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Hearing on Trump's Hush Money Case; Misconduct Hearing in Georgia; Donald Trump Speaks Ahead of his New York Hugh Money Hearing. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired February 15, 2024 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[09:00:33]

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: And welcome to a special edition of CNN NEWS CENTRAL. I'm John Berman in New York. Kate and Sara are out.

This morning, events in two courtrooms, in two states, that could have a huge impact on the legal peril facing Donald Trump, when and if he will go to trial at all and where he might go to trial first.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Kaitlan Collins, outside of the courthouse in New York, where Donald Trump is expected to arrive soon on his way from Trump Tower here in New York. Also where he will learn whether he will face his first criminal trial while seeking the GOP nomination and, ultimately, a return to the White House. If the judge here rejects Trump's longshot requests to dismiss this hush money case, he is expected to set a firm date for the trial, which could be as soon as next month, March 25th. Thirty-four criminal charges against Trump are what's at stake.

LAURA COATES, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Laura Coates in Atlanta, live outside the Fulton County Courthouse, where Trump and his remaining 14 co-defendants are trying to disqualify the DA who brought the election racketeering case against them. Fani Willis accused of an improperly benefiting from a romantic relationship. The man involved expected to take the witness stand and do so first. And we will see it all when the judge turned the cameras on inside that courtroom.

BERMAN: So, we have teams of reporters and analysts halfway up and down the eastern seaboard.

First, let's get back to Kaitlan Collins, who's outside the court in New York, where I do understand the Trump motorcade has arrived. Perhaps, Kaitlan, we could see Trump any minute.

COLLINS: Yes, John, he has just arrived here. And its notable because there are these two separate still key hearings that are happening here today, but he is choosing to be here at this one in New York, John. That is a decision that he made in closed council with his legal team. I also have CNN's Paula Reid here on the scene with me.

And, Paula, obviously we've been covering many of these court cases and situations where Donald Trump has actually been in the courtroom. He'll be in there again today. And I think for people who are, you know, wondering and remembering all of the different legal issues facing him, Alvin Bragg is the Manhattan district attorney. He was the first to obtain an indictment of Donald Trump and he could be the first to actually take him to trial if the judge does dismiss Trumps longshot bid to dismiss this case outright based on a few separate legal theories that they are pushing back against this indictment with.

PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: That's the first thing we're watching for today, will this be the first criminal prosecution of former President Trump? Because a lot of folks forget about this case. The so-called hush money case. He's being charged with dozens of felonies related to falsifying business records in an effort to pay hush money to Stormy Daniels, an adult film star, ahead of the 2016 election. We've been focused mostly on the federal trials because the federal trial, that election subversion trial, was on the calendar first.

But right now, Kaitlan, this is scheduled for March 25th. And what we're watching for today is, does that stick? Because if that sticks, and the Supreme Court doesn't intervene to change Jack Smith's calendar, then this could be the first criminal trial he faces.

Now, the Trump team may also try to drag this out. There are certain appeals, certain arguments they might want to make here to drag this out. But biggest question today is, will this go at the end of March?

COLLINS: And what's at the heart of this? You know, paying hush money inherently is not illegal, which is obviously an odd statement to say, but that's what's at the center of this because it happened the day before voters went to the polls in the 2016 election. Michael Cohen is the star witness here, Trump's former fixer. And the essence of this case is that the reason it is a crime and the reason that the district attorney believes Trump, you know, should face the consequences here is that because he covered it up that it counts as an illegal campaign contribution, by falsifying those business records that it upgrades it to that. That's a theory that his attorneys have been pushing back on.

REID: That's exactly right. The Manhattan DA argues that all of these payments were made in an effort to help Trump in the election, therefore, technically, they are at campaign contribution. They also frame this as 2016 election interference. But Trump's lawyers have argued, as have some legal analysts, that this is kind of a, quote, zombie case. This was out here -- again, we're talking about 2016. Here we are eight years later. This was not brought until many, many years later. And there are some questions about why it took so long.

[09:05:02]

Now, Alvin Bragg will tell you that they have the evidence now to support this case, they're confident in it. But former President Trump argues that this is politically motivated. That Bragg brought this for political purposes.

COLLINS: What does it say to you that Trump chose to be here? Obviously, this is a more imminent threat, very clearly. Georgia, we still - it's to be determined what's going to happen there. But what does it say to you that when they were looking at which case they should be paying attention to today, he chose to be in this courtroom behind us.

REID: I mean, my money would have been on Georgia, right? Bring the circus. Bring the campaign. Bring the attention to Georgia, because that case and the allegations there really fit in to his whole argument that all of these prosecutions are quote/unquote corrupt, right?

