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Gaza Humanitarian Crisis Grows As Half-Million People Flee South; Gaza In Total Darkness As 5 U.N. Fuel Trucks Roll In From Egypt; Israel Gears Up For Next Stage Of War Against Hamas In Gaza. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired October 16, 2023 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:00:05]

SARA SIDNER, CNN HOST: Half a million people have fled to southern Gaza according to the Palestinian authority, that is after Israel warned that civilians were not going to be safe in the northern part of Israel, where 1.1 million people live.

Now Israel warned civilians to leave the north, as it is preparing for what it calls the next stage of its war on Hamas. That could include a ground war. That includes massing thousands upon thousands of troops along its border with Gaza. CNN's Nic Robertson is in Sderot, Israel, where he has been with the troops of the Israeli Defense Forces who are training in that area. Give us some sense of what they are doing when you talk about training, what that entails there on the border, Nic?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: You know, what they want to do, the IDF wants to do is to send in a combined force, they want to send in tanks along with infantry, along with combat engineers, this is sort of typical of a spearhead advance a lot of a lot of armies do this. But when you have reservists in the force and regular troops, you have to bring them together to train to do that. So they've been training to do that. They'd been training as well for fighting in a combat environment in these mock Palestinian towns, there are mosques, there are stores, there are traffic circles, there are people -- there are homes.

So the troops are going and training for exactly the sort of environment absent the people that they'll face when they go into Gaza. So now they haven't been given that order. Everything that we see, the tanks parked in the fields, the troops doing the last minute repairs to the tank tracks, there dozens upon dozens, probably hundreds of armored fighting vehicles lined up nose to tail in the fields close to the border as well. Some of those waiting for troops to join them.

You get that real sense that a possibility of an incursion is getting closer, the whole force not ready yet. Fighter jets in the air -- in the skies above us and still miss our runs taking place in the last half an hour or so.

SIDNER: It is remarkable. I know for you to see this, you've been in this region for decades, and explaining what has been going on. It's remarkable to see the possibility of a ground incursion at this point in time, I mean all out full scale war. Nic Robertson, thank you for all of your reporting for throughout the last week we appreciate you.

I'm hearing some sound a bit, however light in my ear.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN HOST: Our special coverage continues right now we want to show you the new video just in, this is northern Gaza. This is, we're going to show you, northern Gaza -- video of northern Gaza right now. It's new drone video that has come in. We'll pull that up when we can. And it shows a sea of devastation really from the airstrikes coming from Israel.

And this is as Israel prepares to launch an expected ground invasion there. Right now, U.S. Secretary of State Tony Blinken back in Israel. The State Department says during meetings with Israeli leaders this morning that Blinken reaffirmed U.S. support of Israel and its need to defend itself. The State Department also in a readout, if you will, says it Blinken is also focused on the efforts that are ongoing and underway to secure the swift and safe relief of the hostages being held by Hamas terrorists.

And today, that number of hostages has increased a great deal, unfortunately, 199 people are being believed to be held by Hamas in Gaza, John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Yes. I want to get right back to Sderot right now, which is where our Nic Robertson is. It's a mile or so from the Gaza border. Nic, I understand you are beating to hear some things. What do you hearing?

ROBERTSON: Yes, we heard the fighter jets flying over, some very heavy explosions. They could have been artillery fired from the IDF going into Gaza as well. But then we heard Iron Dome intercepts, and we're just, Jones going to pan up into the sky, you might see a small gray cloud up there. Up in that area, we were seeing the Iron Dome intercepts. These probably were missiles fired towards Ashdod, Ashkelon, or perhaps further north into Israel, not fired towards the rock where we are.

But it's just that uptick in activity. Earlier on today it was relatively quiet. And now late afternoon, it's really beginning to -- activities beginning to pick up again. It sort of gave that impression that earlier on the day there might have been a sort of a pause for diplomacy to train to play out for the wrath of border crossing, for hostages, for so many things.

