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Airline Passengers Forced To Spend Evening In Military Barracks After Plane Experienced Mechanical Issues; Judge Rebukes Giuliani After He Doubles Down On Defamatory Claims About GA Election Workers; TX Supreme Court Rules Against Woman's Abortion Request Hours After She Left The State For Procedure; New Data Shows Consumer Inflation Continues To Cool; CNN Poll Shows Most Americans Worried About Economy; Maine Mass Shooter's Brain Senate To CTE Researchers. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired December 12, 2023 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:30:00]

PETE MUNTEAN, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: Pretty quickly after they got over the north Atlantic area, you can see on the track from FlightAware, they had a bit of an issue there over Labrador and they had to turn back for the Goose Bay Airport.

The FAA says it was an issue with the de-icing equipment, something you don't want to mess with, especially this time of year.

So they landed there in Goose Bay. Deplane the flight. For about 24 hours, the passengers were stuck there. And there's not a lot of hotels in Goose Bay. I looked it up online a little bit ago.

There's a military barracks there. It's an Air Force base there for the Canadian Air Force, the Royal Canadian Air Force. They ended up going to a barracks there to spend the night.

I did read a quote from one of the passengers that, you know, it was not all that bad. It was kind of like a hotel basically. So we should not try to make it sound so terrible.

The good news here is that Delta did send another flight to go back and pick up these passengers, called a rescue flight.

One issue, though, the crew on board that flight timed out. So then they had to wait for a bit more time for that flight to ultimately get them back to Detroit, their original destination.

That did happen last night around 7:00 p.m. So ultimately, this ordeal took about maybe like 26 hours in total.

Have you ever seen the play "Come From Away," which is sort of the story of these folks who got diverted after the 9/11 attacks? They got sent to an airport in Gander not too far away.

Another similarly small town. Only about 8,000 people live in Goose Bay. So the population was the same significant when you think about the percentages going down. But yes, not unlike "Come From Away," they had to put people up in homes at that case, in the military infrastructure there --

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Probably --

(CROSSTALK)

MUNTEAN: All's well that ends well.

SANCHEZ: Probably a Christmas wonderland at the time.

(CROSSTALK)

MUNTEAN: And 25 degrees and snowing today.

RAHEL SOLOMON, CNN HOST: Yes. It's obviously not something we talk about a lot.

MUNTEAN: No.

SOLOMON: Is Delta saying sort of what happened here?

MUNTEAN: They are saying they will compensate these passengers. They will not say exactly how they are compensating them.

Although, you really can't really mess with safety. And that is the bottom line here. The aviation rules are written in blood. So when something like this happens, you have to do the smart thing here.

And the crew did the right thing by going to divert. Finding a good airport to land at and waiting it out a little bit. Although, obviously, to the cost of some inconvenience to these passengers.

SOLOMON: Twenty-six hours. Just a little bit.

SANCHEZ: But they have a great story.

SOLOMON: That's right, that's right.

Pete Muntean, thank you.

MUNTEAN: Anytime.

SANCHEZ: Turning to yet another embattled ex-politician in court. Rudy Giuliani, the former Trump attorney, got a talking to from the judge overseeing his federal defamation damages trial.

Giuliani made some eyebrow- raising comments to reporters about two Georgia election workers that are at the center of this case.

SOLOMON: Let's bring in CNN's Zach Cohen who's been following this for us.

Zach, former election worker, Shaye Moss, is at the center of all of this of course. She took the stand. Walk us through the testimony. ZACHARY COHEN, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Yes, Rahel and Boris,

Shaye Moss, really AN emotional day of testimony from her. She walked the jury through how her life had been personally affected by the conspiracy theories that Rudy Giuliani was amplifying after the 2020 election.

And she also told them she remains in fear for her life. She always feels like someone is watching her.

I want to highlight one moment from her testimony that really underscores the persistent fear that she feels that is a direct result of these conspiracy theories.

She said, "I am most scared of my son finding me or my mom hanging outside my house on a tree, or having to get the news at a school that his mom was killed."

