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Sources: Intense Talks Ongoing To Free Large Number Of Hostages; Secy. Blinken Attends U.N. Meeting On War In Gaza; Emer & Johnson Face Off For Speaker Nomination. Aired 11:30a-12p ET
Aired October 24, 2023 - 11:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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[11:32:09]
JOHN BERMAN, CNN HOST: So, this morning, we've learned that the United States and several other countries are in talks to secure the release of a large number, that is what they're saying, a large number of the more than 200 possible hostages being held by Hamas in Gaza. This would be their 18th day in captivity. So far, four people have been released, two Americans and two Israelis. Sources do tell us the negotiations are complicated -- obviously complicated by a number of factors, but they are ongoing.
With us now. Retired General Wesley Clark, CNN military Analyst and former NATO Supreme Allied Commander. And, General, one of the things that we were talking about. Israel from the minute this happened said they will destroy Hamas. Their goal is to destroy Hamas and make sure Hamas can never operate again. But when we're talking about from a military perspective of achievable goals, what are the military goals within Gaza if there is a ground operation?
GEN. WESLEY CLARK, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Now, we don't actually know what those goals are yet. They would be classified in the Israeli operation. But we can imagine what they'd be.
And the other big goals -- strategic goals are, destroy Hamas, make sure they can't reconstitute, provide safety for Israel, etcetera. But the specific tactical missions with objectives, those aren't known yet. So, you can speculate what they might be.
BERMAN: So, what's the universe of things that they might be?
CLARK: So, when they went in 2014, they penetrated in various areas designed to wreck the tunnel access for the tunnels that lead out of Gaza into Israel. This has to be a different operation. So, if they're really going to go after Hamas, they're probably going to compartmentalize Gaza, probably go after key locations in the north like the utilities, the desalinization plant, to completely secure an area, wall it off, maybe protect the population that's there, you identify the population, you go underground, and you do it step by step going through this.
It's a very complicated piece of ground. It can soak up your manpower instantly. So, it's not just a matter of sort of whizzing in because they're going to come in behind you, they're going to come up from underneath, and the population is not on your side.
So, anything you do, there's a whispering campaign. Even if you've knocked out all the telephones and everything else, the Israelis are here, they're there, they're doing this. So, it's you're at an intelligence disadvantage. So, you have to be very specific, very directed, in this.
BERMAN: Let's talk about the tunnels here. This is a look at what the tunnels were like in 2021. They've almost certainly changed, grown, and shifted. How hard is it to destroy a tunnel or fight against an organization that is using a tunnel network?
[11:35:06]
CLARK: Now, it's going to be very difficult because it's not just a matter of closing off a tunnel, you don't know where the interconnections are, and you don't know where the hostages are. So, you can't simply blow up all the tunnels if you could do it by magic. If you could pump some kind of gas in there and blow it up, you might be killing all the hostages and a lot of civilians.
BERMAN: General, we're just getting word that Secretary of State Antony Blinken is speaking at the United Nations right now. Let's listen to what he's saying.
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ANTONY BLINKEN, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: They're unlawful and unjustifiable, whether they're carried out by ISIS, by Boko Haram, by Al-Shabaab, by Lashkar-e-Taiba, or by Hamas. They're unlawful and unjustifiable whether victims are targeted for their faith, their ethnicity, their nationality, or any other reason. And this council has a responsibility to denounce member states that arm, that fund, and train Hamas or any other terrorist group that carries out such horrific acts.
Let's not forget that among the more than 1400 people that Hamas killed on October 7 were citizens from more than 30 U.N. member states, including many of the members around this very table. The victims included at least 33 American citizens. Every one of us has a stake. Every one of us has a responsibility in defeating terrorism.
Second, we all agree on the vital need to protect civilians. As President Biden has made clear from the outset of this crisis, while Israel has the right indeed the obligation to defend itself, the way it does so matters. We know Hamas does not represent the Palestinian people. And Palestinian civilians are not to blame for the carnage committed by Hamas.
Palestinian civilians must be protected. That means Hamas must cease using them as human shields. It's hard to think of an act of greater cynicism. It means Israel must take all possible precautions to avoid harm to civilians.
It means food, water, medicine, and other essential humanitarian assistance must be able to flow into Gaza, and to the people who need them. It means civilians must be able to get out of harm's way. It means humanitarian pauses must be considered for these purposes.
The United States has worked relentlessly to make real these principles. We continue to coordinate closely with Egypt, Israel, and partners across the region, as well as with the United Nations to build mechanisms that will enable sustained humanitarian assistance to flow to civilians in Gaza without benefiting Hama, or any other terrorist groups. President Biden appointed one of our most senior diplomats, Ambassador David Satterfield, to lead our humanitarian efforts, which he's currently doing on the ground.
The United States has committed an additional $100 million in humanitarian assistance to Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank, bringing the total aid that we provided to the Palestinian people over the past two and a half years to more than $1.6 billion. That makes the United States the largest single-country donor by far to the Palestinian people. We call on all countries, particularly those with the greatest capacity to give to join us in meeting the U.N.'s appeal for the humanitarian situation in Gaza.
