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Senator Bob Menendez Faces Bribery Charges for the Second Time; Government Shutdown Looms Due to Republican Infighting; Agriculture Secretary Warns of Shutdown's Impact on Programs Like WIC and SNAP; Bank of America Survey Shows Growing Concern about Wage Stagnation Despite Lower Inflation; Public Support for Unions Reaches an All-Time High; Biden and Trump Plan Visits to Engage with Striking Union Workers in Michigan; Ukraine Receives its First Delivery of U.S.-Made Abrams Tanks for Counteroffensive Against Russia.. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired September 25, 2023 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Earlier today Democratic Senator Bob Menendez offered up his first public response to a federal indictment on bribery charges. This is actually his second time facing corruption related charges in ten years.

Just like the first time, he's not backing down, even though this case includes incriminating photos it seems of gold bars, huge sums of cash. Menendez says he has done nothing wrong. He's confident as well he'll be vindicated.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BOB MENENDEZ (D-NJ): I understand how deeply concerning this can be. However, the allegations leveled against me are just that, allegations. I recognize this will be the biggest fight yet, but as I have stated throughout this whole process, I firmly believe that when all the facts are presented, not only will I be exonerated, but I still will be the New Jersey's senior senator.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Kara Scannell is tracking this for us. So Kara, we know the facts as presented by the prosecution here, including all this cash, the gold bars, and why the prosecution says that he had it. What was his defense for having all this?

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah Jim, so Senator Menendez really focusing in on these allegations in the indictment to some extent. So he has been accused of taking cash, hundreds of thousands of dollars, of gold bars, and a Mercedes-Benz convertible in exchange for helping three New Jersey businessmen and aiding the government of Egypt. So the senator saying that this cash that the FBI found when they searched his home last year, that was an envelope stuffed in a jacket of his, he said that that was old-fashioned and that he just withdrew money from his savings account and stored it like that in his home.

But he didn't address the gold bars, and he didn't address the Mercedes. And on the issue of Egypt, he -- rattled off a list of accomplishments and positions that he has taken as a senator, saying that he has been tough on Egypt, that he's not aided Egypt, and that he's tried to hold them accountable for their human rights abuses. Now he also spoke a bit to these calls, increasing number of calls from Democrats for his resignation, saying that sometimes prosecutors get it wrong, nodding to that 2015 indictment where he was facing similar corruption-related charges, and he ultimately survived that politically and through the justice system. But he also was saying that, you know, he wants people to not rush to judgment. Here's more of what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MENENDEZ: A cornerstone of the foundation of American democracy and our justice system is the principle that all people are presumed innocent until proven guilty. All people. I ask for nothing more and deserve nothing less. The court of public opinion is no substitute for our revered justice system. We cannot set aside the presumption of innocence for political expediency when the harm is irrevocable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCANNELL: Now Menendez did have some of his constituents there saying he has not lost the confidence of New Jerseyans, but he refused to answer any questions from a room filled with reporters. Jim.

SCIUTTO: Notable. Alright, so he's in court soon?

SCANNELL: Yeah, Menendez is due in court along with his wife and those three New Jersey businessmen on Wednesday, where they will go before a judge for the first time to face these charges. Now, Menendez hasn't said whether he's going to -- what his plea will be, though it seems pretty clear he will enter a plea of not guilty. And this will be his second time going through the justice system on charges that are serious corruption charges.

He will be having this play out over the next several months or year, and that overlaps with the big question here of is he going to run for re-election? He did after the last criminal case, and he's been in office since. Now the senior senator of New Jersey. A big question here is will he run for re-election next year? Jim.

SCIUTTO: Kara Scannell, thanks so much. So let's go to Hill now. CNN's Manu Raju is there. And Manu, we've seen a lot of attacks on the justice system when Republicans, including the former president, have been indicted. We have not seen attacks on the justice system from Democrats. In fact, we've seen a number of them call for his resignation.

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, a lot of them from New Jersey. Most of the House members in that New Jersey delegation saying that he should step aside, saying that he cannot do his job effectively anymore. Already facing a primary challenge from one congressman, Andy Kim. But the criticism and the calls for stepping down is not translating or not at least being echoed yet among Senate Democrats. Only one so far, John Fetterman of Pennsylvania, calling for him to resign.

Democratic leaders instead are essentially saying what Menendez is saying, that he's got a presumption of innocence until proven guilty. Some saying that they acknowledge that these charges are very, very serious, but Menendez is due his time in court. And this number two Senate Democrat, Dick Durbin, -- echoed what Chuck Schumer, the Senate Majority Leader, said on Friday that Menendez should be allowed to fight this out in court.