But he chose to come here today. This is a far more serious thing for him because he's facing dozens of felony counts. It suggests that maybe he's taking this more seriously. But let's wait and see, Kaitlan, because we know when it comes to court in New York, he tends to act up. He doesn't follow the rules. We've seen this in the two civil cases over the past few months. He spars with the judge. Something no other defendant in their right mind would ever do. And then when the judge pushes back, he throws up his arms and said, this whole system is rigged.

So, I'm really curious to see how he handles this because this is a criminal proceeding. This is serious. Is he here to take it seriously, or is he here to turn it into a campaign and be a loud martyr?

COLLINS: And he could walk out of here with a trial date of next month.

REID: Yes.

COLLINS: I mean it could be the most - the -- it didn't seem like it was going to happen potentially for a little bit because of Jack Smith's case and Washington.

REID: Yes.

COLLINS: Which, obviously, we've been watching that very closely. We were just talking about it last night. But if that case is ultimately delayed until May or June -

REID: Yes.

COLLINS: This could very well be the first one.

I think the other question here, though, is, even though this is a criminal case, he may not actually face jail time as a result of it, if it meant - if the Manhattan district attorney's case did -- was brought to fruition here.

REID: That's exactly right. Sentencing is always complicated. I mean this is a hypothetical, if he's convicted, the felonies do come with some possible jail time. But usually first time offenders only get probation. So, even if he is tried and convicted here, it's not expected that he would go to jail. But a lot goes in to sentencing. And it's almost too far out to see. But as of now, the legal experts don't predict that he would likely go to prison even if he's convicted in this case. The Jack Smith case is a separate matter.

COLLINS: Paula Reid, we will be out here all day watching this, monitoring this.

And, John, of course, just looking at the scope of all of these cases, it is notable that Alvin Bragg was the first one to get an indictment of Donald Trump, and now here he is potentially preparing to be the first prosecutor to go and take the former president to trial.

BERMAN: Yes. And just so people get a sense of the sequencing right now, we're going to keep this shot up on the screen here of outside the courthouse in New York because over the next few minutes were waiting to see Donald Trump walk in there to see if he says anything, as he has been want to do. Once he enters the courtroom, we won't see anything in New York. We'll be getting reports, as events occur, from inside the courtroom. We'll feed you that information as it takes place.

What we will see all of is the hearing in Georgia that starts very shortly.

Let's go outside that courthouse. Thats where CNN's Laura Coates is standing by.

And this is going to be truly fascinating, Laura.

COATES: It really is. I mean the consequences of why we are here today and really the urgency of it.

Remember, this is Fani Willis, the DA in Fulton County, who has a, at one point in time, 18 defendants. And there are 14 remaining co- defendant. She is the DA in Fulton County. She's the one who brought the RICO case against Donald Trump and 18 other co-defendants.

She hired Nathan Wade as the special prosecutor to oversee the case. Now, it's important to note, Wade has little prosecutorial experience. That will not be at issue today. He's never tried a felony RICO case. That won't be an issue today.

What will be an issue today is they have admitted to having a romantic relationship. The problem with that? Well, she is now accused of financially benefiting from it. And there have been a host of different motions filed to try to disqualify her from it, to try to get this entire case thrown out as well.

Nathan Wade has earned more than $650,000 from working on this case. And those defendants and co-defendants are trying to seize on the opportunity. Trump has said that Wade has used that money to take Willis on several lavish vacations. Other defendants had the same thing about the issue. It's a matter of extraordinary consequence.

And I want to bring in CNN's Nick Valencia here because this is not just a matter of an overall mess, or someone trying to suggest, Nick, that this is somehow salacious details. The consequences here, if Fani Willis is disqualified from this, it doesn't then just go to the next person, right?

NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right.

COATES: It goes - it goes away. It could.

VALENCIA: And let's be clear, it's not just whether or not they had a relationship.

COATES: Right.

VALENCIA: It's whether or not Fani Willis personally benefited financially from this personal relationship.

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We know that she was taken out of state. We know that she was taken on lavish vacations, cruises, trips to Napa Valley, things like that. So, if the judge who's presiding over this case, Scott McAfee, he's allowed this hearing to go forward. She was trying to quash this hearing. It's now happening. If he sees evidence of Willis financially benefiting from this, that could lead to grounds for her being disqualified. It goes without saying, Laura, this is a nightmare scenario for the DA if that happens.

COATES: I mean this is going to be almost Clinton-esque in what is is, right?

VALENCIA: Yes.

