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Trump Loses Appeal to Block Pence Testimony; Trump Accuser Testifies; Interview With Former National Intelligence Director James Clapper; Economy Slowing; Pentagon Leak Suspect in Court. Aired 1- 1:30p ET

Aired April 27, 2023 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:00]

JOHN KING, CNN HOST: Some tough questions before meeting the president on the South Lawn.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Now, you got to just to -- you got to make me a promise though. When you're president, and they say "Joe Biden is out in the waiting room coming to see you, promise me you won't say, "Joe who?"

(LAUGHTER)

BIDEN: You will remember me, OK?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Thanks for your time today on INSIDE POLITICS. We will see you tomorrow.

CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Happening right now: suspected leaker in court. Federal prosecutors argue that Jack Teixeira should remain behind bars. They say releasing him would put U.S. national security at risk and he may have access to classified information.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Plus, a sharp slowdown, new data showing the Fed's rate hikes could be hampering the U.S. economy. Now, that was the plan, but is the fight against inflation going too far? Today's news not helping to calm fears of a recession.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: And a furious manhunt in Mississippi, three inmates still missing, one inmate dead, but not before killing another man while on the run.

Authorities worry they could slip through the net now. We are following these major developing stories and many more all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

KEILAR: Any moment now, the Air National Guardsman accused of leaking highly classified intelligence documents is due in federal court.

And prosecutors are set to argue that 21-year-old Jack Teixeira still poses a grave threat to national security and that he should be kept in federal custody ahead of his trial. In a late-night court filing, prosecutors alleged that Teixeira may still have access to hundreds of classified documents, and that he made searches online -- quote -- "in what appears to be a deliberate effort to disseminate this country's secrets."

They also claim Teixeira is a major flight risk and an attractive candidate to hostile foreign governments.

CNN's Jason Carroll is outside of the court in Worcester, Massachusetts.

Jason, what more are prosecutors saying?

JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, a couple of things.

First of all, as you had pointed out there, they are very concerned about this recent development that was laid out in these court documents that he had viewed hundreds, not dozens, but hundreds of classified documents.

And the real concern, Brianna, is that, if he gets out on bail, the thought is that he will be able to in some way access some of those documents. So, that's why prosecutors say -- one of many reasons why they say he needs to remain behind bars.

They said the following -- quote -- "The defendant knows where the information is. He knows how to access it. And, based on his specialized I.T. skills, he presumably knows how to disseminate that information without being noticed."

Also in those court filings, the defense weighing in and saying that, look, that this was a young man who was taken into custody at his own without incident. They say that he is not a serious risk of flight or obstruction, and that, if the judge were to allow bail, perhaps he could set certain conditions, such as he should be released to his father, confined to his residence, under -- undergo location monitoring, and no contact with witnesses, and no access to the Internet.

Again, the prosecution laying out a number of situations that they say should have been a red flag to not only the Air National Guard, but others, that they say that this young man was indeed troubled.

Going back to high school, Brianna, they point out to one incident, where they say he was denied a gun I.D. card by police after police found out he was suspended from his high school after he made comments about guns and racial threats.

And so then this is why I think there are so many questions as to not only, why was he a candidate for the Air National Guard? Why did he have access to these types of classified documents? These are just some of the things that are being argued outside the court. The judge has much to consider inside the courtroom -- Brianna.

KEILAR: All right, Jason, we will be watching to see what comes of today.

Prosecutors, though -- this is really interesting, and I think something that may work against him today -- they detailed the things he did to try to destroy evidence, they say, before he was arrested, right?

CARROLL: Right, right, right. You're talking about that he tried to -- he tried to destroy some of the things that was in his home, such as a laptop, a gaming counsel they found in a dumpster.

He also, at one point, when he found out that the authorities were on to someone leaking this information, he decided to get -- to change his phone, to get a new e-mail.

[13:05:02]

In addition to that, investigators were very alarmed by some of the searches that they found. They say that Teixeira searched for things like Ruby Ridge, the Las Vegas shooting, Mandalay Bay shooting, the Buffalo Tops shooting, and Uvalde.

Again, they say these are red flags and point out why he is a risk possibly not only to himself, but to others in the community -- Brianna.

KEILAR: All right, Jason, thank you so much for that -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: All right, so a lot to break down here as to how this happened.

