Return to Transcripts main page

CNN News Central

Trump Sharpens Attacks on Republican Rivals; Interview With Rep. Gregory Meeks (D-NY); Arrests Made in Alleged Terror Plot in Europe. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired December 14, 2023 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:00:03]

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN HOST: We do have breaking news coming in, and working through some more details on this, but we're learning that four people have been arrested on terrorism offenses following an operation by Danish intelligence.

Let's get right over to CNN's Alex Marquardt. He has much more on this.

Alex, tell us what you're learning.

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, OK, we are getting a statement now from both the Danish intelligence and security services, as well as the Israelis.

There is a bit of a discrepancy in terms of how many people were arrested. The Israelis are saying that some seven people were arrested, while the Danish services are saying four were arrested, three of them in Denmark and one in the Netherlands.

But what everyone is agreeing on right now is that these people were arrested in connection to a possible terror plot. The Mossad and the Shin Bet agency here, which is the equivalent of the U.S.' FBI, says that these arrests were made in connection with a terrorist plot to kill civilians on European soil.

The Israelis are saying that these people were acting on behalf of the Hamas terrorist organization. The statement from the Danish security services going on to say that the three who were arrested have been charged with terrorism offenses.

So, of course, this is far away from this region. This is far away from this war. Kate, there had been fears that, as a result of this war, we could start to see more terrorist attacks. Of course, in the United States, we have seen this huge spike in antisemitism and Islamophobia.

This war in Gaza has led to a huge amount of anger across the Arab and Muslim world. And so this was a major concern from officials and terror experts that we could start to see a new spike in terrorist attacks, this one, this plot clearly stopped before, thankfully, it was carried out.

But there was a series of raids in Denmark that took place today resulting in these arrests that Israel is saying was targeting European citizens on European soil. They say that Hamas has been expanding their operations to try to go after Israeli, Jewish and Western targets -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: Let's point -- let's reiterate the important points here, as there clearly is more detail to kind of be worked out with some of the details on this.

But what you're talking about is terror suspects now under arrest that you're being told, we're learning, at least officials are saying, were trying to act on behalf of Hamas to carry out some operation on European soil.

Now, talk to me more about this fear that we have been hearing about for quite some time since October 7 and what October 7 and the reaction from Israel in going after Hamas terrorists in the aftermath, the fears that it has raised in terms of Hamas expanding their capabilities far beyond Israel and Gaza.

MARQUARDT: Well, I think you're absolutely right, Kate, to zero in on that phrasing from the Israelis that those who arrested were acting on behalf of the Hamas terrorist organization.

At the same time, Israel has made clear that it plans to hunt down Hamas operatives around the world, saying that really no one is safe. The belief there was that they were talking about established, well- known Hamas operatives, maybe under the political arm who live overseas.

But there was certainly a concern that this war that has been going on for more than two months now would inspire others to take up arms. I think we really have to be specific about the kind of organization that Hamas has been believed to be.

Until this point, Hamas has focused all of its efforts on Israeli targets. If they're carrying out attacks inside Israel, in Jerusalem, it is really that their focus has been against the Israelis, who they see as occupiers.

This would be a real evolution in their ambitions. It would indicate that they have more global ambitions. And this is the assertion that Israel is making right now that, over the past few years, and certainly since October 7, that Israel (sic) has been trying to step up their game, essentially, get their operations to a level where they could carry out operations, terrorist acts around the world.

This is not like -- Hamas until now has not been like al Qaeda or ISIS, which we have seen countless attacks, whether by their members of their own organizations or copied or lone wolves, carrying out attacks in Europe and elsewhere, the leaders of ISIS and al Qaeda calling for attacks around the world.

That is not something that we see from Hamas. Again, their focus has been on Israel, but now Israel making the allegation that the seven people who were arrested today are acting on behalf of Hamas and that they have been trying to expand their operations beyond Israel to Europe today -- Kate.

[11:05:07]

BOLDUAN: This is important reporting, as you say, scary and definite -- would be a very scary evolution of Hamas from what people know of this terror organization to this point.

Much more to work out in the terms of the details and what we learn on this and much more to come.

Alex Marquardt all over it for us.

Alex, thank you -- Sara.

SARA SIDNER, CNN HOST: All right, back here in the U.S. this morning, we're getting brand-new reaction Capitol Hill after the House voted to formally launch an impeachment inquiry into President Joe Biden.

Let's get straight to CNN's Manu Raju.

You are joining us on the steps of the Capitol, Manu. I know you have been trying to talk to folks, including Congressman Jim Jordan, who himself defied a congressional subpoena, the same type of thing that is happening with Hunter Biden, and now they're going after him. What did he say?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I asked her about that specific issue. He's been criticized for defying that January 6 Select Committee subpoena from the last Congress, and now he's threatening to hold Hunter Biden in contempt for defying the subpoena yesterday, not coming before the committee behind closed doors to be deposed as part of their impeachment inquiry into President Biden.

