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Alabama Brawl; Credit Card Debt Rising; Ron DeSantis Replaces Campaign Manager; New Deadline in Trump Federal Case. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired August 08, 2023 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:01:02]

OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN HOST: A new deadline in the federal prosecution of former President Trump expires in hours, this as intrigue in Georgia grows. A new subpoena is now on the table, as a grand jury weighs whether or not they will charge Trump.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN HOST: A CNN exclusive: U.S. officials say Ukraine is not making significant progress against Russia in the crucial counteroffensive, the sobering new intelligence in this morning.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN HOST: Warrants have now been filed after a brawl at an Alabama riverfront, a group of white boaters -- boaters accused of jumping a black dockworker.

I'm Kate Bolduan, with John Berman and Omar Jimenez. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

JIMENEZ: We are following a lot of developments in several cases surrounding former President Donald Trump.

Right now, the grand jury that handed up the 2020 election indictment against him, they're back at it meeting again in Washington, D.C., in the federal courthouse, this as special counsel Jack Smith and Trump's legal team, they now have a 3:00 p.m. deadline to respond to the federal judge overseeing the 2020 election subversion case.

The issue here is, Trump's legal team wants looser rules about around what evidence he can share publicly before trial. Lawyers for Trump, they say prosecutors are on a politically motivated campaign to restrict his First Amendment rights.

The judge in this case, Judge Tanya Chutkan, she wants this hearing scheduled before the end of day on Friday. All this comes as CNN has learned that this man, Trump ally Bernie Kerik, has met with special counsel Jack Smith's team. The former New York City police commissioner is a long time associate of Rudy Giuliani. He coordinated with Giuliani during the contentious post-election period.

So, we have got a lot to talk about.

CNN's Jessica Schneider is following all of this for us.

So, Jessica, pick where you want to start, but let's start with what we -- what we should expect ahead of this deadline today.

JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Omar, Judge Tanya Chutkan here, she has been very aggressive. She wants to settle these issues that have been bubbling up over this proposed protective order.

So, she does want that hearing before the end of this week. And what she's telling Trump's team and the special counsel is, they need to submit their availability, for scheduling for that hearing by 3:00 today. And we have seen the back-and-forth in court filings.

Donald Trump's team last night once again accusing the special counsel of trying to subvert Donald Trump's First Amendment rights by, in this protective order, restricting what he can disclose publicly once he's received that evidence in the case.

The special counsel's team quickly shot back in another filing. They said that allowing Trump to share anything he gets before trial would really damage this case. And they wrote this. They said: "The goal of the defendant's proposed protective order, pretrial publicity, is antithetical to the interests of justice."

So, basically saying there, Trump just wants to use everything he might get, all of the evidence that might be handed over to drum up his supporters on social media and the campaign trail.

So, this continues to be a fight, Omar, that the judge is determined to put to rest by the end of this week. A hearing will happen before the close of day Friday. And then, at that point, it will be set in stone once she decides what from this proposed protective order will go into effect.

And it will be determined what Donald Trump can and cannot share with his followers on his social media site through social -- Omar.

JIMENEZ: And that's just in this case.

SCHNEIDER: Yes.

JIMENEZ: Jessica Schneider, thank you so much -- John.

BERMAN: Yes, you want a different case?

(LAUGHTER)

BERMAN: In Georgia, former Republican Lieutenant Governor Geoff Duncan says he received a subpoena and will testify this month in the Fulton County grand jury investigation into Donald Trump.

Now, Duncan in the past has described Trump's actions to try to overturn the electoral results in Georgia as -- quote -- "dangerous and pathetic."

CNN's Sara Murray, who's all over the Georgia angle, joins us now with the latest on the lieutenant governor, Sara.

[11:05:03] SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, the lieutenant governor, I mean, saying that he is willing to comply with a subpoena he received to provide testimony before the grand jury that we assume at some point is going to be hearing a case against former President Donald Trump and his many allies.

But, first, take a listen to what Geoff Duncan said on CNN yesterday about why he thinks it's important for him to comply with this subpoena.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FMR. LT. GOV. GEOFF DUNCAN (R-GA): Yes, I will be there to answer the facts as I know them and to continue this process of trying to discover what actually happened during that post-election period of time. Certainly, we can never repeat that as a country.

Certainly, I never want to see that happen in my home state of Georgia. A lot of good people's lives were uprooted. A lot of people's reputations have been soiled.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MURRAY: Now, again, we don't know that the district attorney is going to call necessarily all these witnesses that she's lined up to provide grand jury testimony.