COATES: The idea of what is romantic, what was the relationship, when did it start, all very important points here. Again, because of filings that were made by Nathan Wade saying what the start date was, trying to get a timeline for the judge, that's one reason the judge said, we need to have a hearing because it might very well be that there has been a benefit. So, those details are going to be very important today.

VALENCIA: What is is, they've yet to define what a personal relationship is.

COATES: Right.

VALENCIA: So, we will hear those details. And we will hear from Nathan Wade likely today. In fact, I spoke to Ashleigh Merchant. She was the defense attorney who first leveled these allegations, made them publicly. She says she intends to call Nathan Wade first.

She also has a star witness in her back pocket, Terrence Bradley.

COATES: Who is that?

VALENCIA: Terrence Bradley. He is the former law partner. He actually defended Nathan Wade during divorce proceedings at one time. And he is, according Ashleigh Merchant, he has the goods here. He's the one who is going to prove, according to Merchant, that Fani Willis and Nathan Wade are lying, in her words, about when this relationship began, who is going to prove, according to Merchant, that Fani Willis financially benefited from this.

And if that happens, I mentioned this nightmare scenario. A lot of people within the sources within the DA's office that we've spoken to express a lot of cynicism that this case, it would even proceed if Fani Willis is disqualified. Who takes over the case? Who wants to take this case? Safety concerns. The political circus surrounding this.

We know from our reporting that Fani Willis went to two other people before she tapped Nathan Wade. At least one of those individuals did not want to take the case because of the safety concern and because of the politics surrounding this.

COATES: Wow.

VALENCIA: So, who is going to step up and take this case, and how long will that take?

COATES: Yes.

VALENCIA: We should remind our viewers here that Fani Willis was disqualified from investigating now Lieutenant Governor Burt Jones because she held a fundraiser for his political rival, Charlie Bailey. It's been months since she was disqualified from that investigation. Still no prosecutor has been named in that case.

COATES: Yes.

VALENCIA: So, what would happen in this case? That's the million- dollar question.

COATES: Well, Nick, I mean the part that people have to understand to about this is, if Fani Willis is disqualified, it doesn't mean that other people in her office can then take the case.

VALENCIA: That's right.

COATES: It goes to an independent outside agency that will then decide who will step in as the special prosecutor. And that new team could come in. They're not required to follow the grand jury indictment. They could dismiss. They could proceed. They could eliminate some co- defendants as well. Anything really is fair game at that point, right?

VALENCIA: Look, that's been three years since this all started. Fani Willis, basically after she took the job as the DA, immediately began investigating Trump and his co-defendants. And here we are. We're talking about this personal relationship. We're not talking about the solid case that she has.

COATES: Right.

VALENCIA: She got an indictment against the former president, a historic indictment against him and some of his closest allies. We are not sitting here talking about the fake elector scheme of Trump and his allies trying to subvert the Electoral College, the infamous phone call where Trump asked to find 11,000 more votes, the illegal access of voting data in rural Coffee County where Trump operatives went in and illegally accessed voting machines. None of that is the topic here. Instead, we're talking about a personal relationship between two consenting adults -

COATES: Yes.

VALENCIA: And whether or not Fani Willis financially benefited.

But, you know, to your point, this prosecuting attorney's counsel, Laura, whoever they find does not have to pick up where Fani Willis left off.

COATES: Right.

VALENCIA: They could do whatever they want. Finding somebody to do that, though, that's going to be difficult if Fani Willis is disqualified.

COATES: And there's no timeline, right?

VALENCIA: That's right.

COATES: They could slow walk it. They could try to expedite it. But they've got to get up to speed regardless. And, of course, really important to think about here, as you mentioned, the underlying case. None of what's discussed today goes to the heart of the facts alleged against any of the co-defendants, some who've already pled guilty, by the way.

VALENCIA: That's right.

COATES: And what's so important here to think about is, if this is -- if you're a jury, and here we are in Fulton County, right in front of this courthouse. You've got jury pools who are going to be watching it -- there are cameras in the courtroom -- who are going to be watching to figure out the credibility assessments, not of the witnesses, but of the prosecutors who are bringing this case.

VALENCIA: Yes.

COATES: So, if there is some indication that there has been mistruths in affidavits or courtroom pleadings and filings, that does not bode well for the credibility of prosecutors hoping to have that in the court.

VALENCIA: That's such an important point. And to dovetail off of that, you know, Steve Sadow, the defense attorney for Trump, who's a very phenomenal attorney.

COATES: Strong.