With me now, former Director of National Intelligence James Clapper.

Director, thanks for taking the time.

JAMES CLAPPER, FORMER U.S. NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE DIRECTOR: Good to be with you, Jim.

SCIUTTO: I know you have been watching this with great interest. A couple specific questions here.

We learned that Teixeira, prior to getting a security clearance, had some issues that might have drawn the attention of investigators. The defendant was suspended in high school based on concerning comments he made about Molotov cocktails, other weapons, discussions in school, racist comments, et cetera.

In your experience, would those incidents amount to red flags that would stand in the way potentially of getting a security clearance? Should they stand in the way?

CLAPPER: Well, yes, they would certainly be red flags for, at a minimum, a deeper investigation, perhaps more personal interviews with teachers, school administrators, friends and acquaintances, neighbors, et cetera.

So, yes, that would definitely, at least in my mind, be a cause for a deeper investigation. And I think that's really the key thing to do here is, how was this missed in the course of his initial background investigation and the granting of his clearance?

SCIUTTO: So whose fault is that? Who should -- who should have identified that red flag and investigated further?

CLAPPER: Well, the system for running background investigations and adjudicating them, particularly -- and adjudication is a key thing. And one -- those are two separate steps.

The background investigation, which, as the name implies, tries to gather up as much information about the person's background. And then, separately, adjudicators who do this as a profession, make a judgment about whether this person has -- is of sufficient integrity and character to be granted a clearance.

So, somewhere in that -- in that chain, in that process, something fell through the cracks. And that's what needs to be looked at.

SCIUTTO: As we have been speaking, Director Clapper, the suspect, Teixeira, has been led into the courtroom. We saw him let in, in an orange jumpsuit with handcuffs and we're told holding rosary beads.

All right, so the clearance process seems to have failed. What strikes me too is that, at this point -- and you hear this openly from officials -- we had John Kirby on our air say this himself a few days ago -- the I.C. still does not know how much he got access to, in other words, how much is still out there.

And I wonder, after years of leaks and breaches that we know about and some we don't know about, why there isn't better tracking of what exactly he accessed, what he may have printed out, what he searched. Why don't we know already?

CLAPPER: Well, in many cases, we do.

The major intelligence agencies do have pretty good systems for tracking the electronic behavior of employees. Again, a subject for examination here is to, what extent did this National Guardian have mechanisms in place to monitor his electronic behavior?

And it is admittedly kind of a mixed bag across the entirety of the intelligence community. I said that. What is at issue here, in my view, is a failure of personal trust. And we have had, unfortunately, a history of them in the past, Edward Snowden being a prime example 10 years ago.

We have this current case and we will probably have them in the future, as long as we have to make subjective judgments about people's character.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Sometimes, personal trust doesn't work, case of Chelsea Manning as well with the military. Director James Clapper., thanks so much for helping us break it down. Goodness knows there's more questions to answer, Boris.

SANCHEZ: The U.S. economy in the first quarter grew at a much slower rate than expected. According to the Commerce Department, GDP rose at 1.1 percent, while economists were expecting nearly double that.

Depending on who you ask, that might actually be good news for the economy.

[13:10:04]

CNN business correspondent Rahel Solomon is here to help explain.

Rahel, what does this mean for Americans?

RAHEL SOLOMON, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Well, for Americans, it means they're still spending, and the report bears that out -- bears that out.

But this is clearly a slowing economy, right? And, to your point, some would like to see that, including the Federal Reserve, who would perhaps welcome some signs of cooling. So, to put this in more context, 1.1 at an annualized rate, Boris, you can see how that compares to what economists were expecting. They were expecting 2 percent.

And you can see how the first quarter compares to the previous few quarters, a slowing. So, when you look under the hood of this report, and you will get a sense of where exactly we're seeing spending, it's the consumer. The U.S. consumer is just really powering through, spending on things like goods, services, durable goods, restaurants, bars. Net exports was also a positive contributor.

Now, on the flip side, we saw a real drawdown on inventories. So that was a negative contributor to the downside. Also, businesses really pulled back their spending.

And, Boris, when I talked to Mark Zandi, the chief economist at Moody's, and said, look, how do you square this? Consumers are pulling back. Consumers, rather are spending, but businesses are pulling back. And this is what he told me.

