Return to Transcripts main page

The Lead with Jake Tapper

Rep. Ro Khanna (D-CA) Is Interviewed About House Expected To Vote Tomorrow On Deal To Reopen Govt., Epstein Files Petition Nears Key Threshold As Shutdown End Looms; Financial Times: Trump Donors Receiving Benefits From WH Moves; Saluting Two U.S. Army Veterans After Decades Of Service; British Suspend Some Intel Sharing With U.S. Over Boat Strikes; FDA Remove Black Box Warning Labels From Many Hormone Treatments For Menopause. Aired 5-6p ET

Aired November 11, 2025 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KASIE HUNT, CNN HOST: To the wars that they fought in. They do it completely full of -- free of charge. If you ever have a chance to be at the airport, one of these flights arrives, it's a really, really special experience.

And just on a personal note, on this Veterans Day, I'd like to honor my late grandfather. He was awarded the Purple Heart in World War II. And I think regularly about the values that he and all of his comrades in arms fought for in Europe and in the Pacific, and I just hope that we all hold those values close as we navigate today's turbulent world.

Thanks very much to my panel. Jake Tapper is standing by for "The Lead." Hi, Jake.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Kasie, I have a 101-year-old World War II veteran live in studio this hour, 101. He fought in Europe. We'll see you back in "The Arena" tomorrow.

HUNT: See you soon.

[17:00:49]

TAPPER: A big vote on Capitol Hill. The Lead starts right now.

All eyes on the House of Representatives. Will any Democrats there follow the eight Democratic senators who broke ranks and sided with Republicans on reopening the federal government, though they failed to secure what the whole shutdown was about, according to Democrats, getting an extension on those health care insurance subsidies? Plus, a CNN, how the United Kingdom is cutting off the U.S. when it comes to the deadly boat strikes, keeping intel from the U.S., questioning the legality of the attacks. And on this Veterans Day, that 101-year-old U.S. army veteran who served in a segregated unit going to be here on The Lead with this incredible story right here in studio.

Welcome to The Lead. I'm Jake Tapper. And to all the veterans out there, we salute your service and we thank you for it. We'll have much more on Veterans Day in a sec.

In the meantime, it is currently day 42 of the longest government shutdown in American history. Will this finally end on day 43? That's when the House is set to vote on the funding package that would reopen the government. If it passes, that would be the final step before the legislation heads to the Resolute desk, where President Trump is expected to sign it. The Senate passed this bill last night with the help of eight moderate Democrats who gave up on the party's demand for guaranteed extensions of Obamacare subsidies, which are set to expire at the end of the year.

They got some concessions, including a separate Senate vote on the Obamacare subsidy extensions, but that vote is only guaranteed in the Senate. This angered House Democrats who are vowing to fight against this deal.

So House Speaker Mike Johnson is going to have to wrangle this deal across the finish line, given Republicans hold such a narrow majority. It's unclear whether any Democrats will cross over to support this compromise. A lot's at stake no matter what happens. If the government reopens, Democrats and even some moderate House Republicans say countless Americans will be hurt by the rising health care insurance premiums. If the government stays closed, government workers continue without paychecks, millions of Americans will continue to not get food stamps and this air travel chaos will become even more untenable.

Today, preemptive cuts to domestic flights increased to 6 percent. That's on top of delays from staffing shortages. Even if the shutdown ends this week, experts including Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy say the window for sufficient recovery before Thanksgiving is rather narrow. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEAN DUFFY, TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY: I'm concerned that we're not going to have on day one controllers come back into the towers right away. I'm asking them to do that. President Trump has asked them to do that. It is their jobs and they will be paid. But it might not be immediate that they come back in.

We're going to start to alleviate the restrictions that we're at 6 percent now. We'll alleviate that only when the data says we should.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Let's discuss with Democratic Congressman Ro Khanna of California.

Congressman, thanks for joining us. You've been adamant that Democrats in the House should continue to demand that there is an extension of the Obamacare subsidies that is set to expire at the end of the year. Can we assume you're going to vote against this bill, effectively voting to keep the government closed? And what's your message to the approximately 5,300 federal government employees in your district who are not getting paid in the shutdown?

