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Israeli Woman Mourns Loss Of 6 Family Members Killed In Home; Israel Govt: Babies And Toddlers Found Decapitated; IDF: People, Children "Butchered" In Israel During Hamas Attack; Rep. Tim Burchett (R-TN) Discusses About The Vote For Speakership In The Republican Party. Aired 3-3:30 ET

Aired October 11, 2023 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:00]

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: To all these families?

RANAE BUTLER, FAMILY MEMBERS KILLED IN ISRAEL: Yes, about a fourth of the community was - is gone or missing.

COOPER: A fourth of the community?

BUTLER: Others are wounded. Everyone is for everyone. All the survivors decided to stay together when we were evacuated and that's what we're doing. We had - they had ...

COOPER: Ranae.

BUTLER: ... really - yes.

COOPER: I'm so sorry for what you are going through, what your family continues to go through and all the families from near Oz. I appreciate you being with us and I wish you continued strength and peace in the days ahead.

BUTLER: And I'll just tell you how professional they were with having a bunch of looters, having a bunch of murderers and having the ones who burnt and blew gas and rolled paper under people's doors to smoke them out. Really ...

COOPER: It's extraordinary.

BUTLER: ... they were so prepared, so prepared for this.

COOPER: Ranae Butler ...

BUTLER: Yes.

COOPER: ... thank you. I'm sorry.

BUTLER: I am too.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is CNN BREAKING NEWS.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: You're watching CNN NEWS CENTRAL. I'm Boris Sanchez in Washington, D.C. where we have just learned the House will not be voting on a new speaker today. Republicans just nominated Congressman Steve Scalise for the job.

We're going to have more on that, but we want to start with CNN's Anderson Cooper who is live for us in Tel Aviv, Israel. Anderson?

COOPER: Boris, thanks very much, 300,000 Israeli troops are amassed near the Gaza border. Hamas rockets continue to be fired toward Israel and the civilian toll of - the death toll is coming into greater view. The toll of horror and atrocity is coming into view.

The Israeli prime minister's office has confirmed that soldiers discovered, Israeli soldiers discovered decapitated babies in Kfar Aza. We heard about this for the first time yesterday. That was cited as one of the worst Hamas attacks over the weekend. Hamas denies it attacked children, but the unprecedented slaughter of hundreds of Israeli civilians has led to a fierce response.

And we know children have been killed in many locations here in Israel by Hamas. Air strikes have pounded Hamas targets in Gaza for days. Gaza's only power station is inoperable and hospitals are running out of fuel to power generators as the territory remains under a blockade. Among those dead in Gaza at least 11 U.N. workers.

Right now, there are behind-the-scenes talks underway, as we talked about in our last hour, on a number of fronts. One, to try and free and locate dozens of hostages held by Hamas, including Americans. We don't know how many Americans. And to allow somehow civilians and U.S. citizens to leave Gaza through Egypt ahead of a potential Israeli ground operation. Those talks are underway. We don't know how they will resolve.

CNN's Nic Robertson is posted in Sderot, Israel, for us.

Nic, in our last hour, there were - we saw Iron Dome interceptor rockets going up to knock out rockets coming from Gaza and there was firefighting on the ground. Talk about what has been going on.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes, since we last talked, Anderson, it's gone strangely quiet and calm, although quite - the last couple of seconds, we thought we were seeing some intercept rockets being fired up towards Ashkelon, but I'm not seeing anything at the moment. So it's a couple of heavy detonations there.

I suspect that's artillery, heavy artillery. There are a number of heavy artillery batteries in the fields around here. I suspect that's being fired into Gaza, that we may hear some soft - well, not soft, but distant impacts from that shortly.

Now, the small arms fire we talked about just an hour and a half ago that was over the hill, where a couple of Hamas militants were caught, neutralized, as the euphemism used here, by the Israeli defense forces just over the hill here two miles inside of Israel. That small arms fire picked up at about half an hour ago. Some flares were fired up in the sky, illumination flares. I think that was done to give the troops better visibility on the

ground, on the situation for what they were firing towards. It kind of indicates that the bulk of the firefight was over, it was done, but they really wanted to check the terrain, because if you light the terrain to see the enemy, they can also see you.

So, the flares were up and that operation seemed to sort of wrap up as well. But again, the situation here just - it changes on a dime and it's artillery, again, that's being fired in now.

[15:05:03]

I mean, I think, interestingly, today, at this end of the Gaza Strip, remember we're way up at the northern end of the Gaza Strip behind us there, we haven't heard any huge impacts from missiles dropped by aircraft. It doesn't mean it hasn't happened, but we haven't seen that this evening. It's been mostly the artillery fire, Anderson.

COOPER: And the preparations for some - for the next phase of this, have you seen much on that front?

