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Rep. Victoria Spartz (R-IN) is Interviewed about the Speaker's Race; Rep. Jake Auchincloss (D-MA) is Interviewed about Funding for Israel and Ukraine; House to Vote Again for Speaker; Democratic Leaders Speak about the House Speaker's Race. Aired 9:30-9:55a ET

Aired October 20, 2023 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00]

REP. VICTORIA SPARTZ (R-IN): But I still insist, and I told him personally, that if you cannot get the vote on the floor, we have to go back into conference, reconcile differences or move on, but we have to have a speaker. We cannot continue this and we cannot have grandstanding. It will look foolish.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: And that's generally not what's going to happen because you're taking it -- he said he's -- they're taking it to the floor and it's going to happen in something like 30 minutes from now. So, do you support -- continue -- do you support him today?

SPARTZ: Well, I'll support him one more time, but that is probably be my last time if he's not going to go back to conference because if this is not going to be resolved to the floor. So, we'll see where he is with his votes today. You know, I think he needs to understand that a lot of the things now have to be decided as a group and reconciled by the group. So, we'll see where he is. Hopefully he was able to, you know, to work with some people.

The challenge you have, and Kevin made the same mistake, when you force people on the floor and you put a lot of public pressure, you know, you get attacked a lot. And people get -- their families get attacked, you get attacked and people get upset. And the same like the conservatives were attacked last time and were upset. Now a lot of moderates and other members were attacked. It's not healthy to govern -- ultimately govern the body of people, of members. And speaker works for the members in the tight majority (ph).

BOLDUAN: Absolutely. So, this is important for everyone to know. From a -- every vote is critical at this point, obviously. Victoria Spartz is going to give Jim Jordan one more shot with this vote. And then, after that, Jim Jordan could be even losing more votes because it will show, as you said, that you guys need to get back as a family, if you will, and work this thing out.

You have said that you do not like the idea of giving bigger power, more power to Patrick McHenry as a temporary speaker.

SPARTZ: Well, sure, I --

BOLDUAN: If that is the only option to get enough votes to get the House open and working again, do you see yourself coming around to it at all?

SPARTZ: No, I think this is unconstitutional. It was done after September 11th, but a lot of that law, you know, were done, you know, after September 11th. So it's still, what's happened, how they were abused during (INAUDIBLE) and a lot of governors and a lot of leaders were abusing them. So, I think we actually shouldn't allow to do something unconstitutional, you know, and expand power. We should elect speaker. It's never been tested, you know, in the courts. And, honestly, everything will be done on the floor will be challenged and tested. It's also not good. That's not a way to govern. We have to elect a speaker, even if they have to close out in the room without food and water until we get a speaker in that room.

BOLDUAN: I -- we will see. Let's see what happens at 10:00. But it looks like it's heading a direction of, you may need to get people and hold people in there without food and water to get --get through this, Congresswoman.

I do want to ask you about the speech and what we heard from President Biden last night. He laid out last night that he is going to -- he is asking Congress for $100 billion in aid for Israel, Ukraine, the U.S. southern border and also Taiwan. As our viewers know, you were born in Ukraine. You're a strong supporter (INAUDIBLE). Will you support approving an aid package like this if the House would open up and if you can get it before you quickly?

SPARTZ: Well, I think we have to make sure that, you know, Israel and Ukraine win that war and we need to do much better with weapons that we did. But we also need to make sure that we deal with domestic issues. And, additionally, actually have a debt commission to deal with our huge crushing debt and have some border security reforms to start -- to get it under control.

So, I think it should be negotiation between both sides. It shouldn't be a partisan issue. I think additional to this (INAUDIBLE) we need to demand border security and debt commission. And I'll be very open to that. But better oversight a way that it actually goes to the right cause, not a slush fund which, unfortunately, it became.

BOLDUAN: Well, let's see -- well, first and foremost, you can't pass anything unless the House is actually operating. And in paralysis, the first order (INAUDIBLE) and must take priority. Congresswoman, thank you so much for your time. We'll be watching as the vote plays out very soon. Thank you so much.

SPARTZ: Thank you for having me.

