Return to Transcripts main page

CNN News Central

Sen. Chris Coons (D-DE) On Multiple Dems Piling Pressure On Biden To Exit Race; Today: Armorer Expected To Testify In Alec Baldwin Trial; Trump Asks New York Judge To Toss Hush Money Conviction, Dismiss Case. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired July 12, 2024 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:30:05]

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: Some of the biggest names in sports and entertainment were in Los Angeles last night to celebrate the year's best moments in sports at the ESPY awards hosted by tennis legend and all-around icon Serena Williams.

Prince Harry -- oh, actual royalty, darling -- delivered an emotional speech as he accepted the Pat Tillman Award for Service for his work creating the Invictus Games, a tournament for injured veterans.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRINCE HARRY, RECIPIENT, PAT TILLMAN AWARD FOR SERVICE: The truth is I stand here not as Prince Harry, Pat Tillman Award recipient, but rather, a voice on behalf of the Invictus Games Foundation and the thousands of veterans and service personnel from over 20 nations who have made the Invictus Games a reality. This award belongs to them, not to me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: That's cool.

And retired Saints safety Steve Gleason received the Arthur Ashe Award for Courage. Gleason has been fighting ALS since 2011 and can only communicate through eye-tracking technology.

And then there's Serena Williams, who took a shot at Kansas City Chiefs kicker Harrison Butker while celebrating women in sports.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VENUS WILLIAMS, 5-TIME WIMBLEDON CHAMPION: So go ahead and enjoy women's sports like you would any other sport because they are sports.

QUINTA BRUNSON, ACTRESS, COMEDIAN: Yes.

SERENA WILLIAMS, ESPY'S HOST, 7-TIME WIMBLEDON CHAMPION: Except you, Harrison Butker. We don't need you. BRUNSON: At all. Like, ever.

V. WILLIAMS: So go ahead and enjoy women's sport like you would --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: Wow. Shade like you've never seen it before. Butker received huge backlash after controversial comments he made during his commencement address at Benedictine College in May.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BEASTIE BOYS, HIP-HOP GROUP: Singing "Sabotage."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: If you were around in the '80s and '90s you couldn't miss them. If "you're scheming on a thing, that's sabotage," so say the Beastie Boys when it comes to using their music. The legendary hip-hop group is taking Chili's to federal court claiming the chain's operator used their hit "Sabotage" without permission in a social media campaign. Chili's, they say, was neither licensed to ill nor allowed to advertise using the group's likeness from the "Sabotage" music video.

They're seeing $150,000 in damages for each of its two copyright infringement claims -- one for the music video and another for that song.

And a concerning new study found that many popular tampon brands tested in labs contained over a dozen different metals, including arsenic and lead, leaving a whole lot of us wondering if these tampons are even safe to use at all. Researchers are saying there is no need to panic, apparently, right now because they have not been able to determine whether the metals can leach from the tampons into the body and say further studies would need to be conducted.

I'm sorry, but I think a lot of women are panicking. They can tell you not to panic but I think this is a real issue -- wow.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: I'm just going to say do we need anything even close to heavy metals near any part of a woman.

SIDNER: No.

BOLDUAN: The part of a women, especially, that creates life and carries a child.

SIDNER: Exactly right.

BOLDUAN: I'm going to say -- I'm just going to -- going to say a quick no. So that's bad stuff.

Can we also go back to Beastie Boys?

SIDNER: Yes, we can. BOLDUAN: I have a challenge for all of us and all of you out there. I think we --

SIDNER: Oh, no.

BOLDUAN: -- should -- I think we can, too, very successfully --

SIDNER: We can do it.

BOLDUAN: -- find Beastie Boy content that could really speak to almost every aspect of the presidential campaign.

SIDNER: That is correct.

BOLDUAN: I now have something to do this weekend.

SIDNER: I think you should do it and then on Monday, let's reconvene.

BOLDUAN: We shall. We shall because we must.