At the heart of our efforts to save innocent lives in this conflict, and in every conflict for that matter, is our core belief that every civilian life is equally valuable. There is no hierarchy when it comes to protecting civilian lives. A civilian is a civilian is a civilian, no matter his or her nationality, ethnicity, age, gender, or faith.
That's why America mourns the loss of every single innocent life in this crisis, including innocent Israeli and Palestinian men, women, children, elderly people, Muslims, Jews, Christians, people of all nationalities and faiths, including at least 35 U.N. staff members. That's why it's imperative that we work to protect all civilians in this conflict to prevent more deaths atop many that have already occurred.
The value we place on civilian life is the driving force behind our efforts to secure the release of hostages held by Hamas and other terrorist groups in Gaza. I, as others, have had the occasion to meet with families of those missing and suspected to be in the hands of Hamas on my recent trip, several as you know are in this room with us today, none of us -- none of us can imagine the nightmare they're living. Something no family should have to endure.
[11:40:02]
Their loved ones must be released immediately, unconditionally. And every member of this council, indeed, every member of this body should insist on that. Insist on that. Insist on that.
We're grateful to Qatar, to Egypt, to the ICRC for helping secure the release of four of Hamas's hostages. But at least 200 more, and again, from many of our nations, are still in the grip of Hamas. So, again, I implore every member here. Use your voice, user influence user leverage to secure their unconditional and immediate release.
Third, we're all determined to prevent this conflict from spreading. This goes to the principal responsibility of the Security Council in maintaining international peace and security. The broader conflict would be devastating, not only for Palestinians and Israelis, but for people across the region, and indeed, around the world.
To that end, we call on all member states to send a firm united message to any state or non-state actor that is considering opening another front in this conflict against Israel or who may target Israel's partners, including the United States, don't, don't throw fuel on the fire. Members of this council and permanent members, in particular, have a special responsibility to prevent this conflict and spreading. I look forward to continuing to work with my counterpart from the People's Republic of China to do precisely that when he visits Washington later this week.
Now, it is no secret to anyone in this room or on this council that for years, Iran has supported Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis, and other groups that continue to carry out attacks on Israel. Iranian leaders have routinely threatened to wipe Israel off the map. In recent weeks, Iran's proxies have repeatedly attacked U.S. personnel in Iraq and Syria, whose mission is to prevent ISIS from renewing its rampage.
So, let me say this before this council, and let me say what we've consistently said to Iranian officials through other channels, the United States does not seek conflict with Iran. We do not want this war to widen. But if Iran or its proxies attack U.S. personnel anywhere, make no mistake, we will defend our people. We will defend our security swiftly and decisively.
To all the members of this council. If you, like the United States, want to prevent this conflict from spreading, tell Iran, tell its proxies in public, in private, through every means, do not open another front against Israel in this conflict, do not attack Israel's partners. And we urge members to go a step further. Make clear that if Iran or its proxies widen this conflict and put more civilians at risk, you, you will hold them accountable. Act as if the security and stability of the entire region and beyond is on the line. Because it is.
Fourth, and finally. Even as we address this immediate crisis, we all agree that we must redouble our collective efforts to build an enduring political solution to the conflict between Israelis and Palestinians. The only road to lasting peace and security in the region, the only way to break out of this horrific cycle of violence is through two states for two peoples. As President Biden has underscored from day one, Palestinians deserve equal measures of security, of freedom, of justice, of opportunity, of dignity. And Palestinians have a right to self-determination and a status of their own.
Now, we have no illusions about how hard it will be to achieve a two- state solution. But as President Biden has said, we cannot give up on peace. Indeed, it's precisely in the darkest moments like this one that we have to fight the hardest to preserve an alternative path to show people making it real, and improving their lives in tangible ways is possible, indeed, it's necessary.
We've heard many countries express support in recent weeks for a durable political solution. Our message today is this. Help us build that solution. Help us prevent the spread of war that will make two states and broader peace and security in the region even harder to achieve.
[11:45:05]
Members of this council, we stand at a crossroads. Two paths lie before us. The difference between them could not be more stark.
One is the path offered by Hamas. We know where it leads. Death, destruction, suffering, darkness.
The other is the path toward greater peace, greater stability, greater opportunity, greater normalization, and integration, a path toward people across the region being able to live, to work, to worship, to learn, side by side, a path toward Palestinians realizing their legitimate right to self-determination and a state of their own. Nothing would be a greater victory for Hamas than allowing its brutality to send us down its path of terrorism and nihilism.
We must not let it. Hamas does not get to choose for us. The United States stands ready to work with anyone, it's ready to forge a more peaceful and secure future for the region, the future as people yearned for, and so deserve. Thank you, Mr. President.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I thank His Excellency, Mr. Blinken, for his statement. Now, I give the floor to --
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KATE BOLDUAN, CNN HOST: We've been listening to U.S. Secretary of State Tony Blinken speaking before the U.N. Security Council and saying very clearly, all of us every member that's sitting around that table right now has a stake in making this conflict end. Calling in the unconditional release of hostages by Hamas, calling out Hamas yet again as a terrorist group, and also making clear and you -- we heard that a few times talking about the importance of every civilian life. Saying every civilian life is equally valuable in this conflict.
