Return to Transcripts main page

CNN News Central

Classified Documents Case Hearing; Biden And Harris Focus On Key Issues In Swing States; Former U.S. Diplomat Accused Of Espionage; Trump's Hush Money Trial; Security Preparations For Trump Trial; Abortion Rights Battle In Arizona. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired April 12, 2024 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

JESSICA DEAN, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now, a key hearing in the classified documents case against former President Trump. As CNN reports that a Trump lawyer in that case, who became a critical witness, against him has left the team. Why his exit is making Trump world uneasy.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: The Biden White House focusing on two key issues in two crucial swing states. Right now, Vice President Kamala Harris on her way to Arizona after the state revived a near total ban on abortion. And the president prepares a campaign swing through Pennsylvania, zeroing in on the economy. Ahead, what it all means for the race for the White House. Plus, prosecutors call it one of the most brazen betrayals in U.S. history. A former U.S. diplomat accused of spying. What more we're learning about the plea and sentencing of a one-time U.S. ambassador. We're following these major developing stories and many more, all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

DEAN: Right now in Florida, a Trump-appointed judge will consider whether to dismiss charges against the two co-defendants in the classified documents case facing the former president. The Trump employees claim their obstruction charges should be dropped, partly because they did not know the boxes they moved from Mar-a-Lago, contained classified materials. But the special counsel says they were conspiring to help Trump hide those documents from investigators. CNN's Katelyn Polantz is here. Katelyn, what can we expect as we watch this all play out?

KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN SENIOR REPORTER, CRIME AND JUSTICE: Well, we will be seeing the discussion of these obstruction charges. They're charges that Donald Trump faces as well as his two co-defendants, Walt Noda and Carlos Diaz-Olivera. They and their attorneys are going to be in court, but Trump and his attorneys, they're not. So it's these two co- defendants. And it really does boil down to legal arguments that the judge is going to be hearing that say that he didn't know enough in this issue, that this was something in this case where these co- defendants, they just weren't aware of the benefit of moving boxes.

They didn't know what was in them and that their lawyers are going to be arguing that allegedly they weren't acting with any corruption, and so they shouldn't be charged. So we'll see what the judge does. We're not expecting a ruling today, but every time there's a hearing before Judge Eileen Cannon in Florida, it's important and, of course, have to mention, still no trial date in this Mar-a-Lago documents case. We will wait and see if she has anything to say about that today.

DEAN: A big X factor still out there. We've also learned that a key Trump lawyer whose own notes and memos actually gave the DOJ really a roadmap for this indictment. He's no longer representing the former president. What does that mean?

POLANTZ: Well, it's a long time coming for Evan Corker, and he's been distancing himself from the legal team of Donald Trump because he's had to. A judge compelled him to provide information in the investigation around classified documents where he became a key witness. In that case, he had been taking notes of his conversations with Donald Trump and became Trump attorney one in the indictment, a key person of the witnesses, who is talking or who was talking to Trump around these alleged obstruction charges. So in this situation with Evan Corcoran, the thing that he had heard from Trump and wrote down in his notes that makes him such a key witness, he witnessed Trump saying to him, OK, why don't you take documents that having Corcoran had found that were classified to your hotel room?

And if there's anything really bad in there, you know, pluck it out. And Evan Corcoran says Trump made a plucking motion. All of those documents were supposed to be given back to the Justice Department. Not all of the documents at Mar-a-Lago were, but Evan Corcoran was trying to do his part. This is the final motion in his split from the Trump team. And he really was the only remaining lawyer who had shepherded Trump through early parts of that federal investigation and the January 6th case.

[14:05:09]

DEAN: All right, Caitlin Polantz, who always has all the details for us, thank you so much for that update. And let's bring in legal analyst and former federal prosecutor Jennifer Rogers now. Jennifer, great to see you. How do you expect Judge Cannon to rule on this? Caitlin just laid it all out for us there.

