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The Lead with Jake Tapper
Trump Warns Of "Irreversible" Cuts To Come With Shutdown; Democrats Push To Extend Obamacare Subsidies To Avert Shutdown; Trump Mocks Biden, Touts Economic Policies And Justifies Using Military Force In U.S. Cities; Hegseth: Combat Troops Must Meet "Highest Male Standard Only"; Rep. Greg Murphy (R-NC), Is Interviewed About A Veteran Say Govt. Is "Stalling" On Camp Lejeune Payments; Trump: Military Should Use U.S. Cities As "Training Grounds". Aired 5-6p ET
Aired September 30, 2025 - 17:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LULU GARCIA-NAVARRO, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Rightly note, I mean, this was --
KASIE HUNT, CNN HOST: Based on the 71 night --
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Yes, telegraphed --
HUNT: -- speech --
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Yes.
HUNT: -- from the president --
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Yes.
HUNT: -- today's --
GARCIA-NAVARRO: -- and this was telegraphed for weeks, right, so.
HUNT: -- event. It absolutely does.
All right, Allison Jaslow (ph), I want to say thank you very much for bringing your unique perspective to the panel. Really important voice, I think, to hear from today.
Thanks to all of you for joining us today as well. Really appreciate it. All of you at home can always catch up with our podcast. Follow us online at thearenacnn on X and Instagram. But don't go anywhere, "The Lead" with Jake Tapper starts right.
[17:00:34]
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is CNN Breaking News.
JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Welcome to The Lead. I'm Jake Tapper. And we do start with breaking news. In our politics lead today, in less than seven hours, the U.S. government will begin to shut down, barring some sort of miracle. And while no two shutdowns are the same, the Trump administration has made it clear that this one will be played using a totally different playbook. The Congressional Budget Office is warning that 750,000 federal workers could be furloughed per day. But also some are now at risk of losing their jobs for good. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We can do things during the shutdown that are irreversible, that are bad for them and irreversible by them, like cutting vast numbers of people out, cutting things that they like, cutting programs that they like.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: Moments ago, President Trump added this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: A lot of good can come down from shutdowns. We can get rid of a lot of things that we didn't want.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: Republican leaders want a funding extension of the government for seven weeks with additional money for security for the legislative, executive and judicial branches. Democrats say that they're not going to vote for that unless it includes changes to health care policy, including extending Obamacare subsidies that are set to expire at the end of this year. So far, Pennsylvania Senator John Fetterman is the only Democrat who has said that he will vote for the Republican Party's seven week bill.
It's getting nasty in D.C., just hours after meeting with congressional leaders at the White House, including Democrats, President Trump posted this racist AI depiction of House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries wearing a sombrero and a mustache. That fake video also featured Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer in an AI generated voice saying that he wants to give, quote, "illegal aliens free health care," unquote. Here is the actual response from the actual Democratic leaders.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY), HOUSE MINORITY LEADER: Don't cop out through a racist and fake AI video.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's right.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
JEFFRIES: When I'm back in the Oval Office, say it to my face.
SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (D-NY), SENATE MINORITY LEADER: The president is busy trolling away on the Internet like a 10-year-old.
(END VIDEO CLIP) TAPPER: The drama does not end there, the Housing and Urban Development Agency's official website, this official website for all Americans, has this rather aggressive message splashed across its official government front page, blaming the shutdown on the, quote, "radical left and their $1.5 trillion wish list of demands." Let's start with CNN's Manu Raju on Capitol Hill.
Manu, is there any hope there that a shutdown might somehow be averted, averted at all?
MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: There's virtually none, Jake. In fact, this is all but certain to be the first government shutdown that this country has experienced since 2019. At that time, Donald Trump was president. It lasted 35 days. It was the longest shutdown in American history.
The question now is how long will this shutdown go on for? How painful will it be? What will it take to get out of it? And which party will incur the political blowback? Those are all the questions that are now being confronted here in the Capitol itself.
We expect this hour to be two votes in the Senate floor, one Democratic plan that includes a number of their proposals that they want as a condition to open the government, one from Republicans, a straight extension of government funding over the next seven weeks. And that would not include what Democrats are demanding. Democrats want to reverse the health care cuts that were included in Donald Trump's One Big Beautiful Bill Act. They also want to extend Obamacare subsidies set to expire at year's end. They want to constrain Donald Trump's ability to cut federal spending without the consent of Congress, something they say is blatantly unconstitutional.
