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Four Proud Boys Members Found Guilty Of Seditious Conspiracy; Man Accused Of Killing One, Wounding Four Caught After Hours-Long Manhunt; Today: E. Jean Carroll's Lawyers Expected To Rest Case. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired May 04, 2023 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00]

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JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: In a major victory for the Justice Department, a jury just found four members of the Proud Boys guilty of seditious conspiracy, including the group's leader Enrique Tarrio. We're going to be live outside the courthouse.

JESSICA DEAN, CNN ANCHOR: Ludicrous. That's what the U.S. is calling Russian accusations it was involved in a drone attack on the Kremlin. Meantime, retaliation strikes in Ukraine intensified. We're live from the battlefield. That's next.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: And the suspect in the Atlanta mass shooting waived the right to his first court appearance today. His mother is now speaking out. What we're learning about him and one of the victims? All these developing stories and many more all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

SCIUTTO: An historic verdict today on some of the most serious charges related to the January 6 insurrection. Four members of the far-right group known as the Proud Boys were found guilty of seditious conspiracy. Enrique Tarrio, Zachary Rehl, Joseph Biggs, and Ethan Nordean were on trial for their role in trying to prevent a peaceful transfer of power after the 2020 election. The guilty verdict sparked the third time that prosecutors have secured convictions for seditious conspiracy following the insurrection.

CNN's Katelyn Polantz, she's live outside the courthouse. And, Katelyn, from the beginning, legal experts and lawyers have said this is not an easy charge to get a conviction on. And yet here they have again. Explained exactly what the jury decided here.

KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME & JUSTICE REPORTER (on camera): It's not an easy charge and it's not one that the Justice Department uses often or uses lightly. But they have levied this charge against members of these right-wing groups taking part on January 6. And now juries are agreeing that the Justice Department has enough evidence to prove the case that these men, leaders of the Proud Boys came to an agreement and wanted to somehow block, hurt, hinder, or even overthrow the U.S. government using force. So, those are the two key things that were proved today that the jury agreed with and that resulted in finding these four men, these four leaders of the Proud Boys, including Enrique Tarrio, who was not in Washington, DC on January 6, guilty of seditious conspiracy. Jim, it's both that force -- the use of force is a key part of that charge that they are found guilty on. And the fact that there is some sort of agreement, some sort of planning, and some sort of communication to take steps forward not just on the ground on January 6 but before, during, and then as the prosecutors pointed out that there was a celebration after.

In one text message that was used in this case as evidence, Enrique Terrio sent a message to other Proud Boys on January 6, writing, make no mistake, we did this. And the jury has agreed with the prosecutors and the Justice Department so far.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Goodness, those words, make no mistakes. We -- made no mistake, we did this. And now, that conviction of Tarrio is seen as especially significant in part because he was not there on the day. So, how did prosecutors manage that?

POLANTZ: Right. That's very unusual. And so, what they did to do that is that they were showing Tarrio in conversation in secret chats publicly discussing this.

One of the other things that he wrote. It was publicly online after the election in November of 2020. He wrote, if Biden steals this election, the Proud Boys will be political prisoners. We won't go quietly, I promise.

So, that's how they were building the case around Tarrio. They were able to show that there were Proud Boys on the ground on January 6, leading the rioters into the Capitol, finding a way in, breaking a window. And Tarrio was part of that group that was interested in that -- in this leading up to the day, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Katelyn Polantz, thanks so much. Joining us now is CNN Legal Analyst Elliot Williams, here to share his analysis. First, let's get to the case against them.

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes.

SCIUTTO: Because as we were saying with Katelyn, going into this, folks, I think yourself included, said hard one to prove.

WILLIAMS: Yes.

[14:05:04]

SCIUTTO: Let's look at some of the things that these folks said via their text messages. Here's one of them. So, we just stormed the effing Capitol. Took the mother effing place back. That was so much fun, celebrating as Katelyn was citing.

WILLIAMS: Right. SCIUTTO: Here's another one. Dude, we're right in front of the Capitol right now. American citizens are storming the Capitol taking it back right now. We've gone through every barricade thus far, taking it back. That kind of language there, how do they pull this off?