REP. RO KHANNA (D-CA): Jake, first let me just thank all the veterans out there today and especially the 101-year-old World War II veteran in your studio. What an incredible story. Let me say this, I am going to vote no because I believe we need to make sure that health care premiums don't spike. There's a taxi driver in Arizona who has cancer whose health care premium literally will spike from $44 a month to $2,600 a month. Now, I believe we could keep government open by voting to pay the federal workers, by voting for SNAP benefits to be extended, by voting to pay our troops. There's no reason Speaker Johnson had to shut down the House of Representatives. Let's vote on that but let's continue to negotiate so that the premiums don't spike.

[17:05:02]

TAPPER: You've called on Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer to step aside. You say he's no longer effective as a leader. Explain this for our viewers because he did vote against this compromise that you oppose. Why are you mad at him?

KHANNA: Jake, you've covered politics a long time. Yes, he voted no, but eight senators who said they consulted him daily go and vote yes. One of those people is his number two. He's not going to do that without Senator Schumer sign off. And then, conveniently, all eight of those senators aren't up for reelection in 2026.

This is the D.C. way. Senator Schumer could have blocked this if he had wanted to. And one of the challenges is, in addition to the health care premium spikes, it undermines the narrative that this was a Trump shutdown. If eight Republicans -- eight Democratic senators could have ended it, we should have kept the pressure on.

TAPPER: Well, yesterday, Senator Bernie Sanders, when I asked him about your call for Schumer to step down, he told me that while he and Schumer have very different ideas about what the Democratic Party should stand for, progressives in the Senate are a minority. He said maybe only eight or nine votes. So who do you think could and should be the Senate Minority Leader?

KHANNA: Well, look, they're already annoyed enough that a House Democrat is calling for the Senate Minority Leader to step down. So I don't want to hurt anyone's chances. But there are plenty of good people. Senator Van Hollen, Senator Chris Murphy, Elizabeth Warren, of course, Bernie Sanders, in my view, should have been president. I was a co-chair of his campaign.

But here's the point. We need fresh faces. We need new leadership. I have a lot of respect for Senator Schumer's 50 years of service, the Inflation Reduction Act, the CHIPS Act, none of that would have passed without him. But he's not the right face for the moment and he's not the right face for the future.

TAPPER: If any Democrats in the House cross over and vote with Republicans, will you call on House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries to step down?

KHANNA: No, because Hakeem Jeffries has made it very clear that he's opposed to this deal and he's pushing it and he's publicly fighting. Senator Schumer didn't do that. He didn't make the case to the eight senators who crossed over saying, no, don't do this. This is going to hurt our unity. Hakeem Jeffries, I'll tell you, I'm seeing it, they are trying to get every single Democrat to be on the same page.

TAPPER: You're on the House Oversight Committee where you and your Republican colleague Thomas Massie of Kentucky, you only need one more signature on what's called a discharge petition. And that 218th signature would force a full House vote on legislation to release the Epstein files. You could get that final signature soon, maybe even tomorrow, once Congresswoman-elect Adelita Grijalva of Arizona is finally sworn in. What do you have planned for this moment, if anything?

KHANNA: We will get that signature tomorrow. And then early next week, Thomas Massie, myself and Marjorie Taylor Greene are going to have a press conference with the survivors to make sure that we have an overwhelming vote in the House to release these files. Seven days after Adelita signs it, we will be able to get a vote in the House of Representatives. That will be around December 3rd.

And I expect once we get that vote, we will get 50 to 60 Republicans voting with us. It will be a huge step in getting the release of the Epstein files, justice for the survivors, protecting America's children.

TAPPER: Democratic Congressman Ro Khanna of California, thank you, sir.

KHANNA: Thank you, Jake.

TAPPER: Once the shutdown does end, what will it take to restart government agencies? The head of the Department of Veterans affairs will join me on this Veterans Day. Plus the new report revealing some of the names giving money to Trump causes and some of the actions that followed in some cases just days after the donations.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:12:56]

TAPPER: In our national lead, an end to the record long government shutdown appears to be in sight. Federal agencies will now have to make up for more than 42 days without many in their workforce. At the Department of Veterans Affairs, nearly 37,000 workers have been furloughed working without pay. Here with me now, Veterans Affairs Secretary Doug Collins, who is himself a veteran of both the Navy and Air Force Reserves where he served as a chaplain.