BERMAN: Talking about the responsibility of Israel to protect civilians as it continues its operations. But making clear that the United States feels that Hamas is responsible for the civilians inside Gaza, and their actions are what has caused the recent conflagration as well.
BOLDUAN: And calling out Iran by name. Saying it's no sneak -- no secret as it isn't, that Iran has supported Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis, and other proxies for years. And importantly, sadly, there's more another update that Blinken provided that we see here, which is that 33 Americans have died as a result of the October 7 Hamas attack.
That death toll is higher than what the State Department had said Friday. And also, he noted that in the room as the council was meeting today, were some of the families of the hostages taken by Hamas with them sitting there today traveling over from Israel. Many of them to be at the U.N. Security Council today.
BERMAN: 220 people potentially still being held hostage inside Gaza. BOLDUAN: Yes. So, we're going to continue to follow that. We're also following -- keeping an eye on Capitol Hill. There are only four men now still in contention to be the next House speaker.
The fourth round of voting happening now. We blinked, so maybe the fourth round of voting is over. We'll get a check and we're going to go back to Capitol Hill where things are moving fast.
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[11:52:46]
BOLDUAN: All right. We do have breaking news from Capitol Hill right now. House Republicans behind closed doors entering a fifth round of balloting and down to two candidates left for House speaker. Let's get over to Manu Raju with the very latest. Manu, what are you hearing?
MANU RAJU, CNN HOST: Yes, there are two candidates left so we could see the Republican nominee for speaker potentially on the next ballot, a fifth ballot now with the final two. Tom Emmer, the House Republican whip, and also Mike Johnson, the Louisiana Republican are the final two to be known -- who are going to this final round of balloting. Byron Donalds of Florida is out of this race as is Kevin Hern of Oklahoma.
Now, the magic number is expected to be about 109 votes to be nominated as speaker. That is going to be of course, far short of the 217 you need to be elected speaker in the full House. So, that's going to be the challenge for one of these two members. We expect a vote in this conference meeting to decide to essentially say -- see if whether or not, any of these members who eventually get a nomination, whether or not those can actually get the 217 votes. That will be tested separately after the fifth valid vote, which will happen here in a matter of moments.
But in talking to some members, what's clear is that there's a clear frustration, both of the process of how this has all gone down in the last few weeks. And some members are concerned flatly about Tom Emmer himself and his record on spending. Listen.
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REP. DAN NEWHOUSE (R-WA): But he's frustrated. I think that's the general consensus around the country, us included.
RAJU: Yes.
NEWHOUSE: Republican members of the House.
REP. PAT FALLON (R-TX): They want it over with. They want us to clean up the mess.
RAJU: Congressman Perry, would you be comfortable with Tom Emmer if he's the nominee given his votes on spending?
REP. SCOTT PERRY (R-PA): I'm concerned about that, for sure. (END VIDEO CLIP)
RAJU: And that is going to be a challenge for Emmer. If he's the front-runner heading into this final ballot, if he gets the nomination can he limit the defections to only four Republicans on the House floor? You heard Scott Perry there, a member of the -- leader of the Conservative House Freedom Caucus saying he is concerned about Emmer's record on spending.
Another congressman, Rick Allen, said that he would vote against him over Emmer's past support for codifying same-sex marriage. That could potentially mean it's very close for Emmer to potentially get the votes on the House floor. So, we'll see if Emmer, if he does get the nomination here as a front-runner, whether he runs into the same situation that befell both Jim Jordan and Steve Scalise to replace Kevin McCarthy.
[11:55:07]
Both of them winning the Republican nomination but unable to get the votes on the House floor. So, so many questions here about whether the Republicans can finally move out of this state of paralysis as infighting that has completely stalled all legislative action on the House floor for the past three weeks in the aftermath of the ouster of Kevin McCarthy.
BERMAN: We got about 20 seconds left, Manu. Are Republicans one hundred percent going to take this to the full House floor if Tom Emmer emerges with 109 votes in the next few minutes?
RAJU: It's -- that is unclear. In fact, they had committed privately, John, that they would -- this -- the nominee -- the eventual nominee must show that they can get 217 votes first before going to the floor. So, we'll see. That process, John, could take some time to play out.
BERMAN: OK.
BOLDUAN: Good luck.
BERMAN: All right. High drama here. Tom Emmer with 107 votes right now. He's really just to secure two more?
BOLDUAN: Sure, but not yet. Right?
BERMAN: But --
BOLDUAN: So, Alfred was on with us earlier. He said that that commitment to doing an actual roll call vote inside, which would mean seeing the names of the people inside the room if they're going to get to 217. Standby to standby.
BERMAN: All right. So, a lot is still to happen. Thank you so much for being with us. This has been CNN NEWS CENTRAL. A lot of breaking news on "INSIDE POLITICS" right after this.
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