Moss really detailing in pretty graphic terms there for the jury about how there's a direct line between the conspiracy theories that Rudy Giuliani and Donald Trump were peddling at the time as they tried to overturn the election, also the impact it's had on her family.

So this really does draw a stark comparison to what we've heard from Rudy Giuliani in this case so far. You know, obviously Shaye Moss was asked if Rudy Giuliani had ever apologized to her. She said no.

But just last night, he continued to push some of the same conspiracy theories he's being sued over.

SANCHEZ: Zach, talk to us about this moment between Giuliani and the judge. What did the former mayor say that prompted the judge to take him to task?

COHEN: Giuliani is already potentially on the hook for tens of millions of dollars in damages. Yesterday, after his first day in court, he walked outside the courthouse and talked to reporters.

And he pushed the same exact conspiracy theories about Shaye Moss and Ruby Freeman that he's being sued over right now.

This morning, the judge really did rebuke him about that. Asking Giuliani's lawyer if he can be trusted to testify in his own defense, or if he will go up there and espouse the same conspiracy theories.

At the end of the day, the judge also warned that Rudy Giuliani may have opened himself up to more legal problems and another defamation claim based on what he said.

Take a listen to what Rudy Giuliani said outside the court last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUDY GIULIANI, FORMER TRUMP ATTORNEY: Everything I said about them is true.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Do you regret what you did? [14:35:02]

GIULIANI: Of course, I don't regret it. I told the truth. They were engaged in changing votes.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: There's no proof of that.

GIULIANI: Oh, you are damned right there is. Stay tuned.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COHEN: So we have to stay tuned to see if Rudy Giuliani does testify on his own behalf.

Again, the judge in this case warning he might have already opened himself up to more defamation claims based on his comments just last night.

SOLOMON: So, Zach, I mean, Giuliani -- I mean, it's a head-scratcher. Giuliani doubling down on these comments clearly. What is next for this case?

COHEN: We are in day two of this trial. It is supposed to last around four days.

Like I said, Giuliani is expected to be the only witness called by the defense. And he is supposed to sit up there on the stand and essentially tell the jury why they shouldn't award tens of millions of dollars of damages, maybe a lesser amount.

Keep in mind, too, that the plaintiffs in this case are asking the jury to award somewhere between $15.5 million and $43 million. Ultimately, this is just about the amount of damages that Giuliani is going to have to pay.

A judge has already ruled that he did, in fact, defame these two poll workers in Georgia.

So, at the end of the day, what Giuliani gets up there and says or doesn't say doesn't change that fact.

SANCHEZ: Just a quick point, Giuliani says we have to stay tuned because he will provide evidence that there were votes changed in Fulton County, Georgia.

It has been three years. We've had multiple opportunities to move forward any proof of any widespread election fraud? They have absolutely failed to do so.

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: Yes.

SOLOMON: Zach Cohen, thank you.

All right, and still ahead for us, key new inflation numbers are out just before the Federal Reserve will decide whether to raise interest rates or hold them steady. We will have the details for you coming up, next.

SANCHEZ: And a draft agreement that has climate activists up in arms. We will discuss whether there's outrage and disappointment at the U.N. climate change talks.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:41:14]

SOLOMON: Welcome back. Let's go to Texas now where its restrictive abortion laws is facing its first real test after the State Supreme Court ruled against a woman who was initially granted a court-ordered abortion because she has a high-risk pregnancy.

SANCHEZ: Yes. CNN previously reported that Kate Cox, who's 21 weeks pregnant, ended up leaving Texas to have that procedure in another state.

Doctors said that Cox's life and her ability to have another baby were at risk because her fetus was diagnosed with a rare, fatal genetic condition.

CNN senior national correspondent, Ed Lavandera, has been following the latest details on this story.

Ed, this case is now triggering a tense and highly public legal battle. What are you learning from Cox's legal team?

ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, they have been really speaking out against the Texas Supreme Court opinion that was written by nine justices, all of them Republican, here in the state of Texas.

