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Trump's Historic Trial; Biden Campaigns In Pennsylvania; Israel's Anticipated Response To Iran; Effort To Oust House Speaker Mike Johnson; Secretary Mayorkas' Impeachment Trial. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired April 16, 2024 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: From the trial to the trail, a 20-year-old woman who was a victim of a crime in a 2024 split-screen moment. Former President Donald Trump in a Manhattan courtroom as jury selection is underway in his hush-money criminal trial. President Biden, meantime, making a campaign stop in Pennsylvania trying to sell his economic vision. What this means in the race for the White House.

JESSICA DEAN, CNN HOST: The United States now expects that Israel's response to Iran's attack will be limited in scope. Details on what that could mean and when it could happen. Plus, the effort to oust House Speaker Mike Johnson is growing. Another GOP hardliner is now supporting the effort to remove Johnson as Speaker. And at the center of all of this infighting, crucial foreign aid.

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DEAN: We're following these major developing stories and many more all coming in right here to CNN News Central.

SANCHEZ: Thanks so much for joining us on CNN News Central. We are about to witness a historic split-screen. President Biden on the campaign trail. Former President Trump on trial. It's an image that could play out over and over again throughout the campaign season. Biden is in the battleground of Pennsylvania today, which was key to his 2020 victory over Trump. In just a few minutes, he's going to deliver remarks on the economy in the face of reignited concerns over inflation.

DEAN: And at the same time, on the other side of your screen, Trump is in a New York courtroom as the first former president ever on trial for criminal charges. Jury selection underway on day two of this historic trial. And earlier, Trump complained he stuck there instead of campaigning. CNN chief legal analyst Laura Coates is outside the Manhattan courthouse. And Laura, what will we see when everyone resumes after lunch?

LAURA COATES, CNN HOST: Well, we're told we're going to see on this very historic day yet again, maybe even strikes beginning to happen. Remember, you've got jurors who are in what's called the jury box, distinct from the jury well, which is basically the audience part of the courtroom. They've been brought in. Now, 18 people are in the jury box for a total of 18 people, including potentially 12 jurors, potentially six alternates. They're being asked questions at this time. Now, because they're in that box, it does not mean they're actually going to stay there for the duration of the trial.

And, you know, just moments ago, we were also sitting here, Kara, when Mayor Adams came out onto the street outside of this courthouse to actually check on security issues. He was asked a number of questions by reporters who pressed him about why he was present. He talked about wondering if the footprint of law enforcement was sufficient at a historic time like this. He feels that it has been. It's also been lessened from yesterday, keeping protesters under control. He was also asked whether he thinks that Trump can get a, you know, a fair trial in Manhattan. He said that was above his pay grade, but that was a fair city, and that we should look ahead to this trial as an opportunity to test what we know about our jury system. But what we do know about our jury system here, Kara, is really striking, because you've got jurors inside of that courtroom in the presence of a former president of the United States.

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, I mean, think of this. You've got your thing in the mail to go to jury selection. You come inside here and you walk in the courtroom, and you're sitting there with the former president, of the United States, there as a defendant, and being asked if you could be fair and impartial if you're chosen to be on this jury. And so we've seen the mourning. They've gone through the questionnaires. They've rooted out jurors who said that they think they have a bias. Then they had the prosecution and Trump's lawyers each take 30 minutes to question those 18 jurors currently in the box. You know, we got some interesting answers learning about some of these jurors that, you know, they knew-they watched The Apprentice when Trump was on it. You know, others saying one juror, as we were talking about, said that she was completely unaware that Trump has been charged in three other cases. So you really get a cross-section of New Yorkers. You know, everyone here is from the borough of Manhattan that has been called for jury selection. And, you know, they're going through this process. And as you said, after this, they are now going to begin doing strikes. Each side has 10 strikes. They likely won't use them all now. So this is not the end.

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We're not at the end yet, but we'll get the first sense. Now we know who these 18 people are. Both sides will have an opportunity to use a strike, to use as many as they want, to eliminate people for whatever reason that they don't want to be in this jury. Of course, that's risky because you don't know who's going to come in and fill the seat.

COATES: You don't know. And Boris, when you look at it and think about peremptory strikes, I think about prerogative. It's your prerogative to strike someone for whatever reason you think appropriate, whether they looked at you incorrectly, you don't like the way their t-shirt fits them, or by the way, you can't do it for any absolutely wrong reason like race, gender, or ethnicity. So you have to be careful about that. But at the end of the day, Boris, you've got equal parts art, intuition, gut here, and experience all playing in to figure out who ought to sit on this jury pool. And as Kara talked about, be careful about using up all of your strikes initially, because down the line, you may have someone you want to strike, and this judge is not going to give you additional opportunities to do so.

