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Trump Faces 31 Counts Of Willful Retention Of National Defense Information. Aired 2-2:30p ET
Aired June 09, 2023 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:00]
ABBY PHILLIP, CNN ANCHOR & CORRESPONDENT: Mulling around in Trump world that the nature of the documents matter. And he was absolutely right about that, but suggested that perhaps old schedules that would have been top secret classified at a certain point would not rise to the occasion.
This indictment seems to lay out some very clear instances of real information that was related to national security. That was not only in large quantities stored in the former president's actively used social club, but stored in public, strewn all over the floor, employees texting back and forth about what to do with them, about where to move them. And Trump when faced with the prospect of needing to return them, allegedly suggesting to his attorneys to not be truthful with the federal government.
DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR: Yes. And there's another --
PHILLIP: This is a bombshell.
BASH: Absolutely. And you know, Laura Coates was talking last night about the false statements -- the allegation of false statements. And if you go through not just the what the former president had, the details of how very much it within the realm of national security, many of them weren't aware, the amount of them, but then also the concealment, and the making false statements about having them and so forth. There's also great detail in here about how he -- and more specifically his valet misled --
JOHN KING, CNN ANCHOR: Right.
BASH: -- the Department of Justice and misled their lawyers and so forth. And so it is, again, not just a case of him taking this information, which maybe he could have argued, I didn't mean it. Maybe he could have argued like Mike Pence did, like Joe Biden did, like others did, oh, I'll give it back. This was part of a large number of papers that I took when I left the White House.
It was the, no, I am intentionally not giving it back to you. And I'm giving you statements that are not true. And that falls into the -- again, false statements but also the conspiracy charged.
KING: And part of Trump makes a political argument when he's in legal trouble. And his political argument last night, he labels things. He gives everything a label or a nickname, it was boxes hoax because he wants you to think this is not important, this is not serious, that everybody does it. That's what he wants you to think.
So, when you read the penalty sheet that comes in any federal indictment, this is where the gravity of this comes clear to you. Counts one through 31, willful detention of National Defense Information. Each one of those counts a potential maximum 10 years in prison. That's 310 years in prison.
Count number 32, conspiracy to obstruct justice. Maximum term of imprisonment 20 years. Count 33, withholding a document or record. Maximum term of imprisonment 20 years. Count 34, corruptly concealing a document or record. Maximum term of imprisonment 20 years. Count 35, concealing a document in a federal investigation. Maximum term imprisonment, 20 years.
Scheme to conceal. Maximum term imprisonment, five years. False statements or representation. Maximum term of imprisonment, five years.
So, those are the 37 counts against Donald Trump. Well, not -- well, not so innocent until proven guilty, he gets his day in court. But simply do not believe when people say this is trivial. What they lay out here is of incredible consequence and gravity.
BASH: Yes.
PHILLIP: Very much so. And we've reported at length about the audio tape there of Trump meeting with the people who are working on this book for his former Chief of Staff. There is another meeting that is described in this indictment in September -- August or September of 2021 when Trump was no longer president.
And the indictment says that Trump was discussing an ongoing military operation in a country that's not named. He was showing a political action committee representative, a classified map of that country and told that person that he should not be showing the map to that person because that person obviously did not have a security clearance. So, it's not just the one incident that we know about. Another meeting, another document, showing it to people who were not authorized to see it.
And interestingly, throughout this document, you see evidence of the DOJ laying out not just what Trump was doing after he left the presidency, but evidence from during his presidency that Trump was well aware of the process and the importance of secrecy when it comes to classified documents.
It has statements that he made back in 2016 -- statements that he made back in 2017, about how he would enforce the laws as it relates to classified documents. And then when it applied to him when he was no longer president, it seems based on these allegations, that he put all that to the side, threw it out the window and did not -- did not act on his own knowledge of how important it is to keep these documents secret. KING: And I just want to echo your point about the gravity. If you look at more of the details, again, there's a catalog. There's an inventory, if you will, of some of the documents that they recovered.
And again, Donald Trump wants to say it's a box hoax. His attorney last night said oh, they're just schedules that maybe say something classified at the time but then that event happens and they're not. So you see right there.
[14:05:02]
There's the first picture we have of documents. Those are classified records. Whatever your politics, those are property of the United States government. That's the ballroom that they talk about.
These documents belong in a secure location under lock and key with a guard. There they are casually stacked on a stage in one of the so- called elegant ballrooms, as Donald puts it, at his Mar-a-Lago resort. Again, they're government secrets. And what's in those boxes, well, the government details in this indictment. Here are just some of them.
