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Coast Guard: This Is A Search & Rescue Mission, 100%; NYT: Industry Leaders' Letter Expressed Concern About Oceangate's "Experimental" Approach & 2 Employees Expressed Safety Concerns; AG Garland Distances Himself From Hunter Biden Case; Republicans Rip "Sweetheart" Hunter Biden Deal; Inside Taiwan's Drills To Defend Against China; ProPublica: Justice Alito Took Luxury Fishing Vacation With Billionaire Who Later Had Cases Before Supreme Court. Aired 1:30- 2p ET

Aired June 21, 2023 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30:00]

TIM MALTIN, "TITANIC" EXPERT: And the big question, what will they do even if they find it and even if people are knocking, what will they do to rescue those people?

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Yes, those are difficult questions to answer at this point. During several press briefings, officials wouldn't even entertain it.

Obviously, the oxygen on board the "Titan" is dwindling. In your mind, what would need to go right for the passengers on board to be rescued?

MALTIN: They would need to speak very little. They would need to conserve the power on the craft. And they could maybe eke their oxygen out for another day if they were very conserving of movement and energy. And if they maybe slept as much as possible, in turns, that kind of thing, really keep their energy low.

And then what we need to do is we need to have someone like the French Navy or the U.S. Navy would need to get a sub down there that has the capability to attach a tether by remote operated vehicle, an ROV, and then it would be wound up to the surface.

Because I don't think we have a sub big enough to recover the "Titan" whole. I think we only have something that can attach a hook and then hopefully raise the "Titan."

SANCHEZ: That would require machinery at a scale that is difficult to imagine. No rescue like this has been attempted like this before.

And there are a lot of people fascinated by the "Titanic" as we look at the people believed to be on board right now. We're seeing a wave of tourism to this area.

What is it that you think draws folks to something that is so dangerous?

MALTIN: What it is, is the "Titanic" is such an iconic tragedy. The 1,500 people who died on the "Titanic" on the 15th of April, 1912, they almost represent the whole of civilization.

And then the iceberg that caused the collision also represents the awesome power of nature, the kind of forces the search-and-rescue is ranged against at the moment.

So the story of "Titanic" really speaks to the human condition. It touches everyone.

SANCHEZ: And, Tim, do you think this incident might stunt the research being conducted there? Why do you think this research is so important?

MALTIN: I don't think it will stunt the proper research. I think that what we're dealing with here is akin to tourism. It is a bit like space tourism. The real research work on "Titanic" will continue.

And obviously, the Oceangate submarine did do absolutely some research work but it was partly tourism and partly adventure seeking as well.

I think what we need to do is protect the public. Make sure craft are super safe that go into these dangerous places. Because they're right at the envelope of technology.

So we need to have proper regulation and the scientific work will need to continue.

SANCHEZ: Tim Maltin, we appreciate you sharing your perspective with us. Thank you so much.

MALTIN: Pleasure.

SANCHEZ: Of course.

Brianna?

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Boris, we're seeing some red flags missed, maybe even ignored. "The New York Times" is reporting that, in 2018, a group of more than three dozen experts from the Marine Technology Society sent a letter to the Oceangate CEO, Stockton Rush, warning, quote:

"Our apprehension is that the current experimental approach adopted by Oceangate could result in negative outcomes from minor to catastrophic that would have serious consequences for everyone in the industry."

CNN has also learned that at least two former Oceangate employees brought up safety concerns about the missing submersible's carbon fiber hull.

With me is Daniel Strauss, senior political correspondent for "The New Republic."

Daniel, you have some very interesting new reporting, and what it does is it details the safety issues raised by one of the former employees in particular. Take us through what was raised?

DANIEL STRAUSS, SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT, "THE NEW REPUBLIC": The employee was David Lockridge. According to court documents which we obtained, in early January 2018, Lockridge voiced concerns about the integrity of the hull, the depth at which the craft could reach.

There was a difference between 4,000 feet, which is the amount that it was supposed to reach, and 1,300 feet, which is the amount it was supposed to reach.

