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Biden Urged to Focus on Trump in Debate; Trump Holding Interviews Ahead of Debate; Protesters Breach Kenyan Parliament; Sen. Jack Reed (D-RI) is Interviewed about Assange's Deal. Aired 9-9:30a ET
Aired June 25, 2024 - 09:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[09:00:00]
SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: A new hour of CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Every minute counts. Just two days now until the historic CNN presidential debate. The brand new advice the candidates are getting.
WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange on his way to being a free man. New details on his plea deal with the Justice Department for his role in one of the biggest breaches ever of classified government material.
And breaking news, CNN in the middle of a huge, violent protest. Demonstrators storm the parliament. Shots fired. We have the latest.
I'm John Berman, with Sara Sidner and Kate Bolduan. And this is CNN NEWS CENTRAL.
KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Happening right now, crunch time to debate time. The big CNN debate is Thursday. The first time Joe Biden and Donald Trump will face off in the 2024 election cycle.
This morning, two days out appears to mean the perfect time for a whole lot of advice and advising from advisors and even former opponents, like Hillary Clinton, the only person who has debated both men. She writes in a new piece for "The New York Times" this, "it is a waste of time to try to refute Mr. Trump's arguments like in a normal debate. It's nearly impossible to identify what his arguments even are. He starts with nonsense and then digresses into blather.
Yet expectations for Trump are so low that if he doesn't literally light himself on fire on Thursday evening, some will say he was downright presidential."
Also doling out advice today, outside advisers to the Biden campaign. They say the recipe for success this time is to not focus on your vision for America. Mr. Biden is focused more on Trump's.
Let's start with Arlette Saenz this hour.
Arlette, what are you learning about President Biden and the preparations he's undergoing right now? ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kate, President Biden's debate preparations went late into the evening as he and his team are trying to use every last possible minute to prepare for this debate against Donald Trump on Thursday.
Now, Biden's advisers have signaled that they really see three key areas where Biden can draw stark contrast with Trump on the debate stage. That includes abortion, democracy and the economy.
And CNN has new reporting that outside Democratic advisers have urged the president and his team to really focus less on trying to take a victory lap around President Biden's accomplishments and instead focus on attacking Trump over his economic vision. These sources have said that they have argued that they - the campaign should really try to tie Trump to corporations and also highlight the inflationary nature of his economic plan.
It comes at a time when voters continue to hold deep reservations about President Biden's handling of the economy, even as there have been some economic bright spots, such as 15 million jobs created and the economy, avoiding sinking into a recession.
Polling has shown that voters have tended to trust Trump more on economic issues than Biden. And so that is one of the key challenges for Biden heading into this debate.
Now, the Biden campaign, today, is really trying to lean into drawing that economic contrast with Trump. They've released a new television ad which will run in battleground states arguing that Trump is only looking out for himself and not looking out for the American middle class.
Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Donald Trump loves to attack Joe Biden.
DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Joe Biden.
Joe Biden.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because he's focused on revenge and he has no plans to help the middle class. He'd just give more tax cuts to the wealthy. Here's the difference, Donald Trump is only out for himself. Joe Biden is fighting for your family.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SAENZ: Now, the campaign is also once again criticizing Trump's recent criminal convictions. A spokesperson, Michael Tyler, saying, quote, "the American people deserve better than a white color crook who is only in it for himself. That's why they fired Donald Trump in 2020, and it's why Joe Biden will beat him again in November." So, the campaign this morning previewing a bit of what their arguments
could be on that debate stage as Biden prepares to face off against Trump for the first time since 2020 on Thursday.
BOLDUAN: All right, Arlette, thank you so much.
Kristen Holmes is live outside Mar-a-Lago for us right now.
Kristen, what are you hearing about what Trump is and is not doing to prepare for this debate?
KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kate, Trump arrived here in Mar-a-Lago at his resort last night after a fundraiser in Louisiana. He's going to be holed up here for the next two-and-a-half days, meeting with advisors, talking to allies. In some ways, there is some similarity to what Biden is doing. He is talking to his allies and senior advisers about policy, about what he should be talking about on the debate stage.
