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Wagner Boss Prigozhin Listed Among Passengers In Plane Crash. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired August 23, 2023 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: A Prigozhin-linked plane strapped -- stopped transmission at 6:13 p.m. local time, this according to flight tracking data. CNN, we should note, has previously reported on this particular plane based on its transponder signal. A number of planes send out these things so you know what the plane is, which, according to CNN's reporting, has previously been linked to Prigozhin's companies. And that same plane had been used in the past to ferry Prigozhin from Rostov-on-Don, which became the headquarters for his attempted coup against Putin.

You may remember it was -- that's where the tanks in the armored personnel carriers carrying his forces drove up towards Moscow on that day two months ago. That plane that stopped transmitting at 6:13. And if that video is, what it purports to be, shows when it stopped transmitting is a plane that based on past movements, is one that Prigozhin has used and flown on many times before.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: And this is key -- a very key. The data does not show a steep descent before the plane stops transmitting data over the Russian region of Tver.

SCIUTTO: I was in a sudden -- (INAUDIBLE)

KEILAR: That's right. Sudden catastrophic event --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

KEILAR: -- is what it seems to indicate.

SCIUTTO: And that matches the video that right we just showed that right there. Yes.

KEILAR: Where you see the plane falling out of the sky, it appears in what appears to be the apparent demise of that plane.

SCIUTTO: Listen. This is quite a moment at the top of the hour here. Again, if you're just joining, CNN's reporting is that the Wagner boss, Prigozhin, who led a failed coup against Putin was among the passengers on board. That plane you see there falling to the ground and a cloud of smoke bursting into flames. Four bodies already recovered from that wreckage.

Russian state media reporting that Prigozhin, seen there broadcasting in a video just released two days ago, that he was on board that plane. A truly remarkable event among a series of remarkable events that we've covered on this broadcast and on this network in recent months, including that day, two months ago, when it looked like Prigozhin was carrying out the biggest challenge to Putin's leadership since he took power. And now, that burning wreckage on the ground -- that burning wreckage on the ground.

I believe our Jill Dougherty is also with us now. Jill Dougherty, who's covered Russia extensively through the years. Jill Dougherty, tell us your reaction. You know as well as anyone that Putin has killed other rivals before many of them both inside Russian territory and outside Russian territory. With the proviso that we don't know for certain, Prigozhin was on this plane, what is your reaction to seeing this news as reported by state media?

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: You know, it is shocking. However, I think it is predictable. Many people were predicting that it was just a matter of time, not knowing exactly how it would happen.

But Prigozhin had a rebellion against Putin. And no matter which way you slice it, Putin does not forgive. And so, I think this period of a couple of months, where they were able -- the Kremlin was able to dismantle Prigozhin's you know industry that he had, which included troll farms, and the Wagner of forces, etcetera, that is pretty much underway.

So, I think this was a good moment to say goodbye to him. Of course, we don't know, you know, details. But other people have died.

I'm thinking of the -- at least one person who back in the 90s, who died in a plane crash. He was a very important political figure. So this is not rare.

And it will be very, very interesting to see what happens to Wagner because the other report, although I haven't been in communication, so I don't know whether the second in command was killed as well. But that would give total control to Wagner. And its work in Africa and many other places back to the Kremlin supporting people.

KEILAR: Yes, very --

SCIUTTO: Good point.

KEILAR: Very important point there. I think also, we have to look at the context in which this is happening as we are still searching for some details here. What we do know at this point is that according to Russian state media, they're saying that he was on this plane. What we do know is that he was on the passenger list for this plane that appears to have crashed north of Moscow, Jill.

But listen. In the last two months -- exactly two months since this sort of mini coup that petered out since it happened, but obviously not something Vladimir Putin wanted, you've seen a purge of generals. We learned that General Surovikin, who by the way, we haven't seen since that mutiny, we learned just in recent hours that he's gotten the boot. And then this happens. I mean, there's a -- there are series of things that have happened just here in recent hours that have been, in an understated way, unfortunate for enemies of Vladimir Putin.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

DOUGHERTY: And at this point, you know, he's -- I think Putin at this point is looking at how he can reorganize control of the army, control of security forces.

