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Violent Turn at UCLA; Police Tear Down Encampment at University of Wisconsin; Florida's Abortion Ban Takes Effect Today Florida State Senator Lauren Book is Interviewed about the Abortion Ban. Aired 9- 9:30a ET

Aired May 01, 2024 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

MAYOR ERIC ADAMS (D), NEW YORK: Facilities.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: What's happened?

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: All right, so we are on - just off of Columbia University. And you're seeing behind me, that is Hamilton Hall, where police stormed in from many different vantage points, jumping through windows, with - in really a shock and awe to try to get to the protesters who had broken in and occupied the building.

They occupied the building, throwing out sort of banners that read things like "intifada" and "free Palestine." They have been on campus for the pro-Palestinian movement for two weeks now. Two weeks would be today. But they were removed. Dozens of people arrested. We are hearing now that they have - some of them have already been released from jail.

But you're listening there to Mayor Eric Adams of New York City, and he says that he - that the - that this was a protest that had been, and this is his words, co-opted by outside influences. And he says that they were going to - they've been sounding the alarm that these protests were supposed to be peaceful, he said, but that they had been co-opted by outside influences and that he was going to show evidence that there were people who were not affiliated with Columbia University, who were part of this protests on campus.

You will remember, this has been going on for a couple of weeks. You had an encampment that was outside, but on Columbia University campus, that had tents that were there. The university had wanted those tents to disperse. There had been discussions between the university and the student protests leaders that broke down at 2:00 on a Monday. And since then, then you had this incident overnight where you had people breaking in to the Hamilton Hall and police coming in the evening to get them.

We also have protests that are happening across the country. And one of them got extremely violent last night. All of it captured on video.

I want to go now to the UCLA campus in Los Angeles where our Stephanie Elam is, because now there is a large police presence who have shown up after the violence overnight.

Stephanie, what can you tell us at this hour.

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it's definitely a complete different energy here now then what we saw overnight once we've been here. Now that the sun has come up, you can see a little bit more. You can even just tell by looking at the police officers that it's a different energy now. Things are much calmer here. They're quieter. There was chanting overnight.

If you look at that video that was happening late last night, early into the early hours of this morning, you could see that there were skirmishes happening in different parts of this green area here on UCLA, on this area were, in front of us, you can see the pro-Israeli supporters have been, and then there's a barricade. Then there's a walkway where there was some hired security. And then on the other side of that is the Palestinian encampment.

And what we saw in some of this video, we saw some change here where there was people who were going at the Palestinian encampment, pulling away the barricades. The security in the middle was trying to keep those barricades in place.

We also know from some of the student reporters for "The Daily Buren" here, the student newspaper, saying that some of the reporters were actually assaulted and gassed during what was happening here last night. They're calling it, quote, dangerous and that they needed to get out of here.

We do know that the mayor, Karen Bass, put out a statement last night than what she was seeing on the campus was abhorrent. The chancellor saying that what was happening here on campus was now unlawful.

All of this setting the scene for somewhere around after 1:00 a.m. is when we started to see this big police presence arrive here on campus.

When I got here, this barricade wasn't even here. We saw the law enforcement officers who were from different agencies locally, but from different agencies, coming up and making a line here and then pushing some of protesters out along that path over there, pushing them out, pushing them out, and then they slowly started to erect this barricade and then they pulled back.

So, things are a lot calmer here. We saw some of the people out here for a while who were still playing music very loudly, still chanting, yelling, yelling at some people. And there were some people trying to keep people apart. Last night, as well as today. And now they've cleared out as we're getting closer to the sun coming up here.

But it's still not clear at this point, Sara, what exactly transpired that forced these sides to clash overnight as they did here on the campus of UCLA. Very different than what we saw during the day yesterday for sure.

SIDNER: Yes, that overnight clash was wild, for lack of a better word.

[09:05:04]

We did talk to a student who was at the encampment last hour who said that it began with a group of people they hadn't seen before on campus and they say that they were attacked. We will be hearing more from the police certainly as to how all of this went down. But we did notice one student was being severely beaten by the crowd that had showed up that was counter protesting that encampment there, the pro-Palestinian encampment.

I do have a question for you because in talking to that student he said, look, we have not yet heard from police that we must disperse. Have you heard anything this morning from the police as to what they're going to do further? Have you heard any of those announcements that the encampment is - has been deemed illegal by the university and that the police are going to move in?

ELAM: Yes, no, we have not heard that. I mean we saw the police pushing people out. There were definitely in there riot gear, law enforcement officers were. But there have been no announcements. We heard some more chanting start up again from the encampment, but that's it. We haven't actually heard any loudspeaker announcements from law enforcement out here. They definitely made their presence known, but at the same time they seem to just use their physical presence to push people out. We didn't actually see them going after anyone from where we are standing here. We didn't see that happening. It was all more of a physical presence together, creating getting that wall and pushing people out.

