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Trump Questions VP Harris' Racial Identity At Black Journalists Convention; Trump Falsely Claims Kamala Harris "Turned Black"; Trump Takes Part In Combative Q&A At Black Journalists Convention. Aired 3- 3:30p ET

Aired July 31, 2024 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:00]

SHERMICHAEL SINGLETON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: You can have whatever differences you want with the Vice President, that's fine. Most black people out there are going to say, all right, you've got differences. We'll hear the differences. Now, we might disagree, but let's have that conversation.

But the question of the Vice President's ethnicity, I mean, I can't even say what I really want to say about this, but I just think this was a calculating mistake and I would not have advised that.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Why can't you say, because it's a coarse ...

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: (INAUDIBLE) ...

SINGLETON: Oh, well, because I think it's television.

KEILAR: Is it a coarse word? Is it coarse - it's a coarse word.

SINGLETON: And it's words that I probably shouldn't use on live television.

KEILAR: Okay.

SINGLETON: It is. It is.

KEILAR: Got it. All right.

SINGLETON: So I just - this just wasn't good. Were there some good moments for him on the economy? Sure, with Harris. And Katia (ph), she asked some very pointed, good questions. But overall, I just don't see what the net gain here was, and I think a lot of black people will watch this appearance, and then they will point to the former president, and they will point to the Republican Party and say, this is exactly why we would never give you all the majority of our support.

SANCHEZ: I'm curious what you make of a line that we've heard him say before, but he drilled down on it today, and he was asked a follow-up and he sort of ignored it. He makes the argument that he's the best president for black people since Abraham Lincoln.

SINGLETON: Yes, yes, yes.

SANCHEZ: As a Republican, your response?

SINGLETON: Based on what metric? I mean, based on what metric, honestly? Are there some good benefits, I would argue, in terms of conservatism, culturally speaking? Sure. I think we're not a more relativist party, sure. Are we good on the economic front? Yes. I think we're better than Democrats and liberalism on international relations and the idea of free trade and capitalism.

But I think when you make these sorts of assessments before people who have the experiences that the vast majority of black people have historically, and you say you were the absolute best compared to a litany of presidents, from civil rights to the ending of slavery, I mean, I can go on and on, a lot of black people are going to look at you and say, what the hell are you talking about? I'm just being very honest.

And so if I were advising the former president, I would say, look, you have an opportunity here to talk about some good things potentially that Republicans could do to lower costs, to make things better for the average American, including many black people. But don't go up there and make a fool of yourself. Let me just put it that way.

KEILAR: You think he made a fool of himself?

SINGLETON: I just don't think this was a good moment for him. And I will come on this network, and you guys know this, I'll often talk about very good things that I think the president has to his advantage. We've had those conversations. But I just think it would be ridiculous for me as a black man, regardless of my political beliefs, to come on this network and pretend that that was a great moment when I know it wasn't.

KEILAR: Let's go to Jarrett Hill. He's the former president of the Los Angeles chapter of the NABJ and he's joining us now virtually.

Jarrett, you watched that. What did you think?

JARRETT HILL, IMMEDIATE PAST PRESIDENT, NATL. ASSOC. OF BLACK JOURNALISTS OF LOS ANGELES: I disagreed with a lot of Michael's analysis earlier in the show, but I definitely agree with him on this moment. This was a situation. I think we see here in the headline like him talking about Kamala Harris having, quote, "turned black," which really harkens back to the Barack Obama era, right? This is like beginning of birtherism conversation about whether or not she's actually black, which to me just kind of feels played and old and tired, but also antagonistic.

I think that one of the things that Shermichael was talking about prior to the speech was - or the conversation was that this was an opportunity to reach out to black voters, which is something I really disagree with, because I think that when we see these kinds of moments, this isn't about reaching out to black people at all, because if you look at what he did, there's nothing that you can point to in this interview where he has said something that really reached out to black people.

This is about reaching out to white people that feel like they can make a less - they feel a little less racist in this choice when they see him showing up with black people when they show him coming up to black conventions and doing those kinds of things. And I don't even know if that was accomplished in this.