But as the lights fading here, we really do seem to be sort of seeing this uptick and not only the artillery but the missile strikes that are coming in. And of course for all the ground troops out there, now I don't know if you can see it on your camera. We've been talking about these tens of thousands of Israeli troops and around the border on their tanks, their armored personnel carriers out in the open.

[11:05:18]

Well, look, the skies are opening up. There's really heavy rain flooding in here. We had some rain yesterday. But this is what's predicted. So those troops who are waiting for a signal waiting for an order that they may get an incursion, this rain is obviously going to get to -- is going to impact them in the field and therefore how long the military can keep them on that hold and poised position waiting for an order. John?

BERMAN: Nic Robertson, stay with us if you will. Again, I want to point out where Nic is. Nic is right here in Sderot. This is the Israeli town city, 20 some thousand people live there. I think a lot of people have left. You can see how close it is to Gaza. I'm not even a mile separates the two. Nic has said that some of the firing from Gaza has been going toward Ashkelon and Ashdod, which are up here on the Israeli coast. And he's hearing more incoming.

And Nic are getting other information, by the way. This is also Wadi Gaza, people have been told to leave northern Gaza and head south. We are getting this information, Nic, that U.N. fuel trucks, some five of them have crossed the Rafah crossing, which is right here, from Egypt into Gaza, bringing fuel, one might presume to the southern part of that country, it is a significant development, because it's the first aid to get into Gaza since this conflict began.

You know, but you can get a sense of the distances. It's only 20 miles or so where those fuel trucks are from where there are now explosions behind you, Nic.

ROBERTSON: Yes, we know there as well, there have been explosions right down at the border crossing in Rafah because the road at the border crossing has literally been chewed up by those explosions. So if those trucks have gotten through that proves that to some degree, that road is possible. We knew that these empty fuel trucks were lined up inside the Rafah border crossing, inside Gaza, waiting to pass to go across into Egypt.

If they've now fueled up and filled up and they're coming back into Gaza, that will give some temporary relief principally to the hospitals and the medical facilities there in Gaza. The U.N. agencies say that those medical facilities that rely on generator power, because most of the electricity has been cut to Gaza, that those generators will now have enough fuel to run for another number of hours.

It's not clear how much fuel, how many more hours those generators can keep running. But the hospitals in Gaza have approximately 3,500 beds for the residents, those 2.2 million people that live in Gaza. So keeping the hospitals running, particularly for the elderly, particularly for the many casualties, and people who are in them already, on dialysis, on life support machines, this fuel is vital to help keep them alive.

So that will be we expect would be the sort of first principle use of that fuel once it crosses back in. But again, not just the fuel, in a way the proof if you will, that that border can be crossed by trucks.

BERMAN: All right, Nic Robertson in Sderot, Nic, we are actually seeing the rain falling all around you. This is the first time we've seen anything like that. And one might imagine it could have some kind of an impact on the ground forces, the Israeli ground forces that are preparing at this point, perhaps to move into Gaza soon. Nic, if you see or hear anything else, please let us know. Again, that's where Nic is in Sderot. I'll put up the big map up here so you can see it, Nic down there.

But our Sara Sidner is up here in Haifa, where she has been watching some American citizens leave via boat. And I should mentioned that Sara is not far from the Lebanese border as well where there has been some activity. Sara?

SIDNER: That's right. There have been sirens that have gone off in parts of northern Israel, not far from here. We're about 85 miles or so. So about an hour and a half's drive to the border. I want to talk about what's happening here in just a bit. But I want to bring in CNN's Jeremy Diamond because at the very beginning of the show, we had some breaking news. Jeremy the Knesset, which is the parliaments here in Israel was forced to evacuate just briefly this morning. What more can you tell us about that?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's right, Sara. There was a barrage of rockets fired by Hamas in Gaza towards Central Israel both in Tel Aviv, as well as right here in Jerusalem, prompting the evacuation of the Knesset as it was in session. The Knesset of course is Israel's Parliament's and lawmakers who are on the floor, we're seeing heading out as the sirens rang out heading for a bomb shelter inside that very same building. They waited there until they got the all clear before they were able to return.

