Return to Transcripts main page

CNN News Central

Missile Strikes in Ukraine; Interview With State Sen. Penry Gustafson (R-SC); Inflation Easing; Abortion Ban Backlash?. Aired 1- 1:30p ET

Aired April 28, 2023 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:32]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Abortion backlash. New restrictions fail in South Carolina and Nebraska because some conservatives wouldn't get behind them. Are Republicans starting to fear these types of bans could cost them in 2024?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: Inflation cools. New data suggests the Fed is winning its fight against rising prices. So now what? Central bankers days away from a key meeting and a critical decision on rates. Will the hikes finally come to an end?

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: And the chatbot will see you now. New studies looking at how artificial intelligence could transform medicine. We're going to talk about what it means for you and your human doctor.

We're following these major developing stories and many more all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

KEILAR: Two severely restrictive abortion bans in two Republican- dominated state legislatures, Nebraska and South Carolina, both failed on Thursday, handing unexpected victories to abortion rights advocates, and highlighting this struggle within the GOP on how far abortion bans should go.

We saw this moment in Nebraska, people moved even to tears up in the so-called Heartbeat Act failed by just one vote. It would have banned most abortions after around six weeks of pregnancy, when doctors say women, most of them, aren't even aware that they're pregnant.

And, in South Carolina's state Senate, five women, three of whom are Republican, joined together to filibuster a near-total ban on abortion there.

CNN's Dianne Gallagher is covering these latest developments for us.

The three Republicans in South Carolina, Dianne, who helped block this particular measure spoke passionately against it.

DIANNE GALLAGHER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Brianna.

And it is the third time since the Dobbs ruling that those five women in the South Carolina Senate, as you said, three of them Republicans, have effectively killed a near-total abortion ban in that state. Republicans outnumber Democrats 2-1 in the South Carolina Senate.

And, look, yesterday, it was a 22-21 vote, just a one-vote margin, that blocked a bill that would effectively ban all abortions from the point of conception, with very limited exceptions for rape and incest, just up to 12 weeks.

Now, each time that they have killed this bill, it has been those five women taking to the floor with impassioned speeches on biology, giving lessons on what it's like to be pregnant, also noting the current climate and potential backlash, though, that Republicans could face if they passed it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STATE SEN. SANDY SENN (R-SC): There is not a single thing that I can do when women such as me are insulted, except to make sure that you get an earful. And you need to blame this earful on following that leader blindly off the cliff for the third time on abortion.

And I'm sure you're getting an earful, if you're being honest, from your wives, from your children, from your grandchildren. You cannot tell me that you are not. I know you are.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GALLAGHER: Now, it was also just a one-vote margin in Nebraska on Thursday.

An effort to basically ban abortion around the sixth week of pregnancy, before a person often knows that they are pregnant, fell one short vote of breaking a filibuster, Brianna, because two senators abstained. And, look, the big deal in this one is one of those abstentions was actually a co sponsor of the bill, 80-year-old Senator Merv Riepe, who, again, a cosigner of the bill.

He sort of changed his mind, he said. After looking at things, he presented an amendment to make it a 12-week ban, instead of six-week. That amendment never got a vote, Brianna, so he didn't vote, and it didn't pass.

KEILAR: Yes, he moderated, and it was something to witness.

Dianne Gallagher, thank you so much.

We're seeing this moderation happening in real time, Boris, in places where you might not expect it to happen.

SANCHEZ: Yes, certainly, South Carolina and Nebraska not places that you would anticipate this kind of debate to get so heated, because of their voting record.

My next guest is one of those Republicans who opposed the legislation in South Carolina. And state Senator Penry Gustafson describes herself as -- quote -- "pro-life."

He or she is before the vote. Listen to this. [13:05:02]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STATE SEN. PENRY GUSTAFSON (R-SC): And no matter what the intent is of these people who are preaching, not just speaking to the bill, but really going beyond that, I think, no matter the intent, there are millions of women, millions of women in this state who feel like they have been personally addressed in this legislation.

There are millions of women who feel like they had not been heard, and that's why I'm standing up here this long. And I have never done this before. We have come to an impasse with these abortion bills.

We -- we are here again. I don't like it. We need to do something.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Unfortunately, it appears we're having some technical issues with the state senator. So, we will get to that conversation in just a moment -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: Yes, be sure to have that in conversation.

