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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Trump Veers Off Script In Speech, Criticizing U.N. And U.S. Allies; Secret Service Uncovers 300 Servers Capable Of Crippling New York City's Cell System; Trump Says, We Have To Stop War In Gaza Immediately; Bradshaw Scores With Family Cookbook Recipes. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired September 23, 2025 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:00]

ERICA HILL, CNN HOST: Welcome to The Lead. I'm Erica Hill in for Jake Tapper.

This hour, a series of surprises from President Trump after his blistering U.N. address today, first backing NATO on recent moves by Russia, and then backing Ukraine in its war with Russia. We'll go behind the scenes.

Then drama in a Florida courtroom, the man found guilty of trying to kill Donald Trump trying to stab himself just moments after that verdict came down.

And Comedian Jimmy Kimmel is just hours away from his return to late nights. So, what might he say? I'll discuss with actress Cynthia Nixon, one of many who was pushing hard to get Kimmel back on T.V.

The Lead tonight, President Trump slamming the United Nations and delivering harsh words for foreign allies in his address to the U.N. General Assembly. It began with a remark about his broken teleprompter before he veered off into uncharted territory.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: I have ended seven unendable wars. They said they were unendable.

The United Nations did not even try to help in any of them.

Your countries are going to hell. To every terrorist thug smuggling poisonous drugs into the United States of America, please be warned that we will blow you out of existence.

Climate change, it's the greatest con job ever perpetrated on the world, in my opinion.

HILL: The president making only a brief mention of the two major conflicts abroad between Israel and Gaza and Russia and Ukraine in that speech.

CNN Chief White House Correspondent Kaitlan Collins joining me now. So, it was quite the speech ahead of a day of meetings with foreign leaders went, on a lot longer than it was supposed to, and there was a lot in there.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes. And they're never obviously going to wrap the president of the United States when he's addressing the United Nations and the world leaders who were gathered there in that room. But it wasn't really that surprising of a speech. Maybe it's stunning to hear the president go after friend and foe alike, as he did in those comments.

But what he said about the United Nations is kind of how he's always felt about the body. He's argued, as he did today, that they're not living up to their tremendous potential, as he put it, and basically was questioning the purpose of the United Nations and why it exists, not just because of the faulty equipment, though that was basically how he underscored his grievances with them but was essentially arguing that he does not believe that they are that meaningful or useful.

Obviously, that's notable given his ambassador, Mike Waltz, just was confirmed to his post at the United Nations. But what is fascinating about how today has played out, maybe the president doesn't think the United Nations itself is all that helpful, but being here and the meetings that he's had has clearly had an impact on him, because it was the Truth Social that he posted this afternoon that has had everyone I've been talking to, whether they're Ukrainian officials or just other, you know, European officials who've been watching this so closely, stunned because the president is basically reversing course on what is happening in Ukraine and saying, you know, after four months been saying there need to be land swaps, Ukraine is going to have to give up part of its territory to make a deal here, the president is now saying that after he's gotten to know and fully understand the situation from a military and economic perspective, he says that he does believe it is possible that Ukraine, with the support of the European Union, is in a position to fight and win all of its territory back to its original form.

That is not -- that is something President Trump has never said in all the time that I've been covering him since this war started. He has never thought that Ukraine could get its land back.

HILL: He talked about Ukraine giving up territory, that, basically, you're just going to have to say goodbye to it.

COLLINS: Yes. He was just saying that Zelenskyy would've to make a deal about a week ago. And, obviously, that was front and center during his meetings with the British prime minister last week, and certainly with all of the leaders that he's been meeting with today, including the French president. So, this is a remarkable statement.

What it means going forward remains to be seen. But the President saying, as he did later in that post, that Russia's in huge economic trouble and that it's time for Ukraine to act is a position we've never seen him take. And so, obviously, a lot of this has been influenced by conversations he's been having with other world leaders here. And so, you know, for all the dismissiveness of the United Nations itself, the actual setting that it's provided for the president has proven to lead to quite a shift tonight.

HILL: Yes, absolutely. To your point, we'll see what that translates into beyond that post but remarkable. That's for sure.

Kaitlan, I appreciate it. Thank you.

And, of course, Kaitlan is back with more on The Source tonight. The Source with Kaitlan Collins airs right here on CNN at 9:00 P.M. Eastern.

I want to bring in now Democratic Congressman Seth Moulton joining us, of course, from Massachusetts. Good to have you with us, sir.

So, when it comes to the president's comments today on Russia and Ukraine, obviously, a fair amount of attention, including that Truth Social post, which Kaitlan and I were just talking about, talking about that he believes Ukraine with support of the European Union is in a position to fight and to win all of Ukraine back in its original form.

