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Sources: Trump's Lawyers at Fulton County Courthouse; Expected to Discuss Bond Terms; Soon: Bidens to Arrive in Maui Survey Devastation; Maui Mayor: 850 People Remain Missing, 114 Dead. Aired 3- 3:30p ET

Aired August 21, 2023 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[15:00:41]

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Breaking news out of Fulton County, Georgia. Former President Donald Trump's lawyers are now at the courthouse set to meet with District Attorney Fani Willis and negotiate his surrender on RICO charges tied to his effort to overturn the 2020 Election.

A short time ago, John Eastman, a former Trump lawyer and a primary architect of that 2020 Election subversion scheme agreed to a hundred thousand dollars bond. And pro-Trump poll watcher, Scott Hall, agreed to a $10,000 bond.

Let's get you straight to the courthouse now with CNN's Katelyn Polantz.

Katelyn, Eastman obviously one of the biggest names of the 19 defendants, not including Donald Trump, what's the latest that you're learning about what's happening at the courthouse behind you?

KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE REPORTER: Well, what we're learning now at the courthouse from our own Zach Cohen and Kaitlan Collins is that Donald Trump's lawyers are here indeed doing the negotiations for his own bond terms. Donald Trump being one of the 19 defendants in this criminal case, there are several different defense lawyers that are negotiating bond terms, just like John Eastman, you just mentioned has that a hundred thousand dollar bond set.

Another defendant in this case who was trying to - who was accused of trying to access vote tabulating machines in Coffee County, Georgia, he has a $10,000 bond. And so the big question of the afternoon and throughout the rest of this week is going to be exactly how is Donald Trump treated here compared to the other defendants in this case and then defendants writ large in the state of Georgia, in Fulton County, who are being accused of white collar crime or racketeering charges.

Does he have some sort of bail term that is set and very similar to these other defendants? Is he treated the same as other defendants?

We won't know that until we see what the agreement is that his lawyers reach with the prosecutor's office here and a judge signs off on it. But once we get that document, that is what we're going to be looking for. And then once that document is in the system, along with the documents for these other 18 defendants alongside Trump, they then all have to turn themselves in. They all have to be arraigned. They have to visit the jail. And they will have to enter their pleadings of not guilty.

And so that arrest process, that arraignment process, that's what's teed up for the rest of this week, perhaps arraignments going into next week. We're going to be watching all of that play out as Donald Trump and others working around him, including people who were closely affiliated with his campaign, people who were lawyers for him, as they run a face with the criminal justice system as criminal defendants being accused of taking actions that were illegal in the state of Georgia after the 2020 Election to help the former president maintain power, even though he lost this state and others across the nation.

SANCHEZ: Katelyn, let's zero in on the John Eastman agreement. Take us through the details of that.

POLANTZ: Yes. There's a couple of different pieces of this that are quite important. One is that this Eastman agreement is the first that we have of these 19 defendants. And one of the terms here is that John Eastman cannot communicate with other defendants in this case. He also can't communicate with other witnesses in this case about the facts of the case.

And so that means he's not going to personally be able to coordinate with other lawyers he might know and have quite a long history with, who he was working with alongside with Trump after the election. He's not going to be able to talk to Trump himself about this case. They're going to have to talk through their lawyers or somehow through mediation in some informal sense if they do want to coordinate their legal defenses in some way. But that's a pretty strict term.

And if you do violate it, you could be in violation of your jail terms or your bond terms, meaning you might have to go back to jail. The other thing about this is that $100,000 bond, that doesn't mean that you write a check for $100,000. Although, I guess you can.

It means that you're essentially assuring that you're going to keep showing up and that you would owe that money if you don't show up for future proceedings, if you were to abscond, if you don't show up for trial, something like that.

[15:04:58]

But it still is something that puts you in the court system as a criminal defendant and makes sure - it's the guarantee to the court that you, as a defendant, will see this through and they will be able to try a case against you as a defendant in the state of Georgia.

SANCHEZ: The first day of a big week ahead in Fulton County.

Katelyn Polantz, thanks so much for the reporting. Jim?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: We're joined now by Lawfare's Fulton County Correspondent, Anna Bower, who's been covering this case very closely since the beginning.

Anna, good to have you on.

