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Climate Summit Chief: "No Science" In Ending Fossil Fuels; "Urban Surfers" Make A Living Sorting Recyclables; Ex-U.S. Ambassador Charged With Spying For Cuba; NCAA Leaders Urge Congress To Set Student Athlete Profit Standards. Aired 2:30-3p ET
Aired December 04, 2023 - 14:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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[14:32:09]
BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: The leader of the world's biggest and most high-profile climate conference was heard undermining climate science just as the event was getting underway.
Sultan Al Jaber is the president of the COP28 climate summit and, today, he defended his commitment to science, responding to a comment he made in November that came to light yesterday.
Jaber told the panel that there was, quote, "no science out there or no scenario out there that says that the phasing out fossil fuels will achieve 1.5 degrees."
He was referring to a temperature threshold aimed at curbing global warming.
Today, at COP28, Jaber said that his comments are being misrepresented. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SULTAN AHMED AL JABER, COP28 PRESIDENT: We did not, in anyway, underestimate or undermine the task at hand. We understand fully the urgency. And we understand the responsibility that we have taken on board.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: As the world faces a warming planet, some hard-hit communities are benefiting from the need to go green.
CNN's David McKenzie tells us about the "urban surfers" taking recycling to a new level.
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DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Lamoki Mokoka (ph) and his cart are on the move. His job goes by many names here, reclaimer, hustler, even urban surfer.
It's dangerous work in a dangerous city. There are thousands like Mokoka (ph) fanning out well before dawn.
After an hour on the road, he's in the neighborhood south of the city.
LAMOKI MOKOKA (ph), SOUTH AFRICAN URBAN SURFER: I'm looking for the plastic.
MCKENZIE: "I'm looking for the plastics, cardboard boxes, metals and cans," he said.
MOKOKA (ph): Metal.
MCKENZIE (on camera): And it's a dirty job, do you mind?
MOKOKA (ph): I don't mind.
MCKENZIE (voice-over): What they discard, he recycles, earning about $150 a month. It's steadier than his old construction job, and Mokoka (ph) likes being his own boss.
"There aren't any jobs here," he says. "So we've made our own work."
Making their own work with the scale and impact that's hard to overstate. Just look at the sorting zone near Joburg (ph), where thousands live. It's informal, but hardly simple. Everything is carefully separated. Everything has value.
(on camera): Towards the top of the pecking order are cans. Now, a bag of these will get reclaimers almost $40 U.S. As they say, one man's trash is another man's treasure.
"I'm always surprised how rich people throw away so much rubbish," says (INAUDIBLE). "But I'm happy they do."
(voice-over): This collection took him weeks.
[14:35:00]
"I don't know much about climate change," he says. "Of course, I'm glad that we can help. But what matters is to survive."
Today's payday. And every bag is carefully weighed.
"There's always trust amongst us," says middleman, Motsama (ph). Though, he seems a little skeptical.
"I have to double check they didn't put any water in the bottles to make them heavier," he says. "It must just be the plastic bottles."
What reclaimers don't find end up in a nearby landfall. Even here, the desperate salvage what they can.
Back in the neighborhoods, Mokoka (ph) is in a race against the dump trucks.
MOKOKA (ph): Done. We're done. Done, done.
MCKENZIE (on camera): Are you done?
MOKOKA (ph): Just in time.
MCKENSIE (voice-over): Today, they arrive a bit late.
MOKOKA (ph): I have more stuff today. More stuff.
(LAUGHTER)
MCKENZIE (on camera): More stuff?
MOKOKA (ph): More stuff than other days.
MCKENZIE (voice-over): Mokoka (ph) is proud of his work, proud of his effort.
MOKOKA (ph): Yes, I feel so happy.
MCKENZIE: "I feel so happy. I feel so happy," he says. "Because I'm going to put bread on the table."
David McKenzie, CNN, Johannesburg, South Africa.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: Thanks to David for that piece.
When we come back, a former U.S. ambassador accused of spying for the Cuban government for four decades. We will speak to a former FBI counterintelligence officer known for tracking down spies in the United States. See you in a few minutes.
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[14:40:52]
SANCHEZ: We have an update for you now on last week's deadly Air Force crash that occurred off the coast of a Japanese island. Today, the remains of five U.S. airmen were found during a combined U.S./Japan search-and-rescue dive.
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Air Force Special Operations Command says their identities have yet to be returned. Previously, the remains of a 24-year-old staff sergeant were recovered.
