and state enforcement that can help our MPD officers, like I said, remove violent criminals from our streets.
SCIUTTO: You said in your statement on this that the help you want are federal resources, such as the FBI, DEA, ATF, federal prosecutors, as you mentioned just now, and a fellow member of the city council, Jeff Warren, he noted that the Trump administration actually cut funding for violence prevention programs. So, I wonder, do you see these deployments as more a show of force than good law enforcement policy?
Oh, we lost the council chairman there, Mr. Canale. We'll try to get him back. Once we do, we'll bring him back. We do?
Meanwhile --
CANALE: Jim, I can hear you again.
SCIUTTO: Oh, there he is. There he is. Thanks so much.
So, I'm going to ask that question again just to make sure you got it. You said in your statement that you want federal help, but the help you say you need is FBI help, DEA, ATF, federal prosecutors.
All right, now we lost him for good. We'll try to get them back.
Elon Musk directed Department of Government Efficiency, DOGE, as it's known, took actions that left thousands of federal workers, as you know, without jobs. Now, one Trump official is saying it went too far. Imagine that. That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:35:00]
SCIUTTO: In the Politics Lead, Commerce Secretary Howard Lutnick tells Axios today he thinks that Elon Musk got DOGE wrong, at least when it came to government firings.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOWARD LUTNICK, COMMERCE SECRETARY: I thought Elon got caught up in other people's objectives.
The focus should have been on cutting the waste, fraud and abuse and the people you could do over time. I thought he got that backward.
(END VIDEO CLIP) SCIUTTO: I want to bring in my panel now. T.W., I mean, that is definitely far removed from the rhetoric we heard in the first weeks of this administration when Trump to Elon Musk and everybody down was celebrating. I mean, you remember, you know, the power saw, the chainsaw on stage. I mean, is the party, is the administration realizing this was not a good look for them?
T.W. ARRIGHI, VICE PRESIDENT, PUSH DIGITAL GROUP: Well, look, I think whenever. You take someone else's job away from them in a sense, they're going to get upset. Cabinet secretaries across the administration had some angst over Elon Musk going in without consulting them in some cases in cutting jobs.
Look, I think the jobs were low hanging fruit. I think I've talked to people in Democratic administrations and Republican administrations who say, you go into some of these agencies, look to your left and to your right, and you're like, why do we have these people here? What do they do? So, I get that.
And, look, I think Howard Lutnick is right, I would love to see the government cut by 10, 15, 25 percent, but that's going to require some Congressional action here. If we want civil service reform and allow the president to be able to hire and fire more easily, we ought to do that.
Look, Chester Arthur, way back when, was really right to have civil service reform. But since then there have been more packages and the government's got more and more out of control. We need to revisit that.
Also, rescissions packages, look, I'm all for slashing, but Congress should get involved. We need the administration to highlight what they think should be cut. We need cabinet secretaries to say, okay, and we need Congress to act.
SCIUTTO: You might even say the Constitution said it was Congress' --
KAREN FINNEY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: How about that? In theory, we're supposed to be this constitutional democracy. We could go back to that.
But I think what Lutnick was getting at was something a little bit different. I mean, think back to the chaos. People were getting emails, you're fired, you're not fired, you're back. And, you know, if you really wanted to do strategic cuts, so many experts at the time said, start with the inspectors general. That's actually their job. They're the ones who can hand you, here are places where there's waste, fraud, and abuse, where we could be making cuts.
And I think Democrats and Republicans can agree that there should -- there could be reforms and way to cut fat. But when we were cutting -- when you had doctors at V.A. hospitals saying, I may not be here on Monday to help my PTSD patients, what do I do, that was crazy.
SCIUTTO: Or the folks at the Department of Energy who protect nuclear weapons, right, that kind of thing. So, I mean, my question really is, is the administration realizing there's some political danger here?
ARRIGHI: Well, I think they're realizing a lot of work needs to be done. Look, impoundment used to be a thing in this country until 1977 or whatever the year was.
[18:40:00]
Throughout our nation's history, we've had -- the chief executive had a lot more control over what was going on in his branch in terms of the people who were employed and the spending being done. We need to sort of return to some more autonomy for the chief executive of this government if we actually want to get this problem in line. Also, we need to talk about the bigger problems, which is entitlement spending and other things.
SCIUTTO: Well, a lot of third rails there, right, for both parties.
On the economy, Trump repeated claims today about not just lowering inflation but apparently fixing it on his Fox interview. Have a listen to what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I've already solved inflation. Costs are down. Look at energy costs. You're going to have $2 gasoline pretty soon.
We have almost no inflation anymore.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: I mean, that's not true. That's not true. Yesterday's report showed annual inflation actually rose to 2.9 percent. That's the highest since January. And polling on economic issues are not looking great for the president.
FINNEY: Yes.
