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Prigozhin Presumed Dead in Russia; Iowa Voters React to Debate; Specialist Help Locate Maui Victims. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired August 24, 2023 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00]

GOV. WES MOORE (D-MD): And a normalizing of this type of behavior. It just reenforces why I am not just - I'm excited to be able to have another four years of a partner in the White House, like the Biden administration, but why, frankly, as a governor, and a chief executive of our state, we need it.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Governor Wes Moore, thank you for coming in.

MOORE: Thank you, Kate.

BOLDUAN: Really appreciate it.

John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: So, sometimes a suspicious death is, well, suspicious. Just two months after he led a revolt against the Russian military, militia leader Yevgeny Prigozhin is believed to be dead suspiciously. New details about the plane crash that many people saw coming.

Donald Trump's primetime surrender. Headed to jail in Atlanta. How careful does he need to be with what he says along the way.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:35:13]

BERMAN: The man who led the revolt against the Russian military two months ago is presumed dead this morning after his plane crashed. I'm talking about this man, Wagner chief Yevgeny Prigozhin. He was one of ten people on board this plane that ended up burning on the ground when it came down just north of Moscow. Investigators say there are no survivors. As of this morning, only eight of the ten bodies have been found. And those remains have been taken off site for forensic testing.

So, the fight -- we can follow the course of the flight right here. It left Moscow at about 6:00 p.m. last night. Its last point of contact was right here, just a few minutes after takeoff here. And then by 6:30, only 30 minutes into the flight, that is when it crashed. Now, flight radar says it was at 28,000 feet before things started

going wrong. It started rising and descend erratically. And then it began falling at a rate of about 8,000 feet per minute.

We've got some remarkable footage of this plane plummeting almost vertically from the sky. Obviously, they're receiving no data from the plane at this point.

Our Richard Quest notes that planes don't just fall like that for no reason. They don't malfunction and then just fall directly down. Typically, something needs to happen to them. And we are now learning that the plane is believed to have been on fire before it hit the ground. You can see it there, plummeting to earth. Ten people on board. No survivors.

Sara.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: All right, the Biden administration noting Putin's long history of payback has repeatedly and publicly warned that Prigozhin could be killed at any moment by the Kremlin. So, this turn of events didn't seem to come as a shock to the president when he heard the news.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I don't know for a fact what happened, but I am not surprised.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you believe Putin is behind this, sir?

BIDEN: There's not much that happens in Russia that Putin is not behind, but I don't know enough to know the answer.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: I am joined now by political scientist, author and the president of the Eurasia Group, Ian Bremmer.

Thank you so much for coming on to talk about this really important issue.

IAN BREMMER, PRESIDENT, EURASIA GROUP: Sure.

SIDNER: President Biden said the quiet part outside - to, you know, basically saying, look, the intimation that most people think is that Putin had something to do with this. What are your thoughts on what has happened here?

BREMMER: Well, two important thoughts. One should be obvious, is that you can't really trust Putin on the implementation of a deal. I think we all knew that.

But the second is that when Putin is really challenged, really threatened at home, and that two months ago by Prigozhin, no one had ever seen before, he doesn't act irrationally, he acts to ensure his own survival. And that's why Prigozhin is dead now, as opposed to two months ago. Two months ago you had Prigozhin at his maximum level of power. Thousands of his own troops aligned with him, taking over Rostov, heading towards Moscow. A Ukrainian counteroffensive about to hit the Russians. Putin probably leaving Moscow and going to St. Petersburg. The worst possible timing for him to say, I'm going to go after this guy and hit him hard.

Instead, he cuts a deal. And since then, over the last two months, they've shut down Wagner's media operations. They've taken away and -- the heavy weapons from most of the troops, dispersed them on a wild goose chase in Belarus. They've, in other words, shored up Putin's power, weakened Prigozhin and now he's dead. That's a fair amount of, you know, strategic thinking on Putin's part facing a very significant challenge. I don't think anyone's surprised by the fact that he did it, but it certainly shows how he considers threats to his power going forward.

SIDNER: Yes, and we've seen so many people - there's something like 22 other people who have come up against Putin whose names that we know, some of them we don't, but they've fallen out of windows, for example, at hospitals. They've been poisoned. There's all manners of things. Or jailed.