These are airmen that were aboard the Osprey that track crashed during a routine training flight on November 29th. The cause of the crash is under investigation.
Now to a developing story we are following. A former U.S. ambassador accused of spying for Cuba for four decades.
SANCHEZ: Yes. Attorney General Merrick Garland says the case against Manuel Rocha exposes one of the highest-reaching and longest-lasting infiltrations of the U.S. government by a foreign agent.
Here he is.
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MERRICK GARLAND, ATTORNEY GENERAL: As detailed in the complaint, Rocha repeatedly referred to the United States as, quote, "the enemy." During the undercover, he told the undercover that his efforts to infiltrate the United States were, quote, "meticulous" and, quote, "very disciplined."
And he repeatedly bragged about the significance of his efforts, saying that, quote, "What has been done has strengthened the revolution immensely."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: CNN's Evan Perez is here with more details.
Evan, Rocha appearing in federal court in Miami. What are we anticipating?
EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: This hearing just wrapped up in Miami a few moments ago. And prosecutors asked for his detention pending trial, sol to keep him in jail until trial.
His attorney is asking for bond to be set. And they will have another hearing later this week.
But one of the interesting things that the prosecutors said in the hearing is that they anticipate bringing additional charges against Rocha.
And look, the facts, as laid out by prosecutors, they say they are backed up by recordings that he made with an undercover agent. The FBI coming onto him, essentially getting tipped off in 2022 that Rocha had been acting as an agent of the Cuban government since at least 1981.
In one of the recordings, there is even a reference to perhaps going back to 1973 when he lived in Chile.
But during this time, obviously, according to prosecutors, he was working in various capacities in the U.S. government including working at the Cuban embassy at the U.S. intersection, which was the then, de facto, embassy of the United States in 1986.
At the time, you remember, Boris, I'm sure, from the -- when the shoot down on the unarmed planes belonging to Brother to the Rescue happened off the coast of Cuba in international waters. Four people were killed.
He was essentially one of the top diplomats of the United States in Havana.
According to prosecutors, here's what he said in a number of meetings with his undercover agent. I will read just a part of what they are saying.
He said here, "I want to tell you, I want you to tell my compatriots that I appreciate and I am thankful for this alert."
Again, this is him talking to an undercover agent that he thought was working for the DGI, Cuban intelligence service.
He also said, "My number-one concern and my number-one priority was any action on the part of Washington that would endanger the life of the leadership or the revolution itself."
You heard the attorney general refer to another of his statements where he said, "For me, what has been done has strengthened the revolution."
According to prosecutors, he was doing this, again, over 40 years, while he was serving in Havana, in Bolivia where he was the U.S. ambassador.
But also when he was working in various other diplomatic posts in Argentina and the Dominican Republic and even taking trips to Cuba to meet with the DGI, again, to meet his handlers, according to prosecutors.
KEILAR: Unbelievable.
SANCHEZ: Yes, really fascinating.
[14:45:00]
And he wasn't the only Cuban spy that infiltrated U.S. intelligence in that era. There were many.
Do we know if he was working with them, who were aware of it?
PEREZ: Right. That's one of the biggest questions right now, is how much interaction he had with, for example, some of these others that have come to light, Boris, during the intervening years.
We do not know, at least from these court documents, how integral he was. But clearly, in his remarks about 1986, the shootdown of Brother to the Rescue plane, he clearly believed that he was on the side really of the Cuban government, not on the U.S. government side during that episode.
KEILAR: So clear in his own words.
Evan, thank you so much for the reporting.
Joining us now is former FBI counterintelligence operative, Eric O'Neill. He is now a national security strategist for Carbon Black.
And, Eric, we should mention, you helped take down a U.S. spy before. As you are listening to this and hearing details about the case of 73- year-old Manuel Rocha, tell us how much damage someone like this could have done over the decades.
ERIC O'NEILL, FORMER FBI COUNTERINTELLIGENCE OPERATIVE: Certainly. And it is great to be here with you, Brianna and Boris. Spies can do immense damage. There is no more damage that can be done
than the spy who is on the inside.
And here we have Rocho, who not only worked for the State Department until about 2002 -- from 2006 to 2012, he was an advisor to the U.S. Southern Command, SOCOM, which is responsible for Cuba and their territories.
So he had access to that information that can do incredible amounts of damage.
And he also, because he's been a spy for so long, has the knowledge and the wherewithal to get it into the hands of Cuban intelligence where they could target that information and do immense damage potentially to the United States.