[18:05:05]

That shift, when you hear that shift and when we see what transpired today, how confident are you that this could be a true shift in position for the president?

REP. SETH MOULTON (D-MA): I mean, I have no confidence at all because this president changes his mind on a regular basis, but it's pretty extraordinary. I mean, you're absolutely right. This is a major shift, and it's extraordinary that Donald Trump is, for the first time in the history of this vicious, brutal, illegal war that Vladimir Putin started, for the first time, he's supporting our friend, not our enemy. Never before has the Trump administration talked about having a plan to win.

And, by the way, this isn't just something that we get from the president himself. I have asked this question directly of administration officials appearing before us on the House Armed Services Committee. I often frame it by saying, but there was bipartisan criticism of the Biden administration for not having a strong enough or fast enough plan to win. What is your plan to win? And they've never had an answer.

So, all of a sudden, this administration is going to have to come up with a plan to win and follow the president, hopefully, in finally doing the right thing.

HILL: The president also met of course met with Ukrainian President Zelenskyy today. I just want to play a little bit of what we heard.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: You got to hand it to the Ukrainian soldiers and everybody involved. It's still going on and that's not a good thing for Russia. This was supposed to be quick. And so, you know, Russia doesn't look very distinguished having taken three and a half years, you know, about three and a half years of very hard fighting, and it looks like it's not going to end for a long time.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: It looks like it's not going to end for a long time. There's a lot being made of those comments as well, especially in light of the president's recent pressure on Europe to increase sanctions on Russia and the president also calling for conditions, what we're seeing. The long time, what does that say to you?

MOULTON: I have no idea what the president is talking about. I mean, that's the honest answer. I don't think he has any idea what he's talking about. It may mean that this isn't going to end anytime soon because he is not really going to have a plan to win. He's so afraid of offending Vladimir Putin that he's not really going to give Ukraine what they need to win. He's just shifting slightly in their favor. It could mean that he just doesn't actually plan to put much effort into this conflict, this conflict that he said he promised he would end on day one of his administration. But the bottom line is that this president is all over the map.

And I was thinking earlier today about what it must be like to be one of the people fighting on the ground right now in Ukraine, fighting for your family's freedom, risking your life every single day, and having such uncertain and unclear support from the most important ally in the world. I mean, we had British troops serving alongside us in Iraq, who, you know, you could agree or disagree with George W. Bush, but he didn't continually change his position on the war. He didn't sometimes say, oh, well I kind of support Saddam Hussein, or I so sometimes support Al-Qaeda, or maybe Al-Qaeda's going to win, or, you know, after all, it was what we who started the war, not Al-Qaeda, or the crazy things that Trump has said about our archenemy, Russia, throughout this conflict.

So, it's a great sign that he's kind of waking up and recognizing what the rest of the world can see, which is that Russia is the enemy here, but I don't think anybody really counts on his word at this point.

HILL: I also want to get your take. Of course, there is a deadline looming as we know, President Trump canceling a meeting that he was supposed to have with your leader, Hakeem Jeffries, and also the Senate minority leader, Chuck Schumer. He's asking them to drop their demands when it comes to healthcare in order to meet, saying that, otherwise, it will just be another long, brutal slog through their radicalized quicksand. Going on to say to the leaders of the Democrat Party, the ball is in your court.

So, Leader Jeffries then announcing that your caucus will be in town on Monday ahead of that funding deadline, despite Republicans canceling votes. I mean, how are you feeling at this moment? Are you confident in your leadership as you look ahead to next week?

MOULTON: I am confident in our leadership, but, once again, I don't think anyone, even Republicans has confidence in the president of the United States to avert a shutdown that he owns. Because let's be clear, Republicans control the White House, the House, and the Senate. The only thing they need to do to keep government open is just get a few votes from a handful of Democrats in the Senate to meet the 60- vote threshold, and he refuses to even meet with them.

And, by the way, what's he complaining about? He's complaining about that we are trying to preserve healthcare for millions of Americans, not just in blue states, not just among, you know, our friends, but in red states too. Many Trump voters are going to see their healthcare premiums go up 75, 80 percent if they're not bailed out by Democrats.

[18:10:03]

This is what we're asking for. You know, if the roles were reversed, he would be asking for something that solely benefits himself or his party. We're asking for something that's good for all Americans that a lot of Republicans quietly want in the House and the Senate as well. And what's the president's response? He won't even have a meeting.