All right, to this. Later today, President Biden is heading back on the campaign trail, and what does that political landscape look like on that trail today? The president hoped his NATO summit press conference would prove Democratic doubters wrong and refocus attention elsewhere. It did for some. It definitely did not for others.

After the press conference three more Democrats spoke up to say that they think he should step aside -- Congressmen Jim Himes, Scott Peters, Eric Sorensen. Now, at least 17 Democrats in Congress are breaking from the president.

CNN's Lauren Fox is tracking all of this reaction from last night, today, and for tomorrow, of course. Lauren, what are you hearing now?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. I think that is there was a belief that this press conference could put any concerns to bed. The reality is that it did not stem the bleeding for some.

About a few minutes right after this press conference ended you had Jim Himes, who is the top Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee, coming out and saying that he thought it was time for Biden to step aside. Now, he was pressed on why he waited until after this press conference to put out his statement and here's what he said.

[07:35:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JIM HIMES (D-CT): This needs to be resolved, I don't know, in the next five to seven days. Because we just went 10 days where the story was not Donald Trump promising totalitarianism; it was how is Joe Biden doing to do in the big boy press conference?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOX: And taking a step back, Kate, I think it is important to point out that throughout this week, every single day, every single vote series, every single time we're seeing Democrats in the hallway, we are posing this question to them whether or not they think that Biden can win re-election.

And I think what Himes is speaking to here is a feeling that this is not going to stop and every high-stakes moment that Biden has, whether it's a press conference, whether it is an event on the public stage, whether it is a private meeting with Democrats, they are all going to be watching so closely that I think, in Himes' view and the view of the two other members who came out last night, there is a feeling that they have to find a solution sooner than later. Because the focus right now is on Biden rather than Trump, and that is something the Democrats want to avoid going forward.

Now, I think it is important to point out that we asked leader Jeffries, the top Democrat in the House, yesterday where he was, and he said he is still talking to all of his members and until he has conversations with every single one of them, he is going to put off having a larger meeting with his leadership team. But once he gets through it, he says that they are going to convene and discuss Biden's future.

So I think it's important to point out this is not over yet -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: Yeah, the when this is over. The timing thing continues to be very confusing to me of when this is going to reach the point where they feel like they have a -- they have decided.

It's good to see you, Lauren. Thank you -- Sara.

SIDNER: All right. With me now is Democratic Sen. Chris Coons, also co-chair of President Biden's re-election campaign. Good morning to you, Senator.

I guess the first question to you is are you still riding with Biden this morning?

SEN. CHRIS COONS (D-DE) (via Webex by Cisco): Sara, great to be with you on this wonderful Friday morning.

SIDNER: Oh, you are in a --

COONS: I'm sorry, Sara.

SIDNER: -- very good mood this morning.

I said are you still riding with Biden this morning after the press conference?

COONS: Absolutely. Look, Sara, that was an impressive hourlong press conference. I'll remind you this week was NATO week. There were 31 other NATO nations whose heads of state were in Washington all week and several other Indo-Pacific observer countries.

So, President Biden went from meeting to meeting, speech to speech in his official role as our president while also making time to do campaign events. He had a great rally with the AFL-CIO, for example, in the middle of the day.

And late at night, last night, he gave a 10-minute speech about our place in the world. The importance of NATO. How it contributes to our security and prosperity. And then took a dozen questions.

And I just want your viewers to ask themselves this question. If Donald Trump had been on that stage for an hour last night asking questions from reporters about foreign policy, could he possibly have delivered the answers our president did? We all know the answer is no.

We would have gotten a weird, bizarre, diatribe full of vengeance. Comments about women's appearance. Strange remarks about inviting Hannibal Lecter over to dinner, or whether he'd rather be eaten by sharks or electrocuted. I'm not making this up. These are things he has said in recent campaign rallies.

As President Biden said, Trump has spent much of this last two weeks playing golf so that we Democrats can keep digging a hole and picking on each other and debating.

President Biden made clear last night as he made clear in a letter to all of us he's decided he's running for re-election. And when the poll that was just released this morning by, I believe, Marist/PBS/NPR --

SIDNER: Yeah.