I asked him about this and about, why did you -- and how you defied that subpoena with the January 6 Committee? How could you go forward with this, given your own personal history? He said that he didn't defy the subpoena. He was taking issue with the word defying the subpoena. He said: I wrote a letter back to the committee. They never wrote a letter back to me.

The subpoena did call for interview and also records and the like. But he also indicated he was walking on his way to a closed-door deposition with a former U.S. -- assistant U.S. attorney who was involved in the investigation into Hunter Biden. That's all part of their probe into the president.

The question is, can they establish a connection between President Biden and his son Hunter? And they hope that is enough to move forward articles of impeachment for the president, but many Republicans flatly acknowledge they simply do not have that proof yet, and it's unclear if they will get there. But talking to some Republicans, including some conservative members,

they're making clear that they believe that they should go down the road of impeachment, no matter what, and also warning about political blowback if Joe Biden is not impeached.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Do you think that going down these impeachment routes could be a problem politically?

REP. MARK GREEN (R-TN): No, I don't. In fact, I think if we don't go down these impeachment routes, a huge part of America is going to just say we're not supporting Republicans anymore.

RAJU: And, lastly, the president, the former -- the president is facing this impeachment inquiry in the House. Do you think that this is the right move by Republicans to pursue this?

SEN. JOE MANCHIN (D-WV): I think, with all the problems we're having right now, and we know the impeachment process and amount of time and energy it takes, it doesn't do anything but just fuel the fire of the political discourse that we have.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: The last comment coming from Senator Joe Manchin, someone who is considering a third-party bid against the president of the United States, indicating he is not on board with the Republican idea about pursuing this impeachment inquiry.

But there are just a lot of questions about what will happen next. This investigation will continue into next year. But, at some point, the speaker of the House, Mike Johnson, has to make a decision about whether to move forward with articles of impeachment. And if he does, what is the evidence that they have to show that the president should be charged with high crimes or misdemeanors?

And, also, can he get the votes? Because there's so many Republicans in those swing districts who don't necessarily agree with what you heard there from Congressman Mark Green, who -- they don't believe that it's actually good for them politically to go down this road, particularly the ones in swing districts who are not sold yet on moving forward with an actual high crime or misdemeanor charge against the president.

So, all huge questions, as many on the right pushing to have Joe Biden impeached, some in the middle uncertain and caught in the middle, the speaker of the House, who has key decisions to make when they come back into session next year, as they just wrapped up their session for the year just moments ago -- Sara.

SIDNER: Yes, evidence is key in this case, and, so far, they have not been able to show that.

Manu Raju, thank you so much. Appreciate all your reporting -- John. JOHN BERMAN, CNN HOST: All right, with us now is Congressman Gregory Meeks, a Democrat from New York who is the ranking member of the House Foreign Affairs Committee.

Congressman, thank you so much for being with us.

A number of Republicans who voted to formalize this impeachment inquiry last night, including ones from moderate districts, said this is just to formalize the inquiry. We want to find out information.

To what extent do you buy that? To what extent do you think impeachment itself is now inevitable?

REP. GREGORY MEEKS (D-NY): Look, I don't buy them, what they're saying. They're going along with the extreme MAGA Republicans that they want to try to distance themselves from, but by continuing and agreeing with what they're doing, which is, this is continuing a witch-hunt.

Their own witnesses they have had, they have done some investigations previously, and have come up with zero evidence of anything in regards to Joe Biden.

[11:10:00]

But they want to continue with the witch-hunt and prevent and not do any work on behalf of the people. So, they're playing politics and they're playing -- I think they're trying to be -- or seek revenge for Donald Trump. They're doing Donald Trump's work in this regard, because this is what Donald Trump has said that he would do.

And so I don't buy it from the moderates, so-called moderate Republicans, who are going along and being led by and doing everything that the MAGA Republicans want. It makes them one and the same.

There has been zero evidence. They have had Judiciary hearings and government -- the different -- the Government Operations Committee has had hearings. They come up with nothing. And you should not be using an impeachment process or inquiry as a witch-hunt, because you have nothing else, just to prevent -- this will take up all of their time and utilize this excuse for not doing anything on a positive nature, like passing the president's supplemental to support Ukraine and Israel.

BERMAN: I want to talk about that in just a moment.

When Steve Bannon did not testify before the House January 6 Committee, you voted to hold him in contempt. Why is Hunter Biden not appearing for a deposition different than that?

MEEKS: Hunter Biden has agreed to testify publicly. He does not want to be talked about -- the only Republicans want to be secretly and behind the scenes is because they want to distort what he testifies to.