[14:05:08]

Because as we've been saying, even though they are holding the line with this counter operation by the Ukrainians, they're still not doing very well. Their military is not doing very well. And there was a lot of criticism, not only from people, let's say, you know, on the outside who are criticizing this war, but people inside Russia who are really extreme and want the war to be waged even more brutally. So, that it is a lot of -- you know, I think was Churchill who said, fighting under the rug --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

DOUGHERTY: Dogs fighting under the rug. And I think that's what we're saying. We don't know exactly where it's going. But you can certainly say that some people, at least one important person who was a major figure, and not really controllable either.

I would add -- I would add that, you know, Prigozhin hasn't exactly been quiet on social media since this happened. So, he was, I think, a threat to Putin. At least his message was a threat. And ultimately, this may be what happened that Putin we don't know, but that Putin got rid of him.

SCIUTTO: As we've been saying, it is Russian state media reporting that Prigozhin was on the passenger list on this plane. We don't yet have confirmation that Prigozhin was on the plane. We do know this. That video of debris from that plane shows the plane engine, and that the registration number on that engine, the last four digits match that of a plane belonging to Prigozhin. And that as we mentioned earlier, CNN has tracked him using such a plane on prior trips in and around Russia.

Again, more information connecting that plane going down there, as you're seeing in the video, and then the wreckage of which will show momentarily there on fire. But that video coming into CNN shows a registration number on a jet there that matches information tied to a jet owned -- not just owned by Prigozhin, but one that he has traveled on before.

KEILAR: That's right. And let's get to Nick Paton Walsh. I understand, Nick, you have some reaction from inside of Ukraine because the big question here is, how is this going to shape the dynamics of this war? What are you hearing from your sources?

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR: Yes. Look, we've had a lower-level official, I think it's fair to say, an adviser to the interior ministry well-known in the media, Anton Gerashchenko. But he has said, if Prigozhin's death is confirmed, I think we'll be fairly certain Putin gave this order. He did not and was not going to forgive the humiliation by Prigozhin in June. Referring to that failed mutiny, but they marched to Wagner tanks and vehicles in Moscow. He goes on to suggest that sort of he can and perhaps another Russian commander associated with Prigozhin might want to be sure that their "earthly affairs are ignored."

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WALSH: And now, this is what you might expect to happen. Ukrainians seizing upon this moment, the possibility that Prigozhin is dead that we do not know, at this stage to be the case. But it's important to point out that his role in the war here was significantly reduced after that mutiny. As indeed, you might expect, he went against the Russian top brass and said you are not doing a good enough job in this and challenged Putin in ways.

But I think he even -- Prigozhin didn't think he was doing when he started that move towards Rostov in the south up towards Moscow. And so, Wagner since has been reduced from the front lines. Western officials have suggested indeed, that their funding has begun to collapse.

Putin was very open in the days afterward about how they've been given essentially billions to Prigozhin, the supposed secret denied by the Wagner group to build their presence in Africa and indeed fight in some of the toughest places on the Russian front lines in occupied Ukraine on behalf of Russia. But Western officials suggesting perhaps that the money had begun to dry up, so Wagner was beginning to look disheveled. No real better words than that to describe your Yevgeny Prigozhin when he popped up on a video in a telegram in Africa, just in the last 48 hours.

He did not look particularly happy at all but talked about potentially expanding Wagner's role in Africa. And so, the thought had really been well, maybe Prigozhin has out of favor obviously with the Kremlin. Maybe has too much political currency for Putin to arrest him or take him out of circulation. Maybe he's being allowed to keep going on a lower level clearly with his wings clipped perhaps because of the failure of that rebellion. Maybe his men are being moved to Belrus but Belarus's president was never that welcoming, frankly.

I think also NATO neighbors of Belarus deeply concerned the potential of Wagner being there. And so, the sudden arrival of Prigozhin again in Africa, perhaps explain maybe that might have been the get-out for Putin, exile in Africa for Prigozhin.

[14:10:00]

But that doesn't really fit with the Putin that we know, massively weakened by the armed rebellion. Make no mistake. He has not suddenly recovered.

