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Rafah Crossing Could Open for Some; Airstrike on Gaza Refugee Camp; Biden Faces Tough Questions on Israel; Mark Regev is Interviewed about Israel's Strike on Civilians; Trump Jr. To Testify in New York; Jeremy Saland is Interviewed about the Trump Trial. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired November 01, 2023 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[09:00:36]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now, for the first time, some select people allowed to leave Gaza. This after furious diplomatic negotiation. Details on the deal that will allow hundreds of foreign nationals to get out.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: And a massive strike in northern Gaza leaving a crater where a refugee camp once stood. The IDF defending the strike saying it took out a Hamas commander and other terrorists, as the search for civilians trapped in the rubble continues.

BERMAN: Donald Trump's eldest son going under oath today. Pivotal testimony in the $250 million trial where Trump has already been found liable for fraud.

I'm John Berman, with Kate Bolduan. Sara is on assignment. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

BOLDUAN: Now, we have major developments at the border of Gaza and Egypt. For the first time since Hamas attacked Israel and Israel began striking in Gaza, civilians in Gaza are being allowed to get through the Rafah crossing. Who and how many still remains somewhat unclear, but we are told injured Palestinians are now entering Egypt one by one is how it's described.

And the Jordanian foreign ministry just announced that the start of an evacuation of its citizens from Gaza is now underway.

The latest estimate is that an agreement has been reached that the injured and up to 500 foreign nationals are to be allowed through the crossing, with some Americans, expected to cross as soon as tomorrow.

Now, crowds of people and ambulances have been seen lining up at that crossing, even moving through the crossing throughout the morning, throughout the previous - the last few hours. The key in all of this seems to be Qatar. They, in coordination with U.S. officials, mediated the deal with Egypt, Israel and Hamas to ultimately allow for all foreign nationals, is the goal, and critically wounded Gazans to get out. One man -- we want to show you some new images coming in. One man, as

you see here in this image, is seen lying inside an ambulance as he awaits to receive medical care in Egypt.

In another ambulance there was a young woman who was left there with -- and seen only with a few papers and a phone resting on her chest.

John.

BERMAN: All right, let me give you a sense of where that's taking place, Kate. That's down here at the Rafah crossing.

Meanwhile, there are new questions about what happened to the Jabalya refugee camp. Israel says that an air strike there targeted Hamas Commander Ibrahim Biari, and a few minutes ago said that they saw it as a clear military necessity. But you can see the scale of the destruction here, including this crater which Israel says could be the result of the fact that there were tunnels underneath that were destroyed.

Now, hospital officials do say there are dozens and dozens of casualties. These pictures reportedly of people taken from the refugee camp to a local Indonesian hospital. There could still be people trapped in the rubble there. There has been harsh international reaction with some countries recalling their ambassadors as a result of this.

Let's begin, though, with the very latest from the Rafah crossing because this is the first time we have seen anything like this, people getting out of Gaza into Egypt.

CNN's Melissa Bell is in Cairo.

Melissa, what's the latest?

MELISSA BELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: John, look, we spent much of yesterday at the Rafah crossing. And what was remarkable was what was not getting through, how little was happening. So many lines of aid trucks just stuck there, unable to get in. And, of course, no civilians have gotten out except from the handful of hostages that have, over the course of the last three and a half weeks, made their way out. Until now there have been no Palestinians allowed out. All of those (INAUDIBLE) and foreign nationals have been stuck inside despite being told early on that they would be able to get out through this crossing.

So, a remarkable development today. We're seeing those first most severely wounded Palestinians coming out through the Rafah crossing. They are taken then by ambulance to a field hospital that's been set up some nine miles away by Egyptian authorities. These are the most severely wounded. These are people, John, that are in need of surgical intervention immediately.

[09:05:00]

The very first Palestinians allowed out of the enclave ever since Israel announced that total siege.

We're also seeing the very first foreign nationals now leaving the Gaza Strip, and that also a remarkable development and also down to the mediation of Qatar. What we understand is that the deal is pretty comprehensive, that it will allow all foreign and dual nationals to get out of the Gaza Strip, perhaps not today, but over the coming days. That includes some 400 Americans who have been stuck inside ever since this war began.