So, he's ready to testify. He said that he will testify. He will testify, and they can ask him any question that...

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: Just to be clear, Donald Trump Jr. did appear in various depositions. So why then is Hunter Biden different than Donald Trump Jr., who did testify behind closed doors?

MEEKS: Well, Donald Trump Jr. testified, and he had a choice also. I think that if he had said he wanted to testify in a public forum, he would have been granted the ability to testify in a public forum.

I think Donald Trump Jr. did not -- would not want to testify in a public forum. I think that it is more important so that the public can see what's taking place in that regard. And so Donald Trump, I believe, Jr., did not necessarily want the public to hear to see what he had to say. And Joe -- and Biden does want to testify in a public forum, so the world can see the questions that are asked of him.

BERMAN: You have been ordered in your support for new funding for Ukraine. Right now, there are negotiations primarily on the Senate side to try to secure some of that funding.

And as part of the discussions, there are some new measures being discussed at the border as well. What new measures on asylum would you be willing to accept to secure new aid for Ukraine?

MEEKS: So, let me just say, I'm absolutely locked in.

And I'm very disappointed that we are breaking for the holidays, not coming back until January 9, without additional Ukraine funding, without additional Israel funding, without additional humanitarian funding.

And so that's very disappointing we didn't do any of that work. I am one that do believe that we need to do something on the border. And I think that we should continue to talk and negotiate, but something that is -- still complies with the values of who we are as Americans.

And if the Republicans continue to stick to wanting H.R.2, then that's completely out of bounds as to what Donald Trump did, and we're not in agreement with that. But I hope that we have some dialogue and conversation to do something that is real that can help with the border.

I'm not denying that we have to do -- and I think most Democrats agree that we have to do something with the border and we have to make some changes.

BERMAN: Right.

MEEKS: Of course, ultimately, comprehensive immigration reform will get us there. But we can't get the Republicans to do that. But I'm willing to negotiate, and I think that the president has indicated he's ready to talk about the border and try to figure something out.

BERMAN: Congressman... MEEKS: But it can't be H.R.2.

BERMAN: Congressman Gregory Meeks, we appreciate you being with us. Have a nice holiday break, a break I know you're actually not happy to be going on today. Thank you, sir.

MEEKS: Thank you.

BERMAN: Sara.

SIDNER: All right, coming up: what Donald Trump is doing, sharpening his attacks on his primary opponents and President Biden, as the Iowa caucuses is just a month and a day away.

We're also following breaking news, prosecutors in Germany and Denmark announcing arrests this morning, saying suspected members of Hamas were planning terror attacks in Europe.

Also, the Dow hits a brand-new high after the Fed decides to leave interest rates alone. Do these promising signs mean that we have avoided a recession? We will talk all about it next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:19:35]

BOLDUAN: Thirty-two days to Iowa, and then is off to the races for the presidential primary season.

Polls currently are pointing to an eventual general election rematch of 2020 between Joe Biden and Donald Trump. Yes, we have a long way to that. But the question does remain, how could legal and political troubles right now impact both of their campaigns?

President Biden is now up against an impeachment inquiry by House Republicans, even though they haven't revealed any direct evidence want to back up their claims. And Donald Trump is facing something quite concrete, 91 federal and state criminal charges.

[11:20:07]

This morning, his team is celebrating, though, after his federal election interference case was put on pause, which could push the trial further in to the election cycle.

CNN's Alayna Treene has much more. She's back with us.

And, Alayna, Trump took a turn, it seemed, last night to go quite hard at Nikki Haley. I was wondering. You have been -- you have followed his campaign so closely. What do you see in that?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Yes, well, I will say it was the most explicit language I have heard Donald Trump he has yet to go after Nikki Haley.

And, I mean, I go to nearly all of Donald Trump's campaign events. And he normally is focusing his attacks on Ron DeSantis, specifically in Iowa, and he did attack Ron DeSantis last night on ethanol, on farming, things that is very important to Iowa voters.

But he also, again, really went after Nikki Haley in a way that we haven't seen. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES (R) AND CURRENT U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: They have been talking about the Haley surge. So she goes up two points. I go up, I think 10 points, nine or 10 points, and they say that's a Trump surge.

But they don't want to say that. They said she's surging against him, but he's gone nowhere.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TREENE: Now, Kate, Nikki Haley is clearly having a very good few weeks. She is definitely rising, particularly in New Hampshire. She just had that big endorsement from the New Hampshire governor, Chris Sununu.

And from my conversations with Donald Trump's campaign and his advisers, they recognize that she is a growing threat. Now, when you talk to them publicly, they will say they're not that worried about her, he's still doing very well, which is true. He still has a very commanding lead in the polls.