Essentially, what the Texas Supreme Court ruled yesterday is that the conditions that Kate Cox and her lawyers described in their efforts to get a legal abortion through a court order don't rise to the level of the medical exemption.

In the opinion, the justices wrote, "No one disputes that Ms. Cox's pregnancy has been extremely complicated. Many parents would be devastated that their unborn child's trisomy 18 diagnosis. Some difficulties in pregnancy, however, even serious ones, do not pose a heightened risk to the mother that the medical exemption encompasses."

The attorneys for Kate Cox say that Texans should be enraged by that opinion. They have been arguing for several days and much of the last week that Kate Cox's concern about her future fertility, as well as the continuing with this pregnancy and possibly be a threatening situation to hurt as it progressed.

The attorneys are saying the medical exemption as it exists in Texas right here now simply does not exist. They say it's virtually impossible for any doctor or hospital to agree to perform an abortion, given what the Texas Supreme Court has applied in this case. SOLOMON: There is no travel ban law in Texas, but it allows private

citizens to file a civil lawsuit against anyone who knowingly aids or abets in abortion. Are there concerns here that the state could go after Cox any further?

LAVANDERA: Yes. This has been one of those angles of the story that I think a lot of people have been talking about.

We just spoke with Kate Cox's attorney about an hour ago and asked her this very question. They do not have any concern that Kate Cox will face any kind of -- legal situation because, look, they say she has gone to a place and they will not say where exactly she has gone, where getting an abortion is legal.

There are some questions if whoever she traveled with, her husband, if there was concern about that. Her lawyers tell us that they are not concerned in any way that there will be any kind of repercussions or any potential lawsuits that could be brought by a civilian toward anyone in Cox's family or her world.

SANCHEZ: Ed Lavandera, live for us in Dallas, thank you so much for the update.

There's new economic data out today that shows that inflation has continued a cooling trend that started last month.

SOLOMON: Let's bring in CNN's Vanessa Yurkevich, who joins us now.

Vanessa, it's the last CPI report of the year. Walk us through these numbers.

VANESSA YURKEVICH, CNN BUSINESS & POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, prices are certainly still elevated. But we are continuing to see that cooling trend. That is exactly what Americans want to see, prices coming down.

Year over year, inflation at about 3.1 percent. Month over month, inflation ticking up slightly 0.1 percent.

Economists wanted to see that number remain flat month over month from October to November, but ticking up slightly to 0.1 percent.

[14:45:00]

In terms of where Americans are feeling some cost savings are energy prices. Energy prices have continued to cool. That is good ahead of these winter months where people are looking to heat their homes.

Gas prices also dropping from October to November, down 6 percent. Still, grocery store prices, while cooling, still taking a 0.2 percent.

And then shelter, this is right, what people pay every single month. It's the most of what people pay every single month. That is still elevated, up 0.4 percent. As you mentioned, Rahel, the Fed started their two-day meeting today.

This is the last economic data they are getting before making their decision.

Analysts and economists are in agreement that they will likely pause rates, so not raise interest rates this go around.

That is welcomed news for consumers because as the Fed continues to pause rates that means that mortgage rates have an opportunity to stabilize and cool. The same goes for student loan payments and auto loans.

Hopefully, the cooling of prices and the indication that the Fed will not raise rates will help people moving into 2024 prices.

SOLOMON: And, Vanessa, how do you square this report with how people were feeling? I think you did a great job with that graphic there, just showing the categories where, of course, gas is falling and energy is falling.

But some prices continue to go up like shelter. So Americans are feeling that and it's reflected in polling.

YURKEVICH: There has been this disconnect between some of the promising economic data that we have seen, low unemployment, robust job growth, and cooling inflation, and how people actually feel.

Just take a look at this latest CNN poll. You see that most people are worried about the state of the economy in their communities.

That is because, according to Moody's Analytics, people are paying about $1,000 more this year than they were three years ago for the same items. That is a pain point for many Americans.

And you are seeing it show up right there in that polling. How people feel. It's not necessarily in the economic data, but it is in how people are feeling about the economy right now.

