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Israel: Hamas Won't Let Americans Leave Gaza Through Rafah; Michael Cohen Testifies At Trump's Civil Fraud Case; Soon: House Expected To Vote On Fourth Speaker Nominee. Aired 11:30a-11:55a ET

Aired October 25, 2023 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:30:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KIRBY, NSC DIRECTOR FOR STRATEGIC COMMUNICATIONS: That purpose. We know there's Americans and that we know they want to get out. We're working very hard to find safe passage for them.

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KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: And joining me now is Nabil Alshurafa. His 66-year-old mother is Palestinian-American and one of those stuck in Gaza. Here's a picture of her. She traveled there to visit her sick mother and she is now stuck.

And Nabil joins us from Chicago. Thank you for joining me. What is the latest that you've heard from your mother? How is she doing?

NABIL ALSHURAFA, HIS PALESTINIAN-AMERICAN MOTHER IS TRYING TO LEAVE GAZA: Thank you, Kate. We just -- I spoke to her about 24 hours ago. I couldn't reach her this morning. I was hoping she could speak to you.

But in the last 24 hours, I spoke to her. It's been an impossible situation. There's no food. There's little water. They're eating garbanzo beans, whatever they can find.

When my uncle went to go get some bread, it took him about two and a half hours to wait in line to get bread when the Israeli military bombed the store forcing everyone to fall and collapse on top of each other. It's been a really challenging situation. They just bombed -- I heard from my another -- my uncle that they bombed the street where my mom is. So, if she wants -- if she could go to the Rafah Border, she'll have a very difficult time.

And it's just -- you know, it's an impossible situation to be in. Right now, my mom, it's not -- it's not that she is stuck in Gaza. She was trapped in Gaza. She was 10 minutes away from getting out of the border, the Rafah Border, on October 10 when the Israeli missile -- when Israeli -- when Israeli military struck down that border shutting it and trapping 600 U.S. citizens and hundreds of European and other international citizens. Trapping them in Gaza. And so, this is really an important narrative that's missing.

And what strikes me right now, Kate, is that the -- you know in 1990, in the first Gulf War, the U.S. president, George H.W. Bush, before getting involved in the Kuwait-Iraq War, he sent freedom for flights to get the U.S. citizens out. And I was on -- my family was on those freedom flights and were U.S. citizens. Why didn't the U.S. before getting involved in the war, get the U.S. citizens out? This makes no sense to me before getting involved.

And now our, allies trapped our US citizens. Israeli Government traps them in there. And railing bombs on them. And their bombs raining on them. It's just unbelievable what's happening.

BOLDUAN: So -- and we have -- we have a new video that we had coming in of airstrikes in Southern Gaza and the devastation that is left behind. The IDF says -- I remember seeing the IDF speaking about a strike, maybe on that same day near the Rafah Border that they were targeting underground tunnels that are used by Hamas, which of course, adds to the complexity of all of this. And the administration has said that it has proven really complicated to get Americans out.

We've heard from the Secretary of State speaking about it. He was asked about it. And he says that -- what he has said is that to date, Hamas has blocked people from leaving. And then the spokesperson for the State Department explained the situation further this morning when asked on CNN. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MATTHEW MILLER, SPOKESPERSON, STATE DEPARTMENT: The Egyptians are on their side ready, they say, to accept people, foreign nationals, United States citizens, if they can make it to Egyptian processing. On the other side, we have seen a couple of things. At times, as the -- as in the clip you just showed, Hamas has had no one there manning the Border Station. At other times, we have seen Hamas militants actively there with guns, preventing people from approaching the crossings.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Adding to the complexity of all of this. And if you could appeal to the administration and to the Egyptians, what would your message be? I mean what would your ask be right now with regard to getting access to that border?

ALSHURAFA: Yes. Kate, this is not a really complicated issue. The administration wants us to think it's a complicated issue. My mother has a stamp on her passport to exit. And when the Israeli military struck down the Rafah Border, prevented her and many U.S. citizens from leaving.

There's no one preventing my mother from leaving right now. Right now, we're in a dire situation, right? My mother has no food, there's no fuel to get her to the border, and so what they're requesting is an aid for you know the civilian population.

I mean, right now, it's no longer just about my mother. There are thousands of children, mothers, women being killed. I had four family members that were killed as well recently. Buildings are being wiped out. Neighborhoods wiped out. Doctors are operating without anesthetic.

[11:35:02]

This is not a war -- this is not Israel at war. This is Israel performing genocide on the -- on the Palestinian people. And our government is just sitting there quietly.

Now, what I just heard is that American hostages, there were hostages that Hamas let go into Israel. If Israel is our ally -- our closest ally, why won't they let our U.S. citizens exit through Israel? So, they want you to think it's complicated, but right now, really, it's a matter of get food, fuel to the civilian -- the majority civilian population, so that the U.S. citizens can get out of the Rafah Border or get them to get out through our closest ally, Israel. So, it's really not complicated, Kate.

BOLDUAN: The continue -- folks continue the administration -- the Biden administration continuing to face questions on that. They say that it's day to day they're working on it. And we'll continue to track it.

Thank you so much for coming on to tell your other story. Nabil, thank you. John?

