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Pivotal Day for Trump as Supreme Court Hears Immunity Claim, Hush Money Trial Resumes; Soon, Supreme Court Hears Arguments in Trump Immunity Case; Key Trump Allies Indicted in Arizona Election Subversion Case. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired April 25, 2024 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:00:03]

KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: That's what I keep coming back to. It's like it does feel like this was kind of inevitable after the 2016 election.

MIKE DUBKE, FORMER COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, TRUMP ADMINISTRATION: Well, it's a bad hand that's been dealt that he's doing the best --

HUNT: I mean, in fairness, Donald Trump put himself in this situation.

DUBKE: He absolutely did. But the overreach of all of these cases, one after the other, I mean, there's -- well now with Arizona, is that the fifth case, sixth case, we can't keep track. As an American, you can't keep track. You have no idea.

HUNT: We obviously could keep this conversation going for basically another hour, and I am sorry to have to cut us all off.

Thanks to you guys for joining us. This is a great discussion on a very consequential day. Thanks to all of you for being with us. I'm Kasie Hunt.

CNN News Central starts right now.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: A history defining day for Donald Trump in not one, but two courtrooms.

I'm Kate Bolduan with John Berman. Of course, Sara is out today.

Never before has the country been forced to confront legal issues at the same time like we are about to witness. For one, how far the boundaries of immunity reach for a president. That question, in just hours, will be center stage before the U. S. Supreme Court.

We're standing by for the arguments to begin at the high court over Trump's fight to try to get his federal election subversion case thrown out. That is now up to the justices to decide as Special Counsel Jack Smith is pushing to get his case to trial as soon as possible.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: So, Donald Trump will be in a New York courtroom listening to testimony from David Pecker, the man who used to run the National Enquirer. The first thing this morning, Pecker is expected to reveal new details of an effort to bury stories from a Playboy playmate who said she had an affair with Trump.

By the end of the day, we could hear the first testimony about Stormy Daniels, the adult film actress paid off to keep quiet about her allegations of a sexual encounter with Trump.

Now, on top of all of that, there is breaking news overnight that from Arizona. Some of Donald Trump's closest allies were indicted for election interference.

BOLDUAN: Let's get to all of it. CNN's Kristen Holmes is in New York. Zach Cohen is in Phoenix, Arizona. And Supreme Court Analyst Joan Biskupic is, of course, standing by in Washington.

Kristen, let's begin with you. Before the former president heads to court, he actually made a campaign stop first.

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's right, Kate. He went to this J.P. Morgan building at soon to be the headquarters. He met with some of the construction workers, some of the Teamster members were here. It was both rank and file Teamster union members as well as just some working class voters.

This is something that Donald Trump has been trying to effort in terms of his election with Joe Biden, but it's also a good reminder that Donald Trump, amidst all of his legal issues, is still running for president and still campaigning, or at least trying to, against President Joe Biden, trying to hear in New York City, a city that went for Joe Biden by huge numbers, try to make campaign stops and talk to various groups that might be more favorable to the former president.

Now, we did get a chance to ask him some questions. I'd raised David Pecker, asked what he thought of the testimony, asked the last time he talked to David Pecker. He just said that Pecker was a nice guy and that he's been pleased with the testimony, but he also talked about those critical immunity arguments. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT, 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have a big case today. This judge isn't allowing me to go. We have a big case today in the Supreme Court on presidential immunity. A president has to have immunity. If you don't have immunity, you just have a ceremonial president.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: He also said that the Supreme Court justices were smart at one point, sounded like he was saying that they were going to do the right thing, or he believed that they would do the right thing. But, again, all of this, he's making this campaign stop because of the fact that he is in court now four days a week, and they are trying to figure out ways to keep him engaged with voters. They believe that this is very important for him, and they've become resigned to the fact that this is what the next several weeks is going to look like. So, today, they did this pre-court stop meeting with working class voters.

BOLDUAN: Kristen, thank you so much. John?

BERMAN: So, on the subject of immunity, of course, the issue is not whether a president has immunity, a president does have some, the question is whether it is absolute immunity and whether it covers allegedly criminal acts that are outside the scope of the presidency.

So, let's get to that issue what the Supreme Court will be hearing today on this issue. CNN Supreme Court Analyst Joan Biskupic joins us now with that. Good morning, Joan.

JOAN BISKUPIC, CNN SENIOR SUPREME COURT ANALYST: Good morning, John. Yes, historic day at the Supreme Court with very much an untested question. Can a president be shielded from criminal prosecution for actions he took while in office?

[07:05:01]

Now, just to remind everyone, this arises from the Jack Smith charges brought on behalf of the Department of Justice, representing the United States here at the Supreme Court, four federal counts, fraud, obstruction, denial of the right to vote, all culminating in what happened on January 6th, 2021.

Lower federal courts, John, when they heard this question, rejected Donald Trump's claim of immunity, saying whatever protection he had while he was in office dissolved once he became a former president. Now, Donald Trump's lawyer is going to argue that separation of powers denies any judges to sit and review a president's actions.