Document concerning White House intelligence briefing related to foreign countries. Document concerning White House intelligence briefing related to foreign countries. Document concerning military capabilities of a foreign country and the United States with handwritten annotation in black cameras.
Document concerning White House intelligence briefing related to foreign countries. Document concerning the nuclear capabilities of a foreign country. Document concerning White House intelligence briefing related to foreign countries.
Concerning communications with the leader of a foreign country. Document concerning military capabilities of a foreign country. Document concerning military attacks by a foreign country.
Document concerning military capabilities. You can go on and on and on.
BASH: Right.
KING: So, when they tried to tell you this is trivial on document, updated document concerning military activity.
BASH: Unless you see --
KING: Covered the White House for 10 years. This is the most sensitive stuff in the United States government at a time of great global turmoil. It belongs under lock and key in the United States government.
And what this alleges, and again, I'll say it again, Donald Trump gets his day in court is that he willfully, knowingly, recklessly took it, and then knowingly, willfully, recklessly stored it as those photos show you. And then asked other people to lie about it when the government said, could we please have those back. BASH: And let's just look at the summary of what we're talking about. You are giving some of the details which are so important.
KING: Yes.
BASH: It says. Location, Trump's office. Number of documents, 27. Classification markings, six top secret, 18 secret, three confidential/ Storage room, 75 documents. One top secret, 36 secret, 28 confidential. And it's exactly what you were saying about America's national security. But it's also the question of the rule of law. And it is so noteworthy that you've heard the Republicans who have been coming out to his defense before they've read any of this, talking about the rule of law and going after the FBI and going after the DOJ.
And it is going to be very interesting to see how they get themselves out of those statements reading this he -- the former president, this is an indictment. He is going to be tried just like any citizen. He -- assuming that it doesn't get thrown out. It is going to go through due process as it should. He has not been convicted, not even close.
This is the beginning of the process. But this is incredibly detailed. And it's hard to see how Republicans argue that there is no rule of law here when it seems as though the allegations are that the former president took the rule of law and said it doesn't apply to me.
KING: Right. And, Jim and Brianna, as we go back to you on that point, the former president was on a radio interview the other day where he was saying, yes, sure he fought this because he didn't do anything wrong and they were trying to suggest he was obstructing. Obstructing nothing.
If you read this catalog and you see those photos, it is very hard to make the case. He can argue the law and his lawyer said first, but it's very hard to make the case that there was nothing and then there's pretty damning -- again, it's allegations, but pretty damning testimony from the text messages of his own people about that obstruction part.
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: And to be clear for other people with security clearances, I had one for some time, you only view documents like this. You've covered the military for a long time. You know this as well as anybody outside of a skiff -- outside of a secure location, let alone bring it home to your place of residence.
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Yes. And also, we're seeing Trump in his own words as described by at least one of his then attorneys. If we look at page 21 here, it says that on May 23 of 2022, Trump was meeting with known as Trump attorney one and Trump attorney two. Do we have a sense of who that is?
EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Evan Corcoran is attorney one. It's clear from the context here that attorney one is --
KEILAR: Is Evan Corcoran.
PEREZ: -- is Evan Corcoran. KEILAR: So, he's there at Mar-a-Lago, it says, to discuss the response to this May 11th subpoena. And Trump attorney one, Evan Corcoran, and Trump attorney two tell Trump that they need to search for documents that would be responsive to the subpoena. They need to provide a certification that there had been compliance with the subpoena.
Trump in some in substance made the following statements among others as memorialized by Trump attorney one, Evan Corcoran. A., I don't want anybody looking -- I don't want anybody looking through my boxes. I really don't. I don't want you looking through my boxes.
B., well, what if we -- what happens if we just don't respond at all or don't play ball with them? C., wouldn't it be better if we just told them we don't have anything here? D., well, look, isn't it better if there are no documents?
[14:10:04]
And then going to the -- it appears to the same meeting, he described in some in substance, the following story is memorialized by Trump attorney one, Evan Corcoran. Clearly, referring to Hillary Clinton having to do with the deletion of her e-mails.
Attorney, it says in brackets, he was great. He did a great job. You know what he said? He said that it -- that it was him.
That he was the one who deleted all her e-mails, the 30,000 e-mails because they basically dealt with her scheduling and her going to the gym and are having beauty appointments and he was great. And he -- so, she didn't get in any trouble because he said that he was the one who deleted them. So much there to go through.
