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CNN NewsNight with Abby Phillip
Trump Personally Driving Taxpayer-Funded Ads Promoting Himself; Trump Adviser Says, Midterms are Going To Be F***ing Rough; Trump Denies Discussing U.S. Selling Weapons To China's Xi; GOP Blasts Sarah Huckabee Sanders' New Welfare Ad; Ken Paxton's Estranged Wife Appeals To All Women To Vote GOP. Aired 10-11p ET
Aired September 28, 2026 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[22:00:00]
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ABBY PHILLIP, CNN ANCHOR (voice over): Tonight, the midterms are going to be (BLEEP) rough, that from a Trump adviser, as taxpayers fund a new Republican campaign ad and critics pounce on MAGA's champagne taste.
Plus, did the president offer to sell weapons to China?
DAVID PERDUE, U.S. AMBASSADOR TO CHINA: He actually asked President Xi would he like to buy some at one point.
PHILLIP: It's not only illegal, but would be for a nation that's helping target American troops.
Also --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You pay taxes to cover welfare for guys like Brad, who just choose not to work.
PHILLIP: -- MAGA unleashes on a Republican governor for depicting a white man in her welfare ad.
And Ken Paxton's estranged wife urges conservative women to vote Republican despite moral and value concerns about candidates.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We have more control over that seat and the future when we control the seat, when it's still in the family, even if we're mad at it.
PHILLIP: Live at the table, Caroline Sunshine, Mike Nellis, Brad Todd, Yemisi Egbewole, and Terry Moran.
Americans with different perspectives aren't talking to each other, but here, they do.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIP (on camera): Good evening. I'm Abby Phillip in New York.
Tonight, as Republicans worry about the midterms, President Trump is barreling full straight steam ahead in his all about me strategy. He's launching new ads starring himself, and the American taxpayers are yet again picking up the tab.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: Final battle. We will liberate America from these villains once and for all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: Now, if that looks and sounds familiar to you, it's because this ad is identical to one that his presidential campaign ran in 2024. A source tells CNN that Trump is personally orchestrating the ads promoting himself, including helping to pick the imagery and the videos that are used.
Now, today, Trump vowed to spend money to help GOP candidates get elected, and, once again, he's urging his supporters to pretend that he is on the ballot. But as the midterm elections inch closer, the mood among his inner circle is souring. One adviser tells CNN, It's obviously going to be effing rough. And when asked if there was anything Republicans could do to change the tide, an operative replied, go back in time and never start the Iran war.
Before we open it up at the table here, we invite you at home to join our debate. Go to cnn.com/abby. Weigh in there and we'll get to some of your comments throughout the show.
So, Terry, these ads are extraordinary. They're probably illegal according to many people, including Republicans and Democrats. And it seems like this latest one, the one that aired during football this weekend, because it's literally a campaign ad, was a middle finger to people who say it's unethical.
TERRY MORAN, VETERAN JOURNALIST: Yes, it's a middle finger to the law, and they'll say, well, Joe Biden did something with a bill that he passed, or Barack Obama promoted his policies. He's promoting himself. Now, politically, it's smart. It's smart because the bet they have, and it's a good one, is that they want MAGA to come back for one last charge, one last moment to support the guy who transformed American politics, who made them feel different about themselves in the country, who is their hero. And that's probably the best lane to, for victory to them.
PHILLIP: I saw this thing, Brad a lot of the issues as they kind of wax and wane in the campaign, and obviously the economy is number one. But corruption is up there in terms of concerns that Americans have, and it's a weird choice to make right before an election to remind people that you're taking their money and spending it on things that really only concern you. I mean, what is the political wisdom of doing something like this?
BRAD TODD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, Washington wastes money on a lot of things, and I think it's wasting money on this, and I think that people were frustrated with what government was spending way before this.
But the president, I don't think, needs to do this with advertising from the government or from really from anyone. He commands the attention of television all day every day. We're proving it right here at this table tonight. He can drive the debate around this election any way he wants and he can do it with his actions, and preferably by with actions that are disciplined and right on point every day. That's -- I don't think advertising's necessary for him. Most politicians, it is, but not for him.
YEMISI EGBEWOLE, FORMER BIDEN WHITE HOUSE PRESS ADVISER: Well, it's interesting because the White House was asked about this, and they said, it's educational, not political. And so the question is what are we educating people on?
I think for a lot of Republican lawmakers that are back home right now, we know the House is out of session, and some people are really going to have to fight for their lives in these competitive swing districts, they're wondering, what is the message that I can take to constituents to say, here's what we've done in Washington?
[22:05:13]
And so I think for the White House to sell this as educational, they have to educate what the Trump administration has accomplished so that people like Ashley Hinson, who's running in what shouldn't be incredibly competitive but is this year's seat, isn't saying, hey, I wish I was back in Washington working, because when I'm running, what am I running on?
CAROLINE SUNSHINE, FORMER PRESS AIDE, TRUMP 2024 CAMPAIGN: And that's what's so interesting to me about the ad, is actually the substance of the ad. So the quote that is used in that ad is from a campaign speech the president gave in 2023. The president's been in office for 15 months.
And what is the -- I just want to read this, because the is the full quote that they used. With you at my side, we will demolish the deep state. We will expel those horrible, horrible, horrible warmongers from our government. They want to kill people all over the place, places we've never heard of, places that frankly want to be left alone. We will drive out the globalists, drive out the communists, Marxist, fascists, and the ad goes on.