SANCHEZ: Yeah, I never thought I'd be judged for the way I wear a t- shirt, but apparently that could get you struck from a jury. Laura Coates, Kara Scannell.

COATES: That was precisely for you, Boris. I saw you last weekend. It was a problem. I'm just letting you know. You can't sit on my jury.

DEAN: It's her prerogative.

SANCHEZ: I've got some work to do. Laura Coates, thank you so much. We'll check back in soon.

COATES: I've got him tongue-tied. I love it.

SANCHEZ: Let's bring in CNN legal analyst and former federal prosecutor to discuss. Elliot Williams is with us. Elliot, Laura jokes about the way that the defense and the prosecution might go about employing these strikes. What's the strategy here for them, though? Is it as simple as they gave me a look I didn't like?

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Look, it's not a joke, and I know everybody was chuckling about it. Something like a tire is the kind of matter that you can judge a juror on the basis of that's perfectly lawful and perfectly permissible. Here's a great example. Someone's attire tells you their class, perhaps their education might tell you how they work, where they work, and so on. And these are the kinds of factors that can go into how a person might approach the criminal justice system or a particular defendant. So your T-shirts aside, that could count either way for you or anybody else. And Laura is absolutely right. These ideas about race and gender and ethnicity certainly by law cannot be brought in. But everything else is fair game including that T-shirt.

DEAN: And it is so fascinating, isn't it? And then I think about that and kind of the psychology of all that. And then you have the former president of the United States who's going to the microphones from time to time, who's speaking out while all of this is happening. What kind of role is that playing? Because that's kind of an X factor, too.

WILLIAMS: Well, it is an X factor. Now, any potential juror who hears anything he says could potentially be tainted. Now, the judge has instructed, I believe, anybody who's even in the jury pool, not even the people in the room, to avoid watching the news, avoid reading the newspapers, and so on because of the fact that they might be subject to some of the vast coverage around the country here. But, look, any time anybody hears information about a case before they go into it, they've started to develop preconceived notions about the defendant, guilt, and innocence and so on. It's very dangerous. But I think, wink, wink, the president does know what he's doing here.

SANCHEZ: Elliot, I know you always appreciate when I ask you questions that are impossible to answer.

WILLIAMS: Who's going to win?

SANCHEZ: Right. What do you imagine the timetable for this looks like? Because the pace of it, so many people have been dismissed fairly quickly, it seems like we'll get there before a couple weeks, right?

WILLIAMS: It's hard to say. I know you love when I say that. He did dismiss a lot of people quickly. Now, the judge did not have to. It was a great way to slough off people who clearly would have been tough to rehabilitate. But the judge could have asked them questions and sort of tried to save them, saying, look, if I tell you what the law is, can you still be honest and fair. And most people will say yes. I would be shocked if this happened within a few weeks, only because you have to find people who are equally palatable to all sides. Once those 10 strikes that Laura and Kara talked about for each side, the attorneys have to sort of, these tofu people who are mushy and palatable to everybody, you've got to find where they are. And once you've weeded out people with conflicts, people with politics, people with preconceived notions, it's just, it can be very hard.

DEAN: And you have to get this part right, right? Because the appeal could hang on some of this, right?

WILLIAMS: Absolutely. You have to get this part right, number one, for your chances of victory, because the jury could be the whole game. And you put a couple of bad jurors on, you could end up with a hung jury or an acquittal or whatever else. Now, messing up jury selection is a basis by which an appeals court can throw out the case. If the judge could find that, getting back to this race and gender question, that prosecutors were striking jurors on the basis of their race or used some other factor, that could throw away a whole conviction. So, there are many pitfalls along the way for, particularly for prosecutors, but for the judge as well.

DEAN: All right. Well, we will continue to watch and see how this plays out. Elliot Williams, thanks so much. Good to see you.

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As Donald Trump sits in that Manhattan courtroom for his criminal trial, President Biden is campaigning in Pennsylvania, a critical swing state in the 2024 election. Any moment now, the president is set to speak in his hometown of Scranton, where he will try to draw a sharp contrast between his economic views and those of his Republican rival.