As well as --

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: The 13,000 about right?

STRAUSS: Right. 13,000. Excuse me.

So when Lockridge went to the top executives of Oceangate voicing his concerns, according to the countersuit that he filed, he was stonewalled.

And this was after he was told to create a report, to write up his safety concerns. That's pretty normal as the director of operations, which was his job at the time.

KEILAR: So he goes. He's looking for what you think would be sort of a perfunctory response here. And what is Oceangate's immediate response, according to his countersuit?

[13:35:03]

STRAUSS: According to his countersuit, the response is initially to have a meeting with top executives where they all hear his concerns and then silence, which Lockridge found concerning, according to the suit.

He was not able to access all the information he needed to fully fill out his report. And he found that problematic.

But when he further voiced concerns and issued his report, the response was no different. Shortly after that, he was terminated.

KEILAR: He was terminated. He alleges that it is because of this internal ruckus that he was raising?

STRAUSS: Right. The lawsuit was settled. So it's a little hard to say on my end what the real story is there. But we do know that there was this severance. And this was after the safety concerns were raised.

KEILAR: Very interesting and raising a lot of questions as this submersible is missing and the clock is ticking here.

Daniel, great reporting.

STRAUSS: Thank you.

KEILAR: Thank you so much.

Jim?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: Well, Attorney General Merrick Garland is now responding to Republican critics who claim that Hunter Biden's plea deal was a slap on the wrist. What does the record show? We'll have his comments coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:41:02]

SANCHEZ: New today, Attorney General Merrick Garland is pushing back on Republican claims that the Justice Department gave the president's son a sweetheart deal.

Hunter Biden, you might recall, will plead guilty to two counts of tax evasion and he's agreed to a pretrial program on a felony charge. If a judge signs off, he will avoid prison time.

The attorney general, Merrick Garland, is distancing himself from the investigation and the plea deal. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MERRICK GARLAND, ATTORNEY GENERAL: As I said from the moment of my appointment as attorney general, I would leave this matter in the hands of the United States attorney, who was appointed by the previous president and assigned to this matter by the previous administration.

That he would be given full authority to decide the matter as he decided was appropriate. And that is what he has done. And if you have any further questions about that matter, you should direct them to the U.S. attorney to explain his decision.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Let's take you live to Capitol Hill with CNN's Manu Raju.

Manu, moments ago, we learned about the federal judge who will oversee this case. What can you tell us?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. This judge, Maryellen Noreika, is someone who was nominated by then-President Donald Trump in 2018. Was confirmed by a voice vote in the United States Senate.

Had the support of the two Democratic Senators from Delaware. That's typically how this is done. The Senators from those home states, they have to agree on naming a judge.

Once they agree, the judge's name can move forward and that's what happened in this case.

I looked through her giving records, her giving records show she has provided donations to both Democratic and Republican candidates alike.

Now this judge will be important because she will determine whether or not the justices, the Justice Department's recommendation of no jail time and probation for Hunter Biden had been sufficient or if she breaks from the recommendation.

So the judge is critical here, even as a plea agreement was reached between Hunter Biden and the Justice Department -- Boris?

SANCHEZ: And, Manu, when news of this plea deal broke, Republican lawmakers were quick to condemn it. I'm wondering what they're saying today.

RAJU: We're still hearing a lot of concerns from Republicans planning to push ahead on their investigations.

One big question for some of the big key House Republican chairmen is what the Justice Department means by this investigation into Hunter Biden is ongoing.

And if that means they will not be able to get the records they've been seeking to try to tie Hunter Biden's business dealings with the president of the United States.

But there is still some concern from some folks within the ranks of that, perhaps, the efforts to quickly dismiss this or criticize this plea agreement was essentially too quick to reach that conclusion, as some members voiced earlier today.

Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. TIM BURCHETT (R-TN): Yes, I thought it was pretty weak. But I can guarantee you, if some guy, some working man or woman gets popped with a gun charge, they're probably going to do some time.

