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Harris Does CNN Town Hall; Trump Slams Kelly; Sen. Chris Coons (D-DE) is Interviewed about Harris; Fact Checking Harris' Claims. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired October 24, 2024 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: They also say - the police chief on one reservation told me, simply public awareness. These cases don't get enough attention. It's hard to ask the public to help solve crime if they don't know this is - if (ph) they're existing, John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Nearly enough attention with so much work to be done.

Josh Campbell, thank you so much for your work on this.

We've got a brand new hour of CNN NEWS CENTRAL starting right now.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: For the first time, Barack Obama will be joining Kamala Harris on the campaign trail today. Their message for battleground Georgia. And Donald Trump is headed out west. Two rallies in two key swing states.

And can ChatGPT be tricked into helping people commit crimes? One tech firms says yes and is now raising the alarm.

I'm Kate Bolduan, with John Berman and Sara Sidner. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: The globes are off. Drilling down on the dangers of Trump. This morning, that appears to be the Kamala Harris strategy just a dozen days out from Election Day. At the CNN town hall last night, Harris drew clear lines between her and the rival she says is a fascist.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Do you think Donald Trump is a fascist?

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S. (D) AND U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Yes, I do. Yes, I do. They also care about our democracy and not having a president of the United States who admires dictators, and as a fascist.

He's going to sit there unstable, unhinged, plotting his revenge, plotting his retribution, creating an enemies list. I'm going to tell you, my list will be a list of how I address, and

continue to address the issues that you all are raising this afternoon and evening. It will be a to-do list.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: An enemy's list versus a to-do list. She's putting that starkly out there.

Let's bring in chief national affairs correspondent Jeff Zeleny now.

Jeff, that moment, a clear top takeaway this morning, gone from, you know, the joy and the weird talk, to calling Donald Trump a fascist. Will it work to sway minds?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Sara, good morning.

I mean that, of course, is an open question, which minds will it sway if any, but it is clear listening to the vice president there.

It is time for voting. We know that more than 25 million Americans have voted. She is drawing a very sharp contrast at every turn she can against the former president.

She's closing this campaign, you know, really drawing this contrast. But this is her message. The campaign about Donald Trump has become really the anthem of her candidacy. She's trying to rally, you know, some of the Democrats, of course, who may still be on the fence, or not voting at all, to focus on this race and see this distinction here.

But she also has been trying for weeks to really explain how she would be the candidate of change. That's one of the central issues here, which candidate is viewed as a candidate of change? So, she's been trying to put some distance between herself, how she would govern, and how President Biden did.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S. (D) AND U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: My administration will not be a continuation of the Biden administration. I bring to this role my own ideas and my own experience. I represent a new generation of leadership on a number of issues, and believe that we have to actually take new approaches.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZELENY: And, of course, this comes on the heels of an answer she gave to this very same question just a few weeks ago on "The View" where she said she wouldn't change much at all. That has become an ad that the Trump campaign has been running in battleground states.

So, of course, she said, look, I would not be a continuation. That has been sort of one of her central answers going forward. But this is the challenge. Is she seen as the change candidate or is Donald Trump? SIDNER: Jeff, she's also had this challenge of people saying and pulling that they don't really know enough about her. She's now been out there. She has just done this town hall. Do people know her better now?

ZELENY: I think they certainly do, and they will day by day. But, Sara, you're right, I mean this candidacy has been very accelerated, very quick. But some of the more interesting moments, I was at the town hall last night listening to the questions about how she processes grief and how she thinks about other issues were so interesting and filling in some of these gaps.

I was struck by her conversation about faith in this exchange.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S. (D) AND U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I was raised to believe in a loving God. To believe that your faith is a verb, you know. You - you - you live your faith. And - and that - that the way that one should do that is that your work and your life's work should be to think about how you can serve in a way that is uplifting other people. That is about caring for other people. And that guides a lot of how I think about my work and - and what is important.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[09:05:04]

ZELENY: So, look, it's answers like that, that don't often get as much attention here in this back-and-forth of drawing contrast. But it is things like that that help fill in the gaps for some voters who are wondering a little bit more about who she is. So, that exchange and the one on grieving, about how her mother - about how she grieved after her mother passed certainly is so interesting in sort of rounding out this full picture, Sara.

