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Biden to Appear with Kennedy Family; FCC Investigates 911 Outages; Juror Excused from Trump Trial; Prosecutors Push Back Against Juror. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired April 18, 2024 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00]

KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: A huge surprise. This is the most storied family in Democratic politics. But the intrigue really comes with the backdrop of the third party candidacy of Robert F. Kennedy Jr. He's, obviously, a Kennedy family member himself, but his campaign has already been rejected by so many of his relatives who are alarmed at some of his more controversial views, but also fearful that he could syphon off votes from President Biden from Democrats who might see the Kennedy name on a ballot, tick the box without necessarily knowing some of his views. And in an election which will have the narrowest of margins, that could, in their own fears, tip the election to President Trump.

And so what you'll see today, in Philadelphia, is 15 members of the Kennedy family joining with President Biden. He'll be introduced by Kerry Kennedy, who is RFK Jr.'s sister. And I've seen some of her remarks. She's really going to try and lay out the stakes of this election, Biden versus Trump. And she did preview a little bit of what she would say earlier this morning. Listen to what she said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KERRY KENNEDY, SISTER OF ROBERT F. KENNEDY JR.: Well, I think, you know, when it comes to carrying on the legacies of John Kennedy, and Robert Kennedy, and Ted Kennedy, He's spent his whole life working on behalf of working people, of good workers. He marched with the UAW, and it helped to end that strike early. He's an extraordinary leader.

So, I think there's no competition with him. We need to ensure that he's elected.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LIPTAK: Now, after the event today, Biden will join members of the family in an organizing event. He'll be introduced their by another member of the clan, Joe Kennedy III, who is Biden's special envoy to northern Ireland. Afterwards, members of the Kennedy family will make phone calls, knock on doors on Biden's behalf.

Now, President Biden has long espoused his love for the Kennedy family. He has said that RFK Sr. was a political inspiration to him. He has a bust of RFK Senior in the Oval Office. And the Kennedy family has telegraphed its support for a while. You'll remember, they all posed with Biden in the Rose Garden on St. Patrick's Day without RFK Jr. there to join them. So, certainly today, and attempts to demonstrate that RFK Jr. doesn't necessarily represent the Kennedys' political brand and certainly President Biden very eager for their endorsement.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Kevin, it's great to see you. Thank you very much.

John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, so just in, the FCC has announced it is investigating ongoing 911 outages across several states. Dispatchers in Texas, Nevada, Nebraska and South Dakota all reported issues overnight. We understand most service has been restored. Not all. And there's also no word yet on the cause.

With us now, CNN chief law enforcement and intelligence analyst, John Miller, who literally just ran into the studio with me.

So, John, what have you learned here? What's going on?

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: So, what they started experiencing in Las Vegas was glitches in the system over the last couple of weeks, which they were able to, with their own technical people, overcome.

What happened last night in Las Vegas, in South Dakota, was a system failure. What they could do is, they could get text messages from 911 callers using cell phones. They could see hardline phones in houses calling, but they couldn't answer those calls. But because they captured the data, they were able to call them back on hard lines and say, did you call the police? So, they worked around it. But the question is, what happened to multiple 911 systems at the same time across the country?

Now, one thing that we've learned this morning is that the same provider, the same technical company, provides 911 service for Las Vegas Metro and South Dakota. So, one logical question, were they doing a systems update overnight to correct some of the glitches from before? Did the system crash? It's exactly what we saw with AT&T, you know, going back a couple of months where it was an internal thing. Or two, as we've seen the warnings from DHS, as we saw in Ed Lavandera's reporting yesterday about Russian hacking into a Texas water system, command and control of critical systems has been under attack by hostile foreign powers. Now that's a giant leap, and they have a lot of sorting out to do, going through logs, going through records within that system to figure out what occurred internally, whether that was generated by the system, generated from outside the system, or generated from outside the country.