But the point is, the White House is making a deliberate choice not to use the Iran can't have a nuclear weapon messaging. They're not using the short-term pain for a long-term gain messaging because they know it's not working. So, instead, they're reverting to Trump is on the ballot, and where they're correct about that is the 2023 version of the president. His original instincts, his original vision is the only thing that will drive those Trump voters to the polls. They want that version of Trump to be on the ballot.
And it's a little dishonest what the White House is doing by reverting to that message because the base knows that we've gotten off track. They know that the White House chief of staff allowed only warmongers into the Situation Room when we started the Iran war. So much for direct quote, we're going to expel the horrible warmongers. It was only warmongers, Marco Rubio, Susie Wiles, John Ratcliffe that were in the Situation Room when we started the Iran war. The peacemakers, Tulsi Gabbard, J.D. Vance, they were all back in Washington, D.C.
TODD: Wait a minute. Marco Rubio's the most popular Republican in America though.
SUNSHINE: It doesn't change that he loves war.
TODD: He's the most -- and he's got the best instincts on foreign policy. I mean, let's be careful. More Marco Rubio would help this administration on the campaign trail.
PHILLIP: Mike, you look a little upset that --
SUNSHINE: When he's DJing a wedding?
(CROSSTALKS)
PHILLIP: I mean, let me just read this real quick just so you can respond. A viewer says, a billionaire who needs help with political ads is a cheap billionaire. But we do know, I mean, Donald Trump has a long history of being cheap with his own money.
MIKE NELLIS, FORMER SENIOR ADVISER, KAMALA HARRIS CAMPAIGN: Yes. I'm going to throw a curveball here. I thought I'd be disagreeing with you, but I'm actually going to disagree with Terry for a second because you describe this as politically smart, and I don't think anything about this is politically smart for exactly the reason that you just said. It's literally an ad talking about all the campaign promises that he's violated, right? I'm not going to start new wars. That was the number one thing that he promised, particularly young men right now who are abandoning Donald Trump across the board. His numbers, based on a CNN analysis that Harry Enten did the other day on this network, are cataclysmic with young men in particular, but certainly all people under 30.
He's basically violated every campaign promise. Everything's going to get less expensive on day one. I alone can fix the economy. We're not going to start new wars. I'm going to drain the swamp. He hasn't done any of that.
SUNSHINE: What about the border?
NELLIS: But --
SUNSHINE: He closed the border. And Republicans need to be talking about that.
PHILLIP: Well, let's talk about the border for a second --
NELLIS: Because we've got the caravan. PHILLIP: -- because this is a -- yes, there's apparently now a new caravan coming, which you might be -- it also might ring a bell if you were around in 2018.
Marjorie Taylor Greene of all people, says --
TODD: Who?
PHILLIP: She says --
NELLIS: I think you've met.
PHILLIP: -- we have not seen a caravan headed to the U.S. southern border in several years. Why now? Oh, yes, there's an election coming up, and the GOP needs to scare you into voting because nothing else is working.
TODD: Yes.
PHILLIP: And what she's talking about is a, a long history of President Trump doing exactly that. Back in 2018, he was facing a midterm wipeout. He says, we will not let these caravans, which are also made up of some very bad thugs and gang members, into the U.S. Our border is sacred. It must come in legally. Turn around.
The caravan is a trope.
SUNSHINE: Yes.
PHILLIP: It is a midterm trope. And if you don't hear about it in a month and a half, it's because there's no more election.
NELLIS: But all they have is tropes, right? The entire Republican Party's message heading into the midterms is, we've got to defeat the communists. All the Democrats are communists. They've been doing that for my entire political career.
TODD: The socialists are actually winning primaries on the Democratic side now left and right.
NELLIS: But we're outside of New York, where?
TODD: Well, every, every major Senate primary -- every major Senate race, the farthest left candidate has won.
NELLIS: That's not true.
TODD: Except Iowa, where you have --
NELLIS: That's objectively false.
(CROSSTALKS)
NELLIS: Michigan's the only one.
TODD: You don't think Peggy Flanagan was left of Angie Craig? (CROSSTALKS)
MORAN: The only people in America who are actually doing socialism is the federal government under Donald Trump, taking massive positions in private companies. The government ownership --
TODD: The Democratic socialism where Democrats will not run the DSA out of their party.
MORAN: No, explain that. Explain that.
TODD: They need to run the DSA out of their party.
[22:10:01]
MORAN: He's taking control. He's taking equity stakes in major companies. No Democrat has ever done that temporarily after the collapse of the stock market.
NELLIS: He's spending taxpayer dollars on basically ads you would see running in North Korea. Like, come on, Donald Trump is the most famous communist in America.
MORAN: I'll just say, this is evidence once again of Marjorie Taylor Greene's batty-ness.
TODD: Who?
MORAN: Marjorie Taylor Greene's batty-ness. You don't need somebody to cook up a caravan. That border is the largest wage differential across any border in the world. There is always pressure on it, and that increases in times of trouble down south and in times of prosperity in America.
PHILLIP: But also just to be clear, there's no evidence that this caravan is actually going to the U.S. southern border.