SIDNER: Jeff Zeleny, always a pleasure. Thank you so much. Appreciate it.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: Donald Trump sounded like he did watch the town - CNN town hall last night, but maybe not close enough because Trump was attacking Harris on social media for saying she's - she's gone as far as calling him Adolf Hitler. And she did not. But she did say that she agrees with Trump's former chief of staff, John Kelly, who told "The New York Times" that Donald Trump fits the definition of a fascist. Trump also is continuing to attack the retired general, John Kelly, calling General Kelly a total degenerate.

As for where he heads today, Trump is going to Arizona and Nevada.

Let's talk - let's bring in CNN's Alayna Treene, who's tracking his campaign for us. And before that, he was at a rally in Georgia last night. You were there. What did he say? ALAYNA TREENE, CNN REPORTER: I was. It was in Duluth, Georgia. A

suburb of Atlanta.

Look, it was a wide-ranging rally. We really heard Donald Trump hit all of the key things we've heard him say repeatedly on the campaign trail, which is to talk about the economy, to try and trash Harris' handling of the border.

But one thing that was new and a little bit different, Kate, was, he said that he - and this is when he was calling RFK Jr. up to the stage, he said that he wanted to spend more money on health care, or health is how he put it, than any other country.

And, of course, this comes as he has pledged that he would have RFK Jr. serve in any future administration if he were to win in a role that would oversee health care.

Take a listen to how he put it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We are also going to make America healthy again. Your Kamala health care plan will make our kids sicker and their diets more toxic. Under the Trump administration, we will get the toxic chemicals out of our food supply and we will make our children healthy again. We will spend more money on health care than any other nation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TREENE: Now, Kate, this is obviously something that Donald Trump has just started to say in recent weeks. But I'll tell you where it's coming from. It is coming from RFK Jr. This was a key platform that he had run on before dropping out and endorsing Donald Trump. And part of the reason Trump keeps talking about this and mentioning RFK on the trail, I'm told, is because they think he helps Donald Trump when it comes to women. They believe that women, obviously, a key demographic that they are targeting right now, are being swayed by this message, particularly on health care, about certain processed foods and whatnot.

And you heard RFK Jr. speak on stage, or I heard him last night when I was there in the arena, really focusing this - on this as well.

But one other thing that happened last night, because I just - it was so odd, I feel like I have to bring it up to you. This was a massive rally and a massive arena. There was a lot of high-profile Republicans who spoke. People, like I said, RFK Jr., but also Tulsi Gabbard, Dr. Ben Carson, Marjorie Taylor Greene. But also Tucker Carlson. And at one moment prior to Donald Trump taking the stage, Carlson actually told this story. He said that if Donald Trump were going to win, again, it would be like dad is coming home. And he said, like a father, Donald Trump loves all his children. He was referring to Democrats and the media. But said that he would be, quote, "pissed" at them and then said that he would need to give them a vigorous spanking. Very odd language, but the reason I'm bringing this up is because it seemed to stick with the crowd in the room. When Donald Trump came on stage, the crowd started screaming, "daddy's home." Something I have not heard on the trail so far. And I just felt, you know, it was a bit odd, so I wanted to share that with you this morning.

BOLDUAN: Thank you for sharing, Alayna. You're going to - I'm just going to leave it.

John.

Thank you, Alayna Treene. You're the best. Thank you.

John.

BERMAN: I mean, look, and to be even more explicit, he was talking about spanking girls. Tucker Carlson was talking about that a lot, which was notable and interesting to say the last.

BOLDUAN: Yes. All of the above.

BERMAN: All right, Vice President Harris is set to deliver a speech at The Ellipse next week. We just learned that she's going to give this speech at the same location as Donald Trump's January 6th rally in 2021. This will be a closing argument speech, hitting the theme that she has been hitting lately. Last night at the town hall, she called Donald Trump a fascist. She's going to question his fitness for office.

Now, "Politico" notes this morning, their headline in the political playbook is, "How Harris ended up sounding like Biden."

[09:10:03]

Remember, Joe Biden, the threat to democracy that Donald Trump, he believes is, was the main theme of his campaign.

With us now is Senator Chris Coons from Delaware, Co-Chair of the Harris-Walz campaign.

So Senator, to that point, Kamala Harris calling Donald Trump a fascist, talking about threats to democracy, holding that rally on the Ellipse next week as part of the closing argument. Why the shift from, first of all, joy, second of all, you know, I'm going to help the middle class, to threats to democracy, and do you believe it's the right one?

