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Any Moment, Ivanka Trump Testifies at Father's Civil Fraud Trial; Big State Wins for Democrats Even as Polls Show Biden Behind Trump; Tonight, Five GOP Presidential Hopefuls Debate in Miami Without Trump. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired November 08, 2023 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Ivanka Trump in court and about to be under oath. Donald Trump's daughter is the final witness for the New York Attorney General's civil fraud trial against the Trump Organization.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: One message from last night's election, the country is still deeply divided politically, of course, but voters did speak with one voice on one issue at least, abortion rights. The votes, the data, the lessons for Democrats and Republicans as we charge into 2024.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: America's top diplomat escalates his opposition to a ceasefire in Gaza, and now Secretary of State Blinken says there may need to be, quote, a transition period in Gaza at the end of the Israeli-Hamas conflict.

I'm Sarah Sidner with John Berman and Kate Bolduan. This is CNN News Central.

BERMAN: All right. Just a few moments ago, Ivanka Trump arrived at the courthouse. Very soon, she will be in the courtroom to testify in the $250 million civil fraud trial against her father, her brothers, and the family business.

She will face questions about her role in said business and the alleged scheme to inflate their net worth. There she is right now, Ivanka Trump walking through the hallway, heading into the courtroom. Let's see if she says anything.

All right, decidedly avoiding any comment, unlike her father, we should note, as she headed into the courtroom to testify. She will be under oath in just seconds.

We do want to note Ivanka Trump is not a defendant in this case, but as the final witness for the state, clearly someone that the state attorneys want to get information from.

Let's get right to CNN's Paula Reid. Paula, this testimony about to begin, discuss the significance. PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, this is the last witness for the prosecution. And while she is no longer a defendant in this case, she has tried many different times in many different ways to not have to make this appearance today.

Most recently, she argued that it would be a hardship for her to testify during the week because her children are in school. And not, surprisingly, the court rejected that and, of course, we just saw her arrive at court today.

Now, there will not be cameras inside the courtroom during her testimony, but we have our colleagues, reporters inside the court giving us updates. Questioning has not gotten underway.

But before the proceedings started today, the attorney general of New York, Letitia James, addressed the press. Let's take a listen to what she said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LETITIA JAMES, NEW YORK ATTORNEY GENERAL: We uncovered the scheme, and she benefited from it personally. And Ms. Trump will do all that she can to try to separate herself from this corporation, but she's inextricably tied to the Trump Organization and to these properties that she helped secure financing for. So, you cannot hide from the truth, and the facts will belie the truth and the evidence.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

REID: And, John, we just got a live update. Ivanka Trump is now on the stand.

I will note about Letitia James' comments there. It is unusual for an attorney general, for a prosecutor overseeing a case to come out and preemptively comment on testimony from witnesses. She did that last week before former President Trump testified as well, she also live- tweeted her reaction over the course of the day. That is unusual.

But here, we expect that people from the attorney general's office, the prosecutors, will be asking Ivanka specific questions about her role in securing financing for certain properties as well as her role in evaluation and reporting how much certain assets are worth.

Now, in her previous deposition in this case, she tried to distance herself from that process. Her brothers, her father have all done the same thing.

What I also think we'll see here today is likely a pretty disciplined witness. I mean, this is not someone that I expect will set the proceedings into chaos like we saw earlier this week with former President Trump or her two brothers, who at times had pretty testy exchanges while on the stand.

But, again, the questioning just getting underway. And while there are not cameras, we have live updates, and we'll bring you any developments as they occur. BERMAN: It was interesting to hear from the attorney general, Paula, not just commenting, as you said, which is unusual, but also suggesting that Ivanka Trump had ties to, if not, culpability to what happened inside the family business, even though she's no longer a defendant.

[10:05:14]

REID: Sure. So, she's no longer a defendant in this case. She was at one time. But she did work for the Trump Organization. And that's the time period that they're really going to focus on, her role in securing financing for specific properties, projects that she worked on, as well as specifically, I think they're probably going to focus on the Washington, D.C. project, the old post office, because she was heavily involved in that.

So, even though she is no longer a co-defendant, her two brothers, her two older brothers, and the former president, they are all co- defendants in this case. They've already been found liable by the judge for fraud. She's no longer a defendant, but she is a key witness. She is someone who could have potentially very helpful information for the judge who is now focused more on the penalty phase and what the penalties will be for this fraud.