SUNSHINE: And the caravan conversation is better now for Democrats than it was in 2018 because now Democrats will actually say, yes, we do need strong borders. And when pressed, when candidates are pressed, like a James Talarico in Texas, he says, yes, I do think that criminals come to this country illegally should be --
TODD: He didn't think it when it was a problem. He only says it when it's easy.
PHILLIP: Look, the bigger issue is that this is --
SUNSHINE: Is it solved now?
TODD: He only says it when it's easy.
PHILLIP: This is a symptom of a larger problem for the GOP, which is that right now they're -- everybody's in panic mode. That Republican operative that spoke to CNN is basically saying, we need to be clear that this is not going well. And the president -- maybe this is a sign that he's internalizing that because he is going back to some of the things that he knows has, or he thinks has worked for him in the past.
SUNSHINE: My first question would be why is that Trump adviser speaking off the record to CNN rather than going on CNN, coming on your show, coming on any show, and defending the president and defending his policies, which is their job.
PHILLIP: Maybe because that person cares.
SUNSHINE: And maybe because they're not very good at their job. Because, frankly, there's actually a lot to celebrate and there's a lot to tout. And if you're going to focus on just gas prices and groceries, then, of course, Americans perceive --
EGBEWOLE: The things we need to live.
NELLIS: Right, the things that most people need to have.
SUNSHINE: Yes, but hold on.
PHILLIP: We should have them focus on instead of the number one issue for Americans, which is the cost of living.
SUNSHINE: Thank you for giving me the chance to talk about that.
PHILLIP: So, you really are going to argue that we should ignore the top issue for Americans and focus on other things?
SUNSHINE: Here's what I'm going to paint the picture for you. The economy right now is like a fat person. If you see somebody fat, you go, they're not very healthy.
NELLIS: Do I need to take this personally?
SUNSHINE: Actually, they just need to lose -- they just need to lose weight. What's happening right now is the economy structurally is actually doing better than you think. But because the gas prices and the groceries are high, it's masking that, right?
But let me get into it for you.
EGBEWOLE: Trump was arguing --
SUNSHINE: Wait. No, hold on. Hold on.
(CROSSTALKS)
SUNSHINE: The labor market is the best it's been for people without college degrees in two decades.
NELLIS: That's not true. It's objectively careless.
SUNSHINE: The jobs report was projected to add 52,000 jobs. It added 163,000 --
MORAN: You cannot argue people. You cannot argue people out of the fact of their lives -- SUNSHINE: Inflation is down. It's not. I'm saying that the economy is more --
MORAN: What they're telling you, what the problem in their household is, and you're saying, no, it's not a problem in your household.
NELLIS: Wait. I just want to say --
SUNSHINE: And the administration has to focus on the economic wins that they have that are not being talked about. It's a big deal that people without a college degree have the best labor market in two decades. You want to know why? Because the best Ozempic for the economy is deporting illegal immigrants out of this country.
(CROSSTALKS)
PHILLIP: So, Caroline --
SUNSHINE: That's what Trump on the ballot means.
PHILLIP: Just to be clear, you telling people that doesn't mean that they actually experience it.
NELLIS: Right.
PHILLIP: That's part of the problem. Mike, you get the last word.
NELLIS: I mean, I just I want to say it is you can't gaslight people into believing that the economy is strong, and I'm so sick of hearing about how you just need to feel it. The American people don't feel it. No, the economy that they're experiencing is really bad, and it was not great under Joe Biden. Now, it's significantly worse. You ask people right now, they're going to say, it's worse than it was during the pandemic. It's worse than it was during the 2008 crisis.
TODD: Prices are not going up like they were under Joe Biden. We're living with a jump in prices.
NELLIS: And for a brief period of time. We've now had sustainable inflation.
TODD: It's not worse.
NELLIS: Not to mention you have -- it is absolutely worse.
TODD: You know what would make it worse?
NELLIS: Ask the average American.
TODD: Is if Democrats had been --
NELLIS: This is why you guys are going to lose.
TODD: If Democrats had held the Congress and the presidency, the tax --
NELLIS: The Democrats aren't in control right now.
TODD: Hold on. If they'd won in 2024, taxes would've gone up on every American.
NELLIS: False.
TODD: Every Democrat voted to raise them.
EGBEWOLE: How do we know that?
TODD: Every Democrat voted to raise them on every income tax bracket.
(CROSSTALKS)
TODD: They voted for it. I'll own it. I'll own the -- I'll own stopping that tax increase, absolutely.
MORAN: No, own the economy.
TODD: I'll own conservative judges.
MORAN: You own the economy. Go tell people that everything is hunky- dory.
TODD: I will own the trade deficit with China that's dropped 40 percent. I'll own those things. I'll own those things, okay? They're problems. They're problems, and I'll own those things.
PHILLIP: I do think --
TODD: Let's be factual. You want facts?
PHILLIP: I do think that Brad -- I think Brad is making a fair point. The economy is not all terrible. However, the things that people experience the most on a daily basis are bad. That's the problem, okay? That is the entirety of the problem. When they fill up their gas tank to go to work, to take their kids to school, to do whatever they need to do, it is expensive. It is $4 and above a gallon, right? Go to the grocery store to feed your kids. These are things that are unavoidable. They're expensive.