But Jack Smith's lawyer, Michael Dreeben, will argue before the justices that, no, when you look at the founding documents, the understanding the framers had and American history over the past couple of centuries, there was never any idea that endorsing presidential immunity in a criminal context.

Now, let me just also say that Jack Smith, in his filings, point to a more modern precedent, and that's Richard Nixon. In 1974, when Richard Nixon was forced from office because of Watergate, he ended up being pardoned by Gerald Ford. And that pardon, Jack Smith argues, was followed the recognition that former President Nixon could have been liable for criminal acts that he took while in office.

So, they both used history in different regards, and it was interesting in that clip that you just showed of the former president coming into the into the New York area that he talked about the justices and thought maybe they'd do the right thing.

Listen, this is a court that he has always felt he could bend to his will. It has a conservative majority. Three of those justices were appointed by him, Neil Gorsuch, Brett Kavanaugh. Amy Coney Barrett. So, I'm sure that he thinks he's going to get a better shake from this court than he might be getting up in Manhattan.

But we'll see the justice's action to hear this case now rather than earlier in the year, as Special Counsel Jack Smith had urged the justices means that the federal trial here in D.C. was postponed from its original March start date. And, John, I don't expect a ruling from the justices until late June. That's likely when it will come. And that will mean that any trial, if the justices do say he is not -- he has no immunity here, any trial would not come until, I'd say, shortly before the election, if it comes at all. John?

BERMAN: All right, Joan Biskupic for us in Washington, Joan, thank you very much for that.

The breaking news, overnight, indicted in Arizona, some of Donald Trump's closest allies now charged for their efforts to overturn the results there. Trump is labeled as co-conspirator number one. We have new developments from there.

And violent confrontations with police overnight and protesters on college campuses around the country.

An Oklahoma couple goes on vacation. Now, the husband is behind bars after bullets were found in his luggage. This morning, his family is fighting to free him.

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[07:10:00]

BOLDUAN: So, there's more breaking news that we are following this morning, an indictment in Arizona. Arizona's attorney general now indicting former White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows, former Trump attorney Rudy Giuliani, and several other Trump allies for their efforts to in trying to overturn the 2020 election results in that state, in Arizona.

Donald Trump, not among those charges time, but the indictment very clearly suggests he is unindicted co-conspirator number one.

CNN's Zach Cohen has much more on this. He's in Phoenix, Arizona this morning, Zach, tell us what the indictment says.

ZACHARY COHEN, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Yes, Kate, nine counts, multiple felonies. This indictment alleges that there was a broad conspiracy all in service of overturning the 2020 election for Donald Trump. And as you mentioned, Donald Trump is not indicted in this charging document, but he is referenced as unindicted co- conspirator number one.

And some of his closest allies are now facing criminal charges here in Arizona. That includes Mark Meadows, his former White House chief of staff. That includes Rudy Giuliani, his former personal lawyer. That includes Boris Epshteyn, who is one of his closest aides even to this day.

Boris Epshteyn, people in Trump world tell us that the reason we have not seen Boris Epshteyn around Trump recently, including in New York for the start of his criminal trial there, is because of concerns about this looming indictment that came to fruition last night.

But I want to take a look at a few of the responses from Arizona Republicans because this indictment also charged all 11 fake electors from this state. You'll remember that the fake electors scheme was targeting seven different states. It was part of this broader effort allegedly to overturn the election.

But Arizona GOP is pushing back on this indictment. They're saying that this indictment is a blatant and unprecedented abuse of prosecutorial power aimed solely at distracting the public. Jake Hoffman, one of the Arizona fake electors, who's also a sitting state senator here in Arizona, he said, let me be unequivocal, I am innocent of any crime.

So, look, two conflicting allegations here and push back here. These charges are just the latest in a string of criminal indictments we've seen connected to the 2020 election, though, as you mentioned in the Supreme Court, in the federal case overseen by Jack Smith, we're going to hear arguments about whether or not Trump is immune from prosecution.

[07:15:06]

Trump not being prosecuted here in Arizona yet, but I am told that this investigation is ongoing. So, we'll have to wait and see how that plays out going forward.

BOLDUAN: Still, a lot of people now already charged, even as that investigation continues in Arizona.

Zach, thank you so much. John?

BERMAN: All right. This morning, two Connecticut barbers are heroes after jumping into action when they saw a toddler wandering into a busy intersection. Rafael Santana and Osvaldo Lugo were working at their barbershop when they saw the little girl walking in the middle of the road.

Without hesitating, they ran out to scoop her up and save her from a car speeding by. Both men say they are grateful they saw her when they did and that she was not hurt. Her mother was located a bus stop nearby.

We have special coverage this morning of a truly historic day, an unprecedented day in multiple courts.

Now, the wife of Clarence Thomas, remember, was in touch with White House and state officials following the 2020 presidential election, advocating efforts to overturn the results. Today, Clarence Thomas hears arguments about whether Donald Trump should be immune from prosecution over this. No recusal.