WILLIAMS: So, how they pull this off? Now, look. Seditious conspiracy is a charge you don't see that often. Frankly, in American history, the last time it even got charged was 2010 because there's this surprisingly, a fine line between protected speech and disrupting the government by force or impeding the actions of the government. Now, those two text messages were very, very important ones, Jim, because what you're seeing is a celebration at the fact that they impeded, obstructed, or delayed the functionings of government.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WILLIAMS: So, it's hard. It doesn't happen that often. But this might be the case that holds up and (INAUDIBLE)

SCIUTTO: You know what sticks in my mind as I heard that it's not unlike the way terrorist suspects are charged.

WILLIAMS: Yes.

SCIUTTO: And that they will look to see if they celebrate after the fact that to establish their connection and their intent, and so on. I do want to ask because this is an obvious question --

WILLIAMS: Right.

SCIUTTO: -- because the Justice Department is currently looking into the president's role in all this.

WILLIAMS: Right.

SCIUTTO: He did not storm the Capitol himself. He did not break a window in the Capitol, that kind of thing. But he did go to the mall and encourage folks, it seemed, one could interpret his comments to disrupt the processor.

WILLIAMS: Sure.

SCIUTTO: And that was something else that these defendants were found guilty of, trying to disrupt, prevent a functioning of government here. When you look at this case. Any indicators as to how the Justice Department might proceed with the case against them?

WILLIAMS: What you just read to me were text messages that establish the conspiracy. And the challenge whenever you're establishing a conspiracy is you have to have an agreement between two parties. And finding an agreement between the former president and the people who were there on that day was just going to be exceptionally difficult.

Now, look, this was a historic moment and certainly a tragic moment on any number of levels, right? But the question is, can you link the defendant to the misconduct in the way -- SCIUTTO: Yes.

WILLIAMS: -- and that -- for seditious conspiracy?

SCIUTTO: No.

WILLIAMS: It was -- now, there's other crimes -- there's other terms you might be able to charge the President with, seditious conspiracy.

SCIUTTO: How about -- how about for incitement? For instance, I mean if you're thinking again, terror act --

WILLIAMS: Correct.

SCIUTTO: -- if you might not have made the bomb. But if you said, hey, it'd be pretty nice if you did something along those lines. You might see a case developing there. Is that --

WILLIAMS: For incitement. Again, you got to get past the Free Speech point --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WILLIAMS: -- particularly for an elected official. And the people -- he would have to know that violence would necessarily be what would follow from his actions. But again, the things that we're talking about here. Conspiracy to obstruct Congress, mail fraud, wire fraud, and conspiracy to defraud the United States are all incredibly serious crimes. I just think reaching the bar for incitement could just be challenging.

SCIUTTO: We'll see.

WILLIAMS: Yes.

SCIUTTO: He sure talking to a lot of folks who are speaking to him on that day.

WILLIAMS: Oh, yes.

SCIUTTO: Elliot Williams, thanks so much. Jessica.

DEAN: Russia is seeking revenge and scapegoat after an alleged drone attack on the criminal left smoldering damage on the Senate Palace dome. And today, Moscow baselessly accused Washington of being behind it saying Ukraine is a puppet of the U.S. in this war. The White House dismissing this accusation as a bald-faced lie and expanding on their thinking just a few moments ago. Listen.

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JOHN KIRBY, NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL SPOKESPERSON: Investigating and I want to be clear, I said we're still looking at this. We don't have -- we haven't come to any conclusions one way or the other. We're going to try to learn more. But let's not label it a report or an investigation or anything like that. We're doing the best we can to try to find out what happened.

Let's not lose the bigger picture here. It's not like Mr. Putin has to invent new reasons to kill innocent Ukrainians. He keeps doing it over and over and over again. Now, whether he's going to use this as some sort of pretext is up to him. But just in the last 24 hours, you know, he's bombing shoppers at a supermarket. So, the violence just continues one way or the other.