Republicans want none of that. They want a straight extension of funding to negotiate on these issues later. The question is going to be what happens next and will any Democrats will ultimately come to the GOP side, particularly as this crisis drags on. One key senator to watch, Senator Angus King, independent who caucuses with Democrats, he had voted in March with nine Democrats to extend government funding at that point. I asked him just moments ago if you would vote for this Republican plan that's coming to the floor in just a matter of minutes.
[17:05:01]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RAJU: How are you feeling about this vote tonight? Are you having a voting from this Republican (inaudible)?
SEN. ANGUS KING (I-ME): I haven't decided.
RAJU: You haven't decided?
KING: Correct.
RAJU: What are you weighing or struggling with right now?
KING: I don't really want to discuss about that vote, especially with some of my colleagues. You'll find out when they get to the K's in the Alphabet.
RAJU: Are you concerned about the ramifications of none of these bills passing?
KING: Well, I am so concern about the ramifications of one sided government.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
RAJU: He said he's still concerned about a shutdown, but he's also concerned about one sided government. He shows you how this one senator there is torn. But the magic number for Republicans to see their bill pass is eight. Right now we expect just one Democrat who is a certain yes that Senator John Fetterman of Pennsylvania, perhaps a few others like Angus King and Senator Jeanne Shaheen. Someone else to watch for on the Senate floor, Senator Gary Peters, Senator Maggie Hassan among those who could be swing votes here.
But it's still not expected to be eight, Jake. And that means that the government is all but certain to shut down. The question is who will ultimately cave in the end, what deal will ultimately be cut or how long this will drag on for all huge questions at this very perilous moment. Jake.
TAPPER: All right, Manu Raju on Capitol Hill, thanks so much.
Joining us now to discuss, Kevin Hassett. He's the director of the National Economic Council at the Trump White House.
Kevin, good to see you. Thanks for joining us.
KEVIN HASSETT, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: You too, Jake.
TAPPER: First off, let me ask you, these nonessential workers who are going to be fired, not just furloughed, who are they? How many of them are they? What jobs are going to be targeted?
HASSETT: Well, first of all, it's the hope of the White House that the continuing resolution passes as it, you know, in the Senate, as it did in the House. President Trump does not want to shut down the government and the Democrats are the party that does. This is something if you go back and look at political history that has happened over and over, that a party that's got a political minority tries to hold everybody hostage for a while, but it almost always ends up with a clean continuing resolution. And that's how this is going to end up too. And so that's going to happen.
The question is do we have a shutdown between now and then? And Russ Vought over at OMB sent out guidance to the cabinet secretaries listing their options if Congress refuses to give them the money they need to operate their agencies. And what are the options that is on the table is to have a reduction in force for some people at the discretion of the secretary. But that's not anyone's intent. We -- our intent is to keep the government open. And we're hoping that the Democrats see some reason.
We're -- you know, we're hearing from some moderate Democrats that they might even vote with the Republicans today. So let's see how it goes.
TAPPER: The Democrats are -- they have a list of demands. The one that they talk about the most is extending these Obamacare subsidies which are set to expire at the end of this year. Some Republicans have said that's a separate issue and we can deal with Democrats on that issue separately. But isn't it true that it's the position of the White House that you're in favor of those subsidies expiring at the end of the year, that they were COVID era and you -- and you want them gone?
HASSETT: Right. Well, right now what we want to do is get the continuing resolution. And I know that there are some Republican senators that are concerned about the COVID era stuff going up too quick. Right now, the position of the White House is we need to get the continuing resolution done. It needs to be clean.
And then if we want to have policy debates about other topics of the future, we could do so.
TAPPER: I guess the Democrats are saying they -- they only have the leverage now. And as you know, this is something that both Democrats and Republicans do when they're in the minority. They use this --
HASSETT: That's right.
TAPPER: -- opportunity to -- to use the leverage they have to get this passed to get it to the 60 vote threshold in the Senate. Is that something that the White House is legitimately, sincerely willing to consider when it comes to future negotiations, extending those Obamacare subsidies?
HASSETT: That's -- that's a negotiation for a future time. The thing that I can say is that -- that this -- holding everybody hostage, which is what the Democrats are doing right now, putting government workers livelihood at risk is something that has been played by both parties in history, but it's never really worked. And so this is really a fool's errand that Chuck Schumer has put the Democrats on. And a lot of moderate Democrats recognize that and think that Senator Schumer is just worried that he's going to be primaried by AOC and so he's got to be way to the left of his caucus. But our hope is that maybe even tonight enough people show up to vote for the Republican sensible continuing resolution that it doesn't come to that.