He's been on a PR offensive since then, desperately trying to claw back that image as the infallible strong man utterly shattered by what Prigozhin did. And so it would have been odd, frankly, for long-term observers of the Kremlin to see Prigozhin continue in public life healthy, essentially untouched by that extraordinary decision to challenge Putin in the most overt challenge he'd seen since he came to power in 1999.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WALSH: And so yes, what we're hearing today is in keeping with what we know Putin is about, but we know so little really about who was really on that plane and where Prigozhin is now. And as I said before, Jim, if I was Prigozhin now, I would not be popping up in public anytime soon to tell everybody where I am, and that I'm safe Jim.

SCIUTTO: It may not be possible, frankly. And there has been a Western assessment that Putin could conceivably emerge stronger from this coup if given an opportunity to seek out those willing to -- willing to challenge him. And there's also been somewhat black humor that you've heard from senior Western officials describing Prigozhin's situation going forward. This is what U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken said just last month.

He said. If I were Mr. Prigozhin, I would remain very concerned, NATO has an open-door policy. Russia has an open-windows policy. And it needs to be very focused to that.

That a -- you know call it a dry reference to the tendency of those who have stood up to Putin to fall out of windows or to fall off of balconies. And there's a hard record of that. There are a number of folks who have died in various ways, from poisoning --

KEILAR: Politicians, business leaders --

SCIUTTO: Politicians, business leaders --

KEILAR: So, the list goes on and on.

SCIUTTO: Inside and outside of Russian territory, frankly.

KEILAR: Right.

SCIUTTO: Bianna Golodryga. She's joining us on the phone now. Has also covered the events of this war and Russian leadership.

Bianna, as you watch and we play again, video here of that plane falling from the sky, like a stone, a smoke trail behind it. Tell us what your thoughts are.

BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN SENIOR GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Well, I, like so many others, Jim and Brianna, initially surprised but then not so much. Because as you've long been saying, ever since that failed mutiny two months ago, many had speculated that Prigozhin wasn't long for this world. So, it was just a matter of when.

And what was a bit curious was given all of the circumstances which led up to that failed mutiny, and then the details and the intelligence that we learned after the fact that Putin essentially froze for a good 48 -- 24 hours, such to 48 hours where we saw nothing really transpire in Russia. Wondering why he was -- he and his troops were able to get as far as they did, not only in Rostov-on-Don but also marching towards Moscow.

Essentially, this was a situation, it appears. And again, we don't know many of the details, just the news information that we're getting from Russian state media. It appears that Putin and the Kremlin decided to take their time here to not look like they panicked and to not make Prigozhin look like a martyr, which in the early days following that failed mutiny, his popularity and approval numbers went up in Russia. Prigozhin on all along, said that this wasn't a mutiny or a coup against Vladimir Putin. It was just against the military leadership, which he believed and many others would assess, were doing a poor job in this war.

That having been said, he was somebody who could not be contained and controlled. And that is something Putin liked. And it worked in his favor for all of these years as he was an independent quasi-entity controlling the Wagner group. And it took that failed mutiny for Putin to say what we had all along suspected, and that was that Wagner had been an arm of the Russian military.

We know that Prigozhin, just a few weeks ago, met with African leaders in St. Petersburg, another curious situation where we saw photos of him shaking hands with African leaders. And this may well be a situation where Putin and the Kremlin --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

GOLODGRYGA: -- wanted to get all of their ducks lined up and in get the Wagner group in an orderly situation because it continues to be a profitable group for Russia, specifically in Africa. And as we heard, the number two in command also recently died in just hours ago. We heard that General Surovikin, who was many would assess a competent general in this war was also removed from his job. We have not seen him in weeks. He is to "the Kremlin on vacation."

So, all of this put together comes at a time when we know that this war has been difficult -- has proven to be difficult for Ukraine. And Vladimir Putin has an "election" to prepare for coming up next March. So, his numbers -- his approval ratings if you -- if you are that to believe any of these pollsters in Russia, even the independent ones have gone up.

He still hasn't recovered fully but he survived this failed coup and failed mutiny. And so, now on top, he found himself in a situation where according to the Levada Center, about 20 percent of Russians follow this war on a daily basis, and that's the lowest figure since the war began. So, perhaps you do this collectively, given all the other information that we've discussed, as the perfect time to finally do what many are not surprised to hear.

[14:15:17]

SCIUTTO: Yes. Well, as you say, what the phrase Russian election in quotes is because we know that they do not operate freely or fairly there. We do have this news into CNN.