Meanwhile, bracing for serious flooding in the Midwest. The winter's heavy snows, well, they're melting now and are pushing the Upper Mississippi River beyond its banks. Experts warn the snowmelt could cause some of the worst flooding in 20 years.

This is Davenport, Iowa, from the air. Floodwaters there have already swallowed much of the riverfront area. And the threat along the river will linger, experts say, for weeks.

CNN meteorologist Allison Chinchar, she's been covering.

So, Allison, I mean, listen, we're waiting for this here, certainly out West as well. Where's it going to go from here, and for how long?

ALLISON CHINCHAR, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Right.

So, the hope is that it starts to come back down. We have a lot of these river gauges that are already at moderate or major flood stage, dozens of them across the Upper Midwest. We're hoping we can bring those back down in the coming days.

One thing that's been benefiting us is, temperatures have been at or below normal. That doesn't allow for the melting to be very rapid. But even with that said, we have still had pretty significant amounts of water here coming into these rivers, creeks and streams.

Now, this is the Mississippi River, specifically at the Davenport gauge right now hovering right at around 20 feet. We anticipate this will crest likely Monday or Tuesday of next week just around 21.5 feet. Now, the record sits at 22.5 feet. So we're not likely to get to the record, but still close enough. And one thing to note too is, this is what it already looks like. And

you have to understand, the water is still going to rise until we get to that crest right -- likely around Monday or Tuesday of next week. Now, another thing too, albeit not a lot, we are anticipating some rain across this region over the weekend.

And that -- the concern there is, that is certainly not going to help, Jim, in terms of bringing those levels back down anytime soon.

SCIUTTO: All right, so let's move a little south, concerns about severe storms. I can see it on your map there in Texas.

Where is it going to be worst? What should people be bracing for?

CHINCHAR: Right, so this is going to be a multiday-event system. So the focus right now is really across areas of Oklahoma and Texas. We don't have the severe storms just yet.

That's going to really fire up later this afternoon and into the evening. So this is going to be that focal point, basically, Dallas and Shreveport all the way back to the Texas-Mexico line. Main threats here are going to be damaging winds, some isolated tornadoes, and extremely large hail.

I cannot emphasize that enough. You're talking tennis ball-size or even larger. And this is multiple events this week. Take a look at this hail that was taken from Waco, Texas -- Texas this week. So, again, we have already experienced some of these areas dealing with large hail. Today, we're likely going to see a very similar setup.

Here's a look at that system as it begins to fill in, you will notice this afternoon, especially right there along Eastern Texas, and then it's going to gradually push off to the east into states like Louisiana, eventually in towards Arkansas. Then, by tomorrow, we see the main threat really kind of being right here along the Gulf Coast region and pushing over along the Atlantic Coast of states, say, like South Carolina and even into Georgia.

Now, the threats themselves are pretty similar. We're still looking at damaging winds and the potential for some isolated tornadoes and even waterspouts along the coastline there and also some hail, not quite as large as today, but there will still be some hail as a threat for tomorrow.

And another concern is, because it does start to slow down on the eastern portion of this, we could also have a pretty significant amount of rain, Jim, as well. Some of these areas could pick up three to five inches of rain just through the weekend.

SCIUTTO: Goodness. We just said goodbye to the snow, and now here comes the rain.

Allison Chinchar, thanks so much.

And I understand, Boris, you got your guest dialed up.

SANCHEZ: Yes, we were able to figure out the technical issues.

Turning back now to the fight over abortion, South Carolina State Senator Penry Gustafson is one of those Republicans who opposed the legislation. And she describes herself as -- quote -- "pro-life."

State Senator, we're grateful to have you this afternoon. This is the third time a near-total abortion ban has been put up for a vote in your chamber. And I'm wondering what your message is to those Republicans, not only in South Carolina, but across the country, who are not in line with popular opinion on this issue.

[13:10:00]

GUSTAFSON: Well, first of all, thank you for having me today. It's quite an honor to be able to speak on your show and nationally about such a polarizing issue.

I am pro-life. And my -- I guess the message would be that there -- we -- it's not too late to pass good legislation. The South Carolina House has a Senate abortion bill. It's a six-week bill. It's good, solid, and it will pass constitutional muster.

But this one, H3774, would not -- I don't think it would pass our South Carolina Supreme Court. That was the number one reason why I opposed it.

