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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Trump Says He's Canceled Anticipated Meeting With Putin; Acting ICE Director Says New York City Will See Increase of ICE Arrests; Soon, Final New York City Mayoral Debate. Memoir: Epstein Survivor Tells Sex Abuse, Psychological Torment; Chess Organation Will Look Into Alleged Bullying Before And After Grandmaster's Death. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired October 22, 2025 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:00]

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to the Lead. I'm Jake Tapper.

This hour, breaking news out of the White House, the Trump administration is slapping new sanctions on two major Russian oil companies and blasting Vladimir Putin's, quote, lack of serious commitment to a peace process to end the war and Ukraine, unquote. How big of an impact could these sanctions?

Plus, it's time for the quarrel in Queens tonight. The candidates hoping to be New York City's next mayor will face off in the final debate before election night. Will anyone land a knockout blow?

Also, growing questions after an American chess grand unexpectedly died at only 29 years old. And now the International Chess Federation is investigating allegations of potential bullying and harassment against him in the months before his death.

And Bad Bunny apparently here to stay. The NFL commissioner says they're sticking with the Puerto Rican superstar for the Super Bowl halftime show despite backlash from President Trump and some Republicans. Hear the NFL's reason why, ahead.

Our Lead tonight, major developments when it comes to the U.S. role in trying to end Russia's war on Ukraine. Just moments ago, President Trump confirming he has canceled his upcoming meeting with Russia's Vladimir Putin, claiming it, quote, just didn't feel right. The news coming just minutes after the U.S. announced new sanctions targeting Russia's two largest oil companies, and after President Trump was denied a report claiming a key restriction is being lifted on Ukraine's use of long-range missiles from western allies.

Let's get straight to CNN's Kaitlan Collins, who's at the White House for us. Kaitlan?

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Jake, this was a really rapidly mo moving development today. I'll tell you, we were standing outside the West Wing. We were waiting for the treasury secretary, Scott Bessent, to come walk through. We were talking to him about the government shutdown and what's been going on back and forth with that from his department.

And then just before he walked away from us, Jake, he stopped and said that after the close of the markets today that he expected them to announce a substantial uptick in Russian sanctions. It kind of sent everyone scrambling here at the White House as we were trying to figure out what exactly that was going to look like. And then we got this release, Jake, from the Treasury Department saying that, yes, the United States is sanctioning two of Russia's biggest oil companies in response to the lack of action, frankly, when it comes to bringing this war to the end, as the U.S. is reemphasizing something that President Trump has been seeking for months now, and certainly, Jake, since we were in Alaska with President Trump and President Putin, and that is a ceasefire.

And you're right, he did confirm he will not be sitting down with the Russian leader. And this is what he told reporters just a few moments ago inside the Oval Office.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: When we canceled the meeting with President Putin, it just -- it didn't feel right to me. It didn't feel like we were going to get to the place we have to get. So, I canceled it, but we'll do it in the future.

In terms of honesty, the only thing I can say is every time I speak with Vladimir, I have good conversations and then they don't go anywhere. They just don't go anywhere.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: And, Jake, the NATO secretary general was sitting right next to President Trump in the Oval Office. They're meeting right now. They talked about the Russian strikes that happened in Ukraine overnight, including on a kindergarten school there.

And so the president was just emphasizing that these new sanctions are now in place. He said he hopes that they won't be in place for long because some kind of agreement will happen. But he was clearly getting irritated with the Russian leader, as you could see in those comments.

The question, of course, Jake, is what changes going forward and what these sanctions look like. But, certainly, this has been something that has been a big conversation here in Washington where some Republicans on Capitol Hill have been pushing for the president to put new sanctions in place, but also saying they're waiting for the White House to make that decision here.

And now, Jake, and just the last few hours we've seen just how much this has changed, which is remarkable because just last week, the president was suggesting he could be sitting down with Putin in Budapest within days. And now that it's changed and new sanctions are in place on Moscow.

TAPPER: Interesting development. Kaitlan Collins at the White House, thank you. And don't miss Kaitlan on her show, The Source with Kaitlan Collins. Tonight, she's going to speak to the speaker of the House, Mike Johnson, Republican of Louisiana. That's tonight at 9:00 Eastern only on CNN.