ROBERTSON: Significantly. Significantly more groups of armored fighting vehicles, of troops in transit, in fighting jeeps with their heavy machine gun on top of the jeep, soldiers at the side of the jeep, their weapons pointed out at the ready. We've seen dug-in heavy howitzer gun positions. These are those big - they're big like tank- like vehicles, huge, heavy, massive tracks, but the gun on the front of them, unlike a tank, the gun can go up really high.

And what that means is it can fire so much further. So these heavy artillery guns, the defense forces can really range them over a large part of Gaza with a high degree of accuracy. And again, I think what we understand is they're being used to take out, try to take out or prevent the use of some of the launch sites. Obviously tonight on that, hard to judge just success, but rockets have been launched nonetheless.

COOPER: And in terms of the civilian population in Sderot, are - did a lot of families leave this area already or are they still there?

ROBERTSON: It's really - no, mostly it feels like a ghost town. I think that there are a few families here. I think they're staying indoors. But even for anyone that stays here, the stores are all shut. The gas stations in the town are shut. There's nowhere - there are no cafes open. The only places that are open are the military posts, the police posts and the ambulance stations. Everything else is locked up, so it really is a ghost town.

I - just checking back, I don't think I've seen any civilians or maybe one or two walking around the streets today. They're just not around at the moment, Anderson.

COOPER: All right. Nic Robertson, thanks very much.

Joining me now is Lt. Col. Jonathan Conricus. He's an international spokesperson for the Israeli Defense Forces. Lieutenant Colonel, appreciate you being with us.

I just spoke to a woman whose family has been slaughtered in near Oz, one of many families who was killed there. Do you have a sense at this stage of, I mean, she was saying out of 300 or 400 people who lived in near Oz before Saturday, about one fourth of them have been killed in this attack. Is that - are those kind of the numbers you are hearing as well?

LT. COL. JONATHAN CONRICUS, ISRAEL DEFENSE FORCES INTERNATIONAL SPOKESPERSON: Yes, hello. Thank you for having me on. Those are unfortunately also the numbers that I have. It varies from community to community. But near Oz, Be'eri, Kfar Aza, many other communities, that's the proportion of the Israeli civilians that have been executed in their homes by Hamas indeed.

COOPER: And it's important to point that out. I mean, these are executions. These are not people getting caught in crossfire. This is not people getting killed by a rocket and shrapnel. This is gunmen, killers coming to houses, breaking in, breaking into safe rooms, throwing gas into safe rooms, shooting babies, killing mothers. That's what this is. It's looking people in the eye and killing them.

CONRICUS: Yes. Yes, this is as up close and personal as you can get. And I think that the level of hatred that you need to develop in a human being in order to perpetrate these acts that we have seen documented, it's not rumors and it's not - the Israelis are claiming that. There's unfortunately forensic proof on the ground, forensic proof in the shape of bodies of dismembered Israeli civilians and it hurts me to use those words, but that is what we have found on the ground.

And I'd like to go back and focus attention on a statement made by a Hamas spokesperson, Abu Ubaida, about the day after the operation, their attack, their assault on Israel.

[15:10:03]

When asked, he said that the operation has gone as planned and that they were very happy with the results. And when you add that statement, an official statement by Hamas and what we've seen, the pictures that we've seen, evidence on the ground, you understand that this was not some unit that went crazy or some terrorists who got carried away with themselves. This was a systematic, pre-planned assault on Israeli communities and the aim was to butcher civilians and that is unfortunately what they did.

COOPER: And the hostages who have been taken, many of them from these communities, the woman named Shiri (ph), who was taken and her two children, Ariel (ph) and a younger child, four years old and nine months old, they were taken by the same people who killed other people in these communities. They were taken as part and policy of what Hamas wants. They are killing people in these kibbutzes and then also taking significant numbers of people from these kibbutzes to use.

CONRICUS: Yes, that is the strategy. Hamas is most likely hoping and building on that they will take these poor Israeli civilians, tender, peace-loving and gentle people who live in a quiet kibbutz, a small community, and they are hoping that they will drag them over to Gaza and then get political gains or release of Hamas terrorists from Israeli prisons.

I don't know how distorted their worldview is and in what reality they think that that is a practice that will achieve anything but global outrage against them. But I can say that I think they have signed something close to their own death warrant and an Israeli general said the - in just a few hours after the attack started and we understood what they were doing, he said that Hamas has opened the floodgates of hell on Gaza. And I think that is - it's proportionate because what Hamas has done is an unprecedented level of brutality, something that Israel has never seen and I don't think that any other sovereign country has seen this level of brutality, definitely not a western democracy.

So what Hamas has done is beyond a comparison to anything else. We are going to deal with it and it will be our job to make sure that Hamas will never ever have the ability to do this again.

COOPER: Lt. Col. Conricus, thank you for your time.