BOLDUAN: So, that is the view from a very important Republican on the direction of where this is going in the House in terms of a House speaker, but also with regard to President Biden's primetime address to the nation. The appeal that he made for more wartime funding to support Israel and to support Ukraine was -- did he make a convincing enough case? We'll discuss this further after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:39:14]

BOLDUAN: In a rare Oval Office address, President Biden laid out the stakes of the moment that the nation and honestly the world is in right now. And he laid out his case for Congress to approve tens of billions of dollars for Israel, Ukraine, Taiwan and the U.S. southern border. Biden said very simply, and starkly, that the world is at an inflection point, that Putin and Hamas want to, quote, completely annihilate democracy.

And, today, President Biden says he is going to formally ask Congress to approve a package of $105 billion in aid to these war efforts. That total includes $60 billion for Ukraine, $14 billion for Israel, and also additional money for humanitarian aid, a significant boost in funding to bolster border security in the U.S., and also aid to the Indo-Pacific and Taiwan.

[09:40:08]

Wrapped up in all of this, as we were just talking about, is the fact that without a speaker of the House right now Congress can't pass anything.

Joining us now, Democratic congressman from Massachusetts, Jake Auchincloss.

Congressman, thanks for coming on.

Biden made the case that this isn't about some far away places that we're watching from here in the United States. This is about American security at home as well. But do you think he made a strong enough case to get a Republican majority in the House on board?

REP. JAKE AUCHINCLOSS (D-MA): Yes, the president met the moral moment. Our ally democracies are under attack from terrorists, from tyrants, from totalitarianism and the president is responding with strong statesmanship and with clarity of purpose. And now it's incumbent on Congress to match his resolve. We know that a majority of the Republican conference has been in support of Israel, of Ukraine, of Taiwan. The votes exist. What is necessary is for House Republican leadership to jettison their extremists and to unlock bipartisan governance so that we can set aside the petty infighting and instead actually govern, not just for this democracy here at home, but for democracies the world over.

BOLDUAN: Some Republicans are furious that he's linking the aid for Ukraine, which has become divisive, to -- in parts of Congress, to the aid for Israel. Just one tweet that popped up from Republican Senator from Ohio, J.D. Vance, he didn't mince any words. He wrote, "I think what the president did is completely disgraceful. If he wants to sell the American people on $60 billion more for Ukraine, he shouldn't use dead Israeli children to do it." Calling it "disgusting."

Is this going to be a problem?

AUCHINCLOSS: It's a problem for J.D. Vance. But J.D. Vance has no moral compass. He's somebody who has sold out his own constituents in pursuit of a cult of personality on behalf of Donald Trump.

Ukraine and Israel are linked. They are linked because both are fighting for democracy against neighbors who would destroy the very people who inhabit that territory. Ukraine is fighting against a tyrant --

BOLDUAN: Congressman, would you be open to more accountability around the funds? That is one thing we have heard from Republicans not named J.D. Vance. I know Victoria Spartz, who was just on with us, she's talking about more accountability of where the funds are.

AUCHINCLOSS: A stalking horse for Republicans to try to avoid taking a vote. That the funds going to Ukraine have rigorous accountability within the state (INAUDIBLE). And we've seen President Zelenskyy take muscular action when necessary to assure that.

I will also go a step further and say that the funds being sent to Ukraine have been the highest return on investment for national security dollars in my entire lifetime. For less than Americans spend on soft drinks every year, we have doubled NATO's border with Russia, we have cratered half of Russia's conventional military capacity, we've induced our allies to spend more on their own defense spending, we have sent a clear message to Beijing that America stands for freedom and democracy the world over and change their calculation regarding Taiwan. This has been a successful foreign policy endeavor by President Biden and Republicans agree with him privately, but publicly they're afraid because Donald Trump tweets mean things at them.

BOLDUAN: I want to lean on you military service here. Israel is preparing for a ground invasion, (INAUDIBLE) we believe (INAUDIBLE) something like 200 hostages potentially. Palestinian civilians are also caught in the middle of this. We are seeing protests against Israel for -- pro-Palestinians breaking out again in the Middle East today, showing just how tense and how critical this moment is. Saying its -- where the world is at an inflection point is not hyperbole in this moment.

But you are also -- when President Biden is looking for Americans to come together to speak with one voice, you do have Democratic colleagues of yours, like Rashida Tlaib, who is Palestinian American, speaking out very critically of President Biden and his support of (INAUDIBLE).