So, the economy doesn't have to be macroeconomically much worse than it was a few years ago, but the microeconomics of people's households can be worse, and I think that's what they're saying.
[22:10:07]
That's what the consumer sentiment numbers -- that's what they're about.
SUNSHINE: And that's --
PHILLIP: People are pissed off because they still have to go to the grocery store even though A.I. is driving a boom in the stock market.
NELLIS: I would just say that is the economy, though. Like we could talk about the stock market all day, but that is the economy. People can point to quarter over quarter --
(CROSSTALKS)
TODD: Half the country has exposure to that.
NELLIS: Yes, how about the other half?
PHILLIP: Next for us, the president denies offering to sell weapons to China, even though one of his officials said that he did. That would be illegal, by the way.
Plus, Sarah Huckabee Sanders releases an ad attacking welfare, and MAGA pundits are mad because it features a white guy. We'll discuss.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[22:20:00]
PHILLIP: Tonight, did Donald Trump illegally offer to sell weapons to China? Here's his U.S. ambassador.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PERDUE: President Trump has already sold 50 percent more arms to Taiwan than any other president since 1979. And so I don't accept the premise that, you know, he's not doing all that we should be doing for Taiwan.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: $20 billion in aid and armaments, will that be expedited?
PERDUE: Well, earlier President Trump's already approved $11 billion. There are continuing conversations about other sales. He and President Xi talk about that every time they get together. But President Trump continues to say, hey, we sell arms to other people around the world. He actually asked President Xi would he like to buy some at one point.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: Those comments come as CNN has learned that China has been helping Iran target the United States and its military sites in the Middle, Middle East. The State Department responded to the ambassador's comments, noting that it is against the law to sell arms to China, and that there is no offer or plan to do so. President Trump also denied it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: Is that accurate? Did he make such a suggestion?
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: To China?
REPORTER: To China.
TRUMP: You mean to Taiwan?
REPORTER: No, to China. That's what he said.
TRUMP: I never heard of that one. I'm going to have to ask him. You mean we're going to sell -- no, they'd probably like to buy it because we do make better equipment than them, so maybe it's a good idea. But we didn't discuss that. They may have been talking about Taiwan. I think he probably was talking about Taiwan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: It's an odd thing for Ambassador Perdue to say. And I just think about what you were saying about the president, what he promised and how he campaigned, and he did. He campaigned so many times on this sort of tough-on-China, anti-China rhetoric. He could not be further from that right now than where he is.
SUNSHINE: Well, I disagree because if you look at, you know, fentanyl, fentanyl deaths in the United States are down 36 percent. And when you think about that in the context of thousands of American lives and people's brothers and loved ones and mothers and siblings, that really means something.
I mean, in the last administration, the leading cause of death for young Americans was fentanyl overdose deaths. And Trump did that by being tough on China. You know, he said to Xi, I'm going to do a 10 percent tariff if you don't stop the flow of fentanyl precursors going into America.
PHILLIP: Well, if I'm not mistaken, the drop in fentanyl deaths began under Biden in the end of the Biden term.
SUNSHINE: Joe Biden did not do anything to tell Xi Jinping to knock it off.
PHILLIP: Let's just put on the -- hold on. Let's just put on the table that what's driving the drop in fentanyl deaths is a multifaceted thing. It's not just one thing. It's not just pressure on China. It's a lot of things, and it started under Biden.
SUNSHINE: But it is.
PHILLIP: So, that's the only thing I would say. So, what else, Caroline?
SUNSHINE: But if we look at where -- well, hold on. I don't want to say what else because this is serious. This was the leading cause of death for young Americans.
PHILLIP: Yes, I understand that. But if your premise -- if your premise that this was solely driven by Trump's rhetorical pressure on China when it comes to fentanyl, I don't think that's accurate.
SUNSHINE: Because he told Xi it's a 10 percent tariff. Xi didn't back down.
PHILLIP: Hold on. SUNSHINE: He said it's a 20 percent tariff. Xi said, I'm not going to back down. Now, he said it's a 20 percent tariff and it's $800 de minimis non-exemption, and Xi said, okay.
PHILLIP: You have to then explain how the fentanyl deaths, drug deaths, began dropping before Donald Trump came into office. And if you can't explain that with Trump's pressure on tariffs, then it's just maybe one thing that contributed to it, but it cannot explain the entire phenomenon.
SUNSHINE: Let me explain.
PHILLIP: So -- oh, so let's --
SUNSHINE: Because I've spoken to families who knew that the Biden administration didn't give a rat's ass about this.
PHILLIP: Are you going to offer anything else or no?
SUNSHINE: Yes, I am, because fentanyl precursors come 100 percent from China.
PHILLIP: Are you going to offer anything else?
SUNSHINE: This is a huge deal. I'm so passionate about this because I feel like you guys are being really dismissive of the fact --
PHILLIP: Caroline, nobody is being --
SUNSHINE: Really dismissive of the fact --
PHILLIP: Nobody is being dismissive.
(CROSSTALKS)
SUNSHINE: Well, how did this start? How did this happen?
PHILLIP: But, listen --
SUNSHIHNE: Fentanyl precursors --
PHILLIP: Hold on a second.
(CROSSTALKS)
SUNSHINE: Fentanyl precursors come 100 percent from China.
PHILLIP: Hold on a second.
