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Biden To UAW Picketers: "Stick With It"; Hunter Biden Sues Giuliani For Violating His Privacy; Senate Working On Short-Term Bill To Avert Shutdown. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired September 26, 2023 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[15:01:11]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: History made in Michigan. For the first time, a sitting president has walked a picket line. President Biden joining striking autoworkers with a message: "You deserve a significant raise."

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: And Hunter Biden going on offense. He's suing Rudy Giuliani and his former attorney, accusing them of totally annihilating his digital privacy.

KEILAR: And only about four days left before the government shuts down and House Speaker Kevin McCarthy and hard-right Republicans are no closer to an agreement.

We're following these major developing stories and many more all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTER.

SANCHEZ: In a historic move, President Biden is taking sides in the nearly two-week-old United Autoworkers strike. He just became the first sitting president to join the picket line, walking with UAW members in Wayne County, Michigan, outside a GM redistribution center.

UAW President Shawn Fain thanked the President for his in-person support. And the President told picketers to stick with it. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Wall Street didn't build the country, the middle class built the country. Unions build the middle class. That's a fact, so let's keep going. You deserve what you've earned and you've earned a hell of a lot more than you're getting paid now.

KEILAR: Tomorrow, Republican frontrunner Donald Trump is also going to be showing his support for those who are on strike. He is set to appear with autoworkers in Detroit. He will be skipping the second Republican presidential debate while doing that. And we're covering the story from all sides.

We have CNN's Arlette Saenz, who is following President Biden in Wayne County, Michigan. We have CNN's Vanessa Yurkevich. She is with striking union members in Warren, Michigan.

And CNN's Kristen Holmes is in Detroit ahead of former President Trump's appearance tomorrow.

And also, we have CNN's Senior Political Analyst, Ron Brownstein also with us. He's also senior editor at The Atlantic.

Arlette, to you first, tell us more about this message from the President to the UAW workers.

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brianna, this trip by President Biden really marked his most overt display of support for these autoworkers as the strike against these Big 3 auto companies continue. The President was invited here by UAW President Shawn Fain and appeared with him as they rallied with striking workers outside of a GM facility here in Wayne County.

The President talked about how he believes these workers deserve significant raises and other benefits, and that it is time, in his belief, that the auto companies begin to share more with these workers. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: (Inaudible) of the matter is you guys, UAW, you saved the automobile industry back in 2008 and before. You've made a lot of sacrifices, you gave up a lot and the companies were in trouble. But now they're doing incredibly well and guess what, you should be doing incredibly well, too.

(CROSSTALK)

BIDEN: Well, keep doing it because you deserve the significant raise you need and other benefits ...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Let's get it, yes.

BIDEN: ... to get back what we lost, okay?

ALL: Yes.

BIDEN: We can say, yes, but it's about time (inaudible) step up for us."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAENZ: Now, after those remarks, the President also told reporters that he supports the UAW's calls for a 40 percent increase. That is one of the demands that has been made in these negotiations with the Big 3 auto companies and really marked a change in the President's public position.

[15:05:04] The White House had really refrained from commenting on the specific terms that are under negotiation in these talks. One thing that the White House has noted quite often is that they don't have any legal authority to be direct party to the negotiations, allowing things to play out between the UAW and the Big 3 auto company.

But with the President's visit here today, he was trying to show his support for these striking workers at a time where he's trying to balance not just the need to improve workers' conditions, but also concerns about the economy, as there still are concerns about what a long-term impact this kind of strike could have on the country.

SANCHEZ: Yes. Notably, the White House saying that the President's visit isn't an endorsement of the workers' position, but that sure sounded like one.

KEILAR: It sure does.

SANCHEZ: Right. Vanessa, you actually have some new details on the conversation between President Biden and UAW president Shawn Fain. What are you learning?

VANESSA YURKEVICH, CNN BUSINESS AND POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: We are learning that during the ride from the airport to the GM facility in Wayne County, UAW president Shawn Fain and President Biden had a conversation. And according to a source familiar with that conversation, it was a good conversation. They spoke about workers' issues, and they also spoke about a just transition to electric vehicles.

Now, I want to bring in Larry Wynn (ph). He was not in The Beast with the two presidents, but he was, however, just with Biden in Wayne County. You shared a fist bump ...

