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Biden To Issue Call To Fight Antisemitism In His Speech At U.S. Holocaust Museum; Today: Israeli Negotiations In Cairo For Further Ceasefire Talks; NASA: Boeing Starliner Launch Delayed Over Tech Issue. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired May 07, 2024 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:30:00]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: CNN's Arlette Saenz at the White House. This has been a speech on the calendar for a long time, but I think the importance just keeps growing greater.

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, it certainly does, John, and President Biden plans to use this Holocaust remembrance speech as an opportunity to offer a forceful condemnation of antisemitism in the country. But it also comes as Biden is trying to balance his steadfast support for Israel's campaign against Hamas with growing frustration over how that war has been conducted, especially when it related to the impact on civilians in Gaza.

Now, that frustration has manifested itself in protests on college campuses across the country in recent weeks. But those protests have also resulted in some antisemitic incidents, which has caused growing concern for President Biden and the Jewish community.

White House press secretary Karine Jean-Pierre says that the president plans to address the horrors that took place on that October 7 attack by Hamas while also talking about the alarming rise of antisemitism in the country.

The administration also plans on taking a number of steps to try to address antisemitism at this time. That includes the Department of Education sending a letter to school districts and college campuses outlining some examples of antisemitic discrimination that could be investigated under Title VI of the Civil Rights Act.

But even as the president prepares to deliver this speech on antisemitism on the grounds of the Capitol, he is also grappling with an increasingly fluid situation in the Middle East. Overnight, Israel took control of the Palestinian side of Rafah. And while Israel has said that is a limited operation, the White House has been watching this with some concern. President Biden making clear in a phone call to Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu about his position on Rafah as the administration continues to warn against a widescale operation there that could impact civilian lives.

Take a listen to National Security Council spokesperson John Kirby just yesterday. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KIRBY, SPOKESPERSON, NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL: We don't want to see operations in and around Rafah that make it harder for the people that are seeking refuge there and shelter to be safe and secure.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAENZ: Now it also comes as the U.S. is still trying to work towards a hostage and ceasefire deal with Hamas just yesterday, offering some type of counterproposal to some of the items that have been discussed in negotiations. We are told that CIA Director Bill Burns will be back in Cairo today as though talks continue. But really, this back-and- forth in the 24 hours has highlighted the fluid situation on the ground in Israel and in these talks with the White House, really hoping that they can push forward these negotiations in the coming days.

BERMAN: All right, a lot going on there this morning. Arlette Saenz at the White House. Thank you very much -- Kate.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: And there are still 128 Israeli hostages being held in Gaza today. For more than six months, families have been calling on Israel and the world to do more to secure their release.

One of those families is the family of Abbey Onn. Abbey is an American citizen who lives in Israel. Five of her family members were either killed to taken hostage in the October 7 Hamas terror attacks. Two of her family, 80-year-old Carmela Dan and 13-year-old Noya Dan -- they were killed. Twelve-year-old Erez and his sister, 16-year-old Sahar -- they were taken hostage and released in late November. Their father, Ofer Kalderon, is still being held -- believed to be held by Hamas in Gaza right now.

And their family, Abbey Onn, joins me now. It's good to see you again, Abbey. Thank you for being here.

I want to ask you about the confusion around an agreement accepted -- a deal agreed to and now the conversation around the proposed -- the proposed agreement to secure their release that seems to be on the table right now. It could mean 33 Israeli hostages released in exchange for hundreds of Palestinian prisoners released from Israeli jails in something like a 42-day ceasefire.

What do you think of that proposal? Would you like Israeli leaders to accept a deal like that? Where is your head today on this?

ABBEY ONN, TWO RELATIVES KILLED BY HAMAS, TWO RELEASED, ONE STILL A HOSTAGE (via Webex by Cisco): I think mainly, we're heartbroken and deeply disappointed with Hamas accepting this deal yesterday which, in essence, was psychological terror because they accepted a deal that Israel hadn't agreed to. And so, it is kind of a lie to the world to put them in the right light.

But last week, we saw a letter from 18 world leaders that demanded the release of these hostages, of my cousin Ofer, and of all of them, and I think that's what we want people to focus on right now. This is the first time that Hamas has accepted any deal to release any hostages since late November and so we feel like there is an opening that we really want world leaders, both in Israel, the United States, and everywhere else to help push for.