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DEAN: And that violence includes the heaviest assault on Kyiv in months. And in Odessa, attack drones emblazoned with the message for the Kremlin and for Moscow. CNN's Nic Robertson is in eastern Ukraine for us. And, Nic, first Moscow out-blamed Ukraine, now they're blaming the U.S. It's like we're seeing escalating rhetoric and we're also seeing escalating attacks.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR (on camera): It is. It serves Putin's purpose and perhaps no one else is because it gives him -- or furthers his rationale that Russia is not only up against Ukraine, it's up against NATO. It's up against the United States.

You know, the embarrassment for President Putin that two drones could get themselves over the Kremlin, how else does he explain that? Well, first of all, they blame it on the Ukrainians. But then, how can Putin look the Russians in the eye and say on the one hand we're winning the fight in Ukraine and on the other hand, Ukraine can get drones over the Kremlin? This is the essence of what Putin is saying. So, now they've taken it up and said, well, of course, you know this was directed by Washington.

[14:10:01]

This is the way that Putin explains that essentially, Russia is not doing as well as he says, but the retaliation has been there. Indeed, in the past less than an hour, there have been drone strikes over Kyiv. A city official in Kyiv has said that one drone was shot down over the city.

Debris has fallen on the city. It's not clear how much damage are actually at this moment. How many UAVs may have been shot down over Kyiv? That's a developing situation as the city deals with those incoming drones.

Overnight last night, again, Kyiv targeted by Moscow. Odessa in the South 15 drones fired at it. 12 of them shot down. But on the tail fence of some of those drones, that message you're talking about there from Moscow, from the Kremlin. So, it's that Russia's entire response is that it done last night and today.

It really isn't clear. The city that has taken a lot of hammering over the past 24 hours is Kherson in the south and east, 539 different artillery impacts until early this morning. 23 people killed, 46 injured, two of them, children, and this is the worst that Kherson has had it. Now, Ukraine -- the Russians may be looking at Kherson and thinking this is where Ukraine is going to launch its counter-offensive from it's not clear why they double down on that city. But that's what's happening. Russia makes up a narrative that retaliates, and civilians are the ones who are injured.

DEAN: Yes, no doubt about it. Nic Robertson, for us in eastern Ukraine. Thanks so much for that reporting. Brianna.

KEILAR: Jessica, we're joined now by a member of the House Intelligence Committee, Democratic Congresswoman Chrissy Houlahan of Pennsylvania.

Congresswoman, thank you so much for spending some time with us today. Russia, of course, is calling this a planned terrorist attack. But they have no evidence to support this. You have the White House saying that Peskov is lying. You're on the Intel Committee. Have you seen anything to indicate who may be behind this?

REP. CHRISSY HOULAHAN (D-PA): I would not be able to share that information, even if I had it. But I have not received any information, as you mentioned, through all the briefings that we've received, and also that the spokesperson for the White House has explained we have no indication that this came from anywhere. We have no idea who is responsible for this, other than the fact that we have vociferously denied it as well as Zelenskyy vociferously denied it, which I think is really important for us all to understand.

KEILAR: Could it be possible that a Russian anti-government group may be responsible? And if so, would you have expected that they would take responsibility for this?

HOULAHAN: Sure, I mean, the list is really long of the people who have the capability to pull something like this off. It really doesn't take a whole lot of technology or talent to be able to do these sorts of things. And so, I'm not really sure that we could speculate whether or not it's somebody within Russia or the Russians themselves, frankly, who might be looking for this as a red flag to be able to allow for the provocation and the -- and the further destruction of places like Kyiv.

My father actually was born there about 80 years or so ago. And this is a part of the world that's always being rained on by -- with missiles of one form or another. And this is no exception. President -- I'm sorry. Putin has been relentless with his attacks on civilians, and these are absolutely war crimes.

KEILAR: He has been relentless. We're seeing this onslaught that Russia is perpetrating on Ukraine right now in the wake of this attack. We actually are reporting that an unmanned aerial vehicle was shot down over Kyiv.

