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2024 U.S. Presidential Election; 35 Days Before Caucuses, Iowa Poll Shows Trump Leading GOP by 32 Points; Georgia and Michigan, Two Important Swing States, Led by Trump in CNN Poll; Harvard's President Under Fire for Antisemitic Remarks; Over 600 Faculty Members Sign a Petition Backing the President of Harvard; Following UPenn's Resignation, Pressure Mounts on Harvard President; Following Antisemitism Hearing, University Officials are Under Investigation; In Pentagon Leaker Probe, Air Force Disciplined 15 Individuals. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired December 11, 2023 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:30:00]

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JOHN BERMAN, CNN NEWS CENTRAL CO-ANCHOR: All right. Brand new this morning, a record lead for Donald Trump in Iowa. A poll just released from the Des Moines register shows him at 51 percent among likely caucus goers. No candidate has really ever led by this much before caucus day.

With us now, CNN Senior Political Analyst and anchor John Avlon, a Republican strategist and former Trump campaign advisor David Urban.

And David, I just want to start with you. In Iowa, Trump's commanding lead, and remember, Ron DeSantis, in the last few weeks, has picked up an endorsement from the Iowa governor, Kim Reynolds. She picked up the endorsement of the very powerful evangelical leader, Bob Vander Plaats. So, DeSantis gets this and falls further behind. We have a picture of both of those people we can show you. How do you explain that?

DAVID URBAN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR AND REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST AND FORMER TRUMP CAMPAIGN ADVISER: Sure. Well, listen, Donald Trump's wildly popular in Iowa amongst, you know, the base. It doesn't matter who, you know, the kind of the leadership of the party wants and the leadership of any party in any state. You know, the base voters out in the rank and file and the hustings across America, just still want to see Donald Trump as their nominee. And so, whether it's the governor, or a congressman, or a senator, I think endorsements aren't really helpful at this point to whether it be Nikki Haley, or Ron DeSantis, or even Donald Trump for that matter.

BERMAN: One of the numbers that jumps out at you in this poll, and I think we have this, is that support among first time caucus goers, John. This is people who haven't voted before. This is new voters. This is that fertile territory where you can go in and reach new people who haven't been reached before. Trump is just trouncing DeSantis and Haley among first time caucus goers. So, if you can't get those new voters, and maybe the old voters are cooked for Donald Trump already, what do you --

JOHN AVLON, CNN ANCHOR AND SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Especially when you're making that generational pitch like Ron DeSantis and Nikki Haley have. Look, I think it speaks to Donald Trump's name I.D. The fact that he is a talismanic figure inside the Republican Party. And he's still been able to, sort of, suck up all the oxygen out of the room with a reputation for strength. But it's striking to your point that these new caucus goers, presumably younger, not always. you know, haven't gravitated to the younger candidates making that generational change pitch yet.

[10:35:00]

BERMAN: So, what do you do, David Urban? I mean, you've helped run campaigns before. You're not going to throw it in. There's still a month to go before Iowa. If you are Ron DeSantis and Nikki Haley, what can you do?

URBAN: Yes, John, listen, I think they can. They can be out. If I were running those campaigns, I'd be out in all those different counties. I'd be doing town halls. I'd be shaking hands. Asking for votes. Iowa -- the caucuses are really retail operation. You know, your John -- the other John there will share that with you, right? He's been out there doing it. These people want to meet you. They want to shake hands. I mean, if there is a weakness, Donald Trump's not going to be able to be on the ground in Iowa as much as, you know, Nikki Haley or Ron DeSantis.

And so, if they're looking to make inroads, if there's any opportunity for them, that's where they're going to need to do it. Face to face, asking for folks in diners and in all the counties. Look, Rick Santorum came from behind out of nowhere to win when I was helping him before against Mitt Romney, and that's a possibility here, but a very, very remote possibility.

AVLON: But such an important point to make about that Rick Santorum out of nowhere in 2012. You know, two months out, he'd been in low single digits. I think the fact that the caucuses are unlike other contests. This is about persuasion and persuadables, and there are a lot of persuadables in this poll. That -- you know, there's room for the other candidates to grow and go. And Trump's not going to be doing retail, they will, and they should lean into that.

It's striking though that, you know, so far, the Koch endorsement for Nikki Haley, or the governor and Bob Vander Plaats for Ron DeSantis hasn't translated to that ground game support. But there's still time, because this is unlike any other primaries.

BERMAN: Yes, I mean, you -- I started talking to you over the years. You know, a good ground game, the best ground game ever, can buy you 10, 15, not 30. 30 points, you know, it's --

AVLON: You can't buy love.

BERMAN: -- it's hard for a ground game.

AVLON: Yes.

BERMAN: All right. So, new CNN polls in Georgia and Michigan show Donald Trump building a commanding lead over Joe Biden, a hypothetical general election match-up. These are bad polls for Joe Biden. Be that as it may. There is perhaps what could be a warning sign for Donald Trump here. It gets to do with the federal election charges against Donald Trump, which goes to trial the first week of March. If the charges against Trump regarding efforts to overturn the election are proven true, if he's convicted, will that disqualify him?