But it's clear that she's got people on deck to try to craft this narrative around what Donald Trump and his allies were trying to do in the state of Georgia around the 2020 election. Duncan is someone who has been very critical of Donald Trump's efforts to overturn the election and has made very clear that a number of presentations that went on before lawmakers in the state Senate in Georgia were not sanctioned by him, even though he was the Senate president at the time.

BERMAN: So, she has witnesses on deck.

That's interesting to me -- and I know there have been some other subpoenas to other people as well -- because it indicates that they have maybe some work to do before the indictment comes. Yet the roads are blocked outside the courthouse already. And it makes one wonder, is this going to happen, and, if so, when?

MURRAY: Well, the interesting thing about these witnesses -- again, we know Geoff Duncan has been subpoenaed. We know Jen Jordan, who's a former Democratic state senator, and George Chidi, who is an independent journalist, have both been subpoenaed -- is that all these people testified already before a special grand jury that spent months and months investigating these -- this case.

So the DA's office already has a sense of what these folks are going to say if they ask them questions. And so what appears to be happening is, the district attorney's office is trying to figure out, if we make this presentation before a grand jury, if we seek indictments, what kind of voices can we use to build this narrative around what was happening, whether it was these crazy presentations before the state lawmakers, whether it was the assembling of the fake electors, the Republican fake electors in Georgia.

And these witnesses can kind of speak to that. Again, the question is timing. We know there are two grand juries that meet weekly in Fulton County. One meets Monday and Tuesday. That grand jury heard sort of regular cases about murder and robbery yesterday. So, it's unlikely that we are going to see an indictment today. We expect this presentation to take two days.

So, I think the soonest that she would start making any presentation would be Thursday of this week, but, again, could slip to next week -- John.

BERMAN: All right, keep looking at the calendar. Keep looking at the work they have set out for them. All very interesting.

Sara Murray, thanks for explaining so well -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: Joining us now to talk about this is former federal prosecutor Renato Mariotti, host of the "It's Complicated" podcast.

Renato, let's start off with, Sara Murray knows the ins and outs of this investigation in Georgia better than really anybody. You have got people -- people have been in standby for quite some time now waiting for indictments to come down from the Georgia investigation.

And now, as Sara was laying out, the former lieutenant governor, Geoff Duncan, he's handed a subpoena to testify. How do you see these two things lining up, as people are on standby and the court is kind of on lockdown?

RENATO MARIOTTI, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: Well, as Sara pointed out, these witnesses have already testified before the special grand jury.

I think, right now, what we're seeing is sort of the finishing touches being put on the case by Fani Willis and her team. So, ultimately, what they're doing is considering, hey, are there issues, additional questions that we need to ask, things that we missed?

Maybe they're trying to add some additional testimony they didn't get out earlier. But I really -- all signs still point to August being the month that this is going to come down. I think, as Sara noted, these extraordinary measures that her office has taken and -- Willis' office has taken to ensure that there's security, I think really point this being the indictment.

BOLDUAN: Yes.

And then, on the special counsel's 2020 election case, Trump's team responded last night over the question of a protective order that the prosecutors had asked for to limit what Trump's -- Trump essentially can share publicly in terms of evidence as they head up to trial.

And one thing that Trump's team said in pushing back or pushing for less restrictions than the prosecution wants, they said this. I'm going to read you part of what they said in the filing.

"In a trial about First Amendment rights, the government seeks to restrict First Amendment rights," these attorneys said in the court filing. "Worse, it does so against its administration's primary political opponent during an election season in which the administration, prominent party members and media allies have campaigned on the indictment and proliferated its false allegations."

[11:10:05]

What do you think of this?

MARIOTTI: You know, it's a lot of flash and not much substance case, Kate.

Really, this is a disagreement about the scope of a protective order. Both sides agree there should be a protective order. Protective orders are entered in a very large percentage of civil and criminal cases. Not that big of a deal. Very narrow disagreement.

And there's this wrapping around it of all this talk of First Amendment, and there's -- they have included photos of Biden with his mug in the filing. All that seems to be more for show, more for us to discuss in the media, rather than anything with a lot of substance, very little -- not much meat in the bun, so to speak.

(LAUGHTER)

BOLDUAN: Republican presidential candidate and former federal prosecutor, I guess I should note, Chris Christie, he was on CNN last night.