And I think as we begin to watch both these foreign nationals and these wounded Palestinians come out, it's really important to remember what it is they're leaving. More than three and a half weeks not only of those Israeli bombardments day and night, some as far south as the Rafah crossing where they've been massed waiting to get through that crossing, but also the total siege that has led to so little food. Five percent of the water that is needed inside the enclave, desperate sanitary conditions.

These are civilians that are in desperate need of medical attention for the most part and for the foreign nationals consular services. You're talking about civilians that will have made a mad dash for that crossing, some of them without documentation. And what we understand is that consular services from a whole range of countries. It gives you an idea of just how many different foreign nationals were stuck inside, are now at the Rafah crossing, waiting to take in their citizens or help them through and on their way to Cairo and back home. Consular services from Indonesia, from Japan, from Austria, from Jordan and, of course, the American nationals also due to make their way out over the coming days.

It will be an extremely challenging, logistical difficulty to get these people out. Still, the fact that it is happening, a remarkable development more than three and a half weeks on.

BERMAN: Yes. Melissa Bell, in Cairo, this is the first time we've seen anything like this, these pictures from just a short time ago at the Rafah crossing, people beginning the process of getting out. Again, nothing like that has happened to date in the last three weeks of this conflict.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: To northern Gaza now where an Israeli strike destroyed Gaza's largest refugee camp. These, we're going to show you, are scenes of the aftermath. You can see it there. Dozens believe killed and injured. Where this crater is now, the IDF says it was able to take out a top Hamas commander and other Hamas terrorists.

CNN's Salma Abdelaziz has more on this and she's joining us now.

Salma, what more are you learning about what happened here and what Israel is saying today?

SALMA ABDELAZIZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, and our teams have pushed Israeli military spokespeople further on the civilian casualties. They do acknowledge that this is a residential area. They called the civilian casualties a tragedy of war. But I want to explain to you what that tragedy looks like.

First of all, coms were severed shortly after those bombs dropped on the Jabalya refugee camp, so we're only starting to get images now. I was watching one clip of a man, Kate, just before I got on air with you, and he was holding up the names of 15 people, 15 relatives. He says his mother - his sister's family, his brother's family, everyone he knows was killed. He described it as a massacre, saying his entire residential building, 20 stories, is now wiped out in that tragedy. Of course, tearing apart communities that had already been bombed and besieged for three weeks now.

We still don't know the extent, the number of people killed, because families continue to dig with bare hands into that rubble to try to find anyone, find the bodies of survivors. As I said, entire families wiped out. Parents burying their children today.

The image in the hospitals nearby is also terrifying. The hospitals were already on the brink. Now they're receiving countless more casualties. One doctor saying it's simply too overwhelming for them to bear.

The funerals outside those hospitals also continue to echo through the north of the strip.

Now, the Israeli military will say this is northern Gaza. People should have evacuated. But over and over again we have heard from rights groups that that evacuation order is, as the U.N. described it, inhumane and impossible to do under bombardment and under siege.

And what is so terrifying when you look at those images, and we still don't understand the full extent, the full death toll, is to know that this is only the beginning of the conflict. Prime Minister Netanyahu vowing this will be a long war.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: Salma, thank you very much for that.

Now, President Biden, in the face of all - the face of this, is also now looking at tough questions today about Israel's commitment to protecting civilian life and the enduring support of one of the United States' closest allies. Biden and senior U.S. officials, CNN has new reporting, are reiterating that Israel is trying to limit any loss of civilian life in Gaza, but the rapidly mounting death toll in Gaza is making this all the more challenging.

[09:10:00]

U.S. Secretary of State Tony Blinken, he's returning to Israel this week as the administration continues to stress to Israeli officials that protecting civilians is a paramount priority in all of this.

CNN's Priscilla Alvarez is joining us from the White House with more on this.

Priscilla, what are you hearing about this from behind the scenes? What's the questions and what's the conversation at the White House right now?

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Kate, U.S. officials are keenly aware that they are facing tough questions here and they're also walking a tight rope. They are maintaining that Israel plans to contain or that they are at least communicating to Israel to contain casualties, to protect innocent civilians, but they are also grappling with the images of destruction in Gaza, especially after what occurred yesterday at that refugee camp, which really vividly captured the tight rope that administration officials are walking here.

Now, U.S. officials are concerned. And those concerns have prompted them to ratchet up pressure on Israel to, again, contain -- contain casualties and protect those innocent civilians. And it goes all the way up to President Biden, who relayed concerns in his call with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu over the weekend. Again, telling him he has the right to defend Israel, but that the rules of war need to be followed and that they need to protect innocent civilians at all costs.