SUNSHINE: And they stopped coming from China because the president did something about it, and that matters.
PHILLIP: Caroline, Let me just play what Trump has said about another trading partner of ours that we are typically pretty close to. This is in stark contrast to what he has said about China. This is about Canada. Listen. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Well, they want to have a deal with us. They call us all the time. The problem is that they've treated the United States very unfairly. They have been one of the worst countries in the entire world. You know, we get along with China, we get along with the people, and we make good deals. But Canada's been really very difficult to deal with actually.
[22:25:01]
They've charged our farmers 400 percent tariffs and more, and they take advantage of us. They feel entitled.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: So, the truth is that Trump has been in an escalatory trade war with China of his own making, right? But on this visit, he had almost nothing negative to say about China and it seems like it did pay off because the one thing that he got that we know of so far that benefits him the most is he backed down on tariffs and so did China on some key things that are important for the economy, things like corn, wheat, frozen meat, seafood, cosmetics, medical devices, wood products. The list goes on and on. So, it was a mutual backdown, but one that Trump needs more perhaps than China.
TODD: Wait a minute. Wait a minute, though. When Trump took over, the trade deficit with China was $295 billion. Today, after the tariff policies, it's $140 billion.
Now, I'm not going to defend all his tariff policies. The China -- the Canadian tariffs are a head-scratcher for me still. But tariffs on China were absolutely in order. China was absolutely taking advantage of our market. Joe Biden had done nothing to do it because Joe Biden was a weak president.
President Trump zeroed in on it. American workers are better off now, and now that progress has been made, the president is strategically adding things back into the mix. And that's exactly what should happen. I mean, soybean farmers are a little upset they're not on the list this week. That would probably help politically in the Midwest some. But it is right and good for us to ratchet the pressure up on the Chinese until they are fairer with our economy.
EGBEWOLE: But we're still talking about tariffs as abstract.
NELLIS: Yes.
EGBEWOLE: We're talking about these big numbers, and I want to point to one thing you even said about cosmetics, that little portion. Every woman, since Trump has been president, has had to pay more for things even like getting your hair done. And when you talk to small business owners across the country, even beauticians, they talk about how some of their supplies, because we get them from China, a lot of beauty supplies, including hair extensions, one business owner, $300,000 worth of stock stuck in an L.A. port, wasn't able to recoup that whatsoever.
So, he can talk about the conversations he's had. Now, there are real Americans whose businesses are on the brink because of actions he took.
TODD: And you can move that to Brazil or Mexico or some other place that's comparable, that's not an enemy like China. We'll all be better off. And there is a transition to do that.
NELLIS: Hold on. One, I think it would be hard for us to find an American worker who would say that they're better off now than they were a year-and-a-half ago. You're just not going to find people who are going to say that.
TODD: The construction jobs from the steel plant in Iowa and Wisconsin, they're going to be pretty happy about it.
NELLIS: Well, according to ADP, we lost manufacturing jobs and construction jobs last month. But regardless of all that --
TODD: Yes, energy industry as a whole, they're all pretty happy about it.
NELLIS: I mean, I'm sure you've got a lot of stats try to prove this, but people sitting at home are not feeling any good about this right now.
TODD: But don't -- Mike, you can't be -- you can't --
EGBEWOLE: They're not statistics. They're real people.
(CROSSTALKS)
NELLIS: There are real people who are suffering right now.
TODD: Let's rewind the tape five minutes ago. You were saying it's a multifaceted problem.
NELLIS: I didn't say that.
TODD: That means you need to be honest and say --
NELLIS: We were talking about fentanyl deaths then.
TODD: -- there are some things in the economy that Donald Trump has improved because we didn't have Joe Biden's weakness in there doing it. The Chinese trade deficit is one of them. We should give him credit on that.
NELLIS: Nobody sitting at home is buying this pro-Trump --
PHILLIP: I guess that's if you assume that trade deficits are inherently bad, which is a completely disputed idea.
TODD: They're not that bad for everybody.
PHILLIP: They're not inherently bad. They just represent the flow of trade from one country to another.
TODD: But I'm sorry, can I finish the point? I'm going to make a second point. But with a lying, cheating country like China, they are bad.
PHILLIP: Yes, I get that on things that are important, but on you combs, they're much less important. And so the idea of a trade deficit in and of itself is not -- that's not, that's a -- that's Trump's way of looking at it, but it's not actually economically significant because, yes, Americans probably should pay less to get combs from China as opposed to manufacturing that in the United States. We don't need to manufacture combs in the United States and Americans don't need to pay more for it.
TODD: We don't. We should manufacture them in an ally, not an enemy. We should make them in Brazil or Ecuador, Colombia, not China.
PHILLIP: But if you listen to Trump, you wouldn't even know that Trump --
EGBEWOLE: After this visit, I'm not sure, yes.
PHILLIP: You wouldn't even know that China was an enemy and not an ally.
(CROSSTALKS)
NELLIS: Hold on. Can I get an opportunity? Because we started this conversation about whether or not Donald Trump was going to sell weapons to China, and I think we shouldn't lose sight of that. China is actively helping Iran right now. We have at least 22 military service men and women who have been killed. We have countless others that have been wounded. They're lying about those numbers right now, and what's Donald Trump doing? He's serving a beautiful dinner to the Chinese government. He's lavishing them with praise while attacking our enemies and promising to sell them weapons, which is illegal.