REP. DON BACON (R-NE) I believe, in the end, you had a Trump-appointed attorney. I don't know who this judge is in this case. But I trust our justice system to get it right.

REP. JIM HIMES (R-CT): This is a world where, whenever they go after your people, you say it is unfounded and you quite happily trash the DOJ and the FBI. But when they go after your political enemies, they're doing great. And that is how you end a democracy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Now one aspect the House Ways and Means Committee will look into tomorrow is allegations from an IRS whistleblower that the tax part of the Hunter Biden probe was mishandled in certain ways. So that will be part of another Republican investigation to all of this.

SANCHEZ: Some very strong words there from Jim Himes.

Manu Raju, from Capitol Hill, thank you so much.

Jim? SCIUTTO: Well, President Biden went off script last night and caught some of his advisers off guard when he referred to China's leader, Xi Jinping, as a dictator.

Here's what he said during a political fundraiser in California, quoting, "The reason why Xi Jinping got very upset when I shot that balloon down is he didn't know it was there. That's what a great embarrassment for dictators when they didn't know what happened."

[13:45:12]

One source tells us U.S. Intelligence does believe that Xi was in the dark about the spy balloon. The White House made no effort to walk Biden's comments back.

His adlib comes as Washington indicates they made some progress toward cooling diplomatic tensions and setting up a potential meeting between the two leaders. That was before Biden's comment.

And before, we should note, China sent an aircraft carrier through the Taiwan Strait today. For months, China has been rattling the saber about a potential invasion of Taiwan.

Last week, I went to Taiwan and the Taiwan Strait and saw Taiwan's first line of defense as it prepares for the possibility of a Chinese invasion.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LT. COL. BI SHI QUAN, TAIWAN FIR FORCE: UNIDENTIFIED TAIWANESE SERVICEMEMBER: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)

SCIUTTO (voice-over): Commanders of the Taiwanese Mechanized Combat Team laid out their combat plan.

QUAN: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)

SCIUTTO: Today's mission, defending the Penghu Island situated right in the middle of the Taiwan Strait from a Chinese paratrooper assault. In rapid succession, infantry units stormed a captured airfield. A column of tanks quickly follows.

This maneuver is just a training exercise, but with the very serious goal of readying these forces to defend Taiwan from a Chinese invasion.

QUAN (through translation): In the event of a paratrooper assault on the air base, our troops will be able to respond instantly and defend the territory.

SCIUTTO: Exercises like this one are almost daily effects on the Taiwan's Penghu Islands. Less than 100 miles from mainland China, they are a first line of defense for Taiwan against a Chinese invasion, home to Taiwanese Army, Air Force and naval bases.

And not all operations for these forces are simulations. In fact, as I visited Penghu, four PLA Air Force fighter jets entered Taiwan's air defense identification zone.

Taiwanese Air Force fighters scrambled to respond. Before they fly, they are armed with live ammunition for combat.

Lieutenant Colonel Bi Shi Quan, call sign "Big," commands the Coyote Squadron.

QUAN (through translation): Sometimes it's reconnaissance. Sometimes it is training. Although we're performing combat readiness missions here, the training has never stopped.

SCIUTTO (on camera): Are you proud of the job you're doing here?

QUAN: Of course.

SCIUTTO (voice-over): Taiwanese Navy ships based here have had close calls of their own and they sail with an array of antiship and antiair missiles to do their part in defending against an invasion.

(on camera): The Taiwanese military here is in Penghu is engaged not just in drills and training but in genuine operations, responding to Chinese military operations in the Taiwan Strait.

And commanders in the Navy, the Air Force and the Army tell me their mission is to prepare to defend their country.

(voice-over): Taiwan buys billions of dollars in weapons from the U.S. But its defense plan depends, in large part, on developing and manufacturing many of its own weapons. It's indigenous fighter jets --

(EXPLOSION)

SCIUTTO: -- and many of its Navy frigates and APCs and tanks are all Taiwan built.

QUAN: We won't allow other countries to sail through the waters without permission.

SCIUTTO: On Penghu, Taiwanese military units are widely dispersed for force protection to make they will more difficult targets for any invading force.