LARRY WYNN: Yes.

YURKEVICH: With President Biden. You heard all of what he had to say. Your reaction?

WYNN: I'm very glad to see that he's very supportive of us in our fight. All we're asking for is for a good contract. We have workers that work here that can't even afford to purchase the vehicles that they build.

YURKEVICH: When you were listening to the President, he seemed to say that he supports all of the union's demands. Do you think his support in that will make a difference in these negotiations?

WYNN: I think it's a big help, because, like I said, we're fighting against greedy CEOs and the public needs to see that as well. We have had a lot of good things come from this, actually. We're getting support from all over.

YURKEVICH: And do you think the President's visit today will change the movement from Stellantis? We know that the union has seen more movement from Ford, less from GM and Stellantis. Does this put the pressure on in any way?

WYNN: It very well should put the pressure on them. I mean, we've been out here for a minute and we're not ready to give up in this fight. We took concessions years ago and we just want the things that we lost back.

YURKEVICH: Thank you so much, Larry Wynn. Support driving by right now.

We also know from our reporting that a union source telling us that they do not consider former President Trump's visit tomorrow in Detroit at Drake Enterprises a show of solidarity with the union, because that is not a union shop.

However, we know that President Biden was invited directly by the union. He was here in town today just a few hours ago. The negotiations continue, though, between the three automakers and the union. We know that the union has been more interested in what Ford has put on the table, not as much from GM and Stellantis, but these workers are going to be out here until a deal is reached, Boris?

KEILAR: We'll see how long that is.

SANCHEZ: Yes.

KEILAR: Vanessa Yurkevich, thank you so much for that.

Kristen, you're in Detroit. That is where former President Trump is going to be showing up to make his own show of support. What is he planning to say, especially considering it's not a union shop, as we heard Vanessa detailing there?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it was really interesting to hear Vanessa say that from a union members' perspective, because when I talked to Trump advisors, they believe that there is a divide between the President of the union, who did not invite Trump to come and in fact slammed the fact that he was coming, saying he never helped him when he was in office, slamming his policies as well when he was president, and the rank-and-file members.

Some of this is actually about conservative issues as well. That's what I talked to one advisor about today. Now, we do expect him to dive in on the economy, to talk about how the economy was better when he was president. But I do want to note that union members, union leaders, as well as labor experts have pointed to the fact that Trump's administration was inherently pro-business and not pro-labor, which is why you're seeing so many of these groups come out against former President Trump.

But I am told by members of the union, of the A - UW union, that they will be at Trump's event tomorrow with their families, hearing what he has to say. Many of them say they still stand with former President Trump. And when I talked to Trump's advisors, they do believe that there is a way to maneuver Biden's policies, and I thought this was really interesting hearing Arlette talk about this, with the electric vehicles. [15:10:03]

Essentially, that they believe that auto workers are not fond of these policies, and they think they can paint them as a way to move jobs overseas that will kill jobs here in Detroit and so that is what they're trying to sell.

Now, again, the one thing I really want to point out here is that Trump won over this group in 2016, working class voters, as well as union members, in huge numbers Republicans hadn't seen in years.

But he now has a past. He now has an administration and a record. And whether or not he can do that again, as his people say they can, that remains to be seen, Brianna.

SANCHEZ: A surprising victory for Donald Trump in Michigan in 2016.

Let's discuss more with Ron Brownstein, because Ron, this is more than just about unions. I think both of these frontrunners going to Michigan underscores not only the significance of Michigan, but the significance of the middle class working class vote. How are you seeing this playing out?

RONALD BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes. And there was a famous song in the 1930s written out of a coal mining strike in Harlan County, Kentucky, called, "Which Side Are You On?" It became really the rallying cry for unions during the depression.

President Biden tried to answer that today as unequivocally as we've ever seen an American president do by joining the picket line. And I think it will do him some good.

The challenge he faces, though, Boris, is as you suggested and some of the earlier commentary suggested, is that workers don't only decide who is on their side anymore by economic interest. They also make that decision based on cultural values. And the fact is that if you look at the exit polls among non-college whites who belong to unions, Donald Trump won about three fifths of them in 2020, and Republicans won about three fifths of them in the 2022 election. Now, Democrats did better with them in Michigan specifically. But even there, it was only about 50-50.