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. RASHIDA TLAIB (D-MI): President Biden, not all of America is with you on this one. And you need to wake up and understand that. We are literally, literally watching people commit true genocide and killing the vast majority just like this, and we still stand by and say nothing. We will remember this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: That from a fellow Democratic colleague of yours in the House. What do you say to them? [09:45:00]

AUCHINCLOSS: Outlier Democratic lawmakers who spread disinformation and falsely conflate Hamas with the Palestinian people do not speak for the Democratic Party.

The leader of the Democratic Party, Joe Biden; the leader of House Democrats, Hakeem Jeffries; the leader of Senate Democrats, Chuck Schumer, they are the ones who represent the Democratic Party's position on standing with Israel. And in that vein, it is forceful and unequivocal. Israel has a right and a responsibility to defend itself against terrorists of (ph) the Jewish state and the murder of Jews and the United States has a responsibility to staying with our fellow democracy in the Middle East.

BOLDUAN: Congressman Jake Auchincloss, thank you for your time.

AUCHINCLOSS: Good to be with you.

BOLDUAN: Moments from now the House of Representatives set to convene right up the hallway from where the congressman is standing at our camera position. They are convening one more time for one more vote on the House floor. The third vote for House speaker this week. Jim Jordan pressing ahead, fighting on, even suggesting this could stretch into extra innings this weekend. What is going to happen and what's going to be different for Jim Jordan now? We'll go back to Capitol Hill.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:50:07]

BOLDUAN: Let's get back to Washington right now where it is all about to go down once again. The House of Representatives is getting ready to vote again for House speaker. The third vote this week. Jim Jordan saying he's not giving up.

CNN's Lauren Fox is standing by for us.

They're all going to be walking behind you, Lauren. Where do things stand?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we are waiting right now for the Democratic Leader Hakeem Jeffries to come and give us a update on what the Democrats are coming -- I believe he's right behind us, so we'll move out of the way.

BOLDUAN: He's right behind you, Lauren.

We're going to -- just for our viewers to know, we're going to try to get as close as we can, because the Democratic leader in the House has stopping short of our camera, but he -- looks like he's clearly going to speak with reporters that are all gathered around.

REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY): All right, thank you, everybody. House Democrats have repeatedly made clear that we are ready, willing and able to find a bipartisan path forward to reopen the House so we can get the business of the American people done, so we can stand by our friends and allies throughout the world, like Israel and Ukraine, provide humanitarian assistance to Palestinians who may be in harm's way, and meet the health, the safety and the economic wellbeing needs of every day Americans. House Democrats have repeatedly made clear, we want to find a bipartisan path forward.

QUESTION: Leader Jeffries --

JEFFRIES: At every step of the way, Republicans have rejected bipartisanship and embraced extremism. Jim Jordan is a clear and present danger to our democracy. He wants to end Social Security as we know it, he wants to end Medicare as we know it, doesn't believe that President Biden was elected in 2020. That's disrespectful to the American people. Jim Jordan wants to impose a nationwide abortion ban. And he is the poster child for MAGA extremism.

We are saying to our traditional Republican colleagues, good men and women on the other side of the aisle, end the attachment to the extremist Jim Jordan and join with Democrats in finding a bipartisan path forward.

QUESTION: But why should they join you? Why should they join you if you voted to oust McCarthy?

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) your understanding that --

JEFFRIES: Katherine Clark. Katherine -- Katherine Clark. Katherine Clark. Katherine Clark. Katherine Clark.

REP. KATHERINE CLARK (D-MA): We are 17 days in to a choice by the majority of chaos. A choice to reject coming together and putting the people of this great country over their civil war, their partisan bickering and movement to extremism. This is a choice by the majority. And we are re-emphasizing what our caucus and leader has been saying is for the past two weeks, come together. You are weakening our country. You are weakening this institution. You are ignoring the work of the American people. The time is now. Choose a bipartisan path forward.

QUESTION: But what do you --

JEFFRIES: Pete Aguilar. Pete Aguilar.

REP. PETE AGUILAR (D-CA): Jim Jordan has failed at every vote. And he's going to continue to fail. House Democrats are united behind Leader Jeffries. We want a path forward. We want to make sure that we are doing everything we can to meet the needs of the American public.