JENNIFER RODGERS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, Jessica, this actually is a very easy one. At this stage of the proceedings, the motion to dismiss stage, you have to assume that all of the factual allegations in the indictment are proven, are true. So the judge's only question really is, if the indictment is, you know, if they prove what is said in the indictment, is there a legal reason why that doesn't constitute the violation of the statute at issue. And the indictment alleges that they had reason to know there was an investigation going on, that they moved these boxes at Trump's behest, and that that was with the intent of obstructing or in some way impeding this investigation that they knew was going on.

That Evan Corcoran was about to search through these boxes looking for responsive documents to a subpoena. So there's really nowhere to go for Judge Cannon other than to deny this motion. What I'm watching for is whether she does it swiftly or whether she delays. That's been an ongoing thing with Judge Cannon to delay, delay, delay, and not set a trial date, as you were just speaking to Caitlin about. So I'm looking really not so much for the answer, but for how long it takes to get there.

DEAN: What the time frame is, right. And then on this Evan Corcoran development, he's no longer part of Trump's legal team, likely going to be a key DOJ witness. How big of a blow is this to Trump?

RODGERS: Well, I'm actually surprised that this break didn't happen earlier. I mean, as soon as it became clear that he had had to turn over his notes and was going to be a witness, I expected that he would exit from Team Trump. I'm surprised he didn't do it way back then. So it is a blow, certainly. His testimony always was going to be a blow once we learned about it, especially his extensive note-taking, because, you know, even though testimony is damaging, contemporaneous notes taken at the time really emphasize that. So, you know, the timing, I'm surprised it took so long. But, yes, it's going to be a very powerful witness for the prosecution in the case.

DEAN: All right, Jennifer Rogers for us, great to have you on. Thanks so much. Brianna.

KEILAR: Monday will be a unprecedented and historic day in American history as the first criminal trial of a former sitting President gets underway. The road to this trial is solicitous, expands almost 20 years and we should warn you that some of the details are definitely for adults only. Former Manhattan DA Cyris Vance first began investigating alleged hush money payments, then Trump lawyer Michael Cohen made to Stephanie Clifford known in the adult film industry as Stormy Daniels in the days leading up to the 2016 election. But it wasn't until the Wall Street Journal published this bombshell story on January 12th 2018 about Cohen paying Daniels $130 000 for her silence that news of the alleged 2006 affair and a potentially illegal cover up broke wide open. Initially Daniels denied the affair fearful of legal action of Trump, though she managaed to say a lot even withoout saying much at all. She went on Jimmy Kimmel a few weeks later.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JIMMY KIMMEL, AMERICAN TELEVISION HOST AND COMEDIAN: Did you sign this letter that was released today ?

STEPHANIE CLIFFORD, ADULT FILM ACTRESS 'STORMY DANIELS': I don't know. Did I?

KIMMEL: Wait a minute. That you can say, right?

CLIFFORD: But that does not look like my signature, does it?

KIMMEL: It doesn't look like your signature. So you're saying perhaps this letter was written and released without your approval.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: By March, Clifford spoke more openly about her allegations during an interview with Anderson Cooper on 60 Minutes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: After you had sex, what happened?

CLIFFORD: He said that it was great. He had a great evening, and it was nothing like he expected, that I really surprised him. That a lot of people must underestimate me. That he hoped that I would be willing to see him again, and that we would discuss the things that we had talked about earlier in the evening.

COOPER: Being on The Apprentice?

CLIFFORD: Right.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Trump denied an affair, a month later giving this now infamous response to a reporter's question.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNKNOWN: President, did you know about the $130 000 payment to Stormy Daniels?

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT, 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: No No.

UNKNOWN: Then why-Why did Michael Cohen make this, if there no truth to her allegations?

TRUMP: Well, you have to ask Michael Cohen. Michael's my attorney, and you'll have to ask Michael Cohen.

UNKNWON: Do you know where he got the money to make that payment?

TRUMP: No, I don't know.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: But by May, the dam was breaking. And Trump's personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, was going over it in a barrel. As he said, Trump had Cohen, had given Michael Cohen the money he paid to Daniels.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUDY GIULIANI, FORMER TRUMP ATTORNEY: I was talking about the $130,000 payment, the settlement payment, which is a very regular thing for lawyers to do.