But, again, when we hear from U.S. Officials publicly oftentimes there is that expression of empathy, but there is also an underscoring of allowing Israel to defend itself.

And take a listen to what National Security Council Spokesman John Kirby had to say about that yesterday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KIRBY, NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL SPOKESMAN: Unlike Russia and Ukraine, and unlike what Hamas did on the 7th of October, the killing of civilians is not a war aim of Israel. I'm not denying that it's happening. Of course it is.

What I can tell you is that we have indications that they are trying. I'm not predicting that any -- on any given day they aren't going to fail to meet their own expectations about killing civilians. Sadly, our own experience as a military over the last 20 years has shown us that even with our best intentions and all the efforts that we put in to avoiding civilian casualties we still cause them. And it's tragic each and every time.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ALVAREZ: Now, aides to the president believe that these warnings are delivered more effectively in private, but we are hearing more of that publicly and privately. And, of course, the other reality here is that there are riffs within the own president's party about what is the support for Israel. And so all of that weighing on the White House as it also faces these difficult questions.

BOLDUAN: Priscilla, at the White House for us, thank you.

John.

BERMAN: All right, with us now is Mark Regev, senior advisor to Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Ambassador, thank you so much for being with us.

Since the air strike on the Jabalya refugee camp that you say was targeting a key Hamas leader, Bolivia has cut diplomatic ties with Israel. Chile and Colombia have recalled their ambassadors as a result of this air strike. What's your reaction to that?

MARK REGEV, SENIOR ADVISER TO ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER BENJAMIN NETANYAHU: We took out a key Hamas commander who was involved in the butchery that we experienced on October 7th. He was a commander of the forces that raped, that burned people alive, that massacred the young people who were at the music concert in a ravine, in a -- with machine guns. He was part of an operation where parents were murdered in front of their children and conversely, children were murdered in front of their parents. People were beheaded.

This man is also responsible for the bringing back of the -- of a 240 Israeli hostages who were kidnapped and taken to Gaza. He was a worthy target and I'm glad that we have reached him and taken him out.

BERMAN: How do you explain the world reaction to the fact that three weeks ago Hamas terrorists killed 1,400 people inside Israel, they're holding, as you just said, 240 hostages, you estimate by your count. Even with all that, these countries are cutting diplomatic ties with you. How do you explain that?

REGEV: Well, I don't have to explain their decisions. They have to explain them. But I, frankly, just don't understand what such could be based on. It's irrational.

Here is a democratic country that was brutally attacked by terrorists who behaved like -- to use the words of the German chancellor -- who behaved like Nazis, they butchered, they massacred, they raped, they beheaded, they burned people alive. We are fighting back against this group of terrorists, cut-throats, and so where -- they broke off relations with us.

[09:15:00]

And for people who care about the Palestinians, I know that there are many people across the international community who sincerely care about the fate of the Palestinians, they have to ask, what has Hamas done for the Palestinians? It said no to any peace with Israel, no to negotiations. An extremist, militant, totally inflexible approach that says my country must be destroyed and every Israeli is a legitimate target for murder.

But more than that, what have they done for the people of Gaza? They've been in power for 16 years they've been running the Gaza Strip. They've brought pain, they've brought suffering and they've brought impoverishment to the people of Gaza. When this is over and we've defeated Hamas, and we will, it will be better for the people of southern Israel, of course, who won't have to live next to this terror enclave, next to Hamas and its violence and its brutality, but ultimately it will also be better for the people of Gaza who deserve better than this terrible terrorist regime, this ISIS on steroids regime. They deserve better, too.

BERMAN: Do you have an estimate for how many civilians were killed in Jabalya in this air strike?

REGEV: I don't yet, but I've seen the video and I've seen the video that you've shown the viewers on CNN and I see a lot of men of military age. Most of the civilians we understand heeded our advice and evacuated the camp. And that was a -- the facility we struck was not just a commander there, there wasn't just a senior commander there, but there was also other many, many Hamas operatives. And if we got them, that's good.

We don't target civilians. We target Hamas's military machine. We target Hamas's command and control.