SOLOMON: We will learn a lot more when we hear from Jay Powell and the crew tomorrow at 2:00 p.m.

Vanessa Yurkevich, live for us in New York. Vanessa, thank you.

And we will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:52:58]

SOLOMON: We are learning that tissue samples of a mass murderer's brain are being tested for CTE. The disorder is known to inflict people who take multiple hits to the head, like boxers and football players.

Maine's state examiner said tissue samples from Richard Card was sent to CTE researchers in Massachusetts. Card gunned down 18 people in Maine in October before killing himself.

SANCHEZ: The Army reservist never served in combat but, as a certified arms instructor, "The New York Times" reports this, quote, "Mr. Card worked every summer for years as an instructor at an Army hand grenade training range where he was rocked by thousands of brain-jarring explosions."

Let's bring in CNN chief medical correspondent, Sanjay Gupta.

Sanjay, I think many of us see CTE as a sports injury problem. But this obviously sheds light --

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Right.

SANCHEZ: -- on the potential impact it could have on members of the military.

GUPTA: Yes. "Potential," I think, being the keyword there, Boris. There's a lot we don't know here yet, including whether or not CTE was present. And whether or not you can draw some sort of cause and effect between CTE and this sort of violent abhorrent behavior.

As you mentioned, most of the studies have been done in athletes. The question about folks in the military, there's been studies on this specifically.

I want to show you this because it's important. Back in 2022, they looked at 225 servicemembers, and this gives you context. Ten tested positive for CTE. That's less than 5 percent overall. That gives you some context.

What makes it even more challenging is that 10 of those 10 people also played sports at some point. Was it the sports? Was it the activity in the military? We don't know. I think it's just really important to emphasize that.

CTE is chronic traumatic. It's an Alzheimer's-like syndrome that's caused by these repeated blows to the head.

I can show you what it looks like. What the pathologist may be looking for.

There's different stages. If you look at the upper left, that is the earliest stage. The brain looks normal. The bottom right, that's stage four CTE. And it's infiltrated by this type of protein. The same thing in Alzheimer's. That's why people draw that comparison.

With those stages, you get different levels of symptoms. Stage one, you may have few in the way of symptoms, but you go to stage four and people might have difficulties with impulse control, judgment, things like that.

It's really important to point out, just as someone who has been reporting on CTE for a long time, if there is a history of violence, it is typically violence that is directed at themselves versus directed outwards. They're far more likely to die by suicide than something like that.

I give you that to say there are plenty of caveats. We'll follow this along. It'll take six months to get results back. But that's what they're going to be looking for.

[14:55:00]

SOLOMON: And, Sanjay, let me ask you this, because you've been covering this for so long. I mean, it sounds like there are still a lot of questions here. What questions do you have as they perform this analysis and this investigation?

GUPTA: Yes. I think, first of all, sometimes you're not going to get clear answers no matter how many questions you get or how deep you dig.

We don't always know what may have led someone to do this. Often times, you never know. So, there may never be a clear-cut answer.

But I would be curious about his history, other history. We know somewhere close to 15 to 20 percent of those that serve in the military do have a history of post-traumatic stress. They have a history of depression.

Could that have played a role here? Was there any other abusive drug? Things like that. That'll be tested. They'll do full toxicology.

But also, aside from CTE, people can develop post-concussive syndrome. Again, I want to be crystal clear. No one is drawing a cause and effect between those types of things and gunning down people as we heard with this particular man.

But I think if you look at post-concussive symptoms, people may have the same things we talk about with CTE but at a lesser scale. Mood swings, feeling impulsive, difficulty sleeping, things like that.

Was there a relationship between any of those things and this sort of behavior? Again, we may never know. But this is how they're going to approach and it start to investigate.

SANCHEZ: Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thanks so much for walking us through those studies.

GUPTA: Yes. Thanks.

SANCHEZ: Of course.

So, we just heard from President Biden and Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelenskyy. You're going to hear from them in just a few moments.

Stay with CNN.

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