[11:10:07]

We actually from our bureau here which is less than two kilometers away from the Knesset. We were able to hear those very loud booms of the Iron Dome intercepting those rockets in Tel Aviv, though, one of those rockets actually did make impact, injuring at least one woman according to Magen David Adom, the ambulance service here in Israel.

All of this is coming amid the Secretary of State Tony Blinken visit here. He was in Jerusalem shortly before those sirens went off meeting with the Israeli prime minister as well as the Israeli president. He is now in Tel Aviv where we are waiting to see images of him hopefully, alongside Israel's a defense minister. He's also meeting with one of the country's opposition leader, Yair Lapid.

And ultimately the question is, what will Tony Blinken be able to get out of this visit to Israel today. It caps off a trip that he's been making throughout the Middle East to about a half dozen countries, focused largely on the humanitarian situation in Gaza, trying to get aid to be flowing in as well as allowing American citizens and others to be able to exit southward through the Rafah crossing into Egypt.

Beyond that, of course, the Secretary of State also focus on trying to avoid this Hamas-Israel conflict from blowing up into a broader regional conflict. And of course, beyond that there is the issue of those 199 hostages that we now know, are being held by Hamas in the Gaza Strip, at least 20 of those are believed to be American citizens as well.

And so all of those issues top of mind for the Secretary of State as we await the possibility of a visit by President Joe Biden to Israel, we know that he has been invited by the Israeli prime minister, but as of yet, the White House not confirming whether or not he will actually be making the trip this week. Sara?

SIDNER: That will be if it happens, a very significant moment in the relationship between Israel and the United States. Jeremy Diamond, thank you so much for all of that.

I am going to go now to David Tafuri. He is a former Obama campaign, foreign policy adviser. He's also a former State Department official as well. Thank you so much, sir, for joining us at this really tense time in Israel and in Gaza, and frankly, in the West Bank as well with the leadership there. Sir, can you just give us some sense of how diplomacy can work and whether it is already working to some degree because for the entire past eight days, nothing has come in and out of that Rafah border, the border between Gaza and Egypt.

But now, we've just learned and seen evidence video of it of five different trucks coming in with fuel into Gaza from that Rafah border, which has effectively been closed to people trying to get out. Is that part of the diplomacy that's happening here?

DAVID TAFURI, FORMER OBAMA CAMPAIGN FOREIGN POLICY ADVISER: I would expect it is. You know, Blinken is doing shuttle diplomacy here going between Israel and the Gulf states. He's trying to get the Gulf states to press Hamas to release some of the hostages. He's trying to get Egypt to open that Rafah gate that you just mentioned, that's super important, both for moving supplies into Gaza, but also to create a safety valve for some Palestinians to leave Gaza.

And that's going to be the most controversial for Egypt because they don't want a mass influx of refugees from the Gaza into the Sinai Peninsula, which is where the Rafah gate opens up into in Egypt. Moreover, he's trying to show strong unwavering support for Israel publicly. But privately, he's urging Israel to be proportional its response, to limit the casualties for civilians, and not to ultimately occupy Gaza.

Yes, Israel has to do what it has to do to decimate Hamas, but he doesn't want to see an ongoing humanitarian crisis from Israel staying in Gaza, and controlling Gaza, and continued fighting an insurgency in Gaza.

SIDNER: Yes, those are really good points, because that is a whole different ball of wax, when you consider going in and then having to stay there and trying to govern a place right now, like Gaza. I do want to ask you about how we got here. I think sometimes we need to step back a little bit from what is happening right now, which is a dire situation where war is all out, where people are suffering untold issues in Gaza and death, where Israelis are terrified.