SANCHEZ: And Jarrett, what did you make of his remarks regarding the Vice President?

HILL: I think he did exactly what we expect him to do with the Vice President. We hear him mispronounce her name. We hear him disparage her as a woman. We've heard him do all kinds of different things like this. And I think these are the kinds of moments where he could really have an opportunity to reach out to black voters. He could have an opportunity to push back and say, I'm not a misogynist or I'm not a racist or any of those kinds of things. And we've not seen that here, right?

We've seen him attack these black women on this panel. We've seen him attack the organization saying that he would - that their equipment was bad and you all had me holding up in the back, where we've seen other reporting that he was resisting to the fact checking.

So this is a very frustrating thing to watch him do this on this stage and as a presidential candidate going up against Kamala Harris.

KEILAR: Yes. He also was - he was taking aim at her for failing the bar on her first go, which a lot of people do.

[15:05:05]

In fact, I think some years in California, more people do than not. And lots of well-known people, I was just looking it up, Hillary Clinton talks about it in her book, FDR - they failed the bar, but Kamala Harris also did something that Donald Trump did not do, Jarrett, which is that she passed the bar. And he has not made his academic records certainly public.

I wonder what you think the effect of talking about something like that academic achievement, when actually her academic achievement has been quite good, what the effect is of comments like that.

HILL: Well, I think this is about projection, right? I think one of the most consistent things that we've seen out of Donald Trump is the projection, right? If he's being perceived as a criminal, which he now is, he calls other people criminals. If we see him as any one of these other kinds of things where we were able to point to him being a racist, he calls everyone else racist. If we see any of those kinds of things, he's always projecting.

And this issue about education, where we see him being - where he's calling her stupid, and lazy and not valuable and all of these different things, this is projection, right? And so we see this from him time and time again. We know that Donald Trump ran a university that was for profit and ended up being shut down because it was fake. We know that Donald Trump does these kinds of things all the time. And so when it comes to him calling Kamala Harris uneducated or not smart, we also know that this is a racist attack, right? We know that black people are always being called lazy, being called unqualified in the ways that we've seen him do repeatedly.

So this is on brand for Trump. I don't know what this has gained him. I don't know what this has grown for him. And it also is a bad moment for us at NABJ, to be quite honest.

SANCHEZ: We do want to replay the sound from that first question, what led this question and answer session. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RACHEL SCOTT, ABC NEWS: Claims about some of your rivals from Nikki Haley to former President Barack Obama saying that they were not born in the United States, which is not true. You have told four Congress women of color who were American citizens to go back to where they came from. You have used words like animal and rabbit to describe black district attorneys. You've attacked black journalists, calling them a loser, saying the questions that they ask are, quote, "stupid and racist." You've had dinner with a white supremacist at your Mar-a- Lago resort.

So my question, sir, now that you are asking black supporters to vote for you, why should black voters trust you after you have used language like that?

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, first of all, I don't think I've ever been asked a question so - in such a horrible manner, first question. You don't even say, hello, how are you? Are you with ABC? Because I think they're a fake news network, a terrible network. And I think it's disgraceful that I came here in good spirit.

I love the black population of this country. I've done so much for the black population of this country, including employment, including Opportunity Zones with Sen. Tim Scott of South Carolina, which is one of the greatest programs ever for black workers and black entrepreneurs.

I've done so much. And, you know, when I say this, historically, black colleges and universities were out of money. They were stone cold broke and I saved them and I gave them long-term financing and nobody else was doing it. I think it's a very rude introduction. I don't know exactly why you would do something like that.

And let me go a step further. I was invited here and I was told my opponent, whether it was Biden or Kamala, I was told my opponent was going to be here. It turned out my opponent isn't here. You invited me under false pretense. And then you said you can't do it with Zoom. Well, you know, where's Zoom? She's going to do it with Zoom and she's not coming and then you were half an hour late. Just so we understand, I have too much respect for you to be late. They couldn't get their equipment working or something was wrong. I think it's a very nasty question.

SCOTT: Mr. President, I would love you to answer the question on your rhetoric and why you believe that black voters would trust you with (INAUDIBLE) ...