[14:05:21]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. DICK DURBIN (D-IL): In terms of resignation, that's a decision to be made by Senator Menendez and the people of New Jersey.

SEN. MARK KELLY (D-AZ): I think Senator Menendez is going to have to think long and hard about the cloud that's going to hang over his service in the United States Senate.

REP. ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ (D-NY): I do believe that it is in the best interest for Senator Menendez to resign in this moment. While, you know, as a Latina, there are absolutely ways in which there is systemic bias, but I think what is here in this indictment is quite clear.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: So you are seeing a bit of a split between House Democrats and Senate Democrats. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez responding to that part of Menendez's statement from over the weekend, a written statement where he contended that because he's a Latino, he's being targeted in this way.

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez pushing back on that line of -- criticism from Menendez himself. But we'll see, Jim, when Democratic senators return to Washington tomorrow. We'll have a chance to ask many of them about these charges. How many more of them will say that he should fight this out in court? How many others will say it's time for him to resign? Jim.

SCIUTTO: So do you have a sense of the majority leader's calculus here? Because there are political implications, of course. We happen to be going into a big, important election cycle.

RAJU: Yeah, this is a hugely important decision for Menendez himself about whether or not to run for re-election. He did not say so himself in those remarks that he gave to the press. He wouldn't answer questions from the press. But Chuck Schumer is certainly aware that if Bob Menendez were to run, it could make his efforts to try to keep the Senate that much harder. If this seat becomes a vulnerable seat, something that could flip to the Republican side, already there's a huge map that they have to battle out here.

But Chuck Schumer has dealt with this same way indictments pass, like the last time Bob Menendez was indicted. He didn't call for him to resign. He simply said that he should step aside as chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, which Menendez did last time he was indicted. But later there was a hung jury and he was not convicted.

This time, also stepping aside as Senate Foreign Relations Committee chairman. We'll see again when he's pressed and when he faces more questions about whether he'll back Bob Menendez for his re-election, how he responds to those questions. But at the moment, a brief statement from Schumer on Friday simply saying that he's been praising Menendez's time in office and saying that he supports his decision to step aside as chairman of that key committee, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Manu Raju, thanks so much. Brianna.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Congress has just one work week left to avoid a government shutdown, but infighting among House Republicans has stymied any progress on a deal. The White House is already blaming a small group of what they call extremist Republicans for the impasse. And today the Biden administration is hammering home the stakes. Agriculture Secretary Tom Vilsack detailed the ground level impacts of a shutdown at the White House briefing. And he is joining us now to talk more about that.

Mr. Secretary, thank you so much for being with us. I really do want to cover just the real effects of what will happen if there's a shutdown. One thing that will be interrupted is and you talked about this a little bit, is nutrition and health assistant -- assistance a to women, infants and children. The WIC program. You said the contingency funds run out after a day or two after the government shuts down. What happens then to this vulnerable population if a state does not have extra funds to go beyond that? They simply cannot buy the nutrition.

TOM VILSACK, AGRICULTURE SECRETARY: They can't buy the fruits and vegetables that they would otherwise have access to. They won't be able to get the supplemental nutritional efforts that WIC provides. Nearly seven million women, postpartum, pregnant women, young children, babies. Nearly 50% of America's early young population is in WIC.

So we're talking about a significant impact on a number of families across the United States that shouldn't have to be. A deal is a deal. A majority of House Republicans voted for the debt ceiling deal. And it seems to me that this is an unnecessary consequence of not recognizing that a deal is a deal.

KEILAR: How long until Meals on Wheels is affected? Those programs get impacted at various times.

VILSACK: So, for example, the SNAP program, which is our largest nutrition program, 41 million Americans relying on it. We probably have resources to be able to get through the month of October. But if a shutdown were to last longer than that, then we would see those families also negatively impacted by the shutdown. And it's not just nutrition assistance. It's farm loans, marketing loans, farmers who need assistance and help to be able to pay their bills. Looking for assistance from USDA, they won't be able to get it because of the shutdown. It'll be closed. It won't have anybody there.

[14:09:57]

A young couple wishing to purchase a home in rural America won't be able to do so because the Rural Development Office that would guarantee the loan or provide the loan can't be staffed. There are real consequences to real people as a result of this shutdown. This is what I think sometimes people in Washington do not understand. They like to play the game here, but the game has serious, serious consequences to real people.

KEILAR: You mentioned in the briefing how marketing loans would stop. There's the crop report that is due in October, mid-October, October 12th. That would be interrupted, obviously, at a critical point for soybeans and corn. Are there risks to our food supply if there's a shutdown?