Clashes at college campuses escalate overnight. We have the latest from the hot spots around the country. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:20:00]

BERMAN: All right. This is CNN's special live coverage of a really historic day in not one but two courts this morning. At the Supreme Court, the justices will hear arguments over whether Donald Trump is immune from prosecution over January 6th. We may be able to tell from their questions this morning if this case has any hope of getting before a jury before Election Day in November.

And, of course, you're looking at live pictures from Trump Tower in New York. Today, testimony resumes in the New York criminal case against Donald Trump. David Pecker, the man who once ran the National Enquirer, back on the stand for testimony that could be crucial in the case against Trump.

In the meantime, there is other news. Kate?

BOLDUAN: Yes, more unrest, more chaos and more arrests overnight at college campuses across the country. Pro-Palestinian protesters clashing again and again with law enforcement overnight, that included at Emerson College in Boston. Protesters met in the streets by police in riot gear who were sent there to dismantle the encampment that they had set up. More than a hundred people were arrested.

At USC in Los Angeles, there was also conflict between police and protesters leading to the arrest of nearly a hundred people as well. The protests there are over for now, but the USC campus remains closed.

At the University of Texas at Austin, state troopers arrested 30-plus people after sometimes violent altercations. As you can see, it's in all parts of the country that this is playing out right now.

CNN's Polo Sandoval is live outside Columbia University in New York, where this is really where it all really began and picked up steam, and CNN's Ed Lavendera is outside the University of Texas at Austin.

Polo, let me start with you. In addition to what we've seen has been the continued struggle for the school and protesters to calm this all down, you now have the Republican House speaker who came to Columbia University yesterday, jumping into all of this, his reception, it was -- he did not receive a good reception.

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Kate. And to your point, this really is sort of the where the epicenter of what we've been seeing throughout the country here. And in terms of what we heard from the speaker yesterday, during the visit calling on the president of Columbia University, while he was joined some of his Republican lawmakers, calling on the president to step down, as he put it, if she cannot bear an order to this campus.

Now, it's important to point out that the Columbia board saying that it strongly stands behind President Minouche Shafik as they try to work out a potential resolution here. Meanwhile, we have also heard recently from the Columbia College dean saying, recognizing very clearly that there have been, without question, instances of intimidation and harassment.

And that is something that the university says it's still trying to certainly address with disciplinary action when they can, but also recognizing that there are limits some of the community actually says, especially off campus, and that is the other for the other side of the story that a conversation that's happening about how to address that as well, and still continue concerns about non-students or people that are not affiliated with the university from potentially trespassing on campus. And that is another issue that the university is still trying to address.

Really, that encampment that has led to still the standoff between members of those student organizations that are holding that encampment, at the same time, also speaking to the university to try to bring this to a resolution with commencement still weeks away, and the university making clear in a statement yesterday that he intends to not allow any disruptions of that graduation ceremony next month. Kate?

BOLDUAN: All right. Polo is in New York.

Let's get over to Texas now. Ed Lavandera is at the University of Texas at Austin. Ed, what's happening there?

ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, much quieter, Kate. But for several hours yesterday, very tense and at times violent situations here on this campus, as a student organization called the Palestine Solidarity Committee organized what they described was supposed to be an educational event here on the South Mall of the university.

Now, university officials say that the group was explicitly told not to hold the event. But as soon as it started and the students try to make their way here to the South Mall area, that is when a large line of state troopers showed up here at the U.T. campus, and that's when the confrontations began.

[07:25:01]

Texas Department of Public Safety, the state troopers say some 34 protesters have been arrested. That was the latest number that we had received from them last night. The student organization says it's actually more than 70 people that were arrested in the protest last night.

And we spoke with one protester who said everything was peaceful, that it was the law enforcement presence that turned everything violent yesterday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think had it not been for the authorities, for the police in this situation, we would have had a very peaceful, joyful day of just community building. But, unfortunately, the police did escalate it.

I know people who've died. I have friends who've had their entire families killed. It's a very difficult situation and we're just expected as students to go on with our lives, to just continue.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LAVANDERA: The U.T. president says that the student organization violated, quote, institutional rules and that the university will not be quote occupied.

There is another protest scheduled for later today involving many faculty members here on the U.T. campus. This was already scheduled having to do with the protests of the schools and the DEI enforcement that is going on here at the campus. But now it's taking on a new life because of what happened here yesterday. Kate?

BOLDUAN: It sure seems so. Ed, thank you so much. Ed is in Texas for us, Polo Sandoval in New York. We're going to continue to follow this for all of you.

So, this morning, Donald Trump speaking out before the Supreme Court takes up his case there, just as he's also headed back to the courtroom in New York for his criminal trial to continue and slamming the New York judge for not letting him attend the arguments in Washington today.

And this just in, the Biden administration is cracking down on coal- fired power plants, seen as one of his most significant climate actions to date. We have the details.

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