TAPPER: So Kevin, the president is threatening cuts that he's saying will be irreversible if the government shutdowns happen. Obviously the president then gets a whole lot of power with the -- with the shutdown going on, the executive branch gets to make all sorts of decisions. So irreversible cuts on top of about 300,000 federal workers already leaving their jobs this year amid the DOGE cuts, with the shutdown nearly certain, why is the White House committing to layoffs that it seems could cause permanent damage to the executive branch that you're going to have to then deal with?
[17:10:11]
HASSETT: Well, I think that again that the guidance from OMB is that the cabinet secretary should put all the options on the table. One of the options is to find nonessential workers that aren't being productive and aren't contributing to their cabinet agency. And that if the Democrats shut the government down, then those folks may be at risk of a reduction in force. If the Democrats agree with the Republicans and pass the continuing resolution today, that's not going to happen. I think that that puts a lot of pressure on moderate Democrats to come forward with Senator Thune and agree to pass the House bill and give us seven more weeks to talk about these other policy issues.
TAPPER: All right. White House Director of the National Economic Council, Kevin Hassett --
HASSETT: Thanks, Jake.
TAPPER: -- thanks so much for answering our questions. Appreciate it.
Will unemployment checks still go out during a government shutdown? Will airport security be staffed? Will national parks be closed? We're going to take a look at how the government shutdown could impact your life. That's next.
Plus what President Trump today called an invasion from within as he floats the idea of U.S. cities becoming training grounds literally for the U.S. military. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:15:28]
TAPPER: In our politics lead, any moment the U.S. senate will vote on the House passed bill to fund the federal government for seven more weeks. The last ditch effort is almost certain to fail. And that brings us to CNN's Tom Forman.
Tom, President Trump says a lot of good can come from a shutdown, which government services will keep running and which likely will stop?
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Let's start with the good side there, Jake. The things that might be good out there, which is what keeps working, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Veterans services are all supposed to keep operating. Unemployment benefits should be paid. The National Weather Service should keep operating with weather forecast, all of those things, the Department of Homeland Security, ICE, Border Patrol and so on, that should continue operating. And other essential services, essential being the key word there, that can cover a lot of ground with jobs that you feel like you have to do them, you have to do them in a timely manner to keep things safe and vaguely functional out there. But there are things that could be very much affected by this. Air travel, for example, even though many of the people under the FAA would be considered essential and they have to be there, the plan generally in this case is that they would not be paid. They would have to work, but they'll be paid later. And that can have a disruptive effect. You can have big delays at airports, you can have delayed flights, you can have canceled flights.
All of that may not matter because you may find the national parks, monuments and museums, more than 400 of them, including, for example, the Smithsonian, including the Statue of Liberty, may just all be closed in this process. Government services, research and documents like visas and passports could be very slow, even if they're still working. And food and drug inspections could be pulled way back or curtailed in some fashion.
And the reason I keep saying could be, Jake, is that this administration has been far from state of the art in terms of information about this. Typically when you have a shutdown, you have one big clearinghouse of information so everyone's on the same page. This time it's being done sort of department and agency at a time, making journalists very busy trying to check in with everyone and figure out what's really going to happen.
TAPPER: So, Tom, obviously we've been through these before, but by all accounts, this one seems like it really could be different than previous shutdowns. Explain for us why.
FOREMAN: And one of the reasons why is the very functional idea of the Trump administration. They're cutting a tremendous number of federal workers this year, not just workers that they're losing, but one of the concerns for skeptics out there is the potential loss of expertise. The people who might know how to make it work with fewer people may not be there, in which case you have a problem and, as I noted before, a lack of clear information about what is happening here.
Jake, the real thing to bear in mind here is that no matter which side gets political advantage out of this, the people who lose are the American people. Especially when you consider that just under one in 50 people in the American workforce works for the federal government.
TAPPER: Tom Foreman, thanks so much.