BERMAN: OK, so there are two different things here. One, new information that you're just providing here, which is that there is some link between the different locations here, because that was mysterious all morning long, why South Dakota and Las Vegas and Texas. Now we know at least that there is a tech company involved with all four.

[09:35:02]

But the second question is the one that I think is the one that most people woke up to and raised an eyebrow, which is how did it happen? How difficult will it be to prove one way or the other if this was a tech glitch or some kind of tech attack?

MILLER: So, that's a fascinating question because the answer is, it can be very difficult. Now, on the one hand, if it's the - if it's the technical provider, and that was something that happened because technical things happened, that's going to be between those agencies and the provider. But if it was a hostile actor, and instead of getting into the individual city, states, South Dakota City, Las Vegas, they got into the company's systems -

BERMAN: Yes.

MILLER: And were able to send wrong signals to - to commands, that would be another thing. The way that the Chinese, for instance, work in these hostile environments are something that they call living off the land. And that's when they get into the Windows Operating System and they start performing tasks that look like and act like the Windows Operating System. So, it can be very hard to detect. It's going to take time.

BERMAN: John Miller, great to have you here with this update. Appreciate it.

Sara.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: All right, John.

And, John, we have some breaking news to share with everyone out of the Trump trial this morning. One of the impaneled jurors has now been excused. So we had seven jurors. Now there are only six.

CNN's Brynn Gingras is outside the courthouse. She has the details for us as to what happened this morning. I hear that it involves the oncology nurse who was on the jury as of this morning.

BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, and is now dismiss. Like you just said, this is breaking news, Sara. This oncology nurse, this woman, came into the courtroom today and told the judge that she wanted to be dismissed because she was feeling that she wasn't going to be fair and impartial as the judge, of course, has requested for this monumental trial.

And in a discussion with Judge Juan Merchan, she basically told the court, the aspects of my identity have already been out there in the public. Yesterday alone I had friends, colleagues, and family push things to my phone questioning my identity as a juror. That coming from our colleagues inside the courtroom watching this happen in real time. And essentially because of that, the judge sort of reminded everyone that this needs to be an anonymous jury, that members of the media and elsewhere really cannot get into very detailed things about descriptions of these people because of this reason. And said basically that, you know, we probably lost a very good juror right there.

So, again, this is - this - this is the hurdle, one of the hurdles that - that could happen and did happen when it comes to trying to seat a fair and impartial jury for a trial that involves a former president, like Donald Trump. Obviously, a lot of media attention around it. A lot concerns for the people that have, you know, been called into this jury pool as prospective jurors. It's what we have seen throughout this process.

You know, we have reported on Monday and Tuesday, as these perspective jurors went into the courtroom, concerns from some of them, even from some of them who were picked and empaneled, you know, them looking down, biting their lip, feeling nervous about the fact that they are going to take on this trial as a jury member.

So, here we are. Yes, we had seven as of just a few minutes ago, and now we are down to six. So, the task at hand today and into tomorrow and maybe even further than that is to find six more jurors now.

Sara.

SIDNER: Plus the six alternates as well. So, there's plenty of work to do.

GINGRAS: Yes.

SIDNER: Brynn Gingrass, thank you so much.

I want to continue the conversation now and break down all of the things that you said with Elie Honig.

Ellie, first of all, how unusual is this that they had impaneled her. She was part of this jury. And now she has said, look, I cannot be impartial in this case. But she also brings up a really good point, which I've been asking about, which is, I am being identified by my friends. There's enough information out there that has sparked people asking me whether I'm on this jury, and she's supposed to be anonymous.

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: So, Sara, it is unusual, not unheard of, but unusual to lose a seated juror during the selection process.

Overall, looking at this, it's a hiccup, not a major hiccup, in the minor sense. But if we look broader, it could be suggesting a bigger problem ahead.

