Return to Transcripts main page

CNN News Central

Officials Brace For Migrant Influx; Debt Ceiling Fight; Interview With State Sen. Morgan LaMantia (D-TX); Airline Passenger Payback; Eight People Killed at Bus Stop in Texas; Texas Mass Shooting. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired May 08, 2023 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:10]

JOHN KING, CNN HOST: CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: What motivated a killer to commit mass murder in Texas? Did right-wing extremism drive him to kill eight people at an outlet mall? Another American community now in mourning after the latest outbreak of gun violence.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: Killed just waiting at a bus stop, a second inexplicable loss of life in Texas, this one near the Southern border.

Eight people are dead after an SUV plowed into a crowd outside a shelter housing migrants. We are learning new details about the driver and the charges he now faces.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: And passenger payback.

President Biden set to unveil a new rule that could force airlines to compensate you for delays or cancellations. Flyers may think the new rule is overdue, but the devil is really in the details. How much is this going to help? We will explain the move, and you will hear from the president live this hour.

We are following these major developing stories and many more, all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

SANCHEZ: We start today in Allen, Texas, where police are gathering evidence, trying to determine the motive behind Saturday's mass shooting.

A 33-year-old gunman killed eight people and wounded at least seven others at a mall, with victims ranging in age from 5 to 61 years old. Earlier today, CNN spoke to a man who rushed to the scene after he got a call from his son, who was working at the mall. And what he encountered was horrific. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVEN SPAINHOUER, WITNESS: She was -- she was not able to be saved. I couldn't save the second guy. The third guy actually expired while I was trying to do chest compressions. The child -- the child came out from under what I believe was the

mother. It might have been a relative. I don't know how the relation is, but was starting to wander around asking for help, saying: "Mom, mom, mama, mama."

So I just scooped the child up and took them about 15 feet away, so she or she couldn't see what was going on. I -- there was so much blood on the child, I couldn't tell the sex.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: And we're also learning the death toll could have been higher. The police officer who took down the gunman just happened to be on the scene responding to an unrelated call.

Officials say the shooter was wearing tactical gear, armed with an AR- 15-style rifle with at least one other weapon, along with several magazines. A source tells CNN's Josh Campbell that the gunman briefly served in the U.S. military, but was removed because of mental health concerns.

Let's take you now live to the scene in Allen, Texas, with Josh Campbell.

Josh, bring us up to speed with what we're learning about the suspect, because I imagine a big part of this investigation is going to have to do with how he obtained those weapons.

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: No, that's absolutely right, Boris.

And you look at his past, I mean, this is only the latest mass shooting in this country that's raising questions about how a robust background check, if that existed, might have stopped carnage from happening.

I'm told from a law enforcement source that this suspect, a 33-year- old man from the Dallas area, previously served in the United States military, but was removed over concerns about mental health issues. Nevertheless, he then, after leaving the military, some period of time passes, and he becomes a security guard, undergoes weapons training, firearms training, and assembles a small arsenal, which I'm told he brought here to this mall behind me when he conducted that mass attack.

So, as you mentioned, how he collected those weapons is going to be key. I'm also told by a law enforcement source that authorities are zeroing in on a possible motive, particularly related to potential extremism.

Now, I'm told that that comes down to two key pieces of evidence that authorities are looking at. First, after he was shot and killed by that heroic police officer that you just mentioned there, authorities looked at the suspect's body, and, on his chest, they found an insignia that read "RWDS," which a source tells me authorities believe stands for Right-Wing Death Squad. It's the same type of insignia that we have seen many extremists in rallies and protests across the country over the past few years wearing and displaying. Second, I'm told that this suspect in the shooting had an extensive online presence that authorities are now poring over at this hour.

They found posts that the suspect made about white supremacy, about neo-Nazis. So, obviously, we were seeing where this investigation is going as they work to determine why he came here this day, opening fire, killing so many people.

[13:05:02]

SANCHEZ: Yes, just a tragic scene there.