Coming up next, the top military leaders lectured today by the Secretary of War.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETE HEGSETH, DEFENSE SECRETART: Gene distraction or gender delusions. No more debris. We are done with that shit.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: That was before the president jumped in. Some former senior officials will tell us what they thought of what they heard next. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:22:59]
TAPPER: We're back with our national lead. In today's unusual meeting hastily arranged for top military brass, generals and admirals all summoned to Quantico, Virginia. First, a speech from the Department of War secretary, Pete Hegseth, that he seemed to think was really manly. That was followed by rambling remarks by the Commander in Chief, 71 full minutes on renaming the Department of War and the Gulf of America, talking about firemen up in ladders, Biden's auto pen, his desire to be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize, a number of just downright lies about things President Biden supposedly never said that he actually had said. Wars, Trump claimed that he ended that he hasn't. He attacked CNN because our August reporter accurately reported on a Defense Intelligence Agency assessment of the Iran strikes.
And on and on incoherent at times, not exactly filling one with confidence necessarily about his ability to focus. Here's a bit more of what President Trump had to say. Keep in mind, this is to a room full of senior military leaders with decades of experience.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Actually, I love my signature, I really do. Everyone loves my signature. And it turned out that almost everything he did was signed by -- by auto pen, except for what he gave his son, Hunter, pardon. He signed that one. And that's actually the worst signature I've ever seen.
I love tariffs. Most beautiful word. But I'm not allowed to say that anymore. I said tariff is my favorite word. I love the word tariff.
You know, when I walk downstairs like I'm on stairs, like these stairs, I'm very -- I walk very slowly. Nobody has to set a record. Just try not to fall.
The one thing with Obama, I had zero respect for him as a president, but he would bop down those stairs. I've never seen, da, da, da da, bop, bop.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[17:25:00]
TAPPER: So that happened. Let's bring in CNN's Jamie Gangel and CNN's August National Security correspondent, Natasha Bertrand.
Jamie, what are your military national security sources telling you after listening to that? Do they have confidence in him as a commander in chief?
JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: There are real concerns, you know, even for those of us who are used to listening to sort of long rambling off the cuff Donald Trump speak speeches, this one was notable. The military sources and national security sources I spoke to felt, to use your word, that it was incoherent. And earlier today, you know, Lieutenant Colonel -- retired Lieutenant Colonel Amy McGrath, who was a Marine fighter pilot, she called it bonkers. I will not even say on T.V., even though on cable we can, some of the things that were said to me today, let's just say crazy nuts, never seen anything like it before.
And -- and on a serious note about national security, there was this concern that not only does this divide the military and is dangerous for national security, but one source told me he had already heard from allies across Europe saying, what the hell was that --
TAPPER: Yes.
GANGEL: -- about.
TAPPER: Natasha, meanwhile, the secretary of War, Pete Hegseth, he railed against political correctness, diversity. He defended firing military leaders. He brought up physical fitness. He's quite enamored of his own physical fitness. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HEGSETH: I don't want my son serving alongside troops who are out of shape or in combat unit with females who can't meet the same combat arms physical standards as men. For every designated combat arms position returns to the highest male standard only. If women can make it excellent. If not, it is what it is. If that means no women qualify for some combat jobs, so be it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: This has been something he's been railing against for a long, long time back when he was a weekend co-host on Fox, talking about the allegedly lowered standards for women to be in combat roles.
NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: This is something he's been remarkably consistent about. He at first, when he was not the nominee to be the Secretary of Defense. And I should note also one of the more striking aspects of this entire day was the repeated discussion about this being the Department of War and Secretary of War. While Secretary Hegseth does want to be identified as Secretary of War, Congress has not actually statutorily changed that. So it is still legally the Department of Defense.
But I digress. Hegseth said that he is going to be implementing a new policy requiring standards for every combat arms position to return to the, quote, "highest male standard." And that is consistent with what he said before when he was on this podcast before he was nominated he said, quote, "I'm straight up just saying we should not have women in combat roles. So he actually went further than he is now. He said it hasn't made us more effective or lethal.
In his book, he said, quote, "women in the infantry in combat on purpose are another story for women who are just serving in support rules." So he has long been against this. He kind of changed his tune a little bit during his confirmation hearings, walked it back a little bit, saying that he's just going to look at the standards overall and make sure they're not lowered.
But you know, when you ask military leaders what they think about this, sure, no one wants standards to be lowered, but you also don't want to discourage women from joining and from trying. And that's why back when Obama opened up these combat roles to women in 2015, then Defense Secretary Ash Carter, he said very explicitly, quote, "we cannot afford to cut ourselves off from half the country's talents and skills." And you know, Ranger school, for example, which Secretary Hegseth did not graduate from, that is one standard for men and women. And over 100 women have already graduated Ranger school.