Donald Trump is somebody who crowdsources for advice. But they are not calling this any sort of preparation. It certainly isn't the kind of drills that you're seeing or hearing about from the Biden campaign and what they are doing at Camp David. There is no one filling in for Joe Biden. There is no one filling in for Jake or Dana, who will be moderating that debate on Thursday.
[09:05:06]
Instead, it is what they are calling, quote/unquote, discussions around what Trump should talk about. Of course his advisers are hoping that he's going to talk about the economy and immigration. Things that he polls higher than President Joe Biden on.
However, there is obviously concern that Donald Trump is going to, at some point, go off the rails. Now, we did hear from Trump in an interview yesterday talking about how those interviews are part of his preparation.
Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: How are you preparing? I'm preparing by taking questions from you and others, if you think about it. But I'm preparing by dealing with you. You're tougher than all of them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Not sure that he's tougher than all of them given that many of the interviews that Donald Trump is doing currently are friendly. They also said that him taking questions from audience members at different events was part of the preparation. Again, friendly audiences. But this is the way Donald Trump is doing it. They are hoping again he can stay on message when he gets on that stage on Thursday.
BOLDUAN: Kristen, thank you so much.
John.
BERMAN: All right, with us now, CNN political commentator, former Biden White House communications director Kate Bedingfield, and CNN political commentator and Republican strategist Shermichael Singleton.
Thank you both for being here.
So, team Biden getting a lot of advice, solicited and probably unsolicited here.
KATE BEDINGFIELD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. Yes. Yes.
BERMAN: Outside advisers we are reporting saying, don't talk about yourself, talk about him.
BEDINGFIELD: Yes. There's a - listen, I can tell you as somebody who has been at the center of debate prep, there's always outside advice. But I do think there's some wisdom in recognizing that what Biden's trying to do here, what he should be trying to do on Thursday, is make this a choice. He doesn't want to come out of the debate on Thursday night, having it had been a referendum on him.
That is just - he wants the - he should want the frame to be the contrast between Donald Trump, what he stands for, himself, and Joe Biden, who he's fighting for, you, the middle class. And so, he does have to draw a contrast to do that. He has to - I think he has to be on the attack. He has to take the - he has to drive the conversation to the things that he wants to be focusing on, including the places where Trump is most politically vulnerable, abortion, democracy. January 6th.
So, I think, no question, Joe Biden has to be aggressive on Thursday.
BERMAN: What do you do then - and I'll get - I promise I'm coming to you but you're not going to like - you're not going to like it when I do.
SHERMICHAEL SINGLETON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Take your time, John. Take your time.
BERMAN: If the question is, what about the inflation, Mr. President? What about the fact that prices are 20 percent higher now than they were when you took office.
BEDINGFIELD: Yes. Yes.
BERMAN: How do you deflect that?
BEDINGFIELD: It's, I understand what families are going through. It's - I know that when you go to the grocery store and prices are higher that's tough on your family and that's tough when you're dealing with a family budget. Here are all the things I've done to bring prices down. Here's what I'm going to do in the next four years. Here's how Donald Trump's agenda is going to make things more expensive for you. Every answer has to come back around to, this is why Donald Trump is not a good alternative and not a viable choice.
It doesn't mean Joe Biden doesn't talk about his accomplishments.
SINGLETON: I mean, John, I love my dear friend Kate here, but the problem is, Joe Biden - the president isn't saying that.
BEDINGFIELD: Well, he is, though. No, he actually - he actually is.
SINGLETON: He's not saying that I recognize you're struggles. Well, he's not - he's not campaigning, Kate. But I get that prices are expensive.
BEDINGFIELD: They - they just put out an ad where he says exactly that.
SINGLETON: But the president is on the stump saying to the American people that I understand that prices in the grocery stores are high, but I understand that many of you are struggling to buy your first home.
If you're a young person, you're graduating from college, John, and moving to a city like New York or a city like Washington, D.C., you're going to be paying $3,000, $4,000 a month in rent. I understand that is difficult for you to begin the future that I promised four years ago. I would make palatable for a greater large percentage of the American people.