And there are still dozens of people in the hospital from that initial attack and rockets coming over every single day. How did we get to this point? And what if anything, is the solution? There was so many decades of this idea of a two-state solution. Do you think that that is over now because of where we are, because of this surprise attack by Hamas and now, the Israeli response to it?

[11:15:02]

TAFURI: I still think to a two-state solution is really the only long term solution. Unfortunately, we're moving further and further away from that right now. You know, one of the ways we got here is that Hamas has provided very poor leadership in Gaza. It has betrayed the average Palestinian. I would note that Hamas last had elections in Gaza in 2006, which is stunning, you know, half of Gaza's population is under 18. That means most of them weren't even alive, or many of them were not alive, the last time they were elections.

The reason Hamas has not had an election since then, is because it knows the people of Gaza are unhappy with their leadership, so they betrayed the Palestinians. But there's also been mistakes on the Israel side. Of course, Israel did not deserve this attack. It was unwarranted, it was atrocious. But Israel has made mistakes in terms of going forward with settlements that have made it more difficult for there to be the two-state solution.

And in terms of not working hard enough to press for a two-state solution to press at least the more moderate partners in West Bank, to agree to some kind of deal that would give the Palestinians more rights to self-determination and put the Palestinian territories, both Gaza and West Bank on track to ultimately be independent. And that's what the two-state solution requires.

SIDNER: Yes. I mean, there has been a plenty of dire warnings from Palestinians who do not have freedom of movement, who say that their land. And it is clear that the land that they want to occupy and they once lived on has shrunken enormously over these past few decades. That has been a huge bone of contention from the Palestinian side.

I want to talk to you a little bit about this visit from Secretary of State Antony Blinken. This is the second time he has come to Israel within a week, which is highly unusual. We're looking at the podium where he is going to be meeting with the Israeli Defense Minister Yoav Gallant in just a bit here.

You know this second visit, is this a sort of emergency move to try and find some way to help those who are in particularly in Gaza, while also showing the United States full support to Israel?

TAFURI: I think that's right. You know, this is a multipronged visit. Obviously, he needs to take care of the U.S. citizens that are in Israel, you're in Haifa, there's a, you know, there's a now a way for Israel -- for American citizens in Israel to leave by boat from Haifa. So the State Department is likely involved in organizing that. He's very worried about the hostages. So he's working on discussions with those who can have influence with Hamas to release the hostages, especially the hostages that are U.S. citizens or dual Israeli-U.S. citizens. And then he's also pressing for the opening of the Rafah gate by Egypt and for Israel to allow in fuel, to allow in water, to allow in food. On an average day, Gaza is on the brink, even before this crisis, it barely has enough in resources barely has enough in medicine barely has enough in food. I spent a week in Gaza several years ago. And it's a place that feels like it's going to collapse, even when it's not in the middle of a crisis like this.

So, Antony Blinken is also worried about those things and trying to get Israel to allow that type of humanitarian support to care for the civilians. Ultimately, we need to make sure that we do some protection for the civilians, because if you injure and harm civilians, if you put them in a humanitarian crisis, and if you put them in a human rights violations type situation, you're only going to promote the cycle of violence. You're going to have a new generation of Gazans who feel like they've been betrayed not only by Hamas, but also by Israel.

SIDNER: David Tafuri, you make a lot of good points and sort of giving us the background in history is so important because history does not start where we want it to. There is a long and protracted conflict that has been happening here. But this is an inflection point. And you did mention one thing, you talked about the fact that the State Department was working on getting Americans out who want to leave Israel. That has happened to them.

We just saw the boat leave three hours ago from here in Haifa, we're at the port and that's why we're here. So good on you for reminding me where I am as well. David Tafuri, thank you so much for your very insightful words.

TAFURI: Thank you.