SANCHEZ: So, to be clear, you are in favor of a six-week ban on abortion; is that correct?

GUSTAFSON: Yes, sir.

I do not think we have a right to abortion. But we may not have a right, but it is the reality. And I have always said it needs to be legal, safe and rare, really rare. But there's got to be some gray area, because life is not simply black and white.

I recognize that, and over 70 percent of South Carolina recognizes that. Most of us feel in our state there should be restrictions. So it's just reaching a happy middle, or at least a general consensus among the bodies. And the South Carolina House will not accept our stance, the Senate.

So that's what happened for the third time.

SANCHEZ: I'm wondering how much politics influences that reality that you're describing, because, as we have seen now, not only in your state, but in Nebraska and in the midterm elections and in special elections across the country, Democrats have made abortion a central issue, because they know voters will side with them.

How much of this is politics?

GUSTAFSON: Well, I appreciate that question. And I think most people would assume that.

However, I'm a different kind of politician. I make my decisions independent of the national news. I try to focus on our state and my district, which is 27 South Carolina. I got some good advice from Senator Tim Scott. I asked him once. I said: "How do you deal with all the outside noise and all that?"

And he told me: "I focus on the job. I focus on the job. And I try to do it the best I can do."

It was great advice. That's what I try to do. Frankly, sir, with all due respect, whatever Alaska is doing does not affect South Carolina at all, since the states are determining this per state. So I'm not really affected personally, my voting, by that. I really have to go about what my constituents want and what's best for the state and in line with my own beliefs.

SANCHEZ: I certainly respect that. I am curious to get your perspective, though, on one of your state senators, Lindsey Graham.

You noted this is an issue that you would like to see decided by the states.

GUSTAFSON: Yes.

SANCHEZ: He's promoting a nationwide 15-week ban on abortion. It's not exactly picking up a lot of steam, not exactly popular. It seems like you disagree with it.

GUSTAFSON: Can you still hear me, sir?

SANCHEZ: Yes, of course. I'm wondering if you agree...

GUSTAFSON: Do we still have audio?

SANCHEZ: Yes. Are you able to hear me?

GUSTAFSON: It sounds like you're breaking up.

SANCHEZ: It's...

GUSTAFSON: But I will continue with the answer.

SANCHEZ: Sure.

GUSTAFSON: Senator Graham and others nationally, I have talked with some of my colleagues, especially my female colleagues, and we think it's a bad idea.

If you're going to send the decision-making to the states, we need to do that. We need to legislate on behalf of our states. This quasi- federal/state government thing, we're getting into an area of problems, problematic for separation of the powers and separation of the different parts of government.

So, either the federal government is going to do this or not. I say, stay out. Stay away. We are handling this state by state.

SANCHEZ: And, state Senator, I hope you can still hear me. I'm wondering if that applies to your belief about a potential Supreme Court decision on mifepristone, the most commonly used abortion drug in the country.

There's some dispute over whether a judge in Texas can -- no? She's having -- unfortunately, State Senator Penry Gustafson is having issues hearing us.

If you can hear me, we very much appreciate your time. I'd love to come back for an answer.

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: Maybe next time. We will get your answer on the mifepristone question as soon as we get a chance.

Thank you so much, state Senator. We do appreciate it -- Brianna, over to you.

KEILAR: Boris, there are new signs that the Fed's inflation fight is working. The Central Bank's favorite measure cooled down more in March.

We have seen Vanessa Yurkevich here to break all of this down for us.

Vanessa, bottom line here, what does this mean for Americans?

[13:15:01]

VANESSA YURKEVICH, CNN BUSINESS AND POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: It's good news for Americans. It means that prices are cooling.

The personal consumption expenditure data point is something that the Fed really likes to look at, because it's very detailed. And what we saw is, its PCE rose 0.1 percent in March. That is historically what we like to see, but PCE on the year up 4.2 percent. That is still high.

So the Fed may like what they saw in March, but, on the year, they still have some work to do. And also, today, we got employers cost index. This is what employ -- employers pay in terms of wages to employees. That was up 1.2 percent in the first three months of this year. That is up higher than what we saw on the last three months of 2022.

That is good news for Americans. Obviously, higher wages is better, but that also fuels inflationary spending. So what the Federal Reserve is going to be doing is looking at these two data points, Brianna, and, as they go into their meeting next week, that will factor in to how they raise interest rates going forward, Brianna.