The president can't run on that record. So, what is he going to do? I suspect go after the former president. And my advice to Donald Trump would be, every single time the president brings up something of the past, I would say, but the economy, but immigration, but foreign conflicts. Remind the American people that they are not satisfied with the current reality and they want a new direction.
BERMAN: So, they're each going to be talking about the other guy at some point?
SINGLETON: Absolutely. That's what it seems like to me, John.
BERMAN: I am - I'm not sure I 100 percent buy the spin that we're getting from the Trump team that he's not preparing for the debates. He's just asking policy questions and doing interviews here. I think that's them wanting to say, oh, we're not really trying that hard. What do you think?
SINGLETON: I think it would be incredibly naive to not focus on this debate. This debate is going to be incredibly important. We've seen what the margins are. We were talking earlier, Kate, about 2020. You're talking about, what, three, four states, around 40,000 vote difference. If you're Donald Trump and you're considering the reality that you lost states like Georgia, Arizona, Wisconsin, 10,000 in Georgia, 11,000 in Arizona, 22,000 in Wisconsin. If I'm your advisor, I'm saying, dude, I get that you might be this macho guy and I got it all, I don't need to prepare. But if we want to win this thing in November, you've got to get your butt in the room with advisers and figure out the best way so that you can present yourself well to the American people because this could be a groundbreaking moment that could determine whether you win or lose.
BERMAN: One thing unique to this debate is they are both presidents, one current and one former.
BEDINGFIELD: Yes.
SINGLETON: Yes.
BERMAN: And one of the problems that presidents, current and former, have in debates is that during preparation it's hard to tell them to do better, right?
SINGLETON: Yes.
[09:10:04]
BERMAN: It's hard to tell them when you're practicing, gosh, you know, let's try that one again because I think we can get a better answer there.
Kate, you've been in the room with him doing this kind of thing.
BEDINGFIELD: Yes.
BERMAN: Who can and how do you tell President Biden that he needs to do better?
BEDINGFIELD: Well, I will tell you, people actually do, people do, because Biden wants to do well. He wants to have a good performance. He wants to have a genuine back-and-forth. There's a lot of time in debate prep with Joe Biden spent going through answers with him, getting his feedback on how he wants to address things and saying, you know, sir, I think that wouldn't work and I would consider this way.
Now, he may say, absolutely not, you're wrong. And sometimes he's right. But sometimes he'll say, you know what, that is a better way to go about it.
So, for him, debate prep really is a genuine back-and-forth and he does here feedback.
I will say though, it is typically historically hard for presidents in their first debate out of the gate because not necessarily because they don't get direct feedback, but just because they've been running the country, right?
SINGLETON: Yes.
BEDINGFIELD: I mean they haven't been focused on debating and the specifics of debating, which despite what Donald Trump may say is actually different than doing an interview, and especially then doing an interview with a friendly podcaster. So -
BERMAN: Look, and I -
BEDINGFIELD: We'll see. BERMAN: Yes, and I know there -
SINGLETON: Good point, Kate.
BERMAN: There are other debates scheduled here, but I think there's also a good chance, you know, this is one chance, one opportunity, as Eminem likes to say.
SINGLETON: Yes. Or, John, I would say, if I were Trump, I would focus on tone. Demeanor really matters. He needs to shock the heck out of all of us so that those independent voters in the middle who are looking for some level of stability from him can say, wait a minute here, I may give this guy a second look. I'd knock it out of the park and say, I'm not going to do a second debate.
BERMAN: Right. I mean -
SINGLETON: The risk is too high for him.
BERMAN: I think either guy is capable of saying, you know, I'm not doing a second debate. Whoever wins this debate has no incentive to go back a second time, right?
SINGLETON: Yes. Yes. Yes, I agree with that. I wouldn't.
BERMAN: Which raises the stakes even more for this one.
BEDINGFIELD: It - it - there is zero doubt it is a very high-stakes moment for both of them.
SINGLETON: Yes.
BEDINGFIELD: This will be a significant inflection point in this campaign one way or the other.