HILL: Democratic Congressman Seth Moulton of Massachusetts, good to have you tonight. Thank you.

MOULTON: Good to see you too.

HILL: Still to come here, the stunning moment in a Florida courtroom when the defendant found guilty of trying to kill President Trump apparently tried to stab himself.

Plus, the criminal network had covered after a series of swatting calls, then tracing burner phones and swapped SIM cards. It is a really remarkable story and find. That's ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HILL: In our Law and Justice Lead, a guilty verdict today for Ryan Routh, the man accused of, now convicted, I should say, of trying to kill Donald Trump at his Florida golf course last year. Following that verdict, a rather dramatic moment as Routh tried to stab himself in the neck with a pen. He was stopped by authorities. Routh, you may recall, had represented himself in court. He's now facing the possibility of life in prison when sentenced in December.

[18:15:00]

Also in our Law and Justice Lead a major bust in a swatting case which reveals something even more insidious. Secret Service agents uncovered a vast criminal network in New York, the New York area that had the power to do far worse than make bogus threats.

CNN's Chief Law Enforcement and Intelligence Analyst John Miller is here with me now. I was really struck when I saw this story this morning, and this is, you know, not far from where we were sitting, that all of this was uncovered. First of all, what is it and how are authorities able to actually find and trace this group? JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: So, this begins, the story unfolds, as people like the president's chief of staff, Susie Wiles, the CIA director, the defense secretary, became the victims of swatting calls, masked behind I.P. addresses and changing phone numbers and voice changers and everything else. And Sean Curran, the Secret Service director, had set up this new unit, Advanced Threat Interdiction Unit, to go after these high tech threats.

And they started to get into this, and it's computer scientists and analysts and agents working together, but they managed, and I won't get into how, to figure out where these signals were coming from. And they hit an apartment and you know, you'll see the pictures, an empty apartment filled with servers and an office, empty office filled with servers, and a storage location, walls of servers.

So, you've got 300 servers with a hundred thousand SIM cards. Every SIM card has a different phone number, and the math of it is you could launch millions of calls in just a few minutes. The kind of thing that could overwhelm cell towers, collapse cellular networks in New York City on the eve of the U.N. General Assembly. So, the question was, who built this? What's it for? And we asked, you know, who was using it?

Now, take a listen to Secret Service special agent in charge for New York, Matt McCool.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MATT MCCOOL, SPECIAL AGENT IN CHARGE FOR SECRET SERVICE, NEW YORK FIELD OFFICE: So, what we do know is that foreign governments and criminals located in the United States are using this network to run their organizations. That includes cartels, that includes human traffickers, that includes terrorists are on this network.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: This doesn't sound good.

MILLER: So, it doesn't. And, you know the intelligence gap still is, okay, so who owns that.

HILL: Right.

MILLER: Is it a hostile foreign power? There's calls, I'm told, by intelligence sources connecting Chinese military people on the other end with Mexican drug cartel people. There are communications between hacker groups and human trafficking groups. It's a busy network, but it's way too large and powerful just to facilitate communication. So, the other intelligence gap was, was it some kind of weapon?

HILL: Right. And is there a sense that's what it ultimately was, a weapon that could have been used for something?

MILLER: Well, it certainly had the capability. What we don't know about is the intent. And, Erica, if there is some organization behind this, we have to assume that there's one in L.A., one in Washington, D.C., another in Chicago. Because if it's a nation state that wants to attack infrastructure during crisis to break communications, and we don't know exactly what the timing of that crisis would be, or the type, that's the kind of thing that the Secret Service, the director of National Intelligence, Homeland Security, and I'm sure eventually the FBI will have to really work to get to the bottom of. We need to know who owns this and what it was for.

HILL: So, this is step one, essentially.

MILLER: Yes.

HILL: John, I really appreciate it. Thank you.

MILLER: Thanks.

HILL: Sometimes the best way to understand a difficult situation is maybe through fiction. Why one longtime reporter is now revisiting the conflict in Israel and offering a new opportunity for perspective.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:20:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: So, I have also been deeply engaged in seeking a ceasefire in Gaza. I have to get that done.

Now, as if to encourage continued conflict, some of this body seeking to unilaterally recognize a Palestinian state, the rewards would be too great for Hamas terrorists for their atrocities. This would be a reward.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: In our World Lead today, President Trump condemning the move by multiple countries to recognize a Palestinian state. He also called for an end to Israel's war in Gaza, as we near the two -- as we near two years now since the October 7th attacks on Israel.

Our next guest explores this very complicated subject in a fictional thriller, The Human Scale. It's the story of a Palestinian American FBI agent and an Israeli cop who worked together to solve the murder of a police chief in the West Bank, in his settlement.