TRUMP: I have answered the question.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: So that was the answer that led off this moderated panel discussion at the National Association of Black Journalists Convention, which if someone who was there in the room, I believe - he actually was not in the room, but he is a member of NABJ. Eric Deggans joins us now of NPR.

Eric, what is your response to what we just witnessed?

ERIC DEGGANS, MEMBER, NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF BLACK JOURNALISTS: Well, you know, unfortunately, it sort of unfolded the way I think a lot of critics of his appearance feared that it would unfold, which is that he said a lot of things that were not true. He said a lot of things that were insulting.

[15:10:01]

He said a lot of things that weren't necessarily answering the questions that he was asked and it was very difficult to both keep him on track and also police all the things that he was saying. I think Donald Trump is very much a chaos agent when it comes to politics and when it comes to interviews with journalists. And you have to have a very specific and focused strategy for trying to break through that to actually get him to answer questions that you want to know the answers to.

And I think, unfortunately, whatever strategy they had for trying to question him didn't get to what needed to happen, which was figure out how to sort of pin him down and challenge him when he says things that aren't true. So, unfortunately, I think it turned out the way a lot of critics of his appearance expected, and we didn't learn as much as we hoped we might learn.

KEILAR: Did you think there was some public value to his appearance there, especially as there are so many crucial questions that those interviewers did ask him about things that he has said about not only Kamala Harris, but members of the black community?

DEGGANS: Well, I mean, I do think that the idea of having him come to the convention was an important one, because as others have noted, the major party nominees are always invited to physically come to NABJ in an election - in a presidential election year, because black journalists are often a direct conduit to black voters and to black citizens. And we may ask questions in a way that get at issues in a way that other journalists won't. And so it's important that these candidates visit the convention and speak with us directly. But as I said before, you know, Donald Trump isn't your average political candidate, and he requires a very specific and focused strategy.

So I think the interview probably didn't unfold the way some of us would have hoped, because when you ask a question, but then the answer doesn't relate to the question that you asked, you know, then you're not really finding out the answer to the issues that are really on your mind or that you really want the candidate to address. And I think there was a lot of that sort of going on through this interview where a question would be asked and he would answer the question that he wanted to answer, which was not necessarily what people tried to ask him.

SANCHEZ: Yes, right out of the former president's playbook, we've seen him do that now for years. Let's go to Daniel Dale, who is tracking this moderated session very closely. Because, Daniel, there were a number of things that the former president said that were controversial, but also some things that were just blatantly false, specifically about immigration and abortion. Walk us through some of the misstatements, mistruths, not really sure what to call them at this point, falsehoods that former President Trump went through.

DANIEL DALE, CNN REPORTER: Sure. So the controversialness of the claims about Vice President Harris' identity will probably make the most headlines. But I think it's important to note that his claims on that subject are also false. You know, he said that Vice President Harris has only turned black a couple of years ago and before that she was only promoting her Indian heritage. That is just not true.

I quickly just via Google and with the help of CNN's KFILE team, Andrew Kaczynski and Em Steck, found multiple examples of her talking about her black identity going back decades. Her biography on the official website of the San Francisco district attorney page identified her as an African-American woman. I found an article in Politico that quoted her talking about her black identity and speaking out against anti-black racism in 1989 as a law student.

So this is not some sort of sudden identity conversion. That's just completely fictional.

And then, guys, it was just a laundry list of old Trump false claims. So his claim that - well, he said she didn't pass the bar exam. You addressed that. She passed on a second try, was admitted to the bar a year after she graduated law school. He talked about Democrats allowing the death of babies after birth, suggesting that there's some sort of post-birth abortion. Again, not true, illegal in every state.

He said everybody wanted Roe v. Wade overturned. This issue returned to the states. No, that's not true. Roe was overwhelmingly popular with about two-thirds of the American public. He talked again about foreign countries opening up prisons to send people here as migrants. Has never provided any proof of that. Talked about people coming here from mental institutions over the border, again, provided no proof of that. And he exaggerated numbers even that could work for him.

[15:15:07]

So talking about inflation, yes, has been a problem under President Biden and Vice President Harris. He said worst inflation in 58 years. And then he said, actually over a hundred years.