[07:35:04]

BOLDUAN: I was curious if this, like, two steps forward, four steps back -- you called it psychological terror in what -- in what Hamas said yesterday. Do you see this as progress?

ONN: It's hard to say. I think if we're looking at it from an optimistic point of view, they agreed to something. But without knowing the details and without being at the negotiating table, they may have agreed to something that is entirely impossible for Israel. And all I know as someone who has a family member who for 214 days has been kept in a tunnel without access to food or water and who could be undergoing intense abuse, it just seems that for all of us -- for people who care about justice, and humanity, and fairness, that the one thing that we should be demanding is that all of the hostages come home -- Ofer, and Hersh, and the Bibas children, and Naama (PH) -- every single one of them has to come home and that would bring an end to the tensions here.

BOLDUAN: Have you heard anything about Ofer? Does -- do you -- is he still believed to be alive?

ONN: Our hope is that he's alive. We haven't heard anything to the contrary. And we -- it was shocking and hard to see the videos last week but there is proof that these people are alive but that their lives are in danger every single hour, day, week that they are kept there. And we know that Ofer is strong, and we are sending him all of our strength on a consistent basis. But we need them home and we need them home yesterday.

BOLDUAN: I'm -- the -- my colleague, Arlette, from the White House, was talking about the important speech that President Biden is going to be given -- going to be giving today to mark Holocaust Remembrance Day. And he's going to talk about the horrors of October 7 in this speech and also use it as a clarion call to fight back against the rise of antisemitism here in the United States and around the world.

It's seen as a precarious moment for President Biden in pushing Israel to balance defending itself and also prevent deaths of Palestinian civilians in Gaza.

How do you feel about this moment? You have five family members -- your entire family horrifically impacted by this. How do you feel about this moment and this day, and where this war has gone?

ONN: I feel like our world has been on fire since October 7. That there was a ceasefire on October 6 that Hamas broke. I have always said, and I stand by the fact that we do not want to see any death, whether it be on the side of Israel or the people in Gaza. That is heartbreaking and we mourn every single loss. But that Hamas has the ability to end that, and that is by bringing

our family members home. It is a simple humanitarian act of bringing innocent civilians -- one-year-old babies and 86-year-old Holocaust survivors -- home to their families and allow us to figure out what we do to move forward.

BOLDUAN: Abbey, thank you for coming on with me once again. May our next conversation be talking about the return of your cousin, Ofer. Thank you.

ONN: Thank you.

BOLDUAN: Sara.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: All right. This morning, the possibility of jail time looms over Donald Trump as his criminal trial enters day 13 after the judge ruled he again violated the gag order and if he violates it again, he has no choice but to jail Trump.

As for the jury, finally, they got a look at the bookkeeping and paperwork on how the alleged scheme played out. On the witness stand yesterday, a longtime Trump Organization employee laid out how checks were sent to former Trump fixer and attorney Michael Cohen in 2017. Remember, prosecutors allege Trump falsified business records to conceal the $130,000 hush money payment to Stormy Daniels. Among the pieces of evidence shown, a spreadsheet detailing payments made to Cohen, three paid from Trump's trust, then nine more through Trump's personal account.

Those details coming out in court on the heels of a sharp warning from the judge who found Trump in contempt, as we mentioned, for violating his gag order a 10th time.

Joining me now, CNN legal analyst and former U.S. attorney, Michael Moore.

All right, I want to get to just quickly talk about the gag order. Donald Trump, for a second time, warned by the judge that the next time he violates the gag order the judge will have no choice but to jail him.

Now, he hasn't violated the order, we should be clear, since the initial warning. Trump, though, sort of intimated that he'd be willing to violate it. I just want to let you listen to what he said at court yesterday.

[07:40:08]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: This judge has given me a gag order and said you'll go to jail if you violate it. And frankly, you know what, our constitution is much more important than jail. It's not even close. I'll do that sacrifice any day.

(END VIDEO CLIP) SIDNER: "I'll do that sacrifice any day."

When you hear him say that, if he does violate the gag order again, how would the process work to jail a former president?

MICHAEL MOORE, CNN LEGAL ANALYST, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY (via Webex by Cisco): Well, I'm glad to be with you.

I mean, we're clearly in unchartered waters here. I mean, we've never had the issue of having to think about putting a former president behind bars.

And so, I really think that's what Judge Merchan is wrestling with as he goes through and that is how do I get Trump's attention? How do I maintain the integrity of the respect of the court? How do I protect this process? How do I protect the trial?