I am curious, because you brought up Ukraine, you brought up sort of the -- this is a picture, by the way, of all of the people that have faced there - Vladimir Karamushia (ph), I spoke to him the day before he was arrested, just for speaking out against Putin, never mind trying to create a rebellion against Putin. So, a lot of people not surprised that this happened, although the method is different.

I do want to ask you about the Wagner group. He was the leader of the group. People were following him, as you mentioned. What happens now? Is there any chance that some of those people break off from this group and really start to look at targeting Putin again?

[09:40:05]

BREMMER: Well, again, it's a much weaker group today in terms of their internal capabilities, their lack of leadership than it was even a few weeks ago. It's not relevant for the fight on the ground in Ukraine. That won't change. And indeed we've seen, over the past weeks, the Ukrainian counter offensive has not gone very well. Russian defenses on the ground are dug in, and they're defending themselves capably. So, there we don't see much of a change.

Where you will see a question is what happens on the ground across Africa where Wagner has been a principal paramilitary group making billions of dollars and shoring up a number of dictators, including in Niger, where we've just seen a coup and where the Nigerians and others in Ecowas (ph) may be preparing to attack that illegitimate government militarily. What happens when Prigozhin, who has been personally responsible for those troops on the ground, has now been killed, likely directly on Putin's orders. What are those leaders going to do? Is that a possibility for the Americans and allies, the French, others, to play more of a role? Will we see a breakdown into instability? The single biggest impact of Prigozhin and his confederates being

killed on this airplane is going to be seen on the ground in a number of African states over the coming weeks and months.

SIDNER: Yes, and we know that the Wagner group, they're paid killers, basically. I mean that's what they do.

BREMMER: Yes.

SIDNER: They're mercenaries paid for with Russian money. So, it will be interesting to see who levels up and how that money is getting into the hands of the mercenaries that are in Africa. You bring up a really, really, really good point.

Ian Bremmer, thank you so much for coming on. Appreciate your time.

BREMMER: Good to see you.

SIDNER: Kate.

BOLDUAN: Coming up for us, it is going to be another day of mug shots coming out of Fulton County, Georgia. Donald Trump will be headed there soon and the rest of his co-defendants face a deadline of noon tomorrow.

And, we saw eight Republican candidates on the stage last night battling for time, battling for attention, battling each other, but how did it all land with Republican voters in the early caucus state of Iowa?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GARY TUCHMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Fifteen people. Looks like 14 - 13 raised your hand. You two did not think it was good for the party?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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[09:46:51]

BOLDUAN: The first 2024 Republican debate is now in the books. What do voters think about all that happened?

CNN's Gary Tuchman sat with 15 Republicans in the first in the nation caucus state, Iowa, to find out.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GARY TUCHMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): In the small city of Nevada, Iowa, county seat of Story County, we watched the first GOP presidential debate with 15 loyal Republicans who live in the county.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Eight Republican candidates have qualified and have chosen to be here on our debate stage tonight.

TUCHMAN: And after it was all over, we asked this.

TUCHMAN (on camera): Do you think this debate was good for the Republican Party? Raise your hand if you do. Fifteen people. Looks like 14 -- 13 raised their hand. You two did not think it was good for the party?

JIM: No, I -

TUCHMAN: Why - why not, Jim?

JIM: It brought up a lot more division and stuff. But I still think it - it was worth - it was worth the time.

TUCHMAN: OK, you thought it was good for the party, though?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. It was great for the party. It was great to have a conversation with Iowans and people across the United States to see who our next leader will be for the Republican Party.

TUCHMAN: OK, of these 15 people, 14 say they're still undecided at this point.

Jim, who we just talked to, is the only one who's not. He says he's ready to vote for Trump right now.

And here's what I want to ask about, who you thought did the best during this debate. Basically, who do you think won the debate? I'm going to do it in alphabetical order to be fair.

Anyone think Doug Burgum did the best? That's Zero.

Anyone think Chris Christie did the best? He certainly got most of the air time -- a lot of the airtime, not most of the airtime?

How about Ron DeSantis? How many of you think Ron DeSantis did the best? That's two people.

How about Nikki Haley? One, two, three, four people.