GANGEL: Right.
TAPPER: What are your sources telling you about what Secretary of War Pete Hegseth said?
GANGEL: They thought it was offensive, an embarrassment, and to quote one, "it simply does not reflect how the military works today." It shows how little he knows or appreciates about professionalism and readiness.
TAPPER: Some of something else he said that our viewers should just know is he also encouraged drill sergeants to, quote, "put their hands on recruits," instill a, quote, "healthy fear." He also said the Pentagon is, quote, "overhauling the inspector general process so as to eliminate what he called frivolous complaints."
Natasha Bertrand, Jamie Gangel, thanks to both of you.
Later we're going to talk more about President Trump suggesting that the military should use U.S. cities as training grounds. First, frustration building up at Camp Lejeune after a decades long fight from families exposed toxic water while serving there. Why they now say they may never get answers. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
TAPPER: In our Buried Lead, that's where we talk about stories we believe deserve much more coverage than they're getting. For 30 years, as many as 1 million U.S. Marines and civilians and their families were potentially exposed to toxic water at Camp Lejeune in North Carolina. You know this because we've covered this story many times before. And now we're going to bring you CNN's Nick Watt, speaking with one veteran who was stationed at Camp Lejeune who has suffered unimaginable losses, losses he says the government needs to answer for.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NORMAN STITES, VIETNAM VETERAN: I'm proud to have been a Marine. So it's nothing about the Marine Corps, you messed with my family. My son was born in Lejeune and he was hurting. I wish I had let him die when we're in the delivery room and the doctors were telling me we have to give him another blood transfusion.
NICK WATT, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): David lived, suffered until he was eight.
STITES: I figured it was an act of God. I figured it was for something in my life that I'd done bad and I'm getting paid back.
[17:35:00]
WATT: And how does it make you feel when you know that it was probably the water at the camp?
STITES: You know, that -- that drives me crazy.
WATT (voice-over): Congress finally passed a bill in 2022 allowing Marines like Norman Stites and their kin to file civil claims over birth defects, cancer and more that they say were caused by contaminated water at Camp Lejeune. Remember all those injury lawyer commercials.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You may be eligible for significant financial compensation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Please give us a call.
WATT (voice-over): Just over 400,000 claims have been filed, says the Navy. Just over 1,000 settled.
ANDREW VAN ARSDALE, ATTORNEY: And justice delayed can be, and in this case, is starting to be, justice denied.
WATT: Because people have died.
VAN ARSDALE: Because people have died.
WATT (voice-over): Norman Stites has filed a claim for his son and himself.
STITES: They found cancer in my thyroid. August 13th, I had another cancer removed from my bladder.
WATT (voice-over): Citing pending litigation, the DOJ declined to comment.
STITES: They are stolen, period.
WATT: They don't want to pay the money?
STITES: The only thing that myself and most of the people feel is yes, it's the money.
WATT (voice-over): Here's the history. From 1953 through 1987, water at Lejeune was contaminated by an off-base dry cleaner, leaky storage tanks and chemical dumping. As many as a million people were potentially exposed.
STITES: Our clothes were washed in the water. We bathed in the water. We drank the water. WATT (voice-over): Tests in 1980, '81 and '85 found the contamination. But the worst wells weren't closed until 1987. And the first major warning and outreach we can find wasn't until 1999, recruiting participants for a study into potential health problems. Norman Stites now spends many nights here, drumming in the wee hours.
STITES: If I'm having bad days, this is stakes that are all the way.
I had a daughter that died too, one-month-old. Finding my daughter dead in that crib in the morning was worse than Vietnam.
WATT (voice-over): Now there's another bill before Congress that would expand the number of judges who can handle these cases from just four to many more and reduce some of the demands for evidence.
VAN ARSDALE: A lot of the fight that the DOJ has put forward has been based on, give us a sample of that water in the 1970s, show us what was in it. Well, the water samples don't exist.
WATT: One of the other provisions here is to cap your fee.
VAN ARSDALE: If a cap on my fees allows these senators and these representatives to pass this bill, I welcome that.
WATT: Are you now at least optimistic that --
STITES: No.
WATT: Really?