And at the same time, do I fall into the trap of giving Trump this big political gift of putting him jail? Because the fact is he'd never be in jail in a place where any common person might serve any amount of time. I mean, he would be isolated. He would be put in a secure facility. He may never even see another inmate. It's not like he's going to have to shower in the shower room or use the toilet room with everybody else. That's just not the way it would work.

And so, it would really be a gift I think to Trump, and that's why he's playing this card because he knows that the likelihood of him being incarcerated is slim to none.

The poor judge is sort of like the boy in the dike, you know? He's got his finger in the hole trying to stop the flood, but he can only do so much. The hole being Trump's mouth here.

SIDNER: Right.

MOORE: And that is how do I control this defendant so that he does not destroy the trial process that I'm supposed to protect as the judge? And so, that's the issue. He wants to get deeper into the trial. He wants to get through the trial. That's why you've sort of seen this -- what I think has been sort of a delayed or a stretched out ruling on some of these issues.

SIDNER: Yeah.

MOORE: That is to buy more time to get deeper into the case.

But you're right. Trump has not violated the order since then. So it's big to talk about going to jail; it's another thing to actually have some metal braces slapped on and realize you may be going off somewhere even if it's to a place different than some place like Rikers Island.

SIDNER: Yeah.

Let's talk about what the jury heard yesterday. Monday's testimony from two witnesses really important because jurors finally got to see the sort of documents that prosecutors say were falsified. And this was sort of getting into the nitty gritty of the details here.

We heard this from Deborah Tarasoff, who works in accounts payable for the Trump Organization. She said, look -- she was asked by the attorney, "Now, you talked a little bit about invoices" -- and I'm quoting here -- "I want to talk a little bit about who could sign the checks, particularly for the Donald J. Trump account. Who could sign the checks," he asked, "for the accounts in 2016 and 2017?"

And she says, well, "You are talking about Mr. Trump's personal account?" And the attorney says, "Yes." And she says, "Only Mr. Trump."

The attorney asked again, "Was that true back in 2016 and 2017?" She said, "Yes." And she said it's still that way today.

So she is still working for the organization. She further says that if Trump didn't want to sign a check, he certainly wouldn't do it.

Can you give us some sense of how important this kind of testimony is and how far this went to help, potentially, the prosecution make their case that Donald Trump knew what was going on here because he signed the checks?

MOORE: Well, her testimony was important because it starts to connect some of the dots. And that is can you actually put a pen in Donald Trump's hand? Can you put a check in his hand under his signature?

But that really is not the crux of the government's case. The case deals with have you falsified records as it relates to federal election law? And so, that has not been accomplished yet. So they're moving that way to it.

I mean, this is a paper case. Paper cases are not inherently interesting. This one is a little different because it involves a former president. But the prosecutor has to put some meat on the bone. So they've sort of started building out a little bit of the flesh and they're getting that way. But they're going to have to now go from he knew about the checks, he signed the checks, over to he actually was involved or gave some direction -- gave some direction as it related to these false business records that are at issue in the indictment.

SIDNER: OK. I just want to get to something that just has happened now, so you and I are both learning this at the same time. We know that Donald Trump just posted --

MOORE: Yeah.

SIDNER: -- on social media. He says, "I have just recently been told who the witness is today. This is unprecedented. No time for lawyers to prepare."

[07:45:00]

What do you think about this? We have known this throughout the trial. The reason is because of what we talked about at the very beginning, which is fear he was going to violate the gag order and talk about witnesses or the jury. And so, that's why his attorneys aren't getting this. They have a list of all of the people who were potentially going to take the witness stand. But now, Donald Trump complaining about the fact that he just learned about the witness today and it's unprecedented.

What do you make of this?

MOORE: I think it's probably much ado about nothing. I mean, it is a little unusual. Lawyers typically will, as a courtesy, tell the other side tomorrow I'm expecting this, or I expect that I'll have so-and-so on the stand for a day. That gives you some time to prepare if you need other things to do, especially when you have a trial that takes this long. I mean, that's usually sort of the professional courtesy that goes back and forth. There are reasons that that's not happening here.

But this sort of standing up and pounding your chest and claiming that you've been harmed because somebody didn't tell you until this morning who may be on the stand -- I mean, that's just sort of the way it rolls for him because he's not been able to keep his mouth shut. And so, there's this reason that being -- that prosecutor does not want the witnesses to be subject to tweets and comments and postings and all the night before the day before they testify -- as if somehow, that might put pressure on them.