BERMAN: Capable of coming out calm and measured?
SINGLETON: He - he - John, he doesn't have a choice. Capabilities here is one thing set aside. But again, I think if you're the former president, you're looking at all of the legal issues that he's facing.
To me, my thought process is, if you don't win this thing, all of those trials are eventually going to come. You have to showcase a different version of yourself that people just aren't used to. You don't have a choice. This is a survivability thing for him.
BERMAN: That doesn't sound like something for the American people. That sounds like something for him.
SINGLETON: Well, politics sometimes is about self-preservation, John.
BEDINGFIELD: This is why Trump's campaign message is not resonating with moderate, suburban, swing voters who want to know what the president's going to do for them, not how his presidential -
SINGLETON: Oh, Kate - well, Kate - BEDINGFIELD: How his presidential campaign is going to keep him out of jail.
SINGLETON: Well, wait a minute here, Kate, President Biden's message is resonating with the American people?
BEDINGFIELD: President Biden's - President Biden's message is all about what he's doing for middle class families.
SINGLETON: Their approval rating - 48 percent approval.
BERMAN: You know what - you know what, the good thing is, it's Wednesday - no, what is today. Today's Tuesday.
SINGLETON: Tuesday.
BERMAN: There are two more days until the debate. So, we have time to continue this discussion.
BEDINGFIELD: Thank goodness.
BERMAN: Whatever day it is.
Kate Bedingfield, Shermichael Singleton, great to see you both.
SINGLETON: Thanks, John.
BERMAN: And in case you didn't get it from our conversation here, there is a big debate coming up. An historic presidential debate right here on CNN Thursday night, 9:00 p.m. Jake Tapper, Dana Bash moderate. Do not miss it.
Kate.
BOLDUAN: We're also standing by for court to start back up in Florida today. A third day of hearings in Trump's classified documents case. The new images the special counsel just release and why the judge seems unlikely to be putting a gag order in place for this case against the former president.
And there is also new video of China bringing back dirt from the far side of the moon. This as it - it is an historic first. So, what this means now for their space program.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[09:18:11]
SIDNER: We are following breaking news for you. This extraordinary and, frankly, terrifying scenes in Kenya's capital right now. An African nation known for being very stable. In Nairobi, anti-tax protesters, angry at the growing cost of living, have breached part of the parliament, advancing inside amid tear gas you're seeing there and live rounds being fired by police. This is still happening now.
We've also learned lawmakers had to escape through an underground channels.
CNN's Larry Madowo is there.
You were standing there last hour and you saw a body on the ground. You were hearing live rounds go off. What are you seeing now?
LARRY MADOWO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Sara, we have seen at least two bodies pulled away from outside Kenya's parliament after police used live rounds to try and push back protesters that had breached the fence of the national assembly and made it inside parliament, inside the floor of the house, from the speaker's chair, and made the way with the mace of the Kenyan National Assembly.
What we see here is a standoff between the protesters and the police. There's an ambulance being rushed inside the crowd here. That is probably an indication that somebody could be hurt. They are at a safe distance, but police kept pushing them back, and they keep advancing forward.
Their ambition today was to try and occupy parliament. They declared seven days of rage in response to the high cost of living they say especially in new proposals contained in the finance bill that's extremely unpopular.
It's a critical moment for President William Ruto. Just weeks after his triumphant big state visit to the U.S. and now these scenes on the streets of Nairobi, it looks almost like a war zone except many of these protesters have been peaceful throughout the day. They keep saying again and again and again, that we are peaceful, stop shooting at us. Stop killing us. But we've seen police use a very heavy-handed response to it.
[09:20:02]
A lot of tear gas. A lot of water cannon. And that is what - scene over here.
For instance, there's a lot of these trucks all over the city that - trying to make sure that these protesters do not make it to parliament. But it's almost pointless because they have, in fact, made it to parliament. Made it all the way to the floor of the house. And there's still a lot of cops standing by here trying to protect parliament. But on the ground you see blood. There's lots of litter. Part of it as a result of vandalism and part of it from the violence that we have seen here in front of Kenya's national assembly, which is back there behind me with one part of the wall completely broken down.