Look at that, in Georgia, 47 percent say, yes. In Michigan, 46 percent say, yes. That's pressing 50 percent. That's a potential problem.

AVLON: That's more than a potential problem. That's a potential, you know, Heisman trophy against Donald Trump. And look, you know, those court cases are going to be more in the front of people's minds. Look, these are bad news for Joe Biden. There's an enthusiasm gap that the Biden team needs to confront. But as you point out, that fact that, you know, that these court cases they go forward, that could be a major two by four across Donald Trump.

BERMAN: And, David Urban, yes, it's a hypothetical, but it's not a farfetched hypothetical, given that this is going to trial the first week of March.

URBAN: Yes. Yes, so I don't -- in the Iowa poll, I think it showed that 71 percent of Iowans were unaffected. They -- those polled in Iowa didn't -- said it would have no impact on their vote. Also, John and that CNN poll, which I thought was very interesting, the most interesting thing was of the folks who didn't vote for either Biden or Trump in '20, like overwhelming majority of those -- not an overwhelming majority, like, overwhelming amount, I think like 40 percent said they'd vote for Trump. So, it was a -- it was pretty, pretty staggering.

BERMAN: Well, that's different than the issue of being convicted in the Georgia and Michigan poll --

URBAN: Right, right.

BERMAN: -- which does seem to be an issue.

AVLON: For sure.

URBAN: Absolutely.

AVLON: And the other thing that really jumps out, by the way, is the third-party candidates running right now, and that throws a major, you know, X factor into the race. You know, the highest margin for a third-party candidate in American political history is 19 percent. Right now, just Cornell Western and Bobby Kennedy, that's around 26 percent. That's a huge X factor.

BERMAN: John Avalon, David Urban, thanks to both of you. Kate.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN NEWS CENTRAL CO-ANCHOR: Coming up for us --

URBAN: Thanks for having me.

BOLDUAN: -- the president of Harvard is facing serious questions right now about whether or not she can and will continue to lead the school. This morning, hundreds of faculty members, though, are coming to her defense, including some who've been critical of how she handled that messy testimony about antisemitism on campus.

And Alex Jones, the conspiracy theorist who called the Sandy Hook mass murder a hoax is back on Twitter. Why does Elon Musk want him there? We'll be back.

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[10:40:00]

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN NEWSROOM ANCHOR: One of Harvard's governing bodies is meeting again today as the university's president is facing pressure to step down. Claudine Gay is the first black woman to lead the university. Gay has shot into the spotlight this week after a widely criticized congressional testimony on antisemitism last week. And now, it's important to note today's meeting was already on the books, and we don't know if they will address the pressure against Gay.

But this morning, much of the faculty is actually backing Gay. More than 600 faculty members have signed a petition in support of her.

CNN's Jason Carroll joins us now from Cambridge, Massachusetts. So, do we have a sense, Jason, of what is going on and what is being discussed in those meetings?

JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, first let me tell you, it's clear from that petition that Claudine Gay has her supporters here on campus. For example, yesterday, the number was at 300 today, more than 600. But what is also clear is that her words caused a great deal of pain, and some say it's time for her to go.

[10:45:00]

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CARROLL (voiceover): Now that the University of Pennsylvania's president has resigned, the question for some here at Harvard University is will their president, Claudine Gay, be next?

JANE, HARVARD STUDENT: I don't think that she should leave because she's like a few months into her presidency and I think it's like a little wild. But, like, the entire outside world gets to decide what happens on a college campus.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think it's not a black and white issue. There's a lot of moving factors. And it's hard to address all of those in one conversation.

CARROLL (voiceover): Student, Polina Kempinsky, is Israeli and says she hasn't felt safe being Jewish on campus for some time. She says that widely criticized congressional testimony last week just made things worse.

POLINA KEMPINSKY, HARVARD STUDENT: It felt like a failed leadership. I was really expecting a clear statement of we're against antisemitism, and either here's our plan or we need your help implementing this and that. Instead of this, when hearing the lack of response, they attempt to evade. It just made us feel like we're alone in this. And I'm sure a lot of Muslim students have been feeling the same way.

CARROLL (voiceover): The presidents from Harvard, MIT, and the University of Pennsylvania all came under intense scrutiny after their disastrous congressional testimony where they failed to condemn calls for the genocide of Jews as it related to university policies against bullying and harassment.

REP. ELISE STEFANIK (R-NY): So, the answer is yes, that calling for the genocide of Jews violates Harvard code of conduct, correct?