PEREZ: Lock her up is the chant that we heard so often during the Trump rallies, right in -- during the 2016 election. And so, what the former president we've sees obsessed with those stories about Hillary Clinton. And he's also obsessed with lawyers who are willing to do anything to protect their clients. This is a feature of Donald Trump over the years.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
PEREZ: And so, that story is one that you know, is a very Trumpian story. It's a story where he's basically telling Evan Corcoran, if you take the bullet for me, if you go and you say that you did the search --
PAULA REID, CNN SENIOR LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Yes.
PEREZ: -- and you know that you didn't find anything, the FBI is just going to go away and nobody's going to get in trouble.
SCIUTTO: Well, expressing admiration did seem for delay --
PEREZ: Absolutely.
SCIUTTO: -- Hillary Clinton's lawyers for protected her. LAURA COATES, CNN CHIEF LEGAL ANALYST: I mean --
SCIUTTO: Laura Coates, lawyer present here. Speaking about Corcoran based on what you see in this document, is Corcoran testifying against the president?
COATES: Yes. He did already in a grand jury. I mean, the idea here -- first of all, those statements were the equivalent of you got a nice place here. I hate to see it burned down.
I mean, that was the equivalent what you actually heard him saying, the suggestion we're not subtle. And just to remind people. There -- this complaint includes statements about Trump wanting to see photographs of the boxes. There is actual documentation that he was aware about the breadth of it. The statements that were actually made.
Remember, it was extraordinary for a judge to say that an attorney could testify and speak about the communications with his client. Why, though? Because the judge in that case, in that instance, said, we're not going to honor it if it's a crime fraud exception.
What does that mean? You cannot say that I don't get to tell you anything because I'm a lawyer and you're my client, if what you're asking me to do is in furtherance of a crime or fraud. And just to bring the point home, just look through on page eight. Everyone could follow along.
The types of agency documents that were implicated. The CIA, the Department of Defense, the NSA, the National Geospatial Intelligence Agency, the National Reconnaissance Office, the Department of Energy, the Department of State, and Bureau of Intelligence and Research just to name a few.
KEILAR: And why are these documents that are so important to national security? Because they have to do with weapons capabilities of the U.S. and foreign countries, U.S. nuclear programs, potential vulnerabilities of the U.S. and allies to military attack and plans for possible retaliation. But when you --
SCIUTTO: You can't look at the more sensitive list.
KEILAR: You really --
SCIUTTO: You'll get nothing.
KEILAR: You really cannot.
PEREZ: One quick -- one quick -- one quick point here just to -- just to point out -- but just to follow up on what Laura was just saying. These t notes that you just read, this is -- these are -- these are memorialized by Evan Corcoran, the former president's attorney. And a lot of people are just astonished that why on earth is a lawyer memorializing his client's thoughts like this, right?
Again, he -- they know, they're under a subpoena. They know that there's some kind of investigation. Why are you doing that? Also, by the way, Evan Corcoran is still on the president's legal team. He's still representing the president on the January six investigation. So, we --
SCIUTTO: Yes.
PEREZ: It's just -- there's so many questions that occurred.
(CROSSTALK)
BERMAN: Well, you've been -- you've been perusing this, and you broke so many of the details of this prior to this document.
REID: Yes.
BERMAN: Now, you have the document, what have you learned that you didn't know prior?
REID: And I just want to dovetail for what Evan just said here is our understanding that Evan Corcoran was recording into a device each time he had a conversation with Trump back then, which is partly how they got his notes and some other members of the legal team were curious. Hey, why were you recording everything that was happening at that time? There were some questions about whether he may have wanted to write a book at some time. But they were a little bit surprised that he was recording all of his notes.
BERMAN: Could that also be self-protective?
REID: Completely. It could absolutely be something. Yes.
BERMAN: And that would you --
REID: Yes.
BERMAN: You protect yourself by saying this is what I saw (INAUDIBLE) --
REID: Absolutely, right. We saw a lot of people, especially early in the administration, Jim Comey and others do that, make contemporaneous memos to protect themselves. But you got to have --
COATES: (INAUDIBLE) their credibility, of course.
REID: Yes.
COATES: The more contemporaneous it is, the more your credibility is no longer an issue, trying to recall events -- (INAUDIBLE)
REID: Exactly. So, you want to -- you want to do it immediately.
PEREZ: He didn't sign to that. I didn't sign the attestation, right?
REID: Exactly. They talk about protecting yourself. I think you guys did a great job of laying out exactly how sensitive this material was. But my takeaways here, they've recovered over 300 classified documents, right?