And he was talking to Anderson Cooper, and he said very clearly, in his view, he believes that Mark Meadows is likely a cooperating witness in this case, for -- amongst other reasons, because he's barely mentioned in the indictment. Listened to how Chris Christie talked about it, Renato.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FMR. GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R-NJ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: It could be the worst testimony for him, outside of the family members, because Mark Meadows was with him constantly during that period of time.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: And involved in all of it, in Georgia, in the electors.

CHRISTIE: He was a very involved chief of staff, in my experience. He was -- he made sure he was in every meeting and every conversation.

So -- and we remember there are hundreds of text messages that he turned over to the special counsel that he kept.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Many have speculated the same, that Mark Meadows is very conspicuously not mentioned in the indictment, considering his role in the Trump administration.

Do you agree with what you hear from Chris Christie?

MARIOTTI: Yes, Chris Christie is a pretty savvy and experienced former federal prosecutor himself. I think he's got good instincts here.

Ultimately, the -- Matt -- Mark Meadows hired a very, very good defense attorney. They pursued a very savvy strategy to keep him out of the January 6 hearing. And, ultimately, I -- it sure looks like Jack Smith is made a decision that Mark Meadows is a witness and not a co-conspirator, in his mind.

And if that's where he put him, I think he may not formally be a flipper, in some sense, but he may be providing testimony that supports the text messages and helps fill in the blanks to help Jack Smith prove his case.

BOLDUAN: It's good to see you, Renato. Thanks for coming in -- Omar.

JIMENEZ: Well, Kate, we're following big news this morning on the campaign trail, another shakeup for Florida Governor Ron DeSantis' presidential run.

He's now replacing his campaign manager. We're getting more news on this now.

Steve Contorno joins us.

So, Steve, what are you learning? And why is this so significant?

STEVE CONTORNO, CNN REPORTER: Well, Omar, it's another day, another shakeup in the Ron DeSantis campaign.

And, last month, it was rank-and-file members, where he made deep cuts to his staff. Now the change is coming at the top. Generra Peck, who has led DeSantis' political operation going back to his reelection campaign last year, is out as campaign manager.

And this is a move that some behind the scenes had been pushing for, for weeks. You have been hearing rumblings about all the problems with the campaigns and financing and messaging. And they saw that as a reflection of the campaign manager, who doesn't bring a lot of experience to this job. But she was very trusted in DeSantis' circles.

Now DeSantis has made the decision to change gears. He is bringing in the chief of staff from his gubernatorial office, James Uthmeier, who brings a lot more of an ideological alignment with DeSantis to this job. He is someone who has been seen as an enforcer of DeSantis' agenda in the Florida legislature.

He is very much aligned with DeSantis on all these cultural battles that he's been waging. But he also doesn't bring a ton of experience to this job. Just like his predecessor, he doesn't have a lot of seasoning running presidential campaigns. So, there are some other people they're bringing in to help on that

front. But one thing I'm hearing is, this is a concern that people who are supporting DeSantis, donors and otherwise, have been concerned about for weeks. We are now going into almost a full month of stories and headlines about the shakeup of the Ron DeSantis campaign.

And the concern is that this change being made now, a month after we saw the initial reports of changes to the campaign, is just adding more and more bad headlines at a time where they need to change the narrative. They want to talk about what Governor DeSantis is going to do for this country, how he's going to beat presidential -- Trump.

And yet here we are in August talking about these massive changes to his campaign once again, Omar.

JIMENEZ: And they likely hope this will spark things in the opposite direction, for some positive momentum. We will have to see.

[11:15:00]

Steve Contorno, thank you so much, as always.

Coming up: a brawl on a riverfront dock in Alabama. Multiple arrest warrants have been issued after white boaters were seen on video attacking a black security guard. We will explain. New accusations this morning about how this started.

Plus, new numbers just into CNN are giving us a better idea on how inflation is really impacting Americans and their wallets, specifically household debt.

And a popular drug for weight loss could also help people's hearts. We will explain.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:20:10]

BERMAN: All right, just in, brand-new numbers on credit card and household debt that tell us a lot about where the economy is.

CNN business correspondent Vanessa Yurkevich is with us now.

What do these numbers tell us, Vanessa?

VANESSA YURKEVICH, CNN BUSINESS AND POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: Just in from the Federal Reserve of New York, John, household debt increasing by $16 billion, up 0.1 percent from the first quarter of this year.