COONS: -- shows Joe Biden tied or leading, I see why he has reached that conclusion.

There is no big movement in this race and the 10 percent or less of House Democrats raising questions don't deserve the same coverage as the 90 percent of House Democrats who are saying that Joe Biden is going to be our nominee and that Joe Biden is the leader of our party, or that are recognizing his incredible accomplishments as president and working together to move forward on this campaign.

SIDNER: Yeah. I want to quickly ask you because you talked about the poll and that -- if that poll said basically 50 percent of registered voters would vote for Biden right now. Forty, I think, eight percent for Donald Trump. It is also within the margin of error.

But what -- there have been other polls this week as well, one of which said 67 percent of registered voters said that they did not think that Joe Biden should run for re-election. Fifty-six percent of those polled were Democrats saying the same thing.

What is the path forward when you see those numbers, Senator?

[07:40:00]

COONS: The path forward is that Joe Biden, who ran for and won the primaries in state after state after state and is the only Democratic candidate for president who has a huge number of delegates at our convention next month -- is that President Biden will keep doing what he's been doing the last two weeks. After the debate, which I recognized was a terrible performance by Joe

Biden -- a shocking performance -- I urged him to get out and to engage with voters and to do press conferences and to do small group meetings. He has, in the last two weeks, campaigned in Wisconsin, in Pennsylvania. He is about to go to Michigan for the day today. And he has had good all-day campaign events. He's done small events. He's done large events.

He did the Stephanopoulos interview. On Monday, in Texas, he's going to be doing a long interview with Lester Holt. He has done scripted things, like his compelling speech at the NATO summit. He's done unscripted things.

So, frankly, I have been urging my colleagues to keep this a family conversation and not work through their emotions and concerns in editorials and public speeches, but to convey their concerns to our president. He has been listening. He has met with and heard from dozens and dozens of leaders -- mayors, governors, House members, senators.

He had an hour and a half meeting -- excuse me, over an hourlong meeting last Saturday with all the co-chairs and we represent a broad range of the leadership of the Democratic Party. He is listening to our concerns. But I still have seen no evidence --

SIDNER: Senator, let me -- let me just -- let me jump in and ask you --

COONS: (Audio difficulty) there is another candidate waiting in the wings who can be more successful than he can.

SIDNER: Let me step in and ask you this because we have some CNN reporting that there are some angry and stunned Democrats that are kind of blaming Biden's closest advisers for shielding him from the public and for the full extent of what he has been going through, which they call the president's decline.

One of the top Democrats in close touch with Biden's inner circle advisers told CNN everyone who expresses any level of suspicion of contrary views, they call everyone and they beat the "s" out of them and say stay on message. These are people who are trying to get a message to Joe Biden and they feel like they're not being heard.

What do you say to them?

COONS: Well, Sara, you can put anonymous quotes up here day after day after day and I can tell you that's not my experience.

SIDNER: But it -- but it's not just anonymous -- it's not just anonymous though, Senator. It's not just anonymous. People have come out in full --

COONS: (Audio difficulty).

SIDNER: I'll let you answer the question, but it isn't just anonymous. That was one person. COONS: You didn't let me finish answering.

SIDNER: Sure. Go ahead.

COONS: I'm sorry, Sara.

SIDNER: Go ahead.

COONS: No, no -- you ask your questions.

SIDNER: No. I just said it's not just anonymous. We've seen --

COONS: That --

SIDNER: -- 17 members of Congress come out publicly and say this, including a high-ranking member -- the top member of the Intel Committee coming out, Jim Himes.

So what do you say to them? How do you convince them that Biden is the person that needs to be -- have all the horses behind him?

COONS: OK, now that's two different issues. Let me speak to the first and then the second, OK?

You put out an anonymous quote that someone claims that Biden's age or shielding him and beating the stuffing out of them when they try to express something.

I was personally on a call that lasted well over an hour last Saturday where our president kept asking for input, asking for give it to me straight. Tell us what you're hearing. And I told him directly -- I read him two texts -- one from a longtime friend of mine and his who is urging him to get out of the race, and another from a close friend and supporter who is urging him to fight hard and stay in.