Pulitzer Prize-winning Author and Journalist Lawrence Wright joins us now. I was telling someone on the show I had finished this book. I couldn't put it down. It is a fascinating story. It's a novel that takes place in the days leading up to and surrounding a terror attack in the -- and so much happens in this book. This is a region you covered extensively as a journalist, and it's an idea, as I understand that you've had brewing for some time this story itself as a way to help explain the origins and the reality of this conflict. In this moment, how do you feel that played out? LAWRENCE WRIGHT, AUTHOR, THE HUMAN SCALE: Well, I'm despairing about what's actually happening on the ground. I had written the book before October 7th, and then I went back to Israel and Gaza and West Bank in February of 2023, and I could sense that things were about to explode. I thought about doing a New Yorker story about the next intifada. And then the Israelis were so complacent. It was just really surprising to me. And then October 7th came along and I had to go back and rewrite my book with a different ending.

[18:25:00]

And so, you know, I guess the lesson I've learned in years in the region is that it can always get worse. I just hope that that cycle come to an enemy.

HILL: You hope that cycle has come to an end. Based on what you're seeing, you know, even just in this moment, right, the number of U.S. and Israeli allies, frankly, who are now recognizing a Palestinian state, what we are hearing from the Israeli government and from the United States, that this is nothing but a reward to Hamas. Are you more or less hopeful in this moment, given what we're seeing in terms of efforts on a diplomatic front?

WRIGHT: You know, I support the effort to call and to turn Palestine into a recognized state because the world has to do something. One of the myths that surrounds this quarrel is that it's a regional conflict. Well, no, it's not. It's, you know, spilled onto our streets, into our classrooms. It's very much an American problem. Israel, it has about 8 million people, and America has Jews, but America has 7 million. So, we're two countries that hold most of the Jews in the world, it's no wonder that it's such a pressing issue in America. But it's affecting our politics and it is dividing our generations.

And so we have to -- I think the world has to stand up after all this time and be more forceful and calling for peace. I mean, I'm the same age as Israel. And in my lifetime, I have seen the Soviet Union dissolve. I've seen apartheid come to an end. I've seen Barack Obama elected president. I've seen Vietnam, Afghanistan, two wars in Iraq. That's all part of history. But this just goes on and on and on. And it's a myth to think that peace is not possible.

You know, I wrote a book called 13 Days in September about Carter, Begin and Sadat, a one term governor of Georgia, a terrorist and an assassin who made peace. So, it's -- to think that peace is not possible, it's one of the things, one of the obstacles to actually finding peace.

HILL: It's -- we're very tight on time, but I note that you really take a balance. There are no winners. There are no losers here. It's a very human, frankly, look at how the two sides of this conflict feel about one another. What do you hope readers take away?

WRIGHT: I wrote the book, Erica, hoping that people would see the other through their own eyes. You know, I think one of the problems in the Middle East is that people can't envision the other as a fully -- as a full human being. And it's funny because if you ask someone in Israel or in West Bank, what would you do if you were on the other side, they know what they -- who they would be if they were on the other side. They just don't want to talk about it. And this book is an effort to open the eyes to who the other is.

HILL: And opens a discussion, a discussion that can be very difficult to have, but is increasingly important.

The Human Scale is out now. Lawrence Wright, thank you. I appreciate the time.

WRIGHT: Many thanks, Erica.

HILL: Well, we are, of course, just hours away at this point from Jimmy Kimmel returning to the airways after that controversial suspension from his late night show. Cynthia Nixon, one of hundreds of artists who spoke out on behalf of Kimmel, joins me next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:30:00]

HILL: In our Pop Lead, just hours from now, Jimmy Kimmel live will be back on the air ending a nearly week-long suspension. Not everyone, though, will be able to tune in for Kimmel. Big return because two local T.V. giants, Sinclair and Nexstar, say they're going to preempt the late night show.

CNN's Stephanie Elam is live outside Jimmy Kimmel's theater in Los Angeles. Looks like you have a few friends with you as well, Steph. The FCC chairman is also weighing in about Kimmel's return.

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right, and Erica, it's no small note here that 20 percent of the markets of ABC affiliates are owned by those two companies, and so those people will not be able to see tonight's show.

We did see a post on social media from the FCC chairman, Brendan Carr, and I'm going to read it to you right now. He wrote, quote, Democrats just keep digging themselves a deeper and deeper hole on Kimmel. They simply can't stand that local T.V. stations for the first time in years stood up to a national programmer and chose to exercise their lawful right to preempt programming. We need to keep empowering local T.V. stations to serve their communities of license.