Thank you so much for being here, Secretary Collins. What is the plan right now for getting that many VA employees back to work as quickly as possible once the government reopens?

DOUG COLLINS, VETERANS AFFAIRS SECRETARY: Well, for us it's just as simple as we're going to get a team's message out, e-mail message out. As soon as we get funded, we're putting them back to work. So, you know, my hope would be as we start getting people back in as early as Thursday and definitely by Friday. We already made arrangements when we get our funding to get them in the next paycheck, make up the back pay, get them back going because our veterans are too important for us to wait around.

TAPPER: I saw something on C-SPAN earlier that I wondered what you thought about it. Paul Rieckhoff, who used to be with Iraq and Afghanistan veterans, he's now the founder of Independent Veterans for America. He talked to C-SPAN today about the prevailing feeling of job insecurity at the VA over the last year. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL RIECKHOFF, INDEPENDENT VETERANS FOR AMERICA FOUNDER: The folks who work at VA are heroes and they need to be treated as such, not demonized as lazy federal workers. So many veterans want to continue to serve and they do so at the Veterans Affairs Department. I think it's really important that we hold them up, we protect them and we understand that a lot of them have been waiting for a DOGE guillotine to come by and fire them. That's been a really uncertain environment for them for the last, you know, 10, 11 months. I think that's really hurting retention.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Do you worry at all that the shutdown may have exacerbated any sense of uncertainty and could have led or lead to even more of the VA workforce leaving?

COLLINS: No, I don't. And I resent the fact of what Paul says, just talking out of his own head, not having really any facts. I mean, he can have his opinion. He's entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts. We had 30,000 people.

You and I have talked about this. He took early retirement and we're made it better and making sure that it has been. I've said it every day almost that I talk about how valuable our VA workers are, how we've been able to lower backlogs, how we've been able to increase our veterans health care.

[17:15:10]

And to make a statement like that is really offensive. And if he wants to do that, fine. But you know, again, you're entitled to your own opinion, just not your own facts. This shutdown has been bad from the Democratic perspective of shutting the government down. It's bad for any federal worker.

I don't care if you're veterans or not, because it's just not good to have this situation, especially when it could have been avoided.

So look, the VA is moving up. We're doing more things to help our employees actually get stuff. One of my favorite questions to all of my VA employees is, what are you doing that is stupid? What are you doing that you don't really need to be doing so that we can free you up to be the very best employees that you have? But to have comments like that, just to make a statement, you know, that's just sad. TAPPER: The president, President Trump, made this remark at today's Veterans Day event at Arlington National Cemetery about the VA under President Biden. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We fired thousands of people who didn't take care of our great veterans. They were sadists, they were sick people, they were thieves. They were everything you want to name.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: So I'm not sure what he's talking about there. Do you -- do you know what he's talking about?

COLLINS: I am. I'm very familiar with that. We had people, we had nurses showing up in OR drunk. We had people who were treating and mistreating veterans in the hospitals. We had people who were stealing from us.

Those were what he was talking about. And these were the ones that were fired under the Accountability Act when I was still in Congress and the VA did this and when they were got back, the unions all appealed and was upset. Even some gross negligence that was happening to our veteran care and yet they were brought back and given back pay by the previous administration. That's just, again, it just shows you a difference.

If you do something wrong and hurt my veterans now or you hurt my other VA employees, you're going to be -- you're going -- we're going to get you to -- show you the door so you can go find another career, but you're not going to do that on our watch.

TAPPER: Today is Veterans Day, obviously the more than 900,000 veterans who rely on the GI Bill hotline have not been able to utilize it during the shutdown for help with their benefits. It's been totally turned off. When the shutdown ends, will that service be turned back on? Will there be a backlog of veterans who need it --

COLLINS: Of course.

TAPPER: -- who, you know, well, obviously that backlog might slow down the system. What's your take on all that?