SCIUTTO: First question to you is, are Democrats zeroing in on an affordability message?
FINNEY: Boy, they better be. Let me tell you, many of us have been talking to our Democratic colleagues to say, talk about affordability, talk about healthcare because people's healthcare costs are about to go up. Medicaid front page USA Today, $11 billion in cuts in Kentucky, for example. So, talk about where the rubber is meeting the road.
You know, Trump is sort of doing something that Joe Biden did actually, which was to tell people something that in their own lives they could see or feel wasn't true. Even though the economy was doing better technically under Biden, when he kept saying to people, it's better, it's better, but they weren't feeling it, that created a disconnect. That is part of why the president's polling is off here. People know in their own lives groceries are too expensive, gas is too expensive. You know, Christmas is around the corner, right? It's on people's minds.
SCIUTTO: And mine's like only buy $2 as opposed to several. I mean, do you sense, T.W., some political vulnerability there as --
ARRIGHI: It's always going to be the economy here.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
ARRIGHI: That will always be the case forever. But I want to go quite easy when chasing economic numbers. Everyone made a big deal of what Jamie Dimon said the other day. A few weeks ago, Jamie Dimon was saying something completely different. The economy's strong. It's great. It's in great shape.
Look, last quarter, GDP grew by 3.3 percent. We still see pretty strong consumer confidence. And the jobs numbers, which wasn't the best report, one of the things that many experts on this network pointed out was that people aren't getting fired. People are just waiting to see what happens.
Look, Rome wasn't built in a day. Donald Trump is trying to, for the first time in many, many years, completely overhaul the global trade environment as it pertains to American manufacturers and consumers. That's going to take time as these deals go forward, as Supreme Court makes rulings. Give it time, as he said.
FINNEY: But here's the thing, that's not what he campaigned on. He campaigned on 24 hours, I'm going to solve this war, 24 hours in a week, I'm going to solve this problem and that problem. And here we are. And, again, it go, it's an affordability crisis and that people are saying, look, there's anxiety about the economy, there's anxiety about, am I going to get a raise, am I not going to get a raise, or are my costs going up? And when they're hearing, you can cite -- having done this for three years, we can cite all the economic data we want about, you know, whether it's up or down, it's what people feel.
And when the president -- CBS polled, 36 percent of Americans, only 36, approve of his handling of the economy, that's big trouble and that's a big opening for Democrats.
SCIUTTO: The Wall Street Journal calls tariffs a border tax. And you're hearing that from Republicans opposed to it, the ones willing to say it out loud. Someone's got to pay that tax, right? And it's either the companies, right, and you see auto manufacturers, for instance, taking billion dollar hits, right, as a result of terrorists, or the consumers, if they pass it on. Is that -- where is the benefit of that going to be in the economic --
ARRIGHI: Tariffs absolutely are a divisive topic in the Republican Party. Donald Trump, first of all, A, we had a surplus just a couple months ago for the first time since I think 2012. So, there are signs of that. There are deals being cut currently.
But we got to remember something. For four years, the American people didn't think we had a president who was attuned to their struggles, as you kind of alluded to before, but also was even capable of changing it. Donald Trump has long believed that the global trade environment has been unfair for manufacturers and that he can help bring some of these jobs back, especially in high tech spaces with chips and other things to bring them back in. He's got tons of commitments from the massive corporate leaders in this space. We need them time to get back in when rates go down, which they probably will, there's going to be momentum.
But he ran on this. He was incredibly clear about this. He'd been clear about it since the 60s, and the American people said, yes.
SCIUTTO: It's his most consistent message, one could say, tariffs --
(CROSSTALKS)
FINNEY: I think people just didn't -- I think they heard something different.
[18:45:02]
And the other piece we're not talking about here is with all these immigration raids, when we are depleting a workforce and you're having companies -- where you're having companies that are now need workers. So, what's that impact going to be on our economy as well? And what's that going to mean for your cost?
We don't know again --
SCIUTTO: Well one thing is clear --
FINNEY: -- the right direction.
SCIUTTO: Folks know how much stuff costs. And they also know if they have a job, and they'll make their own judgments.
Karen, good to have you both.
This week here at CNN, we are shining a light on the innovators and change makers who are challenging the status quo to improve the lives of others.
CNN's Erin Burnett introduces us to her champion for change, Kara Hartigan Whelan, who is committed to preserving farmland and teaching kids to grow what they eat.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(MUSIC)
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: Wait, can you do this pepper, too? Your hands are so full. What's your name?
MAX: Max.
BURNETT: Max. Okay. Do you know how to harvest this? She was telling me. I don't know how you do it. Okay.
Max is learning to grow real food in real dirt.
I almost got it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There you go. Good job.
BURNETT: Awesome, Max.
Something rare in America today.