TODD: He should not offer to sell them weapons, even if it's flippant.
NELLIS: I appreciate you saying that because a lot of Republicans won't say that.
MORAN: Trump understands two things about China, I think. First that it was wrong to offshore the entire manufacturing sector of the American economy to China and other countries. And, second, he looks at the world as people who are getting screwed, like Taiwan, and people who do that to them, and he's much more comfortable dealing with the great powers and tossing aside. That's why every country in the world is recalibrating its relationship with the United States under Trump because he won't commit unless you're a power that he has to stand up to.
[22:30:03]
SUNSHINE: I think -- PHILLIP: All right, we got to leave it there.
Next for us, MAGA is furious tonight. Sarah Huckabee Sanders, in her new ad, says a white man is abusing the welfare system. We'll debate that.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIP: Tonight, a political ad touting a popular Republican policy starts a MAGA firestorm all because of who it casted. Watch.
[22:35:06]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. SARAH HUCKABEE SANDERS (R-AK): Me, Brad.
Brad has turned relaxing into a full-time profession. But you, you actually work hard. You pay taxes to cover welfare for guys like Brad who just choose not to work.
That's why I launched a welfare to work requirement. Now, more Arkansans are working than ever before.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: You may be wondering what exactly is the problem with that ad?
Well, according to the MAGA backlash, it's the casting of a young white man to play the welfare abuser. Arkansas's governor, Sarah Huckabee Sanders, dismissed the fallout and reposted the ad again to X. But some of the sharpest critics of the ad highlight a deeper problem in the party.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JACK POSOBIEC, CONSERVATIVE COMMENTATOR: We know that we've seen the Gen Z numbers with the GOP. We know the numbers are down. All the GOP had to do was not attack young white men between now and election day.
The only group in America that there's no taboo to attack whatsoever is white men. And look, that's what GOP is now doing. It is tone-deaf, it is disgraceful.
And honestly, it should be apologized for. This should be taken down and there should be an apology to the young white men in this country.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: I wish this were a joke, but it's not. This is very serious.
TODD: I'm offended that the person's name is Brad.
PHILLIP: Brad's everywhere.
EGBEWOLE: Put down the cheese balls, Brad.
PHILLIP: Are they really losing it over an ad that demonstrates that white people are on welfare too?
TODD: I think I have a pretty good grasp of where the Republican base is since I spend my entire living trying to help Republicans unite to win elections. And I have seen no one legitimate who is upset by this.
These are only clickbait profiteers online (inaudible).
(CROSSTALK)
SUNSHINE: There are 10 million people who have seen that ad online who agree with me, Brad. So I know you think you know the GOP base, but you might want to check yourself.
Let me ask you this.
TODD: Being a self-styled MAGA influencer who sells clickbait does not make you represent (inaudible)?
SUNSHINE: Do you know what percentage of welfare recipients in the United States are white men under the age of 25?
TODD: I know that I don't look at people's race when I'm trying to decide what the policy is.
SUNSHINE: What percentage of welfare recipients are white men under the age of 25?
TODD: Again, I told you, I don't look at people.
SUNSHINE: It's 1 percent, it's less than 1 percent. So white men under the age of 25 are less than 1 percent of welfare recipients in our country, but they're the star of Sarah Sanders' ads.
PHILLIP: Specifically what programs are you talking about?
TODD: She's talking about AFDC. Right? Is that what you're talking about?
SUNSHINE: I'm talking about TANF. I'm talking about SNAP. I'm talking about any of the generous welfare benefits the United States government hands out.
TODD: Caroline, can I call a time out here? Why are you arguing against promoting work requirements for welfare? Why are you causing a Civil War backlash to go against someone who is pushing a core part of the conservative philosophy? Why are you undermining that effort?
SUNSHINE: Here's what I'm arguing. In 2024, maybe Governor Sanders forgot this, Republicans won young men and young women, more young men, under the age of 30 for the first time ever. We had a generational opportunity.
TODD: Are you trying to stroke grievance based on age and race (inaudible)?
SUNSHINE: I'm pointing out the facts.
The facts are that more welfare is handed out to Somali immigrants in Minnesota.
(CROSSTALK)
We have it on the record. If you want to know more about it, you can go ask Tim Walz.
TODD: Shoot outside the tent. Don't shoot inside the tent.
SUNSHINE: Inside the tent are young men who are not going to be in our tent if we keep doing falsehoods about them.
PHILLIP: Brad is representing the perspective that Republicans had on this when they passed these work requirements in the Big Beautiful Bill. Back then in 2025, here is how our Republican leaders on Capitol Hill sold it to the American people. Listen.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
REP. STEVE SCALISE (R-LA), HOUSE MAJORITY LEADER: All of the fully able-bodied, the 35-year-old guy sitting at home playing video games in his mom's basement, he's going to have to go work because we put work requirements in place.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: What we've talked about is returning work requirements. So for example, you don't have able-bodied young men on a program that's designed for single mothers and the elderly and disabled. They're draining resources from people who actually do that.
So if you clean that up, insure it up, you save a lot of money, and you return the dignity of work to young men who need to be out working instead of playing video games all day.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
EGBEWOLE: So many video games. I mean, also I just want to say to Governor Sanders that I think Bill Clinton did this ad first, and he's been on that idea since 1996 passed the Personal Responsibility and Work Requirement Reconciliation Act. So this is not something new.