I haven't had the experience that if you raise a concern someone from the campaign takes you out back and works you over. I just don't think that reflects the experience of many in our caucus.

Your second question, Sara, was how do I persuade the small number of Democrats in the House who are publicly airing their disagreement and who are calling on the president to step aside. Bluntly, I'm less concerned with those, I think now 15-17 Democrats in the House, than I am with my colleagues in the Senate where I serve. Where I believe we're at two who have come out and expressed a desire for our president to set aside.

In my view, the vast majority of Democrats in the House and Senate recognize that Donald Trump is an existential threat to our democracy. Acknowledge Joe Biden is the only Democrat who has beaten Donald Trump and still, by polling, has the best chance to beat him. And we're having a disciplined, appropriate, private conversation about their concerns.

As the polling has come out this week and shown both in a head-to-head and in the battleground states that we are not losing ground, there has been more and more discussion. A lot of my colleagues were waiting to see how that press conference went.

[07:45:04]

And, Sara, it is very hard. There is a lot of concern for those of us who are holding our breath to make sure our president performs as well as we believe he can.

I watched last night as both Keir Starmer, the new prime minister of the United Kingdom, and Olaf Scholz, the chancellor of Germany, in response to questioning said yes, we had very good, very clear meetings with President Biden. He is on top of everything and is a good partner and ally.

In all this, Sara, it is so important that we balance this against the danger of Donald Trump. His Project 2025, which he's lying about, which was written by more than 100 people who previously worked by Donald Trump, lay out a shocking conservative right-wing agenda for how, if elected, he would overtake our country in ways we would not recognize.

So, look, there is polling that is coming in. I am trying to encourage my colleagues to pay attention to that. But frankly, instead of worrying, instead of staying at home watching TV and wringing our hands to get out there and work.

To campaign and to fight hard for our colleagues who are up for re- election in the House and the Senate, and for our president and vice president. I have a lot of respect for Vice President Harris. I think she's been a great vice president.

But I am supporting the Biden-Harris ticket and I am optimistic that Joe Biden will be re-elected as our president this fall.

SIDNER: Senator Chris Coons, thank you for that honest and spirited conversation this morning, nice and early here. I appreciate your time.

COONS: Thanks, Sara.

SIDNER: All right -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: Alec Baldwin's defense team focusing in on the multiple live rounds found on the "Rust" movie -- "Rust" movie set as they start to make their case. And we're learning now -- that we are learning also the now-convicted armorer on that movie set could take the stand.

And a new request by Donald Trump to the judge after his criminal conviction in New York. Could his 34 felony convictions be overturned?

(COMMERCIAL)

[07:50:55]

BOLDUAN: This morning, Alec Baldwin comes face-to-face with the person he blames for Halyna Hutchins' death. Hannah Gutierrez-Reed, the "Rust" armorer, is expected potentially to testify today. Her attorney tells CNN that she will not be cooperating though and plans on pleading the fifth.

Reed, you'll remember, was convicted and sentenced to 18 months in prison for involuntary manslaughter.

CNN's Josh Campbell is outside court following all of this as the trial gets underway in New Mexico. So, Josh, what is expected with the armorer if and when she takes the stand?

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kate, this is setting up to be quite a moment as Alec Baldwin looks across that defense table to the witness stand and one of the people that he blames as being ultimately responsible for this tragic accident. As you mentioned, Hannah Guttierez-Reed -- she was the armorer on the movie set.

And there's long been this question about how a live round of ammunition could make its way to a movie set. But what we learned yesterday in court is in the minds of investigators, it's not a mystery at all.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KARI MORRISSEY, SPECIAL PROSECUTOR: Is there evidence that Hannah Guiterrez brought the live rounds onto the set of "Rust."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

MORRISSEY: As you sit here today, do you have any question about who introduced the live ammunition to the set of "Rust?"

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No.