COLLINS: No, it's going to be turned on immediately. We're going to have them back. And we're actually -- I've already talked to Margarita who runs our VBA, which handles educational event, and we're already looking at putting in overtime. We're actually looking at putting in more help in the short run to get that backlog down.

Look, anybody on the Hill who voted to shut this down and then claims today how much they truly like veterans, I mean, they really need to assess what they're saying there because that's not the way you do it, especially when you have transition veterans, Jake. I know you -- this is something near to your heart as well. We've talked about suicide and death by suicide. When you're having that transition time, when they're trying to get into civilian career and can't access those benefits or have somebody to talk to give them the help going forward, that's not helping anybody. That's hurting them.

TAPPER: Yes. And we should note that critical services such as VA medical centers, outpatient clinics and suicide prevention have remained open during the shutdown.

COLLINS: Yes.

TAPPER: VA Secretary Doug Collins, thank you so much.

COLLINS: You got it.

TAPPER: And once again, thank you for your service, sir.

COLLINS: Jake, thank you. Appreciate it.

TAPPER: From a ballroom makeover to political action committees, a new report is breaking down some of the big money donors to President Trump related causes and the actions that followed some of those contributions. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:22:56]

TAPPER: Topping our money lead today, $116 million, $116 million. That's how much at least 30 individuals or companies have donated to Trump related causes and who have received benefits or advantages perhaps tied to that donation, although we can't prove that, but definitely as a result of action taken by the Trump administration. That's according to an explosive report from the Financial Times. Its analysis finding that in some cases the Trump administration took action in support of these contributors within days of the donations. So just who are these donors?

Where's the money going? Let's start with the donors. They include some of America's wealthiest companies, big tech firms, crypto billionaires, big tobacco, medical industry conglomerates, as well as certain individuals who have received pardons. This is electric vehicle entrepreneur Trevor Milton, convicted of defrauding investors in 2023. According to the Financial Times, Milton donated nearly $1 million to a Trump aligned PAC in October of last year.

And then this March, Milton received a presidential pardon. And the SEC dropped its case against him in September. That $160 million has poured into various Trump aligned groups, including his MAGA Inc. Super PAC inauguration fund, his presidential library. There's also the hundreds of millions given by a slew of major companies to fund Trump's proposed White House ballroom, many of which have business before or are greatly impacted by decisions by the Trump administration.

In a statement to CNN, White House Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt says, quote, "The media's continued attempts to fabricate conflicts of interest are irresponsible and reinforce the public's distrust in what they read. Neither the president nor his family have ever engaged or will ever engage in conflicts of interest," unquote.

Of course, this sort of you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours kind of relationship. Nothing new in Washington, D.C. but ethics groups tell the Financial Times that the scale of Trump donors benefiting so openly from White House actions seems unparalleled, prompting the question as to whether President Trump drained the swamp or just appointed himself chief alligator.

[17:25:13]

We're joined now by one of the co-authors of this Financial Times report, Financial Times investigative reporter Paul Caruana Galizia.

Paul, you write that there is no evidence of any bribery or illegal conduct on the part of the Trump administration. We want to underline that. In a statement to the Financial Times, the White House rejected any claims of doing favors, saying, quote, "any allegations of special treatment are false and lack a basis in reality," unquote. So what exactly are you laying out in this report?

PAUL CARUANA GALIZIA, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER, FINANCIAL TIMES: Well, thanks for having me on, first of all. What we laid out is this very clear pattern which you described briefly a few moments ago, where we noticed money pouring in to Trump's inauguration funds and super PACs aligned to him.

And then sometimes in a matter of weeks, policies changing or investigations being dropped, ones that were into companies connected to these donors. And again, sometimes it was really a matter of weeks that, say a financial services firm, usually cryptocurrency firms, make large donations to Trump via his super PACs aligned to him, his inauguration fund, and then the SEC drops an investigation into that company. So we've really laid out a very clear pattern of this happening, really spanning from the time before his election, the time after his inauguration, and one that's still happening now.

TAPPER: So crypto is a big part of the story in ways in which Trump is now deeply connected with the crypto industry, including with the Tyler and Cameron Winklevoss twins. People might remember them from the Facebook movie the Social Network. You write that the Winklevoss twins have donated at least 3 million to Trump PACs. They declined to comment for your article. What has their relationship with the administration been?