Obviously, if you have a streamer, you could still probably see this, but this is a big line in the sand here that continues to play out. As you can see here, people here still coming out to support Jimmy before he starts to tape his show tonight. Erica?

HILL: In terms of taping that show, as I understand it, you actually spoke to an audience member for tonight's show. What did she have to say?

ELAM: Well, one thing that we learned is that the people who were coming to the show just happened to have tickets for the show. So, it wasn't like they got a special lottery, they already had these tickets. And we want you to hear one woman who was just about to go in when we talked to her.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And I am here today, the day that he's coming back. It couldn't have been a better day to watch Jimmy Kimmel. I'm just hoping to hear the truth from Jimmy's mouth, whatever that truth is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ELAM: And so a lot of people saying that to us. I spoke to a man from California earlier. We also spoke to a woman from Tennessee, all of them saying that they want Kimmel to come back because free speech is very important to this country. Erica?

HILL: It certainly is. Stephanie Elam live for us in Los Angeles, I appreciate it. Thank you.

Also joining us here in the studio, actress Cynthia Nixon, who's one of some 400 celebrities who signed an open letter from the ACLU condemning Kimmel's initial suspension. It's nice to have you here.

CYNTHIA NIXON, TONY, EMMY AND GRAMMY WINNING ACTRESS: Nice to have you too. And I will say it's actually around 475, so almost 400.

HILL: Oh, we're up even more now?

NIXON: Well, 475, yes.

HILL: 475.

NIXON: Yes.

HILL: What made you want to sign onto that letter?

NIXON: You know, I believe in the First Amendment. That's pretty much it. And I feel that if Jimmy Kimmel can be taken off the air without a moment's notice for saying, really, barely anything, Kimmel can be taken off the air without a moment's notice for saying really barely anything, it can happen to everybody and there is no free speech anymore.

[18:35:12]

So --

HILL: So, he's coming back on tonight.

NIXON: Yes.

HILL: Do you think, though, when you look at this moment, and, obviously, we'll have to wait to see what he says, does this change things? The fact that the letter was written may or may not have played a role in the decision or the timing of that decision by ABC, getting him back on the air tonight, does this change things moving forward when it comes to free speech in the First Amendment, in your view?

NIXON: Well, first of all, I want to say there were a lot of factors. Certainly, the ACLU rounding us all up and getting us to sign, I think. Then they put we all put the letter online on Instagram, in places, and in a matter of a few hours, 40,000 people across the country also added their names. And, you know, there were a lot of things that happened. A lot of people, myself included, dropped their Disney subscription, dropped their Hulu subscription, canceled their cruise reservations and the, you know, Disney stock fell like 3.5 points, and I think they -- you know, that's about almost $4 billion.

HILL: Yes.

NIXON: And also I'll also just say, you know, five entertainment unions with about 400,000 members really, you know, joined the fight. And people even like, you know, Ted Cruz, we had, you know, defenders --

HILL: It's not often that you often align with Ted Cruz. But in all seriousness --

NIXON: Right, exactly. But the First Amendment is not a partisan issue. Free speech is something that Democrats, Republicans, left, right, blue, red, really care about. And I also want to say Disney did the right thing. Disney really, you know, listened. They listened, you know, with their ears. They listened with their pocketbook, but they listened.

And I think that Sinclair and Nexstar that are not airing Kimmel tonight and presumably in the near future, they're going to find very quickly that denying Americans their first amendment rights is not a good economic model for advertisers, and it is not something that's going to be very popular with viewers either.

HILL: You talked about how you canceled your subscriptions.

NIXON: I did.

HILL: And I saw a lot. I saw a lot of that online. You posted about it online.

NIXON: I did.

HILL: I just want to play that for people who may have not seen it.

NIXON: Okay, sure.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NIXON: My whole family is really going to miss Abbott Elementary. We are really going to miss Only Murders in the Building. But you know what? We would miss the First Amendment a whole lot more.

(END VIDEO CLIP) HILL: Given that Jimmy Kimmel is back, would you renew your subscriptions?

NIXON: Of course.

HILL: Have you already?

NIXON: Well, you know, the thing about it is I had already paid for the month, so they haven't cut me off yet, so I'll be able to watch Kimmel tonight, but I am 100 percent renewing my Disney subscriptions and my Hulu subscriptions. And I think everybody that did what I did should absolutely do the same because we want to say, hey, that's not cool. But when you listen to us, we want to say, great, thank you. We want to see your shows. We love your network.

