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Trump Guilty On All 34 Felony Counts, Sentencing On July 11. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired May 31, 2024 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Congratulations. You did such a wonderful job. You must be -- I hope you're proud of yourself and I know your family is super proud of you. That work really did pay off.

BRUHAT SOMA, SCRIPPS NATIONAL SPELLING BEE WINNER: Yes, thank you so much.

BERMAN: So congratulations. He's good.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: He I'm going to say, he can have the summer off now.

BERMAN: Yes, exactly. Take a few hours off. And new hour of CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.

So we are standing by to hear from Donald Trump. There is a news conference scheduled at Trump Tower. So how might the words he speaks this morning? How might they impact his looming sentence as a convicted felon? Also, any minute now we could hear from President Biden he has his first chance to respond out loud to this verdict.

A deadly ambush taking the life of a hero, a police officer shot were trying to help the very person who killed him. Sara is out this morning. I'm John Berman with Kate Bolduan. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL. There I am.

BOLDUAN: Donald Trump is set to hold a news conference outside Trump Tower this morning, just one day after a jury in New York found him guilty of 34 criminal charges. This hour, President Biden will have his chance to possibly speak out publicly for the first time as he's leaving Delaware. Both campaigns right now looking to capitalize off this truly uncharted territory-type moment that country finds itself in once again. July 11th is now the newest key date leading up to the November election. That date July 11th is when Donald Trump is scheduled to face sentencing and that's just four days before the Republican convention when Republicans were formally nominate him to be their presidential candidate.

CNN's Kristen Holmes and Brynn Gingras are live inside and outside Trump Tower I think is what I'm looking at. Kristen, take us inside first. Donald Trump says he's holding a press conference. What are you hearing we could be -- he could say? KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I wouldn't expect to hear anything different from what he has been saying that this case was election interference, but it should have never been broad. It was political persecution, and probably trying to link this without any evidence to President Joe Biden. And the reason why he has continue to repeat this rhetoric is because his team thinks that this helps him in November that it riles up the base, that it really helps rally Republicans around the former president.

Now I will note that there are several advisors and allies of the former president who will acknowledge that they are in uncharted territory, they don't know what is going to happen. They are feeling good. After getting a lot of fundraising numbers, they haven't given them to us yet. But they say that they really took in a lot of donations in the last 24 hours, of course, we'll wait to see what those numbers look like. But they still don't know. And I want to talk about a recent poll that came out and it was specifically about people who said that they were going to vote for Donald Trump. Seven percent of those people said they were less likely to vote for him if he was convicted.

Now, his team has told me they don't believe that. They don't believe that number. They believe that this is actually going to help him. But that margin is pretty big when you consider that both Trump and Biden believe that this margin that this election is going to be determined by a very small number of voters. And when you talk about 7 percent of Trump's base, the people that always turn out for the former president, that could be a problem.

But again, I will note his advisors are saying right now they are feeling good, because of the fact that the former president has gotten so many calls from allies, lawmakers, donors saying they're standing by him and they are donating to his campaign.

BOLDUAN: Kristen, stick with us. Let's get to Brynn who's outside Trump Tower right now. Brynn, what is happening next in terms of the legal front?

BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Kate. First, let me just show you some of the headlines that Americans are waking up to this morning, at least in New York guilty on the Daily News, guilty of all 34 counts for the New York Times and an injustice is what the New York Post is calling it and it's headlines. And you're right. We've got the next step in this process that has taken several weeks. Of course, that is the sentencing day July 11 at 10:00 a.m. There are a few things that are actually going to work into Judge Juan Merchan's decision.

Let me tick through those points. One, he's going to factor in the fact that the former president does not have a criminal history. Also the fact that these convictions, well, they're not violent felonies, so that will likely play into his decision as well as he'll get a recommendation from a probation officer that is going to interview Donald Trump ahead of the sentencing date. And, of course, Donald Trump's family and friends can send along some character references as well. As far as the punishment, Trump could receive when it comes to these convictions. Well, in the state of In New York it could be anywhere from four - it could be four years rather in prison for each of those 34 counts but a maximum of 20 years which is basically the most that someone can receive for these types of felonies. And of course, probation is also an option that Juan Merchan can recommend or hand down rather, I should say. Let's listen though to the D.A., Alvin Bragg, what he had to say after these convictions were handed down.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[09:05:32]

TODD BLANCHE, DONALD TRUMP'S DEFENSE ATTORNEY: We were we were indicted for conduct that happened in 2015, '16, '17 in a jurisdiction that it was very hard for us to get a fair trial. I think it's naive to say that this is like any other case.