What are these? Do you know what you're watering? Collard greens. Those are delicious.
Kara Hartigan Whelan leads the Westchester Land Trust.
KARA HARTIGAN WHELAN, PRESIDENT, WESTCHESTER LAND TRUST: Westchester Land Trust is one of 1,300 land trusts in the country. Together, we protect more than 60 million acres of land.
BURNETT: Sixty million?
WHELAN: Yes.
BURNETT: Wow.
She's turning conservation into a fight for healthy food and stronger kids.
WHELAN: I think children like to have ownership, and they like to have a say. And so, if you invite them into the work early, there's a lot of buy in that you may not see otherwise.
BURNETT: Kara has literally helped hundreds of kids get their very first taste of healthy food.
WHELAN: I made a commitment that I would spend the rest of my life trying to protect natural areas that other people could benefit from and experience. The land that we protect safeguards our communities.
BURNETT: Like Stuart's Fruit Farm, family run since 1828.
BOB STUART, STUART'S FRUIT FARM: My dad's been around since the '50s about selling the place, big corporations to small developers. And I said, no, we're not going to sell.
BURNETT: Kara fought for 10 years to save it.
BETSY STUART, STUART'S FRUIT FARM: One man gave me a proposition. He said, oh, you've got two days to look it over. And I -- and I said to him, hmm, let me look at it. I took it and ripped it right in front of his face. I said, I need two days. I only needed two seconds.
BOB STUART: My dad passed it on to me, and we're going to pass it on to the next generation.
BURNETT: Farms like this are becoming increasingly rare. It is really hard for them to survive. BOB STUART: Mother Nature is can -- can be good and it can be cruel.
Two years ago, it rained every weekend, which hurt business. Cut it down about 40 percent. We had $100 left in our savings --
BETSY STUART: We made it.
BOB STUART: We got through.
BURNETT: What happens when something like that is lost? Suddenly, it becomes a development.
WHELAN: Just across the street from Stuart's, actually, there is a development. So, a farm was developed fully and so you can actually see what happens. I visited Stuart's as a child in school. And to see that farm finally permanently protected, words can't describe how meaningful it is.
ERIN BURNETT'S DAD: Oh, how are you doing?
BURNETT: How are you feeling?
ERIN BURNETT'S DAD: Good.
BURNETT: For me, this is personal. My dad spent decades protecting farmland in Maryland, including our own.
The fence. This -- this is where I had one of the schools in my imaginary town. This was the school.
Your mommy used to cut the grass.
I actually recently asked my dad why he did that. He said it just felt good that the place that I loved is never going to change. It can never be turned into a development. It was that love of land that my father had that has always inspired me and given me an appreciation for what conservation can do.
Your need is increasing right now, but the funding has gone down. I mean, it's part of all of the cuts in Washington and the things that are happening. I mean, how significant is the cuts been for you?
WHELAN: It's put pressure on our other fundraising sources. And it's also just led to just an unknowing that leads to anxiety and just trying to figure out if, when we're going to need to replace the fence.
BURNETT: What do you want people to know, to sort of understand about the connection between eating healthier food and preserving the land, land conservation?
WHELAN: We need land to grow food on. It's just that simple. If we don't have these farms, we won't have that local food.
BURNETT: You grow your own tomatoes.
UNIDENTIFIED KID: Yeah, but not this year. Our garden got destroyed by mint. The mint took over the garden.
BURNETT: Oh. The mint? Oh.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCIUTTO: Erin joins me now. I didn't know your family had a farming past. That's fantastic. Such a nice personal tie here.
[18:50:00]
So they're out there trying to hold on to these farms, very moment when Washington is pulling back support. You could hear worry in her voice, and I just wonder how steep the climb is, not just for her, but for the country.
BURNETT: I mean, it's incredible. You heard about 60 million acres across the country, Jim. This has been a bipartisan thing right in the west, championed over many years by Republicans right to preserve land. But she said, literally, that's what keeps her up at night. Whether they can even fulfill their mission, because that farm, for example, has lost 100 percent of its federal funding this year. So they're going to private sources, which is something, as you know, that's a band-aid, right? You can do that for a bit, but not for a long time.
And this is being faced by, of course, nonprofits across the country. But this is a very tangible thing, right? Land and preservation, something that has traditionally in this country, right back to Roosevelt, been a bipartisan thing now very much under threat. But that one farm, Stuart's fruit farm, I think, brings it home, you know, across the street was another farm. It's now a development.
SCIUTTO: Yeah.
BURNETT: So, it makes a difference.
SCIUTTO: If you don't save it, you lose it. Right? Sometimes a lot of history that.
Erin Burnett, thanks so much for shedding light on this story. Be sure to tune in Saturday at 10:00 p.m. Eastern for "THE CHAMPIONS FOR CHANGE", one hour special hosted by Dr. Sanjay Gupta.