With Trump's lawyers there now, based on the way other cases have been negotiated, is it likely that an agreement would come today for his surrender arrangement or might this drag on for a little bit?

ANNA BOWER, FULTON COUNTRY CORRESPONDENT, LAWFARE: I think it really depends on kind of what's on the table. I think it's likely that we see some agreement on the standard conditions that were entered on the consent bonds in John Eastman's case and then Scott Hall as well. That includes things like not intimidating witnesses, not contacting co- defendants except through counsel.

Those are things that are pretty standard conditions that I think will be easily resolved and agreed to. The big questions will be whether they come to an agreement about the bond amount and then also whether they come to an agreement about the terms of surrender that is due to happen by Friday.

Well, that is usually in the realm of decision-making with the sheriff's office as to how to handle it, so that's things like whether or not the defendant has a mugshot ...

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BOWER: ... mugshot taken.

Those things usually are decided by the Sheriff's Office. But the sheriff has said that unless he hears otherwise, he will treat Trump and other defendants the way that they usually would be treated, like every other defendant. But I think that means that the district attorney does have some decision-making here about how to approach it.

So we will see whether or not Trump will be booked and weighed and has - have his mugshot taken like every other defendant.

SCIUTTO: The previous indictments Trump has faced, he has not had to post bond. Is it more likely based on how we know Fulton County runs? And by the way, first time Fulton County has seen an indicted president walk through those doors. But based on the way they typically handle things like that, is it more likely than not that he would have to post bond here, whereas he has not in previous cases?

BOWER: Certainly think that it will be likely that he will post bond. That is very common in Fulton County. I think that that will occur here, especially now that we've seen John Eastman has a bond of a hundred thousand dollars.

As Katelyn mentioned, however, that is not the actual amount that you have to pay. You usually pay about 10 percent and the rest of it is more like an assurance that you will pay it. So I don't - I think that what we will see is that Trump will have a bond that is higher than Eastman's. It seems to be the case that what we're seeing here is a higher amount based on the involvement or alleged involvement in the conspiracy. So I would think that Trump, out of all of the defendants, might have the highest bond amount set.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Regardless of whether he has to, the former president take a mugshot, give his fingerprints. Those scenes we've seen so often for others going through a process like that, he will still have to walk through the doors of the Fulton County jail, walk through rooms that other lower level offenders must walk through every day there. Can you describe what that looks like? What he will certainly have to face there as opposed to questions that are still open at this point?

BOWER: Right. So the facility where Trump is likely to be booked, although nothing is set in stone is what's known in Atlanta as the Rice Street facility. It is an infamous facility in the Atlanta area. It has been subject of numerous lawsuits for inhumane treatment and conditions of individuals who are incarcerated there.

Most recently, it was the subject of national headlines when it was alleged that an incarcerated person died there as the result of a bed bug infestation. So it is a place that certainly no one wants to end up. And Trump will have to walk through that facility and like any other defendant, spend some time there. How long, it's unclear, but he certainly will be treated like other defendants in that respect.

SCIUTTO: It's a remarkable scene to imagine.

Anna Bower, thanks so much. Appreciate it. Brianna?

[15:10:00]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: As we're following all of these breaking details, you really can't ignore that this is a big week for the Republican Party writ large. The first GOP debate is ahead of us here. And Louisiana Senator Bill Cassidy is a Republican who voted to convict Trump in his second impeachment trial. He told CNN that Trump should drop out of the race. Here it is.

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SEN. BILL CASSIDY (R-LA): I think the charge, it seems most likely, I mean, it seems almost a slam dunk, is the one related to mishandling of classified documents. If that is proven, then we may have a candidate for president who has been convicted of a crime.

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KEILAR: Joining us now is CNN Special Correspondent, Jamie Gangel.

We hear Cassidy there. I guess the question is, does it really make a difference? Does that have an impact?

JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, there are probably a lot of Republicans who privately would also like Donald Trump to drop out. I think what was notable about what he said is because so many other elected officials are silent right now. But the reality is, we look at the polls, Donald Trump is far and away the leader. That said, could that change this week? Will these debates make a difference? Will someone rise to the top? But until we see that happen, he's still the front runner.

KEILAR: Does it create challenges for other candidates that Trump is not showing up or does it create opportunity or both?

