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Trump Dehumanizes Migrants, Calls Right-Wing Agitator Laura Loomer A "Free Spirit"; Starliner Astronauts Speak As Return Home Is Delayed; How NH National Guard Failed To Protect Women In Its Ranks. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired September 13, 2024 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:30:00]

DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: And just back to the idea that Trump doesn't know really what Laura Loomer is about, you don't have to dig hard for these posts.

I mean, it's literally, it's every second post is something toxic, is something racist, is something hateful from Laura Loomer.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Daniel Dale, I mean, you've followed Trump and some of these dubious claims better than most. What did you take from that press conference?

DANIEL DALE, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: I thought you all did a fantastic fact-checking. Truly, you barely need me on this panel anymore.

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: That is absolutely inaccurate.

DALE: I think it was great. I think the California claim is bonkers. Like it's one thing to say I would have won Pennsylvania if the count was honest. The count is, of course, honest in swing states, too. But he lost California by five million votes, about 30 points.

So even under the wildest imaginary conception of voter fraud, election fraud in this country, that's, that's still bananas.

He said, again, as he usually has, that ISIS was defeated in four weeks during his presidency. In fact, the ISIS caliphate or so-called caliphate was declared liberated about two years into his presidency.

He spoke of, supposedly, thousands of people being murdered by migrants under Biden/Harris. There have been some homicides in which undocumented people are accused. I don't have a precise number. But it is nowhere near thousands.

He said, again, that Venezuela is emptying jails, prisons to somehow deliberately let criminals come to the U.S. as migrants. Even his own campaign, let alone experts, have been able to substantiate that. The experts say it's just not true.

And, Brianna, you fact-checked the claim about debate polls. I think we can get more specific. He said he has more than 90 percent support. More than 90 percent of people in one poll said he won the debate. What the heck is he talking about?

Those are junk unscientific polls, like polls where some media outlet posts on X, on social media saying, who won the debate, and anyone in any country at any age can flood that so-called poll and say who they thought.

It is the scientific polls that you cited, the ones by major pollsters, CNN, yougov, Lajay (ph), that all found that Harris was supported by the overwhelming majority of people who watched that debate.

SANCHEZ: That's even fellow Republicans though that maybe didn't participate in the poll, but spoke to CNN and said that they were disappointed in his performance.

But he is really selling the idea or trying to sell the idea that he went on Tuesday night.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: You guys, thank you so much.

Daniel Dale, you're absolutely necessary, by the way,

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: Donie and Jeff, thank you to you as well.

And we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:37:08]

SANCHEZ: Happening right now, the Starliner astronauts, Butch Wilmore and Suni Williams, are speaking from the International Space Station about their unexpectedly long stay in orbit.

Let's take you live to space and listen in.

BUTCH WILMORE, STARLINER ASTRONAUT: A decision that we're given is what we're going to march to. Again, like I said, because that's -- that's not what we do. That's -- that's who we are.

SUNI WILLIAMS, STARLINER ASTRONAUT: Hey, Jeff (ph), I might add just a couple of things. You know, I was -- I was really impressed. There's -- there we're a lot of opinions.

There was a lot of data coming in at different times and a lot of people trying to digest that data and understand it and take it forward.

I think it was really impressive for our leadership and our management to take the time and listen to everybody's opinion and really try to understand where all of that was going. That's -- that's really a benefit of this organization. You know, we have a lot of people from many different backgrounds. You're seeing two Navy test pilots here. But we have scientists, we have engineers, we have doctors, the whole gamut for putting humans in space.

And it takes a lot of people to get on board to have us come up to space, to the space station, and have us come home. And all of those people have -- have a say. They have a direct input. And our leadership really open the door and really was open to understanding everybody's opinion.

And that's really impressive. And it's a way, you know, a good organization works, where everybody's opinion is funneled up to their specific director. And then taken into account by the upper management.

So we have to just understand that and be very thankful we have an organization that does that.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We'll take a question now from Kristin Fisher with CNN.

KRISTEN FISHER, CNN SPACE & DEFENSE CORRESPONDENT: Hi, there. This is Kristin Fisher and we're actually live on CNN right now.

So I might ask a question that has already been asked before, but slightly differently. So bear with me.

Butch and Suni, thank you so much for doing this. And I know you both have done long-duration missions before. You've trained for every contingency.

But, you know, NASA Astronaut Frank Rubio, who was in a similar situation as the two of you, he said that he still had a few hard days as he kind of wrapped his head around going from a six-month mission to a 12-month mission.