Now, what this juror did, according to Brynn's reporting, is went into the judge and she said, I don't feel I could be impartial anymore. At that point you have to let the juror go. And, by the way, the fact that we're still in jury selection makes it much easier to release a juror. It gets much more complicated if this were to happen during the trial. But I think you and Brynn hit on the bigger issue here, which is it

sounds like the reason this juror had reservations is because she had essentially been identified by her friends based on the publicly available information about her.

[09:40:04]

And this could be an ongoing issue.

Now, look, it's the court's responsibility, it's the party's responsibility to protect the jurors. It's the media's responsibility to report on what we know. But if we look at the details that we know publicly about the jurors that have been selected so far, it's probably not hard, at least for their friends, their acquaintances, to go, oh, my gosh, that sounds like it could be so and so. And as happened with this juror, she said she got a bunch of contacts from friends saying, is that you? And so that may well repeat itself with some of the other jurors. And the court's going to have to figure out a way to not just lose this entire jury one-by-one, or to have this whole process go off the rails.

SIDNER: Elie, how would the judge do that? And would it be something like having the, you know, the attorneys - would it be possible for the attorneys to be able to know this information but not put it out in open court? I mean how would the judge go about doing this as each of the jurors are asked questions about their backgrounds, who they are, what businesses they're in, you know, what they do and if they have children. There are all these questions that, of course, the attorneys want to know.

HONIG: Right. So, a lot of the information is already out there as to the - what was seven and now six jurors on this panel. The judge's only real option here is to place restrictions on access to the information. The attorneys have to know all this information. You can't keep it away from the attorneys. But really to limit access beyond that.

Now, if a judge is going to start doing that, holding some of these conversations perhaps in chambers or trying to bar the media, you're going to then run into very serious First Amendment rights. I'm sure we at CNN and other media organizations would object to that. So, it's a difficult spot for the judge. He's got to decide whether he's going to continue to see dominos fall like this, or whether he's OK with continuing the process to proceed.

SIDNER: Yes, Elie Honig, there's a lot to unpack here. But as you said, there is a panel of 96 people. There are a lot of people to still get through because the whole jury has not been impanel now, making this a little bit less of a huge issue to try to seat a jury.

Thank you so much to you.

HONIG: Thanks, Sara.

SIDNER: We have much more on this breaking news coming up, but we are going to go over to Kate now. BOLDUAN: Also ahead for us, attorneys for the man accused of killing

four Idaho college students now says cell phone tower data will prove his alibi. The new evidence that they plan to present.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:46:52]

BOLDUAN: We are continuing to follow his breaking news out of the Donald Trump criminal trial that's just coming in this morning. One of the empaneled jurors has now been excused.

CNN's Brynn Gingras, she's outside the court gathering more information for us. CNN's senior legal analyst, Elie Honig, is also standing by.

Brynn, remind everyone what we know about this juror that's now been excused.

GINGRAS: Yes. What we know, Kate, is that this juror is a woman, an oncology nurse. What we're learning is that she came into the courtroom and told the judge that she had issue with being on the jury. And so the judge talked more with her about that. And essentially, she says she was getting messages from family members and friends reaching out to her, finding out if she was a prospective juror.

Well, it turns out there were media reports, not about what she does, but where she works, her place of employment, past places of employment, that were put out in the media. And the judge has now made it clear that those details will not be discussed publicly. They will be redacted from any court transcript. And it's important, obviously, because these people are nervous about, in some cases, serving on this jury.

So, she has been dismissed from this jury. We had seven as of just an hour ago, less than that, and now we are down to six jurors.

Currently going on in court quickly, I would like you to know, that the prosecution has again brought up the fact that they believe Donald Trump has violated a gag order with a recent tweet where he quoted a Fox News anchor about the jury pool and weeding it out. I won't go into exactly what he said. But essentially, they're discussing whether or not he again violated the gag order several times and remind the viewers that on Tuesday there is going to be a hearing about whether or not Trump has violated that gag order in this trial, and whether or not he should be fined.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: Brynn, thank you.