HILL: There have been complaints about free sea speech, about cancel culture for years, frankly. Why do you think this moment is different?

NIXON: Because it was done so quickly and so in such just a really brutal way. And it was so transparent. And this was something that people who are cuddling up to Trump because they want the FCC's approval on a merger, which is a monopoly, which should not be legal. This is really about, you know, shining up to him and doing what he wants, not -- it's not a left, right thing, it's really appeasing and pleasing Trump. And our democracy should not be put on the chopping block for that.

HILL: Cynthia Nixon, I appreciate you coming in.

NIXON: Thank you.

HILL: Thank you.

NIXON: It's a pleasure to be here.

HILL: Kamala Harris, giving a somewhat guarded endorsement of Zohran Mamdani in the New York City mayor's race. Still waiting to hear though from a number of other high-profile Democrats. Why are they still stalling over their support?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:40:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, FORMER U.S. VICE PRESIDENT: Look, as far as I'm concerned, he's the Democratic nominee and he should be supported.

RACHEL MADDOW, MSNBC HOST: Do you endorse his candidacy?

HARRIS: I support the Democrat in the race. Sure.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: In the Politics Lead that quick answer from Kamala Harris about her, I guess you'd call it a lukewarm endorsement of Zohran Mamdani in New York's Democratic mayor as New York's mayoral race and as a Democratic mayoral nominee. Mamdani, who's far left policies have excited his base, but really seem to be keeping a number of other big name Democrats at bay.

My panel is here. So, just for comparison, I want to go through some of the responses from the House and Senate minority leaders, both from New York who were asked the very same question about endorsing Mamdani. Here's what they had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY): I'll have more to say about the mayor's race sometime soon.

SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (D-NY): All I can tell you is I'm going to continue talking to him.

DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: What's the holdup?

SCHUMER: I got to continue talking to him and that's what I'm going to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: It's a lot of talking that's been going on for a long time. And, Xochitl, there's a lot of sort of public hemming and hawing here at this point. So, she does an endorsement from either of these men even matter?

XOCHITL HINOJOSA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I actually don't think it matters. Mamdani won the Democratic nomination on his own without the help of the establishment. The reason why he has been so successful is because he was able to generate support in New York City around lowering costs, what Democrats want to talk about all of the time.

And I think now what is happening is that you have Jefferies and Schumer focus on one thing, is trying to take back the House of Representatives and the Senate, and that is what they're focused on. And at the end of the day, if Mamdani ends up winning, that will ultimately also help Mamdani.

[18:45:01]

I will say that the polling shows that as long as this remains a race with all the candidates still in the race, he will end up winning overwhelmingly.

That is why Trump was trying to get out Mayor Adams of the race because he knows that as soon as Mayor Adams is out of the race, that impacts Black voters, they could potentially go to Cuomo. And then you have a race that is neck and neck.

And so, do I think that Mamdani needs them? No, he is doing his thing. He is campaigning. He is garnering support on his own with his message. And it is okay for Chuck Schumer and Jeffries to go on their business and have their priorities.

HILL: When we look at this two, G.W., what's interesting is Democrats are, I would say, clearly concerned that by backing Mamdani, who is a self-described Democratic socialist, it could hurt them in elections. But the reality is Republicans are already using those attacks against Democrats. Would it change anything if there was an endorsement in terms of those attacks from Republicans?

T.W. ARRIGHI, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well, totally. And Xochitl's right. So long as this is a four-person race, Mamdani will be the next mayor of New York. But I think Jeffries and Schumer are holding out hope that it becomes a two-person race. That poll a couple of weeks ago that showed Cuomo within two points of Mamdani in a head to head race, gave them a lot of hope.

But look, these guys are in between a rock and a hard place, and neither of them are in the George W. Bush parlance, the decider. None of them are good at making these hard decisions. The fact of the matter is the energy and the money is with the socialist left of the party, but they have the House of Representatives to contend with, and they want to win it.

And the fact of the matter is, socialism polls horrendously in the United States. Cuomo right now is using as an attack on Mamdani the fact that he outwardly supported the legalization of prostitution. You have his playing footsies with globalized the intifada in so much more. He is a walking liability for Democrats nationally. Thats why Republicans would like to see him in office, to hold that around every vulnerable Democrat's neck.

HILL: President Trump canceled a meeting that he was set to have with both Schumer and Jeffries over their push to address the Affordable Care Act subsidies ahead of the upcoming government funding deadline. Jeffries then posted, the extremists want to shut down the government because they are unwilling to address the Republican health care crisis that is devastating America.