KEILAR: Vanessa, we're also seeing some stocks, stocks for First Republic Bank plunge. What's going on here?

YURKEVICH: Yes, so First Republic, their stock fell about 50 percent at one point today, but the stock has been falling over the last several days, down 97 percent on the year. And this is because earlier this week, we heard from First Republic in their earnings call. And they reported that about 40 percent of their deposits got pulled out of the bank. That's about $100 billion. And so, as we are seeing this stock price continue to fall, there are also reports that the FDIC is going to come in and take over the bank, just as they did with Signature Bank and also with SVB.

The White House also telling CNN that they have no plans, Brianna, to rescue First Republic.

KEILAR: All right, Vanessa, thank you for that.

We have much more on tap, Boris.

SANCHEZ: Yes, still ahead: Russia strikes.

YURKEVICH: OK, thanks, guys.

SANCHEZ: Long-range missiles launch across Ukraine. CNN is on the scene in one city where children are among the dead.

Plus, Army helicopters colliding, killing three soldiers while returning from a training flight in Alaska. What went wrong there?

And happening now above the Earth, a space walk under way at the International Space Station. A retired astronaut will join us live to explain why this one is making history.

All that more coming up next on CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:21:45]

SCIUTTO: A devastating attack in Ukraine overnight.

In the early hours of the morning, Russia fired missiles at various targets across the country. As we have seen time and again in this conflict, civilians paid the price. The highest casualties were here in Uman, leveling almost, striking a residential apartment building, setting it on fire.

At least 22 people are already confirmed dead, including four children. Officials say they expect the death toll there to rise, and understandably.

CNN's Nic Robertson, he has been on the scene in Uman.

And, Nic, I understand you witnessed some of the aftermath of this. Tell us what you're seeing there.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes, four children are among those 22 people dead as well, Jim.

It's been heart-wrenching to watch because the people standing just behind us are friends and relatives of some of those victims standing there trying to find out what's happened to the ones that they love. We have seen the area swarmed by heavy diggers trying to pull at the rubble at the base of this nine-story building, dozens upon dozens of firefighters there.

It was late afternoon when they were able to excavate out the basement area where a lot of people, when they hear the sirens that went off in the early hours of this morning, when many people were asleep, some people would have likely been sleeping down in that basement already.

There were a number of bodies that were recovered from that basement, at least one child. That's a place that a lot of people feel is a safe sanctuary in these old apartment buildings. But higher up on the higher floors, we know the recovery workers are hoping to get into that -- into those floors, even as the light is fading here late into the day.

We talked to one lady who said she had spoken to a woman who lived on the eighth floor of the building near the top of the building. She said her friend had survived. The friend's husband was in hospital, but their two daughters, one 13 years old and her sister, 7 years old, were still missing.

And the real big concern is, of course, that they are under the rubble up there high in the building. That's where the firefighters will be going in the coming hours, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Now, we know Russia deliberately targets civilians, civilian areas.

Just quickly, were there any military targets in the area? Was the strike here apparently deliberate?

ROBERTSON: Jim, it's not clear.

This was a stealth Kh-101 cruise missile. It flies below the radar. This is what the officials, Ukrainian officials, are telling us. What military sites may be close to this area, we don't know. Most of these towns around here -- and this is a small town. Most of these towns have airfields. We wouldn't know what would be using that sort of airfield.

SCIUTTO: Yes. And you got to plug in coordinates for the -- for those missiles, so they chose their target.

Nic Robertson, thanks so much -- Boris.

SANCHEZ: In Alaska, three soldiers are dead and another injured after two military helicopters crash during a training exercise.

Army officials say that two Apache helicopters like these you see here were flying back from a training flight when they collided near Healy. That's about 100 miles south of Fort Wainwright. Two of the soldiers were pronounced dead on the scene. A third died while being transported to the hospital.

[13:25:00] Notably, this comes less than in a month after nine soldiers were killed in Kentucky when two Black Hawk helicopters crashed during a training mission -- Brianna.

KEILAR: Boris, coming up: Why wasn't he caught earlier?

Lawmakers and officials demand to know why the Pentagon leak suspect could allegedly post classified documents online for months before the Defense Department found out.

Plus, the nation's largest transportation system is saying goodbye to Twitter. Why New York's MTA is giving the tech giant the boot.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)