MORRISSEY: Who do you believe it was, based on your investigation?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hannah.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMPBELL: Now, as you mentioned, we don't expect that she will cooperate on the stand. Her attorney says she's going to assert her Fifth Amendment rights. She is appealing her own conviction for involuntary manslaughter.

But there's a potential for sparks to fly whenever Alec Baldwin's attorneys step up, and you can only imagine that. Obviously, there's a constitutional right to now incriminate yourself, but think of the impact on the jury if you have his lawyers completely asking -- you know, continually asking her how did you -- could you do this? Why did you do this? And then her refusing to respond.

So it's setting up to be quite a moment. Court is set to resume here in just a couple of hours.

BOLDUAN: All right, we'll see what happens today. Josh, thank you very much -- Sara.

SIDNER: All right.

Donald Trump is asking the judge in his hush money trial to overturn his conviction and dismiss the case. Lawyers for the former president say the jury's guilty verdict on all 34 felony counts should be tossed out because of the Supreme Court's recent ruling on presidential immunity.

CNN's Kara Scannell is joining us now. Tell us what the -- what the background is on this. What are the reasons that the lawyers are saying hey, this has to be tossed out because of this ruling by the Supreme Court?

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Sara, the lawyers are really focusing on the part of the ruling that says that the -- that at a trial you cannot use evidence of official acts in a case. And that's really where they're focusing their arguments here before this judge, asking him to throw out the conviction and the indictment.

And looking into some of the specific testimony of some of the witnesses that testified, including Hope Hicks and Madeleine Westerhout, two people who worked in the Oval Office Donald Trump when he was president, saying any testimony they gave about conversations they had with the -- with the then-president at time related to the hush money payments should not be -- should not have been allowed to go before the jury.

They also want to exclude any of the testimony around the special counsel's investigation. Michael Cohen testified about that and how he was acting in a -- in a certain way to benefit Donald Trump at the time. Also throwing out any testimony related to the Federal Election Commission investigations. And also any of the tweets that Donald Trump sent out, saying that those were official communications and they should not have been used.

And prosecutors relied on that to show that there was a pressure campaign against Michael Cohen, trying to get him not to cooperate in the investigation, which he ultimately pleaded guilty to criminal charges in federal courts. But they want to get that thrown out.

And they say that the entire case is irreparably tainted, leaving dismissal as the only lawful option -- Sara.

SIDNER: Very interesting. We'll see what happens with that case as well, although a lot of that -- the things that happened in that case happened before he was president, we should note.

Kara, thank you so much -- Kate.

[07:55:00]

BOLDUAN: So, about last night. Congressional Democrats reacting, the Biden campaign possibly hoping and waiting, and voters responding to the press conference of all Biden press conferences as Biden stood and took 19 questions in just under 60 minutes.

And Gary Tuchman watched it all with voters in battleground Michigan. Here's some of their initial reaction.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GARY TUCHMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: How many of you think it was better than you expected -- this news conference? How many of you think it was better than you expected it would be? One, two, three, four, five.

How many of you think it was worse than you expected it would be? How many of you think it was the same?

MICHIGAN VOTER 1: I think he should stay in.

TUCHMAN: You weren't sure? How do you feel now?

MICHIGAN VOTER 2: The same. I think he's the logical choice.

TUCHMAN: OK.

Now, you thought he should pass the torch. How do you feel right now?

MICHIGAN VOTER 3: I still believe he should pass the torch.

TUCHMAN: And why do you say that?

MICHIGAN VOTER 3: I think he conveyed more defensiveness versus confidence.

MICHIGAN VOTER 4: I think what came across was that -- of what he is. Joe Biden is very caring about people. He's very knowledgeable and experienced, and he's not just out for himself. That he really cares about the country.

MICHIGAN VOTER 5: I think Joe Biden did an excellent job.

TUCHMAN: During this news conference?

MICHIGAN VOTER 5: Um-hum.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: And joining me right now is former Trump White House communications director, Alyssa Farrah Griffin. It's good to see you, Alyssa.

ALYSSA FARAH GRIFFIN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, FORMER TRUMP WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Thank you.