So Democrats don't need to run up the score with these voters in order to be competitive in those key Rust Belt states of Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin. They do need to remain competitive and you saw that - you saw where Biden was putting his chips today on economic solidarity at a time when cultural issues have pulled many of those same voters toward the GOP.

KEILAR: Yes. I mean, Biden did do significantly better in Michigan and significantly better, by the way, than Hillary Clinton did in 2016.

BROWNSTEIN: Yes.

KEILAR: At the same time, we're looking at these numbers - we're seeing some pretty decent economic indicators. But when you pull people and you ask them, how is Biden handling the economy? How are you feeling about your financial situation? They're not feeling good. I mean, look at this approval number.

BROWNSTEIN: Yes.

KEILAR: How does that make things more difficult for him, Ron, in places like Michigan?

BROWNSTEIN: Yes, look, I mean, I think there's two big headwinds that he's facing in 24, concerns about his age and frustration over inflation. Even if inflation is slowing down, it doesn't mean prices are going back down. And there is a strong sense among Americans that things are more expensive, the necessity of daily life than they were when Biden took office.

On the other hand, Michigan will be a really interesting test case, Brianna, because the Big 3 bills that Biden's passed, the semiconductor bill, the infrastructure bill, and above all, the Inflation Reduction Act with the clean energy provisions, that's triggered over $500 billion in private investment in new plants and facilities since he took office, a boom in construction manufacturing.

And while a lot of that has gone south, which is part of the reason for this UAW strike, the concern that the companies are using the EV transition to make a second transition toward a lower wage, non-union environment, Michigan is benefiting significantly.

So this will be a real test case of whether the new jobs and new factories that the Biden agenda can credibly claim credit for inspiring can ameliorate any of that endemic concern about prices, which is real, is not going away and is a big cloud in front of all the other good news on the economy that he's been able to tout.

SANCHEZ: Ron, Vanessa, Arlette and Kristen, thank you all so much. Appreciate you being with us.

Still to come, Hunter Biden suing Rudy Giuliani and his former lawyer, accusing them of causing total annihilation of his digital privacy and violating computer privacy laws. We have the details on that.

Plus, a block of hardline House conservatives ramping up pressure on Speaker Kevin McCarthy as a government shutdown looms just four days away. That and much more next on CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

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[15:18:34]

KEILAR: Hunter Biden is suing Rudy Giuliani and Giuliani's former lawyer. The President's son claims they hacked his electronic devices and lifted and or manipulated personal data, resulting in what he calls a total annihilation of his digital privacy. This is a continuation of Hunter Biden's aggressive civil legal strategy that began before he was indicted on criminal gun charges.

We have CNN Legal Analyst and former federal prosecutor Jennifer Rodgers here with us.

Okay. Jennifer, I mean, just first off, does Hunter Biden have a case here, do you think?

JENNIFER RODGERS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, it's hard to say at this point, Brianna, because this is a civil case, not a criminal case. So what happens is you make a colorable claim that some wrongful conduct happened and then you get to get discovery.

So you get to depose witnesses, you get to ask for documents, you get to ask questions of your opponent. And only after all that is done, do parties make motions to dismiss based on the facts. So it's a little early to tell. He certainly makes colorable allegations.

So if his discovery turns up facts that support those allegations, then there is a case here.

KEILAR: So in this suit, Hunter Biden does not concede that the infamous laptop was his. Still, though, he alleges they accessed his data. How do you explain that to a jury?

RODGERS: Yes. So they're trying to kind of walk this fine line here. What he says is that it's not so much the taking of something that belonged to him in the form of the tangible object, the laptop or the external hard drive, the physical object.

[15:20:05]

It's the fact that they took this object and then they dug into it. They actually took the data. That's what he alleges is the problem: Financial data, personal data, private information, because that's what the law says you can't do. You can't have unauthorized access to somebody's data. So that's what he's trying to say here. Trying to get around, I think, this notion that what he had, what belonged to him was abandoned.

He's saying, well, whatever the object was, what was not abandoned is my right in my personal and private data, so that's the line they're trying to draw here.

KEILAR: Could he be deposed? Could Hunter Biden be deposed in a way? I mean, obviously, that would be something that could obviously dig into his privacy if he has a concern for that and could that hurt him?