A police truck that was on fire earlier, and a reinforcement there. You see more police coming in just as we are speaking, showing that maybe the government is trying to make - keep a handle on this. But so far it appears to have gotten out of hand, especially with the violence. And police having to use live rounds to try and push back protesters, Sara.
SIDNER: Larry, we did see someone who appear to be lying on the ground in your last shot and a building on fire. Do you know where that is and what happened to the person who's sort of sitting there on the ground? Are they injured?
MADOWO: We did see at least two people who were dead. And I have - a warning to our viewers here, what I'm about to say could be disturbing, we saw at least one young man who had been shot right before our eyes. His brains shattered on the ground outside Kenya's parliament. We saw at least one other body that was also lying outside parliament covered in the Kenyan national flag. So, we know at least two people have been confirmed dead because we saw them here. We're not sure if there are any other casualties.
But that is an extraordinary scene here. These protesters back there, they're singing the national anthem. They are not carrying any weapons. They are not harming anyone. They've been thinking the national anthem again and again and again. And their whole point is, please listen to us. We are not harming anybody. And now they're chanting, Ruto must go. Ruto must go. Referring to President William Ruto.
SIDNER: Very - these are extraordinary pictures. Thank you for bringing us that. We really appreciate it. We will be checking in with you, and stay safe with you and your crew.
John.
BERMAN: All right, what a scene there.
So, could the United States be one step closer to requiring women to register for the draft? We've got new details as Congress weighs that decision.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[09:26:50]
BOLDUAN: This morning, after spending years in a London prison and after really a 14 year legal saga, WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange is set to be a free man. Assange has now struck a plea deal with the U.S. government that will allow him to avoid any possible prison time in the United States. As part of the deal, Assange will plead guilty to a single felony count of illegally obtaining and disclosing national security material, which includes one of the largest leaks of confidential military information in American history.
Joining me right now is the Democratic senator from Rhode Island, Jack Reed. He's the chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee.
It's good to see you, Senator. Thank you for coming in.
SEN. JACK REED (D-RI): Thank you, Kate.
BOLDUAN: Julian Assange, a free man, likely to avoid any prison time in the United States. It's a far cry from the charges that have been brought against him.
What's your reaction to this final twist? REED: Well, my reaction is that he clearly stated he was guilty. That,
you know, all of the obfuscation, all of the deviation over many, many years and hiding in embassies, that's over. He's come forward and said, yes, I am guilty. I violated the law.
The issue of custody, I think, is less important than his unconditional declaration of his guilt.
BOLDUAN: Yes, I mean, because this involved one of the largest leaks of confidential U.S. military information in history. He's celebrated by some for his work. Hated by others as endangering Americans and those who work with Americans in these conflicts.
What do you think of the man and his work after all of this? You know, he's - he defends himself and says he should be afforded First Amendment free speech privileges that other journalists should be afforded. Others say he's done - he's gone way too far and did too much damage.
What do you think?
REED: He violated laws of the United States. Again, I think his unqualified plea of guilty should settle this matter. When he faced real trial, there were no adequate defenses that he could find or he simply admitted, yes, I'm guilty. He undermines the security of the United States. He did it systematically. He did it for his own gratification, self-promotion, et cetera. And that guilty plea speaks volumes.
BOLDUAN: The Israeli Defense Minister is in Washington right now and throughout the week meeting with the Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin today. And this comes as Benjamin Netanyahu still seems to be trying right now to contain the fallout from his comments this weekend where it appeared that he was walking back his support for the ceasefire deal that's backed by the United States.
What are you hearing about this in this moment? There - it seems to be unclear where the ceasefire negotiations are or can be given this ambiguity and what Netanyahu has been saying the last two days. Do you trust his commitment to the hostage and ceasefire proposal that the president - that President Biden put out there?
REED: Well, Netanyahu has been politicizing this issue and many more for his own, I think, advantage politically within Israel.
[09:30:04]
I think the critical issue here is that the military,