STITES: Really, no. It's just stall, stall, stall, stall until you die.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WATT: Now, in an email, the Navy tells me that some of the claims don't have supporting documents. Some are for injuries that aren't covered. And they tell me that the time taken to settle a claim is, quote, entirely dependent on timely receipt of relevant supporting documents. Now, Norman Stites, who we just heard from, he has bladder cancer, which is number one on the list of injuries on the form. And he filed in December of 2022. So coming up on three years, he is still waiting. And Jake, losing hope.
TAPPER: All right, Nick Watt, thank you so much for staying on top of the story.
Let's bring in Republican Congressman Greg Murphy of North Carolina. Congressman, thanks so much for joining us. As we have reported before, Camp Lejeune's in your district, and you have been very aggressive trying to help these survivors. We spoke two months ago about this and a bill called the Ensuring Justice for Camp Lejeune Victims Act. Are you any closer --
REP. GREG MURPHY (R-NC): Yes.
TAPPER: -- to getting that passed now than you were a few months ago?
MURPHY: Well, obviously, with the looming shutdown, we're not doing anything about that right at present time. But this is now in the Judiciary Committee. All the -- all the members really have been briefed very heavily on this and what the changes are. We're -- we're -- we're strengthening the bill by clearing evidentiary standards, capping the attorneys fees, which was -- which was an issue, making sure that people have a juris -- they have a jurisdiction, really, that's going to be able to handle the claims that have been heretofore just in one particular district.
And really trying to strengthen up the bill. And so I think it's in a good place. You know, getting anything through Congress of this magnitude is very, very difficult. Why the, you know, Biden DOJ would not allow jury trials still is beyond me. You know, I don't know why, how that got passed, but I'm a physician, not an attorney. So we've been working very, very hard on this to try to bring the people of Camp Lejeune justice.
You know, as you point out, 400,000 claims and very, very few adjudicated comparatively. You know, as a physician, I want to see people healed, but I also want to have some closure to this also. So hopefully sooner than later.
TAPPER: I'm sure you've heard many, many stories like the one we just aired. Can you promise that these veterans and their families ultimately will get the justice they deserve?
[17:40:02]
MURPHY: Well, Jake, I can't promise anything when I'm -- I'm one vote and 435 plus yet another 100. I can just promise them that I'm working very, very hard on this. You know, this has become -- I inherited this from our former congressman who had worked on it for a very long time.
I was happy that it was the Camp Lejeune Justice Act was included in the PACT Act. But sometimes we have to go back and refine things for the Navy or whoever it is really to stand up and push forward. We're doing the very, very best we can. But, you know, I personally can't promise anybody anything. That wouldn't be fair.
TAPPER: I appreciate your honesty. Can I just say that I -- I just constantly find it amazing how and I'm not talking about you, but how many ways we as a country figure out to screw our veterans.
MURPHY: Yes.
TAPPER: It just never -- it never stops amazing me.
MURPHY: Well, I -- I -- I'd love to know who -- who are the point person who allowed all this, who knew this first at the beginning, who -- why the delay occurred, why were people still exposed to this, and why it's not gotten hastened? That said, that's not helping the people today. That's more of an academic pursuit.
I'd like to get this adjudicated. I'd like to get this put forward. I'd like to put this in the books and give these people closure. And that's what I'm working very hard ardently on.
TAPPER: Well, stay in touch with the -- with our show. We'll keep covering it until -- until this is actually passed. Appreciate it. Congressman Greg Murphy of the great state of North Carolina.
MURPHY: Yes, sir.
TAPPER: Thank you, sir.
A mayor just outside Chicago said today that the Trump administration is running a disinformation campaign and making war on her community. That sentiment likely propelled even more today by the President's own words. We'll get into that next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:45:44]
TAPPER: In our Politics Lead, President Trump, earlier today announced a new plan for what he calls America's dangerous cities.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: In our inner cities, which we're going to be talking about because it's a -- it's a big part of war now, it's a big part of war. We're under invasion from within. No different than a foreign enemy. But more difficult in many ways because they don't wear uniforms. At least when they're wearing a uniform, you can take them out. These people don't have uniforms.
But we are under invasion from within. And I told Pete, we should use some of these dangerous cities as training grounds for our military, National Guard, but military.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: I'm here with my panel. So Jonah Goldberg, first of all, he was very unspecific about who he was talking about. It's not like he was talking about undocumented criminals with MS-13. He's not talking about Antifa. It was just like from within this menace. He wants to turn cities like Chicago into military training grounds. What's your response? What might that even look like?