We're talking volume. That's what distinguishes this, of course, in the case of the current president. And they were stored in everything from a ballroom to a bathroom to a shower to an office space to his bedroom to a storage room.
[14:15:03]
There's also a photo here where Walt Nauta walks into the storage room and sees information that was only supposed to be shared with the five eyes. So, that's Australia, Canada, New Zealand, and the United Kingdom --
SCIUTTO: Right.
REID: -- displayed across the floor, spilled out on a box, as I'm sure some of us have maybe in our attic, right old college papers or something. These are classified secrets to spread across the floor of a storage room. We're also learning there were secrets in a bathroom, in a ballroom. I mean, the sloppiness in terms of storage, it's really breathtaking. And we've been reporting on this for quite some time. This is surprising.
KEILAR: And not only -- not only that. We know that Mar-a-Lago is not a fortress.
REID: It's a hotel.
KEILAR: This is also a place -- a target for foreign adversaries.
REID: Yes.
KEILAR: And we have seen that --
BERMAN: People come and then going.
KEILAR: -- certainly in the past. But John and Dana, particularly when you look at the statements from the former president memorialized by his then attorney, it's him pressing in a sort of graduating way. At first, it's the, I don't want anyone looking through my boxes.
Well, what if we just don't respond? Well, what if we don't have anything here? What if there are no documents? Clearly, things that he is asking his attorney to do that he should not be doing.
BERMAN: And we also have memorialized here something that had been reported, but now it's written paper in the document. The president granting that he no longer had the power to declassify. Reading on page 16.
Trump, see you as president, I could have declassified it. Staffer, yes. Laughter. Trump, now I can't you know, but this is still a secret. Staffer, yes. Laughter. Now, we have a problem, Trump. Isn't that interesting? Dana, John, lots to digest.
KING: And, Jim and Brianna, you're making I think, a critical point as people walk through this and study more of this. Viewer is watching this in the context of where we are, which happens to be not only an unprecedented legal case against a former president, but happening in the middle or at least the early days of a presidential campaign where he's the Republican Party frontrunner.
Yes, it's very important to look at what Donald Trump says that everybody else is out to get him and then focus on the point you just made. And the language in these documents. Those are his words. Those are his aides. Those are his people. That is his house. When you look at the pictures here.
And again, just as you go through the details -- and I'm -- forgive me, but this is just a fact. The -- there is hypocrisy in the Republican ranks if you roll back the camera -- the tape a little bit to how they treated Hillary Clinton and her e-mail server.
I'm not here to defend Hillary Clinton in her e-mail server at home. That was a mistake. And she should have known better. But that's like lowercase A., compared to what you read in this indictment, as you go through it for the context, which is important.
Just in the documents that Trump did return. Just in the first way when he did return some of the documents just in those 15 boxes, 14 contained documents were classified markings, 197. 98 marked secret, 30 marked top secret.
It's just reprehensible behavior. And candidate Donald Trump said he would not stand for it. It would not happen when he was president. And you just read through the details here just about the number, the scope, the gravity, national security importance of these documents, the reckless sloppiness, and then to his aide Walt Nauta, who's also indicted, saying things to the FBI that his old text messages and the other employees at Mar-a-Lago proof are just not true.
BASH: And it goes to the question -- and maybe this is something that Jack Smith will address. Why? Why did he want to keep all of these? What was the reason for wanting to keep all of these? Wasn't just for -- is there something in there that suggest it?
SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, no. I mean, I think look. In the past, his aides have said, you know, he felt they were his or he declassified them, so they were his to take or you know they were mostly mementos. They weren't, you know, serious documents. And that's why he wants to keep them.
I think what these instances though, especially if him sort of showing documents to other people, waving them around, talking about them, it shows a certain amount of hubris. I mean, it shows somebody who wanted to take sort of the spoils of his one-term presidency with him, and to be able to brag about them when he left.
KING: Yes.
BASH: But how you can release it to the bathroom?
MURRAY: This photo, you can see -- you can see that this is the bathroom. It is a little confusing. I think it's some of the earlier photos perhaps not surprising, it's marble and gold, very Trumpian style, but it kind of -- these photos really show you the carelessness with which these boxes were moved throughout Mar-a-Lago move --
BASH: Talk about the picture saying it all.
MURRAY: Yes.
PHILLIP: But I don't want to leave the impression because one of the things that this indictment really lays out is that there was a period of time when Trump spent meticulously going through these boxes himself. And they do that to say that it wasn't just that the boxes were being stored in a ballroom --
BASH: And there is the -- (INAUDIBLE) color.