Well, it's not even the worst in 20 years right now, it's about 3 percent, and when it did hit a high under Biden and Harris in 2022, it was a 40-year high. So he could just say, we hit a 40-year high, instead he made it 58 and then a hundred plus, none of which is true.

KEILAR: Yes. Not letting facts get in the way of a good story, which is frequently how former President Trump does that. Daniel, thank you so much for that essential fact check.

And also we'll note that the hosts of that conversation were also doing some fact checking, they certainly did on the abortion topic as they went, so I just want to note that. We are going to talk more about this after a quick break, please stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:20:17]

KEILAR: All right, we just witnessed, really, an epic sort of appearance by former President Trump at the National Association of Black Journalists conference. It went sideways, for sure, very quickly. And in particular, when you heard former President Trump talking about Vice President Kamala Harris and her racial identity. And also, let's listen to this moment where he was asked about some of his allies talking about how she is a DEI hire, which is often seen as a racial slur. Let's listen to the moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCOTT: Do you believe that Vice President Kamala Harris is only on the ticket because she is a black woman?

TRUMP: Well, I can say no. I think it's maybe a little bit different. So I've known her a long time indirectly, not directly very much. And she was always of Indian heritage. And she was only promoting Indian heritage. I didn't know she was black until a number of years ago, when she happened to turn black. And now she wants to be known as black.

So I don't know, is she Indian or is she black?

SCOTT: She is always identified as a black woman and she went to a historically black college.

TRUMP: But you know what? I respect either one. I respect either one, but she obviously doesn't, because she was Indian all the way and then all of a sudden she made a turn and she went - she became a black person.

SCOTT: Just to be clear, sir, do you believe that she is ...

TRUMP: And I think somebody should look into that, too, when you ask, continue in a very hostile, nasty tone.

SCOTT: It's a ...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: All right, as one of the hosts said there, she has always identified as a black woman and pointing out that she went to a historically black college. This was - I do want to read something by Natasha Alford of TheGrio, where she commented on X, nay Twitter about it.

She said, "Kamala Harris is a Black woman and identifies as such. She has said this multiple times in interviews. She's also discussed how the local black community uplifted her Indian mother and supported her as a child. Source: her memoir. She is also a South Asian. Both identities can coexist. The disinformation campaign behind her identity is an intentional one."

SANCHEZ: I'm also curious to understand, if possible, what he means by someone should look into it. Is that like looking for Barack Obama's birth certificate? Like, what exactly does that mean?

KEILAR: I think that is exactly what that means.

SANCHEZ: Yes, that's odd.

We want to go to Arlette Saenz now, who is in Houston, where the Vice President, Kamala Harris, is expected later today at a fundraising dinner.

Arlette, we got a response from the White House. They called these comments essentially ridiculous, saying that respect has to be put on the Vice President's name. What are you hearing in response to what we just saw from the former president?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Boris, Vice President Kamala Harris is currently on her way here to Houston on Air Force One, where she will be speaking a bit later tonight. It's unclear whether she will formally address these comments from former President Donald Trump. But the venue that she is speaking at could be a fitting one for her to do so.

Harris will be speaking at the buy-in annual Boule for Sigma Gamma Rho. That is a black sorority that is part of the Divine Nine. Harris herself, of course, is also an alumni of a Divine Nine sorority, Alpha Kappa Alpha. Now, so far, the campaign has not formally responded to Trump's suggestions that Harris turned black at some point.

But the view, I'm told, from Harris aides is that the president's - former president's comments at that NABJ convention further highlight why Americans decided not to elect him in 2020. And they believe that he came across as angry and not showing leadership. Now, as you mentioned, White House Press Secretary Karine Jean-Pierre, she did respond in real time to these comments from Trump. She personally called them repulsive, insulting and said that no one has the right to tell someone how they identify. That is likely something that we would hear from Harris' allies going forward.

But a bit later tonight, she will be speaking here at that event in an effort to really try to mobilize black female voters in this election. Now, the Divine Nine is comprised of nine historically black sororities and fraternities. They do not endorse in political candidates, but they could act as a mobilizing force heading into November's election.