[14:10:09]

The question there was, the only possible violation there would be, was it a campaign finance violation, which usually would result in a fine, by the way, not this big storm troopers coming in and breaking down his apartment and breaking down his office. That was money that was paid by his lawyer, the way I would do, out of his law firm funds or whatever funds, doesn't matter. The president reimbursed that over a period of several months.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: In August 2018, Michael Cohen pleaded guilty to criminal charges in federal court, including, yes, campaign finance violations over the hush money payments. He testified that Trump repaid him and that Cohen was directed to make the payments for the principal purpose of influencing the election. By October, Stormy Daniels was out with a new book, Full Disclosure, and Disclose, she did.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KIMMEL: What has changed? Why are you now allowed to say things?

CLIFFORD: I have left peeps to give.

KIMMEL: So, he did not have a condom.

CLIFFORD: Nope. Nope.

KIMMEL: Which, supposedly he's a germaphobe, is weird, right?

CLIFFORD: That, he was not a germaphobe.

KIMMEL: He was not a germaphobe-

CLIFFORD: No.

KIMMEL:- at all. Yeah. And you made love.

CLIFFORD: Gross. What is wrong with you?

KIMMEL: I mean.

CLIFFORD: I laid there and prayed for death.

KIMMEL: Well you did though, you did go there. Why did you, if you were so grossed out by him, why did you have sex with him?

CLIFFORD: I still don't know.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: A couple months later, in December. 2018, Trump changed his tune, calling the hush money payments a simple private transaction done correctly by a lawyer. He said that on Twitter, though shortly after that lawyer said it indeed was not done correctly under oath before Congress.

(EBEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNKNOWN: Did the president call you to coordinate on public messaging about the payments to Ms. Clifford's in or around February 2018?

MICHAEL COHEN, FORMER TRUMP ATTORNEY: Yes.

UNKNOWN: What did the president ask or suggest that you say about the payments or reimbursements?

COHEN: He was not knowledgeable of these reimbursements and he wasn't knowledgeable of my actions.

UNKNOWN: He asked you to say that?

COHEN: Yes, ma'am.

UNKNOWN: Are you telling us, Mr. Cohen, that the president directed transactions in conspiracy with Allen Weisselberg and his son, Donald Trump Jr., as part of a civil criminal, as part of a criminal conspiracy of financial fraud? Is that your testimony today?

COHEN: Yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Trump responded to that testimony. He tweeted that Cohen was lying in order to reduce his prison time. In summer 2019, then District Attorney Cyrus Vance subpoenaed the Trump Organization for records of hush money payments. Ultimately, as prosecutors debated whether a successful prosecution was a long shot, Vance decided not to pursue charges. But in 2021, it was out with Vance and in with Alvin Bragg, a former New York state and federal prosecutor as the new Manhattan DA. After more than a year and a half, in January 2023, Bragg's office went to a grand jury with evidence about Trump's alleged role in the 2016 hush money payments to Stormy Daniels.

By March of last year, the historic criminal indictment of a former president, followed by Trump pleading not guilty to 34 felony criminal charges of falsifying business records. This could be the only criminal case against Trump that actually goes to trial before the presidential election. Trump's lawyers have called it politically motivated. They've denied any wrongdoing on his part. Bragg had campaigned for Manhattan DA on his experience taking on Trump. As chief deputy AG, he had supervised the 2017 investigation into the Trump Foundation, a case that would lead to the charity's closure. And on primary day in June 2021, Bragg tweeted, as chief deputy attorney general of New York State, I didn't just sue Donald Trump and the Trump Foundation, I won. Trump's lawyers accused Bragg of reviving a so-called zombie case to interfere with Trump's chances to retake the White House. Bragg has denied that.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

ALVIN BRAGG, MANHATTAN DISTRICT ATTORNEY: The core of it's not money for sex. We would say it's about conspiring to corrupt a presidential election and then lying in New York business records to cover it up.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

KEILAR: And all along in this process, the Trump team has filed motion after motion in an effort to quash or delay this trial. Last July, a motion to move the case to federal court denied. Last August, a motion for the judge in this case, Juan Merchan, to recuse himself because his daughter is a Democratic political consultant, denied. Though Merchan did expand a gag order on Trump as he ramped up criticism of the judge's daughter. And this year, Trump's team filed a motion to dismiss the case entirely. It too was denied.