G.W., Donald Trump is the president of Republican Senate, Republican House. Is there a way for Republicans to avoid this being their shutdown, if, in fact, that's where we end up?

ARRIGHI: Yeah, I definitely do not think it would be. Look, that four days ago, the House of Representatives passed a clean C.R. to push us to November. A lot of the oxygen the last few months have been dedicated around one big, beautiful bill. The president's cornerstone achievement thus far in this administration.

And right now, the Democrats have said they won't vote for anything unless he pulls back $1 trillion from that bill. That's laughable. That's a nonstarter.

Look, this is a negotiation. And next week will look a lot different than today. But right now, the president, after receiving that letter from Democrats, asking them -- him to trash his crowning achievement that just passed a couple weeks ago is ludicrous. We have a clean CR on the table. We can push and fund the government

until late November, until Thanksgiving, try to get appropriations bills passed. Now that we have nothing else on the docket, and do the American people's bidding, if the Democrats want to hold this hostage in the Senate, be our guest. But it's on them.

HINOJOSA: So, I just want to respond to that quickly. I think that what is happening here is there isn't a clean CR. What happened in the Senate was that you had people like Murkowski and Rand Paul who voted against it. It wasn't just Democrats.

And T.W. brought up a very important point, which I agree is -- agree with. This is a negotiation. This should be a negotiation.

Donald Trump is the leader of the party. He should come to the table to negotiate. Instead, what Johnson said is that the House will be on recess unless there is a shutdown. And now with Trump canceling this meeting, it is the Republican Party who they are control -- they're in control of everything, who should be leading the negotiations to come forward with Democrats and figure out how were going to figure out -- how we're going to go ahead and solve our health care crisis, because health care will go up for millions of Americans later this year.

And the president should clear his schedule because there is a health care crisis. There is no important thing or issue in the country right now than people's health care.

ARRIGHI: Don't disagree with having to tackle health care down the road, but we have the government about to shut down. We don't have control of the Senate. We don't have 60 seats, so that's a nonstarter there.

HILL: When we look at where things are really quickly, before I let you both go, Xochitl, so, with Jeffries calling Republicans extremists in that tweet, and then a few days ago, you have Schumer posting a tweet that said Trump was leading us towards a dictatorship -- is this -- you know, Democrats trying to do politics as usual with an administration that they say is not normal. They're making the point to say it's not normal.

I mean, is it worth it at this point, given the way things are playing out, Xochitl, or do they need to change tactics?

HINOJOSA: Well, I think that Schumer and Jeffries have played this well in the sense that they should -- Donald Trump leads a party, and they should ask for a meeting with him. I do think that this administration has done unprecedented things like drop investigations at the Justice Department and other things.

[18:50:08]

And so, I understand their frustration. I don't love the language, but I understand where they're frustrated and how they want a meeting with Schumer.

HILL: Xochitl, T.W., good to see you both. Thank you. ARRIGHI: Thank you.

HILL: He has won multiple Super Bowls, became a big time broadcaster. Now this Hall of Famer is offering up his take on Game Day Grub and maybe even a little bit more. Jake Tapper's conversation with Terry Bradshaw is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HILL: In our pop lead, four-time Super Bowl champion, NFL broadcaster and pro-football Hall of Fame member Terry Bradshaw has scored again as Jake Tapper found out. This time, it's in the kitchen.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Terry Bradshaw, it is so great to have you on THE LEAD. You have a new book out. It's called "The Bradshaw Family Cookbook".

Terry, congratulations. And I have to say, reading this book, it's so cool. Everyone in your family fancies themselves a chef of some sort, has come up with delicious recipes. What are some of your favorites?

TERRY BRADSHAW, CO-AUTHOR, "THE BRADSHAW FAMILY COOKBOOK": Oh, well, Bradshaw beans is my favorite. You should try it, Jake. It's a great weekend. It's a great tailgating. All the -- most of the dishes that I do in there are -- I did. One, one thing I wanted to put in was my cat head biscuits, but I actually forgot to put that in there. My grandmother taught -- my grandmother taught me how to do cat head biscuits.

TAPPER: That's -- wait, hold on one second. What do you mean cat head biscuits? That's --

BRADSHAW: Well, that's -- well, here's what you do when you grow up in the south, in the rural areas where farmers and my grandmother every morning cooked for my grandfather, every morning. 4:30. And you'd hear in there rolling flour, throwing it on, rolling it out and watering them, rolling it out.

And then she'd roll it and put it in a ball and shed choke it off, pull it off with her hands and stick it in the pans like this. All right?