But the credit card debt is really what we want to look at, up 4.6 percent in the second quarter. That's jumping to over a trillion dollars in credit card debt for Americans. That's about $45 billion in the second quarter. And why it's important to look at this is because consumers are clearly still spending, but they're putting a lot of that spending on credit cards. So what that could mean is that Americans are still grappling with

high inflation, and also struggling with higher interest rates, thus putting a lot more of their spending on credit cards, carrying greater debts.

And then I want to draw your attention, though, John, to online sales. This is sort of a little bit of the flip side, online sales decreasing 1.6 percent year over year. And this is significant, because this means, while inflation is still high, folks might be peeling back spending just slightly.

Here's what has come down in terms of what people are spending on -- for online sales, appliances down 8 percent, electronics down 11.7 percent. But what is still high for consumers, groceries. That has been sort of the sticking point for people, trying to figure out how to pay for these higher prices at the grocery stores that have still remained high, up 6.3 percent year over year, and also apparel, 11.9 percent up year over year.

So, folks still spending, trying to be mindful of what they're spending, but anything they are spending, John, being put on credit cards.

BERMAN: Yes, it's really interesting to think about the implications here, because consumer spending is something that drives the economy forward, but it is something that could come back to haunt consumers if they pile up this debt, and ultimately can't afford to pay it off.

Vanessa Yurkevich, thank you so much. Deeply interesting numbers there -- Omar.

JIMENEZ: Yes, John, a lot of numbers to keep an eye on.

Something else we're keeping an eye on, we expect an update from officials on the brawl at Montgomery, Alabama's, Riverfront Park. The police have issued at least four warrants, and more could be on the way after a group of white boaters apparently attacked a black dockworker.

We have seen the video all over at this point. Montgomery's mayor is calling for justice to be served.

CNN's Ryan Young has the latest.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

RYAN YOUNG, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): An altercation on a Montgomery, Alabama, boat dock over the weekend between a group of white boaters and a black employee escalated into a massive brawl that resulted in multiple arrest warrants.

Montgomery Mayor Steven Reed is calling for justice to be served for attacking a man who was doing his job.

STEVEN REED (D), MAYOR OF MONTGOMERY, ALABAMA: It's an unfortunate incident. And it's something that we're investigating right now. We will continue to go through that process before we take any additional steps.

YOUNG: It all began when the black employee was trying to clear the dock space where the riverside cruise the Harriott II normally docks. The cruiser was about to return to shore and needed its space to dock.

LAUREN SPIVEY, WITNESS: You know, just doing his job. And, for some reason, they didn't like it. They didn't want to move the boat, and he decided to get physical with him.

YOUNG: You can see in the video the black employee on the dock arguing with one of the men from the pontoon boat, and then another shirtless white man charging at the employee and hitting him in the face.

Soon after that, you can see several others join in on the attack of the dock employee. In some of the video which has gone viral, with millions of views, people on the boat can be heard yelling for someone to go help the employee. Then, at one point, you can see a young man who has jumped off the boat swimming ashore to help the man who was being attacked.

SPIVEY: The boat got closer. The guys and the crew members and everybody got off. And that's when it happened. That's the reason why, when they got off the boat, they came right to that smaller boat.

YOUNG: And that's what more fighting ensues, turning into an all-out brawl that included several people getting hit over the head with a folding chair.

Soon after, officers started trying to take control, handcuffing people in the fight.

SPIVEY: You know they were the antagonists of the whole situation. Arrest them, because, unfortunately, when things happen, people of color are the first to put -- be put in handcuffs.

YOUNG: Many questions remain about the melee that appear to be very much split across racial lines.

REED: We are fully engaged, and we are doing all of our due diligence to find out exactly what took place.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[11:25:00]

YOUNG: Yes, talk about a story that's really taken social media by storm.

There's a lot of people who've analyzed this video from every angle. Talking to that witness, though, she believes it's pretty clear that the man who was working was the one who was attacked. And police are, of course, investigating.

They're asking anyone with a video of this incident to come forward. Hopefully, today, at the 2:00 news conference, we will learn much, much more about what police have been able to find out and who those people who are charged and what they are facing -- guys, back to you.

JIMENEZ: Ryan Young, thank you -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: Coming up still for us: Ukraine's Western allies receiving increasingly sobering reports on Ukraine's counteroffensive.

The former President of Ukraine Petro Poroshenko is our guest.

And the teenage cousin of the Uvalde school murderer was just arrested after making threats to carry out a similar attack. What he is now telling police.

We will be back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:30:00]