ALVIN BRAGG, MANHATTAN DISTRICT ATTORNEY: We arrived at this trial and ultimately, today at this verdict, in the same manner as every other case, that comes to the courtroom doors by following the facts, and the law, in doing so, without fear or favor.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GINGRAS: Yes, and you heard a Bragg there. He's really sticking to the script not really going off that even so when he was asked point blank, what is he going to recommend to the judge at the sentencing, saying he's going to let his court filings speak for itself. You also heard from the lead defense counsel, Todd Blanche, they're talking to Kaitlan Collins, basically saying that they are ready to be filing motions ahead of this sentencing date. And then after that, of course, they plan to appeal. Kate?

BOLDUAN: Brynn, thank you. Kristen Holmes inside Trump Tower is we're going to be hearing from Donald Trump in very shortly.

BERMAN: All right with us now, CNN legal analyst, criminal defense attorney Joey Jackson and former federal prosecutor Jennifer Rodgers. The Trump team says they will appeal. How hard is it to win on appeal in New York State?

JENNIFER RODGERS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, it depends what your arguments are on some things like sufficiency of the evidence at trial, it's very hard, right? It's very hard to overturn a jury's verdict. But some of these legal issues that Judge Merchan ruled on before trial, those are legal issues. They don't rely on a witness's credibility, that sort of thing. So those will be evaluated legally by the Court of Appeals, the Intermediate Court and then ultimately, perhaps the Court of Appeals. So those are easier because the standard is lower.

BOLDUAN: But what is then the strongest argument against an appeal? I mean, we -- it's -- Todd Blanche is definitely moving ahead with it. You speak to any of the surrogates as we have supporters of Donald Trump, they list out all of the reasons they think this wasn't fair and why he didn't get a fair shake but?

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, Kate, good morning. Good morning, John, Jennifer. Look, the bottom line is, there's not many reasons against an appeal, Kate, because you want appeals, that's our system of justice. And that's how you exhaust the system. And if there's any error, and just to be clear, what you're appealing is not -- the jury got it wrong. You're appealing whether there was evidence before the jury that perhaps should not have been before, or evidence that the jury didn't see that perhaps they should have. Those are judicial rulings.

I think another thing that's going to be significant is the issue as to how we got to the felony, and how we got to the felony, somewhat technical, but you have to first conclude that there's this fraudulent ledger invoices and the checks, and then you have to make the leap with respect to the concealment of this other crime. What is concerning is that as to that leap, you just have to determine that it was an unlawful purpose.

You can decide smorgasbord, what unlawful it is to you. And that's somewhat troubling to me. I think there should be a specific delineated other crime not well, it could be campaign finance, it could be taxed. Well, I think it's this, if the jurors could have a different assessment with respect to what it is, but could conclude it was unlawful, and therefore he's guilty. That to me is troubling, that certainly will be an issue for appeal.

BERMAN: So one of the things that we heard from Trump surrogates over the last 12 hours or so is they expected this, they expected a commission, I'm not sure I buy that. I think they'd all talk themselves into a hung jury. I really do. If you listen to what they had said, in the days and hours, even while they were deliberating. I think that's where they were. So I just wanted that as framing. Jen if you could talk to a juror this morning to find out what went on in the room and their thought process. What would you want to know most?

RODGERS: I'd want to know the whole thing, right? I mean, we don't get to know any of it. But you know, really, I think where they started because oftentimes they'll take kind of an initial vote to take the temperature. And then like how it progressed. How do you persuade your fellow jurors? Because that's what they're doing when they asked for things like a read back of certain testimony or the judge's instructions. Again, they're using that to persuade their fellow jurors, this is a negotiation among the jurors.

And then finally, you know, this was 34 counts of guilty. A lot of people thought that they might split that up, they might find the checks that Donald Trump wrote to be guilty, the other ones not guilty somehow compromise on that, but they didn't, 34 counts of guilty. So what happened there? Did they talk at all about splitting up those counts in any way and finding some guilty, some not guilty? Or were they just, you know, on it for the whole time.

BOLDUAN: And there's also now lots of questions around sentencing come July 11. One thing I'm wondering is we're waiting to hear from Donald Trump this morning between now and July 11th, is Donald Trump's public commentary on what he will say about the verdict? And can that impact sentencing?

[09:10:15]

JACKSON: You know, Kate, I think it's fair game. And the reason I believe that is because of the issue of remorse, right, and the issue of the lack thereof. And I think it's false to presume that he won't get any jail. Now, let me be clear, there'll be bail pending appeal.

BOLDUAN: Right.