BERMAN: All right, you're looking at live pictures right now from Tel Aviv. That is where the U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken is meeting right now with Israeli officials. We are waiting to hear from him shortly. We just got word from Sderot, right on the Israel Gaza border, that the rain is beginning to fall, it's quite heavy. How might that impact what seems to be a pending ground operation?

[11:20:03]

Plus, we're getting new reporting of all these tunnels inside Gaza. These are a key part of how Hamas has been attacking Israel for years. And we are now learning that key A has crossed the border from Egypt into Gaza. Our producer saw six fuel trucks crossing the border, the Rafah crossing right now into the southern part of Gaza. We'll talk about the significance there. Our live breaking news coverage continues right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:25:05]

BERMAN: All right, a couple of important developments over just the last hour or so. We're getting word that U.N. fuel trucks, five of them have crossed from Egypt into Gaza over the Rafah crossing that is significant to get at least some supplies to some of the people in southern Gaza who have moved there over the last several days.

Meanwhile, we know that Israeli forces are massing here for a possible ground invasion. It just started to rain up here in Sderot. How might that impact a possible ground invasion? And Israel announced this morning, the IDF, that there are 199 hostages they believe, now being held in Gaza.

With us now is retired U.S. Army Brigadier General Mark Kimmitt, former Assistant Secretary of State for Political military affairs. General, thank you for being with us. A 199 hostages inside Gaza, how will that complicate or shape what seems to be an impending ground operation?

BRIG. GEN. MARK KIMMITT, U.S. ARMY (RET.): Well, it certainly it will complicated things. But more importantly, will shape how the Israelis decide to fight. Obviously, if they go into hard, there's a very, very strong risk that Hamas will kill the (inaudible), which is tough thing to say. But it's true. But as important they go into soft, it could very well risk the mission itself. So it's going to be very, very complicated for the IDF as they do that tough street to street fight that you know so well, John.

BERMAN: Well, in general, one of the things that President Biden said yesterday in terms of the Israeli operation in Gaza, is he would advise against Israel reoccupy Gaza. Obviously, you served in Iraq, when U.S. troops were there, you know, the complications of troops staying in one place for an extended period of time, if they aren't going to, quote unquote, occupy northern Gaza, what would they do there exactly? How long would they stay? And how would they get out?

KIMMITT: Well, their mission is very clear, rescue the hostages and rid Gaza of the mosque dictatorship that they have had for so many years. Yes, we know that Hamas has been in power since about 2006, probably a lack of leadership to take over from them. But the first issue is, as you say, military mission, rescue the hostages, just as we've seen in so many of our own occupations. You don't win the peach (inaudible).

SIDNER: General, I'm going to move to Tel Aviv for one second, general. We're seeing the U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken meeting with the Israeli Defense Minister. Let's listen to hear if they say anything.

YOAV GALLANT, MINISTER OF DEFENSE OF ISRAEL: Mr. Secretary, thank you for coming to Israel. We always know -- knew that the United States is a great ally. But today people in Israel, in the world, see with their own eyes you are here for the second time in this week, senior officials of America are here every day, and the American flag is on -- is sailing on boats in the Mediterranean, and we know what is the meaning.

So let me tell you, Mr. Secretary, this will be a long war, the price will be high. But we are going to win for Israel, for the Jewish people, and for the values that both countries believe in. With your permission, a few words in Hebrew. (Speaking in Foreign Language). BERMAN: That's the Israeli Defense Minister Yoav Gallant, he's speaking in Hebrew now after he greeted the U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken. They are in Tel Aviv right now where they have been meeting. This is Blinken's second time in Israel. And just a few days he left Israel and then did this whirlwind diplomatic mission to many countries in the region.

[11:29:47]

But now back in Tel Aviv, Yoav Gallant, the defense minister also mentioned the U.S. military presence not far off the coast. There is already one carrier group the USS Gerald Ford and now a second carrier group the U.S. Dwight D. Eisenhower will be headed to that region I'm talking here until they start.