BERMAN: All right. Paula Reid, standby for us. Ivanka Trump on the stand, now begins the process where we will get regular updates about the exact nature of the testimony and what she's saying. So, we'll be talking to you again very soon. Kate, Sara?

BOLDUAN: Joining us now for more on this, CNN Legal Analyst and former Federal Prosecutor Elliot Williams. It's good to see you, Elliot.

So, you say that claiming -- Ivanka is on the stand and you say that her claiming ignorance, to kind of sum it up, claiming ignorance is not going to fly with her testimony today. Why is that?

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Right. I think, Kate, she has a very delicate needle to thread here because, as Paula had noted, she's not a defendant in the case and also was not as involved in the day- to-day management of the Trump Organization, as her two brothers were, but still carries the name, Ivanka Trump, and would have certainly been familiar with the operations of the Trump Organization, certainly benefited in some ways in terms of financing and personal finances and so on.

So, the question is, how does she demonstrate that, number one, I wasn't there day-to-day and I'm not familiar with the particulars, but credibly, I can still comment fairly about what I knew about the organization. And I think the judge who sort of doesn't really have patience with the defendants in this case isn't really going to stomach a witness who doesn't appear to be credible on that point.

SIDNER: She's the fourth member of the Trump family to have to testify in this case. What exactly are they looking for from her? Is it something that they're getting out that's very specific to something she did or an overall look?

WILLIAMS: Right. So, I don't think the case is going to rise and fall on the success of Ivanka Trump's testimony just because of the big and explosive testimony that came from Donald Trump and both of his sons.

Now, again, getting back to what Paula had said earlier, there's a few properties that she would have been involved in the financing for, number one, Doral Country Club outside of Miami, and the old post office building, which, as many people know, became the Trump hotel in Washington, D.C. And she may have information about those two things.

The other question looming overhead, and this was a little bit muddy with her father and brothers' testimony, is did accountants or members of the Trump family or others ultimately signed off on the statements of financial conditions, the balance sheets there?

Now, the Trump sons sort of said, no, no, no, this was all accountants and we didn't really have much to do with this. Their father was a little bit more ambiguous about it. So, I would think the prosecutors today would sort of push her and ask questions about that, what, who actually made the calls as to what the financing was for any of these properties.

BOLDUAN: And, Elliot, she's not a co-defendant in this case, as we've said, so how could that, should that, will that change what she does on the stand or how the assistant state attorney approaches her in questioning?

WILLIAMS: You know, I really don't think so solely on account of the fact that this is a civil case and the rules are much looser for what you can do and say to a defendant. If this were a criminal trial, they couldn't even -- prosecutors couldn't even put her on the stand. The Constitution says that prosecutors can't force somebody to testify against them self.

In a civil case, the defendants can act as witnesses, too, as you saw with both Trump brothers and the former president.

So, I think, you know, it's largely the same type of questioning that they'd send her way, and I think her answers ought to be the same as they would if she were a defendant, which is just answer the questions you're asked, don't veer off script. That can be very hard to do. But for any witness, the important thing to do is just, you know, stick to a straight narrative and not get tripped up by prosecutors, which can be very hard.

BOLDUAN: It's good to see you, Elliot. Thank you.

WILLIAMS: Thanks, both.

BOLDUAN: John?

BERMAN: All right, this morning, Democrats are celebrating. They're celebrating victories in Kentucky, where the incumbent Democratic governor, Andy Beshear, won re-election by a margin of about five points in a state that Donald Trump won by an enormous margin in 2020. [10:10:04]

He won by nearly 26 points. Democrats very happy about that.

Democrats also celebrating what happened in the state of Ohio where an abortion rights measure, a measure to enshrine abortion rights into the Constitution won by about 13 points. Again, that's in a state that Donald Trump won by about eight points. So, they look at that as a swing.

Democrats also very happy about what took place in Virginia. And just like Ohio, abortion rights played a major issue there.

Now, every seat in the state legislature, the General Assembly, was up for grabs last night. And in the state Senate, Democrats maintained control of the state Senate. And in the House of Delegates, the lower chamber, Democrats retook it. They flipped it.

And now they control both chambers in the General Assembly in the commonwealth of Virginia, which is the exact opposite of what the Republican governor, Glenn Youngkin, wanted. He wanted the trifecta. He wanted the governor's mansion and control of both chambers to push through his agenda. He is getting the opposite. Again, abortion rights front and center.

Let's get right to Richmond. CNN's Jessica Dean is there. Jessica, what are you hearing this morning?