I'm going to go back to Boris Sanchez. Boris?

CONRICUS: Thanks for having me.

SANCHEZ: Yes Anderson, we are continuing to follow breaking news out of Capitol Hill. Congressman Steve Scalise winning the Republican nomination for Speaker in a closed door ballot by just 14 votes. But the path forward to the 217 votes he needs to be confirmed as House Speaker still appears unclear and after some disagreement, the decision that House members will not move forward on a vote to elect the next Speaker today.

Let's take you live to Capitol Hill where CNN's Manu Raju has been following the action all day.

So Manu, House members will still gather this hour but not for a Speaker vote, rather a procedural step. Yes, that's right. In fact, it just happened and it's over. The House came in just for a couple of minutes for just a session called a pro forma session on Capitol Hill. They just simply turn on the lights, turn it back off and that's pretty much it.

The person who gaveled it in was Patrick McHenry, who is still the interim Speaker, put in that position after that historic vote, the unprecedented vote to oust Kevin McCarthy from the speakership.

McHenry was asked by our colleague Haley Talbot when the vote would be for the Speakership. He said that is up to Steve Scalise to call that vote. He said Scalise has the right to make a decision about getting his supporters in line and taking it to the floor when he's ready to.

But one thing is very clear, Scalise does not have the votes at this moment to be elected speaker. He needs 217 votes on the House floor. Just moments ago this afternoon, he was nominated to be the next Speaker of the House by the Republicans, but got 113 votes. That shows you the deficit he has to make up.

Now, there are dozens of those members who plan to vote for him, but not all of those members who voted for Jim Jordan are ready to fall in line. Some of them still say they'll vote for Jim Jordan on the floor, including Congressman Marjorie Taylor Greene, who I just caught up with and indicated she's not planning to vote for Steve Scalise and she says others are willing to vote for Jordan on the floor as well.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R-GA): I'm not supporting Steve Scalise. I'll be voting for Jim Jordan.

[15:15:01]

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: And why is that?

GREENE: Well, Jim Jordan presented a strong plan for us, a detailed plan on how to move forward. We didn't hear that plan from Steve Scalise. It was more vague answers, but there's another situation that's very personal to me. I lost my father in 2021 to cancer and unfortunately, Steve is going through a cancer battle of his own. And I like Steve Scalise a lot and I like him so much. I would like to see him put his full efforts into defeating that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Now, Scalise has been under treatment for blood cancer and it's a treatable form of blood cancer. He says he's fully capable of doing the job despite these health challenges. But that shows you the challenge of getting the votes on the House floor. Steve Scalise can only afford to lose four Republican votes, already more than four, saying that either they're not going to vote for him or they're not willing to vote for him. So it shows you how Scalise will have to get some of those members in line.

But in a key step, Jim Jordan, who he ran against for the speakership in that closed door meeting this afternoon, has indicated that he will nominate Steve Scalise for speaker and is trying to encourage his supporters also to vote for Scalise on the floor. But as you can hear there, Boris, from one of his supporters there, Marjorie Taylor Greene, simply not willing to vote for Steve Scalise, others not willing as well.

And one Republican member also told me that Steve Scalise will never get the 217 votes to be elected speaker. So we'll see if that prediction bears out, but shows you the work ahead and also points to the challenge that Kevin McCarthy had, keeping his conference in line, ensuring he can limit those defections and those defections ultimately pushing him out of the speakership.

Can Scalise avoid all those traps in the days ahead? Big question for him as he tries to become the next Speaker of the House. Boris? SANCHEZ: And Manu, notably, Marjorie Taylor Greene, is she the first

member that you've heard publicly voice concerns, apprehensions about Scalise's health and his blood cancer as a reason to not elect him speaker?

RAJU: I've heard a lot of that privately. One member did say something publicly earlier this week, that's Congressman Ralph Norman. He said that was the reason why he was voting for Jim Jordan today in that closed door session. He was concerned about Steve Scalise's health.

Now, ultimately, Norman, he told reporters this afternoon that he would support Scalise on the floor when that floor vote happens, but there are some members there. But this is a significant comment that she's making, given the fact that he has virtually no margin for error if he wants to be elected Speaker of the House. And if she does not come off that position, if others don't as well, he could have a math problem on the floor, much like Kevin McCarthy did. The question for Scalise is when does he try to force that vote on the floor, no decision on that quite yet. Boris?

SANCHEZ: A difficult path ahead for Scalise, no doubt about that. Manu Raju, thank you so much from Capitol Hill.

Aid to Israel and Ukraine, a myriad of issues hanging in the balance in Congress as House Republicans pick their next speaker. We're going to speak to a member of the House Foreign Affairs Committee about these issues as soon as we come back. Stay with us.