Now, I also want to play for you a bit of what Karine Jean-Pierre had to say a bit earlier today. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KARINE JEAN-PIERRE, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: As a person of color, as a black woman, who is in this position that is standing before you at this podium, behind this lectern - what he just said, what you just read out to me is repulsive, it's insulting. And, you know, no one has any right to tell someone who they are, how they identify.

[15:25:01]

That is no one's right. It is someone's own decisions. It is - I'll add this - only she can speak to her experience. Only she can speak to what it's like. She's the only person that can do that. And I think it's insulting for anybody, it doesn't matter if it's a former leader, a former president, it is insulting. And we have to put, she is the Vice President of the United States, Kamala Harris, we have to put some respect on her name, period.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAENZ: So some strong pushback there from White House Press Secretary Karine Jean-Pierre, something certainly her allies will likely echo in the coming hours and we will see whether Vice President Kamala Harris herself decides to take this head-on in her speech tonight.

SANCHEZ: We will be watching it closely for a response. Arlette Saenz, live from Houston. Thank you so much for that update.

We want to go back to Chicago to go to Sara Sidner, who is in the room for this moderated conversation.

Sara, as folks were leaving, as you were talking to folks following what we saw, what did you hear from people that watched all of this unfold?

SARA SIDNER, CNN HOST: If you come into a room where the majority of people in the room are black and try to convince them that someone else who has gone to an HBCU, who has pledged to Alpha Kappa Alpha, who has constantly talked about her commitment to the black community, to try to convince them that she's not black, that's a mistake. I mean, that is the conversation going on here. There was a gasp, and then there was laughter. And laughter - mocking laughter - the kind of laughter that is uncomfortable for any candidate in a room. People were taken aback by, when you guys were talking about what he said about Vice President Kamala Harris, saying, oh, she's always grabbed onto her Indian heritage, but she's suddenly become black. That is just a lie. That is not true. It is not something that anyone has seen during her entire career.

I mean, let's remember that her career started long before, her career in politics started long before her becoming a vice president. There was something else, though, that we haven't yet talked about, haven't quite picked up on yet. When he was asked about vice president, his vice presidential pick, JD Vance, he was asked about some of Vance's comments, and if he thought that they were appropriate, and whether or not he is happy with his pick.

He evaded that question, but here's what he said about JD Vance that I think is worth noting. He said, "Historically the vice president, in terms of the election, does not have any impact. I mean virtually no impact," virtually never has it mattered. He was talking about the person who he chose for vice president, basically saying that it doesn't matter who's on the ticket.

Now, in Trump's case, that may well be true. We have people who have come here who are Trump supporters, not a member of NABJ, who liked what he had to say and put all the blame on the Democrats. But it is interesting to note that he has basically slammed his own vice president in this crowd, saying that, really, it doesn't matter who his vice president is at all.

We should also just talk about the tone and tenor of what happened here. I don't think train wreck is too far to go. This went off the rails immediately with the first question, which was a question that a lot of people had been asking at the conference. This is a person they have seen go after black journalists, saying negative things to black journalists about their questions, calling their questions dumb, saying that they are stupid.

And so there was a question as to why he should be trusted with his commitment to the black community. It was a valid question. The answer was never given, and it was really a moment where people could see that this choice of having Donald Trump here could turn out to be problematic.

But he got 45 minutes. He talked for the whole time. He answered some questions. And people sort of left here, honestly, disappointed. They were hoping to have a deeper conversation, to hear what some of his answers were to some of the questions about policy. They didn't really get that today. Boris, Brianna?

KEILAR: Yes. No, they didn't. He was trying to pivot at times to the economy, but he also kept coming back to his personal animus to Rachel Scott of ABC News, who asked that tough but exceedingly fair question right off the bat of this question-and-answer session.

Sara, thank you so much for that live report for us from Chicago.

We are covering this event, former President Donald Trump, in a Q&A at the National Association of Black Journalists convention in Chicago. It got testy. It got downright insulting and a lot of questions about how this is going to serve him politically and whether this was a mistake for him to attend. We'll be right back with more.