That is -- that the Russian State Aviation Authority says that a specially created commission has begun investigating the circumstances and causes of the accident with the Embraer-135 aircraft. We should note that you need to take the word of Russian agencies with a grain of salt given that their past record for well, holding credible investigations if you look back at MH-17 when Russia shot that down in 2014, not a great record of credibility.

Our Fred Pleitgen joins us from Berlin again. Fred has covered Russia extensively in the war in Ukraine. Fred, tell us what more you're hearing.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Jim. Yes, and I've actually been in touch with some folks inside Russia who are very pro-Kremlin, obviously. And also one of them is a former adviser to Vladimir Putin, who is also very close to Yevgeny Prigozhin and to Wagner as well.

And, you know, obviously, they don't have very much in the way of rock-solid information. And we can sort of see a narrative that seems to be forming among some of them folks who are -- who are saying they believe that perhaps Ukraine might have been behind this. I was myself quite surprised to hear that, but this is a former adviser to Vladimir Putin, who was close to Prigozhin.

He said that he believed that this could be a Ukrainian intelligence operation on Ukrainian Independence Day. Another Russian also telling me "Budanov did it," who is, of course, the head of Ukrainian military intelligence. They point to former plots that the Russians have said the Ukrainians were behind.

Like, for instance, the killing of Daria Dugina, of course, the daughter of Aleksandr Dugin, the Kremlin -- pro-Kremlin propagandist, and others as well. So that seems to be sort of the narrative that is -- that is forming right now among some of those pro-Kremlin figures who are very influential, of course, in Russian state media as well.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

PLEITGEN: So, we're going to wait and see how that develops in Russian state media. But I thought one of the really interesting things that I heard from Brianna, actually. She was just saying, I think, a couple of minutes ago, that there have been sort of purges, people who have been losing their jobs. And one of them was Sergey Surovikin.

Now, of course, that was announced today that he had been dismissed as the head of the Russian Aerospace Forces. The Aerospace Forces, of course, are in charge of all air defense systems, including the ones inside Russia. And if we look at that plane coming down, it certainly looked as though it had witnessed or had been subjected to something very catastrophic.

Of course, all this impossible to say what's really behind it. But certainly, there are interesting things that are developing here where people who appear to have been close to Yevgeny Prigozhin and Sergey Surovikin losing their jobs in positions that of course, are key to air transportation safety.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

PLEITGEN: And then you have this incident. Again, very difficult to ascertain what exactly is going on. But we do see sort of in Russia -- in Russian state media, a narrative that is unfolding right now seemingly trying to pin this on Ukraine.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

PLEITGEN: While at the same time of course, others are saying that possibly Vladimir Putin himself might have been behind this, Jim.

SCIUTTO: And we should note. Russia has a history of flooding the zone with misinformation and disinformation, sometimes contradictory. We saw that again in the wake of the shoot-down of MH-17 in 2014, putting out stories that it was a whole host of people other than Russia to carry that out. It's a timeworn Kremlin strategy. Fred Pleitgen, in Berlin, thanks so much. Brianna.

KEILAR: All right. We are taking a look now at just some of the particulars of this -- of this flight here. And as you know, we are looking at this video that appears to be of this Embraer Legacy 600 falling out of the sky in the Tver region of Russia.

We have learned some pretty interesting deal -- details from the Russian news agency that has provided this video saying that it shows a plane that is matching the size and shape of the Embraer that is falling from the sky. You can see it almost vertically. The plane had reached -- and this is according to preliminary examination of data from the plane, 28,000 feet, that it was moving at a speed of 590 miles per hour when publicly available flight tracking data suddenly stopped transmitting southwest of the city of Tver.

I do want to bring in Richard Quest, if we can, to talk right now about what we're seeing. Some pretty interesting stuff here, Richard. Because one of the details that stands out to me is that this data which is publicly available, and pretty amazing that we're able to see it or learn about it so soon. The data does not show a steep descent before the plane stops transmitting data. What do you make of all this?

[14:20:12]

RICHARD QUEST, CNN EDITOR-AT-LARGE: Right. The starting point is, Brianna, planes at altitude do not fall out of the sky. That is the starting point of any discussion about what happened to this aircraft.