And so, this is probably a bed of his own making, but it certainly is red meat to the base -- to play it to the game and play it to the argument that he is being abused and misused by the criminal prosecutors here. That this is all a sham. And so, not much substance to his -- to his post, but certainly some fodder for the campaign trail.

SIDNER: Michael Moore, you rightly point out this is not just a legal trial. This is something that is political for Donald Trump and he is using this as his campaign stage every time he can.

I really appreciate your time. Thank you for coming on this morning -- John.

MOORE: Thank you.

BERMAN: I do suppose one question is which witness could he see that would get under his skin like that? Why is he upset about the witness this morning? We'll find out shortly.

In the meantime, overnight, with only a couple of hours left on the countdown clock, NASA scrubbed the launch of the Boeing Starliner rocket due to a technical issue. Astronauts were already in the cockpit when it was decided they would be on the ground for at least another day. This is supposed to be the first crewed mission for the Starliner and, if successful, it would join SpaceX's crewed Dragon rocket in shuttling astronauts to the International Space Station.

CNN's Kristin Fisher is at Cape Canaveral. Look, it's been a long, difficult road for Starliner, and this is one more bump in the road I think they didn't want or didn't need. KRISTIN FISHER, CNN SPACE AND DEFENSE CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, but the irony here John is that this scrub -- despite all these delays, last night's scrub was not caused by Boeing. Last night's scrub was actually caused by an issue with the rocket that propels the Boeing Starliner spacecraft into space. So you have Starliner on top, the rocket on the bottom.

The rocket is called the Atlas V. It's built by the United Launch Alliance. And the irony is that the Atlas V is America's longest- serving active rocket. This is a rocket that's responsible for launching -- this would have been its 100th launch. It is 100 percent success right -- rate. Very reliable.

But last night, about two hours before liftoff with NASA astronauts Suni Williams and Butch Wilmore on top and inside that Starliner spacecraft, they ran into an issue where they found a faulty oxygen relief valve. This is the kind of valve that vents some of the oxygen -- some of that pressure that builds up from inside the oxygen fueling tank. And so, out of an abundance of caution, they called off the launch.

The United Launch Alliance said if it had just been satellites -- non- human payloads on top of that rocket -- those satellites would now be in orbit. They would have gone ahead with the launch. But because there were people on board for the first time, they decided to scrub and delay another day.

So if all goes according to plan, those astronauts will launch again. They'll spend about a week up at the International Space Station. And the whole point of this is to give NASA some redundancy in terms of getting their astronauts to the International Space Station so they aren't 100 percent reliant on SpaceX to get their astronauts there and back, John.

BERMAN: Kristin Fisher at the Cape. Listen, terrific job explaining the context there of what delayed the launch. We will see if they get off the ground today. Thanks so much, Kristin -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: So, a Louisiana police officer got the surprise of a lifetime and also in helping to deliver a baby on the side of the road. According to CNN affiliate WAFB, the officer, Jason Lee -- he was waved down to help escort Destiny Allen, who was in labor -- escort her to the hospital. But before they could get to the hospital, Destiny had to pull over. And Officer Lee then jumped in to help safely deliver little Noah -- a sweet little baby boy.

Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OFFICER JASON LEE, BATON ROUGE, LOUISIANA POLICE DEPARTMENT: Everybody is saying I'm a hero. She's most definitely a hero, you know, at her age. And she had a little -- a young, healthy boy. In that situation -- that environment -- that takes a lot of courage.

(END VIDEO CLIP) [07:50:02]

BOLDUAN: Absolutely.

Mom and baby are both doing well. And Officer Lee says they have kept in touch and are forever bonded.

I love baby pictures, especially in the big wall. Look at her sweet smile. She's so relieved.

There's also this coming up for us. From the good stuff to a new warning, saying there is something worse for you than processed foods -- ultra-processed foods. That new health warning is next.

(COMMERCIAL)

SIDNER: This morning, a health warning. There is new science on what ultra-processed foods do to our bodies, including our brains. Scientists say eating ultra-processed foods like soda, chips, chicken nuggets, frozen pizzas, could be harming your health and making you gain weight.

[07:55:08]

CNN's Meg Tirrell has the details for us. First of all, this is what our mothers have always been telling us. What's new here?