[22:40:02]
But I will say, to give Caroline a point here, I do think there is a generational divide in the message. Because there is an ongoing, pervasive, consistent drumbeat that young people don't care about work. And the reason that they are in the state that they are within this economy is because they lack the drive to work. PHILLIP: Okay, that might be a fair point, but that's not what these people are mad about.
Here's James Fishback, who ran for governor in Florida. "White men named Brad, you might agree with that part, don't typically commit welfare fraud. I'd recommend you start with the baby mama with the BMW who just got back from her carnival cruise."
Matt Walsh says, "But of course, Republicans don't have the balls to do this ad with 'Shaniqua' as the villain, even though that would actually be an accurate portrayal of the problem at hand."
They just want to be more racist.
NELLIS: What they're mad about is that they didn't put a black person in the set. Let's just be clear about that for a second. They want to cast all black people in America as lazy and living off the government.
It's absolutely disgusting stuff. Now they're seeing it reflected in their own face in the way that they look, and they're very upset about it. And instead of offering a real solution, because look at the state of the economy right now.
If you're a man under 30, you are significantly less likely to have graduated from college, you're significantly less likely to be able to afford a home compared to your female counterparts. First generation of men to ever be experiencing that right now.
The labor market is really bad for men. It's not that they don't want to work, it's that there's no work for them. And there's no answer from the Republican Party on any of this stuff except to cast dispersions.
PHILLIP: There's also this idea of grievance politics against women. It's like for the party that argues against identity politics, they've really been embracing that. Last month when the job gains, frankly, this is not a trend.
It just so happened that last month, most of the job gains, almost all of them, were made by women. Non-stop complaints from Republican men, mostly, but some women, about how terrible that was. How terrible it was.
NELLIS: Hold on. Katie Miller on her podcast said that fewer women should be in the workforce.
TODD: You keep going back to people who are professionally engaging in things for real.
PHILLIP: Yes, and look, and Brad, I'll give you that. Some of these folks are professional provocateurs.
TODD: It's part of the job.
PHILLIP: They're out there setting a rhetorical agenda for the far- right that basically says it's a bad thing when women are employed.
MORAN: And it's always identity with these people. And they may not be, you know, senators, but they are driving and shaping the next conversation in America. And if you don't think so, look at the Republican Party.
I mean, Nick Fuentes was dining with the president. He's now a major voice in the party, whether you like it or not.
The question I have, and I'm not well-versed in it, is, you know, those entry-level jobs that they're supposedly not taking up, do they pay anything?
EGBEWOLE: A.I. is kind of encroaching in on those jobs. And I just think it's a part of the conversation that Democrats and Republicans do a very poor job of turning out young voters. And the way to get that out to vote is not by them.
SUNSHINE: And more people were upset about the fact that it was a young man. They were more upset about the fact that it was a young man.
EGBEWOLE: And a lot of the conversations that I saw were about Caroline.
(CROSSTALK)
Okay, but you haven't.
PHILLIP: Caroline, they were upset that he was a white man.
SUNSHINE: There were some areas that are telling you a lot of the conversation with young politicos was at the same time helpful. It was about being young, not about being white.
PHILLIP: Let's just be clear that Trump's problems with young voters in this election, in this year, don't have anything to do with that ad.
NELLIS: Yes.
PHILLIP: They have to do with his stewardship of the economy writ large. That has nothing to do with whether or not they are being portrayed as welfare.
SUNSHINE: But it has to do with how the GOP talks about young people. And for too long, people like Brad have talked about young people in the GOP as stupid and lazy as it's some funny trope.
And let me tell you, come 2028, when this generation has more political power than it has ever had, Republicans better not find themselves on the wrong side of that power dynamic. And a great way to do that would be to run more ads like the one that Governor Sanders --
NELLIS: I want to defend Brad here, because I just don't think that that's fair. I don't think that that's what he said. And it pains me to defend you at a table right now, but I'm going to do it.
But you hit the nail on the head on something, which is that the entire Republican Party right now is run by clickbait provocateurs. And frankly, I think you're playing a clickbait game right now, okay?
And I enjoy it.
SUNSHINE: I think I'm speaking for the 10 million people who saw that ad.
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIP: We've got to go ahead and leave it there.
You were just defended. You can just take the win.
NELLIS: We're healing the wounds.
PHILLIP: Next for us, Ken Paxton's estranged wife says that even if conservative women aren't mad at male GOP candidates, they should still support them. We'll debate that next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[22:45:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIP: The estranged wife of Texas Senate nominee Ken Paxton has a message for Republican women ahead of the midterm elections. Last year, Angela Paxton filed for divorce, citing biblical grounds and accusing her husband of adultery. But in a recent speech, she urged conservative women to vote GOP despite any moral concerns that they may have about the candidates.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANGELA PAXTON, WIFE OF KEN PAXTON: The reality is, while we are the party of values, we have some vulnerabilities on our ballot.
[22:50:03]
I think Republican women will decide this election. Because some of those vulnerabilities, I think, have been particularly alienating to women. We have more control over that seat in the future, when we control the seat, when it's still in the family, even if we're mad at it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: It's an interesting turn of events in a race that Republicans right now think that they are losing.