Taylor Swift's lawyers are denying a claim that she agreed to be deposed in a high-profile case. We've got the back story.
Plus, comedian Nate Bargatze will host the Emmy Awards this Sunday, and he's got a plan to prevent long acceptance speeches. That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:55:53]
SCIUTTO: In our pop culture lead, Taylor Swift's attorneys are denying reports she agreed to sit for a deposition in an ongoing civil dispute as actress Blake Lively pursues claims of sexual harassment and retaliation against director Justin Baldoni. Baldoni's attorneys claimed in a court filing that Swift agreed to be deposed, but her lawyers say shell only do it if the court forces her. An attorney for Swift wrote, quote, "We take no role in those disputes."
Also, in our pop culture, lead comedian Nate Bargatze will host the primetime Emmys this Sunday, and he's got a plan to try and keep acceptance speeches brief. That's hard. He'll dock his $100,000 charity donation for every second a winners speech runs long, so let's keep it short and get straight to Bargatze's interview with our Elizabeth Wagmeister.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ELIZABETH WAGMEISTER, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: Have you watched all the shows?
NATE BARGATZE, COMEDIAN: I've seen a lot of commercials of the shows.
WAGMEISTER: OK.
(voice-over): If you're like Emmy host, Nate Bargatze, and haven't seen all the nominated shows -- well, you might still watch the Emmy Awards for this.
You're making a $100,000 donation to the Boys and Girls Club of America, which is amazing that you're doing that.
BARGATZE: Yeah.
WAGMEISTER: But there's a catch.
BARGATZE: There's a catch.
WAGMEISTER: Bargatze says for every Emmy winner's acceptance speech that exceeds the allotted 45 seconds --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And perfect choice of music --
WAGMEISTER: The donation shrinks by $1,000 per second.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ouch.
BARGATZE: The positive, too, if they go under, we will put money on top of it.
WAGMEISTER: Okay.
BARGATZE: So I would prefer them not all go that under, because that can get pretty expensive. The amount of money I give the Boys and Girls Club is totally up to all of Hollywood.
WAGMEISTER: Either way, Bargatze can afford it. He's currently Billboard's number one selling stand up comic in America. His tour grossed more than $80 million last year alone. For his first Hollywood hosting gig, he's getting advice from veterans like Nikki Glaser, Jimmy Kimmel, Jimmy Fallon, and Conan O'Brien. BARGATZE: They're all just kind of like, you just got to be you and
trust that you know what you're doing. Fortunately, we learned that in other settings, and so I don't have to hopefully not learn it, you know, in front of Harrison Ford.
WAGMEISTER: Right.
Bargatze says, sure, he'll joke about Hollywood, but in his trademark polite style, like the cancellation of nominee Stephen Colbert's late night show.
Is that off limits? Are you going to address it?
BARGATZE: I think we'll say something. But it will be done in a fun, playful way.
WAGMEISTER: That family-friendly comedic style has helped the Tennessee native gain wide appeal in an era where comedy often divides audiences.
Bargatze met his wife while working at Applebee's.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Welcome, my daddy, Nate Bargatze.
WAGMEISTER: And his daughter introduces him at many of his shows. His father was a magician and a clown.
I have to ask, did you have a fear of clowns growing up? Because a lot of kids do.
BARGATZE: I had a joke about like, as, I would say, have you ever been yelled at by a clown? Because I have, and it's pretty confusing to get yelled at by a guy that's got a smile painted on his face.
WAGMEISTER: Bargatze doesn't fear the Emmy's stage. In fact, this star can't wait to be starstruck.
Who are you excited to see?
BARGATZE: Ben Stiller. I'm excited to see.
WAGMEISTER: Well, "Severance" has the most nominations, so you will definitely meet Ben Stiller.
BARGATZE: Ben Stiller, we should cross paths.
WAGMEISTER: Yes.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WAGMEISTER (on camera): Jim, I have been covering award season for over a decade. And Hollywood events always have a huge security presence. But in light of Charlie Kirk's murder, there have been questions about heightened security on Sunday night. Well, I reached out to the LAPD, and they did acknowledge that they are sufficiently deployed and prepared to keep everyone safe at the Emmys. SCIUTTO: Good Lord. It's so sad. We all have to think about that so
often now.
Elizabeth Wagmeister thanks so much. Hopefully there'll be some cause to laugh at the Emmys.
Well, coming up on Sunday on "state of the union", Utah Governor Spencer Cox and Republican Senator James Lankford of Oklahoma. That's Sunday morning, 9:00 Eastern again at noon, right here on CNN. You can follow me on X @jimsciutto or the show on X @TheLeadCNN.
If you ever miss an episode of THE LEAD, you can listen to the show wherever you get your podcasts.
"ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT" starts right now.