Here with me now is Oklahoma's Republican Senator Markwayne Mullin. Senator, what's your reaction to these new sanctions against Russian oil companies, especially as the president is still obviously trying to balance and maintain a relationship with Vladimir Putin?

SEN. MARKWAYNE MULLIN (R-OK): Well, it's pretty clear that the president said what he referred to while ago, that Putin's conversation with the president is one thing, but his actions aren't following it up. The president is, as the president of NATO has said, that President Trump is the only one that can bring this war to an end. And if Putin isn't going to be somebody that's trustworthy, that's going to negotiate in honest terms, the best thing we can do is go after, you know, his economy.

[18:05:03]

Their economy, Russia's economy's already dropping, the ruble is dropping. Going after these major oil companies, making sure that the rest of the world is able to follow up on those sanctions, if you start putting the economic woes and start damaging their economy even farther, I believe this is what will bring Putin to the table. Other than that, nothing else seems to work, and the president has been very frustrated with this. And I believe that if it's going to be possible, President Trump is the only man in the world that can do it.

TAPPER: Do you think that there need to be even harsher sanctions? And the reason I ask is because, obviously, August 15th, I believe it was, was the summit in Alaska where President Trump was hoping that Vladimir Putin would agree to any sort of ceasefire. And not only did he not get a ceasefire, Putin, since the U.S. literally rolled out the carpet for him in the United States of America, on American land, Putin has upped the tenor of the war, some of the worst attacks on Ukraine have happened since then. And I'm wondering if President Trump, do you think needs to be even more aggressive.

MULLIN: Well, this is step one. The president and Congress has talked multiple times what the next step might be. We have been briefed. We've been in briefings. We've been in classified settings. This is literally the first step to put more pressure on Russia if we need to.

I believe we probably will. I don't think Putin is someone that's going to pay attention the first time his hand was slapped. I think you're going to see this get ratcheted up farther and farther to the point to where either we're going to bring them to their knees, economically, or they're going to decide that fighting Ukraine isn't worth it.

At the same time, I wouldn't be surprised if you start seeing us give the accessibility to new weapons for Europe to buy for Ukraine to be able to fight against Russia and their aggression in Ukraine. As I said, Jake, this is just the first step, but this is the first step of a lot of options we have on the table. TAPPER: Let's turn to another major story at the White House. We're seeing these images that are frankly surprising and shocking to many people of the demolition of the East Wing of the White House today. Do you think that President Trump should have told the country, should have informed Congress that he was planning to take the step of tearing down the entire East Wing to do this edition? We all knew that the ballroom was coming, but the president in June, I believe it was, said that it wasn't even going to touch the White House building, which he said he loved. And now we have the entire East Wing headed for the scrap in.

MULLIN: Well, he was telling the American people from the beginning that he was wanting to put a new ballroom in. This is something that isn't new. Presidents have talked about this. Clinton talked about this. Bush talked about this. Obama talked about this. Trump talked about this at Trump 45, and he said that he was going to do it. The difference was, is that the other presidents were wanting to do it with taxpayer payer dollars. The president's doing it with actual personal funds and some private funds.

And this isn't any different. If you remember, I believe it was Truman who, in 1948, did a complete renovation of the White House. The only thing he saved was the exterior walls. He changed the foundation. He changed the footprint. He completely demolished the entire side of the White House. And, by the way, remodels and expansions on the White House goes all the way back to Teddy Roosevelt. And if you remember correctly, in 1993, Bill Clinton and Hillary Clinton basically tore down the entire inside of the executive mansion at the White House and rebuilt it in 1993. And in 2009, Barack Obama refurbished the tennis courts, put in a basketball court and an outdoor kitchen for personal use. And, by the way, those are taxpayer or tax dollars that went to it, not private funds.

TAPPER: I'm not. Questioning whether or not President Trump has the authority nor am I questioning whether or not he's announced he's going to build this ballroom.

MULLIN: Then what was the conversation about if not question authority?

TAPPER: The question is -- no, the question is, should he have informed Congress, should he have told the American people, hey --

MULLIN: He did.

TAPPER: No. The specifically we're going to tear down the entire East Wing of the White House. That part we did not know.

MULLIN: Well, first of all, he did say he was going to be building it. He didn't tell us how he was going to fund it since he didn't come to Congress to ask for the funds. There wasn't specific ask that has to be made because, once again, there's a separation of powers, executive, you have legislative, you have judicial, right? Before the president can even come to the Capitol, he has to be invited. We know that because Nancy Pelosi wouldn't invite the president to come to the Capitol. And the same thing, we have to give notice before we go over to the executive buildings.