VALENCIA: He's famous here in Georgia and beyond. He has filed a motion saying that Fani Willis has already prejudiced jurors by bringing up the race card. Her first comments about this allegation was at a church, at Big Bethel here. It's a, you know, church here that has a lot of fame as well. She did not directly address allegations, but she did bring up race. And according to Steve Sadow, that has prejudiced future jurors on this case. That has prejudiced, according to Sadow, the remaining co-defendant in this case.

[09:15:00]

So, she's already facing a lot of problems.

She would very much like this to go away. She's filed a motion to try to quash the subpoena.

COATES: Right.

VALENCIA: There's a chance that we could hear from Fani Willis today or tomorrow. It's clear, she's not going to want to take the stands. It could be potentially embarrassing revelations that we hear in this courtroom.

COATES: It certainly could be.

And, John, when you think about just what is at stake today, the potential disqualification of Fani Willis, it is not a certainty. This hearing will be very, very illuminating. The testimony that we very well my hear today, including the first witness, very, very informative, how this will lead and what will happen next. This is why we're here, riveted already.

John.

BERMAN: Yes, today is absolutely about when and if Donald Trump will go to trial this year because of the sequence of events happening in these two cases and many others. We could learn by the end of today if there is a trial date in any of these cases, or if they will be pushed out perhaps even indefinitely.

OK, on the other side of your screen from me, pictures from the courthouse here in New York. Let's get back to Kaitlan Collins, who's standing by outside there.

We see a huge law enforcement presence there, Kaitlan, not far from where you're standing right now. Is there an expectation that Trump wants to be seen or heard before this hearing begins?

COLLINS: I think it's an open question. I was in this courthouse before previously when he was indicted in this case, when it came to enter his not guilty plea. He did not speak then initially, but then he spoke after he had left.

Of course, a lot has happened since then, John. We've seen multiple indictments and multiple moments where he has been inside the courthouse, especially when it comes to this civil trial. That's a big question that we have facing the former president tomorrow where he did choose to speak to reporters. And so that's a key question here. I'll tell you what it looks like outside of the courthouse, when you

do see that there is a massive law enforcement presence here, obviously not surprising given the former president is here, but also some protesters are here. Not really more than a handful, a dozen or so. We've seen previously before where there have been a slew of protesters here. So, we'll continue monitoring that as well.

And, Paula Reid, you know, when we look at this and the nature of this case, I think one thing that stands out is even if it doesn't pose the biggest threat when it comes to if there's a prison sentence or what the ramifications are, this is very sensitive for the former president because of what it involves. And, obviously, we covered the Trump White House together.

REID: Yes.

COLLINS: We were both in that Briefing Room as this story was unfolding once he was already elected and once he was inaugurated. It's a sensitive case also because of what's at the nature of this, these allegations made by Stormy Daniels, the fact that Michael Cohen and the Trump team felt the need to make this payment the day before the election because they were so worried about the repercussions of it.

REID: Yes, and it reminds voters, I think, of a lot of things about former President Trump that he would prefer they not focused on. You know, like a history of adultery. Here, you know, this alleged affair with a porn star. Maybe questionable business practices. I say that because just about a block away, of course, we just went through a month's long civil trial were he -- his business, the Trump Organization, and former President Trump, were found liable for fraud. And actually tomorrow we're going to hear about the penalties and whether they can even still do business in the state of New York.

So, this case brings up a lot of those issues and it brings back people like Michael Cohen, his longtime personal attorney, consigliere, turned nemesis, right? Michael Cohen testified before Congress, which became the genesis of a lot of the cases that we've seen here in New York. And Michael Cohen does not miss an opportunity to insult or speak out against the former president and his family. He could potentially be testifying in this case.

So, like you said, it's very sensitive. The allegations go back to 2015, 2016, 2017. And it's likely something that the former president would not want to have dredged up in the heat of campaign season.

COLLINS: Yes, and, of course, it very much is. And now they're trying to dismiss it, but that seems like it's going to be rejected.

And, John, I think it would be -- a big part of that is what we're going to hear from the judge today and whether or not we get that firm trial date really speaks to what we're looking at big picture here. I mean the fact that Paula and I are sitting here as Trump is preparing to go inside to find out what the date of this is going to look like. Laura in Atlanta, waiting to see the outcome of that hearing there in the state charges in Georgia against Trump, but also the decision looming tomorrow.

You know, we look at this big picture of all of the legal cases and legal issues surrounding the former president, which he is spending a ton of money on, it's a really critical 48 hours that we are in right now of what we could see the outcome of several of these cases for a former president who, even before he took the White House, had spent decades, you know, abating lawsuits and that. And we could hear from him inside this courthouse any moment when he walks through those two double doors that you see there.