Brynn is standing by if we get more from court on this and how everything is playing out. Elie, let's talk - let's talk first about what the breaking news is

with what we're learning about this juror.

Let me read the quote that I - that I see some - our CNN colleague, who's this bringing this to us, is that juror number two said, "aspects of my identity have already been out there in the public. Yesterday alone I had friends, colleagues, and family push things to my phone questioning my identity as a juror."

Is it more about the fact that she is - she believes her identity is getting out there, or is it the simple fact that she did say then she doesn't think she can be impartial?

HONIG: It sounds like it's a combination of both, Kate. And the judge has a really difficult and delicate balancing act to do here. On the one hand, he wants to and has to protect this jury. And the amount of detail that's publicly available about these jurors would certainly allow anyone who knows them, any of their friends or acquitted, to say, wow, that sounds like it's so and so. And it sounds like that's exactly what happened in this case. And this person was hit with several incoming messages saying, is that you, which caused this juror to feel like she couldn't serve and she couldn't serve impartially. So, that's one concern.

On the other hand, there's the First Amendment.

[09:50:02]

And the judge can't just shut all this information out from the press and the public. Now, it sounded like what Brynn just said is the judge has said, I'm going to keep some of the specifics about these jurors. For example, the name of the specific company where they work. That's going to be redacted, meaning the lawyers will know it, but we in the media and the public will not know. And so it looks like the judge is trying to sort of limit the most specific information that gets out there.

Now, again, there could be a First Amendment concern with this. This isn't my decision to make on behalf of all the media, but it wouldn't surprise me if we see pushback from media organizations saying to the judge, we're entitled to that information. You cannot redact it. This is a public trial. Judges do redact things, however, to protect the process as it goes along.

So, those are the two issues that the judge is trying to balance. I think if I'm in the judge's shoes, I would wait and see, does this happen again. If it happens again, it seems like you may have a recurring problem. If it's a one-off, then you can probably live with it.

BOLDUAN: That is interesting. So, what we also know is that going into today both sides had four preemptory strikes left. I'm just asking this because I'm - the control room is telling me, Elie, hang on, that Brynn has some more reporting to bring to us.

GINGRAS: Yes. BOLDUAN: Brynn, what do you have?

GINGRAS: Yes. So again, Kate, we're getting real-time information from our several colleagues that are inside the courtroom. And now I just told you they were talking about the gag order issue. They've moved on from that and are addressing now another jury issue. This time it's coming from the prosecution's side. I'm reading from my colleague Lauren Delavi (ph). It says that the ADA has notified the court yesterday that the DAs research found about an impaneled juror number four, who I believe was someone who described themselves as finding Trump fascinating and mysterious, they say that they are calling into question the veracity of the answers that they gave during this process. So, that juror, number four, was supposed to be in court today by 9:15. Apparently is not here today. Again, this is one of the empaneled jurors. And they essentially - the ADA say they found records of that person - a person, rather, with the same name as juror four, who was arrested in Westchester in the 1990s for tearing down political advertisements. So, again, this is all information that's coming out in real time inside the courtroom, but it appears there is questions with yet another impanel juror.

Now, it's unclear what's going to happen with this situation as that juror doesn't appear is in the courtroom just yet but has been summoned to the courtroom. So, again, we're still working to get what is going on there, but it does look like there is some more drama happening inside that courtroom this morning.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: I think most definitely there's some more drama. And there is a lot going on with the most important aspect that we're looking at right now is seating a jury to get this trial going.

Brynn, keep us updated.

Elie, let me come back to you.

The assistant district attorney talking about juror four. And this is common - the commentary that was made during the questioning process that he believed - he thought of Donald Trump as fascinating and mysterious. What do you see and what's going -- what do you think of this?

HONIG: Well, now this is getting unusual, Kate. Now, to have two jurors seated who you might lose, or potentially might lose in the very first day after that, that is extraordinary.