CARUANA GALIZIA: So the Winklevoss twins have long been donors to Trompoline super pacs, again from November last year. So they have a close donor relationship with this current administration. They feature in our article because over this period they donated, like you said, about $3 million, including $1 million alone, to MAGA Inc. in January. So just weeks later, the SEC closed a very long running investigation into a crypto exchange they own, Gemini, which is now listed on Nasdaq.

TAPPER: So how is what we're seeing from Trump any different from previous administrations? Because big money and favors, this is not new to Washington.

CARUANA GALIZIA: That's right. And it's a very good question, and it's one we ask throughout the piece. It's a question we asked of lawyers and ethics experts and like you say, there's always been a kind of expectation that donors will see their causes pushed through into policy. What's really different qualitatively this time is the scale, right? So the total sums of money flowing into super PACs and inauguration funds. So we give the example that Trump's inauguration fund reached a record $240 million in donations, compared to $62 million to Biden's.

And the kind of open transactionalism, as one ethics experts described it --

TAPPER: Interesting.

CARUANA GALIZIA: -- in that it's a kind of overt transaction that the money goes in, the regulations change, the investigations are dropped. I think that's a qualitative difference in that it's now openly the way things are working.

TAPPER: Paul Caruana Galizia of the Financial Times, thanks so much. Appreciate it.

Coming up next on this Veterans Day, an Army veteran who is 101 years old, he met Macron (ph) at Normandy a year ago. He's going to join me here in studio next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: In our National Lead, on this Veterans Day, we are today saluting a 101-year-old military veteran for his contribution towards keeping our nation safe and the world a better place.

Dr. Arlester Brown, known as Tech 5 Arlester Brown when he served, was a quartermaster engineer in the U.S. Army. He served in World War II with the 599th Quartermaster Laundry Company. It was an all-black unit. The military was segregated in those days. An all-black unit that helped keep clothing for troops and supplies in line.

Today, Dr. Brown was supposed to be honored at an event in Northern Virginia, but organizers postponed it because of the government shutdown. But we are going to honor him here on The Lead. Dr. Brown joins me live in studio along with another Army veteran, Claradith Landry, who was helping to organize today's event. Thank you to both of you for being here. Thank you for your service.

DR. ARLESTER BROWN, WORLD WAR II VETERAN: I'm just glad we won the war.

TAPPER: As am I. As am I, sir. So let me start. The U.S. military was obviously still segregated when you were drafted in 1942. Did you or your unit receive any recognition or honors when you returned from Europe?

[17:35:01] BROWN: No.

TAPPER: None at all?

BROWN: None.

TAPPER: And how would you say the world is today in 2025 compared to when you got back from the war? Have we made some progress? Are we a little bit better now?

BROWN: Oh, we've made excellent progress from back in the 40s up until now.

TAPPER: And Claradith, you deployed to Iraq after college. You're also the daughter of a veteran. Tell us about your organization, the Celebration of Service Event Series. What -- what inspired you to start that?

CLARADITH LANDRY, U.S. ARMY VETERAN: Well, Jake, number one, thank you for having us.

TAPPER: Oh, my God. The honor is 100 percent mine. I'm -- I don't know if you can tell how excited I am about this interview, but thank you for being here.

LANDRY: Really, it truly is an honor to be here. And -- and as you said, it's important to celebrate. And that's really the nexus. That's the genesis of the Celebration of Service Event Series.

And how did I get here? I mean, service is in my blood. I'm third generation military service member.

TAPPER: Third generation.

LANDRY: I am. I am. My grandfather, my father's father, served in World War II. My father graduated from the United States Military Academy at West Point, class of 1978. Go Army.

TAPPER: Yes.

LANDRY: And -- and then I, as well, commissioned in 2006 from the Army ROTC program at the University of Notre Dame. And so just understanding the rich tradition of service, what it means, that's just something I've lived with. And not only for the people that are in uniform, but having the opportunity to see my mother alongside my father for over 40 years until she passed away in 2022. She, too, was committed to the military, to military families, because while service members sign up, it's families that serve.