This is what Ukrainian defense forces say. This is something that happened here not too long ago. How are you viewing the onslaught that Russia has unleashed in the wake of this drone attack? HOULAHAN: Well, so I'm -- I would imagine that Putin is looking for opportunities to respond to retaliate the narrative that he's created in his own head and that he's trying to convince the rest of the world of. And so, this would be one way, I would imagine that he would do that. And again, defenseless people on the ground in Kyiv who are not part of this particular battle and who are being murdered in their civilian lives is not the response that any person would expect from anybody. And certainly, Putin is demonstrating the fact that he is a reprehensible and no leader certainly.

KEILAR: Yes. We see in the pictures. They're being killed while grocery shopping. These are civilians here.

I do want to ask you on the domestic side. Seven Defense Secretaries from both Democratic and Republican administrations are now urging Republican Senators Tuberville and Lee to stop blocking military promotions over a DOD policy that allows service women time off and also travel reimbursements for them as well as military spouses independents who have to go out of state to receive abortion care. Of course, many bases are in states that do not allow for abortion care. You're an Air Force veteran, what's your message to them, to senators about how this affects women in the military?

HOULAHAN: So, I'm not only a veteran and obviously a woman and a mother, but I also serve on the Armed Services Committee and in -- within the Armed Services Committee on the Military Personnel Subcommittee so it's in my direct line of responsibility to think about these issues.

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And I have joined those senators and asked -- I'm sorry, those folks who have supported making sure that women have access to travel and have access to the ability to take the time off that they need to be able to seek health care that they can't find in the places that they are stationed. When you serve in the military, you serve, and you don't choose where you get to go. And so, it's really important that we support these women in their choices to make sure that they can travel to places where they can avail themselves of the health care that they deserve.

KEILAR: How does this affect military readiness? How will this affect it if these blocks continue?

HOULAHAN: Sure. It's multi-dimensional. I think it, of course, affects the life and service of the person that we're talking about. It also affects the willingness of people to be able to continue to serve. We have an all-volunteer service, as you might recall.

And so, when you're thinking about what sort of career you'd like to pursue, you may think twice if you feel as though your rights are being limited by a place like the military. And we really can't afford to have any person who's interested in wheeling and serving in uniform feeling as though their rights and freedoms and liberties would be taken away as a consequence of that. So, I think it's a short-term readiness issue and it's also a longer-term readiness issue. KEILAR: Yes, the big anniversary of that all-volunteer force that we're seeing here as well. Congresswoman, thank you so much. Really appreciate your time and your service. Thank you so much. Jim?

HOULAHAN: You're welcome.

SCIUTTO: Well, several victims are still in intensive care following yesterday's mass shooting in Atlanta. You saw us covering it here. The latest on their injuries and what we know about the suspected shooter.

Also ahead, Donald Trump's legal team says it will not put a defense in the trial, the rape and defamation trial. What's behind that strategy?

And as the shortage of air traffic controllers worsens in this country, the FAA is looking for applicants. We'll tell you what the qualifications are just ahead. You're watching CNN NEWS CENTRAL. Stay with us.

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DEAN: A nearly eight-hour manhunt across two Georgia counties ending in the capture of this man, Deion Patterson. A 24-year-old military veteran is suspected of fatally shooting a woman and injuring four others at an Atlanta medical facility. And you can see here the frantic aftermath of the facility as it unfolded. Newly released dispatch audio from the moments after the shooting. Deion Patterson's mother helped in the search for her son.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They're now advising an active shooter. Person shot. Advising female shot She's seriously believing. Shot in the side and the back.

Black male about six feet tall with a black hoodie. He's going to be the part between the ages of 20 and 25. Named Deion Patterson. Caller is still in the phone with 911 advising that it's going to be her son.

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DEAN: CNN's Ryan Young is now joining us from Atlanta. And, Ryan, we are learning more about the victims' conditions. What can you tell us about that?

RYAN YOUNG, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, so very tough for this community throughout the city of Atlanta who's been trying to put the pieces together. Especially in this small midtown area where people come to work all the time, and then stopping outside of this location really just to sort of look up and see what was going on yesterday. When you talk about the people who are involved in this, at least two people are still in critical. One is in stable condition.