Josh, please keep us up to speed on the very latest details. Thank you so much for that -- Jim, over to you.

SCIUTTO: As you just heard from Josh, the shooter was apparently wearing a patch with "R -- a patch with "RWDS," like you see there.

Authorities believe that stands for "Right-Wing Death Squad," just alarming to hear. The Southern Poverty Law Center monitors extremism here in the U.S. and said that members of various far right groups have worn RWDS patches in recent years. Several Proud Boys, for instance, reportedly have worn it since at least 2018.

Joining us now, CNN senior law enforcement analyst Charles Ramsey. He's led police departments in two major metropolitan areas.

We know, Chief Ramsey, that the FBI has been saying for years that right-wing extremism is the number one terrorist threat in this country. During your time in law enforcement or recently, have you been aware of this particular symbol, RWDS? And what does it mean, in your view?

CHARLES RAMSEY, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: No, I wasn't aware of that particular symbol. I have heard of it, but I wasn't really aware of it during my time as a police chief.

This is something, it may not be relatively new, but it's relatively new as far as I'm concerned. But it really does just go to show how these far right and, for that matter, far left extreme -- extremist organizations pose a threat to our national security.

SCIUTTO: Once again, the shooter used an AR-15, as we have seen in so many mass shootings, semiautomatic, high-velocity rifle.

For someone, again, who served in law enforcement, can you describe what a weapon such as that is -- whether you call it an assault weapon or not, however you define it, what a weapon such as that can do in a short period of time and why it's particularly dangerous?

RAMSEY: Well, first of all, the wounds that are inflicted by a weapon like that are absolutely, incredibly damaging to the human body. These are weapons that were designed for one purpose, and that's to

kill people. And it's very effective as it relates to that in the hands of people that should not have it. My personal feeling is that assault weapons do not belong in the civilian population, but, certainly, they don't belong in the hands of people who are suffering from any form of mental illness, where they're a danger to themselves or others, or people who are just inclined to engage in criminal conduct.

There are a lot of people in our society, unfortunately, that just should not have access to the -- not only these kinds of firearms, but firearms in general. But it really does raise it a lot when you're talking about assault weapons.

You can kill so many people in such a short period of time that you have an officer who happens to be there. He still takes action. And even within that period of time, we have got eight dead.

SCIUTTO: Seconds, not even minutes, oftentimes.

Let me ask you this. Let's say you were called back into duty to run a police department in a metropolitan area in the state of Texas. You have the governor saying, as you often hear in the wake of this from gun rights supporters, that this is purely a mental health issue, does not mention guns.

Texas is a state that has been weakening gun laws in recent years, including not requiring permits under some circumstances. If you were in charge of law enforcement and responding or trying to prevent shootings like this, what position would that put you in?

RAMSEY: Well, I mean, we would be at odds, I mean, the governor and I, because there has to be some form of control over firearms, universal background checks, red flag law.

We got to be able to tighten the loopholes from private sales. I mean, there are a lot of things that can be done. As far as mental health goes, it's the intersection between mental health and firearms that really is the problem. And so it's easy to just say, well, it's a mental health problem.

Well, it's more than that and it's more complicated than that. And you have to really be able to sit down and have a reasonable discussion in order to find that middle ground to be able to deal with this issue in our country of not just mass murder.

I mean, there are murders that occur on the streets of our cities every single day, just don't get the media attention that a mass shooting gets. So, there are things that need to happen. I'm not optimistic it's going to happen, not just in Texas, but in other jurisdictions as well.

There has to be a national solution. It's too easy to circumvent any state law by simply going to another state. Or even buying through mail order, people can buy firearms. We have an issue with ghost guns. I mean, it goes on and on and on, and it's not improving. And it won't improve as long as we have the current group of elected

officials in office.

SCIUTTO: Yes, it struck me. As you were talking there, we're seeing yet another scene of folks walking out with their hands up from this shooting. Goodness, been watching that for 20-some-odd years.

