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DeSantis, Haley Spar As Trump Maintains Large Lead In Iowa Polls; House Report: Trump Org. Made $5M-Plus From China When Trump Was President; Prominent Names In Unsealed Epstein Documents; More Names Tied To Late Sex Offender Epstein Released Soon; Judge, Officials Attacked By Defendant In Nevada Courtroom. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired January 04, 2024 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[13:33:00]

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: So in just 11 days, the first 2024 primary ballots will be cast in Iowa.

Tonight, Donald Trump's chief rivals, Governor Ron DeSantis of Florida and former Governor Nikki Haley of South Carolina, are going to take questions directly from Iowans in a pair of CNN town halls.

As part of their aggressive final push to sway any remaining undecided caucus goers, things are getting a little heated.

Haley recently made comments that seemed to downplay her chances in Iowa. She joked, in New Hampshire, that voters there would correct Iowa's results. Ron DeSantis is now seizing on that today.

Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NIKKI HALEY, (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & FORMER SOUTH CAROLINA GOVERNOR: You know, Iowa starts it. You know that you correct it. You know that you continue to go --

(APPLAUSE)

GOV. RON DESANTIS (R-FL) (voice-over): It was incredibly disrespectful to Iowans to say that somehow their votes need to be, quote, "corrected." I think she's trying to provide an excuse for her not doing well.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Let's dig deeper on the final sprint, with veteran pollster, Frank Luntz.

Frank, great to see you as always.

I see you shaking your head. It does seem like these two are more focused on each other than the actual front runner. In your mind, is it a foregone conclusion that Donald Trump is going to win Iowa?

FRANK LUNTZ, POLLSTER & COMMUNICATION STRATEGIST: It's a foregone conclusion. There is no other way. No one ever says never.

But in Iowa, Donald Trump is absolutely going to win and I will be watching to see if he gets more or less 50 percent of the vote.

Frankly, the fact that Ron DeSantis and Nikki Haley are going at each other so brutally is bad news for both of them in New Hampshire. Iowa sends a message, New Hampshire nominates candidates and elects presidents.

So in that point, tonight's discussion, town hall, whatever you want to call, it is very important but it's not going to change the outcome come next week.

It is going to change the outcome of New Hampshire. At least it has the potential to do so.

[13:35:04]

SANCHEZ: That's really fascinating. So you're going to be watching whether Trump eclipses the 50 percent mark.

What about Nikki Haley and Ron DeSantis? Where would you put their numbers for their campaigns to show promise going into New Hampshire and then South Carolina?

LUNTZ: The promises anything over 20 percent and promises the person who comes in second.

By the, way it doesn't matter if they come in second for by half a percent or 10 percent. In the end, the second-place finisher gets a little bit of momentum, not a lot.

Because the conversation, quite frankly, is going to be about Donald Trump's vote and whether any of them can overcome him in New Hampshire.

SANCHEZ: Part of our audience tonight for these two back-to-back town halls consists of undecided voters.

I wonder what your sense is about where those voters are in Iowa right now or other many left and where might they be leaning?

LUNTZ: I don't know how you found them.

(LAUGHTER)

LUNTZ: They are hard to locate. Usually, they are in witness protection programs because they are that important.

(LAUGHTER)

LUNTZ: The issue with undecided voters is there's two kinds. There are kinds that like both candidates and can't decide between them, or the kind that dislike the candidates and can't figure out who is the lesser of two evils.

In Iowa, these opinions are made. In New Hampshire, it is much more open. You will notice, if you asked me a question about Iowa and I'm giving you a New Hampshire answer because Iowa is a foregone conclusion.

What is not clear is what is going to happen eight days later.

SANCHEZ: So you recently held a focus group, looking forward to the general election, about a dozen 2020 Biden and Trump voters.

What was your biggest take away from that conversation? Did you glean anything that would give you insight into what the general would look like with those two?

LUNTZ: Yes. The most important factor is, who is the third-party candidate? Who is the candidate endorsed by no labels, some other third-party organization?

What we keep hearing among those few undecided voters is that they don't like Donald Trump's behavior. They don't like Joe Biden's age. And so it is a pox on both houses.

Their question is, can a third-party candidate truly be viable? Is it someone they can vote for that could win? Or is it just a spoiler?

But there is a lot of animosity towards both political parties because it feels like 2020 all over again.