VILSACK: There's not a risk to the food supply, but there certainly is a risk to the ability to make a profit as a farmer. And many small and mid-sized producers have a difficult time as it is. Without marketing information, without the marketing loans, and that adds a considerable amount of stress to families. All of us have adequate resources and adequate food supplies.

You know, this is an unfortunate consequence, and it's not just the farmers out there in rural places. It's also those people who want to visit a national forest. They're also going to be shut down. That's going to disrupt the tourism economy of so many small communities in the western part of the United States. And there's no reason, there's no reason for a shutdown when a deal was struck and all parties basically agreed to it and voted for it.

KEILAR: Should Democrats throw McCarthy a lifeline? Should they vote for a CR to keep the government open?

VILSACK: Well, I would say this. I think the Speaker has to do his job. He certainly worked hard to get it. Now he's got to do it. And it's in his hands. It's his members and the rather extreme element of his caucus that is essentially holding everything up. In some way, somehow, he needs to deal with those folks in a way that ultimately gets a budget that is consistent with the deal that was struck by a majority of House Republicans, a majority of House Democrats, a majority of the United States Senate, and signed by the president.

I mean, that is the answer here. We went to great lengths to avoid the debt ceiling by striking this deal, which cuts spending. Certainly my department will see a cut. And we're willing to accept that cut in terms of the debt ceiling, but we're not willing to accept a cut that will literally cripple the capacity of the USDA to do its work for so many people in rural America.

KEILAR: While I have you, I do want to ask you about India, because Canada and India are in a row right now because the Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau called out India for alleged involvement of an assassination of a Sikh activist on Canadian soil. The US ambassador to Canada confirmed, quote, there was shared intelligence among Five Eyes partners, which of course includes the US, to support what Trudeau was saying to India here.

The US government, of course, has major interests in maintaining a positive relationship with India. Here just a couple weeks ago, you welcomed India reducing tariffs on certain American agricultural products. At what point do you risk American economic interest to send India the message that it's not okay to assassinate someone on Canadian soil, obviously a very close neighbor of the US, as they're alleged to have done here?

VILSACK: Well, when you want to talk about trading relationships, certainly the Canadian-US trading relationship is incredibly important. They're one of our top three trading partners when it comes to agriculture. And frankly, we have quite a number of issues with India when it comes to trade. My focus is going to continue to be on what I can control and what I have some oversight over, which is the trade relationship between the United States and India. And we need to continue to work to break down these barriers. We certainly welcome the tariff relief, but there is still a great deal more than India needs to do.

KEILAR: All right, Secretary Vilsack, thank you so much for being with us. We appreciate it. Thank you. Jim.

SCIUTTO: CNN has obtained a new survey by Bank of America showing that two out of three employees feel that prices are rising faster than their paychecks. Why this could be a big problem for President Biden's re-election campaign. Meanwhile, both Biden and Trump are heading to Michigan this week to battle for that swing state, how support for the unions could play into this. And later, the writers' union reaches a tentative deal with the studios, details on how soon shows could restart and where actors now stand in their strike. Just ahead you're watching CNN News Central and we'll be right back.

[14:15:56]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: So if you feel like your paycheck is not keeping up with inflation, you're not alone. According to a new Bank of America study shared with CNN, more than 2 out of 3 workers believe that their wages are not growing fast enough to match the rising cost of living. That's up from 58% who felt that way in February 2022.

KEILAR: This despite the fact that the inflation has actually dropped dramatically from the peak 9.1% in June of 2022. We have CNN's Matt Egan, the man who obtained this exclusive look at this data here. Matt, what are your biggest takeaways from the survey?

MATT EGAN, CNN REPORTER: Well, Jim and Briana, this is a sobering report. And it's a reminder that a lot of Americans are stressing out about money right now. What is most surprising to me is that some of these numbers are moving in the wrong direction. Right? 67% of these employees surveyed by Bank of America say that prices are going up faster than their paychecks.

And as you can see, that is up from 58% early last year. And this is understandably unnerving a lot of people. If you look at how many people say that they are financially well right now, that's just 42%. That is the lowest percentage since Bank of America started tracking this back in 2010. Right? So this is lower than just after the Great Recession, lower than even during the COVID recession.

And this is surprising because government statistics show that the rate of inflation has cooled off significantly. Prices are going up, as you can see on this chart, prices are going up at less than half the pace that they were at the peak last year.