The Hamas control, Ministry of Health, is saying that we killed civilians, I'm sorry. It's possible they were caught up in the crossfire. But the way that they tell their story, and, of course, once again, the Hamas-controlled ministry of health, it's only civilians that we've killed, that's obviously ridiculous. That's not factual.

BERMAN: There have been pictures that have been released of children carrying children from that. And we see images of body bags here. Are you suggesting that all of these body bags we're looking at are Hamas terrorists?

REGEV: We know - no. We know that there was an underground bunker there, right? And Hamas, of course, doesn't work according to a building code where they worry about civilian structures. It's possible that when we hit, right -- that when we hit the underground headquarters of Hamas, that caused -- because it's the underground tunnels, it caused other structures to fall, right? We don't want to see collateral damage. We do our best to avoid collateral damage. It's possible it happened and I'm very sorry. And sincerely we don't want to see civilian casualties. We don't want to see children (INAUDIBLE) -

BERMAN: Ambassador -

REGEV: Caught up in the crossfire between us and the Hamas fighters. But, you know, this can finish tomorrow. This whole conflict can be over tomorrow if - if Hamas throws down its weapons, agrees to disarm and returns all the hostages. Then all the fighting is over then. Then and there. The only reason we're fighting now is because Hamas brutally attacked, invaded Israel and butchered our people.

BERMAN: Ambassador --

REGEV: And we're saying we won't stand for it anymore. We won't live next to this terror enclave. And as long as Hamas remains a brutal threat, we will fight it. But this could end tomorrow. Hamas just has to disarm and give back -- free all the hostages. A simple solution.

BERMAN: Ambassador, there are, for the first time, people leaving Gaza through the Rafah crossing. We've seen pictures of it over the last several hours. I'm wondering what Israel's role has been in this. And we are hearing just a few minutes ago that one of the things that complicated negotiations up until this point was that Hamas wanted a guarantee that it would be able to get some of its injured fighters out of Gaza. What can you tell us about that?

REGEV: So, I can tell you straightaway, this issue was discussed already at the very beginning of the conflict. That's more than two weeks ago. I remember it came up in discussions when Secretary Blinken was here on his first trip. So that's maybe 20 days ago, something like that. And we already agreed then to the exit of all the foreign passport holders, American passport holders, other passport holders. We've got no reason to keep any civilians in the Gaza Strip. It was Hamas that up until now has said no to that. It was Hamas that sort of kept them there, not as -- like the Israeli hostages who are in dungeons but refused to allow these people to leave.

I think if Hamas has allowed them to leave today, and only some of them I understand, it's because they're under pressure. And we're going to keep ratcheting up that pressure until Hamas releases everyone who wants to leave Gaza and releases all our hostages of course.

And we will continue hitting them hard. We will destroy their military machine and we will end their political control over Gaza. As I said a moment ago, that's not just good for Israel, that's good for the Gazans, too.

BERMAN: Ambassador Mark Regev, we do appreciate your time. Thank you so much for being with us.

REGEV: My pleasure. Thank you for having me.

[09:20:01]

BERMAN: Kate.

BOLDUAN: Coming up for us, Donald Trump Jr. getting ready to take the stand today in the civil fraud trial in New York against him, his father and their family business. More on this big day in court ahead.

Plus, House Speaker Mike Johnson facing a real fight already, trying to move forward with a limited funding bill, only really for Israel, despite knowing that Senate Republicans think it's the wrong move. Johnson now getting ready to meet for the first time with all Senate Republicans during their weekly lunch today. What's going to happen there?

And we are keeping a watch on the Rafah crossing in Gaza, as John was just discussing with Mark Regev, as the first foreign nationals are now being allowed to leave for the first time since Hamas attacked Israel.

We'll be back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BOLDUAN: A big day in court for the Trump family today. Donald Trump Jr. expected to testify in the New York civil fraud trial against him, his father, his family and the Trump family business.

[09:25:06]

He will be the first of Trump's children to take the stand in the coming days. Don Jr. is named along with Eric Trump as a defendant in the $250 million lawsuit.

Let's get over to CNN's Kara Scannell. She's outside the courthouse in New York.

Kara, what are you expecting from Don Jr. today?

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So, Kate, as you say, Don Jr. is going to be the first of Trump's three eldest children to testify in the civil fraud case. And he is expected to take the stand we think a little bit later this afternoon. There are still two witnesses that the attorney general's office are going to question before they get to him. But he is someone that they say was intimately involved in this alleged fraud. They say that he signed the financial statements that the judge has already found to be fraudulent and that he signed certifications to banks every year indicating that his father, former President Donald Trump's net worth was at least $2.5 billion. The attorney general's office say that that also was not accurate.