And so that is what we're very focused on. And when it comes to some of the impacts that we're experiencing right now, the -- the shutdown didn't stop. We didn't start our -- our recognition of service members because of a shutdown. And we won't stop because of a shutdown.

TAPPER: Yes.

LANDRY: It continues.

TAPPER: Dr. Brown, on your left side there, underneath your name, is the Legion of Honor. You were in Normandy.

BROWN: Yes.

TAPPER: You went to Normandy last year. President Macron awarded you that. That's the most prestigious French order of merit. What was that moment like for you, the president of France, in this -- in this celebration of America and the Allies' victory over Nazis and despots? And they honored you, and Macron put that right there.

BROWN: Yes, it was almost unbelievable for the president of France to honor me, to give me the award.

TAPPER: And -- and you and your late wife created a foundation that benefits veterans. Tell us about that.

BROWN: My wife expired about five years ago, and I have developed a foundation scholarship in honor of her. And of course, I hope to share that with any of the communities that want to send their children on -- in any direction they want to go in terms of learning and being part of the community.

TAPPER: What was her name?

BROWN: My wife?

TAPPER: Yes.

BROWN: Ozeal Shyne Brown.

TAPPER: Ozeal Shyne Brown.

BROWN: Yes.

TAPPER: All right. Well, on this Veterans Day, I can't tell you how honored I am to meet you, sir. Thank you so much for your service. Thank you for what you did in World War II for me and my family.

BROWN: Well, I say over and over, and I do believe and honor that, that I'm just glad we won the war, because we didn't have to win it.

TAPPER: I'm very glad that you won the war, as well. Dr. Arlester Brown, Claradith Landry, thank you, and I hope you have a peaceful memo -- and -- and meaningful Veterans Day.

LANDRY: Thank you so much, Jake.

BROWN: Thank you.

[17:39:09]

TAPPER: CNN has learned that the United Kingdom is now suspending some of its intelligence sharing with the United States over those boat strikes in the Caribbean. The new exclusive reporting is next. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: We have some exclusive CNN reporting today in our World Lead. The United Kingdom will no longer share intelligence with the U.S. about suspected drug trafficking vessels in the Caribbean.

With sources saying that the British do not want to be complicit in these lethal U.S. military strikes against drug trafficking suspects. Strikes that the Brits, and lots of legal experts believe, are against international law. Let's get right to CNN's Natasha Bertrand, who broke the story. Natasha, this is a critical departure from a top U.S. ally.

NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Yes, it's the U.S.'s closest ally. They have a very long-standing intelligence-sharing partnership. And it's important to note some of the context here as well. Prior to the U.S. military beginning its lethal campaign against these suspected drug vessels, the U.K. was very happy to share intelligence with the U.S. in the Caribbean to try to locate suspected drug traffickers. Because, of course, the U.K. controls territory in the Caribbean, and they have an interest in controlling the flow of drugs in that area.

But when the U.S. military started to bomb the boats, rather than just interdict them and arrest everyone on board, instead they started killing everyone on board, 76 people to date have been killed in these U.S. strikes. The U.K. decided to pull back its intelligence-sharing, we're told, because they did not want their targeting information to be at the U.S. military to conduct these lethal attacks, which the U.K. believes are illegal. They believe that they are in violation of international law.

[17:45:18]

Now, the Trump administration has argued that the U.S. military can legally kill suspected traffickers because they pose an imminent threat to Americans, and they have designated them as enemy combatants, saying that the U.S. is in an armed conflict with those groups. But, crucially, the administration has not provided evidence, either publicly or even to lawmakers, that these individuals on board these boats are, in fact, members of these criminal organizations, these cartels.

And they've also told lawmakers repeatedly that they don't even know the individual identities of each of these people on the boats before they strike them and kill everyone on board. So this is why the U.K. and other allies around the world, as well as so many legal experts, are questioning the legality and, frankly, just the wisdom of this U.S. military campaign, Jake.

TAPPER: All right, Natasha Bertrand in Brussels, thanks so much.