If he's not asking Congress for funding, which he didn't, then he really doesn't have to give us the details to it because we allocate the dollars. Without us allocating the dollars, it's a separation -- it's a complete separation of power. It's a separate branch of the government. He can do what he needs to do.

TAPPER: It's day 22 of this government shutdown.

[18:10:00]

More than 1 million federal workers are working right now without pay, or they're furloughed without pay. CNN spoke to one woman at a food bank event for federal workers in Maryland that actually ran out of food today. We spoke with her about the shutdown. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DENISE, DEFENSE DEPARTMENT EMPLOYEE: I've been in the federal government almost 40 years. I've never seen anything like this. I've never seen a shutdown that seems like it's so spiteful and mean.

I have to buy my medication and I've been postponing it, waiting to buy the medication because I'm thinking maybe we'll get back to work in the next week.

It doesn't matter whether you're Republican or Democratic, it doesn't matter. People are hurting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: That's a Pentagon employee. Putting politics aside, when people like Denise call your office, Oklahomans who are feeling this day-to-day, what are you telling them? Are you giving them resources? Are you telling them where they can go for financial support? What does the Senator do in such a situation?

MULLIN: Well, you can't put politics aside because, Jake, we'd love to, but this is what this is all about. This is exactly what Katherine Clark, the number two ranking Democrat in the House, said in an interview that this is, they know people are going to suffer, but this is the only leverage they have. You had Chuck Schumer who said that each day gets better for the Democrat Party that they stay shut down. This is all about politics for them.

If we can't negotiate when you're talking about political decisions, we are literally asking them to vote for the same bill, Jake, that Chuck Schumer wrote a year ago. This is a clean C.R. that they voted for in September that Chuck Schumer was a leader when he wrote it. They voted for it in December. They voted for it in January. They voted for it in March. And now they're not voting for it because it is all about politics for them.

It is shameful that the Democrat Party is literally holding the American people hostage for leverage, because, why, the number two ranking Democrat in the House admitted to it on national T.V. I don't know how you negotiate with that.

TAPPER: Without saying what I think about the Democrats' tactics, the difference in the legislation is since the Big, Beautiful Bill Act passed, Medicaid dollars have been reduced, and they're trying to -- they say they're trying to restore some of those Medicaid dollars to the budget. But let me just say, they also say that the main thing is they want to extend these Obamacare tax credits, because, otherwise, when those tax credits expire at the end of the year, millions of Americans are going to have much higher insurance premiums.

MULLIN: Well, let's think about that, that argument about putting dollars back in Medicaid, that's bull crap. Because keep in mind, the one big beautiful bill was passed underneath reconciliation, that deals with mandatory spending. We are shut down on discretionary spending, two separate buckets of dollars. So, that argument doesn't even fly. It doesn't make sense, and it's a flat out lie, and the Democrat Party knows that.

TAPPER: Senator Markwayne Mullin, Republican of Oklahoma, thank you, sir. I appreciate it.

MULLIN: Thank you.

TAPPER: A new report claims that nearly a third of ICE recruits are failing their physical fitness tests. We're going to break down the numbers with the reporter behind that story next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:15:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TODD LYONS, ACTING ICE DIRECTOR: Because there are so many criminal, illegal aliens that have been released in New York, so you will see us making those criminal arrests to make New York safe again.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: In our National Lead that is the acting director of ICE, Todd Lyons, earlier today on Fox, after protests broke out during an ice raid in New York City's Canal Street area earlier today. DHS, Department of Homeland Security, says nine migrants were arrested. This comes as DHS is working to beef up its ranks of ICE workers.

But new reporting from The Atlantic Magazine suggests that the agency is having a difficult time finding recruits who can pass the physical fitness test, quote, more than a third have failed so far, impeding the agency's plan to hire, train, and deploy 10,000 deportation officers by January.

Here now is Atlantic Staff Writer Nick Miroff, who covers immigration and the Department of Homeland Security for us. Nick, thanks for joining us.