But they do recognize that you could be a problem for him, particularly in New Hampshire. And one of the key things here to keep in mind is that Donald Trump's team doesn't just want him to win in Iowa and win in New Hampshire. They need to have a really good showing. And that's because there's a lot of expectation that he's going to dominate.

But they also want to build that momentum to be strong enough to not only carry him through the rest of the primaries, but to really force his opponents like Nikki Haley and Ron DeSantis out of the race. And so that is a growing concern.

And then just really quickly, Kate, I also want to get to another major point that Donald Trump made last night. He is growing -- or -- excuse me -- he is increasingly going after Joe Biden and making the primaries not just about his opponents, but also about Joe Biden.

He really is trying to go after Joe Biden's unpopularity to try and galvanize these voters to come out for him. And he very much made that message clear last night, talking about the economy and arguing that, as we go into the holidays, people are very worried about it and that Joe Biden is the reason that there are those concerns -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: And in doing so, he's trying to create something of an inevitability around his -- him winning the primary, which would be to just start talking about the general.

It's great to see you, Alayna. Thank you -- Sara.

SIDNER: All right. Joining me now to discuss all of this, Nancy Cook, senior national political correspondent with Bloomberg.

Nancy, thank you so much for coming in this morning.

You just heard Alayna Treene there talking about the attacks that Donald Trump has made on Haley. We have been hearing from DeSantis. We have been hearing from Ramaswamy. But you're out with this new podcast saying this is basically the election no one wants. At this point, if the numbers prove true, it will beat Donald Trump versus Joe Biden.

How did we end up here? I mean, what are some of the serious things that are facing these challengers from voters?

NANCY COOK, BLOOMBERG NEWS: Well, I think it's interesting.

What is facing Trump is that there's a huge part of the Republican base who's still -- he's still really popular with and they still really want him to be the nominee, but a lot of donors and establishment Republicans really don't want him at all, but they haven't really found a successful challenger.

Biden faces basically the opposite problem, whereas he really has the support of donors and establishment Democrats, but sort of rank-and- file Democratic voters are really concerned that he's too old. They think he -- they are worried about his handling of the economy, and he just has a low approval rating.

Bloomberg News has a new poll out this morning that shows that Biden's standing with young voters, with black voters is really dropping. And this is a third month that we have done this poll. And this is really a warning sign to the Biden White House.

SIDNER: I do want to ask. You talked about Republicans.

And former Speaker Paul Ryan, who headed the House majority during Trump's first two years in office, has come out with some really strong comments, saying that Donald Trump is not a conservative. He's, in his words, an authoritarian narcissist.

We haven't heard a lot from Paul Ryan throughout all this with all the shenanigans going on. I mean, where are all of the anti-Trump Republicans? Are they there and going to vote differently? Or is this really going to be a blowout by Donald Trump, in your eyes?

[11:25:14]

COOK: Well, I think that Paul Ryan is expressing the views of a lot of Republicans in Washington and donors, who really do not want to see a Trump second term.

The problem that they're facing is that he is still wildly popular with primary voters in these key early voting states like Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina and Nevada. So, what the Trump campaign is really hoping to do is take this momentum and lock up the nomination by early March.

And it will really be up to the primary voters, not these pundits in Washington or former politicians like Paul Ryan. That is a big part of their message.

SIDNER: I do want to quickly play Donald Trump speaking to the crowd in Iowa, the caucus coming up very, very shortly. He invoked Ronald Reagan's line. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Were you better off four years ago or are you better off today?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: It's the economy, stupid, right? Is that really where voters are?

But there's also something else going on here when it comes to Donald Trump and those who are staunch supporters of him, right?

COOK: Yes, I think that he is really a movement figure. He's not just your ordinary politician to a lot of Republican primary voters.

They like going to the rallies. I have been with -- to a bunch of rallies. I have met people who have been to 60 rallies since 2016. There's a community there. And that is definitely part of his appeal. I do think his advisers will continue to emphasize his handling of the economy, which our Bloomberg News polling shows he really has a disproportionate support.

Voters really trust him to handle the economy much more than Biden. So I think that that will be an ongoing message to people in these early voting states as this gets under way in January.

SIDNER: Well, with the way the economy is going right now, things are looking up for Joe Biden. We will see what happens as we go forward.

Nancy Cook, thank you so much for coming on -- John.

COOK: Thanks for having me.

BERMAN: All right, we do have breaking news, arrests made in Denmark and Germany of suspected terrorists. The Israeli security services claims the suspects were acting on behalf of Hamas.

So, the stock market soaring, retail sales numbers stronger than expected, gas prices going down, yet, as you just heard, Donald Trump slams President Biden on the economy.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)