[13:10:00]

Chief Ramsey, always good to have you on. Thanks so much -- Brianna.

KEILAR: Now to another horrifying deadly incident in Texas over the weekend, this time near the border in Brownsville.

At least eight people are dead, several more injured, after a speeding SUV plowed into 18 people at a city bus stop. Police say the driver is a man named George Alvarez, and he's facing eight counts of manslaughter and 10 counts of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon.

The crash was caught on surveillance video. And we're not going to show you all of this video. It is, quite frankly, too disturbing. But you can see here at the top of the screen that SUV that was speeding before it struck the crowd.

Police say Alvarez tried to flee the scene. You can actually see in some cell phone video a crowd of people trying to keep him from escaping.

CNN's Nick Valencia is in Brownsville.

Nick, what else are police saying about Alvarez? You were sitting in on this press conference, where we learned some new things.

NICK VALENCIA, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Brianna, this is somebody that has been known to the Brownsville Police Department for quite some time, according to the police chief.

He has a long criminal history, which includes aggravated assault, as well as driving under the influence and possession of marijuana. He's being held on a $3.6 million bond, charged with eight counts of manslaughter and 10 counts of aggravated assault in this incident.

And I want to show you exactly what happened here. According to eyewitnesses, he came barreling through this intersection at a high rate of speed, totally ignoring this red light, blowing through that, hopping a curb, and eventually ending up just about 40 or 50 yards in that direction, where the migrants were waiting for the bus stop.

Some of them were sitting on the curb, having no idea what was about to happen to them. The investigation has taken police to a variety of threads here, and one of the threads is whether or not this act was intentional.

And it's something that I asked the Brownsville Police Department police chief about directly at a news conference earlier.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VALENCIA: Chief, Nick Valencia at CNN.

How were you able to rule out that this was not intentional? Because it sounds like you're saying he lost control.

FELIX SAUCEDA, BROWNSVILLE, TEXAS, POLICE CHIEF: We have not ruled that out, sir. It is an ongoing investigation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VALENCIA: I spoke to an eyewitness who says there is no doubt in his mind the act was intentional. He said that Alvarez tried to get out of the car and take off running.

He was eventually subdued by eyewitnesses here, and all of this, of course, Brianna, happening with just days left in Title 42 before it expires, causing a lot of anxiety along border communities like this one here in Brownsville -- Brianna.

KEILAR: Yes, certainly is.

Nick Valencia, thank you so much for that report.

I now want to bring in Texas State Senator Morgan LaMantia. She represents the area where this happened.

Senator, I'm so sorry for what your community is going through here. This is just awful.

And it seems increasingly like this may have been an accident. Is that your read?

STATE SEN. MORGAN LAMANTIA (D-TX): So, this is one of the largest mass fatality instances that Brownsville has ever had.

Our chief of police and our police department are doing everything they can to make sure that they are fully investigating this issue. So they're not going to be releasing any information. So, as far as we know right now, it could have been intentional, but there could have been an accidental element to it as well.

And so until we have more information and they're able to interview all the witnesses, we're not going to know for a fact, at least not yet.

KEILAR: So, some of these folks, I mean, they just arrived in the country this weekend. I wonder if you see this as this tragedy speaking to the vulnerable state that your community and these migrants are in at a critical time, with Title 42 expiring this week.

LAMANTIA: Very much so.

In the state of Texas, we treat everyone's lives equally, regardless of their citizenship status. And these individuals that came across, they came across recently

across the border, and this is after over three months of travel through some of the most dangerous terrain and going through just very, very dangerous situations. And yet they made it to Texas. They're one of the lucky few that actually made it to our borders.

And at a point where they should be able to breathe easy and be safe, we failed them as a state. We failed them and weren't able to protect them. And they were mowed down. Their lives were taken. Their families' hopes were taken. And this is something, with Title 42 ending, with the influx of more migrants coming across and more individuals coming to our state, we need to make sure we protect them at every step of the way.