So, some of the recruits, as you write, have been described as athletically allergic. And you note, to pass this physical fitness test, recruits have to do 15 pushups, 32 sit-ups, run 1.5 miles in 14 minutes. That's not really that tough. And you note that the standards had already been relaxed in order to boost numbers. Tell us more.

NICK MIROFF, STAFF WRITER, THE ATLANTIC: Yes, well, so part of the problem is that these applicants had to self-certify, as they call it. Basically, they had to attest that they can pass this fitness test before they were sent to the academy in Georgia. And what ICE was finding was that they had, in the words of an ICE official, misrepresented their athletic ability. And so they are making changes to try to prescreen these applicants before going through the trouble of sending them to the academy because so many are failing to pass the physical fitness test and others are dropping out for various reasons.

TAPPER: A Department of Homeland Security spokesperson told you that the one third failure rate reflected only, quote, a subset of candidates in initial basic academy classes, not all of their new hires. Is that accurate? What did you make of that response?

MIROFF: Yes. And that is because, you know, they intend to fill, you know, what they say, 85 percent of these 10,000 positions with police officers from other, you know, state, local agencies who have applied to, to switch jobs, to go and work for ICE and participate in this mass deportation campaign. And those officers are not going to be subjected to this same test at the academy. This is the test that they're giving to new hires who don't have any law enforcement experience. But we're going to go through a fast track training course there in Georgia and that's where they're having the most problems.

TAPPER: You also report that the Trump administration's cutting the training time from four months down to just eight weeks. Given the intense pressure facing ICE officers, are you concerned that DHS is cutting corners, and this actually would be a bad idea?

[18:20:00]

MIROFF: Well, I mean more than my concern, I spoke with veteran ICE officers and officials who are going to have to work alongside the new recruits, and they're the ones who are definitely worried about the aptitude and the fitness of the new hires that the agency is going to be putting on the street.

I mean, this is an extraordinary number of new hires. 10,000 new officers by January is basically more than doubling ICE's existing workforce. And given that the agency is already under all this strain and these officers are working, you know, long, you know, stressful shifts in order to try to meet the president's deportation goals and often, you know, facing off with angry crowds, protesters and things like that. You know, they're very worried about, you know, the new recruits they're going to be working alongside with.

TAPPER: All right. Nick Miroff from The Atlantic Magazine, thank you so much. I appreciate it.

MIROFF: Thank you. TAPPER: Breaking news in our World Lead, NATO Secretary General Mark Rutte just left his meeting with President Trump in the Oval Office. He's going to join us next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:25:00]

TAPPER: We're back with breaking news on our World Lead. During a meeting earlier today with NATO Secretary General Mark Rutte at the White House, just moments ago, President Trump addressed speculation amid reports stating that the U.S. might send -- might consider sending powerful long-range weapons to Ukraine.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: The problem with the Tomahawk that a lot of people don't know, it'll take a minimum of six months, usually a year to learn how to use them. They're highly complex. So, the only way a Tomahawk is going to be shot is if we shot it, and we're not going to do that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Joining us now to discuss NATO Secretary General Mark Rutte. Secretary General, thanks for joining us.

So, President Trump also announced that he's canceled his meeting with Putin. He didn't have a good feeling about it. How do you feel your meeting went with the president?

MARK RUTTE, NATO SECRETARY GENERAL: It was a very good meeting. The president since he came into office in February, he started -- in January, in February, he started to have a dialogue with President Putin. And I think he was the only one who really could open up that channel of communication. He has always been in very close contact with President Zelenskyy. And what he said last Friday and Sunday, which is basically telling the two parties, the Russians and the Ukrainians, stop where you are was exactly right. And we know that Ukrainians want to play ball. And it seems with the Russians that a little bit of more pressure is needed to get them there. And I think what happened today, the sanctions on oil companies will help.

TAPPER: President Trump seemed to suggest, and I'm putting words in his mouth, but he seemed to suggest he's sick of Putin lying to him. I mean, that's in not so many words, that's what he said. He said something like, speaking of honesty, you talk to Putin and he says one thing, and then it's not matched with action. This, of course, is what Putin has been doing for years in terms of people trying to end this war. I wonder if you think these current sanctions will be enough to ratchet up the pressure to convince Putin to stop or even more sanctions are needed.