PHILLIP: -- in an active social club. But that Trump also insisted on going through them. And Walt Nauta was part of the process of ensuring he knew how many boxes Trump had gone through which ones he had gone through.
At one point, one of Trump's attorneys, Evan Corcoran, presumptively, is going through the boxes, finds a bunch of classified documents, puts them in a folder and tries to seal up the folder. He has that.
He memorializes then a conversation with Trump in which Trump says that he made a funny motion as though well, OK why don't you just take them with you to the hotel room? And if there's anything really bad in there, like, you know, pluck it out. And that was the motion that he made.
[14:20:13]
He made a motion to suggest to Corcoran that he should pluck out the really bad stuff, the things that were highly classified. This is really significant for people who are watching who have been through two indictments of Donald Trump, you know, the case in New York. Donald Trump is not a person who spends a lot of time writing things down. He doesn't e-mail really. He doesn't spend a ton of time texting. So, when you're trying to understand his state of mind, the recollections of his attorney, in real time, are incredibly significant.
BASH: Yes.
KING: Yes.
BASH: And Paula and Evan, on that note, we haven't mentioned the Evan Corcoran of it all. And Evan Corcoran is the Trump attorney who went and he testified. The attorney client privilege was pierced, which is something that very, very rarely happens.
Given everything you guys have reported on this, what you're reading now and what Abby was just talking about, how much do you think that his testimony played into what we're seeing in these indictments? REID: It's clearly incredibly significant. We knew that when a judge allowed attorney client privilege to be pierced, you know, they needed an exception here. So, they needed to convince a judge that Evan Corcoran's advice had been used potentially in furtherance of a crime.
I mean that's a -- that's a pretty significant thing for a judge to allow. And from our reporting, we learned a little bit about the kinds of information that he had in his notes. We knew that the former president had asked if there were any other options besides a subpoena 1-- cooperating with the subpoena.
Now, some folks on the former president's legal team argued to us that look, he was just trying to get some good legal advice. But clearly, based on the facts here in this indictment, what Evan Corcoran and this other attorney provided, shows that it was much more than that. He was asking them to obstruct this investigation, incredibly, incredibly significant evidence from Evan Corcoran.
PEREZ: And the idea of really that -- you know, that the former president was hoping to use these lawyers as his shield. And in the end, what this has done is really kind of sealed what the -- what the prosecution is trying to say, right, which is that the former president knew he had these documents, he was being cavalier with documents that I've caught -- you know, if you look at that list of the levels of classification, this is not small things.
And then he also was trying to essentially ignore a subpoena from a federal judge. A judge who had ordered the former president to turn over all of these documents that he had no right to continue to hold. And so, that's one of the things is that you know what comes across from this is that he's looking to all of these people. He's used to all of these people.
REID: Yes.
PEREZ: I mean, he definitely had experience when he was at the White House to have all of these people who essentially took bullets for him to protect him. And that's what he was going for here. And it appears it ended up backfiring.
REID: Yes. And lawyer slash fixer is a common title in Trump world. Now, a lot of these lawyers have ended up needing lawyers of their own. Evan Corcoran is just one of the attorneys --
PEREZ: Right.
REID: -- who has testified to this investigation. He had attorney client-privilege -- was pierced there. But other attorneys including Tim Parlatore and others have testified in this investigation. Just another aspect of how extraordinary this probe is. Multiple attorneys testifying in this probe.
KING: Well, I want to read through -- forgive me, I just want to read through a bit of it just to get to the point that as people listen, after you watch these photographs, again, these are documents --
BASH: Look at that.
KING: -- that belong locked up. They've been locked up under key and secure because some of them, sure, were classified at the time and maybe today or when these photos were taken in the months before this, and maybe there's a debate about classification.
But as we've gone through maps, details, foreign military operations, foreign military nuclear capabilities, you know, I dare any Republican, anybody to come forward and say these should not be left under lock and key in the most secure place because of the secrets. And if you're going to declassify them, that should be done through a process because of how sensitive they were at least at one time.
But Evan and Paula, as you go through it, again, you get to the point here that if you read the indictment, these are Donald Trump's own people and frankly, what the government alleges and they need to prove it in a court of law, are the lies. Now, the next day on June 3, 2022, Trump attorney three signed a certification as the custodian of the records. Took it to Mar-a-Lago to provide to the Department of Justice and the FBI.