JACKSON: And what that means is if he is for example, sentenced to an incarceratory sentence and the judge remands him, I think that there will be an opportunity to submit bail and have it go through the legal process before he serves any time. But let's be clear about this. There are people at Rikers Island on misdemeanor offenses, right? There are people were sentenced to jail because their lawyers take pleas from felonies down to misdemeanors to do jail.

But I think that an essential thing with the judge is going to be respect for the judicial system. Look, I know it's a campaign you can wax poetic, corrupt judge, corrupt D.A., this, that, the other, but you got to accept some responsibility, 34 counts, we have a jury system, and that 12 jurors concluded you're guilty, and just to absolve yourself of all sin, because it's Biden, it's this one, it's that one, it's not you, I think that's troubling to the judge. And it may play a big factor with regard to what the judge does, and will certainly hear Trump saying a lot of things between now and then I'd be careful.

BERMAN: I'm going to go out on a limb here and say at this news conference that Donald Trump will hold shortly, there will not be an expression of remorse, or I taking responsibility with his action. But we'll see. We'll see. I'm Friday morning quarterbacking. I know sometimes we don't like to do it.

But Jen, you consistently I think when people are going after the prosecution in this trial is like, oh, they blew this. They didn't do that. You can just do the work. Well, wait a minute here. And let's wait and see. Talk about the defense. Was there anything you think they did wrong here could have done better?

RODGERS: I do think that they focused too much on parts of the case that ultimately didn't matter. I think going after Stormy Daniels the way that they did even the framing of the cases that she was a liar. And this never happened when you didn't really need to prove any of that. I think they should have focused really narrowly on whether he was involved in causing those financial documents to be falsified and not getting into the whole thing about did he or didn't he with her?

Yes, and even the part about, you know, the conspiracy with respect to the campaign, not that they shouldn't have challenged that, they should have. But that was so overwhelming. That at the end of the day, I think if they had narrowly focused on, you can't believe Michael Cohen, he's the only one who gives you direct evidence of the falsification. And so you must acquit really narrowly and strongly. I think they would have been better off. JACKSON: Yes, you know what I agree with Jen. The problem is, I don't put that on the defense lawyers. I don't. I think their client was like, I want you to rip Stormy Daniels. I want you to do this. You know, clients have to sit down, right? And certainly they're very important with regard to what we do. But we're the lawyers, let us have our strategy in theory. Stormy Daniels doesn't matter. Let's not talk about the affair, not the affair. Did you see ledgers falsified? Do you know anything about the internal operations of the company? Do you know what Trump did or not? You know, if he signed anything, no, sit down.

But they're like, I'm sure he was behind that saying I want that him to be excruciated. I want this. No. You want to win and whatever we take to win, that's what you should follow. And that's why, John, I think you're absolutely right. But I think they were hamstrung don't know that for a fact. But look at their client.

BERMAN: Well, Todd Blanche said last night on television, he said he talked to Donald Trump about every aspect of the case. And Trump was very involved. So maybe that was the thing, Jennifer Rodgers, Joey Jackson, thanks for all of this, all this case, appreciate it.

BOLDUAN: Exactly. Thank you for being with us through the whole.

BERMAN: All right. We are standing by to hear from Donald Trump. And we'll see if I'm right that there will be no expression of remorse --

BOLDUAN: Betting then, betting then.

BERMAN: -- after this conviction.

A stern warning for Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin, his message to China on its support for Russia's military.

And a Minneapolis Police officer shot and killed by a person he was trying to help. The officer Jamal Mitchell was actually honored by CNN just last year for saving an elderly couple from a house fire.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[09:14:04]

JAMAL MITCHELL, POLICE OFFICER: That's part of the job. Like putting others, we're here to protect the community, do what we can to serve the community. We are trained to put other's lives in front of ours.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: All right. July 11th, Donald Trump will be sentenced for the guilty verdict on all 34 counts of falsifying business records. He faces a maximum of four years in prison on each count. But it's likely they would be served concurrently, which really does mean the maximum is four years total or he could get no jail time at all. With us now CNN chief law enforcement and intelligence analysts, John Miller. John, what are the next steps now that Trump has been convicted?

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, he'll -- in the normal system, they would prepare a probation report which is for the judge to review things like the defendants history, criminal record, whether they express remorse for the crime, things like that. In this case, do we see Donald Trump sitting down with a social worker from the Department of Probation to, you know, talk about his life before this case and whether --

BERMAN: But why not? If he doesn't would that mean we see any special treatment?