So, not the aggressive stance that we've seen in other times and other instances here on the campus of UCLA. So, still a lot of questions about when the decision for them to come on campus happened and how they decided to tactically interact with the people that are here.

SIDNER: Yes, that's a really good point, Stephanie Elam. We heard that from a student as well, that they said that they were not getting help from the police once they were under attack.

We will be watching this. I know you will be on campus. Thank you so much to you and your crew out there watching that for us.

I do want to go to some pictures right now of the University of Wisconsin. There is a student protest there that is happening at this hour. And police have moved in. Police have moved in to clear out protesters on that university. You hear the chanting there and there is police activity going on, on that campus as we speak. So, at least two campuses where police have moved in to try and move out the protesters.

And then, of course, overnight here at Columbia, that is exactly what happened on this campus. This would have been two weeks of the protests today that began with an encampment with tents outside that turned into two different places where students were occupying space. One was in the encampment with the tents and the other here at Hamilton Hall. Hamilton Hall with a long history of being occupied by students during protests. So, I think we are still looking at those pictures there in Wisconsin

where you're seeing police and protesters come up against one another as police are trying to move protesters who were there for Palestinians and who are there to ask for a ceasefire and for their universities to divest from Israel, they are being moved out as we speak.

So, that is the scene on university campuses.

We are going to listen in here to what is going on there in Wisconsin as police activity is happening there right now.

Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get back! Get back! Get back! Get back!

(INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hold! Hold!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: So, you're listening to police tell students to get back there. And you can hear the situation very tense there on the University of Wisconsin campus. We will continue to listen into this just a bit here.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Back up! Back up! Back up! Back up!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You're public servants. You serve us! You serve us (EXPLETIVE DELETED).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: So, you can see what's taking place in Madison, Wisconsin.

Sara, I know you're standing by at Columbia without much ability to see this video. This is live right now at Madison, in Wisconsin, where these protests have been going on as well.

[09:10:03]

And law enforcement there just appear to move in to break up some of the barricades and appeared to take some people into custody. Some pushing and shoving that you can see there as well.

We saw much worse than this overnight at UCLA, where some protesters and counter protesters were clashing with each other.

What you see here again is police pushing the line of protesters back. And the protests trying to hold their ground there and shoving back at law enforcement.

You also see, as we have seen at many of these protests around the country, the protesters are masked. Some of the reasons for that is so that they can't get doxed. Some of it is so that if they are seen on video later on that footage cannot be used against them in trial. But you do see it at more and more of the protests around the country.

The situation seems to be stabilized right there. Tense but stable, Sara. And again, I expect that you'll see scenes like this around the country today as colleges in different states see what happened at Columbia overnight and some of the protesters react to that. Certainly at UCLA overnight we saw much worse than this, Sara.

SIDNER: Yes, it's absolutely true. And, you know, we should mention that, you know, here at Columbia and in some of these universities, Columbia told students that broke into Hamilton Hall that they would be expelled as opposed to suspended, which they suspended some of the protesters when the first police action happened here a couple of weeks ago.

And you were seeing this all over campus. So another reason for some of the protesters using - trying to sort of obscure their faces is not wanting to face the consequences from the universities. That is a possibility as well.

But we are seeing this across the United States and really here in Columbia because it's sort of the epicenter, which pushed this to the fore. And then you see students, you know, at UCLA, at USC. You saw students at UT Austin. You see students at Tulane.

Now, this morning, we're seeing, you know, the havoc that is going on because SWAT teams, for example, at Tulane went in to remove student protesters there. Here, at Columbia University, we saw an incredible scene of shock and awe with dozens of police officers going into all different vantage points from the second story window, to the - to the door, and pulling out protesters who had broken into that hall as well.

So, there is a lot of police activity going on, on college campuses right now. And this is all due to the war in Gaza. Basically the war has come home in the minds of these students and they want to see some action on the university. Now they are seeing police action instead.

John, Kate.

BERMAN: All right, Sara, standby for a moment. Again, we continue to look at the picture from the University of Wisconsin at Madison.

I want to bring in our homeland security analysts, Juliette Kayyem.

And, Juliette, we are looking at these pictures. Sara described, I think, the shock and awe of it. But purely from a law enforcement standpoint, particularly when we're talking about Colombia last night, as an operation, it was less than two hours long. As an operation, they moved through the building that had been occupied, remove the people that were in there, cleared the campus, made arrests, and there were no reports of serious injuries on site there.

JULIETTE KAYYEM, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Yes.

BERMAN: Does that provide an example of how to take care of these situations?