EGBEWOLE: Yes, they should have bet their horse on John Cornyn, and I think a lot of Republicans in Texas know that. I'm sure Brad probably feels that way. TODD: I said it the night it happened.
EGBEWOLE: Over $200 million spent in the primary, $103 million in the general, and more that he needs because his campaign has only donated $465,000. It makes absolutely no sense to run somebody like this.
And this race keeps being about things that James Talarico says, and that's the Republican talking point of, oh, he said this one thing a little while ago. But I think that this is really about what Ken Paxton has done, and that is fraud, and that is corruption. That is allegedly a fake Uber account to drive around his mistresses.
It's all this one big ball. And I know that she's going through a divorce, and so maybe we don't want to be too much tea on everything that happened.
But, I mean --
PHILLIP: I mean, is it possible that voters would even take that seriously, after what they already know about Ken Paxton? You know, the times when they conducted a poll and they asked some of the voters what they thought about Paxton.
This is independent and Republican voters.
Crook. Criminal. Crook.
All of those. Bad. Immoral.
Two words. Morally corrupt.
Disgusting. Womanizer. Crook.
That seems pretty settled in, in terms of sentiment.
MORAN: Those are just the Republicans, too.
TODD: If Ken Paxton wins, it will be exactly for the reasons Angela Paxton said. It will be because we are mad at him, but it's better than letting the Democrats have the seat. That will be why he wins.
I think he will win.
PHILLIP: You think that's persuasive, is what I'm wondering.
TODD: Yes, because I think that's exactly the conversation Republicans are having with themselves in Texas.
MORAN: And the question I have is, how low do you have to go to be a Republican?
This guy is a low-character, loutish individual. His wife is up there trying to bail him out. He is a corrupt man, and the people of Texas know it better than everyone else.
And the National Republican Party, and the President, and this low- life is saying, forget all of the commitments you have. Forget the way you want your kids to grow up. Forget what you believe in as basic human decency, and do it for Ken.
TODD: But you know what the problem is, Terry? If Democrats in Texas had picked a Hispanic border sheriff who was Catholic and pro-life and pro-gun. By the way, those guys have been Democrats for forever. Pro- labor, pro-healthcare, pro-education spending.
But I'm not saying a hardcore conservative, but a Catholic, border, gun guy. If they picked that kind of guy, they could win in Texas. But you can't win with an Austin Unitarian.
You cannot. It's too big a --
PHILLIP: I don't know. The polling, the Marist poll seems to suggest, at least right now, that Talarico is leading. I mean, we're working hard at this.
I don't have time to play this, but I'll just say, Karl Rove on Sunday basically said he's gotten calls in the last 48 hours from Ted Cruz and from Ken Paxton, both of them telling him that Paxton is losing.
NELLIS: Yes, and I just want to make the following point, which is neither political party is perfect, okay? Plenty of flawed Democrats, plenty of flawed Republicans. But for the most part, we do a much better job of policing our own, because it isn't just Ken Paxton, who is an absolute scumbag, and I could list you everything that I know about him.
But there's Max Miller, who Donald Trump personally saved in this Ohio House election, who was accused of beating his wife and breaking his three-year-old daughter's collarbone. There's so many other people exactly like this. At a certain point, the Republicans that are out there are going to have to go, we can't keep supporting these guys, even if they're going to vote with us 100 percent of the time.
Some things have to matter. Like cheating on your wife. Some things have to matter, like breaking your daughter's collarbone.
I'm sorry, we've got to move on.
SUNSHINE: Or Republicans could just get out and say what's on everyone.
PHILLIP: We'll react to your feedback from cnn.com/abby. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[22:55:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIP: Now some viewer feedback from cnn.com/abby. We have a couple on this. I'll just read this first one.
Abby, can you please tell Caroline and let her know that she cannot body shame people.
SUNSHINE: What is that? I'm just telling the truth. If that affects you.
PHILLIP: She said, another viewer says, shame on Caroline for shaming fat people. She should never use someone's size as an example.
SUNSHINE: I'm using it as a metaphor for the economy. Go back and watch the clip. Thanks for watching.
PHILLIP: Okay. All right. Next one.
Anyone complaining about this welfare ad has never been to Appalachia.
TODD: I mean, I'm an Appalachian person, and I think I take offense to that remark. They're the hardest working people in America.
PHILLIP: But are some of them on welfare?
EGBEWOLE: You can be a hard worker and still need government support.
TODD: Of course, welfare dependency is not a regional problem in America. It's a failure of our government to encourage people to go back to work. Sarah Huckabee Sanders is trying to do that.
MORAN: And to provide good, well-paying jobs.
NELLIS: And what would be great is if we could stop demagoguing people who are on it, white, black, green, doesn't matter. I think everybody's tired.
SUNSHINE: Or young.
[23:00:04]
NELLIS: Or young.
SUNSHINE: That's what it's actually about.
NELLIS: Or fat, Caroline.
PHILLIP: All right. We got to leave it there.
Before you go, remember you can stream the show live or watch on demand anytime with an all-access subscription. Scan that Q.R. code at the bottom of your screen. Go to cnn.com/watch to learn more there.
Thank you very much for watching "NewsNight." "Laura Coates Live" starts right now.