Then shed stick it, then shed take her elbow and put dents in the biscuits. All right? And then shed put a little -- either -- or bacon fat in the middle of that, or butter. And she called them cat head biscuits. That's --

TAPPER: Well --

BRADSHAW: It's delicious.

TAPPER: It sounds delicious when you describe it. The cat head part of it throws you off a little bit. BRADSHAW: Well, yeah, but -- I mean, look, Jake, you got to try it. I

mean, I would have put it in there. Maybe they'd have thought it's too gross, I don't know. But, boy, I'll tell you what? It's good stuff.

TAPPER: You called your grandmother a hoodie baby.

BRADSHAW: Hoodie baby, right.

TAPPER: First of all, with that nickname, did she play football? And tell us more --

BRADSHAW: My grandmother --

(LAUGHTER)

TAPPER: Which recipe -- which recipes of hers do you think people are going to love the most?

BRADSHAW: My grandmother's -- I wish I'd put those biscuits in. Well, they're going to love all the chickens. Chickens was favored. Matter of fact, I was the chicken kid on Sunday after church, I called the chicken.

And you know what? I don't want to say it's gross. But yeah, chicken on Sunday, her chicken recipes are good.

All my kids, except for Erin. Erin didn't want to participate in the book, which is hilarious because I told her we're making millions of dollars on the books. She said, you never told me about the money, dad. And I said, well, you never asked. And so now every time, about every 90 days, I tell, oh, we got another check today.

(LAUGHTER)

TAPPER: Why was she called hoodie baby, your grandma?

BRADSHAW: Well, grandmother, when I was a little boy, for some reason I couldn't say Estelle. Her name or her name is Estelle Thornton. And I couldn't -- for some reason, I couldn't say Estelle, and I said hoodie. It just came out of nowhere.

And so, I started calling her hoodie. And as I got older, I made it cute by calling her hoodie baby. I -- she was a five foot one, 190 pound German lady, and my grandfather was a six foot four, 165 English guy.

TAPPER: Boy.

BRADSHAW: So, put that -- put those two together. But a lot -- a lot of country cooking. My kids are a little more gourmet. My son in law Noah Hester, who wrote a lot of these recipes, he's an award-winning chef. Matter of fact, the award-winning chef in Dallas, Texas.

TAPPER: Nice.

BRADSHAW: But he's from Hawaii, so there's a lot of Hawaii flair in a lot of the dishes that we put in there. Well, most of mine are simple.

TAPPER: I think a lot of people are going to are going to love it. But I have to ask you before you go, obviously everybody knows you from your 14 years with the Steelers and obviously your broadcasting. Give us the lowdown on who you think is going to make it to the Super Bowl this year. You know, I'm an Eagles fan, but you don't.

BRADSHAW: Yeah, I do.

TAPPER: But you don't -- you don't have to say the Eagles. It's fine. We believe in free speech here.

BRADSHAW: No. No, I -- listen, I just left Kansas City where the eagles came in and played. It was an amazing game. Jake, it kind of reminded him about the early '70s and even the '60s where it was run, run, run, played great defense, capitalize on a break, which they did on the fourth down. They didn't make it.

That kind of game -- right now, I'd put the Eagles from the NFC with Green Bay. Some are saying Green Bay -- well, I want to see a little bit more out of Green Bay. And the Rams are coming on strong. That's about it. Atlanta's playing pretty good.

And then on the other side, I don't know why my heart if this -- says Buffalo.

TAPPER: Yeah.

BRADSHAW: I don't know why. I don't know why.

I would like to see Baltimore get there because of their quarterback, Jackson. I'd like to see buffalo get there because of their guy. Those two guys are amazing to watch.

So, I'm going to say from the NFC side, I don't think anybody can beat Philadelphia. And Philadelphia's focus. They're not -- they're not still cashing in on the Super Bowl. They're focused.

And so, I'm going to -- just because you're from Philly doesn't mean I'm kissing up to you, all right?

TAPPER: No, no. I said you could say anything you want.

BRADSHAW: I know, and I did. I said what -- I said what I wanted to say.

TAPPER: Terry Bradshaw, the book is "The Bradshaw Family Cookbook", and it is available now. Thank you so much. And I'll be --

BRADSHAW: Thanks, Jake.

TAPPER: I'll be watching you on my TV next time there's a game.

BRADSHAW: I hope so. Look forward to being with you again, buddy.

(END VIDEOTAPE) HILL: Cat head biscuits. Learn something new every day.

If you ever miss an episode of THE LEAD, you can check out the show wherever you get your podcasts.

Erin Burnett starts right now.