KEILAR: The suspect here, George Alvarez, I mean, that rap sheet that was displayed at this press conference is so long.

And we heard Chief Sauceda say, you know, even if this was an accident, look, this is someone with this criminal history. Was this person a ticking time bomb?

LAMANTIA: I can't speak to that matter, but I can tell you that there are steps we're going to need to take to make sure that people coming into the state of Texas are going to be safe, that we have better protections out there.

And where this incident occurred, it was on the side of the road by a bus stop in front of Ozanam Center, which is a homeless and migrant shelter. And they're doing a wonderful job. And we just need to make sure that they have the resources that they need to help educate the migrants coming over here, so that they know what safety precautions they should be taking as well.

[13:15:13]

KEILAR: All right, Texas State Senator Morgan LaMantia, thank you for your time this afternoon. We appreciate it -- Boris.

SANCHEZ: Still ahead: passenger payback. The White House unveiling a plan to make airlines pay customers for canceling or delaying flights. So, what do the airlines have to say about that?

Plus, digging in. The GOP ramping up their demands over the debt ceiling, but President Biden isn't budging, and time to avoid a potential economic disaster is running out.

And bracing for a bigger surge. How the end of a pandemic era health order could spell more chaos at the Southern border.

We're back in just moments.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: If the White House gets its way, canceling flights could cost airlines big time.

[13:20:01]

Minutes from now, President Biden is set to propose a new rule when it comes to -- quote -- "controllable airline cancellations or delays."

Now, here is what the administration wants. They want airlines to compensate passengers and cover expenses like meals and hotels in cases where the airline caused a cancellation or delay. So, keep in mind, this doesn't apply when weather gets in the way of your travel plans.

But it's all part of a major push to protect passenger rights following some serious meltdowns over the last year.

Let's take you now to the White House and CNN's Jeremy Diamond.

Jeremy, lay out the nuts and bolts of this proposal for us.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, listen, Boris, the administration started looking more closely at this issue after last summer.

We saw some of those widespread flight disruptions across the country. They began by looking at transparency measures, posting information on the Department of Transportation's Web site that said which airlines offer what kind of compensation or refunds in the event of delays and cancellation.

But now they're going a step further. And we're going to hear this directly from President Biden this hour, as he is set to propose new rules that would require, require some of these airlines to compensate passengers who face cancellations or delays that are within the airline's control.

So that could be mechanical issues, for example, staffing issues, all issues within control, not weather, as you just outlined there. The secretary of transportation, Pete Buttigieg, he says, when an airline causes a flight cancellation or delay, that passengers should not foot the bill.

And that is basically the core of this. Now, the details of this will be worked out in the rulemaking process over the next several months. But, clearly, this is an effort by the administration, which, as we have seen, President Biden before has tackled issues like junk fees, for example, for consumers.

He views some of these issues as important as he looks towards his reelection campaign. He's trying to tackle some of these issues that affect every single person, not just Republicans, not just Democrats, but every American.

SANCHEZ: Yes, we look forward to hearing from the president and the transportation secretary in the next half-hour or so.

Jeremy Diamond from the White House, thank you so much -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: So, from travel disasters to potential economic disaster, time running out, both sides digging in; 43 Senate Republicans are now vowing to block any deal to raise the nation's $31.4 trillion debt ceiling unless the Biden administration agrees to budget cuts Republicans are demanding.

It is a big show of support for House Speaker Kevin McCarthy's position, but the White House says it is a nonstarter. The president is calling for a clean raise, as it's known.

The risks for the national economy are significant and real. Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen warns the U.S. could default on its debt without a deal as early as June 1. That's just 24 days away.

CNN congressional correspondent Lauren Fox has been covering this.

Lauren, I mean, we have had both sides dig their heels in for weeks now, but the fact is, they're facing each other. And they have got to deal with each other at some point. I wonder, where does that stand? Is there any middle ground here? Is the Biden administration showing any signs it's willing to deal, negotiate?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's the big question, right?