GANGEL: So I think the challenge is how do you differentiate yourself, how do you take on someone when they're not on the stage with you. But there are always surprises in debates. Something happens, there's a moment where someone may rise to the top. I think one question will be, how do they attack Trump? Do they say he was a coward for not showing up? Do they try to take him on policy when they agree with a lot of the policies? But that's it - no question it's a challenge not having him there.

KEILAR: Trump may not like that.

GANGEL: Yes.

KEILAR: Someone saying that he's a coward for not showing up. I think that might be a button of his that could be pressed there.

GANGEL: Right.

KEILAR: Does he have anything to lose by not showing up?

GANGEL: So, political consultants, I think, would tell you, by and large, hey, you're this far ahead. Why show up with these guys who are at 1 percent or 2 percent? That said, I'm told that some Trump aides have been trying to convince him to debate for a different reason.

If he is the nominee, he wants to debate Joe Biden. And if he doesn't show up for these debates, it hurts the argument that Biden has to show up to debate him.

KEILAR: That's a really interesting point.

GANGEL: Yes.

KEILAR: Jamie Gangel, as always, thank you for being with us.

GANGEL: Thank you.

KEILAR: Boris?

SANCHEZ: We're following all the latest developments, the breaking news out of Fulton County, Georgia.

Plus, President Biden traveling to Maui to meet with the victims and first responders of a devastating wildfire. We're going to take you to Hawaii live.

And later, Russia's first lunar mission in decades ends after the spacecraft crashes into the moon. You're watching CNN NEWS CENTRAL. We'll be back in a few minutes.

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[15:17:30]

SANCHEZ: Soon, President Biden and the First Lady will arrive in Maui to tour the devastation left behind by the deadly wildfires there. It's been nearly two weeks since the flames erupted on the island. Maui's mayor says some 850 people are still missing. The confirmed death toll, 114, that already makes it the deadliest American wildfire in more than a century.

Today, the president plans to meet with some survivors, first responders, officials and volunteers. Later, he's going to deliver remarks.

We're joined now by our Bill Weir, who has been covering this since the beginning on Maui.

You've been so eloquent, Bill, in describing just the sadness there, the loss of life. That is a graveyard, effectively, Lahaina remains. The grief that the president is going to run into headlong as he arrives there, it's going to be difficult. And I imagine the folks there have some things to say to him. What is this visit going to be like and what do they want to hear from him?

BILL WEIR, CNN CHIEF CLIMATE CORRESPONDENT: That's a great question, Jim. Yes, this is really a case study in grief when you think about the idea that hundreds of brothers, and fathers, and mothers and children may never be found, which makes the historic town of Lahaina, the former capital of the Kingdom of Hawaii, even more sacred. They're processing through that and there's an awful lot of frustration given the official response both at the county and federal level.

Now sort of the zone has been flooded with all the help they need. So there's some venting that probably has to happen. But primarily what I'm hearing again and again is listen to the locals. I was hanging out yesterday with a native Hawaiian, regenerative farmer, water rights person very interested in that and asked him, what would you say to the President. Take a listen.

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WEIR: If you could get face time with President Biden, would you want that and what would you say?

HOKUAO PELLEGRINO, PRESIDENT, HUI O NA WAI EHA: Let the people of Lahaina lead this restoration of their community. That includes native Hawaiians and locals. Let the community be in charge of what these next steps will be. We need government. There's no doubt about that, but work with the community. Because right now you're having two people leading, but not necessarily together, just kind of parallel to each other.

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[15:20:06]

WEIR: It was 1993 when Sen. Joe Biden was in Congress that the United States officially apologized for overthrowing the Kingdom of Hawaii a century earlier. And ever since then, generationally, native Hawaiians and multigenerational locals have been left out of planning decisions as big hotels, golf courses, resorts pop up all around them.

So that, I think, is the message that most will say is please listen to us. Let us share some indigenous wisdom with you and ask for our help on rebuilding this place and making it even more special.

SCIUTTO: You've noted that some names have come off the missing list. It was around a thousand last week. It's 850. But boy, that's still just a unconscionable number. Do you have any sense if more names are likely to come off that list?

WEIR: That's the question, Jim. The mayor of Maui said that thanks to the FBI, they whittled that list from over 2,000 down to 850. But just a couple of days earlier, it was over a thousand, according to the governor. Our producer actually ran into a couple who asked, who were asking, how do I get our names off of the missing list.