Asa Hutchinson?

Mike Pence? Zero.

Vivek Ramaswamy? One, two, three, four, five, six, seven.

Tim Scott?

OK, so this panel here thinks Ramaswamy won the debate.

TUCHMAN (voice over): One reason those seven Republicans feel that way.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I really appreciated during his closing statements when he said, there are two genders, God is real. He made sure to put those out there and made them very clear.

TUCHMAN: And one of the reasons Nikki Haley was the runner up.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She came across as poised and confident, prepared. And I think out of the candidates, I think she helped herself the most tonight.

TUCHMAN: The candidate who has spoken out the most against Donald Trump, Chris Christie, received no traction here.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He was just argumentative pretty much. And out after Trump.

TUCHMAN (on camera): You don't think there was any logic to what he said, though?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think it was a lot of revenge.

TUCHMAN (voice over): Some here feel Trump hurt himself by not being at this debate. Most, though, feel he benefitted by being absent.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think he helped himself just because he wasn't able to say anything that people would use against him in the general election.

TUCHMAN: Fifteen Iowa Republicans who will all be caucusing less than five months from now.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BOLDUAN: Gary Tuchman, thank you so much for that.

I find it interesting, John, the take on wherever that line is of, you've got to go after Trump, but then it's turning some voters off when they do go after Trump.

BERMAN: No, it was really interesting to hear that in real time.

[09:50:01]

And the kicker at the end saying that Trump helped himself by not going. The idea that he can not show and grow.

BOLDUAN: Yes.

BERMAN: Crazy.

BOLDUAN: So, is the nomination already over?

BERMAN: We will see.

All right, new teams joining the search for victims of the fires on Maui. How cell phone analysis is now playing a role.

And then hours before Donald Trump is due to surrender in Atlanta, he switches lawyers. New details about what this tells us on his legal defense.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: This morning, new tactics in the search for victims of the wildfires on Maui. A specialized FBI team is helping ID those killed and locate where more victims may still be. Now, the confirmed death toll is at 115 this morning, but more than 1,000 people are still unaccounted for. And that's even though 92 percent of the area burned has now been searched.

CNN's Josh Campbell covering this for us this morning.

So, this new FBI effort, Josh, how will it help?

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes, John, so the special agent in charge of the FBI saying the bureau is offering numerous resources to the island of Hawaii.

[09:55:04]

And he said that included cellular telephone analysis. Now, a law enforcement official tells me that that involves this specialized FBI team known as CASS (ph), that's the cellular analysis survey team. These are highly trained agents that are - and analysts that are brought in on some of the most urgent cases, including terrorism matters, including kidnappings, other criminal case.

Now, the FBI hasn't specified what they're specifically doing here, but as you look at their tactics and their techniques, you can see how that will be beneficial to search and rescue efforts. This CASS team is able to look at cell phone company records, is able to look at cellular telephone tower data in order to help try to geo locate cell phones.

And, you know, the grim reality is, is that this search and rescue team is finding and searching for people who perished in a fire. And so, if you think about it, all of us carry a cell phone. When this cell phone is connected to a tower, those records are kept. And so this FBI team could be able to look at those tower records to try to geolocate where the phone was before the device was possibly destroyed in a fire. And so that could be very beneficial to help the people there on the island of Maui move close to some semblance of closure.

Finally, the FBI is just one team that's there. There are multiple law enforcement agents. As we look at these new photos, you can see, teams from the ATF, teams from Customs and Border Protection have surged from the United States to Maui, helping local law enforcement there and FEMA with search efforts. And then finally, it's worth - you know, realizing that the Maui Police Department,, which is not a large department, has certainly been taxed with this crisis. So, I'm told that federal agents are actually riding with -- shotgun with local police trying to provide public safety efforts there, John.

BERMAN: Yes, still, I can't get over these pictures, even weeks after the level of destruction there. You can see why there's need for the FBI and others to be there to help.

Josh Campbell, great to see you. Thank you very much. Sara.

SIDNER: Today, another historic day, even though it's his fourth arrest, Donald Trump will walk into jail in Atlanta and turn himself in. But just hours before he surrenders, he's shaking up his legal team. What we know about his new Georgia attorney. That's ahead.

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