RUTTE: Well, it maybe in itself it is important, but let's see what happens. But we have seen in the recent past when it came to Alaska, Alaska happened when the president decided to put secondary tariffs on India. We saw a phone call last week that happened when the president started to contemplate yes or no sending Tomahawk myself into Ukraine. So, it means you can change Putin's calculus, you can change his way how he wants to end the war.

And I think what we discussed today, and the president and I are in complete agreement on this, sustained pressure is needed, the Europeans doing more and more here, which is important to today, the 19th sanction package by the Europeans being announced. So, collectively, we have step-by-step get relations to the table, and, of course, the Ukrainians who already said they want to sit down.

TAPPER: I certainly see how you can argue that President Trump has upped the pressure on Putin with the sanctions on India, the secondary sanctions, and also today the oil sanctions, but where is the evidence that Putin has changed any of his behavior?

RUTTE: What we have seen is his going into Alaska, the phone call last Thursday, which hastily came about after the president announced that he was contemplating sending these Tomahawk long-range missiles to Ukraine for them to be used. Yes or no? Not yet decided, but it was something he contemplated, he pondered to do. And you see therefore that when Putin feels under threat that he feel things are moving in the wrong direction, that he then starts to react and act. When the president said Russia is a paper tiger, it was the Russians who said, no, we are not a paper tiger. We are a bear, which, of course, is silly because a bear is very easily recognizable. You don't have to explain it to anyone. So, all of these shows that they are not on a sure footing, the Russians, and the economy is not doing well.

TAPPER: Speaking of the Tomahawk missiles, you have said it's not NATO's place to litigate which weapons the U.S. sends to Ukraine. We did see these horrible images today of Russian strikes under kindergarten. Ukrainian President Zelenskyy says that Putin is continuing these attacks because he's not feeling enough pressure. You heard President Trump suggest that Tomahawks are not on the table. It does seem that they might make a difference though.

RUTTE: Well, again, it is up to inevitable (ph) countries and let's never think that one specific weapon system will change the whole war. If it was that easy, then we would have ended it when the German sent Leopards II, when the Dutch and the Danes sent the F-16s. These systems are important. They will absolutely help to bring this war to an end, but in itself, one weapon system will never end it.

And I think what the president should explain today is that for the Tomahawk system, and he was completely right here, it takes month for anyone other than American soldiers to be trained on them.

[18:30:00]

So, it is not that if you decide today that Ukrainians can use them tomorrow.

TAPPER: President Trump said that he thinks Chinese President Xi Jinping, with whom the president's meeting next week, could have a, quote, big influence on Putin. Do you think roping Xi into these negotiations, who, of course, has his own not so secret ambitions to seize Taiwan, do you think that's a good idea?

RUTTE: Well, I think President Xi is a key enabler of the war effort through sanction circumvention, through dual use goods, the Chinese delivery into Ukraine. They work together with North Korea, with Iran supporting the war efforts. And to your point of Tehran (ph), we all know that the old thinking that you have the Euro-Atlantic, NATO and then you have Indo-Pacific, and they're totally separate, that is really all thinking. We know that the theaters are more and more interconnected.

So, the president of the United States sitting down with the general secretary of the Communist Party of China next week is important, and I'm absolutely convinced, and the president said so much in the pressure this afternoon that Russia and Ukraine will be on the table.

TAPPER: Obviously, President Trump's relationship with NATO has had its ups and downs. How are you feeling about the U.S.-NATO relationship right now?

RUTTE: I would argue it has never been better thanks to President Trump. Because I know from President Trump 45 when I was still prime minister, he was totally committed to NATO, but he irritated the fact that Europeans and the Canadians were not paying the same as the Americans. At the NATO summit in The Hague, we collectively decided to move to 5 percent, including 3.5 percent spent on the core defense spending that equalizes what the Europeans and Canada are doing with what the United States are spending.

So, since Eisenhower, so over 70 years, this has been a big pebble in issue, a big irritant in the relationship within NATO. President Trump, I think, had one of his biggest foreign policy successes at that NATO summit in The Hague, convincing the other 31 to collectively move to this 5 percent. And you see it today, the Europeans stepping up when it comes to weapons into Ukraine, buying from America, when it comes to coming together, discussing whatever they can do in terms of security assurances for Ukraine post the ceasefire slash a peace deal. This is all evidence. Europeans are stepping up under President Trump's leadership.

TAPPER: NATO Secretary General Mark Rutte, thank you so much. I appreciate it, sir.