KAYYEM: Yes. It provides a good example as a last resort. So, we've been saying throughout the last two weeks that - that this kind of police action really should be a last resort and in some instances it may be appropriate that each - and each individual university or college is going to have to decide when that - when that moment comes.

But what we saw last night in real time, I was with you, is the - is - is a tiered approach in which you give students an off-ramp. That was the most important thing so that the pool of people that may be - that you would have to arrest gets limited. So, we saw students first leave and then - and then the - the more limited arrest than we would have officially thought, and then the protection of the space. This has been a consistent theme of mine over the last two weeks. Protest is a natural part of college and university activity. They needed to provide outlets for students to protest this difficult issue. The ratcheting up that you've seen that I'm talking over right now -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, guys, things have picked up in the last -

BERMAN: Keep going, Juliette.

KAYYEM: Yes.

BERMAN: And again, if you can, describe what we are seeing -

KAYYEM: Sorry.

BERMAN: It's OK because we're getting an audio bleed.

[09:15:01]

And if our control room can get rid of that, from the University of Wisconsin, in Madison. But as we look at this, if you can see what's happening and how police are handling it there, again, its tense.

KAYYEM: Yes.

BERMAN: I'm not suggesting it's not tense. But it also does appear controlled and deliberate.

KAYYEM: No. Right. And this is different - exactly. This is different than two weeks ago when you saw sort of at some of these schools that sort of automatic armed law enforcement approach with only one solution available, which was conflict. Police have been known and are trained, as we certainly know, for a de-escalation techniques. I hope and I think that's what you're seeing now. They - that not that they're casual. They are just trying to isolate and secure certain areas, make sure they don't bleed over to other areas. So that's the kind of use of law enforcement, basically time and manner enforcements, to ensure that two things. One, of course, that the community is protected. But, secondly, also we - you know, that the protesters are protected. It is - that is - that is part of what we need to do as well so that they're not harmed.

And I think what I'm seeing now on air is basically just isolation of a limited area of protesters who seem to be willing to be arrested. If you break the law, you're - and you're willing to be arrested, that is the part of what the students perceive as civil disobedience. They're - they're not allowed to do unlawful things and then not face consequences. And most of them still, even though we've now still had these numerous hot spots, most of this still, at colleges and universities throughout the country, is still peaceful protest. And the goal is, I know this sounds counterintuitive, but the deployment of safety and security personnel actually can de-escalate these situations. It's the vulnerabilities that we are - and the openness that we have often seen that causes these kinds of conflicts.

And so I - hopefully we can, you know, I've been saying this for two weeks, de-escalate, de-escalate, de-escalate. We know how to do this and we've seen it. I - we always talk about the bad examples, but I'm also looking at north - you know, Northwestern and Brown and Wesleyan and other schools that are engaging students, allowing them to protest, making sure that other students are safe and secure, having appropriate time and place restrictions, protecting graduation, which is key for all of us, and where that's not occurring to utilize law enforcement in a manner that is - that is tiered. And I think that's what we saw last night and what we're seeing now.

BERMAN: It's interesting to see the choice that some of those law enforcement officers were making -

KAYYEM: Yes.

BERMAN: Not wearing their helmets as they stand on the front line there. That does appear to be an attempt to de-escalate at least the appearance of what's going on.

KAYYEM: Yes.

BERMAN: Juliette, don't go far. We're going to continue to monitor the situation in Madison as there was a brief burst of tension of activity of conflict between law enforcement and protesters. We don't know what precipitated the action right there. We'll stay on that.

We have our eye on college campuses around the country. This is CNN's special live coverage.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:22:55]

BERMAN: All right, you're looking at live pictures from Madison, Wisconsin. This is the University of Wisconsin, where just a few minutes ago we did see clashes between law enforcement and some of the protesters there. They have calmed down. There is still a very large law enforcement presence there. We do not know what led to these clashes, but obviously the University of Wisconsin at Madison just one of the college campuses around the country where we are seeing protests and we are seeing, I think, heightened tensions this morning, especially after what happened last night at Columbia where police did go in to remove the protesters who had taken over and vandalized one of the college buildings there. That operation did take place without incident, seemingly without injury as well. We will continue to follow these demonstrations all throughout the morning.

In the meantime, women in Florida are facing a new reality this morning. A new ban on abortions after six weeks takes effects. Six weeks is before many women even know they are pregnant. Now up until now thousands of woman actually traveled to Florida for abortion services.

CNN medical correspondent Meg Tirrell is in Jacksonville this morning. What are you seeing and what are you hearing, Meg?

MEG TIRRELL, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, John, it's expected to be a much different day today here at this clinic where we are called a Woman's Choice, in Jacksonville. We are starting to see more folks showing up here, including more anti-abortion protestors. A handful of them here, along with some of the escorts for people who are still coming to the clinic today. Abortion is legal in Florida up until six weeks, but previously it had been up until 15 weeks. So, quite different this morning.