In the normal course of aviation, once a plane reaches its altitude, it is at the safest part of its flight. The engines are not stressed. It is tootling along, as indeed was this aircraft at flight level 28,513.

So, you've got to ask yourself, what sort of incident, accident, action, deliberate or otherwise, would cause an aircraft to suddenly literally fall out of the sky? And once you move into that realm, you're in a very different area. Because you're literally talking about just a few things. You're talking about total failure of the structure of the -- of the aircraft. Why? Why should that suddenly happen? We were to perhaps find out about it.

You're talking about pilot error? Well, that's Air France 447. But there were other things going on as well.

Again, you had a descent. You had a sort of a trajectory. The reality is that when a plane falls out of the sky, in such a fashion, it's usually been brought out of the sky.

And the problem here is that the investigation is going to be done by the authorities in Russia under international rules and regulations. And unless, frankly, Embraer or some of the other authorities, the NTSB or the CIA or any of the other authorities, the ATSB get their hands on it, we'll never know. We will never know. Because not only was there MH 17, you also had the Polish president, whose plane crashed once in Russia on his way to a funeral. So, that's why I'd say planes don't fall out of the sky unless somebody brought it out of the sky or there was a dramatic failure of the aircraft.

KEILAR: And, Richard, I'm joined here by Pete Muntean, our aviation correspondent. As Russian state aviation -- the Russian state aviation authority is creating this special commission to investigate the circumstances. Do you put -- it sounds like no stock in that.

QUEST: The same thing for the Polish president. They created an investigation which looked into why that plane crashed when he was on his way to the funeral. And there's all sorts of disputes about what actually, the -- who they blamed in that in the end. And you've got MH-17 and I've read the report. I've read both reports both the Dutch and the Russian and you know chalk and cheese.

So, unless -- the difficulty here -- and Pete will be able to join in. The difficulty here is that Embraer is the manufacturer and Brazil is the state of manufacture. If this is an ICAO investigation, which it may or may not be, but if this is an ICAO -- under ICAO rules, then this -- the contracting state, the operating state, the state of the manufacturer, can have representatives. And they may want to get their hands on the wreckage. But who knows what the -- who knows what the Russians would hand over to them?

KEILAR: Yes. Such a good point, Richard. And I want to bring Pete into this conversation because you've been looking at some of this publicly available flight data. Let's talk about that as we go through some of the images that we do have available to us.

PETE MUNTEAN, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: Sure.

KEILAR: This first one of this plane.

MUNTEAN: Let's pause it.

KEILAR: Let's pause it. MUNTEAN: This is pretty telling to me. I'm just going to let it rerack here. And you can see that this is an airplane in freefall. This to me looks like a streak of fuel.

Obviously, if this -- if this was in fact a shoot down, of course, we're just speculating right now, but if that was ultimately the case, a missile would lock on typically to the hottest part of the airplane, which would likely be the entrance. And so, this to me looks like an airplane that is broken apart, trailing fuel and sort of spinning down here. Probably upside down inverted.

KEILAR: Then let me ask you how strange it would be for an airplane at 20,000 feet --

MUNTEAN: Yes.

KEILAR: -- cruising altitude to suddenly break apart and transmit no more flight data. Is that unusual?

MUNTEAN: Such structural failure. If we're -- let's just talk about a structural failure, right?

KEILAR: Yes.

MUNTEAN: So, if the airplane broke into several parts suddenly, if there was a catastrophic failure of the airframe itself, those are extremely, extremely rare. Especially when you talk about an airplane like this. We're talking about a private jet, but it is also an airliner that's used very commonly around the world. You've probably been one of it. ERJ-145.

KEILAR: And reliably. That's right.

MUNTEAN: And reliably. And so, there's no real track record of anything like that ever happening with an airplane like this.

[14:25:04]

If you -- if that did happen, you would have heard about it, and also there would be a huge international response to pause the flying of something like this. Look at what happened after the Macs, that was a software issue. If there was an airframe issue, this airplane would likely not be flying.

There are a lot of other really interesting clues here too. And this is what has come up over and over again. There is an engine to sell where you were able to see in some of this video, some of the registration markings on the video here. It's not in the -- it's on the following video but rather, in the video of the crash site.

KEILAR: We actually have -- can we take that full?

MUNTEAN: Yes.