BERMAN: Yes, a lot of this, a lot of his legal issues coming to a head in the next two days, particularly the sequencing, particularly when and if and where he will go to trial first.

[09:20:10]

On the right-hand side of your screen, you see the courthouse in New York. Donald Trump, he has arrived. We are waiting to see if he chooses to speak before that hearing begins. And it will be perhaps not the end of the hearing when we learn when there is a trial date, if there is a trial date set in the New York criminal case.

We're also watching Georgia, where the entire federal racketeering case, sorry, state racketeering case against Donald Trump and all those other defendants is in peril depending on what a judge decides to do about the prosecution there.

This is special coverage on CNN NEWS CENTRAL. Stay with us.

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[09:25:01]

BERMAN: OK, you're looking at live pictures from Fulton County, Georgia, inside a courtroom where over the course of today and tomorrow the fate of the Georgia case against Donald Trump and all those other defendants in the election interference case, it really does hang in the balance over issues concerning alleged prosecutorial misconduct.

Right there on your screen, you just saw him there briefly before we chose to go away there, right there on your screen is Nathan Wade. He is the lead prosecutor in the case. Now, the allegations here are -- some of which are admitted to, is that he has a relationship with Fulton County DA Fani Willis. A personal relationship. And what has been alleged by some attorneys from the defense is that he was hired in some way to benefit her and that she has somehow benefited financially from the payments he has received in this case. And today one of the things they will discuss is when that relationship started and what's taken place since their personal relationship started.

Over at that table right there you are looking at some of the many attorneys who are there for the defense clients. Remember how many there are there. This room you're looking at right there was filled with attorneys. With us now, CNN's senior legal analyst, former assistant U.S. attorney for the Southern District of New York, Elie Honig, CNN legal analyst -- hang on one second here, guys.

Donald Trump has arrived at this other ring that we're watching today. The courthouse in New York. Let's listen to see if he talks.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. President, are you prepared to go to trial on March 25th?

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: So, thank you very much.

Everything that I've heard and read, even from legal scholars, said there's absolutely no case here. It's not a crime. This is not a crime. And when you look at what's going on outside on the streets, where violent crime is at an all-time high, I think it's a very, very - it's a great double standard.

The other thing -- this case could have been brought three years ago. There is no case. They decided not to bring it. And District Attorney Bragg didn't want to bring it. He said he doesn't want to bring this case. But it's not a crime. We're here for something that is not a crime. Nobody's ever seen anything like it.

What it is, is election interference. It's being run by Joe Biden's White House. His top person was placed here in order to make sure everything goes right. This is a - this is a terrible time for our country. This is a real dark period for our country.

His top person, Paul Angelo (ph) and some others, have been placed into the DA's office to make sure they do a good job of election interference. There's never been anything like this in the history of our country.

With all of this being said, I look outside, I look into the streets, it's so different from when I left New York. It's so different. It's dirty and it's crime-ridden. And today you walk down the street and you get mugged or you get shot, and they are doing this where literally legal experts, legal scholar said, they don't understand it, there's no crime. And there was no crime here at all.

This is just a way of hurting me and the election because I'm leading by a lot. We're leading by numbers that nobody's ever seen before. And they figured this is their way of cheating this time. Last time they had a different way. This time they have something that's really down and dirty that no -- frankly no country does other than a third world country, a banana republic.

So, we're going to do our process. They want to rush it because they want to get it desperately before the election (INAUDIBLE). If it goes before the election, that's what they want to do. They don't care after the election. They wouldn't have brought this except for the fact, no way, except for the fact I'm running for president and doing well. If I were doing poorly, they wouldn't have brought it. And, frankly, if I didn't run, they would have been extremely happy because they don't like me running and they don't like the numbers. The poll numbers have us beating him by a lot.

So, that's where we are. I'll talk to you later after -- we don't know what's going to happen. We want delays. Obviously, I'm running for election. I can't - how can you run for election and be sitting in a courthouse in Manhattan all day long. I'm supposed to be in South Carolina right now, where other people are and where, again, this is where I should be. I shouldn't be at a courthouse. This is something that virtually every legal scholar says they don't understand it, there's no crime. Even if he was guilty of something, there's no crime.

So, I will say that -- enjoy it. It's a sad thing. It's a sad day for New York. They really do -- look, I love this city and I love this state. They have to focus on violent crime taking place outside. You have a new form of crime now. You have migrant crime. Migrants are trying to beat up our police officers. They're trying to do things that we've never seen before, actually.

[09:29:59]

We are going to have a problem with -- I call it Biden migrant crime, because you have millions of people came into this -- this place, this country, that has been so badly hurt.