The Trump administration claims that the U.S. strikes on boats are targeting boats operated by what they call narco-terrorists and cartel members bound for the United States. An Associated Press report finds that for at least nine of the more than 60 people killed in the strikes, that does not seem to have been the case, in dozens of interviews, "residents and relatives said the dead men had indeed been running drugs but were not narco-terrorists or leaders of a cartel or gang."

The report details how the men made up to $500 a trip, laborers and fishermen. They were low-level career criminals who lived along the poverty-stricken coast of Venezuela. They were people whose families and friends could confirm their deaths only through their absences and by word of mouth.

My panel is here, former Director of National Drug Control Policy under President Biden, Dr. Rahul Gupta, also with us, national security expert Sean McFate. So, Sean, the relatives and residents interviewed in this story are, in a sense, these people were just killed, not interdicted, not captured, not given any sort of due process. Can you shed some light on how the process, according to international law experts, is supposed to work?

SEAN MCFATE, AUTHOR, "THE NEW RULES OF WAR": Yes. So the law of armed conflict or international humanitarian law, you can only hit combatants, which is like a soldier versus a civilian. It distinguishes between a combatant and noncombatant. But we've -- we've had this discussion before for the last 25 years about, say, a terrorist. Is a terrorist, you know, they -- they deliberately blur the line between civilian and combatant.

And what the Trump administration has done is said, OK, well, we targeted terrorists for the last 25 years. These cartels kill more Americans through fentanyl and opioids than terrorists do. So really they're the same thing. And that's the question that others like United Kingdom and Canada, to some extent, have criticized.

TAPPER: So, Dr. Gupta, obviously narcotics are a huge problem in the United States. Lots of innocent people are overdosing, people that take fentanyl and opioids purposefully, but also people that think they're taking like a natural herb pill or something far less dangerous, marijuana even, and that's been laced with fentanyl and they die of the overdose. What do you think about what the Trump administration is doing to combat this -- this horrible situation?

DR. RAHUL GUPTA, DIRECTOR, OFFICE OF NATIONAL DRUG CONTROL POLICY, BIDEN ADMIN.: Well, Jake, I think there's a number of issues here. First, four out of five people that die or -- or overdose and die is because of fentanyl, not cocaine, necessarily. But --

TAPPER: And the fentanyl is coming from China and Mexico, not from South America.

R. GUPTA: Exactly. So the boats generally have cocaine. Now, we get about 2,500 tons of cocaine coming to this country every year. And we try to interdict about 10 percent of this. And we are not able to match that goal for the inspector general of the Coast Guard in this administration. Now, think about that, 2,500 tons. That means that there is a demand problem also in this country.

Now, the second issue here is that if we're killing people without any judicial process or accountability, that also means we don't know what's on those boats and who are those people, except for the reports that now we know. I will also say that when we move to, for not high- level terrorists or high-level cartel leaders, but everyday people who are doing a side hustle, even though it's criminal, to kill them this way, we're denying not only due process, but basic principles that we've stood by, which is accountability, fairness, and the rule of law. And that's what's important.

TAPPER: Sean, sources tell CNN the U.K. is suspending intelligence having to do with the Caribbean. Do you think it's likely that other U.S. allies who also have territories or relationships in the Caribbean, France, Norway, et cetera, et cetera, are likely to follow suit?

[17:50:09]

MCFATE: It's a good question, Jake. So, first of all, the United States and the United Kingdom are in an intelligence alliance called the Five Eyes.

TAPPER: Five Eyes, yes.

MCFATE: Right, which includes Australia, New Zealand, and Canada. And this move is really more symbolic than an operational constraint, because the U.S. has pretty superb intelligence there, especially since they have like 10 percent of the Navy fleet docked off the Venezuelan coast. So, it's -- it's really a symbolic sort of shot across the bow, if you will --

TAPPER: Yes.

MCFATE: -- to the Americans. And the Canadians, they haven't gone that far, but they've voiced publicly they also have reservations about operations there.

TAPPER: Before we go, quick thoughts, Sean, on the new head of Syria who was in the White House yesterday. He -- he fought Americans along Islamist insurgents in Iraq in his early 20s. What do you make of it all?

MCFATE: Well, it's -- it's super historic, right? I mean, you have a guy who just a couple of years ago was -- was a terrorist that we would have shot on sight, speaking of the same thing.