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[15:22:11]

SANCHEZ: Breaking news to CNN, we're learning the House will not vote on electing a new speaker today as Congressman Steve Scalise wins the Republican nomination over Jim Jordan. That earlier vote happening behind closed doors on a secret ballot.

We want to talk to someone who was there in the room, Congressman Tim Burchett of Tennessee joins us now. He's one of eight Republicans who voted last week to remove Kevin McCarthy as speaker.

Congressman, thanks for being with us. You said that you were ready to stay all day. You've also said that you will support Steve Scalise in his bid to become speaker. Are you disappointed that he's not putting forward a vote on the floor of the House for the speakership right now?

REP. TIM BURCHETT (R-TN): No, actually, I thought we would do that today, but there are a lot of people that aren't here, both Republicans and Democrats. Some of - one of my Republican colleagues, I know for certain, is in Israel right now, so they're obviously having a little trouble getting home, so I think they're just going a little slower or we get there a little faster.

I think it has more to do with just complete numbers of the Congress and getting them all here. SANCHEZ: Are you confident that Scalise can eventually get to 217

votes?

BURCHETT: Yes, sir, I am. He's a proven leader. He raises money. He knows how to recruit candidates. He's handled some of the toughest legislation that's been handled up here, honestly. And I think he understands negotiations. He's fiscally conservative. He's strong on the border, all those things that Republicans rally around.

I think he understands the fact that when you take in $5 trillion a year, you cannot spend $7 trillion, which has been the habit of Washington.

SANCHEZ: Congressman, what is your message to members like Marjorie Taylor Greene, a Republican colleague, who says that she opposes Scalise, even though she likes him personally, in part because of concerns over his health?

BURCHETT: Well, I would hope that Jim Jordan would talk to some of those folks and further convince them along, because I think, Steve, if he's willing to serve and his doctors say he can serve, then I think he's more than qualified, and I think he can handle it. He's been through a lot of - more medical issues than this and a lot more than most member of Congress have - most members of Congress have. So I think he's up for the job and I think he'll do a fine job.

SANCHEZ: In an interview with CNN yesterday, you said the conference would come out of today's meeting united, that there wouldn't be 15 rounds of votes to elect a speaker. But there's obviously still disagreement, and not just over Scalise, but whether a vote should have happened today. How concerned are you that there is still disunity among your conference?

I think the unity is fine. We just have to heal a few wounds and I think that's what we're doing right now, as well as just getting members here, like I said, so we know that we can - we have a majority here.

[15:25:05]

So I think that's - those two things play into it, but also I think the fact that people are just concerned about the country and where it's headed, and that it's headed forward in a conservative manner, which I think the folks that are holding out now for Jim will eventually come over.

SANCHEZ: Congressman, there are also questions about aid for Israel, and I'm curious about the classified briefing that House members received this morning. Obviously, there are things that you can't share with us about what you learned, but what stood out to you about that briefing that you can share with us?

BURCHETT: Well, I've often said when I was, one time when I first got here, I was, if I came 15 minutes late to a classified briefing, I could probably catch it all on CNN pretty quick. So I think that continues to this day. There isn't really a whole lot they tell you in those meetings that you didn't already know or you didn't suspect. I've - I'm always disappointed in our State Department and their abilities and they did not disappoint me in that regard at all this time. I'm still disappointed in their abilities and their grasp on world issues and the people that we allow to make these decisions, and that they try to legislate from behind a desk, and they're not legislators. They don't have a vote, so - and I'm not worried about Israel, because they're on auto check to get about $3.4 billion from America.

The President did the right thing. He sent the Gerald R. Ford, the largest carrier, I guess, in the world, maybe sending more, and that shows a huge amount of support, and he can free up aid if he sees fit, just like he did for Ukraine without congressional support. And really, Congress is going to write a strong resolution, and I don't know that Hamas would actually read that.

So unless we declare war or there's some additional aid that I don't know about that isn't on auto check, I think they're going to be just fine and they probably would like America to mind our own business and let them handle it. And I think they're getting - as I stated before, you're going to see some very Old Testament kind of judgment come down on a lot of mean people and they deserve it.

Killing babies, that reminds me of my dad telling me about the Second World War and the Japanese and Nanjing, China in I think '38 and just what they did to those poor civilians on Okinawa. And there hasn't been this many Jewish folks killed since the Holocaust. I mean, my gosh, if we can't rally around Israel right now, then we need to think about where we are.

SANCHEZ: Congressman Tim Burchett, we have to leave the conversation there, but we very much appreciate your time and perspective, sir. Thanks.

BURCHETT: Thank you, brother.

SANCHEZ: Of course.

Still to come on CNN NEWS CENTRAL, we're on the ground in Israel, where thousands of Israeli reservists are amassing near the border with Gaza. The potential for a ground operation soon to be underway. Stay with CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

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