SANCHEZ: Do any of the third-party candidates right now, or even folks that have been speculated potentially the third-party candidate, like West Virginia Senator Joe Manchin, do any of them to you appear like anything other than a spoiler?

LUNTZ: I think they all appear viable. When you've got almost 70 percent of Americans saying that they would vote for a third-party, at least consider voting, if they thought that person could win, that's higher than any time in my lifetime.

And I worked for Ross Perot in 1992. So I know what it is to have a viable third-party candidate.

Three things. Number one, they are looking for results. Number two, they are looking for someone with experience, other than Washington D.C. Number three, they want to be told the truth.

If any third-party candidate can hit all of those three attributes, they are certainly viable.

SANCHEZ: Frank, one last question. I want to get your thoughts on new reporting that we have in our air about Donald Trump and his businesses making million dollars from Chinese state entities and other foreign firms while he was in office.

We heard claims similar to those from House Republicans. They made them about Joe Biden. But they have yet to produce proof that he profited from foreign businesses while in office.

Would that in any way influence Trump supporters?

LUNTZ: I've come to see that nothing influences Trump's supporters.

In fact, let me put it in perspective. I have never seen a candidate with the intensity of Donald Trump.

That said, if it is Chinese money that is making Donald Trump rich on the side, that is something that would upset Republican voters and Independents and would upset other voters.

China is not enemy number one but they are not well liked. And if a candidate or president is making money on the side, doing business in China, that will not be received well at all.

SANCHEZ: Frank Luntz, we have to leave the conversation there. I always appreciate your perspective and insight.

LUNTZ: It's a privilege. Thank you.

SANCHEZ: Of course.

And another reminder, Governor Ron DeSantis and Nikki Haley are going to take questions directly from Iowa voters in back-to-back events tonight. The CNN Republican Town Hall is moderated by Kaitlan Collins and Erin Burnett. It airs live starting at 9:00 Eastern right here on CNN.

[13:39:52]

So a trove of documents connected to Jeffrey Epstein have been unsealed, naming several prominent people in business and politics. What might we learn when the next set of documents is released? We'll get into that when we come back.

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SANCHEZ: Today, we are expecting to find out about the VIPs connected to the serial sex offender, Jeffrey Epstein. The first batch of court documents in 40 filings were released yesterday and they confirmed earlier public accounts of the elite circles that he belonged to.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: The court records mentioned, among others, former president Bill Clinton and Donald Trump, and philanthropist multibillionaire, Bill Gates. None of them have been accused of wrongdoing in this case.

CNN's Shimon Prokupecz has more on what these documents reveal about the associates of Jeffrey Epstein who died by suicide before trial in 2019.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Long- awaited documents finally released. The first batch of sealed court filings pertaining to the late sex offender, Jeffrey Epstein, were made public Wednesday.

[13:45:00]

The documents stem from a civil defamation lawsuit brought in 2015 against Epstein's former girlfriend, Ghislaine Maxwell.

Prominent figures, including Prince Andrew and former Presidents Bill Clinton and Donald Trump, included in a 2016 deposition of Johanna Sjoberg, a former employee of Epstein.

She says in the document that she and Epstein had a conversation and, quote, "He said one time that Clinton likes them young, referring to girls."

When asked if Clinton was a friend of Epstein's, she said she understood Epstein had, quote, "dealings with Clinton."

Clinton has not been accused of any crimes or wrongdoing related to Epstein and has denied any kind of criminal activity. But in 2019, he admits to having flown on Epstein's private plane but knew nothing of the financiers, quote, "terrible crimes."

Sjoberg also recalled a time she was with Epstein on one of his planes and pilots said he needed to land in Atlantic City. Jeffrey said, "Great, we'll call up Trump and we'll go to -- I don't recall the name of the casino -- but we'll go to the casino."

She said in a deposition she never gave a massage to Trump. This is the first reference to Donald Trump, but he is not accused of any wrongdoing.

LISA BRYANT, DIRECTOR, "JEFFREY EPSTEIN: FILTHY RICH": Right now, the only person who has been prosecuted is a woman, Ghislaine Maxwell, who certainly, you know, should be behind bars.

But it's interesting in this, you know, network of all these men who have been trafficking, you know, young women and under-age women for decades and yet the only person that's been prosecuted, you know, is a woman.

There are many, many other people that, you know, are -- should be held accountable as well.