MILLER: Well, it would mean the process has to be served. He could not participate in it and have his lawyers have the meeting with them or he could engage. But this is one of those documents that the judge reviews. Now in real life, not this out of body experience we're having, you know, we can talk about the hard scrabble upbringing of a person who, you know, lost their mother at such and such an age and, you know, all the factors that a judge might consider in sentencing.

[09:20:08]

In this case, he's a first offender. Absent the probation report participation, it's going to be a nonviolent crime, a first offender, typically, in the policies of the Manhattan D.A.'s office, that wouldn't be a sentence where they asked for jail time. That said, the Department of Corrections when pressed on this, what do you do if Donald Trump is remanded to, you know, a sentence of a year or less or more, they have said, we will find appropriate housing for him.

BERMAN: We'll find out what that means maybe, or maybe whenever we'll get to that. What restrictions might Trump face as a convicted felon? Does this changes day to day life?

MILLER: So it does, now in ways that doesn't matter. He does not qualify for a license in New York State to become a barber, a security guard, a number of other jobs, but then in ways that might which convicted felon cannot possess a liquor license. He owns a number of hotels with, you know, licensed establishes -- establishments in them, as the owner does that count. They'll just have to sort through that, can't get a real estate license without a certificate of relief or a waiver from the state that could affect him. But there are plenty of people in the Trump organization who probably have those licenses. Just the question is whether that'll affect them as an owner.

BERMAN: Can't be a barber.

MILLER: I mean, there is one other thing which is, at this point as a convicted felon in any state in the United States, it would be unlawful for him to possess firearms, or ammunition. And as someone who had a license to carry concealed weapons in New York City, there'll be the question of where are those guns disposed of? Where are they? You know, does he have weapons in Florida? But for a guy who's got Secret Service protection, it's probably not a real factor.

BERMAN: Very interesting. All right. John Miller, great to see you this morning. Thank you very much.

We are standing by to see if President Biden will make his first public comments on the guilty verdict. He departs Delaware shortly so we might hear from the President. We've also got new reporting on how the Biden campaign is going to approach this conviction on the campaign trail.

And a guilty verdict in the triple murder case, prosecutors say was fueled by power, sex, money and apocalyptic spiritual beliefs. Now, Chad Daybell, one of the nickname Doomsday Killers could face the death penalty.

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[09:27:06]

BOLDUAN: In just about an hour and a half, Donald Trump is expected to be holding a news conference. We've got a live picture inside of Trump Tower. And that is where he is going to be speaking to reporters. He is now the first former president to be convicted of a crime and he could very well win the White House even with a stack of felonies to his name. How will this look decades from now when you see these major historical moments you lean on people like this. Julian Zelizer, presidential historian, to put it in perspective of what decades from now, we're going to look back at these major moments in history.

When you heard, as you've watched the trial, you've watched all of the dynamics, Julian, from the conviction to Donald Trump's initial reaction, and maybe even more specifically, react -- the broader reactions swiftly after the verdict, what stood out most -- what stands out most to you?

JULIAN ZELIZER, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, the impact of hearing guilty, I think, was significant for everyone. It was the first measure of accountability for the former president. But it's also been notable how quickly Republicans are supporting him. They are lining up, you know, faster than kids at an ice cream truck to say that they stand by him and to discredit the legal system. And I think that is a signal of how this might play out politically within the Republican Party.

BOLDUAN: And when on any question that guilty verdicts would be a breaking point, a shifting point, whatever, you know, a turning point for the direction of the Republican Party long term.

ZELIZER: Correct. I mean, I think the legal decision matters a lot and we shouldn't discount it because of what happens politically, it's very important that the legal system is upheld. That said, we're talking about a person who was impeached twice, had a one term presidency, four indictments, and was part of an insurrection and yet is the Republican nominee. So that should be some kind of evidence that this might not be a turning point at all, at least politically.

BOLDUAN: There is an example that sticks out that kind of encapsulates what you're talking about Julian? There -- the swift reaction was outrage for most Republicans. However, the former Republican governor of Maryland he's now running for Senate and out of Maryland, Larry Hogan. He spoke -- he tweeted right around the time all this the verdict was coming down and all this was happening yesterday. In history, he said regardless of the result, I urge all Americans to respect the verdict and the legal process and he talks about reaffirming the rule of law.

Trump's coach -- co-campaign manager responded to the tweet Chris LaCivita saying, you just ended your campaign. And then Trump surrogate, Byron Donalds, member of Congress, he was on with us just a few minutes ago and he attacked Larry Hogan. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[09:29:58]

REP. BYRON DONALDS (R-FL): Listen, I don't agree with Larry Hogan. He is wrong because you cannot respect the process when the fix is in from the beginning.