Going into tomorrow, is there a middle ground to forge in the weeks ahead? And there's just not that much time to strike the kind of grand bargain that you might expect at this historic moment, with Republicans and Democrats at a crossroads over what to do and how they are going to try and prevent the country defaulting on its debt.

Janet Yellen, the Treasury secretary, laying out that this date is going to come some time in early June. Lawmakers on Capitol Hill only in session for about eight days. That's not to say that they can't have a conversation with the White House if lawmakers aren't here in Washington or that leadership can't stay behind to try to hammer out a deal.

Interestingly, tomorrow, this meeting is going to happen with all four congressional leaders. That means that top Democrats and top Republicans, including the Senate leader, Mitch McConnell -- excuse me -- the Republican Senate leader, Mitch McConnell, will all be present.

But the two main figures to keep your eye on are Joe Biden and Kevin McCarthy, the House speaker. And that is because they are the only two who can really get the message back to their party that this is the middle ground, this is some kind of compromise. And it's just not clear that one is going to appear after tomorrow's meeting.

It may take a few false starts to really start to see progress. Also, it might take some pressure coming from Wall Street to start to see some progress.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

FOX: Jim.

SCIUTTO: And economists have been telling us that the damage to the economy starts before that fiscal cliff. You start to see impacts there. We will see how close they're willing to bring us.

Lauren Fox, thanks so much -- Brianna.

KEILAR: Now to the U.S.-Mexico border, where officials are bracing for a migrant influx ahead of this lifting of Title 42.

Here, in just three days, the Trump era policy that allows certain immigrants to be quickly turned away at the Southern border is going to be expiring. And, right now, border officials are encountering over 8,000 migrants a day. So you can see how this is an issue here, right? And that number could be rising to 10,000 a day when Title 42 ends.

[13:25:09]

Here, you can see some new drone video, long lines of migrants camped out just on the other side of the border in Ciudad Juarez, Juarez, Mexico.

We have CNN's Rosa Flores in the border city of El Paso, Texas, with the latest on the ground there.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The city of El Paso in a state of emergency. Take a look around me, and you will see that there are hundreds of migrants simply on this street.

And according to the city of El Paso, there are more than 2,000 migrants living in the streets of El Paso. Now, as you look around, you will see that the majority of the individuals here are adults. Most of the women and children are able to get shelter inside some of the shelter facilities that are in this city.

That's why most of the individuals are adults. Now, you will see that the city has brought out more port-a-potties. There are more resources out here. And, over the weekend, the city deployed these barricades to close off the city streets.

Now, this was done before the tragedy in El Paso, but for the same reason, because of public safety. As you look around, you will see that a lot of migrants are on the streets. And the city of El Paso is asking motorists and people driving around the -- these streets to be very careful just because of the volume, because of the number of migrants who are out here.

And the flow is not stopping. Take a look at this video. This is from the area in El Paso where migrants turn themselves in to U.S. immigration authorities. You can see that there are hundreds of individuals. There's videos that were posted by the Border Patrol chief here in El Paso that shows the magnitude of the situation here.

Now, according to an administration official, more than 25,000 migrants are immigration custody, and encounters per day right now along the U.S.-Mexico border surpass 8,000. Now, from talking to individuals in communities from Tijuana all the way to Brownsville, I can tell you that all of the border communities in between that I have talked to say that they're seeing an increase in migrants.

Rosa Flores, CNN, El Paso.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KEILAR: Thank you to Rosa for that -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: Yes, we will see if those administration changes make a difference.

Well, coming up: contempt threat. Why a House Republican is threatening to hold Secretary of State Antony Blinken in contempt of Congress, this over documents related to the withdrawal from Afghanistan.

And new cars, they're becoming more expensive -- you may have noticed -- and out of reach for many Americans. What's behind that spike in prices? And is there any hope they will come back down soon?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:30:00]