Now, here's what happened. This juror was seated. He went through the entire process. The judge said, I don't see any problems with his partiality. Both sides elected not to strike this juror, not to remove this juror, and hence he landed in the jury box. He was one of our what was seven and now as six, and who knows if that is going to reduce further. But he was in the box. He was going to be a juror on this case.

Now, it sounds like the DA's office, the prosecution, went back and did more research on this juror, and it sounds like they're saying to the judge that either he was not fully forthcoming or he misled us, or he lied about something in his background. It also sounds like, according to Brynn's account, there was an arrest of this juror. An arrest does not necessarily alone bar someone from sitting on a jury. But certain types of convictions could.

So, the judge needs to dig in on this and figure out, first of all, are those allegations correct? Did this juror mislead the court or give incomplete information? And, second of all, does that necessitate the judge to remove this juror from the jury pool?

Now, I do want to say this, it is much easier legally to remove somebody from the pool at this point, before the jury has been sworn in. It gets much more difficult and much more legally fraught after that moment when the jury takes its oaths and starts - starts hearing the case.

BOLDUAN: All right, this is, as Elie Honig says, and would know better than anybody, this is extraordinary now what we're looking at with the issues that are popping up in the courtroom as they are trying to seat this jury for Donald Trump's criminal trial in New York.

Brynn, she's standing by. We're going to get back to her shortly.

Elie, please stick close.

We're going to have much more on this breaking news.

[09:55:01]

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: All right, important breaking news out of Donald Trump's criminal trial here in New York. One impaneled juror has been excused and there are potential major issues with a second juror.

Let's get the very latest from CNN's Brynn Gingras outside the courthouse.

Brynn.

GINGRAS: Yes, John, so the issue is with juror number four. He is an older man from Puerto Rico, has adult children and grandchildren. In the questioning process that happened earlier this week, he said he found Trump fascinating but didn't really have strong, political views. That's what we know about this person.

What happened was apparently yesterday the district - assistant district attorney notified the judge that there might be some issues with this juror that weren't exactly brought up in the questioning process. They found some possible arrests of someone of the same name, and they wanted that to be addressed with the court.

Now, this juror was summoned to the court to be here at 9:15 to speak with the judge, and that person has not shown up yet. So, it's unclear what's going to happen next.

The judges did offer to immediately strike this juror, take them off the panel, but it appears that the attorneys want this person to show up and have these questions actually happens.

So, what's happening right now in the courtroom is those 96 jurors, prospective jurors who have been sworn in already, that they are coming into the courtroom. We're going to go through this process of trying to find more jurors.

Of course, at this point, there's an extra juror that they need to find since one has been removed. And there's the potential that another will be removed as well.

John.

BERMAN: All right, Brynn Gingras outside the courthouse.

Senior legal analyst Elie Honig back with us.

Elie, on this juror, not the one who was excused, but this other perspective juror they want back in there, this gets to issues of possibly misrepresenting yourself in the voir dire process, which is serious on many different levels.

HONIG: Yes, John, that's the fundamental issue. When you're going through voir dire, when you're going through jury selection, you have to trust people to be able to tell you the truth and be forthcoming. And what the allegation is from the ADA's office here, at least the raising questions about, did this person withhold or mislead us or give us false information in the course of answering questions that resulted in this person being placed on the jury? And so that's what the judge is digging into.

The fact that the parties or the judge instructed this person to be there at 9:15 this morning. And according to our reporting from Brynn, he no showed, that in itself would be basis for the judge to dismiss this juror from the pool.

So - and it's interesting, John, because we saw a version of this on the other side earlier in the week.

[09:59:59]

Donald Trump's team was going and looking at social media posts of potential jurors, which you're perfectly allowed to do as a lawyer, and they were finding things that they believed jurors were not quite giving the full truth on with respect to their political beliefs and their potential biases.