CLAUDINE GAY, HARVARD UNIVERSITY PRESIDENT: Again, it depends on the context --

CARROLL (voiceover): Gay later apologized. Telling "The Harvard Crimson" in an interview, "Words matter, but the damage was done." One of her staunchest critics, Bill Ackman, a billionaire hedge fund, CEO, and Harvard alum sent a letter Sunday to the university's governing boards of directors. It reads, in part, in her short tenure as president, Claudine Gay has done more damage to the reputation of Harvard University than any individual in our nearly 500-year history.

RABBI DAVID WOLPE, VISITING SCHOLAR, HARVARD DIVINITY SCHOOL: I hope that she will be able to do what is best for the university and best for her, but I don't know what that is.

CARROLL (voiceover): Until recently, Rabbi David Wolpe, a visiting scholar at Harvard's Divinity School was part of the university's antisemitism advisory group, created in the wake of October 7th. He was chosen by Gay. But Wolpe said while he had accountability, he had no real authority to do anything. Gay's testimony was the final straw. He resigned from the group last week.

WOLPE: And I had wanted from any of the presidents a certain urgency and anger and indignation had they once -- it wasn't even the content of the answers, had they once pounded their fist on the table and said, this is unacceptable. I will not have this at my university. I think people would have felt reassured. I would have felt reassured.

CARROLL: But instead, you got what?

WOLPE: Instead, we got legalisms and equivocations.

CARROLL: Should Gay resign? WOLPE: Not for me to say, really. I don't think the decision on --

CARROLL: Why not? Why --

WOLPE: Because I'm a rabbi who's been at Harvard for two months.

CARROLL (voiceover): Yet several hundred members of the school's faculty signed a petition, calling on university leaders to resist political pressures and outside forces trying to remove Gay.

ELIAS SCHISGALL, SR. REPORTER, THE HARVARD CRIMSON: They united to say that we don't think it's appropriate for national politicians and, you know, major alumni to be dictating, you know, who should or shouldn't be in the leadership of the university.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CARROLL (on camera): MIT's board of governing board didn't release a statement in support of its president. Harvard's governing board, again, is meeting today, a regularly scheduled meeting waiting to decide and waiting to hear what that board will decide. Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: All right. Jason Carol, thanks so much.

John.

BERMAN: All right. New reporting just into CNN, 15 members of the National Guard have been disciplined in connection with one of the largest leaks of military documents in history. We have details.

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[10:50:00]

BOLDUAN: This just in to CNN, the Air Force is now disciplining 15 people connected to the massive leak of national defense information and other classified documents, the investigation into that massive leak. National Guardsman Dack -- Jack Teixeira, he was accused this year of posting a slew of classified documents online. And now, after that investigation, more people are facing punishment.

CNN's Natasha Bertrand is at the Pentagon. She's got much more for us on this. Natasha, what are you learning about what the Air Force found in this investigation, and who's now going to be facing punishment?

NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Well, really significantly, Kate, the Air Force Inspector General, which carried out a probe into just how this happened, found that several people within Jack Teixeira's unit actually intentionally failed to report some of the suspicious things that he was doing, including his, "Intelligent -- intelligence seeking behavior", which basically involved him trying to access classified information that he did not have a need to know.

Remember, just for people who are -- need a refresher on all of this, he was essentially like an I.T. person for the Massachusetts Air National Guard.

[10:55:00]

But throughout his tenure there, he was trying to access classified information, according to prosecutors, that he did not need to actually known for his position. And as we now know prosecutors believe that he went on to leak troves of highly sensitive, detailed, classified military information on "Discord", that gaming, platform where he allegedly shared all of this information with people of -- who, of course, did not have a security clearance.

So, now we are learning that the Air Force is disciplining 15 members of the Air National Guard who were involved or related or, in some way, connected to this massive intelligence leak, including the commander of Jack Teixeira's unit who is the commander of the 102nd intelligence wing. And according to the Air Force, he's being removed from his position. The commander of the 102nd intelligence support squadron has also been permanently removed.

So, clearly, they are trying to set an example here. Really showing how there was a real breakdown here in terms of the security. So, the Secretary of the Air Force, Frank Kendall, he said in a statement, "Every airman and guardian is entrusted with the solemn duty to safeguard our nation's classified defense information. When there is a breach of that sacred trust for any reason, we will act in accordance with our laws and policies to hold responsible individuals accountable.

Now, notably from this report, they say that it had any of these members come forward with their concerns about Teixeira's behavior, the very suspicious behavior that he was undergoing, then officials likely would have been able to facilitate more restrictive facility access for him. But as we saw, those steps clearly were not taken, and he was essentially able to leak all of this information, this very damaging information online for several months. Kate.

BOLDUAN: Yes, and that's part of it, right, Natasha? Because it went on for a long period of time, and that's what this gets at is anywhere along the way this could have been stopped. At least some of the damage been mitigated if they -- if anyone had spoken up. And now, we're seeing some more fallout from that massive leak.

It's great to see you. Thank you so much for bringing that to us, Natasha.

Fred

WHITFIELD: Still ahead, where is Alexei Navalny? His legal team says, the imprisoned Russian opposition leader has been missing for six days now.

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