We're just minutes away --

RUTTE: Thank you so much.

TAPPER: -- from the final debate in the race for New York City mayor. Coming up next, I'm going to be joined by a rabbi who has a stark warning for his congregants about one of the candidates.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:35:00]

TAPPER: In our Politics Lead, cue the music please, there it is, CNN's election night jam. Election Day's only 12 days away. Just minutes from now, the three men running for mayor of New York are going to face off in their second and final debate with New Yorkers set to start casting early ballots as soon as Saturday. Democrat nominee Zohran Mamdani maintains double digit leads in polls, which President Trump says spells bad news for Republican Candidate Curtis Sliwa, not to mention independent candidate, disgraced former Governor Andrew Cuomo.

Here now is Rabbi Elliot Cosgrove from Park Avenue Synagogue. And, Rabbi Cosgrove, I should note we have repeatedly asked Mamdani to come on the show for an interview for months and Cuomo for that matter, for years, and neither of them have come on. Sliwa came on yesterday. This is obviously a very important race. The reason we invited you is because you took to your pulpit this last Sabbath, sharing your belief that Mamdani is a threat to the Jewish community. Why do you think that?

RABBI ELLIOT COSGROVE, PARK AVENUE SYNAGOGUE: Thanks for having me, Jake. It is my opinion that Zohran Mamdani poses a threat to the security of the New York Jewish community because his repeated refusal to disavow terms, like globalize the intifada, his thrice repeated at last week's debate, accusation, false allegation of genocide at Israel's heels, his call to arrest Prime Minister Netanyahu should he step into New York, should Mamdani be mayor. These are attacks, not just on Israel, but on the Jewish body politic.

As a rabbi, you know, to tell me that that somehow it's okay to be a Jew but not to accept Israel is a preposterous claim to no more than I could disavow scripture or God or the Commandments, or any other pillar of my faith. Israel is part and parcel to what it means to be a Jew.

TAPPER: So, Cuomo has been going at Mamdani on this issue. I want to play part of an exchange between Cuomo and Mamdani during the last debate. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDREW CUOMO (I), NEW YORK CITY MAYORAL CANDIDATE: I know there are many Jewish people who believe he is anti-Semitic, I believe, not condemning the globalized intifada, what he has said about Hamas.

ZOHRAN MAMDANI (D), NEW YORK CITY MAYORAL CANDIDATE: I have denounced Hamas again and it will never be enough for Andrew Cuomo.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Has Mamdani denounced Hamas enough for you?

COSGROVE: No. I think that his -- on the Hamas issue specifically, you know, it's a terrorist organization and it should be condemned repeatedly and never enough. But I think to myself what would happen. We have a Celebrate Israel Parade in New York every year, tens of thousands of Jews show up and we express our support for the state of Israel and I'm deeply fearful as to what would happen under a Mamdani administration for those and other public expressions of support for the state of Israel. TAPPER: A recent Fox News poll shows that among New York Jewish voters, Cuomo leads, but it is within the margin of error. Independent Candidate Cuomo, 42 percent, Democrat Zohran Mamdani, 38 percent, Sliwa with 13 percent.

[18:40:04]

It seems like a lot of your fellow New York Jews disagree with you.

COSGROVE: Yes. No, this is a tough one because I think that there are many Jews, right, my community, I'm in a way preaching to the choir, but the polls show that the Jewish community is divided, which is why my call to action for my community is to network, to leverage whatever sphere of influence that have those conversations.

There are young Jews who legitimately feel alienated from the Netanyahu government. There are Jews of New York who feel that they are voting for the mayor of New York, not the mayor of Jerusalem. And in this instance, I wish to God that this was just about sanitation or transportation or policing or all the issues that a mayoral election should be about. But there are issues of Jewish concern on the docket Jewish security on the docket. And I think this is an election unlike any other election that the Jewish community needs to put self-concern at the forefront of a range of competing and legitimate concerns that every New Yorker holds.

TAPPER: Rabbi Cosgrove, thank you so much for your time. I appreciate it.

Coming up next, I'm going to be joined live by the co-author of Virginia Giuffre's memoir to break down the new allegations she made against Jeffrey Epstein and the other powerful people who may have been involved in his crimes.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:45:22]

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Continuing our focus on Jeffrey Epstein and our law and justice lead. Virginia Giuffre's harrowing posthumous memoir, "Nobody's Girl", is out now, is published yesterday, gives an in-depth look into Epstein's sex trafficking ring.