SANCHEZ: CNN's Arlette Saenz his life force on the ground in the battleground state. Arlette, what should we expect to hear from President Biden in light of this news regarding concerns over inflation?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Boris, President Biden is expected to make a sharp economic contrast with former President Donald Trump as he kicks off this three-day swing through Pennsylvania. He will not be just trying to draw a contrast when it comes to policy, but also how the two men are spending their time at this point in the election, with the president probably needing to spend the next three days here in Pennsylvania, while former President Donald Trump is in New York City in a courtroom facing criminal trial. Now, the president really is expected to deliver an economic populist message as he tries to draw this stark contrast with Trump when it comes to the issues of taxes. And you see right over my shoulder, the banner for this event is tax fairness for all Americans. That is something that the president's expected to stress in his remarks today as he is criticizing Trump's plan to extend the 2017 tax cuts, tax cuts that were given to all Americans, but really favored the wealthy much more than others.

The president, for his part, has been campaigning in the middle of the campaign to raise taxes on the wealthy, as well as corporations, while vowing to keep, to not have any tax hikes for those families who are making $400,000 or less. Now, I want to read you a little bit of the excerpts that the campaign released ahead of this speech. The president will say, quote, no billionaire should pay a lower tax rate than a teacher, a sanitation worker, a nurse. He will also say, under my plan, nobody earning less than $400,000 will pay an additional penny in federal taxes. Nobody, not one penny. I want to cut taxes for hardworking folks here in Scranton and across the country. The president has often turned to Scranton to really vouch for his working class roots. Back in 2020, I traveled here many times with him when he tried to make that argument that it was a campaign between Scranton versus Park Avenue.

Heading into this trip, campaign officials really tweaked that a little bit, saying that it's a campaign where the president is focused on those kitchen tables issues facing Scranton voters, while the former president has a Mar-a-Lago vision for the country. But this all does come at a time when the President is trying to move the needles with voters who disapprove of his handling of the economy. And of course, Pennsylvania will be critical to Biden's re-election if he were to win here as they're trying to keep that so-called blue wall intact, looking at states like Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin heading into November.

SANCHEZ: Arlette Saenz, live for us in Scranton. We will be monitoring the president's remarks and bringing you the details as we get them. Thank you so much. Still ahead, sources telling CNN that Israel's military response to Iran's strikes will be limited as Iran warns of severe and painful consequences if Iranian interests are hit. Plus, just minutes from now, the House is going to send articles of impeachment against the Department of Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas to the Senate. We'll be live on Capitol Hill for that moment.

DEAN: And book bans are on the rise at public schools from coast to coast, but one state is leading the way. I'll tell you which one. That's ahead on CNN News Central.

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[14:15:09] SANCHEZ: We're keeping a close eye on Capitol Hill this afternoon where House Republican impeachment managers are set to walk over to the Senate side to deliver their articles of impeachment against Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas he is the first cabinet official to be formally impeached in almost 150 years. Republicans alleged that Mayorkas willfully and systematically refused to enforce existing immigration laws. CNN's Manu Raju is live for us on Capitol Hill. Manu what's happening right now.

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah we're waiting for the House impeachment managers to actually deliver those articles of impeachment over in the Senate they're finishing up their final round of votes and that's when we expect this to happen. This will be a bit of a formal process they'll go and deliver these articles over into the Senate and they're going to read from the articles themselves and ultimately the trial will begin tomorrow. And that's the question about how quickly Democrats plan to dispense of this effort. This of course is historic, it is in a lot of ways unprecedented. It has been one other cabinet secretary that has been impeached before but that was during some of the Civil War era. Well something that has not happened really in modern times, the cabinet secretary being charged with high crimes or misdemeanors and Republicans do not have the votes to convict Alejandro Mayorkas. That would require 67 votes. A United States Senate that has controlled 51-49 for the Democrats and the question will be how some of the Democrats and whether some Republicans will join this effort to dismiss these charges. One Democrat that I caught up with, Senator Bob Casey of Pennsylvania, he's a vulnerable Democrat in a difficult race but he made clear that he is not concerned about being attacked by Republicans by voting to essentially dismiss these charges as soon as tomorrow contending this is all political.

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SEN. BOB CASEY, (D - PA): Going through this what is a political exercise. But we'll see what happens today in the process and hope we can conclude this and get back to work-

RAJU: Do you think there should be a trial?

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CASEY: -securing in the border

RAJU: Do you think there should be a trial?

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CASEY: I don't. I think we should move on and get to work on a bipartisan border security deal.