PROKUPECZ: The documents also contains excerpts of depositions taken of Virginia Roberts Guiffre, who previously reached an out-of-court settlement in her sexual abuse lawsuit against Prince Andrew.

Guiffre alleged in her deposition that Maxwell directed her to have sexual contact with people, including former New Mexico Governor Bill Richardson, Prince Andrew, and tech guru, Marvin Minsky.

Attorneys for Ghislaine Maxwell said in a statement on Wednesday, "She has consistently and vehemently maintained her innocence."

This is the first set of documents to be unsealed under a December 18th court order, with more expected in the coming weeks. The documents are expected to include nearly 200 names, including some

of Epstein's accusers, prominent businesspeople and politicians.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KEILAR: Our thanks to Shimon Prokupecz for that.

And now to some of the other headlines that we are watching this hour.

New video out of Japan showing the incredible moment a man is pulled from the rubble three days after a 7.5 magnitude earthquake struck the country's west coast.

The survivor's family watching on as he has pulled from the collapsed House. The quake has killed more than 80 people with dozens still missing. Thousands of troops have been dispatched to the region to assist in rescue operations.

In the meantime, a Biden administration official has resigned over the handling of the Israel-Hamas war. Tariq Habash was a policy adviser in the Department of Education.

In a letter to the education secretary, Miguel Cardoni, Habash accused the administration of turning, quote, "a blind eye to the atrocities against innocent Palestinians."

Habash is the second administration official to resign over such policy disagreements. State Department veteran, Josh Paul, stepped down in October as the U.S. accelerated arms transfers to Israel.

And a mostly good year for air travel. The Department of Transportation says flight cancellations in 2023 fell to the lowest level in at least 10 years, with just 1.2 percent of flights canceled. Also noting that holiday travel has been relatively smooth these past few weeks.

Still to come, chaos in the courtroom. A judge attacked by a defendant. The whole thing caught on camera. You may have seen this moment already. What led to this?

[13:49:04]

We will have that next on CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

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KEILAR: New charges for a nomad a man who launched a shocking courtroom attack on a judge and a Marshal that was caught on camera. This is something that began as a routine sentencing hearing. It ended up in chaos and with a trip to the hospital for the Marshal.

SANCHEZ: CNN's Mark Valerio has the latest.

Mike, this video is wild. It really strikes me that part of this was a probation hearing. And right before the attack, this person was talking about how much he had changed and how much it was a different person. Then he lunges at her.

MIKE VALERIO, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: He was asking for probation, Boris and Bri. I mean, the video is crazy town. It is the textbook definition of nuts.

But to dive into what exactly happened here, as you were so wonderfully describing the scene, this is a judge who is relatively well known. Because in a completely different case, Judge Mary Kay Holthus is handling the Trump Nevada fake elector scheme.

So she is a veteran prosecutor-turned-judge and is handling this case for a man who is asking for probation yesterday morning, Deobra Redden, a three-time felon.

As his defense counsel is saying, you know what, our clients has rethought his life. He's going back to school.

The judge says, you know, I'm looking at criminal history. Domestic violence, attempted robbery, home invasion. I think you need a taste of something different.

Boris and Bri, this happens.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JUDGE MARY KAY HOLTHUS, : According to the laws of the state of Nevada

DEOBRA REDDEN, DEFENDANT: (EXPLETIVE DELETED)

(SHOUTING)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (EXPLETIVE DELETED)

(SHOUTING)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (EXPLETIVE DELETED)

(SHOUTING)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (EXPLETIVE DELETED)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[13:55:02]

VALERIO: I mean, we were talking to Sara Sidner about this earlier this morning. In all the law and orders and all the court cases we've covered over the years -- look at those punches on the right-hand side of the screen -- we have seen nothing like this.

Of course, we want to know if the judge is OK. I sent her a note earlier this morning through email. The court sending out a statement saying "Judge Holthus experienced some injuries and her condition is being monitored."

Boris and Bri, as you alluded in the intro, the Marshal who was trying to protect her had injuries that were bad enough where he needed to go to the hospital. His condition was in an OK state at our last check.

And something else that we did not anticipate, he was supposed to answer for these charges earlier today. He was supposed to go back into court. He refused to leave his jail cell.

So his next court date has been pushed back to Tuesday of next week -- Bri and Boris?

KEILAR: All right, that is unbelievable to watch that.

Mike Valerio, thank you for that.

Multiple people injured after a shooting at a high school in Iowa. We are live from the scene next on CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

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