MEG TIRRELL, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Sara, what's interesting about this is it's sort of a new way of classifying food not based on the nutrients -- you know, how much sugar or fat or salt something has, but actually, its degree of processing. And this is leading to new avenues of research. It turns out that more than half of the food that U.S. adults consume is considered to be ultra- processed -- 57 percent, according to recent estimates.

Now, what this actually is -- ultra-processed foods -- is based on a formal classification system that groups foods into four groups. Group one is unprocessed or minimally processed -- things like fruits and veggies, milk, eggs, meat, rice, and things like that.

Group two are processed culinary ingredients. Things like oil, butter, sugar, and salt.

Then you get to group three, which is processed but you're not yet at ultra-processed. That's essentially when you're combining groups one and two and you've got, like, veggies that are in brine or you've got freshly baked bread or cheese. Things like that.

Then you get to group four, which are ultra-processed foods. And some experts don't even really refer to these as foods. They call them food products because they're sort of created with these industrial processes. And these are all of the words you see on food packaging that you have no idea what they are for the most part.

Now, there have been a ton of studies linking ultra-processed foods to all kinds of health problems, but there is only one controlled clinical trial that actually shows a causative effect of eating these foods. It was done by the NIH on 20 people who actually lived in the NIH hospital for a month.

And what they found is that when folks ate a diet made up most of ultra-processed foods, on average, they ate about 500 calories more and over two weeks, they gained about two pounds. People eating an unprocessed diet had the opposite effect. They lost about two pounds in that period of time.

These are important implications, guys, for our health and they show up in the new dietary guidelines -- Sara.

SIDNER: Really interesting stuff, Meg. A lot of us knew that ultra- processed foods were not that good for us, but the way they break it down is actually telling.

And I know that you have a special episode of the podcast coming up here called "Chasing Life" -- it's out today -- all about ultra- processed foods. So make sure you take a listen -- John.

BERMAN: All right. This morning, one Republican is urging his fellow party members to vote for President Joe Biden.

Geoff Duncan, the former lieutenant governor of Georgia, published a piece titled "Why I'm voting for Biden and other Republicans should, too." He says, "Donald Trump has disqualified himself through his conduct and his character. Trump has shown us who he is. We should believe him. To think he is going to change at the age of 77 is beyond improbable."

Geoff Duncan is with me now, along with CNN senior political commentator and former special assistant to President George W. Bush, Scott Jennings.

All right, lieutenant governor, we're listening. Convince Republican Scott Jennings and your other fellow Republicans that they should vote for President Biden.

GEOFF DUNCAN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, (R) FORMER LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR OF GEORGIA (via Webex by Cisco): Well, enough is enough. Donald Trump is not our future. He's not our present. And now, looking back, he certainly wasn't our past. Donald Trump is a fake Republican. He's proven that over and over and over again. He simply wants the position of president to be powerful and he's willing to lie, cheat, and steal for it.

And if we're going to fix this party and go forward -- the party that is conservative but not crazy and angry -- we've got to do it without Donald Trump. And I know it makes sense to try to elect a Republican to be the president but if we can get past Donald Trump and have a Republican-controlled Congress, we can have a firewall in place, and then we can take the next four years to fix our party and get a legitimate candidate forward that can lead us in the right direction.

BERMAN: Scott, I don't want you to feel like you have to answer on behalf of Donald Trump, but as a lifelong Republican, how do you think most Republicans will take this?

SCOTT JENNINGS, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, FORMER SPECIAL ASSISTANT TO PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH, CONSERVATIVE COLUMNIST: Well, most Republicans are not going to vote for Joe Biden. Very few Republicans are going to vote for Joe Biden. Of course, the political analysis question for Donald Trump is will enough Republicans or Republican leaners vote for Joe Biden to help him win the presidency?

I think Geoff is speaking for a very small minority of the party that are going to take that position. But at the same time, there are going to be some Democrats -- maybe a lot more Democrats that decide to vote for Donald Trump. I actually think this election is an interesting scramble. You're going to see people who would traditionally think of a supporting one-party shift to the other.

It's Geoff's -- you know, he's a -- the kind of a voter I think that represents the shifting sands of our politics under Trump and Biden and the kinds of coalitions that they're both able to attract. You see it in all the polling, and it certainly seems to be reflected in Geoff's opinion piece today.

Although I have to do -- I have to say one comment about Geoff's argument. I -- you know, he wants to elect a Republican Congress as a firewall. That does nothing to restrict the President of the United States from all executive action that they can take.