SANCHEZ: And, Eric, it is notable that he was not alone. Evan mentioned one man., There is Kendall. There is also the Cuban Five that were caught in Florida in the late 90s.
It seems like the Cuban intelligence service had some success infiltrating U.S. intelligence. Why is that?
O'NEILL: They do an amazing job. And I have been going back to those cases. I know a lot about the cases. And now, this new Rocha case has really made me take a look.
And it's amazing. Cuba is very capable of recruiting people, U.S. citizens who have access to information, through what we call ideology. So you believe in Cuba, you believe in the revolution, you believe in the struggle, and you're going to help us.
It is less about, like, for example, other spies, who are doing it for money or because they are being blackmailed.
So these idealogues believe in Cuba and so they are helping this small country that thinks very differently than the United States as far as their government in order to help them achieve their goals.
KEILAR: Are you surprised that Rocha fell for this? He gets a message on WhatsApp from someone and he responds to them, not in a particularly secretive way. And ultimately uses some tradecraft before the meeting.
But he seems pretty convinced when this person tells him that they are his new handler and he just goes on to be very open with them.
O'NEILL: Yes, the FBI is very adept at holding what we call a false flag operation. So it's an undercover asset - like when I went undercover to catch Robert Hanson (ph), who was a spy for the Russians for over two decades.
The undercover assets are trained, we're trained to go and gain the person's trust. Here, clearly, just reading between the lines of the complaint, the FBI knew a good deal of information, enough information to hook him to take the meeting with the U.C., the undercover asset. So for this false flag operation, where they pretend that the
undercover FBI agent is part of Cuban intelligence, is meeting with him.
This is another thing I have seen about spies, especially long-career spies. They get into it. They feel like they belong to something bigger than themselves.
And it seems from the conversation that Rocha felt very comfortable being back active and back in that very exciting spy life that perhaps he had gone dormant from. He does mention -- one of the weirdest things he mentions is he created a legend for himself as someone was right-wing so he would not be found.
It seems like he wanted to get back into the game. And the undercover asset is trained to play on that and gain the target's trust.
KEILAR: Yes, he certainly was very proud of himself and that was exploited very clearly, in your point.
Eric O'Neill, so great to have your perspective on this. We appreciate it.
O'NEILL: Thank you so much.
KEILAR: And we will be right back.
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[14:54:21]
SANCHEZ: Commissioners of the NCAA's most powerful conferences are calling on Congress to set national standards on how student athletes can be compensated for use of their name, image or likeness, or NIL.
The Supreme Court a few years ago paved the way for students to get paid but that led to the creation of a passel of state laws governing those profits.
Let's discuss with CNN sports anchor, Coy Wire.
So, Coy, walk us through how the NIL change has impacted college football.
COY WIRE, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: Yes, I will. And after the show, you better promise to call me and apologize for making it a second-best looking ball game at CNN, Boris, buddy.
(LAUGHTER)
[14:55:01]
WIRE: Hey, listen, before this, no collegiate athlete could make money for the name, image or likeness. If you are an artist, you couldn't sell your art, couldn't make money signing autographs, nothing.
But now you have these well-known names like Iowa hoops star, Caitlin Clark.
They are appearing in national commercials, major national brands, like State Farm, Wendy's. And high-profile universities are wooing these star athletes with perceived bigger, better, more lucrative commercial opportunities.
Recently, Nebraska head coach, Matt Rhule, revealed that if you want a top-tier quarterback, for example, that is a big price tag.
Listen to this.
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MATT RHULE, NEBRASKA HEAD FOOTBALL COACH: Make no mistake, a good quarterback in the portal will cost $1 million-$2 million right now. Just wanted us on the same page. Make sure we all understand what is happening. So, you know, there is some that have six or seven million- dollar players playing for them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WIRE: You've had a lot of coaches out there that have said it feels like the Wild West. There's, like, hardly any limit, Boris, on what a school could promise a high school recruit.
Or in the portal, the transfer portal you heard the coach talking about there, where a player now, they can potentially transfer without any penalty. So a school can lure players from other teams.
And if you have more money to offer, then you might be losing your star players to one of those smaller schools.
SANCHEZ: Coy, when I first read the headline, I thought that these commissioners were going to talk about the FSU's stub to Congress. Apparently, that is not that high a priority.
WIRE: Right.
SANCHEZ: Coy Wire, appreciate the praise, by the way.
By the way, tonight, only eight teams remain. Which teams will survive? Coverage of the NBA in-season tournament knockout round begins tonight at 7:00 p.m. Eastern on TNT and Max. Don't miss it.
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