And when you think about the work that Grady did yesterday in terms of being ready for all these victims when they started being brought in during this mass couching -- mass casualty event, they were able to give them aid very quickly. In fact, listen to the doctor at Grady Hospital talk about the work that still has to be done.

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DR. ROBERT JANSEN, CHIEF MEDICAL OFFICER, GRADY HEALTH SYSTEM: They have been traumatized. They are very grateful for the support and care they've received. They realize that this is a horrific event. And the fact that they were in a health care facility just makes it worse.

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YOUNG: Yes, this has been very tough for this community. The one person killed is a CDC employee, Amy St. Pierre. Throughout this afternoon, I've been talking to people who lived in Atlanta for quite some time. Friends who know folks who work inside this building, there's a total state of shock. And they also wanted to make sure that the police department got a lot of praise for what they were able to do yesterday.

When you talked about that 911 call where that mother was so instrumental in terms of helping to get that information out early on to authorities so that they can start that tracking processes, through the camera network. It was through the mutual cooperations from the police departments in this area that they were able to bring this to a close in a certain direction. But there are still so many questions about how did everyone end up in this place yesterday where a lot of people were trying to get medical care and then the shots started being fired.

There was one woman talking about the idea of trying to have some sort of memorial service out here. Because the one thing that so many people are scared of is that people will move on from this so very quickly because of all the gun violence that's in America, Jessica.

DEAN: Right. Because it just keeps happening. All right, Ryan Young, for us in Atlanta, thank you so much. Jim?

SCIUTTO: Now, to the battery and defamation trial against Donald Trump. Lawyers for writer, E. Jean Carroll are expected to rest their case today. Carroll, you'll remember alleges that the former president raped her in a department store dressing room in the 1990s. Trump denies it, but his lawyers say they will not be calling any witnesses.

CNN's Kara Scannell, she's outside the courthouse in New York. And, Kara, I wonder how do his lawyers explain this decision not to, in effect present the case?

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (on camera): Jim, I couldn't quite hear your question there. But I can tell you that the jury heard about 30 minutes of Trump's deposition this morning. That was a videotaped deposition that Trump sat for in October.

And at the heart of this case are the defamatory statements you know where he allegedly said that Carroll was not his type, that he never met her before and that, you know, he did not -- you know, do -- you didn't rape her in the department store. So, Trump admitted today you know.

He confirmed -- he wrote the exact statement. He said it was not anyone else. And then -- and he said that these were his words, and he stood by them in that deposition.

[14:25:04]

Now, he was also shown a black and white photograph of him at a GALA, he was sitting next to his wife Ivana Trump, with E. Jean Carroll and her husband. And it was -- Trump is holding the photograph in his hands. He pointed to it and said, that's Marla, that's my wife. And it was corrected and told, no, that's E. Jean Carroll. And he pointed and said, that's Marla. So, that's going to go part of the argument that Carroll's attorneys are -- make that she was his type at the time, you know, 27 years ago when this alleged assault took place.

You know, the one time that he appeared to become more agitated in this video was when he was addressing the allegations of rape, the underlying issue in the battery charge here. And you know, he became -- you know, a little bit more animated. He said, you know, she is accusing me of rape. That's the worst thing you can do. The worst charge. This is a woman I have no idea who she is.

Then they called Carol Martin, the friend that E. Jean Carroll said she confided in. Martin corroborated that story. She is -- we were just returning from a lunch break. She is back on cross-examination. Then Carroll's lawyers said they have two more witnesses are going to call, an expert and Carroll's former boss at Elle Magazine, Jim.

SCIUTTO: That was amazing. They're discussing their who is and his, not his type. Kara Scannell outside the courthouse, thanks so much. Brianna.

KEILAR: Jim, still to come on CNN NEWS CENTRAL, a major win for climate advocates. The state of New York announces a natural gas ban in new buildings including gas stoves. And shares of PacWest taking a dive after reports that it could be the next regional bank to collapse. It's just further fueling anxiety over the health of the banking sector. We'll have details ahead.

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