[14:15:09]

And then here, in just the last four days, three attempts by Trump to delay his hush money trial, all denied. Jessica.

DEAN: And here we are. Extraordinary measures being taken ahead of the hush money trial. It will require an incredible level of security, an unprecedented and strategic choreography between law enforcement and the Secret Service. CNN's Brynn Gingras got an inside look at how the NYPD is preparing. Brynn, what'd you learn?

BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, Jessica, they call this a robust security package. Now, we know this is the first criminal trial of a former president, but this is not the first time, as we know also, that Donald Trump has been in court. And so law enforcement has really been looking to that civil fraud trial here in New York, to the E. Jean Carroll defamation case trial here in New York, to kind of take lessons, have discussions about it for the last couple of months and put this security package in place. And it's going to have all the toys, is what law enforcement told me.

Basically, that includes bombs, sniffing dogs, barricades to set up frozen zones around that courthouse, lots of security cameras, more personnel outside the courthouse and inside the courthouse. Now, they have a lot to look at, right? Protesters, supporters expected to be there, the crush of the media. We're talking about protecting also a former president. A lot of that also includes threats that they continue to see online or made you know, ever since this case even was brought about. Here's what the NYPD, how they responded to how they'll handle those.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ASST. CHIEF JOHN HART, NYPD INTELLIGENCE & COUNTERTERRORISM BUREAU: We're going to be looking at the threat picture on a, you know, a constant basis. Social media, you know, scrubbing, just listening to people making calls or making threats online.

GINGRAS: How do you handle that?

HART: We want to find the basis of the threat. Is it real? Is it an online warrior? Is it, you know, what kind of extra security preparations do we have to take?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HART: Inside that court house at 100 Center, 15 floors where this trial is going to take place. Jessica, that entire floor is going to be shut down to the general public. It all kicks off, as you guys have been talking about, on Monday. DEAN: All right, Brynn, thanks so much. And still to come, Vice President Kamala Harris will visit the new epicenter of the abortion rights battle. She's looking to galvanize voters after the Arizona Supreme Court revived a 160-year-old law banning most abortions. Plus, the U.S. military is moving more firepower to the Middle East. Its fears grow over a retaliatory attack from Iran or their proxy forces within that region. And a little bit later, the former interpreter for superstar baseball player Shohi Ohtani just surrendered to federal authorities. These stories and much more coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DEAN: Next week, President Biden heads to the battleground state of Pennsylvania to talk up the economy. It'll kick off three days of campaigning there with an address in his hometown of Scranton. And it should be quite a contrast. We're told Biden will highlight plans to raise taxes on the rich to help the middle class, while former President Trump will be facing criminal charges in a New York courtroom. Let's bring in CNN's MJ Lee, live from the White House. MJ, in 2020, he did so many events in Pennsylvania and Scranton, so not surprising to see him back there. What else are you learning about President Biden's campaign plans for next week?

MJ LEE, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESSPONDENT: Jess it's easy to lose count of the number of times that the president has traveled to the state of Pennsylvania. It is a state that is so critical to the president's path to re-election and also a state that happens to have personal significance for the president. Next week, we're going to see him making three back-to-back stops across the state, starting with his hometown of Scranton, and then he goes to the Pittsburgh area before finally ending up in Philadelphia later in the week. When we hear him speak in Scranton, expect to hear remarks that are, really heavy on economic populism.

We know that he plans on talking about his plans to raise taxes on the wealthiest Americans as well as cooperations. And of course, built into this is going to be the contrast that he wants to make against former President Donald Trump. The campaign has accused Trump of promising tax giveaways to the wealthy. Now, zooming out, of course, Jess, this is all about the president trying to sell his record on the economy more broadly, even though we have seen some strong economic indicators in recent months, we know that there are plenty of Americans who are not satisfied with his record on the economy. Take a look at this recent poll, and some six in 10 Americans say that they do not approve of his handling of the economy. So, certainly, this is an issue where the campaign is very aware that they have to make up ground before November. Jess.