BOLDUAN: So it was very -- it's always very interesting to hear what voters as they watch something in progress -- to hear initial reaction. And it seems -- you know, there was a little of this, there was a little of that, and it seems it is what it is -- kind of a Rorschach test, it seems to have become.

Your thoughts, though, watching last night and what you think happened last night, first and foremost, on how Biden did. GRIFFIN: So it was a mixed bag. It could have been worse. It could

have been better.

Listen, he -- foreign policy is an area Biden knows well.

BOLDUAN: Yeah.

GRIFFIN: He's worked in the space for 40 years. It was smart to do this at the backdrop of NATO to show he has a command of the history and the facts.

On the flip side, what is going to live on TikTok? What are young voters going to see? It's going to the Putin-Zelenskyy gaffe. It's going to be the Harris-Trump gaffe --

BOLDUAN: Yeah.

GRIFFIN: -- off the top.

And I worry -- listen, he uses this line don't compare me to the almighty, compare me to the alternative. Sure, that standard -- he didn't tell Russia to invade Eastern Europe or something. But it -- by all means, I think will not help where he needs the most immediate help, which is Capitol Hill Democrats.

BOLDUAN: Um-hum.

GRIFFIN: The fact that Jim Himes came out -- somebody with a national security background on the Intel Committee -- and is saying it's time to step aside, I think that signals that Capitol Hill sees this as just unsustainable.

BOLDUAN: It's sounded like Himes was ready -- was going to come out to say that no matter what. He was, out of respect, waiting until the NATO summit wrapped up. But your point still remains.

GRIFFIN: Well -- and I think that's what we're going to see over the next week. I think that is absolutely right to hold most of your fire when he's meeting with foreign leaders here.

But the fact is this. He didn't lay out a forward-looking case. There wasn't some big vision of what the next four years is. He answered the questions he was asked, but he may never have a platform as big as the one he had on the debate stage.

So it's tough to see the case for how he's going to turn around these battleground polls we see where he's losing outside of the margin of error in nearly all of them to Donald Trump.

BOLDUAN: It's hard to talk about the case going forward when you -- when you are facing very real questions about the here and the now, which is -- which is -- it's -- it is about vision. It's also about what happened two weeks ago. And it's also about what happened today. And lost in that is the lack of vision or the mess of a vision that he can be making -- should -- could be making against his opponent Donald Trump. I want to read for you -- getting really to your point, Peter Baker of

The New York Times, said at -- the top of his analysis today I think summed it up pretty well, which was this.

"Did President Biden really think that Donald Trump was his vice president instead of Kamala Harris? Of course not. Did he actually believe that he was meeting with Vladimir Putin instead of Volodymyr Zelenskyy? Not at all. But when it comes to his political future, did it matter that he mixed up those names in front of television cameras on Thursday? Well, it certainly did not help."

So how did this become a Rorschach test in, like, lightning speed and overnight? And the fact that it has, I don't understand what that means for the -- what happens now.

GRIFFIN: Well, and just to be completely honest, I watched it as somebody with a foreign policy background who worked at the Department of Defense, and I was not exactly impressed. It felt like we have lowered the bar for the American presidency so low in the era of Donald Trump that simply being able to explain why we support NATO is like oh, that was so presidential. That was my genuine takeaway.

How voters perceive it may be different though because as we saw in Gary Tuchman's group, these are complicated times. These are complicated issues that he's talking about and he's pulling from his years of experience.

But again, I think what voters are -- I think what actually we're going to be talking about the most a week from and two weeks from now was the answer to the first question about the vice president. You chose her to be your vice president. Does that mean you think she's capable to be the president? And he answered affirmatively.

BOLDUAN: Um-hum.

GRIFFIN: So I think if this conversation continues -- James Clyburn, this morning, was saying the conversation needs to be had up until the convention and he would support Kamala Harris if she was the replacement. I think that will be something people pay attention to.

BOLDUAN: Because -- OK, because this gets to my -- the thing that I'm harping on and don't have an answer to. I'll lean to you to help me. The timing question is confusing for me.