[14:21:05]

But here's the problem. Prices are still going up, just not as much as they were, and inflation is cumulative, right? There's this snowballing effect. Everything from eggs and car rentals to a night out at the restaurant is a lot more expensive than it was before COVID. And even though government data shows that paychecks are starting to catch up, a lot of Americans just feel like they can't keep up with these prices.

KEILAR: And what about for women? The numbers are particularly stark for women. A Bank of America found that just 38% of women say they feel financially well. That's down pretty dramatically from 55% early last year. Women are also more likely to say that financial stress is keeping them up at night, that they feel like they won't be able to make ends meet due to inflation.

And look at this, we see 39% of women who say that they've had to look for additional employment just to try to keep up with rising costs, 39% of women say that, just 17% for men. I think this is evidence of that pay gap where women generally make on average less than men. Also, just big picture here, Jim and Brianna, I think that this is just another reminder of why Americans are giving President Biden's economic performance such low numbers. They just feel like they can't keep up right now.

SCIUTTO: Of course, there is a political element to this. That's why we have CNN National Political Reporter, Eva McKend with us. And there's often a lag effect to this, right? That folks will feel things even as the numbers change. And as Matt made the point, inflation is cumulative.So a lot of that effect is still there, but it might explain these really, really bad economic job approval numbers that Biden has.

EVA MCKEND, CNN NATIONAL POLITICS REPORTER: Yes, Jim, and the data only seems to be getting worse for the president. But listen, this is a persistent issue, not just for President Biden, but for Democrats more broadly, where when you speak to voters, they tend to give Republicans a bit more credit when it comes to economic issues. Even though the policies that Democrats champion, like extending the child tax credit, for instance, are popular with most Americans.

That's why we're likely to see what we saw in the midterms is Democrats make other arguments in concert with the economic one. They can't only run on the economy alone. We're gonna hear a lot about reproductive freedom, about preserving American democracy. And that will sort of make up for maybe not being able to convince voters on the economic issue.

SCIUTTO: Right, invariably there are lots of voting issues, particularly in a cycle like this one. Eva, please do stay with us. We are also following the politics of the campaign. President Biden, former President Trump, how they're responding to labor strikes in all this. Biden set to travel to Michigan tomorrow to join the picket lines of striking members of the UAW. And on Wednesday, Trump also plans to visit union members in that state instead of going to the GOP primary debate, notably.

They are making those trips as public support for unions today is at an all-time high. CNN business reporter, Nathaniel Meyersohn, he has more on that. Nathaniel, that's interesting, because for decades, going back to the 80s, right, participation as well as the impression of unions had gone down, it's reversed.

NATHANIEL MEYERSOHN, CNN BUSINESS REPORTER: Yeah, Jim, we've really seen support for unions grow since the financial crash in 2008. That's when we start to see a bump in union support. And right now, 67% of the public approves of unions, according to Gallup. And we're also seeing really strong support for the striking UAW members. According to Gallup, 75% of the public approves, sides with workers over the auto companies. And this is -- this support is bipartisan. About 85% of Democrats, 77% of independents, and 66% of Republicans are siding with UAW workers.

SCIUTTO: So how about participation rates? Because they were way down for a long time. There'd been some evidence it was ticking up again more recently. Where do they stand now?

MEYERSOHN: So Jim, the strong public support for unions, it's not translating into strong union participation rates. In 1950, 30% of the public, one in three workers, was unionized. We've seen that number steadily decline. And in 2022, just 10% of the public belonged to a union. That was an all-time low. And you look at UAW membership, it's tracked this decline. In 1979, UAW membership peaked at 1.5 million members. Now it's down to under 400,000.

SCIUTTO: Wow, that's remarkable. It's like less than a third.

KEILAR: Yeah, Eva, back with us now on this. It's really interesting that we're going to be seeing Trump and Biden this week in talking to these union workers in part because it's not just about the auto workers. You know, they set the pace for the middle class. And this is really a bit of a battle for the middle class, but they're going to be doing it in very different ways.

[14:26:05]

MCKEND: They are, Brianna. And President Biden arguably has more at stake. He is the president. And so he is taking a very clear side here. But, you know, it could sort of come back to bite him. We know that these are very delicate negotiations, but ultimately he wants to be seen as on the side of the American worker. And he wants to remind folks that it is actually Democrats that support policies that that support union workers.

Meanwhile, the former president will go down there and blame Democrats for this push for green policies and say that is the real reason for the auto industry's woes.

KEILAR: Eva and Nathaniel, thank you so much to both of you. We do appreciate it. And the Pentagon confirms it. Ukraine has gotten its first delivery of U.S. made Abrams tanks. What it could mean for the counteroffensive against Russia. We'll have that next.