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: A new report that Mark Meadows was granted immunity and testified in the special counsel case against Donald Trump. And we are minutes away from what could be the final election for House Speaker, at least for a while.

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[11:40:42]

BERMAN: Two key players in Donald Trump's world going under oath against or at least about their former boss. Happening now, trump's one-time fixer and lawyer Michael Cohen is on the witness stand testifying in the civil fraud case against Trump where Trump has already been found liable. This comes as ABC News reports that Mark Meadows, his former chief of staff, was granted immunity to testify in the special counsel probe in efforts to overturn the 2020 election.

With us now. Former Assistant Special Watergate prosecutor and former Assistant U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York, Nick Akerman. Counselor, how essential do you think Mark Meadows is in the special counsel case against Donald Trump?

NICK AKERMAN, FORMER ASSISTANT U.S. ATTORNEY: Oh, I think he's huge. He is actually a fulcrum point in this entire case. It's going to be tried on March 4 of next year.

He was the person that basically took in all the communications that were directed to Donald Trump. He carried messages from Donald Trump to everybody. We know from the testimony of Cassidy Hutchinson, who was Meadows's chief assistant, that Meadows was supposed to go to a meeting at the Willard Hotel, the War Room with Bannon and Giuliani and other miscreants, who were there plotting what was going to happen the next day, he decided not to go but attended by telephone.

We know that he talked to Roger Stone who is up on the Capitol steps with the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers. I -- he might even be able to put evidence out there that Donald Trump knew beforehand that there would be violence on the Capitol steps. He is an extremely important witness.

He was in the room at the time. He knew what was going on. I know there's reports in the ABC about what he may have said, but we're not going to really know the importance of that testimony until we actually hear him testify at the trial.

BERMAN: One of the things he reportedly said, according to ABC News, was that he, Mark Meadows, never believed that the election was stolen, and told Trump repeatedly that that was the case. However, Mark Meadows wrote a book -- Mark Meadows wrote a book where he says the opposite, or basically -- or he says things at least that are different than what ABC News is reporting he said under oath. How much does that matter?

AKERMAN: Well, it matters to the extent that certainly when he's at trial, he's going to be cross-examined extensively on his prior inconsistent statements. And what he is going to say are lies. The problem that the defense is going to have here is that Mark Meadows is going to be corroborated by lots of other witnesses. He's going to be corroborated by his own text messages and other documents. And the government is likely to incorporate that into the narrative that they put forward when Mark Meadows testifies. He's going to talk about all of that.

BERMAN: When Mark Meadows testified. So, you think this means he's on the stand?

AKERMAN: There's no question about it. He is going to be one of the star witnesses. But don't forget, there are other witnesses who have lots of credibility, like Pat Cipollone, who was the White House Counsel, who has no problems with prior inconsistent statements, who has always told the truth about this matter.

And we don't even know what he says because he was claiming executive privilege, which basically has been knocked down by the district court judge. So, there's going to be a lot of evidence. But what's critical about Mark Meadows is, he really can tell the whole story about what Trump knew, when he knew it, and what he was doing during the insurrection.

BERMAN: Nick Akerman, great to see you. Thank you very much.

AKERMAN: Thank you.

BERMAN: Kate?

BOLDUAN: Coming up for us. The House of Representatives will take another stab at it in electing a speaker and maybe possibly getting back to actual work. Where does support stand at this moment for Congressman Mike Johnson? Will head back to the Hill to find out. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:48:56]

BERMAN: All right. Those were pictures from just minutes ago of the man who, in just minutes, might be the next Speaker of the House. Congressman Mike Johnson, a Republican from Louisiana, looks like he is on the verge of succeeding where all these other people have failed, including Kevin McCarthy, right from the moment that he got booted from the speaker's chair.

Just to review, overnight, 22 Republicans didn't show up for a vote on whether they would support Johnson today, three voted present but it does not look like there will be the four Republican votes to keep him from earning the speaker's gavel. Let's get the very latest from Lauren Fox on Capitol Hill. Lauren.

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, John. In fact, two of the members who voted present last night have since said that they are planning to support Johnson on the floor today. That shows he has momentum to get this gavel in just maybe even the first round of voting.

We are going to obviously be keeping close tabs. We expect that after they get through some of the formalities, the pledge, as well as keeping tabs on who is actually in the chamber, they're probably going to get to voting around 12:30 -- 12:45.

[11:50:06]

Then things could move relatively quickly. Again, we've seen this play out many times before over the course of the last three weeks. They will have members called by name, then those members will decide who they are supporting for speaker. Democrats, of course, are going to be supporting Hakeem Jeffries on the floor.

But you are hearing from so many Republicans, from the far right to the moderate wing of the party who say that Johnson is the guy for the moment. They are exasperated, they are exhausted, they are ready to move on with the speaker so they can actually get to governing. Something they haven't been able to do over the course of the last three weeks, John.

BERMAN: So, this chaos might be over soon. Lauren Fox, thank you so much. Keep us posted.

BOLDUAN: Yes, might.

BERMAN: Might.

BOLDUAN: Heavy dose of might. Thank you all so much for joining us. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL. CNN's special live coverage of the House Speaker vote starts after this quick break.

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