SEN. CHRIS COONS (D-DE), CO-CHAIR, HARRIS-WALZ CAMPAIGN: Well, John, I thought she had a great town hall last night in Pennsylvania, where Vice President Harris showed an open-hearted and an optimistic side. She got asked direct questions by undecided voters in Pennsylvania, and it wandered into subjects like how does she process grief, how does she make decisions about her personal faith, and I think that was very positive. She also talked about specific ideas she has for reducing costs like housing, child care, health care. But John, you're right, she also ended up talking about how Donald

Trump is an existential threat to our democracy. It's not that she's made a shift in tone, it's that Donald Trump has not just continued to have rally after rally, where he says alarming and concerning and off- balance things, but that's accelerated.

The news broken by the "New York Times" this week that Donald Trump's longest-serving chief of staff, former Marine Corps General John Kelly, believes that Trump has the instincts of a fascist, that he admires authoritarians, that he's privately said complimentary things about Adolf Hitler, that was the news that propelled her comments last night, but frankly that's nothing new. That's just what those who serve most closely with Trump in his White House, in national service and intelligence and national security roles, forgive me, they all say the same thing, that he's too great a risk for us to take.

BERMAN: What about the argument that we've heard right here on this show from Governor Chris Sununu, a Republican from New Hampshire, who says the fact that Donald Trump says nice things about Hitler, well that's baked into the cake at this point.

COONS: Look, I think there are still undecided voters, we heard from them last night in that great town hall, which could have been a debate had Donald Trump had the courage to show up and actually debate Kamala Harris, and those undecided voters are just tuning into this election. So even though we had a great convention, there was a debate between Trump and Harris, now weeks ago.

There are folks who need to hear one more time. Here's their economic ideas, Donald Trump has a terrible idea to impose a 20% nationwide sales tax that he calls a tariff on all imported goods. That means your groceries, your clothes, your furniture, your cars, everything that comes into this country from anywhere, he wants to increase their costs. Kamala Harris has ideas for how to address housing, health care, pharmaceuticals, child care, and make taxes fairer.

You look at those two ideas and independent reviewers like, for example, Goldman Sachs, say if Trump gets to enact his ideas, inflation will go up, growth will go down. Kamala Harris, inflation goes down, growth goes up. I do think we need to keep making the case and I'm looking forward to Vice President Harris' closing argument this coming week.

BERMAN: So the "Wall Street Journal" has a new poll out overnight and some of the underlying numbers show what other polls have shown also that on the question of in which direction is the country headed, you know, right track, wrong track. Right now, only 26% say the country's headed in the right direction. 64% say the wrong track and that number is getting worse from August, Senator.

I mean, how challenging is it for an incumbent party to run into those headwinds?

COONS: So, John, it's important to get into some of the internals of polls that show that right track, wrong track number. More and more Americans think that their own economic situation and of their community is getting better as there are more jobs available, as the manufacturing rebirth that was started under President Biden and Kamala Harris because of the bipartisan infrastructure bill, because of the chips and science bill.

Folks are feeling better about their own prospects, but they are very worried about the country being on the wrong track and that's largely because of political division.

Look, as I've campaigned across the country recently in Ohio and Michigan, Arizona and nearby in Pennsylvania, I hear a lot of concern from folks about the future of the country.

BERMAN: Sure.

COONS: Now, that's for different reasons in different places, but they are concerned in large part because of the division and the nastiness they're seeing on their televisions and TV ads and in discussions they're having with family and friends about this election.

[09:15:09]

BERMAN: Just to that point, finally on the whole fascism discussion, I suppose there are two things that the Harris campaign needs to do here. It's A, to convince voters that Donald Trump is a fascist and they're saying, look at what John Kelly said, who worked with him. But then you also have to convince voters, maybe Republicans, maybe people in the middle, that they care. I mean, what will it say to you if people don't care that those close to Donald Trump say he's a fascist?

COONS: I have a very hard time believing that Americans will look hard at these two candidates and say, oh, I don't really care if Donald Trump violates the Constitution, turns the military on his internal enemies. Her closing summary that Donald Trump has an enemies list and she has a to-do list, that she's open to ideas from wherever they might come, that she wants to work across the aisle and solve the pressing problems that face our nation going forward. I have a hard time believing that the average American will look at that contrast and choose Donald Trump if they believe what Republican after Republican has now come out and said publicly.

Look, conservative congressman, former Congressman Fred Upton just said yesterday that he voted for Kamala Harris. He's joining a long list, like my friend Jeff Flake, former conservative Republican from Arizona. Liz Cheney was just here in Pennsylvania a few days ago campaigning with Vice President Harris.