This clinic had been scheduling two to four times as many patients in the days leading up to this law change, trying to see those patients before this took effect. Florida has been an important access point for abortion across the south. It accounted for about one in 12 abortions nationally in 2023. And one in three in the south.

We spoke with a patient inside this clinic yesterday who was in the process of getting a medication abortion. She was comfortable only sharing her first name, Candace, and not showing her face on camera for privacy reasons.

Here's what she told us about the impact of this on her.

[09:25:02]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CANDACE, FLORIDA ABORTION CLINIC PATIENT: I've experienced traumatic births. I went on to have two healthy children, but it was very touch and go. It was high risk. And now being over that 35 mark, it's even more high-risk for me to get pregnant. So, it's very scary that these laws are being put into place, you know. And my life matters. And it's just a tough thing to have to go through. I don't think anybody plans to do something like this until it happens to them and they're faced with that decision.

(END VIDEO CLIP) TIRRELL: So, Florida has also been a place where people from other states with more restrictive laws have come to seek abortions. As many as 8,000 last year. An increasing numbers since Roe v. Wade was overturned.

Now, the closest states where people will be able to access abortion are North Carolina, where there's a 12 week limit, or even further north to Virginia beyond that.

But, guys, there is still a political fight ongoing here because abortion is going to be on the ballot in November. Both sides sort of playing out behind me here at this clinic, trying to make their case to people in Florida for or against abortion. But that, of course, this clinic is trying to stay afloat until then.

Guys.

BERMAN: All right, Meg Tirrell in Jacksonville. This is going to be a very difficult day for a lot of people in Florida. We appreciate you being there.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: And joining us right now is Florida State Senator Lauren Book. She's the Democratic leader of the senate there.

State Senator, thank you so much for joining me.

You are a long time and vocal abortion rights advocate. What does today mean for Florida?

LAUREN BOOK (D), FLORIDA STATE SENATOR: It is a devastating day for women across the state of Florida and, quite frankly, in the southeast. And the reality of this ban hit before today where women were being turned away from clinics because of our 24 hour waiting period and two appointments required before they can receive abortions. So, the reality has really set in. It is a devastating day, a devastating time and truly horrific when you think about 84,000 abortions happened in 2023, 51,000 to 54,000 of those happening after six weeks. There is going to be a huge dearth of services here for women. And it is a scary time.

BOLDUAN: We heard from an abortion provider in Florida, a physician who was speaking to my colleague, John Berman, just last hour and she called it human cruelty. And she said she herself has already hard to - because of that 24 hour rule that you said and the two appointments, she cannot treat someone who is six weeks plus one, six weeks plus a day, and she has seen that. And that's what happens today.

With that in mind, what are the options for women and families in Florida now this morning?

BOOK: (INAUDIBLE), they have three options. One, have the resources to become a medical refugee and leave our state, oftentimes costing more than $2,500, you know, having to travel to Illinois, Virginia, or Maryland, depending on where you are. Two, unfortunately, what we don't want, women taking matters into their own hands. Or, three, availing yourself to the rape, incest, and human trafficking exemption, which I believe, as a survivor of sexual assault, is cruel and unusual.

The Republican Party in this state didn't see fit to have that exemption. And then I believe saw the devastating consequences of that in an election cycle and sought to provide that exemption in name only. And you have to provide more documentation for that, which is horrific for survivors of sexual assault.

So, you have three options, none of which are good. You don't know that you're pregnant in six weeks. And I think this is a truly horrific time.

Moreover than that, abortion is health care. And so if there's any complication in a pregnancy past six weeks, doctor's hands are tied. And that is going to be horrifically dangerous for the women in Florida.

BOLDUAN: There's an amendment on the ballot, a ballot initiative, in November that would secure, if passed, if approved, would secure the right to get an abortion in the state constitution. Republican Governor Ron DeSantis, he said last - he said last week that this, quote, "will mandate abortion until the moment of birth." I have seen that fact check as false, but what is going on here?

BOOK: Look, I think that the Republicans are continuing to try to utilize this. You saw this when the Supreme Court handed down both rulings, the approval of putting the amendment on the ballot and handing down the - the upholding of the 15-week ban, putting the six- week ban in place. You know, lies, obfuscation of the truth.

But what we know - what we know to be true is Republicans, independents and Democrats alike across our state support this initiative. They know that the legislature has gone too far.

BOLDUAN: State Senator, I'm so sorry to interrupt.

[09:30:30]

BOOK: They know the legislature has gone too far.

BOLDUAN: State Senator, I'm sorry for the delay in our audio.

BOOK: That's OK.

BOLDUAN: And I'm so.