And that certification said that -- stated, among other things, a diligent search was conducted of the boxes that were moved to the White House in Florida. The search was conducted after receiving the subpoena in order to locate any and all documents. Any and all responsive documents accompany the certification.
In other words, you asked for documents. We looked. Here they are. You're getting them all back. It goes right on to say false because Trump had directed not to move the boxes before Trump attorney came through.
[14:25:00]
So, the challenge here is to prove this to a jury down the road months and months from now, most likely. But if you read this document, you know that Trump and his legal team have tried to make this is not a big deal. Maybe it was a misunderstanding.
The president thought he could have these things. It's not that important. What's this big fuss about? Line by line by line of this indictment lays out calculation, deliberate misconduct, including lies and then asking people to lie.
PEREZ: I think -- one of the things I think that's going to be important for us to see in the coming months, frankly, with that this is -- this process is going to take is the willingness of the Justice Department to -- and the federal government to declassify some of these documents. Because, look, you know, having this -- these papers and the descriptions of them, they're going to be able to -- they're going to bring in people from the CIA.
The people who created these documents, they're going to come in, and they're going to attest that these documents are still classified. And they're going to have to testify about what -- generally what these are. But, you know, if you really -- if you want to make sure the American public is paying attention and knows how serious this is, I think the challenge here will be for the Justice Department to at least declassify some of these documents so that everybody can see it.
And you know, that's always the struggle with these cases. It's one reason why very rarely do they even bring these cases in in court. They try -- they struggle with the idea of, well, these things are so sensitive that we can't bring it to court because we can't declassify it. And so, the challenge here will be for the Justice Department to decide.
Are there some of these documents, what is it, 30 something documents that they cite here, that they believe they can bring down the classification? And then show this to a jury to bring home the point that this is the kind of things that the former president put at risk with his cavalier attitude in the treatment of these -- of these classified documents. It's going to be a challenge.
REID: And I think publicly, the former president's attorneys have been overly confident that not only would they not charge -- their client, the former president, but also that they wouldn't charge Walt Nauta. I was told repeatedly, look, without Walt Nauta cooperating with the government, they won't have a case.
When we see here, obviously, the former president and Walt Nauta have both been charged here. But they appear to have an extraordinary amount of evidence both in audio recordings. They clearly have text messages. They have other cooperating witnesses.
It may be that they were just completely incorrect that they cannot -- clearly, they could bring a case without Walt Nauta. But it'll be interesting to see if they are able to successfully prosecute this if Walt nada continues to refuse to cooperate with the government. He has been under an enormous amount of pressure, as we've been reporting, for months.
They have been trying to flip him. They have threatened him just even on potentially charging him with false statements for lying to the FBI, something very smart people -- Martha Stewart even had been charged with. But it was unclear if he was going to be charged today. If he's charged, it'd be really interesting to see --
PEREZ: What are the chance?
REID: --see if he stays loyal the president.
PEREZ: What are the chances do you think that Walt Nauta decides that after now that he's been indicted --
REID: Yes.
PEREZ: What are the chances he thinks that perhaps, you know, it's time for him to come in and talk to the FBI and cooperate?
BASH: Maybe.
PEREZ: We don't know. Right? That sometimes happens in these cases. REID: Yes.
PEREZ: But given the fact that, as you pointed out, for months, he has resisted that and the fact, he's still -- he's with the president today at Bedminster, you know, I don't think the chances are great.
REID: Yes.
BASH: Evan, you use the word cavalier in the way that he -- the former president appears to have dealt with these highly classified documents.
PEREZ: Right.
BASH: There's a lot in here. I just want to highlight one example. And it's on page 14, there is a photo of a box of documents spilled onto the floor. And in this -- in this indictment, it says that the documents included intelligence that was releasable only to -- only to the five eyes, the five-eye countries. And we're talking about intelligence only supposed to be shared with the U.S., the United Kingdom, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand. That's according to the indictment.
And so, here you have a person who was president, who wants to be president again, have -- with boxes of documents, including one that was spilled onto the floor. I'm not sure if we have that picture. We had it before if we could get it back.
That's the bathroom. That's another example -- that's another example of what we're talking about. But on this specific part of the indictment, these documents that are only supposed to be seen with those countries that the United States relies on for intelligence, the most important intelligence that deals with not just national security for the United States, but for the United States' allies. And so this is not just an issue for within the borders.
KING: There you go.
BASH: There it is. That's the photo -- that's the photo that this part of the indictment is referring to. So, it's not just the intelligence and national security of the United States, you have allies around the world looking at this -- these photos.