Two objectives this week for House Democrats. One is to make sure Jim Jordan does not get close to the speaker's chair. And the second is to reopen the House of Representatives. We still have work to do, but we are going to do it. We're going to do it together. And we're going to advocate for a bipartisan path forward and continue that discussion until we open up the chamber.

QUESTION: Leader Jeffries, it seems like a bipartisan path forward is what you're talking about, but in our conversations with Republicans it sounds dead. What makes you think that there's a reason for it to be revived?

JEFFRIES: Well, there are still reasonable Republicans over on the other side of the aisle. As I've repeatedly said, good men and women who want the House reopened, who want the congress to function. And what we've said is, we just want a House that allows for bipartisan bills that benefit the American people, not Democrats or Republicans, the American people. We want a House that allows for bipartisan bills to receive up or down votes, that will receive the majority of members on both sides of the aisle, but are being blocked right now by the extremists.

QUESTION: Leader Jeffries, if you -- if you would have all of your people here this weekend to continue to block Mr. Jordan, that you have enough votes every single roll call vote this weekend?

[09:55:04]

JEFFRIES: We recognize that Jim Jordan is a clear and present danger to the American people. And we are going to be here for as long as it takes to end this national nightmare.

QUESTION: Leader Jeffries -- Leader Jeffries --

QUESTION: Have you heard from any moderate Republicans who would be willing to partner with you on a speaker candidate?

JEFFRIES: That's a question you should ask them.

QUESTION: Leader Jeffries, at this point would you ever vote at -- for Patrick McHenry on the floor?

JEFFRIES: I've said repeatedly that there are many Republicans on the other side of the aisle who we believe are good Americans, good patriots, good men and women. Patrick McHenry is one of them. There are others.

QUESTION: Sir, have you spoken directly with any of your Republican colleagues about a bipartisan path forward?

JEFFRIES: I haven't spoken directly with Patrick McHenry.

QUESTION: What do you say to those who believe Democrats are to blame for this situation that we're in since you all voted with those eight Republicans to oust McCarthy?

JEFFRIES: Well, the job of the House Republicans is to elect a speaker who can get to 218 votes and to sustain a speaker at 218 votes. That is the job of the majority. From the very beginning of the republic going back to 1789. And, by the way, who created Jim Jordan? Who normalized Jim Jordan? Who is about to nominate --

QUESTION: But he wouldn't be a candidate if McCarthy was ousted, sir.

JEFFRIES: Who is about -- who is about to nominate Jim Jordan? That's clear.

QUESTION: And are you OK if they were to go ahead and elect a speaker pro-tem, as they did in the early '60s after Speaker Rayburn, so the House could operate? I mean that's what you're saying here, that that -- that type of option is on the table, and that's something you'd be OK with because of this precedent?

JEFFRIES: What we're saying, that all options are on the table to get the House back open so we can do the business of the American people.

QUESTION: If every Democrat -- if every Democrat --

JEFFRIES: Say that again.

QUESTION: Is McHenry the only name that's in that conversation?

JEFFRIES: No.

QUESTION: Who are the other names that you're --

QUESTION: Then what are the other options?

QUESTION: Is it Steve Womack? Are there other names? Can we just kind of get into detail?

JEFFRIES: I think you've got to ask the other side of the aisle who they're willing to put forward.

QUESTION: We have.

QUESTION: If you guys went to -- if every Democrat went to the floor and they voted for a Republican today, (INAUDIBLE) who would join you organically in that moment, would you take that (INAUDIBLE)?

JEFFRIES: (INAUDIBLE) Republican to be speaker of the House?

QUESTION: Yes.

JEFFRIES: We'd have to have a real conversation about what that would look like.

QUESTION: Is that a challenge because your side -- obviously there are some on your side who just have such antipathy for Republicans, that they could not potentially do that at all. I --

JEFFRIES: No, no, let's be clear. Let's be clear. We have said repeatedly for the last two weeks that we are ready, willing and able to find a bipartisan path forward, to enter into a partnership with our Republicans colleagues to reopen the House, to get the business of the American people done, to solve problems for hardworking American taxpayers. We just need some traditional Republicans to join us. Instead of rejecting bipartisanship, they need to stop embracing extremism. QUESTION: One of --

QUESTION: What are the concessions that you (INAUDIBLE).

QUESTION: Is there any scenario where you think you could be speaker right now if you have.