He said, so, usually, it's the consumer that pulls back and the businesses respond. This go-round, the thing that feels a little uncomfortable is, if we go into a recession, it will probably be businesses pulling back and forcing consumers to follow.

So that is perhaps a potential but, at this point, that's not what we see, as consumers continue to spend.

SANCHEZ: And, Rahel, jobless claims continue to fall. The job market continues being very strong.

SOLOMON: Well, that's the interesting thing, right? So we got jobless claims today, which, Boris, this is a real-time

indicator of what's happening in the labor market, so jobless claims coming in at 230,000 -- falling 200,000 to 2 -- 230,000. Excuse me. That is lower than economists were expecting. That is also lower than the prior week, but really in this range that we have been in 220,000 to 250,000 over the last few weeks.

Boris, this would be the first report, the first sign of trouble in the labor market. This would be the first signs where you would see flashing signs of trouble perhaps. We're not seeing it yet. Unemployment remains very low. And perhaps that is the reason why consumers continue to spend, because they have the jobs to continue to spend. And we're seeing that in the GDP report.

SANCHEZ: Now we will have to wait and see how the Federal Reserve responds at its next meeting.

Rahel Solomon, thank you so much for the update -- Brianna.

KEILAR: The woman accusing Donald Trump of rape is back on the witness stand. What she is telling jurors -- next.

And then later: WNBA star Brittney Griner spent 10 months detained in Russia. And, today, she's speaking publicly about it for the first time.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRITTNEY GRINER, WNBA PLAYER: I can say, for me, I'm never going overseas to play again, unless I'm representing my country at the Olympics.

If I -- if I make that team, that'd be the only time I would -- I would leave the U.S. soil. And that's just to represent the USA.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: And remembering Jerry Springer. The legendary tabloid talk show host has died.

This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:17:09]

KEILAR: The woman accusing Donald Trump of rape is back on the stand today in a New York court, writer E. Jean Carroll cross-examined by Donald Trump's legal team in the defamation and battery trial against the former president.

She is alleging that Trump assaulted her in a dressing room at a department store back in the 1990s. He denies the allegation, calling it a hoax and a con job.

CNN's Kara Scannell is live for us outside of the courthouse in New York.

Kara, can you tell us how the cross-examination has gone so far?

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So, Brianna, E. Jean Carroll has been on the stand under cross-examination for about an hour today. They're at a lunch break right now.

But former President Trump's lawyers are starting to make their -- lay out their plan of attack here. They're looking to attack her credibility, to suggest that she's politically motivated, and that she was doing this to boost sales of her book.

So, what they have done, they have taken some of E. Jean Carroll's own words and said to her: Didn't you tell people and say that you even thought your own story, your own allegations of this alleged rape in the Bergdorf Goodman department store was odd?

And Carroll acknowledged that certain parts of the story are difficult to conceive of, yes. They also pointed to an e-mail exchange between her and one of her closest friends, one of the women that we expect to hear testify in this case to back up Carroll's allegations of rape, because Carroll said that she told her about this at the time back in 1996.

So they pointed to an e-mail between the two women in which they talk about a potential scheme where we must do our patriotic duty. Now, Carroll testified she had no idea that -- what that was about and that she and Carol often send jokey e-mails and use the word scheming.

And then they also pointed to her financial motivation, saying that, in the pitch, in this draft for her book proposal, in which she first detailed these allegations, that she focuses on Trump, and that it was a highlight of the proposal which Carroll had agreed to.

They also pointed out and had her agree on the stand in testimony that the first time she told this story was when she was trying to sell this book.

Now, her cross-examination will continue again after lunch break -- Brianna.

KEILAR: All right, we will be waiting, Kara, as we are in the middle of this. Thank you so much for telling us what's happening -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: All right, another court case, another bruising loss in court for Donald Trump.

This one could lead to a rare event in U.S. history, a former vice president testifying against a former president under which he served. It involves the federal criminal probe of the former president and his actions tied to the January 6 attack on the Capitol.

A D.C. circuit court ruled against Trump's appeal aiming to stop Mike Pence from speaking to a federal grand jury.

CNN senior crime and justice reporter Katelyn Polantz, she has been outside the courthouse covering the story.

I suppose, Katelyn, could Trump appeal again? He's been known to do that sort of thing.

KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE REPORTER: Jim, he could try, but this really appears to be the end of the road, at least on the Pence testimony.

[13:20:05]

And it has been the end of the road every time Donald Trump has gone to court in this January 6 investigation trying to claim executive privilege, trying to block some witnesses from testifying or giving answers.

But, in this case, Mike Pence, he is not like other witnesses. He's the vice president being called in to testify against the former president he was serving beside. He has said that he is willing to testify under this under -- this subpoena because this has gone through the courts.

We did get a court order last night that really did seem to put a button that, saying, this is the end. There is not going to be any emergency help for Donald Trump to block his testimony at this point. And we know that the prosecutors are really trying to rebuild an understanding under oath before that federal grand jury investigating January 6.

They want to know about the direct conversations Donald Trump had with people about pressuring Mike Pence to try and block the election. That includes a conversation that no investigator has ever heard before between Donald Trump and Pence himself, where Pence wrote in his book about this conversation. It happened the morning of January 6.

Trump said: "You will go down as a wimp if you do that. I made a big mistake five years ago," whenever he picked Pence as his running mate. That was what Pence -- what Trump said on that call to Mike Pence. Pence said he was unmoved by all of this pressure, even the direct conversation from Donald Trump that morning.

And we do expect that is something that prosecutors, the grand jury could be asking Pence about today, if he does appear today, or in the coming days. We expect that could come quite soon, as prosecutors have moved very fast in this case -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: Pence's testimony essential to this investigation.

Katelyn Polantz, thanks so much.

And, Boris, you got the Manhattan DA. You got the special counsel. You have the E. Jean Carroll case, and you have an attorney, a DA in Atlanta still has to make a decision.

SANCHEZ: Yes, quite the backdrop for a presidential campaign, right?

Meantime, Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, taking swings at Disney after the company sued him for allegedly violating its constitutional rights. DeSantis was in Jerusalem this morning, and he dismissed the lawsuit as political, warning that Disney should not expect more days of special treatment.

Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. RON DESANTIS (R-FL): I don't think the suit has merit. I think it's political. They're upset because they're actually having to live by the same rules as everybody else. They don't want to have to pay the same taxes as everybody else, and they want to be able to control things without proper oversight.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Disney's lawsuit alleges that DeSantis waged a relentless campaign, weaponizing the government against the company to retaliate for expressing a political viewpoint.

That viewpoint, of course, is Disney's opposition to a Florida law banning classroom discussion of sex or gender orientation. Disney says that, after it spoke out against the law, DeSantis moved to revoke its special tax status.

Now, keep in mind this lawsuit comes as Dis -- as DeSantis is reportedly preparing to launch a run for the White House and as some of his potential rivals slam his decision to pick a fight with the mouse.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NIKKI HALEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If Disney would like to move their hundreds of thousands of jobs to South Carolina and bring the billions of dollars with them, I will let them know I will be happy to meet them in South Carolina.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: With debate season just around the corner, it remains to be seen whether the feud is going to help or hurt DeSantis among Republican voters.

Jim, it seems like Trump is not the only one facing lawsuits.

SCIUTTO: No question. And yet he still seems to pull ahead.

Well, other story we're following, for the first time, WNBA star Brittney Griner, she is speaking publicly about the time she spent in Russian custody, nearly a year. What exactly she's saying, that's coming up.

Later, a manhunt for a suspected killer, it ends in flames.

This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:28:56]

SCIUTTO: Suspected leaker Jack Teixeira is in a Massachusetts courtroom today, as federal prosecutors argue that releasing the 21- year-old Air National Guardsman would put U.S. national security at risk.

They say he has a history of making violent threats and are pointing to an arsenal of weapons the suspect had in his bedroom. Teixeira's lawyers say the government is exaggerating the danger.

The U.S. economy grew at a much slower pace in the first quarter of this year, at a rate of just 1.1 percent, that well below economists' expectations. But first-time claims for unemployment benefits fell last week, 230,000 initial claims filed for the week ending April 22. That's down 16,000 claims from the week before.

Brianna, the job market still strong.

KEILAR: It certainly is.

Brittney Griner was met with applause today at a press conference for the Phoenix Mercury. This is the next step in resuming her professional basketball career after her 10-month-long detainment in Russia. And she was moved to tears when she answered the very first question.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRINER: I'm no stranger to -- to hard times. So.