JESSICA DEAN, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, good morning to you, John. You have Democrats here in Virginia absolutely thrilled over the moon with how it went for them last night. Governor Glenn Youngkin had spent the last several weeks on a bus tour canvassing the state, doing everything he could to convince voters that while he may not be on the ballot, that if they would just give him full Republican control, he could push further with his agenda. And as you mentioned, part of that was a 15-week ban on abortion with exceptions for rape, incest and the life of the mother.

Now, he talked about a lot of other issues when he was up on the stump. Democrats really made abortion a central issue in all of their elections across this commonwealth. And that, as you mentioned, was an issue that was a big winner for Democrats both here in Virginia and across the country last night.

And so now we will see the Senate will stay Democratic, the House flipping. That means that Governor Youngkin will have a very hard time pushing forward any of his agenda that Democrats do not agree with or do not want to see turned into Virginia state law.

And, John, the question, too, is what does this mean for Governor Glenn Youngkin. He is such a rising star in the Republican Party and there were so many eyes on him last night. Could his particular brand of Republican politics be where that party might be headed in a post- MAGA world? Could a post-MAGA world exist that's conservative but not full-MAGA? But last night, voters rejecting that and citing with Democrats here in Virginia.

BERMAN: Jessica, if I can, if I can ask one question about Ohio, I'm going to pull that back up on the map here so people can see what happened there in this contest. This was a contest to enshrine abortion rights into the Constitution. And you can see it won by a large margin. And if you look at the counties that Donald Trump won in 2020, all the green counties here are ones that he won but also voted for abortion rights. So, what are you hearing from Democrats about the signs they're taking from this?

Democrats still believe, they believed this last night and they believe they were proven right, that abortion is still a big issue for them, that it is going to drive turnout that benefits them. And you just laid out essentially why they think that.

If you look at these counties that Donald Trump won that were voting in favor of enshrining abortion rights in the Ohio Constitution, that's what they believe.

And Ohio was just the latest example of a number of states that have put this on the ballot over the last year-and-a-half, two years since Roe v. Wade was overturned and seen success that abortion rights activists have seen success with this.

So, Democrats believe that this is a good, solid message for them as they head into 2024. John?

BERMAN: All right. Jessica Dean, great to have you, thank you very much. Sara?

SIDNER: John, you're getting really good with that wall. I'm just going to start calling you the wall master. I think that's -- you've taken over. John King, watch out. Thank you, Jessica. Very nice, John, very, very nice.

All right, tonight, five Republican presidential hopefuls will try to make a dent in Donald Trump's huge primary lead. What we know about their strategies for tonight's debate as Trump rallies supporters nearby.

Plus, thousands of people in northern Gaza try to walk to safety in the South after Israel gave them a deadline to get out. That deadline now over. What happens now that that window has closed?

Also, when doctors needed to keep a man alive long enough to give him a life saving double lung transplant, they used breast implants to save his life. More on that innovative solution, that is ahead.

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BERMAN: All right. It happens tonight, five Republican presidential hopefuls take the stage in Miami for the third Republican presidential debate. With us now is former governor of Wisconsin, Republican Scott Walker, also a former presidential candidate himself. Governor, it's good to have you.

We had you on around the first two debates, so it's great to have you on for the third. Who needs it most tonight?

FMR. GOV. SCOTT WALKER (R-WI): I think it's between Nikki Haley and Ron DeSantis. I think for all the rest, it's largely over and it may be for the two of them as well. But one of them has to have a breakout moment particularly as you look ahead and saying those early states, in the state like Iowa, where Nikki Haley has crept up on DeSantis, essentially the last Des Moines Register poll.

[10:20:05]

You see a tie between the two of them, still way behind President Trump at 43 percent. But if she were to elevate herself even more in tonight's debate then I think she can lay claim to being the alternative to President Donald Trump, but even saying that it's still a long ways off not only in the national polls but particularly in key states like Iowa.

BERMAN: All right. Let's talk about Nikki Haley a little bit more because her campaign put out a video in advance of this debate and it was a little bit notable. It basically said it was going to go after Ron DeSantis as a liar, and I think we can put this up on the screen up here, at the next debate. Expect Governor Ron DeSantis to lie about his record again. That was a dramatic reading of what was up on the screen. It also said, these boots are made for lying, the video did, which is a dig at the footwear that Ron DeSantis wears. What do you read into this message from Governor Haley's campaign?