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RAJU: So after these are delivered today, then essentially after they're read aloud in the United States Senate, then work will essentially be done on the trial portion for the day. Then they'll come back tomorrow. The jurors will be sworn in. President Pro Tem Patty Murray is a senator from Washington, a Democrat, will oversee these proceedings. Then there may be some votes on the Senate floor sometime tomorrow, maybe some efforts by Republicans to try to force a full-blown trial. But with a simple majority of senators, that will be enough for Democrats to essentially dismiss this outright, assuming they can keep all their members in line. And what you heard from there, one vulnerable Democrat, Bob Casey, saying he's running to dismiss.

But also watch for some Republicans in the center, some of the other Republicans like Susan Collins or Lisa Murkowski or even Mick Romney; a retiring Republican senator who has criticized this effort as well. There could be a bipartisan opposition to this effort, which has been going on for months and months, but will end here soon in the Senate as Democrats stand poised to essentially reject this trial, prevent it from having a full-blown proceeding here in the United States Senate. Boris.

SANCHEZ: Yeah, a historic moment to witness, even if it gets dismissed. Manu Raju from Capitol Hill. Thank you so much. Stay with CNN News Central. We're back in just a few minutes.

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DEAN: A second member of the House GOP is threatening to oust Speaker Mike Johnson over his plans to send billions in aid to Ukraine, Israel, and Taiwan. Here's Republican Congressman Thomas Massey speaking earlier.

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RAJU: You want him to resign? You want him to resign?

REP. THOMAS MASSIE, (R - KY): Yes. Yeah, I asked him to resign.

RAJU: What did he say?

MASSIE: He said he would not. And then I said, well, you're the one who's going to put us into this. Because the motion is going to get called, OK? Does anybody doubt that? The motion will get called. And then he's going to lose more votes than Kevin McCarthy. And I have told him this in private, like, weeks ago.

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DEAN: CNN's Lauren Fox is on Capitol Hill. And Lauren, Massie joins Marjorie Taylor Greene on this. How is Speaker Johnson responding and trying to move forward at this really critical time for this aid package?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, Jessica, we are expecting that we will get a sneak peek, a view of exactly what Johnson plans to put on the floor later today. If indeed we get the details of what that package looks like, we may have more details about what Johnson's future actually looks like. But right now, he is staring down two members who are publicly saying that they would vote to oust him. Those two members have not indicated when they would bring that to the floor or even if they will definitely bring that to the floor. But obviously, Johnson managing what he thinks is the right thing to do, which is putting these aid packages on the House floor, and the reality that he may lose his job over it. Here's what Johnson said just several minutes after that House Republican conference meeting when Massie said that he had asked him to resign.

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REP. MIKE JOHNSON, HOUSE SPEAKER, (R -LA): I am not resigning. And it is, in my view, an absurd notion that someone would bring a vacate motion when we are simply here trying to do our jobs. It is not helpful to the cause. It is not helpful to the country. It does not help the House Republicans advance our agenda, which is in the best interest of the American people here.

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FOX: And, Jessica, we obviously hear a lot from the hard-line conservatives, people like Marjorie Taylor Greene, people like Thomas Massie. But I was just at House Republican votes. They were having a discussion. You saw so many Republicans that I was talking to saying that they support Speaker Johnson, that they think he is doing the right thing. But in the context of such a narrow majority, any one single member can be the difference-maker here. And after Friday, he can only afford to lose one single Republican on any important vote. That includes the vote of whether or not he keeps his job, Jessica.

DEAN: Yeah. One single member. That's all it takes. Lauren Fox for us on Capitol Hill. Thanks so much. Boris.

SANCHEZ: Right now, world leaders are bracing for Israel's response to the unprecedented attack from Iran. The State Department says that U.S. officials haven't been informed about the plan despite Israel's war cabinet meeting earlier today for the fifth time since the attack. Joining us now is Global Opinions writer for The Washington Post, Jason Rezaian. We should note he spent 544 days wrongfully imprisoned in Iran. He's also the author of Prisoner, My 544 Days in an Iranian Prison. Jason, thanks so much for being with us. U.S. intelligence is suggesting that Israel is weighing a response inside Iranian territory, though reportedly a limited response in scope. What do you think potential targets could be?

JASON REZAIAN, WRONGFULLY IMPRISONED IN IRAN FOR 544 DAYS: Well, Boris, first and foremost, I think we have to think about Iran's nuclear programs, other military installations, places where they might be building ballistic missiles. But you've got to remember, a lot of these facilities are underground. I think it's unlikely that they would target heavily populated areas. But ultimately, Iran, especially urban Iran, is very densely populated, and most of the country's top leadership lives in Tehran. So there is quite a lot of damage that could be inflicted by any sort of attack on Iranian soil.

SANCHEZ: As limited in scope as this attack might be, how do you anticipate the Iranian government might respond.