KEILAR: Because I think we do have that one full, but we don't have it loaded here on them all. What about that? MUNTEAN: And so, this is we're able to deduce a little bit here. This is the video now of that engine on the left side of the screen there, that vertical video. The registration markings typically printed on there.

And you can make out the numbers 2795. This airplane that was registered to Prigozhin, the tail number, RA-02795. So, you can deduce that this was very likely an airplane belonging to Prigozhin the Wagner boss.

And the data is really interesting. It tells a lot here. You've talked a bit about it. But the data from Flight Radar 24 says that this airplane was flying at 28,000 feet level.

KEILAR: Which is tracking site (INAUDIBLE)

MUNTEAN: The tracking site --

KEILAR: Yes.

MUNTEAN: -- level cruising altitude at 28,000 feet, a normal cruising altitude for an airplane like this. 513 knots, it's about 590 miles an hour, so pretty stabilized speed. Not climbing. Not descending.

So, not something where there would be some sort of catastrophic emergency where you would need to descend very quickly and get down to breathable air, maybe. The air is not breathable at 28,000 feet. And was headed northwest on a 360-degree heading. So, that's west- northwest and wasn't turning. Wasn't doing anything out of the ordinary.

So, this sort of says that this airplane was in a normal cruising position. That nothing was really going wrong. And so, of course, not only will there be an investigation here by the federal authorities in Russia, the Federal Air Transport Agency, but also we'll wait to see what other agencies ultimately glom on to this.

I've reached out to the Federal Aviation Administration here in the U.S. I've reached out to the National Transportation Safety Board. Sometimes they're party to especially international investigations that have a lot of heft. And so, they have not necessarily been contacted just yet. We'll wait to hear from them as the sort of unfolds.

But a lot of key data here. The one caveat that I've put on this from Flight Radar 24 is that they're still analyzing this data, and it's potentially incomplete, only because the way that they gathered data using sensors at transponder centers out there in -- near Moscow can be a little spotty. So, there may be more data here out there that could really bring in some answers to these questions.

KEILAR: And we're taking a look here of course, at the crash site. I do want to give people a sense as you said, that this is a commonly and reliably used plane.

MUNTEAN: Yes.

KEILAR: People will recognize this.

MUNTEAN: Yes.

KEILAR: If they have flown, they have flown regionally --

MUNTEAN: Yes.

KEILAR: They are going to know -- I think I have been on one of these, right?

MUNTEAN: That's right.

KEILAR: So, this is the plane -- this is the model of the plane. This is not the exact plane.

MUNTEAN: This is the private version. It's called a Legacy 600. That commercial version is called an ERJ-145. You've most definitely been on one --

KEILAR: Maybe less shiny.

MUNTEAN: Especially if you're flying between --

KEILAR: Maybe less shiny.

MUNTEAN: Newark.

KEILAR: That's right.

MUNTEAN: DC places like that.

KEILAR: And we were talking about -- look, this is how close it is to Moscow. This is just slightly Northwest. We don't know, right, the flight path exactly? We just know that this is similar to this plane making a trip to St. Petersburg where it is flown many times.

MUNTEAN: It was on that heading, right? And so, you can deduce that once the airplane gets up to altitude, you set the autopilot, you pointed toward the place that you want to go, barring any sort of reroutes or changes from air traffic control, the plane is mostly going to go in a straight line. The route will mostly be straight.

We were able to see at least from the data right now that it picks up just northwest of Moscow, and it drops off just southwest of Tver. So, there's a pretty good sample size there that shows this airplane was flying along, with no problems for a relatively extended period of time.

KEILAR: And then, it falls out of the sky.

MUNTEAN: Yes.

KEILAR: A lot of questions, Jim. Of course, 28,000 feet, cruising altitude, flying straight, no problems, and then it stops transmitting data as it falls out of the sky.

SCIUTTO: If you're just joining us now, Russian state media is reporting that the Wagner chief, Yevgeny Prigozhin was on board that jet you just saw a video of which falling to the ground. We're getting a reaction now from the National Security Council. Spokesperson Adrian Watson says we have seen the reports. If confirmed, no one should be surprised that the disastrous war in Ukraine led to a private army, that being the Wagner group, marching on Moscow and now it would seem to be this.

I also just received a reaction, moments ago from the Estonian Prime Minister Kaja Kallas.