DEAN: All right. Senior White House correspondent MJ Lee Forrest, thanks so much. Brianna.

KEILAR: Soon, Vice President Kamala Harris will be speaking in Arizona as the fight for access to abortion intensifies in that battleground state. On Tuesday, the state Supreme Court reinstated a near total abortion ban that dates all the way back to the Civil War era. In remarks, Harris is expected to say that the ban is, quote, one of the biggest aftershocks yet following the United States Supreme Court's reversal of Roe v. Wade. And she's expected to place blame squarely before former President Trump. Trump has repeatedly taken credit for overturning Roe and has said abortion legislation should be up to the states. But now he says that this particular law goes too far.

[14:25:19]

Moments ago in a new Truth Social post, he called the ban in Arizona inappropriate. He called on the legislature there to act immediately. Well, this week, Democratic and Republican efforts in Arizona to repeal the total ban there in both the state Senate and the House, respectively, were blocked by Republicans. In the House, Democrats heckled their GOP colleagues after two Republicans moved the chamber into recess until next Wednesday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNKNOWN: Shame (SCREMAING)

UNKNOWN: All in favor of that motion, vote aye.

UNKNOWN: Aye (SCREAMING)

UNKNOWN: All opposed, vote no. Ayes have it.

UNKNOWN: Shame (SCREAMING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: And joining us now is Arizona State Representative Matt Gress. He is the Republican in the House who, stick with me here, brought up a Democratic-authored bill in the House, in an attempt to repeal that 1864-era abortion ban before his fellow Republicans scuttled his attempt. Sir, thank you for taking time to be with us today. I do wonder, have you talked to Representative Livingston, who led the effort to put the House into recess?

MATT GRESS, (R) ARIZONA STATE HOUSE: I have talked to him, and I think that the feeling among him and many others in the Republican caucus is that they wanted time to kind of process, you know, what this bill means in terms of the legal implications. You know, the ruling happened 24 hours prior to us convening in session. So I think lawmakers wanted a little bit more time to consider it. In my personal view, I think that we need to repeal the territorial law as quickly as possible, because I don't believe that women or doctors should be locked up for abortions. That's what the territorial law does.

KEILAR: Is he good to go now on what you were proposing?

GRESS: Members in our caucus are still continuing to discuss this. It will continue through the weekend and into next week. There are a wide variety of views on this issue on both sides of the aisle, as you can imagine, because it's so significant and deeply personal. So we'll continue to have those conversations. KEILAR: So you said that you believe there's going to be a vote on Wednesday. Why are you saying that, if... that there's a possibility that that someone in your party may try to thwart you on that?

GRESS: There's no doubt about it that there are some Republicans who will not support the repeal, and that is their deeply held conviction, and there are Republicans who came up to me and who have reached out to me to say that they are looking closely at crossing over to vote to repeal this law. So those conversations continue to happen and in the legislative process, it's continuing to reach out and talk to members and walk through any of their concerns. But I think we can all agree, hopefully, Democrats and Republicans, that the territorial abortion ban goes too far.

KEILAR: Okay, so the Arizona House Speaker Ben Toma did a radio interview yesterday. He said he's looking at this option of getting an abortion initiative on the November ballot. There is, as you know, already expected to be one, which I know that you have some issues with. But he's saying, basically, Governor Katie Hobbs is not going to sign into law something similar to the now-repealed 15-week ban that was passed in 2022. Talk to us a little bit about whether you'd like to see an alternative to the initiative that we already know is in the works because of that mental health exception, and why in particular you have an issue with that.

GRESS: Well, right now, voters are going to have a choice between a territorial ban, a near-complete ban on abortions, and the abortion access initiative, which I think goes too far. I haven't seen any specific proposal yet, but I do know that Republican members are coming up with some ideas, talking about that. And, you know, I'll take a look at that. You know, I'm proudly pro-life. I've supported efforts to respect women and protect new life. I think that the 15- week time frame is an appropriate time frame, with exceptions that need to be included. So, we'll continue to have those conversations with colleagues. But we need to provide voters this November with a real choice between, you know, respecting women and allowing for them to make a deeply personal decision with their family, their doctor, and the clergy. That's really what we need to be doing.