I'm just curious how that transition has been for the two of you mentally, when you learned that you'd be going from a days-long mission to an eight-month mission. Thank you.

WILMORE: Well, like I said earlier, there's one thing that I try not to fret, if maybe fret's the right word.

Things that I can't control, I'm not going to -- I'm not going to fret over it. I mean, there's no benefit to it at all.

[14:40:05]

So my transition was, maybe it wasn't instantaneous, but it was pretty close. If I can affect it, if there's nothing we can do, there's nothing we can do.

So we march forward, carry out the plan of the day, as we used to say back in my AOCS days and, shortly thereafter. Aviation Officer Candidate School, by the way, that's what that means. And it was very short-lived, if at all, for me, it's all.

WILLIAMS: Kristin, I -- just add two thoughts to that. You know, for us, I think Butch hit the nail on the head. You know, you sort of turn to and just take on the next activity for the day and we -- that's what we do. We're professionals.

I think I have to say, though, in the back of my mind, you know, there's -- there's folks on the ground who had some plans, right? Like my family, and to spend some time with my mom.

And I think I was fretting more about that, like the things that we had sort of all talked and planned for this fall and this winter. And I think I was little bit nervous, to be honest with you, to say like, OK, I'm not coming home for it.

But, you know what? Like we both mentioned at the very beginning, everybody is onboard and is supporting us while we're up here. So I think that fret went away real quick, as well as the idea of like, hey, we're here and we're going to be the best crewmates that we can be for our crewmates up here.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's great to hear, you guys.

Our next question now will come from Loren Grush (ph) with Bloomberg.

LOREN GRUSH (ph), CORRESPONDENT, BLOOMBERG: Hi, Butch and Suni, thank you so much for doing this.

SANCHEZ: "We are professionals, everybody is on board, and everybody is supporting us." That's Suni Williams talking about the transition between planning for a short stint in space to now a month's-long one.

Taking a question from Kristin Fisher, live from space right here on CNN.

We're going to take a quick break. But after that, we're going to talk to two former NASA astronauts to get their reactions to all of this as we monitor these remarks.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:46:24]

SANCHEZ: Right now, Starliner astronauts, Suni Williams and Butch Wilmore, are taking questions it's from space about how their days- long mission turned into a months-long stay aboard the International Space Station.

Joining us now, former NASA astronaut, Garrett Reisman. And Leroy Chiao with us as well. Garrett once worked for SpaceX.

And, Leroy, first to you.

What is your reaction to what we've been hearing so far from Suni and Butch?

LEROY CHIAO, RETIRED NASA ASTRONAUT: Not a surprise at all. Butch and Suni are consummate professionals. They accept their assignments readily and happily, just like any of us would. And you know, they're going to do fine.

Of course, as Suni mentioned, there's an impact, of course, too personal plans. And probably your family members and your friends are first in your thoughts of who's going to be impacted.

But at the end of the day, hey, she's saying, just like Butch did, this is my job. And I like being in space. That's why astronauts are astronauts. And so it's all going to be fine.

SANCHEZ: Garrett, what came to mind listening to their remarks?

GARRETT REISMAN, FORMER NASA ASTRONAUT: Well, listening to their remarks and also I've been in touch with Suni directly via email And I can tell you that I think what was the most difficult thing for them was the uncertainty.

And what she said was that, once they made a decision about which way they're going to go, it was almost a relief because now they can get on with it and move forward.

And I think Leroy understands this perfectly well as an astronaut. Plans change all the time. You think you're going up on one rocket and then they tell you going up on a different rocket. And you have to adjust.

And not knowing how this is going to turn out, psychologically, I think that is actually the most difficult thing in the process.

Once you know what to expect and you can go out and do your job, I think it's easier.

KEILAR: Garrett, I don't -- you may or may not have spoken with Suni about this in your communications. She did give a shout out to a lot of people who are writing to her. So clearly, you're among -- among those people.

But what do you think the impact was when Starliner made it back OK but they had decided that it wasn't safe enough for them to go back on it. But ultimately, it did make it back. What do you think the psychological effect of that is? They weren't on it. They could have come back sooner.

REISMAN: Well, you know, I think, first of all, that's the result that we all expected. Everybody that's been following this closely in the space community thought that, in all probability, the Starliner was going to come back and land just fine.

And as I -- as I mentioned to you in a previous broadcast, I would -- I would have bet really good money on that outcome. I just wouldn't have bet my life on it. Right? So I still think NASA made the right decision. And I think Suni and

Butch are looking at the same way that it was the right call. It's what they expected. They expected the Starliner to be fine.