WALKER: Well, I think, clearly, she's going to you know be a bit of the alpha dog, and that's their projection for tonight's debate, is that she needs to rise above the rest. She needs to say, hey, all these others don't matter, I'm the one alternative to President Trump. That may be effective for tonight's debate. That may continue to elevate her.

I still think beyond that, she's got to make the case to the primary and caucus voters that the guy that they like, the guy they're familiar with, that being president, former President Donald Trump, somehow she's a better alternative to that.

Up until now, one of the arguments people thought that they would make would be electability. But in this latest poll we just saw a few days ago, we're in a head-to-head between Trump and Biden. Former President Trump ends up slightly ahead in all but one of those six key battleground states. I think that makes it even tougher for her and anybody else on that field to say we're the better alternative.

Yes, she's the more electable in polls but I don't think it shows that she -- it doesn't show that he can't be elected at least today.

BERMAN: Right. The poll is very clear, actually, that she is more electable in that poll. She leads Joe Biden by more than Donald Trump.

We'll get back to Trump in just a minute. I want to cover Ron DeSantis because you said he's got a lot at stake tonight, too. He woke up -- if you read the Financial Times this morning, like I do, so many mornings, there was a quote in the Financial Times from Robert Bigelow, who's a huge Republican donor, donated $20 million to the DeSantis super PAC.

And Bigelow is basically saying he's considering throwing his support to Donald Trump. He said, quote, I think Trump is too strong. I think Trump has the momentum, the inertia to beat him. Trump was a bull, Bigelow added, but DeSantis was dinner. I'm not really sure what that means, but he's talking about Trump. If he's going to be in the gutter and you want to beat him, you better be willing and ready to go in the gutter too, said Bigelow. You better be able to kill, and that's not who Ron is.

If you're Ron DeSantis waking up to the news that one of your biggest donors is considering, you know, forsaking you, how do you feel?

WALKER: Well, I think it's a big blow. I think early on, in the sense that he was kind of presumed, presumptive alternative to Donald Trump. He's putting all his stock into the state of Iowa. Certainly, Governor Kim Reynolds' endorsement will help. But I think in the end, in these early states, Iowa and I would throw in New Hampshire.

These voters take the election very seriously. They like to hear from the candidates multiple times. They want to know about plausibility. And if he doesn't have the finances, that was one of his advantages early on was having the money, that's largely starting to dry up.

I think you're going to see momentum if Nikki Haley has a big night. On the flip side, he could have a dramatic night and that might revive his efforts. But in the end, I keep going back to this, it's still Donald Trump's to lose.

BERMAN: Let me leave you with this poll number, get your reaction to it, too, because inside those series of polls that were very bad for Joe Biden, again, trailing Donald Trump and all the Republican candidates by a significant margin, it asked the question The New York Times did, how do you feel? How would you vote differently if Donald Trump were convicted in the federal election trial, which is the one that takes place in March? He leads -- Trump leads Biden by three right now, but if convicted, Biden leads by nine. How much do you think that message might play in the debate tonight?

WALKER: Well, that's, again, one of the wedges. One of the things I hear when I'm out across the country talking to folks at the work I do at Young America's Foundation, talked to a lot of conservative activists as well as students across the nation. And one of the big warnings, one of the big red flags is they love what Donald Trump did, many of them overwhelmingly behind the former president, they are concerned about these legal issues. On one hand it fires them up because they think a lot of these are politically motivated, but there is a growing concern as to what would happen, not just in the federal indictment, but what might happen in Georgia. And so I think, to a certain extent, there might be some of that with some of these other candidates waiting to see if there's an opportunity. Assuming that doesn't change though, again, I still think it's Donald Trump's to lose right now. And in a head-to-head, particularly where people know, unlike last night's results, the money isn't a factor.

[10:25:03]

It was a factor in the big races across the country, Joe Biden, Donald Trump head-to-head. The money is not the factor. It's what do you think of each of them? And right now there's a lot of people upset with Joe Biden and rightfully so.

BERMAN: Governor Scott Walker, great to have you on for this third debate. I look forward to speaking to you at the fourth, I guess if there is one. Kate?

BOLDUAN: It's great to hear from him.

Coming up for us, the IDF opened an evacuation corridor for civilians to get out of Northern Gaza. People seen walking and waving white flags as they went.

The secretary of state speaking out from Tokyo about a transition period in Gaza after Hamas is gone. John Kirby from the White House joins us next.

Plus, now that the voters have spoken in several states on several important issues, why one Democrat says this election shows it's about the issues, not about the people carrying the message, and what they hope that means for 2024.

We'll be back.

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