Giuffre wrote about Epstein showing her hidden doorway inside a massage room at his Palm Beach residence. Giuffre described it as a trophy closet, which she described as being overfilled with pictures of naked young girls. Quote, "I turned to him speechless. He didn't speak either, but the smug look on his face said, look at my conquests. Look at how powerful I am," unquote.

Giuffre died by suicide in April. She was only 41 years old and left behind three children.

The coauthor of her book, "Nobody's Girl", Amy Wallace, joins us now.

Amy, thank you so much on what must be a experience of very mixed emotions. I mean, you're getting a lot of attention for this book, which is important, but obviously Virginia is not here to go through it with you.

She -- you spent four years working on this with her.

AMY WALLACE, CO-AUTHOR, "NOBODY'S GIRL": I did. Yeah.

TAPPER: Giuffre's a longtime lawyer told me yesterday how bittersweet this all is. How are you doing in this moment, given your partner's absence? And what kind of reactions are you getting from the memoir?

WALLACE: I am, I've given a lot of interviews in the past couple of days, and, I'm a ghostwriter. I'm supposed to be invisible, and that's the way I like it. I wish that this was Virginia sitting here in this seat. So, it's tragic that she died so young. And I cared very much for her. So, it's hard in that way.

On the other hand, I'm fiercely protective of her, and it's an honor to be able to speak up for -- for her legacy and for her voice, which is living on in this book.

TAPPER: So, yesterday, I spoke with a different Epstein survivor, Jess Michaels, about the memoir. I want you to take a listen to one thing she told me that I thought was interesting.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JESS MICHAELS, EPSTEIN SURVIVOR: I think what's going to happen with this book is its going to be sex trafficking 101 for the wealthy, how to get away with it. I think it's going to be a book that I hope parents read and learn from, that I hope law enforcement, attorneys, justice systems, justices, criminology classes actually use this book as a way to try to understand the victim's perspective.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: And one of the things Jess said in the interview was how important it was that Virginia provided the explanation of how people get groomed and become strongly complicit in their own victimization.

WALLACE: Yeah, Virginia is really, really eloquent about this. I mean, this is in some ways a predator's playbook, as the other person, you just --

TAPPER: Yeah, Jess Michaels.

WALLACE: Yeah. Jess. Jess who I've never met, but I admire her. It's a predator's playbook about how you procure, how you then manipulate, how you threaten, how you degrade, but also how you groom. And part of the grooming is you choose women a lot of the time, who are already vulnerable or who are financially desperate. And then you tell them, even as you're degrading them sexually, you tell them, we see something in you.

There's a class issue here. We're wealthy. Our opinion matters. You're poor. We see something in you, and we could help you get to this better life. You're special.

And Virginia writes very honestly about how even as she was in fear of her life, even as she was being brutalized by trafficked to men, to strangers walking into massage rooms, not even knowing who the naked man was on the table, being told to sexually service at the same time, she would come back from some of those incidents, and Epstein would say, you did a good job. You're a best girl. That kind of validation for a lot of these girls, they either hadn't heard it at all, or they had not heard it enough.

TAPPER: So, you have said that you have tapes of Giuffre naming her abusers in ways that the book does not name them. Partly because she was afraid of repercussions and partly, I assume, the publisher, Penguin Random House, I assume, there was some legal, involvement of what you could say and what you could not say.

It doesn't appear as though the FBI or the Justice Department, which also know these names, is going to share them. It does not appear we're ever going to get these Epstein files released. I mean, even if the House does eventually vote on it, still has to get through the Senate. And then President Trump has to sign it.

How are we ever going to learn the names of these people?

WALLACE: Well, I still haven't given up hope that the Epstein files are going to be released. I know it looks maybe unlikely, but there is a clamoring out there.

[18:50:00]

And it's a bipartisan clamoring. It is not just one side or another. People are sick of the fact that learning that wealthy people get to play by a different set of rules, and this has been this has been something that's in our culture for a long time. This is just a particularly egregious example of that. Wealthy, powerful men got to rape children, period.

TAPPER: Right.

WALLACE: So those names are in the files. I know, I know all the names for the Virginia knew, and that Virginia told me, and I know them, and so does the FBI, and so does the Department of Justice. They are in whatever those files are. We keep calling about the file. I don't know if there are 12 file cabinets.