TAPPER: Yes.

MCFATE: And now he's meeting the president in the Oval Office. Maybe it marks the end of the global war on terror, I don't know.

TAPPER: All right, Dr. Rahul Gupta and Sean McFate, thank you to both you. Really appreciate it.

Coming up, new video shared on this Veterans Day. See the shock experienced by some military veterans, veterans of Vietnam and Korea, when a former president suddenly showed up on the plane, bringing them to D.C., an honor flight. Stay with us. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:55:49]

TAPPER: In our Health Lead, the FDA's plans to remove certain warning labels from hormone therapy medication used to treat menopause symptoms. But why? Let's page CNN's Dr. Sanjay Gupta. Sanjay, what exactly is a black box warning, and why did hormone therapy products have it, and why don't they have it anymore?

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, so a black box warning is -- is the strongest warning that you can put on medications. About 400 medications out of 4,000 have these black box warnings.

Sort of an interesting story, Jake. I mean, when you talk about hormone therapy, in many ways it made total sense, right? Women's hormone production starts to go down during menopause. Replace that, and that could potentially alleviate or at least mitigate some of the symptoms of menopause.

Problem was when they studied this, a few years into the study, they started to get all these safety signals. I don't know if you saw that black box warning, but safety signals including endometrial cancer, cardiovascular problems, breast cancer, possible dementia as well. I mean, it scared people. No surprise, Jake.

So I think based on that, when you -- when you -- that black box warning went out there, put on in the FDA about 20, 25 years ago, you saw significant reduction in women taking hormone therapy. So before, to give you an example, one in four women were on hormone therapy.

After the black box warning, it went down to one out of 25 women. So about a generation of women, Jake, who either weren't taking this or taking very low doses of this.

TAPPER: What -- what -- what has changed, and who should be using the hormone therapy now?

S. GUPTA: Yes, so, you know, it's interesting. I -- I looked at a bunch of the studies, and we've been reporting on this for -- for some time now. I think that what changed was when you looked at the data, you realized that they were primarily looking at women who were over the age of 60 and sort of making a lot of assumptions based on that.

When they started to stratify by age, looking, for example, at women between the ages of 50 and 59, women who started hormone therapy within 10 years of menopause, a different picture started to emerge. So -- and -- and the other thing, and I'll show you some of the benefits when you -- when you look at it that way, but another thing is that there's a lot of different formulations of these hormones that exist now that didn't exist then.

So I think those two things in combination have made it clearer that you see cardiovascular disease benefits down, you know, 50 percent reduction, Alzheimer's disease, 35 percent, bone fractures, 50 percent to 60 percent. Again, in those specific situations, though, Jake, if -- if hormone -- hormone therapy has started within 10 years of menopause and before the age of 60, that's when you seem to get the most benefit.

I've got to tell you, you know, Jake, this -- this is a -- it's a big deal. I mean, my mom, I helped her navigate this when she was around that age. My wife around that age helped her navigate this. I think it's been very confusing for a lot of people. My mom had a spine fracture last year, as you may remember. We talked about that.

Her doctors told her, had she been on hormone therapy, she may have had stronger bone density and been able to prevent a fracture like this. So hopefully this could provide relief in the right circumstances for women going forward.

TAPPER: All right, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thank you so much. And Sanjay is, of course, taking your questions on the top. You can scan the QR code on your screen right now to submit a question. And Sanjay will be back tomorrow to answer some of your questions.

Welcome to The Lead. I'm Jake Tapper. This hour, a key House committee is meeting tonight with the final vote to reopen the government now set for tomorrow afternoon as House members are rushing back to D.C. from across the country. President Trump said today he expects the bill to pass. So how soon could we see air travel and food stamp benefits and other government searches -- services return to normal?

Plus, in the last hour, you heard Democratic Congressman Ro Khanna call for Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer to step aside over that bipartisan Senate deal. In moments, I'm going to ask another Democrat in the House if he agrees and how his seemingly fractured party can fix these ugly divides playing out in public.

[17:59:58]

And on this Veterans Day, I'm going to be joined by one of the heroes of my 2012 book, "The Outpost."