RODGERS: Well, he certainly can and certainly will be deposed here. I think what's happened is this: It would be one thing if not all of the information had come out in the public realm, then Hunter Biden might have an interest in not pursuing these potential legal cases of his. But at this point, with everything out there, all the embarrassing stuff already in the public eye, I think he probably feels like, what's the harm. It's all been out there anyway. There's really nothing else that can come out factually that will be even more embarrassing. So I might as well push back, try to make my legal claims and try to turn the tide of public opinion as far as who is in the right and who is in the wrong here.

KEILAR: Yes. Maybe what has he got to lose here.

Jennifer Rodgers, thank you for your insights. We appreciate it. Boris?

SANCHEZ: With fewer than five days until a government shutdown, House Speaker Kevin McCarthy still can't get his members in line. Right now, there is no funding deal in sight, but the Senate could release its own bipartisan short-term spending bill at any moment.

If that happens, McCarthy then faces a critical test. Could he work with Democrats and potentially get fired by his GOP hardline right or potentially wrangle them and risk the possibility of the government running out of money on Saturday night.

CNN's Manu Raju is live for us on Capitol Hill.

So Manu, where do things stand right now?

MANU RAJU, CNN HOST: Yes. Speaker McCarthy has very little room to maneuver. He still wants to try to pass a short term spending bill to keep the government open with Republican votes alone. But there's a problem, he does not have enough votes because he included provisions in there, including spending cuts, border security provisions that simply will not get Democratic support.

But those hardliners on the right want to go even deeper in terms of spending cuts and they are not willing to go along, some of them say, with any short term bill at all. So McCarthy simply does not have the votes if you were to go that route, but if you decide to moderate and try to cut a deal with Democrats, that can open up to a challenge to actually push him out of the leadership.

That is a warning that has been issued by several conservatives and one that the leader - the Speaker's team and his allies don't take lightly.

And when I asked the Speaker moments ago about whether or not he has the votes and how he can reconcile these problems, he sidestepped that question and indicated he still wants to press ahead.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: (Inaudible) acknowledge that you have a math problem right now?

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): Do I have a math ...

RAJU: Yes. You have more than four members of your own conference who are going to vote against any stopgap measure. Why continue to try to convince them to go along with you when they are saying that they're not going to go along with anything you're putting on the table?

MCCARTHY: Well, it would be concerning to me that there would be people in the Republican Party that would take the position of President Biden against what the rest of the Americans want.

(END VIDEO CLIP) RAJU: So he's saying that those hardliners are essentially aligning themselves with President Biden's position. What McCarthy has been calling for all day is more border security measures as part of this plan, trying to shift the blame to the White House over all of this. But the simple fact is that he doesn't have the votes himself to get a party-line plan out of the House.

This comes as the Senate leaders on both sides of the aisle are still negotiating, trying to come up with their own compromise, a 45-day stopgap measure to keep the government open that would not likely deal with the issues of border security. So if that does pass the Senate in the next few days, what does Speaker McCarthy do? Does he put that on the floor to avert a shutdown?

He has not said and refuses to commit to taking up a Senate-passed plan, all raising major concerns here in Washington that a shutdown could happen by Sunday. Boris?

SANCHEZ: A math problem, as you put it, Manu, with no simple solution.

Manu Raju on Capitol Hill, thanks so much. Brianna?

KEILAR: Coming up, the Supreme Court rejecting Alabama's attempt to avoid creating a second black majority district. What this could mean for the state and the nation.

And then later, El Paso at the breaking point, as migrants keep streaming into the city. We're going to take you there live.

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[15:29:30]

KEILAR: For a second time in less than four months, the Supreme Court has rejected an attempt by Alabama to avoid creating a second black congressional district. The state's population is 27 percent black and right now only has one majority black district.

We have CNN Supreme Court Reporter, Ariane de Vogue, following this story.

All right, what happened here?

ARIANE DE VOGUE, CNN U.S. SUPREME COURT REPORTER: The Supreme Court basically said to Alabama today, oh, no, you don't. And it rejected Alabama's request to keep its congressional map that only had one black majority district in a state with 27 percent black majority.

[15:30:06]

That's going to clear the way for court ordered maps that will likely add another black majority district there, big win for NAACP.