So, Donald Trump Jr. has already sat for a deposition. He did that last year. So, we have a sense of what he may testify to today. And then he said that he had no role in the financial statements. Here's exactly what he said, "I had no real involvement in the preparation of the statement of financial condition and don't really remember ever working on it with anyone." He also testified that he never reviewed it, he never approved it. And he said if there's an allegation that someone had taken from a conversation he had with them, something that went toward a valuation of one of the properties, he said that was inadvertent and he was not aware that it was used that way.

And he also testified that when he signed those bank certifications he did so after they were reviewed by accountants and lawyers. So, Donald Trump Jr. here expected to distance himself from any involvement in the financial statements. His testimony is expected to last a couple of hours. He will then be followed by his brother, Eric Trump, who has come up a lot more in the testimony so far now in the fifth week of this trial. That -- his testimony is expected to begin tomorrow and could continue into Friday. And then on Monday, former President Donald Trump is expected to testify. His daughter, Ivanka Trump, to take the stand on Wednesday.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: All right, Kara, let's see what -- how it all starts off today. Thank you.

John.

BERMAN: All right, with us now, former Manhattan prosecutor Jeremy Saland.

Jeremy, counselor, thank you for being with us.

I think we haven't asked this yet. What do the Trump children -- what's at stake for them? What do they have to lose here?

JEREMY SALAND, FORMER MANHATTAN PROSECUTOR: Well, they have to lose really the same thing that Donald has to lose, which is the ability to work in New York, the ability to get those loans, the ability to operate those New York businesses. And that name and that brand is not just Donald Trump, there's a next generation, too, which is these three folks.

BERMAN: What's - so, a lot's at stake for them.

SALAND: Absolutely.

BERMAN: Including perhaps their future livelihood.

What's at stake for Donald Trump in the testimony of his children?

SALAND: Well, I think you have to look at all of his children under one theme here. And really even Donald himself, or the former president, pardon me, is, they admit what they can't deny and deny what they can't admit. If you sign something on a piece of paper certifying, you know, under -- whether it's under penalty of perjury or not, this is what I did and this is accurate, you have to admit that you did that. So, that's the admission. But the denial is, I didn't know. I was relying on somebody else. It's not my fault. That's going to be the theme. I was not as immersed intimately as the attorney general says.

BERMAN: How effective is that going to be for Eric and Donald Trump Jr., one who's a trustee, another who basically runs a big part of the company, to say, yes, I didn't really understand. I didn't know this.

SALAND: When you're an executive vice president and you're a fiduciary, it's very hard to say, I did not know and I was not aware. Though that being said, you know, Michael Cohen doesn't say, these three young - well, they're not young -- Donald Trump's kids were -- had their hands on this as intimately as he did. But nonetheless, it's very difficult to say and it's more difficult when you have a judge, as opposed to a jury, who's going to see through some of it.

BERMAN: I want to put up on the screen so we can both see this, a social media post that Donald Trump made last night. I can't read that. It says -- it says, "this rigged trial brought by the racist New York state AG Letitia James before Trump and developer hating judge Arthur Engoron, which should have never been brought in that so-called star witness" - I can't even -- it's not even English, coherent here, but he says a lot of mean things about a lot of people, including the attorney general, the judge, Michael Cohen, who's a witness here. And then he goes on to talk about other aspects of this trial.

How close to the line or how far over the line does this get for Trump? SALAND: I think it got over the line so many times and it's going so

far well beyond. It's appalling. It's putrid. It's ugly. It's disgusting. We could find so many words to describe this. It - you know, you can fight your fight, and you should fight your fight. And -- whether it's a criminal case or a civil case, they have the burden on the other side. But this is not how you do it.

BERMAN: More sanctions coming his way? More fines?

SALAND: Very well could be and that's only him to blame.

BERMAN: OK, he knows this then. Is there a strategy, is there a reason he's doing this, even though he knows he's going to get fined?

SALAND: Well, what's a fine, $5,000, $10,000.

[09:29:59]

If you're purportedly worth billions of dollars, even hundreds of millions if not true, what's that dollars when you're going to get your riled base up to say, look at him, he's standing up for us.