They were happy for the Boeing teams that put so much work into making it happen that they did have success.

And I'll tell you, all the NASA community that really wants to see Starliner be successful, they are much closer to that day when we fly people in Starliner again, given the successful outcome of that entry.

If that had gone bad, that day would have been much further in the future.

SANCHEZ: Leroy, I don't want to put you on the spot. I'm not sure if you could answer this. But Butch talked about requesting his absentee ballot from the International Space Station. He wants to vote in the election.

How does voting from space actually work?

CHIAO: Its actually pretty simple. Basically, an encrypted word document is sent up to -- will be sent up to their email addresses. They can open those with the password. They can fill out the ballot and then save it.

[14:50:02]

And then email it back to the registrar and their voting office. And then there, somebody with the password will open it and then record their votes. So it's really actually a very simple process.

NASA had set that up some years ago. And when I left to go launch in my mission in October, we left in August for our last training, and I suddenly realized, in that year, 2004, I hadn't put in for an absentee ballot and I hadn't made any arrangements.

And I quickly ask NASA, hey, can I vote from the station. And they said, oh, yes, we have the process in place, no problem.

And it turned into a great, great public service announcement for me to send down messages encouraging people to go out and vote.

KEILAR: Yes, that's pretty cool. You can do it even from space. Just don't forget to request your absentee ballot. They have a very good excuse for needing one.

Leroy and Garrett, thank you so much to both of you.

GARRETT: My pleasure. Thanks.

KEILAR: We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KEILAR: New today, CNN has exclusive reporting on the New Hampshire National Guard and how it became a hotbed for sexual harassment and assault, according to interviews with current and former members of the guard.

They describe a culture of retaliation against whistleblowers and neglect of victims of sexual assault.

In one instance, a lieutenant colonel deployed to the southern border in October of 2022, sent sexually suggestive messages to women, took photos of women without their knowledge and shared them.

He even ordered women to come to his hotel room and threatened to make their deployments miserable if they complained about it.

CNN's Pentagon producer, Haley Britzky, is with us now on this story.

Haley, great reporting here. Tell us just how rampant this kind of behavior was in the New Hampshire guard?

HALEY BRITZKY, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY PRODUCER: Yes, so, Brianna, the current and former members that I spoke with say that this is incredibly normalized, that it was not a new issue.

And I was speaking to them about it and they say it was really swept under the rug by leadership for years. And I think a snapshot that illustrates that perfectly is this investigation into this battalion commander you mentioned down at the border.

[14:55:01]

In this investigation report, they talked to over 50 soldiers, many of them saying that this commander bragged about beating past investigations. He's been investigating multiple times.

And it's caused them to totally lose faith in the system and holding him accountable.

And we should mention that his lawyer, when we asked him about this, said that he felt the women under his command we're being friendly and that he erred in letting that level of familiarity go too far.

KEILAR: Your investigation has shown systemic issues in the New Hampshire National Guard that really enabled this kind of conduct. What are your sources telling you about that?

BRITZKY: Yes. So the National Guard is a kind of complex military because it's made up of these part-time, oftentimes part-time service members, which means this is not their full-time job.

And therefore, they're not held to the same regulations as their active-duty counterparts, which can impact some of that change sinking down into the culture of these organizations.

But multiple sources in the guard and experts outside also pointed to the fact that there's this gray area of who really oversees these units. They report directly to the governors of their states, but they also

report to the National Guard Bureau in Washington, which can leave this uncertainty of who's in charge of ensuring these things don't happen.

And as one source put it, you know, a lot of these issues, including sexual assault, harassment, of course, can fall through the cracks because there's no one there stepping into that gap and ensuring it's being taken care of.

KEILAR: Yes, it's like when everyone's accountable, no one's accountable. And they may be experiencing that.

What are other guardsmen and women saying about this kind of toxicity being allowed to just continue on?

BRITZKY: I mean, frankly, the multiple people that I spoke with just have no confidence in leadership and being able to handle this.

They're worried if they come forward with their own allegations or their own concerns, they won't be heard, they won't be handled appropriately.

And I think it's important to note that the New Hampshire National Guard TAGS, which are general officers in charge of that unit, says that they take these allegations very seriously, that they've made changes in the organization to try to improve the culture.

But there really is no trust here that they can ensure the source members that they can ensure that these leaders take appropriate action.

And you know, as -- as one person put it to me, it's not that there's not rules in place. There are rules in place, but they're not being followed.

KEILAR: It's a leadership issue.

Haley, great reporting. Thank you so much. Really appreciate it.

And we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)