There is a saying here, one commander told me. If you want to take Taiwan, you have to take Penghu first. And these forces are training to make sure that never happens.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: One message I heard consistently on Taiwan is they are preparing to defend themselves if necessary but they don't want to provoke China. They want things to stay the way they are.

But they take defense very seriously. There is a brigade-size force on call at all times to respond to any potential attack, a sort of quick reaction. They take that threat seriously -- Brianna?

KEILAR: What a great look inside Taiwan's military preparedness.

Jim, thank you so much.

[13:49:23]

On the defensive. Supreme Court Justice Samuel Alito blasting a new report that said he didn't disclose a luxury fishing trip with Republican billionaire, Paul Singer, who had many cases before the court. We'll have details on that and much more when CNN NEWS CENTRAL returns.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: The U.S. Coast Guard says this joint effort to find the missing submerged tourist vessel is still a search-and-rescue mission 100 percent as opposed to search-and-recovery.

Although officials estimate the five people on board only have some 16 to 17 hours of oxygen left, they are cautiously optimistic because of the headway their mission has made.

A Canadian aircraft searching for the "Titan" detected more underwater noises just this morning. They also heard some yesterday. Some teams described them as banging sounds. But a more in-depth analysis of that data has come back inconclusive.

This story is constantly updated. Of course, we'll bring you more information as it comes in.

Brianna?

KEILAR: Supreme Court Justice Samuel Alito making the highly unusual move to dispute ethics allegations before they even went public.

"ProPublica" published an article overnight alleging, in 2008, Alito went on a luxury fishing trip with a billionaire hedge fund manager, Paul Singer.

You see Alito there in the center, Singer on the right. And the report goes on to state that Singer flew Alito to Alaska on a private jet that the justice did not report the trip or the flight on his annual financial disclosure.

ProPublica also reports Alito did not recuse himself when cases involving Singer's hedge fund came before the Supreme Court in the years after that trip.

Before the article came out, Alito wrote an op-ed in "The Wall Street Journal" claiming "ProPublica" investigative report here is misleading and that the charges against him are not valid.

CNN Supreme Court analyst, Joan Biskupic, is with us now on this story.

This was pretty unusual, right, that he did this, sort of getting ahead of the story. What did you think? JOAN BISKUPIC, CNN SUPREME COURT ANALYST: Trying to get ahead of it

but calling all the more attention to it, Brianna.

"The Wall Street Journal" op-ed, penned in his name, by Samuel Alito, went up last night, got a lot of attention. Everyone wondering, what does "ProPublica" have?

[13:55:06]

And what Justice Alito tried to do was minimize the claims in the story, minimize the lavish travel, minimize the trip to this Alaska fishing resort, minimize any potential conflict of interest with this Republican mega

donor and hedge fund operator, Paul Singer.

But it had almost the opposite effect. Because here he is protesting something and doing -- he's protesting that he has this chummy relationship with Paul Singer and others.

There were others, Leonard Leo, who is a conservative activist, who brings together justices with very rich people. He's also cited in the story.

It has the effect of showing him trying to separate himself from those chummy people in that story and going to another set of pals at "The Wall Street Journal" editorial board.

Writing this column, protesting any potential conflicts of interest, protesting any suggestion that he should have disclosed the gift that he got from Paul Singer in terms of the private jet travel.

And what it did, Brianna, was just, once again, call attention to the fact that these Supreme Court justices operate under inconsistent rules and have no formal code of ethics.

And again, reinforcing it all the more by Justice Alito, who didn't -- he wanted to brush off any kind of press or public concern and go to his own mouthpiece, so to speak.

KEILAR: But maybe just making the case that there needs to be more transparency.

Joan --

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: -- thank you so much for taking us through that. We appreciate it.

BISKUPIC: Thank you.

KEILAR: Jim?

SCIUTTO: Just ahead, we'll have the latest on the search for that missing submersible. New ships joining the effort, as noises heard underwater are still unidentified do inspire hope, hope that those five people on board could still be alive.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)