JONAH GOLDBERG, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. Look, I -- I think that's appalling in its own right for a whole bunch of different reasons. Just a fact check, it is very different than a war -- wartime situation in all sorts of important ways, constitutionally, morally, legally, factually, all that kind of stuff.
The biggest disconnect for me was that you had Pete Hegseth, who said some things I think are perfectly defensible and all that kind of stuff. But one of his major focuses was lethality, lethality, lethality. Like, our military is going to be lethal. We're going to be -- we kill people to defend our country.
And then the -- the top of the card comes on stage, the commander in chief, and says, yes, we're going to train our lethal military in American cities. That's weird stuff.
RACHAEL BADE, JOURNALIST: Yes. I mean I have written this a few times in my columns over the past few months. I think the crime issue obviously can be a beneficial thing for Republicans.
TAPPER: Sure.
BADE: You see the polling, typically voters trust Republicans over Democrats.
TAPPER: And crime is bad, without question. They need more cops in all the cities, of course.
BADE: Absolutely. Absolutely. But you know, there's a way to talk about this and a way not to talk about it. You know, it reminded me back just a few weeks ago when Trump was tweeting about, what did he call Chicago, a war zone or something? I -- I can't remember --
GOLDBERG: Called Portland war raft.
BADE: I think we were actually on together --
GOLDBERG: Yes.
BADE: -- for -- for a panel about that. But it's -- talk about protecting.
TAPPER: Today he said, D.C. is more dangerous than Afghanistan.
BADE: Talk about protecting. What you want to do to protect Americans. What you want to do to try to eradicate crime. And I mean, look, they have a number of things they can point to. I mean, I'm thinking about Iryna Zarutska's murder in that video.
TAPPER: Yes. Sure.
BADE: That was so gut wrenching and horrible. And it was a repeat offender situation. This is something that a lot of even Democrats are uncomfortable with. It's an easy sort of topic for Republicans to sort of pivot to say, this is a problem. We want to change it. But they're not doing it that way. They're -- they're talking about it, as you said, like, you know, we're going to train the military, our lethal military in Chicago. It's just -- there's a way to resonate with people and there's a way not, and that's the way not to.
TAPPER: And I -- I -- it's a great point that you're making because there is a vulnerability that Democrats have when it comes to permissive structures that allow repeat offenders, violent repeat offenders out on the streets. When it comes to there not being enough police.
BADE: Right.
TAPPER: Because there was this like vogue era of defund the police, et cetera, et cetera. But sending our troops after they've been -- after they become the manliest, deadliest troops ever to downtown Chicago to do what? Who is the enemy from within he's talking about?
GOLDBERG: Yes, I think he likes to keep it vague. And some of it you -- you can -- you can drive yourself a little crazy trying to overthink what his personal motivations are on these things. But I think the White House messaging on this is, in part, to freak people out and get them to overreact and say, see how unreasonable they are. All we're really talking about is having the National Guard protect some immigration, you know, federal buildings in downtown Portland.
And -- and you're the ones who are screaming fascist, right? And so you get this sort of race to the bottom of -- of hysterical language that triggers more hysterical responses. And you get a place where it puts everybody on edge. And that's actually beneficial with Trump.
TAPPER: So the President also teased that there's -- there are more changes to come.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[17:50:06]
TRUMP: Once we'll be making even more historic announcements to fully embrace the identity of the Department of War. I love the name. I think it's so great. I think it stops wars. The Department of War is going to stop wars.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: Could we just take one second to talk about his presentation? He seems to be slurring like he has some dentifrice issues going on.
BADE: I hadn't even noticed it.
GOLDBERG: Yes.
BADE: I would or Jonah had, sorry.
GOLDBERG: Yes. I -- I -- I -- he sounds slurry to me. It could be that it's just very early in the morning to get up. It could have been the mic, but he sounded a little bit slurry later in the day, too.
TAPPER: Anyway, back to the substance.
BADE: Yes, sure.
TAPPER: What are these more historic announcements? Do we have any idea what he's talking about?
BADE: I -- I'm not sure at this point what it's going to be. But I mean, look, he's trying to project the United States strong man image. And, you know, it's interesting to me because he's already done this. I mean, like, we already see a bunch of our allies are concerned. You know, the whole world is worried about tariffs. You know, what is the U.S. going to do on this and that?
But look, he's -- he's trying to double down on that and try to, you know, project this tough man image. It's part of the changing of the Department of Defense, the Department of War.