TAPPER: Right.

WALLACE: I don't know if there's videotapes in there. There may well be, but they know those names, and not just because Virginia told them, but because victim after victim after victim have bravely come forward and named those people, saw who was in the houses, knows, knows who hung around a lot, knows who went into the cabanas with girls, underage girls. Knows who went into the bedrooms in the Manhattan townhouse.

So -- so that information exists. And I think obviously, any victim that comes forward in any case, not just Epstein and Maxwell's abuse, has to weigh the cost of -- I want to hold my abusers to account, but what is it going to cost me? In Virginia's case, it cost her her privacy, obviously. It cost her her safety. She was -- she got credible death threats from the FBI her family rents a camper van and flees into the wilds of Australia for three weeks.

They have three kids. They're in school. They have to finally come home. They don't have any protection. Their house is broken into. There was a -- there was a constant drumbeat.

And she was also directly threatened by people saying, take your name, take our names out of your mouth --

TAPPER: Yeah.

WALLACE: -- or we will keep you in deposition hell for the rest of your life.

So, she had to weigh all of those things. And those are decisions that she made and that I honored in the book. But yes, there were a lot of conversations about it.

TAPPER: Amy Wallace, thanks for being here. And may Virginia's memory be a blessing. We appreciate it.

We'll be right back.

WALLACE: Thank you. Thank you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:56:21]

TAPPER: In our national lead, the International Chess Federation announced that they're looking into allegations of bullying -- bullying of Daniel Naroditsky, the American grandmaster who passed away suddenly on Sunday. While no cause of death has been released, many in the community have voiced concerns about what they call the harassment of him by another grandmaster, Russia's Vladimir Kramnik. Kramnik denies any allegations of bullying or name calling.

Joining us to discuss is the president of the International Chess Federation, Arkady Dvorkovich.

Arkady, thanks for joining us.

So, Kramnik has publicly and repeatedly accused Naroditsky of cheating during online matches. Now, allegations that Naroditsky denied up to his last live stream before he passed away.

Did your organization look into these accusations?

ARKADY DVORKOVICH, PRESIDENT, FIDE/INTERNATIONAL CHESS FEDERATION: First of all, my deepest condolences to the family and friends, with Daniel Naroditsky passing away. He was a bright person, grandmaster, educator commentator he was loved by many. And yes, indeed, we started looking into that quite a while ago. As,

we thought that Vladimir's accusations reckless and ungrounded. And now our fair play commission is looking into that. And, I personally and our management board decided to pass it to our ethics commission for investigation, independent investigation.

We do believe that any kind of bullying harassment is intolerable in any -- well, life activity in sports, in chess in particular.

TAPPER: Other grandmasters have commented on Kramnik's alleged harassment and bullying. Recently, India's Nihal Sarin told "The Indian Express", quote, he meaning Vladimir Kramnik, has kind of literally taken a life, unquote. If your investigation finds evidence of harassment and bullying, what kind of punishment might Kramnik face?

DVORKOVICH: Well, in our system, as in any other systems, it's an independent investigation. And the kind of, justice framework that we have. So, I cannot preempt what they are going to decide. But any kind of sanction is possible.

Again, we are talking about our community where we have a family of chess players. Family of grandmasters, top players, amateur players, and any kind of such behavior, cannot be tolerated by anyone. But again, it's up to our independent judges to decide what kind of sanction they can impose.

TAPPER: International Chess Federation President Arkady Dvorkovich, thank you so much. Really appreciate it.

And for all of you watching, if you or anyone you know is in need of help, you can call or text the suicide crisis lifeline at 988. The number again 988. You can call or text anytime, talk to a professional for free. There is help for you. There is love for you.

In our pop culture lead today, NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell was asked about Bad Bunny performing at the Super Bowl halftime show. It's a decision that has garnered some criticism from President Trump and his supporters.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROGER GODDELL, NFL COMMISSIONER: He's one of the leading and most popular entertainers in the world. That's -- that's what we try to achieve. It's an important stage for us. It's an important element to the entertainment value. It's carefully thought through. I would say that I'm not sure we've ever selected an artist where we didn't have some blowback or criticism.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: The Super Bowl takes place February 8th.

"ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT" starts now.