You don't see the same thing happening with Democrats who are endorsing Donald Trump. But there are dozens of Republicans, mayors, members of the House, members of the Senate and his own cabinet who are publicly cautioning he's too great a risk to take.

BERMAN: Senator Chris Coons from Delaware. Thanks for being with us this morning.

Sara. SIDNER: Ahead, how much did Kamala Harris stray from the truth at the town hall? We've got our Daniel Dale. He is going to do the fact check.

And the decision Pennsylvania's supreme court just made about mail-in and provisional ballots that could have a hugely important impact in that battleground state.

Those stories and more, ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:21:32]

BOLDUAN: Vice President Kamala Harris took the stage - took the CNN stage last night in battleground Pennsylvania and she faced questions from the slim slice of the electorate who say they still have not made their minds up, undecided voters.

And they asked her a wide range of things at this town hall event, which would she expand the Supreme Court, would she codify Roe versus - Roe v. Wade into federal law? What would she do about Gaza, and what's behind her policy reversals from when she last ran in 2019. The voters there hoping for clarity on her issues on all these things.

CNN's Daniel Dale is here with the facts.

Daniel, let's start with the question on changing her positions on certain policies. One of those policies that's gotten a lot of attention is fracking, an important issue in Pennsylvania.

Let's play this moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S. (D) AND U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I've been very clear. We kind of dispensed with this in 2020. I am not going to ban fracking. I did not as vice president. In fact, as vice president, I cast the tie-breaking vote that now has opened up more fracking leases.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: And you point out too, when you're running for vice president in 2020, you were not talking about banning fracking but -

HARRIS: No, No, No, Anderson, I - I pledged that I would not ban fracking.

COOPER: Right, I know.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Daniel, what are the facts here.

DANIEL DALE, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: The facts are that this claim is not true. Vice President Harris did not pledge in 2020 that she wouldn't ban fracking. Her campaign has previously made clear that what she's talking about here is comments she made in her one 2020 vice presidential debate with Mike Pence.

But if you go look at the transcript of that debate, it's online, or go watch it on YouTube or wherever, you'll see that she did not say that she had abandoned or changed her previous 2019 support for a fracking ban. Rather, she simply said that Joe Biden, who was then the head of the Democratic ticket, himself would not ban fracking.

Listen to what she said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S. (D) AND U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I will repeat, and the American people now, that Joe Biden will not ban fracking. That is a fact. That is a fact.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DALE: So, it makes sense that, you know, she was speaking about Biden. He was the head of the ticket at the time. But her suggestion to Anderson that this was a pledge that she herself would not ban fracking as president just doesn't hold water.

BOLDUAN: So, Donald Trump spoke last night at an event in Georgia and showed a chart that he often uses. He claims it shows the level of legal immigration on the day that he left office.

Let's - let me - let me play this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: See the arrow on the bottom. That is the day I left office. Look what happened after that. What they've done to our country is unbelievable. So, when you look at that, that was the best we had had, and it was going better. We had it done. The border was the most secure it ever was.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Daniel, what are the facts here?

DALE: Look, we're all happy that turning to look at this chart help save former President Trump's life at that Pennsylvania rally in July. But it is not true that that red arrow that shows a low level of migration at the southern border points to the day he left office as he keeps claiming.

If you actually look at the statistics behind this chart, you'll see that that low level of border crossing was in April 2020, more than eight months before he left office, not his last day. Why does this matter? Well, because he keeps saying, look, it was at its lowest level the day I left office, then it started increasing. In fact, those increases happened while he was still president. In fact, they more than quadrupled in the - in the subsequent eight months. [09:25:02]

So, if you look at the actual numbers, April 2020, when migration was low because of Covid-related restrictions around the world, you had 16,182 border patrol encounters with migrants. By January 2021, the month he actually left office, it was up to 75,316. So, this claim it was at a record low and then Biden and Harris took over and it exploded, not true. In fact, those sharp increases happened under President Trump.

BOLDUAN: Daniel Dale, thank you.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, new revelations about what Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, really thought about Donald Trump. His words, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SIDNER: Kamala Harris drawing a sharp contrast between herself and Donald Trump at CNN's town hall, saying, if he wins, he'll be focused on retribution not the American people.

[09:29:57]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE U.S. (D) AND U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You can look at a Donald Trump in the White House after January 20th, sitting in that Oval Office, plotting his revenge. He is going to sit there, unstable, unhinged, plotting his revenge, plotting his.