GOLDBERG: But there is a there's a -- there's a weird binary thing about this talk today. He went again hard saying, you stupid idiots. Why aren't you giving me a Nobel Peace Prize, right? About all these wars he stopped, all kinds of stuff. But then when you start talking about, you know, how you're going to use your troops on -- in -- on American cities, that's the kind of thing that makes the sort of squishy people in the Nobel Peace Prize Committee kind of nervous, you know. And I don't think he understands that the messaging for domestic consumption is also messaging for foreign consumption.
BADE: Yes.
TAPPER: The Democratic mayor of Broadview, Illinois, which is a suburb of Chicago, spoke today about the ICE raids impact on her community. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR KATRINA THOMPSON, BROADVIEW, ILLINOIS: Our Hispanic residents, our African-American residents, our Asian-American residents, our white residents are all begging for relief from ICE siege of our neighborhood in our community. The Department of Homeland Security is running a disinformation campaign that would make even Russian blush. And they are making war on my community.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: Do you think Democrats in D.C. are hearing Democrats like her? I -- I just -- it's just like that seems like a very different message than what Democrats in D.C. are talking about.
BADE: I mean, I don't know. I think like -- I feel like I expected more Democrats to say, look, let's like put the whole concern about National Guard constitutionality aside and reemphasize the need to do something about crime, the need for more cops, et cetera. And yes, we need to address illegal immigration.
But then we haven't really heard that. And we are -- I feel like we have heard more from the other side, which is what you just heard here, which is like we don't want any of this right now. And I -- I wonder if that's how that politically will play for Democrats. Like, I feel like perhaps there's a better messaging campaign for them than to just say, look, we don't want these ICE people coming in and they're going to just ruin our communities rather than acknowledging that there actually is a problem that needs to be addressed in a very different way perhaps.
TAPPER: You mentioned, Jonah, that President Trump talked about the deploying agents to war ravaged Portland. The police chief there, in addition to the governor and the mayor, say we don't -- we don't want or need your federal agents.
GOLDBERG: Yes, look, and there are real constitutional problems with sending them anyway. At the same time, you know, just to get to Rachel's point, there's a problem. The Democrats have a -- their comfort zone rhetorically was back with the defund the police stuff and all that. And they realized that was politically disastrous. It was also a whole bunch of stuff about immigration that no longer works for them. And they haven't figured out how to talk about this stuff.
Now, Portland is not a beautiful, vibrant city the way a lot of Democrats are saying right now. It is a really messed up city that is starting to get better. But it's also not Fallujah. And so you have these people talking on these scripts that are just not reflective of reality.
TAPPER: It's so crazy when he's -- when he talked about how D.C. is more dangerous than Afghanistan. I've been to Afghanistan a couple of times during the war. You have to wear a helmet and a vest everywhere you go. You have to drive in an MRAP because of it's -- it's -- it's so insane. Yes, there are parts of D.C. I would never want to go -- go to late at night. But oh, my God, it's not the same thing. Rachel, Jonah, thanks for being here.
Some new video just in from North Carolina's outer banks, five homes have now collapsed in the ocean, the likely result of dangerous waves being kicked up by not one but two hurricanes just off the East Coast. We're going to get new storm tracks in next.
[17:54:40]
And breaking news on the floor of the U.S. Senate, lawmakers are voting on the first of two proposals to fund the government. They are expected to fail. We're going to monitor this. More to come.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
TAPPER: Breaking news, in our National Lead, new updates in on Hurricane Humberto and hurricane Imelda, both just off the U.S. east coast. Let's get to CNN meteorologist, Chris Warren. Chris, what are the latest updates show?
CHRIS WARREN, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Well, Jake, first, I want to show you what this looks like on satellite. And this is a remarkable sight to be seen. This is the visible satellite. This is as close as you're going to get to being in space looking down at earth at these two hurricanes, not only are there two tropical systems very close to each other, but these are two tropical systems that are hurricanes close to each other and close to the United States.
Now, when it's all said and done, after everything becomes official, this may end up being the first time two Atlantic hurricanes have been this close to each other since we've been tracking these storms from space. With the latest update, this is an 85-mile per hour category one hurricane, Imelda. It is expected to strengthen as it gets closer and passes across possibly right over Bermuda.
[18:00:16]
And Jake, as these storms continue to move away from the U.S. they're still generating a lot of rough surf and dangerous rip currents along the East Coast. TAPPER: Thanks so much.