And so hopefully there's enough of that confusion to bring that down right now. But two weeks now, nearly after this fire, with most communications restored, and a lot of children we know were left home while their parents had to go to work.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WEIR: It's still tragic, regardless.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WEIR: One is too many.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WEIR: But 850 is still unfathomable.

SCIUTTO: Yes, I think about that kid - those kids left at home all the time. Well, please do send the people there our thoughts. We're thinking about them and we appreciate your reporting.

Bill Weir in Lahaina. Boris?

SANCHEZ: Let's talk more about relief efforts in Maui with someone spearheading that work.

Kainoa Horcajo joins us now. He's with Maui Rapid Response, a disaster response team helping to provide assistance to survivors left devastated by the wildfires.

Kainoa, thanks so much for being with us.

Talk to us about the work that your organization is doing right now. KAINOA HORCAJO, ORGANIZER, MAUI RAPID RESPONSE: Thank you for having us and thank you for keeping this in your news cycle, so much changes. I was lucky enough just to jump in with a dedicated team of volunteers. Maui Rapid Response is an ahupua'a-based, citizen-led crisis response team. So ahupua'a is our traditional form of land management. It means, as was stated in the last individual, we let the community lead, the Lahaina community, the upcountry community, who also lost a lot.

As soon as this tragedy started happening, we just kind of started activating the community. There's no one person here, even no one agency spearheading this. This is a completely decentralized, distributed community supporting itself. A bunch of people got together. We organized collection centers and distribution hubs.

Obviously, at first, getting over there via roads was difficult. It was cut off because of safety measures. But we're pretty industrious and we can get things done, so we got helicopters and boats and jet skis and everything to get help out to those people.

At first, it was the things you can imagine, right? Drinkable, potable water, food, perishable food, things you can eat without having to cook, because you couldn't cook. And then it became propane and gas and cooking facilities as well.

SANCHEZ: Kainoa, obviously, President Biden will be on the ground in Maui today. What is it that you want him to see and hear most?

HORCAJO: It's less about what I want him to see. He's going to get out there and he's going to see what is. He's going to see our community having risen, having called - being called to the challenge and rising to that challenge quicker than any government agency can.

And rightfully so, when your neighbor's house is burning, you're there before any agency is. And you saw every single neighbor, every family member just rise to that call to help our people. That is something that we are known for. What I do think a lot of us recognize is that while we think of ourselves as a very small community, the people from Maui, we still think of ourselves as an agricultural community, as a small, tight-knit community.

Yet the world over knows about us because we are a tourist destination, which means that we have an incredible amount of resources here. We have 10s of thousands of condo and hotel rooms. We have nearly every large nearly - every large private equity firm and corporation in the world here.

So tapping into the resources that the president can activate both directly and through networks to increase support from corporate America, we've got amazing hotels here that are staffed by local people.

[15:25:07]

But pushing that up the chain so that corporate and the ownership, the brands that you know and the private equity firms are all supporting in the ways they can. And then engaging our small business.

We know the SBA leader was out here. We have a lot of businesses across the island in the non-affected, non-physically affected areas that are suffering right now. And so whether it's about assuring people that it's okay to visit, whether that's from a different island, supporting our small businesses in any way to make sure that we don't have another crisis like the COVID shutdown on top of the crisis that we have because of the fires.

SANCHEZ: Kainoa, quickly, still well over 800 people unaccounted for. Have you heard any update about those that are missing?

HORCAJO: I have not. I know that some people are sheltering in homes and scared to come out. I know that there's a lot of trauma here. I think we have to hold hope and I think we have to allow first responders some time to do what they do for search and rescue and recovery to do what they do and hold them in our thoughts as we allow the people to keep safe as well because there's a lot of contamination out there.

SANCHEZ: Kainoa Horcajo, our hearts go out to those families with loved ones still missing and obviously to you and the important work that you're doing. Thank you so much.

HORCAJO: Thank you, guys. Mahalo.

SANCHEZ: Of course. Brianna?

KEILAR: Right now, lawyers for the Republican presidential front runner are at a courthouse in Atlanta hashing out the terms of his bond. The political impact of all of this just days before the first GOP debate without former president, Donald Trump.

We'll have that next on CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

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